Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Exactly, GDPR is about both citizens and residents.

 

Anyone living in EU is also protected.

 

If Afrinic host mailing list and databases with may contain EU-person data, it 
is subjected to GDPR. There is no doubt in that.

 

After all, what it really matters is that Maurituis has an explicit agreement 
adopting an equivalent regulation to the GDPR.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 12/7/19 9:29, "John Walu"  escribió:

 

@ Owen

 

Interesting insights.

 

True GDPR is EU person-specific rather than EU Citizen specific. U also rightly 
point out this is a broader term compared to the narrow citizen specific term I 
had imagined.  Dont you then think that this expands the risk exposure rather 
than limit it?

 

Either way, what of the AfriNIC data related to resource members who happen to 
be both African and European (and you and I know many of them ;-)  Does their 
data held in AfriNIC databases then fall under GDPR?

 

Anyway, the best thing for the Board to do is to carry out a GDPR Impact 
Assessment and share the report with the community about the risks or otherwise 
of GDPR in their processes/systems.

 

rgds.

 

walu 

 

 

 

 

 

On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 3:52 AM Owen DeLong  wrote:

 



On Jul 10, 2019, at 00:51 , John Walu  wrote:

 

@ Owen 

 

GDPR territorial scope extends beyond Europe since its is EU citizen specific 
rather than geo-specific.

 

https://gdpr-info.eu/art-3-gdpr/

 

Nope… It’s EU PERSON specific, not EU citizen.

 

EU Person has a rather odd definition, but it is a superset of EU citizens (or 
more accurately citizens of member nations).

 

However…

 

GDPR only pertains in so far as the data processing is related to:

 

 

· the offering of goods or services, irrespective of whether a payment 
of the data subject is required, to such data subjects in the Union; or

· the monitoring of their behaviour as far as their behaviour takes 
place within the Union.

 

Since AfriNIC specifically doesn’t offer services in the EU, and doesn’t 
monitor the behavior of anyone to the best of my knowledge, the applicability 
is suspect at best.

 

In other words, anyone (Data controller/processor) handling EU citizen data is 
automatically subject to the GDPR in the event of a data breach - irrespective 
of their geo-locality.

 

You also seem to have missed this part:

 

 

1.  This Regulation applies to the processing of personal data by a controller 
not established in the Union, but in a place where Member State law applies by 
virtue of public international law.

While the fact that Mauritius stupidly (IMHO) signed an agreement making this 
paragraph problematic, many other nations in Africa have not and so it’s again 
questionable whether the law can be applied to entities outside of AfriNIC that 
are in countries that haven’t agreed to partake in this particular brand of 
European overreach. (Which I admit is a trick they unfortunately learned from 
the gestapo tactics of the US banking regulators).

Note also that in Article 2 we have this:

 

 

1.  This Regulation does not apply to the processing of personal data:

1.  in the course of an activity which falls outside the scope of Union law;

I’m pretty sure that AfriNIC’s issuing of IP addresses is not in any way 
governed by EU law. As such, the activity in question is, by my reading, exempt.

 

 Ofcourse the main issue will be if the affected EU citizen will actually file 
a complaint in the EU Courts or not.  The second issue is whether the EU courts 
will find the data controller guilty and if the fined/penalized entity will to 
pay up or ignore given their remoteness to EU centers of power. (nb:Facebook 
and Google have so far been paying up ;-)

 

To the best of my knowledge, few, if any, of the people likely to be in the 
AfriNIC whois database would be EU persons since AfriNIC specifically requires 
the businesses they interact with to be in the AfriNIC service region. Is there 
a country in Africa that joined the EU without my noticing?

 

 

Is AfriNIC bound by GDPR?

 

The simple answer is -  it depends. 

Do Afrinic processes and systems at any one point collect, store or process 
data that contains EU citizens?

 

This is not the only criteria… Also it should be noted that the actual term is 
“EU persons” and not “EU citizens”.

 

Further, it only applies to EU Persons when conducting activities which fall 
within the scope of EU law. (see Article 2 reference above).

 

>From Lexology.com (an article by Morgan Lewis & Bockius LLP): 
>(https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=0dc9663d-ac3b-438e-adcd-1415a45f99ca)

 

At its core, the GDPR enumerates rights of natural persons who are present 
within the European Union (EU), whether or not their data is in fact in the EU. 
The word “citizen” does not appear in the language of the regulation, which 
would indicate a reluctance to simply identify rights of EU citizens as opposed 
to the rights of all 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Owen DeLong]

> On Jul 10, 2019, at 00:51 , John Walu  wrote:
> 
> @ Owen 
> 
> GDPR territorial scope extends beyond Europe since its is EU citizen specific 
> rather than geo-specific.
> 
> https://gdpr-info.eu/art-3-gdpr/ 

Nope… It’s EU PERSON specific, not EU citizen.

EU Person has a rather odd definition, but it is a superset of EU citizens (or 
more accurately citizens of member nations).

However…

GDPR only pertains in so far as the data processing is related to:


the offering of goods or services, irrespective of whether a payment of the 
data subject is required, to such data subjects in the Union; or
the monitoring of their behaviour as far as their behaviour takes place within 
the Union.

Since AfriNIC specifically doesn’t offer services in the EU, and doesn’t 
monitor the behavior of anyone to the best of my knowledge, the applicability 
is suspect at best.

> In other words, anyone (Data controller/processor) handling EU citizen data 
> is automatically subject to the GDPR in the event of a data breach - 
> irrespective of their geo-locality.

You also seem to have missed this part:


This Regulation applies to the processing of personal data by a controller not 
established in the Union, but in a place where Member State law applies by 
virtue of public international law.
While the fact that Mauritius stupidly (IMHO) signed an agreement making this 
paragraph problematic, many other nations in Africa have not and so it’s again 
questionable whether the law can be applied to entities outside of AfriNIC that 
are in countries that haven’t agreed to partake in this particular brand of 
European overreach. (Which I admit is a trick they unfortunately learned from 
the gestapo tactics of the US banking regulators).
Note also that in Article 2 we have this:


This Regulation does not apply to the processing of personal data:
in the course of an activity which falls outside the scope of Union law;
I’m pretty sure that AfriNIC’s issuing of IP addresses is not in any way 
governed by EU law. As such, the activity in question is, by my reading, exempt.

>  Ofcourse the main issue will be if the affected EU citizen will actually 
> file a complaint in the EU Courts or not.  The second issue is whether the EU 
> courts will find the data controller guilty and if the fined/penalized entity 
> will to pay up or ignore given their remoteness to EU centers of power. 
> (nb:Facebook and Google have so far been paying up ;-)

To the best of my knowledge, few, if any, of the people likely to be in the 
AfriNIC whois database would be EU persons since AfriNIC specifically requires 
the businesses they interact with to be in the AfriNIC service region. Is there 
a country in Africa that joined the EU without my noticing?

> 
> Is AfriNIC bound by GDPR?
> 
> The simple answer is -  it depends. 
> Do Afrinic processes and systems at any one point collect, store or process 
> data that contains EU citizens?
> 
This is not the only criteria… Also it should be noted that the actual term is 
“EU persons” and not “EU citizens”.

Further, it only applies to EU Persons when conducting activities which fall 
within the scope of EU law. (see Article 2 reference above).

From Lexology.com (an article by Morgan Lewis & Bockius LLP): 
(https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=0dc9663d-ac3b-438e-adcd-1415a45f99ca)

At its core, the GDPR enumerates rights of natural persons who are present 
within the European Union (EU), whether or not their data is in fact in the EU. 
The word “citizen” does not appear in the language of the regulation, which 
would indicate a reluctance to simply identify rights of EU citizens as opposed 
to the rights of all people within the boundaries of the EU. Practically 
speaking, the GDPR protects the rights of anyone within its territorial reach 
while at the same time applying to any entity[2] 

 using or accessing this personal data, no matter where the data exists. Trying 
to decipher what this means can be confusing without a more thorough analysis 
of the regulation and its accompanying commentary.

——


> If the answer is NO. Then they are not bound by GDPR.
> If the answer is YES. Then they are potentially bound by GDPR to the extent 
> that if that data is abused/breached, then they potentially face 
> sanctions/penalties from EU courts.

If the answer is YES, then there are more questions that need to be asked…

1.  Is the person actually in the EU at the time the personal data is 
provided?
2.  Is the person otherwise classified as an “EU Person”?

If the answer to either is YES, then there are more questions that need to be 
asked… If both are NO, then you’re done, no GDPR for you.

1.  Is the activity in question subject to EU legal jurisdiction?

If you can answer NO to this (and I can’t think of an activity where AfriNIC 
would be 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Mathieu Paonessa]

Dear all,

Just a quick reminder that many have forgotten:   
    - Réunion and Mayotte are part of the Afrinic service region.
    - There is members in both those territories that hold ressources
from Afrinic (IPv4, IPv6, AS).
    - Both territories are French and fully belong to the EU.

I think this closes the debate whether Afrinic is or isn't bound to GDPR.

Mathieu


On 10/07/2019 09:51, John Walu wrote:
> @ Owen 
>
> GDPR territorial scope extends beyond Europe since its is EU citizen
> specific rather than geo-specific.
>
> https://gdpr-info.eu/art-3-gdpr/
>
> In other words, anyone (Data controller/processor) handling EU citizen
> data is automatically subject to the GDPR in the event of a data
> breach - irrespective of their geo-locality.
>
>  Ofcourse the main issue will be if the affected EU citizen will
> actually file a complaint in the EU Courts or not.  The second issue
> is whether the EU courts will find the data controller guilty and if
> the fined/penalized entity will to pay up or ignore given their
> remoteness to EU centers of power. (nb:Facebook and Google have so far
> been paying up ;-)
>
> Is AfriNIC bound by GDPR?
>
> The simple answer is -  it depends. 
> Do Afrinic processes and systems at any one point collect, store or
> process data that contains EU citizens?
>
> If the answer is NO. Then they are not bound by GDPR.
> If the answer is YES. Then they are potentially bound by GDPR to the
> extent that if that data is abused/breached, then they potentially
> face sanctions/penalties from EU courts.
>
> Either way, Mauritius has one of the most comprehensive Data
> Protection legislation on the continent
> 
> and any data breach can actually be litigated locally (without the
> need for GDPR) with penalties to AfriNIC (if for example it is
> determined that email targets/addresses were harvested from Afrinic
> digital resources without consent from the data subjects).
>
> walu.
>
> On Wed, Jul 10, 2019 at 8:04 AM Owen DeLong  > wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jul 5, 2019, at 14:13 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via
> Community-Discuss  > wrote:
> >
> > Hi Alan,
> >
> > If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem,
> because Afrinic has to comply with GDPR.
>
> Why? AfriNIC is not located in the EU and does not solicit
> business with EU persons.
>
> AfriNIC is not, by my reading, subject to the GDPR.
>
> Even if they were, AfriNIC did not violate GDPR here. Wafa might
> have, but I don’t think she is subject to GDPR, either. Last I
> looked, Tunisia was outside EU jurisdiction.
>
>
> > I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else,
> but some logs may tell.
>
> Why is this relevant?
>
> > I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and
> I'm sure the community will be happy to forgive her. My intent is
> not to punish anyone, just to make sure that we find solutions to
> possible problems and mistakes and avoid repeating them.
>
> I have no issue with the use of the email addresses. I think the
> far more important issue here is the message sent under color of
> authority which authority likely was not authorized to Wafa at the
> time.
>
> Owen
>
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jordi
> > @jordipalet
> >
> >
> >
> > El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett"  > escribió:
> >
> >
> >
> >> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via
> Community-Discuss  > wrote:
> >>
> >> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
> >>
> >> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
> >>
> >> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have
> provided voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in
> Afrinic lists, or if those emails are part of their Afrinic
> contacts, in order to understand if this personal data (emails are
> personal data), have been collected from Afrinic internal databases.
> >
> >    There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate
> whether the recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by
> Wafa Dahmani.  There is also no reasonable way for staff to
> investigate whether email addresses were collected from the public
> WHOIS database.  There is no non-public AFRINIC database that
> could have been used.
> >
> >    Regards,
> >    Alan Barrett
> >
> >
> >    ___
> >    Community-Discuss mailing list
> >    Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
> 
> >    https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Ousmane M. TESSA]

Great to AfriNIC staff to have on the table this will to be up-dated,  
relating to such world-wide important issues!


Looking forward to seeing sound proposals  & actions, among them  
"education kits" for the readiness of our community to complain with  
these nowadays "acceptable rules" of Internet beyond continents, as  
Internet is ONE!


