Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wednesday 31 May 2006 18:08, Lennart Sorensen wrote: On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 05:08:35PM +0200, Francesco Pietra wrote: Hi Adam: I extrapolate your indications to my case (hope to the benefit of others too) of installed debian 64 testing from etch beta 2 release, choosing linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-generic. Hardware: TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd in raid1 from debian. All that functioning. Aim: to have a worksation for crunching numbers, i.e. no gui, no sound, but equipper for X with a flexible window manager like mwm. At present it is twm and nothing else is offered. When all ok, i have to compile some special applications in OpenGL as pre-computation. Finally, computations with mpqc, already available for debian unstable 64. Question: should I compile kernel from the present situation or it should be better replace before that actual kernel with a smp kernel (or it is immaterial)? Additional question: should hardware change, like additional ram, etc, I guess that the kernel has to be recompiled. True? Thanks a lot. I am no expert in computer science, just user who is looking for the highes floating point he can afford. Simepl solution: apt-get install linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-k8 or maybe linux-image-2.6.16-2-amd64-k8 (whichever is the currently available one). You might even be able to do: apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8, which will auto depend on whatever is current which is the simplest way to go. I am very sorry for having bothered Len and the audience with a number of faulty e-mails. This morning 1st June, with sources.list: deb http://secure-testing.debian.net/debian-secure-testing etch/security-updates contrib main non-free deb ftp:/at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp:/at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free I imported security key with: gpg --recv-key 946AA6E18722E71E gpg --armor --export 946AA6E18722E71E |apt-key add - Then: apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd6a-k8 uname -a reports Linux debian 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8 #2 Mon Mar 20 11:13:14 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux A question related to e-mail by helices, as they reported # uname -a Linux odin 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp #2 SMP Mon Mar 20 11:41:50 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux is their smp a must, or am I OK without it for my hardware TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd in raid1 from debian? Thank you again francesco pietra Len Sorensen
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Thu, Jun 01, 2006 at 08:32:52AM +0200, Francesco Pietra wrote: I am very sorry for having bothered Len and the audience with a number of faulty e-mails. This morning 1st June, with sources.list: deb http://secure-testing.debian.net/debian-secure-testing etch/security-updates contrib main non-free deb ftp:/at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp:/at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free I imported security key with: gpg --recv-key 946AA6E18722E71E gpg --armor --export 946AA6E18722E71E |apt-key add - Then: apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd6a-k8 Add -smp to the end. Then you will get the multi processor kernel instead. uname -a reports Linux debian 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8 #2 Mon Mar 20 11:13:14 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux A question related to e-mail by helices, as they reported # uname -a ? ? Linux odin 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp #2 SMP Mon Mar 20 11:41:50 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux is their smp a must, or am I OK without it for my hardware TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd in raid1 from debian? The smp kernel is required if you want to use more than one cpu core. Any dual core, or multi processor system requires an smp kernel to use those extra CPUs. Similarly any system with intel's hyperthreading requires an smp kernel to use the hyperthreading extra cpu. smp simply means you have more than one processor in linux. Doesn't matter what method of having multiple processors it is. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Thursday 01 June 2006 15:18, Lennart Sorensen wrote: On Thu, Jun 01, 2006 at 08:32:52AM +0200, Francesco Pietra wrote: I am very sorry for having bothered Len and the audience with a number of faulty e-mails. This morning 1st June, with sources.list: deb http://secure-testing.debian.net/debian-secure-testing etch/security-updates contrib main non-free deb ftp:/at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp:/at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free I imported security key with: gpg --recv-key 946AA6E18722E71E gpg --armor --export 946AA6E18722E71E |apt-key add - Then: apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd6a-k8 Add -smp to the end. Then you will get the multi processor kernel instead. uname -a reports Linux debian 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8 #2 Mon Mar 20 11:13:14 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux A question related to e-mail by helices, as they reported # uname -a ? ? Linux odin 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp #2 SMP Mon Mar 20 11:41:50 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux is their smp a must, or am I OK without it for my hardware TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd in raid1 from debian? The smp kernel is required if you want to use more than one cpu core. Any dual core, or multi processor system requires an smp kernel to use those extra CPUs. Similarly any system with intel's hyperthreading requires an smp kernel to use the hyperthreading extra cpu. smp simply means you have more than one processor in linux. Doesn't matter what method of having multiple processors it is. Len Sorensen #apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd6a-k8-smp OK, only reported that source packages couldn't start $uname -a Linux debian 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp #2 SMP Mon Mar 20 11:41:50 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux Therefore, the story is ended thanks to your advice. It was clean, simplifying, great advice. francesco pietra -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wednesday 31 May 2006 16:08, Francesco Pietra wrote:
Hi Adam:
I extrapolate your indications to my case (hope to the benefit of others
too) of installed debian 64 testing from etch beta 2 release, choosing
linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-generic.
