Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Alex ARNAUD]

Le 15/03/2018 à 15:53, michael caron couturier a écrit :

If you need at all cost to see to under that accessibility isn't on a
build made from the mini iso :

https://i.imgur.com/VIVjeSl.png


What your screenshot means is you've install Debian without 
accessibility enabled on the installation media. If you install Debian 
as a sighted person accessibility of the new environment will not be 
configured properly. If you expect to have a out-of-the-box environment 
with accessibility you have to install with braille, speech or both.


Best regards,
Alex.

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Samuel Thibault]

Hello,

michael caron couturier, on ven. 16 mars 2018 01:11:35 -0400, wrote:
> Minimal iso is worthless for an accessibility user and you would break
> the purpose of it by adding accessibility, it's clay to build from
> with the only bare minimum.

Well, "bare minimum" does not mean "inaccessible", really. The non-gtk
mini.iso does include braille support, just like other non-gtk images.
The gtk mini.iso does include speech support because just like other gtk
images, gtk already takes a lot of space anyway.

"mini" does not mean "minimum at all costs". It means "minimal set to
install Debian, everything that can be downloaded is not included".

> Adding the packages later didn't fixed the issue since there's a
> configuration (dotfiles) that manage accessibility.

Yes.  Thus why I pointed you several times to the
http://wiki.debian.org/accessibility page which does contain the
configuration needed to enable accessibility.  If something is missing,
then we need a more precise report of what you did exactly, because as
far as we know they just work.

Samuel

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[john doe]

On 3/16/2018 6:11 AM, michael caron couturier wrote:

Minimal iso is worthless for an accessibility user and you would break
the purpose of it by adding accessibility, it's clay to build from
with the only bare minimum.

Adding the packages later didn't fixed the issue since there's a
configuration (dotfiles) that manage accessibility.



If the Debian installer can get you what you want, it means that you are 
missing packages.

The installer simply install packages based on what you choose.

--
John Doe

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

Minimal iso is worthless for an accessibility user and you would break
the purpose of it by adding accessibility, it's clay to build from
with the only bare minimum.

Adding the packages later didn't fixed the issue since there's a
configuration (dotfiles) that manage accessibility.

2018-03-15 12:16 UTC−04:00, Samuel Thibault :
> michael caron couturier, on jeu. 15 mars 2018 11:47:37 -0400, wrote:
>> Skip since you obviously don't understand ...
>
> Well, if I can't understand, it will be hard for you to get any answer,
> so we need to discuss so I can understand.
>
>> There's no accessibility in the mini iso, I would have used it,
>
> The mini iso doesn't have any .deb package *at all*, so it just can not
> have any impact on what is installed or not in the eventual system.
> netinst does include some packages, but no gui package at all, so it
> should not make a difference.
>
> If there *is* a difference (which is not supposed to happen, and thus
> there would be a bug to be fixed), then please tell exactly how you
> installed with mini.iso and with netinst, so we can reproduce the issue
> and fix it, because for all we know it is working, but as soon as you
> don't pick up default options, there might be bugs which we have not met
> simply because we can not test all possible options combinations.
>
>> installed gnome-orca and brltty don't add accessibility options.
>
> Do you mean that after installing with mini.iso, gnome-orca and
> brltty were not installed (had you selected the MATE task item in the
> installer, or installed MATE afterwards?), and that even with installing
> gnome-orca brltty afterwards, there was still no accessibility option
> shown in the interface?
>
> Samuel
>


-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Samuel Thibault]

michael caron couturier, on jeu. 15 mars 2018 11:47:37 -0400, wrote:
> Skip since you obviously don't understand ...

Well, if I can't understand, it will be hard for you to get any answer,
so we need to discuss so I can understand.

> There's no accessibility in the mini iso, I would have used it,

The mini iso doesn't have any .deb package *at all*, so it just can not
have any impact on what is installed or not in the eventual system.
netinst does include some packages, but no gui package at all, so it
should not make a difference.

If there *is* a difference (which is not supposed to happen, and thus
there would be a bug to be fixed), then please tell exactly how you
installed with mini.iso and with netinst, so we can reproduce the issue
and fix it, because for all we know it is working, but as soon as you
don't pick up default options, there might be bugs which we have not met
simply because we can not test all possible options combinations.

> installed gnome-orca and brltty don't add accessibility options.

Do you mean that after installing with mini.iso, gnome-orca and
brltty were not installed (had you selected the MATE task item in the
installer, or installed MATE afterwards?), and that even with installing
gnome-orca brltty afterwards, there was still no accessibility option
shown in the interface?

Samuel

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

Skip since you obviously don't understand ...

There's no accessibility in the mini iso, I would have used it,
installed gnome-orca and brltty don't add accessibility options.

Yes I build a distro slowly, I have an interface for colorblinds
tested ready to pack but to fix accessibility for real on Linux I have
to create a distro in a proper way so I can't simply join Debian team,
I will later push my changes however.