Merci beaucoup Alan

Dr Ousmane TESSA


Alan Barrett  a écrit :

On 10 Jul 2019, at 12:22, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via  
Community-Discuss  wrote:


Right now, I just checked the privacy statement in the web site  
(https://afrinic.net/privacy). Sadly, I don’t think this is  
consistent with the latest GDPR (even for the Mauritius regulation).


We recognise the need to update the privacy statement, and we have  
been working on that.


Alan Barrett


___
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--
**
Dr Ousmane MOUSSA TESSA
Département de mathématiques et d'informatique
Université A. Moumouni, Niamey, NIGER

Adresse postale: B.P. 10.111 Niamey, NIGER
Téléphone (domicile): +227 20 31 52 28
  (mobile) :  +227 93 77 74 93 /  91 49 16  39 / 96 27 99 92

E-mail: ousmane(at)musatesa.net ou musatesa(at)yahoo.com
Skype : musatesa



___
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Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Alan Barrett]

> On 10 Jul 2019, at 12:22, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
>  
> Right now, I just checked the privacy statement in the web site 
> (https://afrinic.net/privacy). Sadly, I don’t think this is consistent with 
> the latest GDPR (even for the Mauritius regulation).

We recognise the need to update the privacy statement, and we have been working 
on that.

Alan Barrett


___
Community-Discuss mailing list
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi John,

 

Right, those are the points that most of the people is missing:
Citizens and Residents of the EU are protected, never mind the infringement is 
committed outside that territory. You may decide not to pay the fine, but then 
that person/organization will not be able to continue doing business with the 
EU persons/organizations, and even more, if you at some point come to the EU, 
you can get detained until you pay the fine.
Mauritius signed an agreement with the EU about GDPR, so all the Mauritius 
organizations are also bound (Afrinic in our case). The same happened with 
Uruguay (so it happens the same with LACNIC).
 

Further, there is no need for a citizen to file a complaint in the courts (of 
course it can be done and it can claim even damages).

 

The process is much simpler. Any citizen/resident can file a free complaint, 
even via a web site if you have a digital certificate or equivalent (or by 
postal mail if you don’t have it), to the Data Protection Agency (of any EU 
country or equivalent entity in countries that signed the agreement with the 
EU). I’ve done that myself (even before GDPR), already about 2.000 times in the 
last 5 years, and I can tell that it works (and the companies pay fines), so 
I’m not talking about “smoke”.

 

The point is that in many cases, the Data Protection Agencies will open the 
case automatically by themselves. Before GDPR the maximum fine (for almost 
equivalent data protection breaches and spam) was 600.000 euros. Now is 20 
million euros or up to 4% of the worldwide annual revenue of the prior 
financial year, whichever is higher.

 

So, just make sure that if you are managing phone numbers or emails from EU 
citizens, you comply with the GDPR, and don’t provide those data to “others” 
even to friends or colleagues, unless you have a previous and explicit consent 
from the owner.

 

One recent example (this week) about a big fine:

 

https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/8/20685830/british-airways-data-breach-fine-information-commissioners-office-gdpr

 

I just hope that Afrinic has already took sufficient measures to comply with 
GDPR. Those fines aren’t peanuts!

 

Right now, I just checked the privacy statement in the web site 
(https://afrinic.net/privacy). Sadly, I don’t think this is consistent with the 
latest GDPR (even for the Mauritius regulation).

 

The board meeting on 6th May 2018 talks about that and confirms that it will be 
resolved before 24th May 2018 (25th was the strict deadline). If that really 
happened, the web site doesn’t state that. Minutes from the April 2019 still 
keep talking about that, but nothing clear from my reading.

 

This needs to be corrected immediately, or Afrinic can be subjected to 
very high fines.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 10/7/19 9:51, "John Walu"  escribió:

 

@ Owen 

 

GDPR territorial scope extends beyond Europe since its is EU citizen specific 
rather than geo-specific.

 

https://gdpr-info.eu/art-3-gdpr/

 

In other words, anyone (Data controller/processor) handling EU citizen data is 
automatically subject to the GDPR in the event of a data breach - irrespective 
of their geo-locality.

 

 Ofcourse the main issue will be if the affected EU citizen will actually file 
a complaint in the EU Courts or not.  The second issue is whether the EU courts 
will find the data controller guilty and if the fined/penalized entity will to 
pay up or ignore given their remoteness to EU centers of power. (nb:Facebook 
and Google have so far been paying up ;-)

 

Is AfriNIC bound by GDPR?

 

The simple answer is -  it depends. 

Do Afrinic processes and systems at any one point collect, store or process 
data that contains EU citizens?

 

If the answer is NO. Then they are not bound by GDPR.

If the answer is YES. Then they are potentially bound by GDPR to the extent 
that if that data is abused/breached, then they potentially face 
sanctions/penalties from EU courts.

 

Either way, Mauritius has one of the most comprehensive Data Protection 
legislation on the continent and any data breach can actually be litigated 
locally (without the need for GDPR) with penalties to AfriNIC (if for example 
it is determined that email targets/addresses were harvested from Afrinic 
digital resources without consent from the data subjects).

 

walu.

 

On Wed, Jul 10, 2019 at 8:04 AM Owen DeLong  wrote:



> On Jul 5, 2019, at 14:13 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Alan,
> 
> If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because Afrinic 
> has to comply with GDPR.

Why? AfriNIC is not located in the EU and does not solicit business with EU 
persons.

AfriNIC is not, by my reading, subject to the GDPR.

Even if they were, AfriNIC did not violate GDPR here. Wafa might have, but I 
don’t think she is subject to GDPR, either. Last I looked, Tunisia was outside 
EU jurisdiction.


> I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Kris Seeburn]

Well said walu

But the Parliament in Mauritius is about to pass the privacy law at some point 
which is very close to GDPR. Which is to protect the Mauritius citizens equally 
so I would say as I keep saying this let us just use the most not lenient laws 
so we have a compass to ensure compliance with the harshest one which makes it 
more difficult to miss out on things. 



Kris Seeburn
Email: seebur...@gmail.com 
Linkedin: linkedin.com/in/kseeburn/ 
Twitter: twitter.com/seeburnk 

 


> On Jul 10, 2019, at 11:51 AM, John Walu  wrote:
> 
> @ Owen 
> 
> GDPR territorial scope extends beyond Europe since its is EU citizen specific 
> rather than geo-specific.
> 
> https://gdpr-info.eu/art-3-gdpr/ 
> 
> In other words, anyone (Data controller/processor) handling EU citizen data 
> is automatically subject to the GDPR in the event of a data breach - 
> irrespective of their geo-locality.
> 
>  Ofcourse the main issue will be if the affected EU citizen will actually 
> file a complaint in the EU Courts or not.  The second issue is whether the EU 
> courts will find the data controller guilty and if the fined/penalized entity 
> will to pay up or ignore given their remoteness to EU centers of power. 
> (nb:Facebook and Google have so far been paying up ;-)
> 
> Is AfriNIC bound by GDPR?
> 
> The simple answer is -  it depends. 
> Do Afrinic processes and systems at any one point collect, store or process 
> data that contains EU citizens?
> 
> If the answer is NO. Then they are not bound by GDPR.
> If the answer is YES. Then they are potentially bound by GDPR to the extent 
> that if that data is abused/breached, then they potentially face 
> sanctions/penalties from EU courts.
> 
> Either way, Mauritius has one of the most comprehensive Data Protection 
> legislation on the continent 
>  and 
> any data breach can actually be litigated locally (without the need for GDPR) 
> with penalties to AfriNIC (if for example it is determined that email 
> targets/addresses were harvested from Afrinic digital resources without 
> consent from the data subjects).
> 
> walu.
> 
> On Wed, Jul 10, 2019 at 8:04 AM Owen DeLong  > wrote:
> 
> 
> > On Jul 5, 2019, at 14:13 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
> > mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net>> 
> > wrote:
> > 
> > Hi Alan,
> > 
> > If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because Afrinic 
> > has to comply with GDPR.
> 
> Why? AfriNIC is not located in the EU and does not solicit business with EU 
> persons.
> 
> AfriNIC is not, by my reading, subject to the GDPR.
> 
> Even if they were, AfriNIC did not violate GDPR here. Wafa might have, but I 
> don’t think she is subject to GDPR, either. Last I looked, Tunisia was 
> outside EU jurisdiction.
> 
> 
> > I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, but some 
> > logs may tell.
> 
> Why is this relevant?
> 
> > I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and I'm sure the 
> > community will be happy to forgive her. My intent is not to punish anyone, 
> > just to make sure that we find solutions to possible problems and mistakes 
> > and avoid repeating them.
> 
> I have no issue with the use of the email addresses. I think the far more 
> important issue here is the message sent under color of authority which 
> authority likely was not authorized to Wafa at the time.
> 
> Owen
> 
> > 
> > Regards,
> > Jordi
> > @jordipalet
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett"  > > escribió:
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
> >> mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net>> 
> >> wrote:
> >> 
> >> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
> >> 
> >> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
> >> 
> >> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
> >> voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or 
> >> if those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand 
> >> if this personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from 
> >> Afrinic internal databases.
> > 
> >There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether the 
> > recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.  There 
> > is also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email addresses 
> > were collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no non-public 
> > AFRINIC database that could have been used.
> > 
> >Regards,
> >Alan Barrett
> > 
> > 
> >___
> >Community-Discuss mailing list
> >Community-Discuss@afrinic.net 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[John Walu]

@ Owen

GDPR territorial scope extends beyond Europe since its is EU citizen
specific rather than geo-specific.

https://gdpr-info.eu/art-3-gdpr/

In other words, anyone (Data controller/processor) handling EU citizen data
is automatically subject to the GDPR in the event of a data breach -
irrespective of their geo-locality.

 Ofcourse the main issue will be if the affected EU citizen will actually
file a complaint in the EU Courts or not.  The second issue is whether the
EU courts will find the data controller guilty and if the fined/penalized
entity will to pay up or ignore given their remoteness to EU centers of
power. (nb:Facebook and Google have so far been paying up ;-)

Is AfriNIC bound by GDPR?

The simple answer is -  it depends.
Do Afrinic processes and systems at any one point collect, store or process
data that contains EU citizens?

If the answer is NO. Then they are not bound by GDPR.
If the answer is YES. Then they are potentially bound by GDPR to the extent
that if that data is abused/breached, then they potentially face
sanctions/penalties from EU courts.

Either way, Mauritius has one of the most comprehensive Data Protection
legislation on the continent

and any data breach can actually be litigated locally (without the need for
GDPR) with penalties to AfriNIC (if for example it is determined that email
targets/addresses were harvested from Afrinic digital resources without
consent from the data subjects).

walu.

On Wed, Jul 10, 2019 at 8:04 AM Owen DeLong  wrote:

>
>
> > On Jul 5, 2019, at 14:13 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss <
> community-discuss@afrinic.net> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Alan,
> >
> > If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because
> Afrinic has to comply with GDPR.
>
> Why? AfriNIC is not located in the EU and does not solicit business with
> EU persons.
>
> AfriNIC is not, by my reading, subject to the GDPR.
>
> Even if they were, AfriNIC did not violate GDPR here. Wafa might have, but
> I don’t think she is subject to GDPR, either. Last I looked, Tunisia was
> outside EU jurisdiction.
>
>
> > I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, but some
> logs may tell.
>
> Why is this relevant?
>
> > I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and I'm sure
> the community will be happy to forgive her. My intent is not to punish
> anyone, just to make sure that we find solutions to possible problems and
> mistakes and avoid repeating them.
>
> I have no issue with the use of the email addresses. I think the far more
> important issue here is the message sent under color of authority which
> authority likely was not authorized to Wafa at the time.
>
> Owen
>
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jordi
> > @jordipalet
> >
> >
> >
> > El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett"  escribió:
> >
> >
> >
> >> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss <
> community-discuss@afrinic.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
> >>
> >> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
> >>
> >> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided
> voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or
> if those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand
> if this personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from
> Afrinic internal databases.
> >
> >There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether
> the recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.
> There is also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email
> addresses were collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no
> non-public AFRINIC database that could have been used.
> >
> >Regards,
> >Alan Barrett
> >
> >
> >___
> >Community-Discuss mailing list
> >Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
> >https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > **
> > IPv4 is over
> > Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> > http://www.theipv6company.com
> > The IPv6 Company
> >
> > This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or
> confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of
> the individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized
> disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this
> information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly
> prohibited and will be considered a criminal offense. If you are not the
> intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or
> use of the contents of this information, even if partially, including
> attached files, is strictly prohibited, will be considered a criminal
> offense, so you must reply to the original sender to inform about this
> communication and 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

Ok Owen, let me agree with you this time.
As I said in my first intervention in this issue I my self - and many others 
like you - will not state my affiliation/membership when sending such email, 
but in the same-time I can't blame people do. IMHO I think sending email to 
anonymous without stating your positions is useless especially for those who 
didn't have enough information about AFRINIC - and I think the group received 
Wafa message is one of them.
I also didn't see that Wafa should apologies and we are not in a position to 
punish her, this is just a different way to communicate. Its OK to notifying 
her with our opinions - that why we are here in a community list -  but we need 
to respect our diversity.

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Owen DeLong 
Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2019 7:55 AM
To: Sami Salih
Cc: Andrew Alston; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Sami,

I would hope that you (and others) can see the difference between your 
signature as SUST (which merely depicts an affiliation) and campaigning with a 
signature that purports to represent multiple groups seen by many in the 
community as authority figures and/or positions of responsibility within the 
community.

You will note, for example, that when I go to the microphone or post something 
on the list, I do not include anything about my membership on the ARIN advisory 
council and in many cases, will go out of my way to make it very clear that I 
am speaking only for myself and not representing the views of ARIN, the AC, etc.

IMHO, there’s nothing particularly wrong with the content of Wafa’s email, but, 
if she was going to put that content above the signature she did, she should 
have made it clear that those groups were not endorsing the candidates or 
opinions expressed.

Owen


On Jul 3, 2019, at 04:47 , Sami Salih 
mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com>> wrote:

Salam,

I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
(I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat of 
AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned signature 
represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community and gives the 
recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of the community. 
This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
them to support/oppose something.
My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
represent SUST!

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Andrew Alston 
mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:28 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

This email raises so many questions.



While as I have clearly stated – I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs – however – I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.



As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.



  1.  Is this email representative of the ASO /AC ‘s view
  2.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee – and how does that align with the neutrality that is meant to exist 
in such a committee.
  3.  Is this email representative of the views of Global IGF?



I really hope not – but – I have to ask – since that is what the email was 
signed as.



Thanks



Andrew





From: Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:15
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?





If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?



I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community





Thanks,



Ahmed Fadl

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Owen DeLong]

> On Jul 5, 2019, at 14:13 , JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Alan,
> 
> If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because Afrinic 
> has to comply with GDPR.

Why? AfriNIC is not located in the EU and does not solicit business with EU 
persons.

AfriNIC is not, by my reading, subject to the GDPR.

Even if they were, AfriNIC did not violate GDPR here. Wafa might have, but I 
don’t think she is subject to GDPR, either. Last I looked, Tunisia was outside 
EU jurisdiction.


> I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, but some logs 
> may tell.

Why is this relevant?

> I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and I'm sure the 
> community will be happy to forgive her. My intent is not to punish anyone, 
> just to make sure that we find solutions to possible problems and mistakes 
> and avoid repeating them.

I have no issue with the use of the email addresses. I think the far more 
important issue here is the message sent under color of authority which 
authority likely was not authorized to Wafa at the time.

Owen

> 
> Regards,
> Jordi
> @jordipalet
> 
> 
> 
> El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett"  escribió:
> 
> 
> 
>> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
>> 
>> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
>> 
>> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
>> voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or 
>> if those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand 
>> if this personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from 
>> Afrinic internal databases.
> 
>There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether the 
> recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.  There is 
> also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email addresses were 
> collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no non-public AFRINIC 
> database that could have been used.
> 
>Regards,
>Alan Barrett
> 
> 
>___
>Community-Discuss mailing list
>Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
>https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss
> 
> 
> 
> 
> **
> IPv4 is over
> Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> http://www.theipv6company.com
> The IPv6 Company
> 
> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
> confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
> individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
> copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
> partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
> considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware 
> that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
> information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
> prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
> original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Noah]

On Sat, Jul 6, 2019 at 1:09 AM Omo Oaiya  wrote:

>
>
> On 5 Jul 2019, at 23:01, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss <
> community-discuss@afrinic.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Ommo,
>
> Responding very shortly:
>
> If the emails come from an internal Afrinic database (for example,
> membership), then the data protection regulations are not efficient.
>
>
> Perhaps you missed this?
>
>
>
> On 5 Jul 2019, at 09:13, Alan Barrett  wrote:
>
>  There is no non-public AFRINIC database that could have been used.
>
>
>
>
> The nicer/faster solution is that Wafa tell us how the emails were
> collected, because if there is some unexpected “open” database, we need to
> correct it.
>
>
>
> OK.  Ask her nicely then.   She might “forgive” you and tell you.
>

I doubt she will because Jordi (supposed champion of GDPR) seems to be
attempting to harrass Wafa.

Noah
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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Omo Oaiya]

> On 5 Jul 2019, at 23:01, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Ommo,
>  
> Responding very shortly:
>  
> If the emails come from an internal Afrinic database (for example, 
> membership), then the data protection regulations are not efficient.

Perhaps you missed this?

> 
> On 5 Jul 2019, at 09:13, Alan Barrett  wrote:
> 
>  There is no non-public AFRINIC database that could have been used.



>  
> The nicer/faster solution is that Wafa tell us how the emails were collected, 
> because if there is some unexpected “open” database, we need to correct it.
>  

OK.  Ask her nicely then.   She might “forgive” you and tell you.


> Regards,
> Jordi
> 
> @jordipalet
> 
>  
> 
>  
>  
> El 5/7/19 23:57, "Omo Oaiya"  > escribió:
>  
> Jordi,
>  
> 
> 
>> On 5 Jul 2019, at 22:13, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>> mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net>> wrote:
>>  
>> Hi Alan,
>> 
>> If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because Afrinic 
>> has to comply with GDPR.
>> 
>> I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, but some 
>> logs may tell.
>  
>  
> …may have a problem
>  
> …..I don’t know if those ..
>  
> Seems to me that you are fishing and stretching this a bit.   What 
> responsibilities would AFRINIC not have complied with in this case?
>  
>> 
>> I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and I'm sure the 
>> community will be happy to forgive her. 
>  
>  
> If anything, this business is between Wafa and the folks with whom she 
> communicated.  I don’t see how “forgiveness” by the community comes in. 
>  
>> My intent is not to punish anyone, 
>  
> Even if it were, how would you punish anyone??
> 
> 
>> just to make sure that we find solutions to possible problems and mistakes 
>> and avoid repeating them.
>  
> It is starting to look like you have more in mind than that.
>  
> Best wishes
> Omo
>  
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Jordi
>> @jordipalet
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett" > > escribió:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>>> mailto:community-discuss@afrinic.net>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
>>> 
>>> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
>>> 
>>> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
>>> voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or 
>>> if those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand 
>>> if this personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from 
>>> Afrinic internal databases.
>> 
>>There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether the 
>> recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.  There 
>> is also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email addresses 
>> were collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no non-public 
>> AFRINIC database that could have been used.
>> 
>>Regards,
>>Alan Barrett
>> 
>> 
>>___
>>Community-Discuss mailing list
>>Community-Discuss@afrinic.net 
>>https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> **
>> IPv4 is over
>> Are you ready for the new Internet ?
>> http://www.theipv6company.com 
>> The IPv6 Company
>> 
>> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
>> confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
>> individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
>> copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
>> partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
>> considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be 
>> aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of 
>> this information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
>> prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
>> original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> Community-Discuss mailing list
>> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net 
>> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss 
>> 
>  
> 
> Omo OAIYA
> Chief Strategy Officer/Directeur de la Stratégie | WACREN 
> 
> m: +234 808 888 1571 , +233 205 228 693
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> **
> IPv4 is over
> Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Ommo,

 

Responding very shortly:

 

If the emails come from an internal Afrinic database (for example, membership), 
then the data protection regulations are not efficient.

 

The nicer/faster solution is that Wafa tell us how the emails were collected, 
because if there is some unexpected “open” database, we need to correct it.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 5/7/19 23:57, "Omo Oaiya"  escribió:

 

Jordi,

 



On 5 Jul 2019, at 22:13, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
 wrote:

 

Hi Alan,

If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because Afrinic has 
to comply with GDPR.

I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, but some logs 
may tell.

 

 

…may have a problem

 

…..I don’t know if those ..

 

Seems to me that you are fishing and stretching this a bit.   What 
responsibilities would AFRINIC not have complied with in this case?

 


I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and I'm sure the 
community will be happy to forgive her. 

 

 

If anything, this business is between Wafa and the folks with whom she 
communicated.  I don’t see how “forgiveness” by the community comes in. 

 

My intent is not to punish anyone, 

 

Even if it were, how would you punish anyone??



just to make sure that we find solutions to possible problems and mistakes and 
avoid repeating them.

 

It is starting to look like you have more in mind than that.

 

Best wishes

Omo

 


Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet



El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett"  escribió:





On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
 wrote:

I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.

Can the board and the staff investigate this?

Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or if 
those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand if this 
personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from Afrinic 
internal databases.


   There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether the 
recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.  There is 
also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email addresses were 
collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no non-public AFRINIC 
database that could have been used.

   Regards,
   Alan Barrett


   ___
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**
IPv4 is over
Are you ready for the new Internet ?
http://www.theipv6company.com
The IPv6 Company

This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware 
that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.




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Omo OAIYA
Chief Strategy Officer/Directeur de la Stratégie | WACREN
m: +234 808 888 1571 , +233 205 228 693


 





 



**
IPv4 is over
Are you ready for the new Internet ?
http://www.theipv6company.com
The IPv6 Company

This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware 
that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.

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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Omo Oaiya]

Jordi,


> On 5 Jul 2019, at 22:13, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Alan,
> 
> If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because Afrinic 
> has to comply with GDPR.
> 
> I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, but some logs 
> may tell.


…may have a problem

…..I don’t know if those ..

Seems to me that you are fishing and stretching this a bit.   What 
responsibilities would AFRINIC not have complied with in this case?

> 
> I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and I'm sure the 
> community will be happy to forgive her.


If anything, this business is between Wafa and the folks with whom she 
communicated.  I don’t see how “forgiveness” by the community comes in. 

> My intent is not to punish anyone, 

Even if it were, how would you punish anyone??

> just to make sure that we find solutions to possible problems and mistakes 
> and avoid repeating them.

It is starting to look like you have more in mind than that.

Best wishes
Omo

> 
> Regards,
> Jordi
> @jordipalet
> 
> 
> 
> El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett"  escribió:
> 
> 
> 
>> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
>> 
>> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
>> 
>> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
>> voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or 
>> if those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand 
>> if this personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from 
>> Afrinic internal databases.
> 
>There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether the 
> recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.  There is 
> also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email addresses were 
> collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no non-public AFRINIC 
> database that could have been used.
> 
>Regards,
>Alan Barrett
> 
> 
>___
>Community-Discuss mailing list
>Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
>https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss
> 
> 
> 
> 
> **
> IPv4 is over
> Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> http://www.theipv6company.com
> The IPv6 Company
> 
> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
> confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
> individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
> copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
> partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
> considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware 
> that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
> information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
> prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
> original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
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> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss


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m: +234 808 888 1571 , +233 205 228 693







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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Alan,

If the board can't investigate that, we may have a problem, because Afrinic has 
to comply with GDPR.

I don't know if those emails come from whois or something else, but some logs 
may tell.

I my opinion it will be nicer to get a response from Wafa, and I'm sure the 
community will be happy to forgive her. My intent is not to punish anyone, just 
to make sure that we find solutions to possible problems and mistakes and avoid 
repeating them.

Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet
 
 

El 5/7/19 10:16, "Alan Barrett"  escribió:



> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
 wrote:
> 
> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
>  
> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
>  
> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or if 
those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand if this 
personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from Afrinic 
internal databases.

There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether the 
recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.  There is 
also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email addresses were 
collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no non-public AFRINIC 
database that could have been used.

Regards,
Alan Barrett


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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Noah,

 

I just responded to a previous email on this.

 

The law is not about “if you don’t like an email send it to the junk box”. The 
law is about protecting people privacy and emails are (in most of the countries 
in the world), personal data.

 

Nobody can use emails for a different purpose as the one they have been 
provided. Spam is not about “repetitive” emails. Spam is “any” single email 
that is not authorized, because you didn’t provided the email for that.

 

Saying “send it to the junk box” is like saying a victim of rape (or whatever 
other crime), is your fault, you were on the wrong streeet on the wrong time, 
don’t go there.

 

I understand that in some countries this is not the law, but we should respect, 
when working in the Afrinic enviroment, the laws from Mauritious, which is one 
of the countries that has already agreed on those data protection regulations 
(GDPR).

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 5/7/19 10:51, "Noah"  escribió:

 

 

 

On Thu, Jul 4, 2019 at 1:42 AM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
 wrote:

Hi Noah,

 

I’m sure we all have contacts from lots of people from the community, but we 
use those contacts for the reason they have been provided, is not lawful to use 
those for anything else.