2018-03-15 11:17 UTC−04:00, Samuel Thibault :
> michael caron couturier, on jeu. 15 mars 2018 10:53:32 -0400, wrote:
>> If you need at all cost to see to under that accessibility isn't on a
>> build made from the mini iso :
>>
>> https://i.imgur.com/VIVjeSl.png
>
> You mean you installed Debian without using accessibility, and
> then you got a system which does not have accessibility enabled?
> Well, yes, that is expected.  Again, to enable accessibility in the
> installed system, see the few commands we run, as documented on
> https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility
>
> Samuel
>


-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Samuel Thibault]

michael caron couturier, on jeu. 15 mars 2018 10:53:32 -0400, wrote:
> If you need at all cost to see to under that accessibility isn't on a
> build made from the mini iso :
> 
> https://i.imgur.com/VIVjeSl.png

You mean you installed Debian without using accessibility, and
then you got a system which does not have accessibility enabled?
Well, yes, that is expected.  Again, to enable accessibility in the
installed system, see the few commands we run, as documented on
https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility

Samuel

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

If you need at all cost to see to under that accessibility isn't on a
build made from the mini iso :

https://i.imgur.com/VIVjeSl.png

2018-03-15 10:46 UTC−04:00, michael caron couturier :
> Man could you do what was asked ?
>
> I wanted to know the config not touch the documentation, accessibility
> isn't on the mini iso, I installed anyway cause I have to start there,
> there's no point to add accessibility to this minimal iso anyway, it
> won't fit the purpose but  someone building up from it could need to
> know how the accessibility stack is build on Debian ...
>
> 2018-03-15 4:45 UTC−04:00, Samuel Thibault :
>> michael caron couturier, on jeu. 15 mars 2018 03:56:39 -0400, wrote:
>>> "Accessibility support is available on all images except the non-gtk
>>> mini.iso image."
>>>
>>> https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility#Debian_installer_accessibility
>>
>> Ok, so the bug was in the documentation, which I have now fixed, thanks
>> for the report.
>>
>> Samuel
>>
>
>
> --
> Michaël Caron Couturier
>


-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

Man could you do what was asked ?

I wanted to know the config not touch the documentation, accessibility
isn't on the mini iso, I installed anyway cause I have to start there,
there's no point to add accessibility to this minimal iso anyway, it
won't fit the purpose but  someone building up from it could need to
know how the accessibility stack is build on Debian ...

2018-03-15 4:45 UTC−04:00, Samuel Thibault :
> michael caron couturier, on jeu. 15 mars 2018 03:56:39 -0400, wrote:
>> "Accessibility support is available on all images except the non-gtk
>> mini.iso image."
>>
>> https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility#Debian_installer_accessibility
>
> Ok, so the bug was in the documentation, which I have now fixed, thanks
> for the report.
>
> Samuel
>


-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Samuel Thibault]

michael caron couturier, on jeu. 15 mars 2018 03:56:39 -0400, wrote:
> "Accessibility support is available on all images except the non-gtk
> mini.iso image."
> 
> https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility#Debian_installer_accessibility

Ok, so the bug was in the documentation, which I have now fixed, thanks
for the report.

Samuel

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

"Accessibility support is available on all images except the non-gtk
mini.iso image."

https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility#Debian_installer_accessibility

2018-03-15 3:54 UTC−04:00, Samuel Thibault :
> michael caron couturier, on mer. 14 mars 2018 22:41:31 -0400, wrote:
>> Mini iso don't,
>
> How so?  What doesn't work?  If you don't provide details, we can't fix
> bugs, because for all that I know, it just works.
>
> Samuel
>


-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Samuel Thibault]

michael caron couturier, on mer. 14 mars 2018 22:41:31 -0400, wrote:
> Mini iso don't,

How so?  What doesn't work?  If you don't provide details, we can't fix
bugs, because for all that I know, it just works.

Samuel

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

Mini iso don't, net install include accessibility but I try to build a
distro slowly so I start with the bare minimum ...

2018-03-14 20:22 UTC−04:00, Samuel Thibault :
> michael caron couturier, on mer. 14 mars 2018 20:00:07 -0400, wrote:
>> I asked cause mini iso don't include accessibility
>
> It does include it.  Or else it's a bug that shall be reported and
> fixed.
>
> Note however that for speakup support you need to take the gtk mini.iso,
> which doesn't have size constraints.
>
> Samuel
>


-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Samuel Thibault]

michael caron couturier, on mer. 14 mars 2018 20:00:07 -0400, wrote:
> I asked cause mini iso don't include accessibility

It does include it.  Or else it's a bug that shall be reported and
fixed.

Note however that for speakup support you need to take the gtk mini.iso,
which doesn't have size constraints.

Samuel

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

I asked cause mini iso don't include accessibility so I need to
replicate the usual settings ...

2018-03-14 17:09 UTC−04:00, Samuel Thibault :
> Hello,
>
> michael caron couturier, on lun. 12 mars 2018 12:42:04 -0400, wrote:
>> I just build up from the minimal iso into a Mate desktop, what are the
>> packages and settings done for accessibility on Debian, do you mod
>> some to improve accessibility and how ?
>
> There aren't realy tweaks, only making sure that accessibility is
> enabled, as documented on https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility
>
> Samuel
>


-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier

Re: Debian accessibility settings

[Samuel Thibault]

Hello,

michael caron couturier, on lun. 12 mars 2018 12:42:04 -0400, wrote:
> I just build up from the minimal iso into a Mate desktop, what are the
> packages and settings done for accessibility on Debian, do you mod
> some to improve accessibility and how ?

There aren't realy tweaks, only making sure that accessibility is
enabled, as documented on https://wiki.debian.org/accessibility

Samuel

Debian accessibility settings

[michael caron couturier]

I just build up from the minimal iso into a Mate desktop, what are the
packages and settings done for accessibility on Debian, do you mod
some to improve accessibility and how ?

-- 
Michaël Caron Couturier