 

I have sent some of my contacts an emails that were not related to the original 
reasons the email was provided for. I have received emails from my contacts and 
people who are not my contact. I even receive calls from people I don't know 
and who are not my in my mobile phone contact. If I found the email reasonable, 
I act on it otherwise I delete it, simple as that.  If you don't like the 
email, send it to the SPAM/JUNK email, simple as that. If you don't like the 
phone call, drop it.

 

People share other peoples contacts email/phones and people ask other people 
about other peoples contacts. In my country, I even receive presidential 
campaign text messages and sometime from even member of parliament requesting 
for my vote in the national elections. Candidates and their supports always go 
so far in outreach activities in order to consolidate support from different 
constituencies for their preferred candidate and its the nature of political 
campaigns world over. 

 

If the same email or call is made frequently, then that is a different story.

 

Noah



**
IPv4 is over
Are you ready for the new Internet ?
http://www.theipv6company.com
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This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware 
that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.

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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Badru,

 

Well with the response from Ahmed, it is clear that:
He didn’t provided his email.
He didn’t authorized this kind of communication.
 

Only the sender can tell from were the emails have been obtained, but in any 
case, it is an illegal action in many countries (personal data 
collection/proccesing without the owner authorization,  and sending spam 
without previous and explicit consent).

 

I’ve got also a handful of emails, in private, from other folks that have been 
in the same situation as Ahmed. I asked them to go to the list, because I need 
to respect their privacy if they don’t want to say.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 5/7/19 6:13, "Badru Ntege"  escribió:

 

Jordi  

 

Curious to know the end in mind with your question??   Please elucidate

 

BN

 

 

From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
Reply-To: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ 
Date: Thursday, July 4, 2019 at 12:11 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl , "Community-Discuss@afrinic.net" 

Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Hi Ahmen,

 

I mean before getting the email advertisings the candidates, have you 
personally provided your email to Wafa?

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 10:06, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Hi Jordi 

Already my mail provided for all community members

Thank you 

 

 

From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:00 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Hi Ahmed,

 

Can you confirm if you have provided your email to Wafa and if that’s the case, 
if it was for discussing about candidates?

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 9:32, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Thank you Sami for your introduction

Let me also introduce myself 

My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.

Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.

Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.

My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.

I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know 

The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.

This is what I mean by my mail.

Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.

Also all respect for community members.

Thank you 

 

 

From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah ; Ahmed Fadl 
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani 
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Salam

 

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !

Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

 

BR 

 

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355 

From: Noah 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections 

 

Dear Ahmed

 

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

 

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

 

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

 

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Noah]

On Thu, Jul 4, 2019 at 1:42 AM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss <
community-discuss@afrinic.net> wrote:

> Hi Noah,
>
>
>
> I’m sure we all have contacts from lots of people from the community, but
> we use those contacts for the reason they have been provided, is not lawful
> to use those for anything else.
>

I have sent some of my contacts an emails that were not related to the
original reasons the email was provided for. I have received emails from my
contacts and people who are not my contact. I even receive calls from
people I don't know and who are not my in my mobile phone contact. If I
found the email reasonable, I act on it otherwise I delete it, simple as
that.  If you don't like the email, send it to the SPAM/JUNK email, simple
as that. If you don't like the phone call, drop it.

People share other peoples contacts email/phones and people ask other
people about other peoples contacts. In my country, I even receive
presidential campaign text messages and sometime from even member of
parliament requesting for my vote in the national elections. Candidates and
their supports always go so far in outreach activities in order to
consolidate support from different constituencies for their preferred
candidate and its the nature of political campaigns world over.

If the same email or call is made frequently, then that is a different
story.

Noah
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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Alan Barrett]

> On 3 Jul 2019, at 15:50, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
>  wrote:
> 
> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
>  
> Can the board and the staff investigate this?
>  
> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
> voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or if 
> those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand if 
> this personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from 
> Afrinic internal databases.

There is no reasonable way for AFRINIC staff to investigate whether the 
recipients had agreed to receive the messages sent by Wafa Dahmani.  There is 
also no reasonable way for staff to investigate whether email addresses were 
collected from the public WHOIS database.  There is no non-public AFRINIC 
database that could have been used.

Regards,
Alan Barrett


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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Badru Ntege]

Jordi

Curious to know the end in mind with your question??   Please elucidate

BN


From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
Reply-To: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ 
Date: Thursday, July 4, 2019 at 12:11 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl , "Community-Discuss@afrinic.net" 

Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi Ahmen,

I mean before getting the email advertisings the candidates, have you 
personally provided your email to Wafa?

Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet



El 4/7/19 10:06, "Ahmed Fadl" 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>> escribió:

Hi Jordi
Already my mail provided for all community members
Thank you


From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:00 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi Ahmed,

Can you confirm if you have provided your email to Wafa and if that’s the case, 
if it was for discussing about candidates?

Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet



El 4/7/19 9:32, "Ahmed Fadl" 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>> escribió:

Thank you Sami for your introduction
Let me also introduce myself
My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.
Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.
Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.
My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.
I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know
The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.
This is what I mean by my mail.
Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.
Also all respect for community members.
Thank you


From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>; Ahmed Fadl 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Salam

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !
Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Dear Ahmed

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various matters pertaining the African Internet Community. What I am trying 
to say is that, Wafa as a community member, just like me, so often speaks on 
her own personal capacity and I believe she has since clarified this to you and 
the community.

Therefore, I doubt its "bias"as you put it .. and my view of that email 
from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate and 
candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid off as 
some of the candidate she was s

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Thanks a lot for your response Ahmed!

 

I think is key to identify the source of the emails and to make sure that they 
haven’t been provided explicitly by the owners.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 10:25, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

No 

 

 

Ahmed Fadl  |​  Healthcare Applications DirectorP: +201229889806   |  EXT: 6236 
  |   E: ahmed.f...@57357.org 
​ 
The information contained in this transmission may contain privileged and 
confidential information. It is intended only for the use of the person(s) 
named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified 
that any review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this 
communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, 
please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original 
message

 

 

From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:09 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Hi Ahmen,

 

I mean before getting the email advertisings the candidates, have you 
personally provided your email to Wafa?

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 10:06, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Hi Jordi 

Already my mail provided for all community members

Thank you 

 

 

From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:00 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Hi Ahmed,

 

Can you confirm if you have provided your email to Wafa and if that’s the case, 
if it was for discussing about candidates?

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 9:32, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Thank you Sami for your introduction

Let me also introduce myself 

My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.

Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.

Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.

My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.

I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know 

The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.

This is what I mean by my mail.

Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.

Also all respect for community members.

Thank you 

 

 

From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah ; Ahmed Fadl 
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani 
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Salam

 

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !

Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

 

BR 

 

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355 

From: Noah 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections 

 

Dear Ahmed

 

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

 

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

 

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

 

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Ahmed Fadl]

Thanks for clarification


[cid:5310A542-164E-418D-8580-1702FF9D8251]
Ahmed Fadl  |​  Healthcare Applications Director
P: +201229889806   |  EXT: 6236   |   E: 
ahmed.f...@57357.org<mailto:mona.ashma...@57357.org>

​ [cid:image001.png@01D2A70B.D20C5C70]

The information contained in this transmission may contain privileged and 
confidential information. It is intended only for the use of the person(s) 
named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified 
that any review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this 
communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, 
please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original 
message



From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 9:47 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Noah 
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani 
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Shokran Ahmed for showing up, welcome to AFRINIC community.

you said: I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I 
don’t know

If I understand your sentence correctly, I have to tell you that AFRINIC board 
is 9 seats (6 Regional, 2 Non-Regional, and the CEO).
for more details please visit AFRINIC Governance portal
https://afrinic.net/board

hope this help clarifying the issue.

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:28 AM
To: Sami Salih; Noah
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani
Subject: RE: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections


Thank you Sami for your introduction

Let me also introduce myself

My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.

Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.

Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.

My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.

I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know

The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.

This is what I mean by my mail.

Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.

Also all respect for community members.

Thank you





From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>; Ahmed Fadl 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Salam



I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !

Looking for your positive continuous engagement.



BR



Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355



From: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Dear Ahmed



First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.



So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.



Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.



I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Andrew Alston]

Indeed  I was attempting to avoid lobbying from an unbiased perspective and 
encouraging people to read and make up their own minds

*grin*

Andrew


From: Frank Habicht 
Sent: Thursday, 4 July 2019 11:13
To: community-discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi,

I don't want to speak for Andrew, but I think these 2 links can be helpful:
https://lmgtfy.com/?q=apparent+authority<https://lmgtfy.com/?q=apparent+authority>
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apparent_authority<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apparent_authority>

I think Andrew was encouraging own initiative of the reader.

Regards,
Frank


On 04/07/2019 10:51, Sami Salih wrote:
> Andrew
> Just a reminder, Please share the link
>
> *Dr. Sami H.O. Salih*
> Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
> Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
> President of SDv6TF
> T/F: (249)122045707/187171355
> 
> *From:* Sami Salih mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com>>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:54 PM
> *To:* Andrew Alston; Sander Steffann
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann; 
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; Ahmed 
> Fadl; wafa
> Dahmani
> *Subject:* Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
>
> Could you please share the link
>
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36<https://aka.ms/ghei36>>
>
> 
> *From:* Andrew Alston 
> mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:52:10 PM
> *To:* Sami Salih; Sander Steffann
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani;
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
> *Subject:* RE: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
>
>
> Sami,
>
>
>
> Do yourself a favor – and go and read up on the doctrine of apparent
> authority.
>
>
>
> It makes for some fascinating reading – particularly the case law in
> various jurisdictions about email domains and email signatures.  I’ll
> let you draw your own conclusions from what you find, keeping in mind
> I’m no lawyer – but I do have an interest in this stuff – and reading
> material was… very interesting 
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:*Sami Salih mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com>>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 3 July 2019 16:33
> *To:* Sander Steffann mailto:san...@steffann.nl>>
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann mailto:san...@retevia.net>>; Andrew 
> Alston
> mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>; 
> Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>;
> wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>; 
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
>
>
>
> So wafa use her public email too :-)
>
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36<https://aka.ms/ghei36>>
>
>
>
> 
>
> *From:*Sander Steffann  <mailto:san...@steffann.nl<mailto:san...@steffann.nl%20%3cmailto:san...@steffann.nl>>>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:27:55 PM
> *To:* Sami Salih
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann; Andrew Alston; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani;
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net> 
> <mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
>
>
>
> Hi Sami,
>
>> I'm using a public email (outlook.com) not my official one
> (sustech.sd), however my signature is MY signature I use it to show the
> people the ground where I stand when I say something.
>
> Exactly.
> Sander
>
>
> ___
> Community-Discuss mailing list
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss<https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss>
>

___
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Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss<https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss>
___
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Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Ahmed Fadl]

No


[cid:5310A542-164E-418D-8580-1702FF9D8251]
Ahmed Fadl  |​  Healthcare Applications Director
P: +201229889806   |  EXT: 6236   |   E: 
ahmed.f...@57357.org<mailto:mona.ashma...@57357.org>

​ [cid:image001.png@01D2A70B.D20C5C70]

The information contained in this transmission may contain privileged and 
confidential information. It is intended only for the use of the person(s) 
named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified 
that any review, dissemination, distribution or duplication of this 
communication is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, 
please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original 
message



From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:09 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi Ahmen,

I mean before getting the email advertisings the candidates, have you 
personally provided your email to Wafa?

Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet



El 4/7/19 10:06, "Ahmed Fadl" 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>> escribió:

Hi Jordi
Already my mail provided for all community members
Thank you


From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:00 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi Ahmed,

Can you confirm if you have provided your email to Wafa and if that’s the case, 
if it was for discussing about candidates?

Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet



El 4/7/19 9:32, "Ahmed Fadl" 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>> escribió:

Thank you Sami for your introduction
Let me also introduce myself
My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.
Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.
Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.
My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.
I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know
The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.
This is what I mean by my mail.
Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.
Also all respect for community members.
Thank you


From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>; Ahmed Fadl 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Salam

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !
Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Dear Ahmed

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some memb

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Frank Habicht]

Hi,

I don't want to speak for Andrew, but I think these 2 links can be helpful:
https://lmgtfy.com/?q=apparent+authority
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apparent_authority

I think Andrew was encouraging own initiative of the reader.

Regards,
Frank


On 04/07/2019 10:51, Sami Salih wrote:
> Andrew 
> Just a reminder, Please share the link
> 
> *Dr. Sami H.O. Salih*
> Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
> Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
> President of SDv6TF
> T/F: (249)122045707/187171355
> 
> *From:* Sami Salih 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:54 PM
> *To:* Andrew Alston; Sander Steffann
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; Ahmed Fadl; wafa
> Dahmani
> *Subject:* Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
>  
> Could you please share the link
> 
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>
> 
> 
> *From:* Andrew Alston 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:52:10 PM
> *To:* Sami Salih; Sander Steffann
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani;
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
> *Subject:* RE: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
>  
> 
> Sami,
> 
>  
> 
> Do yourself a favor – and go and read up on the doctrine of apparent
> authority.
> 
>  
> 
> It makes for some fascinating reading – particularly the case law in
> various jurisdictions about email domains and email signatures.  I’ll
> let you draw your own conclusions from what you find, keeping in mind
> I’m no lawyer – but I do have an interest in this stuff – and reading
> material was… very interesting 
> 
>  
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> Andrew
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> *From:*Sami Salih 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 3 July 2019 16:33
> *To:* Sander Steffann 
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann ; Andrew Alston
> ; Ahmed Fadl ;
> wafa Dahmani ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
> *Subject:* Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
> 
>  
> 
> So wafa use her public email too :-)
> 
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> *From:*Sander Steffann mailto:san...@steffann.nl>>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:27:55 PM
> *To:* Sami Salih
> *Cc:* Sander Steffann; Andrew Alston; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani;
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net <mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections
> 
>  
> 
> Hi Sami,
> 
>> I'm using a public email (outlook.com) not my official one
> (sustech.sd), however my signature is MY signature I use it to show the
> people the ground where I stand when I say something.
> 
> Exactly.
> Sander
> 
> 
> ___
> Community-Discuss mailing list
> Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
> https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss
> 

___
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Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Ahmen,

 

I mean before getting the email advertisings the candidates, have you 
personally provided your email to Wafa?

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 10:06, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Hi Jordi 

Already my mail provided for all community members

Thank you 

 

 

From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:00 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Hi Ahmed,

 

Can you confirm if you have provided your email to Wafa and if that’s the case, 
if it was for discussing about candidates?

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 9:32, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Thank you Sami for your introduction

Let me also introduce myself 

My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.

Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.

Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.

My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.

I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know 

The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.

This is what I mean by my mail.

Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.

Also all respect for community members.

Thank you 

 

 

From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah ; Ahmed Fadl 
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani 
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Salam

 

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !

Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

 

BR 

 

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355 

From: Noah 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections 

 

Dear Ahmed

 

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

 

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

 

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

 

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various matters pertaining the African Internet Community. What I am trying 
to say is that, Wafa as a community member, just like me, so often speaks on 
her own personal capacity and I believe she has since clarified this to you and 
the community. 

 

Therefore, I doubt its "bias"as you put it .. and my view of that email 
from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate and 
candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid off as 
some of the candidate she was supporting for the Northern Africa seat Dr.Habib 
ended up getting the highest votes ever of all candidates in the entire board 
elections. I was on the ground in Kampala and Habib did well also in terms of 
campaigning, so did other candidates and I can understand why he was Wafa's 
choice and and her strategy for the Northern Africa candidate for board 
election did indeed work. That is what good mobilization in campaigns does.

 

In fact just in the same elections, there was a very well coordinated campaign 
that involved among other thi

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Ahmed Fadl]

Hi Jordi
Already my mail provided for all community members
Thank you


From: JORDI PALET MARTINEZ [mailto:jordi.pa...@consulintel.es]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:00 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi Ahmed,

Can you confirm if you have provided your email to Wafa and if that’s the case, 
if it was for discussing about candidates?

Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet



El 4/7/19 9:32, "Ahmed Fadl" 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>> escribió:

Thank you Sami for your introduction
Let me also introduce myself
My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.
Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.
Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.
My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.
I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know
The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.
This is what I mean by my mail.
Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.
Also all respect for community members.
Thank you


From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>; Ahmed Fadl 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Salam

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !
Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Dear Ahmed

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various matters pertaining the African Internet Community. What I am trying 
to say is that, Wafa as a community member, just like me, so often speaks on 
her own personal capacity and I believe she has since clarified this to you and 
the community.

Therefore, I doubt its "bias"as you put it .. and my view of that email 
from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate and 
candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid off as 
some of the candidate she was supporting for the Northern Africa seat Dr.Habib 
ended up getting the highest votes ever of all candidates in the entire board 
elections. I was on the ground in Kampala and Habib did well also in terms of 
campaigning, so did other candidates and I can understand why he was Wafa's 
choice and and her strategy for the Northern Africa candidate for board 
election did indeed work. That is what good mobilization in campaigns does.

In fact just in the same elections, there was a very well coordinated campaign 
that involved among other things, mudslinging of a spe

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Ahmed,

 

Can you confirm if you have provided your email to Wafa and if that’s the case, 
if it was for discussing about candidates?

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 9:32, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Thank you Sami for your introduction

Let me also introduce myself 

My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.

Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.

Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.

My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.

I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know 

The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.

This is what I mean by my mail.

Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.

Also all respect for community members.

Thank you 

 

 

From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com] 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah ; Ahmed Fadl 
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani 
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Salam

 

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !

Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

 

BR 

 

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355 

From: Noah 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections 

 

Dear Ahmed

 

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

 

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

 

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

 

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various matters pertaining the African Internet Community. What I am trying 
to say is that, Wafa as a community member, just like me, so often speaks on 
her own personal capacity and I believe she has since clarified this to you and 
the community. 

 

Therefore, I doubt its "bias"as you put it .. and my view of that email 
from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate and 
candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid off as 
some of the candidate she was supporting for the Northern Africa seat Dr.Habib 
ended up getting the highest votes ever of all candidates in the entire board 
elections. I was on the ground in Kampala and Habib did well also in terms of 
campaigning, so did other candidates and I can understand why he was Wafa's 
choice and and her strategy for the Northern Africa candidate for board 
election did indeed work. That is what good mobilization in campaigns does.

 

In fact just in the same elections, there was a very well coordinated campaign 
that involved among other things, mudslinging of a specific candidate by some 
members of the various constituencies within the community and this also 
perfectly OK. Folks can go as far as using print media and sometime private 
lobbying through mailing lists and chat rooms. Its the nature of politicking 
and campaigns are tough and sometimes they get ugly, after all, not all 
candidates are supposed to be liked by the entire electorate yet politicking 
still goes on. This is basically pure politics 101 and its perfectly acceptable 
and no

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

Andrew
Just a reminder, Please share the link

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Sami Salih 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:54 PM
To: Andrew Alston; Sander Steffann
Cc: Sander Steffann; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Could you please share the link

Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36>


From: Andrew Alston 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:52:10 PM
To: Sami Salih; Sander Steffann
Cc: Sander Steffann; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: RE: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections


Sami,



Do yourself a favor – and go and read up on the doctrine of apparent authority.



It makes for some fascinating reading – particularly the case law in various 
jurisdictions about email domains and email signatures.  I’ll let you draw your 
own conclusions from what you find, keeping in mind I’m no lawyer – but I do 
have an interest in this stuff – and reading material was… very interesting ??



Thanks

Andrew







From: Sami Salih 
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 16:33
To: Sander Steffann 
Cc: Sander Steffann ; Andrew Alston 
; Ahmed Fadl ; wafa 
Dahmani ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



So wafa use her public email too :-)

Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36>





From: Sander Steffann mailto:san...@steffann.nl>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:27:55 PM
To: Sami Salih
Cc: Sander Steffann; Andrew Alston; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Hi Sami,

> I'm using a public email (outlook.com) not my official one (sustech.sd), 
> however my signature is MY signature I use it to show the people the ground 
> where I stand when I say something.

Exactly.
Sander
___
Community-Discuss mailing list
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

Shokran Ahmed for showing up, welcome to AFRINIC community.

you said: I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I 
don’t know

If I understand your sentence correctly, I have to tell you that AFRINIC board 
is 9 seats (6 Regional, 2 Non-Regional, and the CEO).
for more details please visit AFRINIC Governance portal
https://afrinic.net/board

hope this help clarifying the issue.

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Ahmed Fadl 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 10:28 AM
To: Sami Salih; Noah
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani
Subject: RE: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections


Thank you Sami for your introduction

Let me also introduce myself

My name is Ahmed Fadl, I’m working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.

Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.

Also I’m responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.

My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.

I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don’t know

The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.

This is what I mean by my mail.

Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.

Also all respect for community members.

Thank you





From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah ; Ahmed Fadl 
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani 
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Salam



I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !

Looking for your positive continuous engagement.



BR



Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355



From: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Dear Ahmed



First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.



So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.



Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.



I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various matters pertaining the African Internet Community. What I am trying 
to say is that, Wafa as a community member, just like me, so often speaks on 
her own personal capacity and I believe she has since clarified this to you and 
the community.



Therefore, I doubt its "bias"as you put it .. and my view of that email 
from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate and 
candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid off as 
some of the candidate she was supporting for the Northern Africa seat Dr.Habib 
ended up getting the highest votes ever of all candidates in the entire board 
elections. I was on the ground in Kampala and Habib did well also in terms of 
campaigning, so did other candidates and I can understand why he was Wafa's 
choice and and her strategy for the Northern Africa candidate for board 
election did indeed work. That is what good mobilization in campaigns does.



In

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Ahmed Fadl]

Thank you Sami for your introduction
Let me also introduce myself
My name is Ahmed Fadl, I'm working in healthcare nonprofit organization called 
children cancer hospital Egypt (57357), it is curing our patients with free of 
charge, my role is healthcare applications director.
Our hospital is one of the biggest hospital in the world in this 
specializations.
Also I'm responsible for the IP pools of our organization so I joined Afrinic 
community.
My point from my mail is we have to know the plan and strategy for every person 
before we vote for them.
I noticed that all the list by Wafaa from the same region why? I don't know
The characteristics of the board members should include diversification because 
we need all Africa regions to take all benefits and increase all regions 
knowledge and skills.
This is what I mean by my mail.
Finally welcome everyone has good plan for developing my country and all 
African countries.
Also all respect for community members.
Thank you


From: Sami Salih [mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 6:14 AM
To: Noah ; Ahmed Fadl 
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani 
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Salam

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !
Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Noah mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>>
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>; wafa 
Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Dear Ahmed

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various matters pertaining the African Internet Community. What I am trying 
to say is that, Wafa as a community member, just like me, so often speaks on 
her own personal capacity and I believe she has since clarified this to you and 
the community.

Therefore, I doubt its "bias"as you put it .. and my view of that email 
from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate and 
candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid off as 
some of the candidate she was supporting for the Northern Africa seat Dr.Habib 
ended up getting the highest votes ever of all candidates in the entire board 
elections. I was on the ground in Kampala and Habib did well also in terms of 
campaigning, so did other candidates and I can understand why he was Wafa's 
choice and and her strategy for the Northern Africa candidate for board 
election did indeed work. That is what good mobilization in campaigns does.

In fact just in the same elections, there was a very well coordinated campaign 
that involved among other things, mudslinging of a specific candidate by some 
members of the various constituencies within the community and this also 
perfectly OK. Folks can go as far as using print media and sometime private 
lobbying through mailing lists and chat rooms. Its the nature of politicking 
and campaigns are tough and sometimes they get ugly, after all, not all 
candidates are supposed to be liked by the entire electorate yet politicking 
still goes on. This is basically pure politics 101 and its perfectly acceptable 
and normal and as they say, politics is part of daily life and so many of us in 
this community have been party to this and its nothing new.

I submit to you that, being a member of, sa

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

Salam

I hope you reply Ahmed, since we have very bad experience with unknown fellows 
who come once to raise suspicious issue then disappear !
Looking for your positive continuous engagement.

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Noah 
Sent: Thursday, July 4, 2019 1:41 AM
To: Ahmed Fadl
Cc: Community-Discuss@afrinic.net; wafa Dahmani
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Dear Ahmed

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am 
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to engage 
in various discussions as a member of the community now.

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute to 
the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being biased in 
general.

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of 
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the AfriNIC 
ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary general of an ISP 
association in my country of residence, and I am generally involved within the 
AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer with various non-profit organizations 
because voluntary work is fulfilling. However, whatever I say here often is 
from a personal point of view unless I state otherwise.

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this 
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I use 
my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation of any of 
the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my affiliations have 
been used by some members of this community to attack my personal character, 
sometime as far as going after my employment just because of my personal views 
on various matters pertaining the African Internet Community. What I am trying 
to say is that, Wafa as a community member, just like me, so often speaks on 
her own personal capacity and I believe she has since clarified this to you and 
the community.

Therefore, I doubt its "bias"as you put it .. and my view of that email 
from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate and 
candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid off as 
some of the candidate she was supporting for the Northern Africa seat Dr.Habib 
ended up getting the highest votes ever of all candidates in the entire board 
elections. I was on the ground in Kampala and Habib did well also in terms of 
campaigning, so did other candidates and I can understand why he was Wafa's 
choice and and her strategy for the Northern Africa candidate for board 
election did indeed work. That is what good mobilization in campaigns does.

In fact just in the same elections, there was a very well coordinated campaign 
that involved among other things, mudslinging of a specific candidate by some 
members of the various constituencies within the community and this also 
perfectly OK. Folks can go as far as using print media and sometime private 
lobbying through mailing lists and chat rooms. Its the nature of politicking 
and campaigns are tough and sometimes they get ugly, after all, not all 
candidates are supposed to be liked by the entire electorate yet politicking 
still goes on. This is basically pure politics 101 and its perfectly acceptable 
and normal and as they say, politics is part of daily life and so many of us in 
this community have been party to this and its nothing new.

I submit to you that, being a member of, say, the AfriNIC appeals committee, or 
ASO-AC or GC ...you name it, does not stop someone from having their own 
subjective views nor does it stop them from being involved in community 
politics at a personal level. Remember above and beyond, we are all part of the 
Internet community before our various affiliations and after being party to 
these affiliations, we continue to be members of the internet community and 
remain in this community.

What really matters is respect for each other and how we treat each other even 
when we disagree because in the end, its through this politics that we progress 
as we continue to individually contribute, improve and resolve some of our 
challenges.

Cheers and I look forward to more engagement with you Mr.Ahmed.

Noah


On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:17 PM Ahmed Fadl 
mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>> wrote:

Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is you

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Mark Tinka]

I spend 20% of my e-mail time unsubscribing from lists I was signed on,
that I have zero clue about. I don't wonder how my e-mail address was
obtained (I mean, I could guess since Google'ing myself actually returns
a usable result), but I just don't have the time.

A further 10% of my e-mail time is ignoring Linkedin requests for people
I don't know and have no immediate connection with. I've found many of
those are just trying to grow their network, sell you something, or both.

I spend another 10% of my time ignoring and deleting e-mails from
companies that join industry meetings simply to sell you attendee lists
or to sell you airtime with other participants. ITW, PTC, Capacity * are
all victims of this, and this has now spread to our beloved NOG community.

I again spend another 7% of my e-mail time just ignoring or deleting
what I term "improper" correspondence. This has, in the past, included
e-mails from people asking me to vote a certain way for a number of
elections, all over the world, for a number of organizations (within and
outside of our industry). If I find the way in which you reached out to
me for this, especially if I don't know you, I just delete the e-mail
and move on. If I know you and feel you can do well for the community,
I'll advise you about doing better.

I then spend another 3% of my e-mail time ignoring discussions that
aren't going anywhere.

That leaves 50% of my e-mail time to do something actually constructive.
That's not a lot, in the grand scheme of things.

If we throw everyone in the slammer and not teach them how to do better,
we won't have anyone left to throw in the slammer or teach about how to
do better.

Bottom line, you can either spend your 24hrs in a day advancing a
meaningful objective, or not. I do a lot more of the former. Time on
this earth is limited... if I were drop dead right now, the mailboxes I
leave behind will still be half full of just nonsense.

Mark.

On 4/Jul/19 00:39, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss wrote:
>
> Hi Noah,
>
>  
>
> I’m sure we all have contacts from lots of people from the community,
> but we use those contacts for the reason they have been provided, is
> not lawful to use those for anything else.
>
>  
>
> The point here is that even if I’ve your email because we have
> contected about operational issues of our networks (for example), I
> can use your email for selling you “fruits” or “a car” or “convince
> you about what candidates to the board you should vote”.
>
>  
>
> In fact, according to the GDPR (and in many countries even before the
> GDPR), if I’ve your email because you’re my customer for shoes, and
> tomorrow I setup a shop for fish, I can’t use your email for that. If
> instead of shoes it is clothes, it may depend on the original data
> that was provided about my business when you registered for the shoes.
> However, definitively I can’t use your email for sending you a support
> request for my prefered board candidates.
>
>  
>
> Anyway, there is a simple answer to all that. Can Ahmed, who send the
> original email, confirm if he provided it to the sender, for elections
> information or something else ?
>
>  
>
> Can other folks who got that email, confirm if they have provided it?
>
>  
>
> With just a few responses, we will be able to understand if that was
> part of an allowed communication or there is data protection issue.
>
>  
>
> Regards,
>
> Jordi
>
> @jordipalet
>
>  
>
>  
>
>  
>
> El 4/7/19 0:07, "Noah" mailto:n...@neo.co.tz>> escribió:
>
>  
>
> Hi Jordi,
>
>  
>
> On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:51 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via
> Community-Discuss  > wrote:
>
> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
>
>  
>
> I hope you have come down.
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have
> provided voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in
> Afrinic lists, or if those emails are part of their Afrinic
> contacts, in order to understand if this personal data (emails are
> personal data), have been collected from Afrinic internal databases.
>
>  
>
> I can confirm I did receive such similar emails from various
> candidates and some of their supporters seeking my vote. I can also
> confirm that my address book is full of contact email addresses of
> technical members of various communities. I for instance know most
> email addresses of technical people in my country and a few other
> countries in East and Southern Africa and I have exchanged emails with
> folks in the past and I still reach out to them often regarding
> various Internet related activities.
>
>  
>
> Cheers,
>
> Noah
>
>  
>
>  
>
>
> **
> IPv4 is over
> Are you ready for the new Internet ?
> http://www.theipv6company.com
> The IPv6 Company
>
> This electronic message contains information which may be privileged
> or confidential. The information is intended to be for the 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Noah]

Dear Ahmed

First and foremost, welcome on-board this community mailing list since I am
seeing you post for the first time ever and I hope you will continue to
engage in various discussions as a member of the community now.

So, I have been catching up with email and I would like to also contribute
to the discussion by stating a few things in reference to people being
*biased* in general.

Let me introduce myself first. I personally work for AS37100 a member of
AfriNIC, I was popularly elected by the community as a volunteer to the
AfriNIC ASO - AC and my term ends next year in 2020, I am a secretary
general of an ISP association in my country of residence, and I am
generally involved within the AFRICAN internet community as a volunteer
with various non-profit organizations because voluntary work is fulfilling.
However, whatever I say here often is from a personal point of view unless
I state otherwise.

I am telling you all this because, with all my years of engagement in this
community, I have always spoken in my own personal capacity that is why I
use my own personal email address. Nothing I say is ever a representation
of any of the organization I am affiliated with, though so often, my
affiliations have been used by some members of this community to attack my
personal character, sometime as far as going after my employment just
because of my personal views on various matters pertaining the African
Internet Community. What I am trying to say is that, Wafa as a community
member, just like me, so often speaks on her own personal capacity and I
believe she has since clarified this to you and the community.

Therefore, I doubt its "*bias*"as you put it .. and my view of that
email from her to you is basically an elections campaign for a candidate
and candidates of her choice and in the end, her efforts seems to have paid
off as some of the candidate she was supporting for the Northern Africa
seat Dr.Habib ended up getting the highest votes ever of all candidates in
the entire board elections. I was on the ground in Kampala and Habib did
well also in terms of campaigning, so did other candidates and I can
understand why he was Wafa's choice and and her strategy for the Northern
Africa candidate for board election did indeed work. That is what good
mobilization in campaigns does.

In fact just in the same elections, there was a very well coordinated
campaign that involved among other things, mudslinging of a specific
candidate by some members of the various constituencies within the
community and this also perfectly OK. Folks can go as far as using print
media and sometime private lobbying through mailing lists and chat rooms.
Its the nature of politicking and campaigns are tough and sometimes they
get ugly, after all, not all candidates are supposed to be liked by the
entire electorate yet politicking still goes on. This is basically pure
politics 101 and its perfectly acceptable and normal and as they say,
politics is part of daily life and so many of us in this community have
been party to this and its nothing new.

I submit to you that, being a member of, say, the AfriNIC appeals
committee, or ASO-AC or GC ...you name it, does not stop someone from
having their own *subjective* *views* nor does it stop them from being
involved in community politics at a personal level. Remember above and
beyond, we are all part of the Internet community before our various
affiliations and after being party to these affiliations, we continue to be
members of the internet community and remain in this community.

What really matters is respect for each other and how we treat each other
even when we disagree because in the end, its through this politics that we
progress as we continue to individually contribute, improve and resolve
some of our challenges.

Cheers and I look forward to more engagement with you Mr.Ahmed.

Noah


On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:17 PM Ahmed Fadl  wrote:

> Hi Wafa,
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks for your email.
>
>
>
> I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email
> from you many times.
>
>
>
> I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially
> for those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole
> candidate in his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and
> Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy " what is your strategy and
> who are you ?
>
>
>
>
>
> If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your
> email as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex
> Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?
>
>
>
> I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on
> community
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> Ahmed Fadl
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
> *To:* wafa Dahmani 
> *Subject:* AFRINIC Borad Elections
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Dear,
>
>  My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Noah,

 

I’m sure we all have contacts from lots of people from the community, but we 
use those contacts for the reason they have been provided, is not lawful to use 
those for anything else.

 

The point here is that even if I’ve your email because we have contected about 
operational issues of our networks (for example), I can use your email for 
selling you “fruits” or “a car” or “convince you about what candidates to the 
board you should vote”.

 

In fact, according to the GDPR (and in many countries even before the GDPR), if 
I’ve your email because you’re my customer for shoes, and tomorrow I setup a 
shop for fish, I can’t use your email for that. If instead of shoes it is 
clothes, it may depend on the original data that was provided about my business 
when you registered for the shoes. However, definitively I can’t use your email 
for sending you a support request for my prefered board candidates.

 

Anyway, there is a simple answer to all that. Can Ahmed, who send the original 
email, confirm if he provided it to the sender, for elections information or 
something else ?

 

Can other folks who got that email, confirm if they have provided it?

 

With just a few responses, we will be able to understand if that was part of an 
allowed communication or there is data protection issue.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 4/7/19 0:07, "Noah"  escribió:

 

Hi Jordi,

 

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:51 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss 
 wrote:

I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.

 

I hope you have come down.

 

 

Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or if 
those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand if this 
personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from Afrinic 
internal databases.

 

I can confirm I did receive such similar emails from various candidates and 
some of their supporters seeking my vote. I can also confirm that my address 
book is full of contact email addresses of technical members of various 
communities. I for instance know most email addresses of technical people in my 
country and a few other countries in East and Southern Africa and I have 
exchanged emails with folks in the past and I still reach out to them often 
regarding various Internet related activities. 

 

Cheers,

Noah

 

 



**
IPv4 is over
Are you ready for the new Internet ?
http://www.theipv6company.com
The IPv6 Company

This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware 
that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.

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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Noah]

Hi Jordi,

On Wed, Jul 3, 2019 at 2:51 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss <
community-discuss@afrinic.net> wrote:

> I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.
>

I hope you have come down.


>
> Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided
> voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or
> if those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand
> if this personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from
> Afrinic internal databases.
>

I can confirm I did receive such similar emails from various candidates and
some of their supporters seeking my vote. I can also confirm that my
address book is full of contact email addresses of technical members of
various communities. I for instance know most email addresses of technical
people in my country and a few other countries in East and Southern Africa
and I have exchanged emails with folks in the past and I still reach out to
them often regarding various Internet related activities.

Cheers,
Noah
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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sander Steffann]

Hi Sami,

> So wafa use her public email too :-)

Again: it doesn't matter which email address you use, when in the content of 
the message you claim affiliation.

Cheers,
Sander



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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

So wafa use her public email too :-)

Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36>


From: Sander Steffann 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 4:27:55 PM
To: Sami Salih
Cc: Sander Steffann; Andrew Alston; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi Sami,

> I'm using a public email (outlook.com) not my official one (sustech.sd), 
> however my signature is MY signature I use it to show the people the ground 
> where I stand when I say something.

Exactly.
Sander

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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sander Steffann]

Hi Sami,

> I'm using a public email (outlook.com) not my official one (sustech.sd), 
> however my signature is MY signature I use it to show the people the ground 
> where I stand when I say something.

Exactly.
Sander



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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sander Steffann]

Hi Sami,

(re-sending because the previous email had a wrong from address)

> I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
> (I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat 
> of AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned 
> signature represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community 
> and gives the recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of 
> the community.

It also implies that those positions are relevant to the content of the 
message. I would be very surprised if some if those organisations mentioned 
agree with being drawn into an African election process. I'll be asking the 
RIPE delegates to the NRO AC about their involvement in this.

> This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
> them to support/oppose something.

Indeed. This is a strong indication of a conflict of interest, while the 
actions of an independent foundation are not.

> My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
> represent SUST!

Oh but it does. You are communicating using an official company template. If 
you are not speaking as an official representative you cannot use that template 
or you have to be very explicit that you are speaking only for yourself. 
Otherwise your message WILL be seen as a statement from an employee.

Cheers,
Sander



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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

Sander,

I'm using a public email (outlook.com) not my official one (sustech.sd), 
however my signature is MY signature I use it to show the people the ground 
where I stand when I say something. If I signed as Lecturer in ICT then I say 
something about Football people should take it as coming from a football fan 
not from a professional in the field. Conversely, when I participate in 
something related to education people have to take my comments as serious as 
its coming from a professional in the field.
I hope the point is clear, signature(s) is used to wight the information stated 
in the message. Using official account is another thing.

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Sander Steffann 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 3:17 PM
To: Sami Salih
Cc: Andrew Alston; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

Hi Sami,

I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
(I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat of 
AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned signature 
represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community and gives the 
recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of the community.

It also implies that those positions are relevant to the content of the 
message. I would be very surprised if some if those organisations mentioned 
agree with being drawn into an African election process. I'll be asking the 
RIPE delegates to the NRO AC about their involvement in this.

This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
them to support/oppose something.

Indeed. This is a strong indication of a conflict of interest, while the 
actions of an independent foundation are not.

My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
represent SUST!

Oh but it does. You are communicating using an official company template. If 
you are not speaking as an official representative you cannot use that template 
or you have to be very explicit that you are speaking only for yourself. 
Otherwise your message WILL be seen as a statement from an employee.

Cheers,
Sander

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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

PM
To: Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



This email raises so many questions.



While as I have clearly stated – I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs – however – I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.



As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.



  1.  Is this email representative of the ASO /AC ‘s view
  2.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee – and how does that align with the neutrality that is meant to exist 
in such a committee.
  3.  Is this email representative of the views of Global IGF?



I really hope not – but – I have to ask – since that is what the email was 
signed as.



Thanks



Andrew





From: Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:15
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?





If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?



I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community





Thanks,



Ahmed Fadl





From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections







Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board of Directors:
North Africa (seat 1)

  *   Habin Youssef

West Africa (seat 2)

  *   Ly Ousmane

South Africa (seat 5)

  *   Mpisane Vika William

East Africa (seat 6)

  *   Nkusi Robert Ford

Non-regional (seat 7)

  *   Eshun Benjamin Adzenyamebeye



Election Number Resource Organization Number Council

  *   Mustapha Ben Jemaa

Election Policy Development Working Group

  *   Komi Elitcha
  *   Sami Hassan

Election Governance Committee

  *   Daniel Nanghaka

Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy  and in order to preserve 
AFRINIC's interests for Africa and to be able to choose the right candidates 
for North Africa in the long term, it is desirable to join all our efforts and 
vote for these candidates who presents the best choice for an adequate board

the de facto vote online through your interface with AFRINIC is very simple for 
all categories except the policy development Working group where we want you to 
mobilize your teams on the spot to vote for our candidates
We strongly solicit your support

Thank you

Wafa Dahmani

member AFRINIC Appeal Committee
Global IGF MAG member
ASO / AC excom member
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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Andrew Alston]

It won’t be read that way?

Well – the very fact that this email landed up on the list seems to imply 
otherwise – and the communications I’ve had off list – also seem to imply 
otherwise.  Jordi’s email (though Jordi can speak for himself!) also seems to 
imply that he believes this email portrays itself as an abuse of position.

So – won’t ever? Er I see at least 3 instances in the last few minutes 

Andrew


From: Sami Salih 
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 15:10
To: Andrew Alston ; Ahmed Fadl 
; wafa Dahmani ; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: AFRINIC Borad Elections

I'm sorry too to ask you read my email again, as stating the level of 
engagement is necessary for me to show how the sender are interested and 
participated in the community and who she has the needed knowledge about the 
individuals who are deserve to be elected. Stating the committees she is 
involved in will never has o be misunderstood as what you claim (But some 
people may need to read/think carefully before making any assumptions).
and I'm sorry again to tell you that your fair questions is trivial -sorry if 
its not a good word I'm not native- the answer is NO.



Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Andrew Alston 
mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:53 PM
To: Sami Salih; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: RE: AFRINIC Borad Elections


Sorry Sami,



But I fundamentally disagree with you.  When you use your position on community 
based bodies that are meant to maintain a position of neutrality to lobby in 
this manner – and state that it is “part of our strategy” – without specifying 
who – it implies that the strategy is that of one of the organizations that you 
signed for.



My problem with this email is NOT that lobbying was done – that is part and 
parcel of how elections (which are by nature political) occur – my problem is 
the implications of the representations made in this email – not just in the 
signature either – and the reference to “our strategy” – which could be read to 
imply a wider group with a specific strategy that is involved in an attempt at 
organizational capture (though I will not go so far as to say that this last 
implication is actually accurate)



If you lobby for a candidate – you either do so on your own behalf – or you do 
it at the behest of your employer or another group – and when the email is 
signed in the way that it is and prefixed the way that it is – it very 
definitely carries implications – and hence me asking if this is actually the 
position of those bodies – I want clarification from THEM as to their position 
vis-a-vie this email – and it is a fair question to ask – particularly when one 
of those bodies has to be in a position of total neutrality because they deal 
with appeals.



Thanks



Andrew





From: Sami Salih mailto:sami.sa...@outlook.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:47
To: Andrew Alston 
mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>; 
Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>; wafa Dahmani 
mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: AFRINIC Borad Elections



Salam,



I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
(I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat of 
AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned signature 
represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community and gives the 
recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of the community. 
This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
them to support/oppose something.

My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
represent SUST!



BR



Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355



From: Andrew Alston 
mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:28 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



This email raises so many questions.



While as I have clearly stated – I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs – however – I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.



As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.



  1.  Is this email representative of the ASO /AC ‘s view
  2.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee – and

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

I'm sorry too to ask you read my email again, as stating the level of 
engagement is necessary for me to show how the sender are interested and 
participated in the community and who she has the needed knowledge about the 
individuals who are deserve to be elected. Stating the committees she is 
involved in will never has o be misunderstood as what you claim (But some 
people may need to read/think carefully before making any assumptions).
and I'm sorry again to tell you that your fair questions is trivial -sorry if 
its not a good word I'm not native- the answer is NO.



Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Andrew Alston 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:53 PM
To: Sami Salih; Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: RE: AFRINIC Borad Elections


Sorry Sami,



But I fundamentally disagree with you.  When you use your position on community 
based bodies that are meant to maintain a position of neutrality to lobby in 
this manner – and state that it is “part of our strategy” – without specifying 
who – it implies that the strategy is that of one of the organizations that you 
signed for.



My problem with this email is NOT that lobbying was done – that is part and 
parcel of how elections (which are by nature political) occur – my problem is 
the implications of the representations made in this email – not just in the 
signature either – and the reference to “our strategy” – which could be read to 
imply a wider group with a specific strategy that is involved in an attempt at 
organizational capture (though I will not go so far as to say that this last 
implication is actually accurate)



If you lobby for a candidate – you either do so on your own behalf – or you do 
it at the behest of your employer or another group – and when the email is 
signed in the way that it is and prefixed the way that it is – it very 
definitely carries implications – and hence me asking if this is actually the 
position of those bodies – I want clarification from THEM as to their position 
vis-a-vie this email – and it is a fair question to ask – particularly when one 
of those bodies has to be in a position of total neutrality because they deal 
with appeals.



Thanks



Andrew





From: Sami Salih 
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:47
To: Andrew Alston ; Ahmed Fadl 
; wafa Dahmani ; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: AFRINIC Borad Elections



Salam,



I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
(I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat of 
AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned signature 
represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community and gives the 
recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of the community. 
This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
them to support/oppose something.

My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
represent SUST!



BR



Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355



From: Andrew Alston 
mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:28 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



This email raises so many questions.



While as I have clearly stated – I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs – however – I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.



As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.



  1.  Is this email representative of the ASO /AC ‘s view
  2.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee – and how does that align with the neutrality that is meant to exist 
in such a committee.
  3.  Is this email representative of the views of Global IGF?



I really hope not – but – I have to ask – since that is what the email was 
signed as.



Thanks



Andrew





From: Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:15
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "L

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

Hi Sami,

 

My point here is that the campaigns need to be done *only* in a neutral way, 
not by board or committee members, not by staff, and only to people that you 
*already* know. So, they should be done only in the official ways determined in 
the elections process.

 

I’m not, *at all*, discussion about if the candidates are good, bad, or if I 
support them or not, just the way it has been done and I urge the board to take 
measures.

 

If you collect my email from any kind of database, without my previous and 
explicit consent, this is against law (and even immoral and unethical, in my 
personal opinion).

 

Moreover, if you do that with an EU citizen or resident, it is against GDPR, 
which means that you can get fines up to 20 million euros. And in case you 
don’t know, Mauritius is one of the countries that signed agreements with the 
EU about GDPR, so the legislation is applicable with the Afrinic databases as 
well.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 3/7/19 13:49, "Sami Salih"  escribió:

 

Salam,

 

I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
(I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat of 
AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned signature 
represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community and gives the 
recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of the community. 
This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
them to support/oppose something.

My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
represent SUST!

 

BR

 

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355 

From: Andrew Alston 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:28 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections 

 

This email raises so many questions.

 

While as I have clearly stated – I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs – however – I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.

 

As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.

 

a.   Is this email representative of the ASO /AC ‘s view

b.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee – and how does that align with the neutrality that is meant to exist 
in such a committee.

c.   Is this email representative of the views of Global IGF?

 

I really hope not – but – I have to ask – since that is what the email was 
signed as.

 

Thanks

 

Andrew

 

 

From: Ahmed Fadl  
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:15
To: wafa Dahmani ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

Hi Wafa,

 

 

Thanks for your email.

 

I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.

 

I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?

 

 

If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?

 

I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community 

 

 

Thanks,

 

Ahmed Fadl 

 

 

From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani 
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

 

 

Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board of Directors:
North Africa (seat 1)

· Habin Youssef

West Africa (seat 2)

· Ly Ousmane


South Africa (seat 5)

· Mpisane Vika William


East Africa (seat 6)

· Nkusi Robert Ford


Non-regional (seat 7)

· Eshun Benjamin Adzenyamebeye




Election Number Resource Organization Number Council

· Mustapha Ben Jemaa


Election Policy Development Working Group

· Komi Elitcha

· Sami Hassan


Election Governance Committee

· Daniel Nanghaka

Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy  and in order to preserve 
AFRINIC's interests for Africa and to be able to choose the right candidates 
for North Africa in the long term, it is desirable to join all our efforts and 
vote for these candidates who presents the best choice for an adequate board

the de facto vote online through your 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Andrew Alston]

Sorry Sami,

But I fundamentally disagree with you.  When you use your position on community 
based bodies that are meant to maintain a position of neutrality to lobby in 
this manner - and state that it is "part of our strategy" - without specifying 
who - it implies that the strategy is that of one of the organizations that you 
signed for.

My problem with this email is NOT that lobbying was done - that is part and 
parcel of how elections (which are by nature political) occur - my problem is 
the implications of the representations made in this email - not just in the 
signature either - and the reference to "our strategy" - which could be read to 
imply a wider group with a specific strategy that is involved in an attempt at 
organizational capture (though I will not go so far as to say that this last 
implication is actually accurate)

If you lobby for a candidate - you either do so on your own behalf - or you do 
it at the behest of your employer or another group - and when the email is 
signed in the way that it is and prefixed the way that it is - it very 
definitely carries implications - and hence me asking if this is actually the 
position of those bodies - I want clarification from THEM as to their position 
vis-a-vie this email - and it is a fair question to ask - particularly when one 
of those bodies has to be in a position of total neutrality because they deal 
with appeals.

Thanks

Andrew


From: Sami Salih 
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:47
To: Andrew Alston ; Ahmed Fadl 
; wafa Dahmani ; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: AFRINIC Borad Elections

Salam,

I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
(I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat of 
AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned signature 
represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community and gives the 
recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of the community. 
This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
them to support/oppose something.
My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
represent SUST!

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Andrew Alston 
mailto:andrew.als...@liquidtelecom.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:28 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections


This email raises so many questions.



While as I have clearly stated - I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs - however - I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.



As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.



  1.  Is this email representative of the ASO /AC 's view
  2.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee - and how does that align with the neutrality that is meant to exist 
in such a committee.
  3.  Is this email representative of the views of Global IGF?



I really hope not - but - I have to ask - since that is what the email was 
signed as.



Thanks



Andrew





From: Ahmed Fadl mailto:ahmed.f...@57357.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:15
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>; 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net<mailto:Community-Discuss@afrinic.net>
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?





If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?



I sent this mail many time but I don't know why I can't find this mail on 
community





Thanks,



Ahmed Fadl





From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections







Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

I’m angrier about this as much as I think on it again.

 

Can the board and the staff investigate this?

 

Can all the people that got those emails confirm if they have provided 
voluntarily their emails or if they have participated in Afrinic lists, or if 
those emails are part of their Afrinic contacts, in order to understand if this 
personal data (emails are personal data), have been collected from Afrinic 
internal databases.

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 3/7/19 13:43, "JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss" 
 escribió:

 

This is really very ugly. Are we really crazy to believe that the community is 
not able to decide on their own?

 

I’ve seen a similar situation in other regions and this is outside of the code 
of conduct (written or not), or the elections proccesses. There are several 
points here:

 

1)  Have the emails of the recipients of this message been legally 
“acquired”, I mean with a previous and explicit consent, or have they been 
“collected” from people participating in mail exploders? In many countries, 
collecting emails from people is against law.

2)  Have the recipients of those emails, authorized explicitly to get 
“publicity about candidates” ? If not, this is just one more way of spam, 
again, may be against law in many countries.

3)  Has the elections process authorized to do advertising of candidates 
outside of the formal processes?

4)  Has the elections process authorized other committee members to use 
their “position” as a way to convince the community about whom to vote?

 

I think there must be an explicit prohibition for doing all this and if anyone 
does it, it needs to be possible to punish him/her (and possible the involved 
candidates) with several years impossibility to be part of board, committees, 
or participate as candidate in any kind of elections.

 

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 3/7/19 13:18, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Hi Wafa,

 

 

Thanks for your email.

 

I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.

 

I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?

 

 

If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?

 

I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community 

 

 

Thanks,

 

Ahmed Fadl 

 

 

From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani 
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

 

 

Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board of Directors:
North Africa (seat 1)

· Habin Youssef

West Africa (seat 2)

· Ly Ousmane


South Africa (seat 5)

· Mpisane Vika William


East Africa (seat 6)

· Nkusi Robert Ford


Non-regional (seat 7)

· Eshun Benjamin Adzenyamebeye




Election Number Resource Organization Number Council

· Mustapha Ben Jemaa


Election Policy Development Working Group

· Komi Elitcha

· Sami Hassan


Election Governance Committee

· Daniel Nanghaka

Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy  and in order to preserve 
AFRINIC's interests for Africa and to be able to choose the right candidates 
for North Africa in the long term, it is desirable to join all our efforts and 
vote for these candidates who presents the best choice for an adequate board

the de facto vote online through your interface with AFRINIC is very simple for 
all categories except the policy development Working group where we want you to 
mobilize your teams on the spot to vote for our candidates
We strongly solicit your support

Thank you

Wafa Dahmani

member AFRINIC Appeal Committee
Global IGF MAG member
ASO / AC excom member

___ Community-Discuss mailing list 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net 
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss 


**
IPv4 is over
Are you ready for the new Internet ?
http://www.theipv6company.com
The IPv6 Company

This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Sami Salih]

Salam,

I see this email sent to individuals to support/campaign for some nominators 
(I'm not in agreement with all proposed names) who are among the public slat of 
AFRINIC candidates, IMHO any one is free to campaign. The undersigned signature 
represent the level of engagement of the sender in the community and gives the 
recipient more confident about her selection to the benefit of the community. 
This is too far from sponsoring youth and educate them in a way that may push 
them to support/oppose something.
My personal signature as SUST employee did't mean my view i this email 
represent SUST!

BR

Dr. Sami H.O. Salih
Assistant Prof, School of Electronics Engineering, SUST
Head of R, NTC, SUDAN
President of SDv6TF
T/F: (249)122045707/187171355

From: Andrew Alston 
Sent: Wednesday, July 3, 2019 2:28 PM
To: Ahmed Fadl; wafa Dahmani; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections


This email raises so many questions.



While as I have clearly stated – I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs – however – I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.



As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.



  1.  Is this email representative of the ASO /AC ‘s view
  2.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee – and how does that align with the neutrality that is meant to exist 
in such a committee.
  3.  Is this email representative of the views of Global IGF?



I really hope not – but – I have to ask – since that is what the email was 
signed as.



Thanks



Andrew





From: Ahmed Fadl 
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:15
To: wafa Dahmani ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections



Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?





If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?



I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community





Thanks,



Ahmed Fadl





From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections







Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board of Directors:
North Africa (seat 1)

  *   Habin Youssef

West Africa (seat 2)

  *   Ly Ousmane

South Africa (seat 5)

  *   Mpisane Vika William

East Africa (seat 6)

  *   Nkusi Robert Ford

Non-regional (seat 7)

  *   Eshun Benjamin Adzenyamebeye



Election Number Resource Organization Number Council

  *   Mustapha Ben Jemaa

Election Policy Development Working Group

  *   Komi Elitcha
  *   Sami Hassan

Election Governance Committee

  *   Daniel Nanghaka

Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy  and in order to preserve 
AFRINIC's interests for Africa and to be able to choose the right candidates 
for North Africa in the long term, it is desirable to join all our efforts and 
vote for these candidates who presents the best choice for an adequate board

the de facto vote online through your interface with AFRINIC is very simple for 
all categories except the policy development Working group where we want you to 
mobilize your teams on the spot to vote for our candidates
We strongly solicit your support

Thank you

Wafa Dahmani

member AFRINIC Appeal Committee
Global IGF MAG member
ASO / AC excom member
___
Community-Discuss mailing list
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via Community-Discuss]

This is really very ugly. Are we really crazy to believe that the community is 
not able to decide on their own?

 

I’ve seen a similar situation in other regions and this is outside of the code 
of conduct (written or not), or the elections proccesses. There are several 
points here:

 
Have the emails of the recipients of this message been legally “acquired”, I 
mean with a previous and explicit consent, or have they been “collected” from 
people participating in mail exploders? In many countries, collecting emails 
from people is against law.
Have the recipients of those emails, authorized explicitly to get “publicity 
about candidates” ? If not, this is just one more way of spam, again, may be 
against law in many countries.
Has the elections process authorized to do advertising of candidates outside of 
the formal processes?
Has the elections process authorized other committee members to use their 
“position” as a way to convince the community about whom to vote?
 

I think there must be an explicit prohibition for doing all this and if anyone 
does it, it needs to be possible to punish him/her (and possible the involved 
candidates) with several years impossibility to be part of board, committees, 
or participate as candidate in any kind of elections.

 

 

Regards,

Jordi

@jordipalet

 

 

 

El 3/7/19 13:18, "Ahmed Fadl"  escribió:

 

Hi Wafa,

 

 

Thanks for your email.

 

I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.

 

I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?

 

 

If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?

 

I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community 

 

 

Thanks,

 

Ahmed Fadl 

 

 

From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani 
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections

 

 

 

Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board of Directors:
North Africa (seat 1)

· Habin Youssef

West Africa (seat 2)

· Ly Ousmane


South Africa (seat 5)

· Mpisane Vika William


East Africa (seat 6)

· Nkusi Robert Ford


Non-regional (seat 7)

· Eshun Benjamin Adzenyamebeye




Election Number Resource Organization Number Council

· Mustapha Ben Jemaa


Election Policy Development Working Group

· Komi Elitcha

· Sami Hassan


Election Governance Committee

· Daniel Nanghaka

Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy  and in order to preserve 
AFRINIC's interests for Africa and to be able to choose the right candidates 
for North Africa in the long term, it is desirable to join all our efforts and 
vote for these candidates who presents the best choice for an adequate board

the de facto vote online through your interface with AFRINIC is very simple for 
all categories except the policy development Working group where we want you to 
mobilize your teams on the spot to vote for our candidates
We strongly solicit your support

Thank you

Wafa Dahmani

member AFRINIC Appeal Committee
Global IGF MAG member
ASO / AC excom member

___ Community-Discuss mailing list 
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net 
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss 



**
IPv4 is over
Are you ready for the new Internet ?
http://www.theipv6company.com
The IPv6 Company

This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or 
confidential. The information is intended to be for the exclusive use of the 
individual(s) named above and further non-explicilty authorized disclosure, 
copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, even if 
partially, including attached files, is strictly prohibited and will be 
considered a criminal offense. If you are not the intended recipient be aware 
that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this 
information, even if partially, including attached files, is strictly 
prohibited, will be considered a criminal offense, so you must reply to the 
original sender to inform about this communication and delete it.

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Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Andrew Alston]

This email raises so many questions.

While as I have clearly stated – I do not have ANY problem with anyone lobbying 
on behalf of candidates and their beliefs – however – I have serious issues 
when other groups that are meant to be neutral start doing this.

As such, I need some clarity based on the signatures of the email.


  1.  Is this email representative of the ASO /AC ‘s view
  2.  Is this email representative of the combined view of the AFRINIC Appeal 
committee – and how does that align with the neutrality that is meant to exist 
in such a committee.
  3.  Is this email representative of the views of Global IGF?

I really hope not – but – I have to ask – since that is what the email was 
signed as.

Thanks

Andrew


From: Ahmed Fadl 
Sent: Wednesday, 3 July 2019 14:15
To: wafa Dahmani ; Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
Subject: Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections


Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?





If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?



I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community





Thanks,

Ahmed Fadl


From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com>>
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections



Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board of Directors:
North Africa (seat 1)

  *   Habin Youssef
West Africa (seat 2)

  *   Ly Ousmane

South Africa (seat 5)

  *   Mpisane Vika William

East Africa (seat 6)

  *   Nkusi Robert Ford

Non-regional (seat 7)

  *   Eshun Benjamin Adzenyamebeye



Election Number Resource Organization Number Council

  *   Mustapha Ben Jemaa

Election Policy Development Working Group

  *   Komi Elitcha
  *   Sami Hassan

Election Governance Committee

  *   Daniel Nanghaka
Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy  and in order to preserve 
AFRINIC's interests for Africa and to be able to choose the right candidates 
for North Africa in the long term, it is desirable to join all our efforts and 
vote for these candidates who presents the best choice for an adequate board
the de facto vote online through your interface with AFRINIC is very simple for 
all categories except the policy development Working group where we want you to 
mobilize your teams on the spot to vote for our candidates
We strongly solicit your support

Thank you

Wafa Dahmani

member AFRINIC Appeal Committee
Global IGF MAG member
ASO / AC excom member
___
Community-Discuss mailing list
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss

Re: [Community-Discuss] AFRINIC Borad Elections

[Ahmed Fadl]

Hi Wafa,





Thanks for your email.



I, among other members of AFRINIC in Egypt, received the following email from 
you many times.



I wondered at that time why should I vote for these candidates specially for 
those in Eastern and Southern regions while each one was the sole candidate in 
his region. I quote this from your email "Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context 
of our strategy " what is your strategy and who are you ?





If you are talking about biasing the community, So, do you consider your email 
as a "member of the appeal committee; ASO / AC excom member and Ex Chair of 
Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC." fall under what ?



I sent this mail many time but I don’t know why I can’t find this mail on 
community





Thanks,

Ahmed Fadl


From: wafa Dahmani [mailto:wafatn7...@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2019 1:05 PM
To: wafa Dahmani 
Subject: AFRINIC Borad Elections



Dear,

 My name is Wafa Dahmani from Tunisia, an active member of the African 
community and more specifically AFRINIC: member of the appeal committee; ASO / 
AC excom member and Ex Chair of Governance Committee '(GC) at AFRINIC.
I contact you to solicit your votes for the following candidates:

Board of Directors:
North Africa (seat 1)

  *   Habin Youssef
West Africa (seat 2)

  *   Ly Ousmane

South Africa (seat 5)

  *   Mpisane Vika William

East Africa (seat 6)

  *   Nkusi Robert Ford

Non-regional (seat 7)

  *   Eshun Benjamin Adzenyamebeye



Election Number Resource Organization Number Council

  *   Mustapha Ben Jemaa

Election Policy Development Working Group

  *   Komi Elitcha
  *   Sami Hassan

Election Governance Committee

  *   Daniel Nanghaka
Ladies and Gentlemen, in the context of our strategy  and in order to preserve 
AFRINIC's interests for Africa and to be able to choose the right candidates 
for North Africa in the long term, it is desirable to join all our efforts and 
vote for these candidates who presents the best choice for an adequate board
the de facto vote online through your interface with AFRINIC is very simple for 
all categories except the policy development Working group where we want you to 
mobilize your teams on the spot to vote for our candidates
We strongly solicit your support

Thank you

Wafa Dahmani

member AFRINIC Appeal Committee
Global IGF MAG member
ASO / AC excom member
___
Community-Discuss mailing list
Community-Discuss@afrinic.net
https://lists.afrinic.net/mailman/listinfo/community-discuss