Hardware: TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi
card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd
in raid1 from debian. All that functioning.
Aim: to have a worksation for crunching numbers, i.e. no gui, no sound, but
equipper for X with a flexible window manager like mwm. At present it is
twm and nothing else is offered. When all ok, i have to compile some
special applications in OpenGL as pre-computation. Finally, computations
with mpqc, already available for debian unstable 64.
Question: should I compile kernel from the present situation or it should
be better replace before that actual kernel with a smp kernel (or it is
immaterial)?
Well, you definitely want an SMP {symmetric multi processor} kernel, to be
able to make use of the multiple processors. Whether or not you want to
enable SMP is something that you have to select when you compile the kernel;
using the wrong one will give a performance penalty.
Removing anything unnecessary will speed your system up to some extent. Of
course, there's a trade-off; the process of deciding what you can do without
and removing it can end up taking you longer than you eventually save.
Additional question: should hardware change, like additional ram, etc, I
guess that the kernel has to be recompiled. True?
Just adding extra RAM shouldn't require a new kernel. It sometimes used to,
in the days of limited address space; but we haven't got anywhere near maxing
out 64-bit address space yet. Maybe we will by the time KDE5 comes out :)
You only need to recompile the kernel to add drivers for new hardware. If
there's something you know you're going to buy somewhere down the line,
consider compiling its driver as a module.
Thanks a lot. I am no expert in computer science, just user who is looking
for the highes floating point he can afford.
Compiling a kernel can be a bit of an adventure and you probably will want to
read up on it before you start. However, if you follow the instructions, it
will all work. The package kernel-package does most of the hard bits,
giving you a .deb file that you can install like any other.
As Len has pointed out, you do need to watch out for security patches with
home-made kernels. If one does come out that demands your attention, then
you'll have to patch your sources and re-compile. But you can cross that
bridge when you come to it .
--
AJS
delta echo bravo six four at earthshod dot co dot uk
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Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Thu, 1 Jun 2006, A J Stiles wrote: On Wednesday 31 May 2006 16:08, Francesco Pietra wrote: As Len has pointed out, you do need to watch out for security patches with home-made kernels. If one does come out that demands your attention, then you'll have to patch your sources and re-compile. But you can cross that bridge when you come to it . you can, to some extent, keep the best of both worlds: compile your own kernel, using the debian packaged kernel sources. I currently run a number of (unofficial) sarge machines, using backported udev, yaird and a few more packages from sid + kernels compiled from the linux-source-2.6.x packages from sid. They are maintained by the Debian Kernel team, including security patches, are up to date and I compile what I need (the debian way, using kernel-package). Bye Giacomo -- _ Giacomo Mulas [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ OSSERVATORIO ASTRONOMICO DI CAGLIARI Str. 54, Loc. Poggio dei Pini * 09012 Capoterra (CA) Tel. (OAC): +39 070 71180 248 Fax : +39 070 71180 222 Tel. (UNICA): +39 070 675 4916 _ When the storms are raging around you, stay right where you are (Freddy Mercury) _ -- Il messaggio e' stato analizzato alla ricerca di virus o contenuti pericolosi da MailScanner, ed e' risultato non infetto. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
helices wrote: Now that my new hp xw9300, dual opteron system is up and running, I give thanks to all of you who have steered me in the right direction. Thank you. Now, I have this kernel booting: # uname -a Linux odin 2.6.15-1-amd64-generic #2 Mon Mar 20 10:43:41 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux So, I am not yet running on both cpu's ; This is what I see: # COLUMNS=160 dpkg -l '*kernel*' | sed 's!^!!;s! .*$!!' | grep 64 kernel-headers-2.6-amd64-generic kernel-headers-2.6-amd64-k8 kernel-headers-2.6-amd64-k8-smp kernel-headers-2.6-em64t-p4 kernel-headers-2.6-em64t-p4-smp kernel-headers-2.6.8-11-amd64-gene kernel-headers-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8 kernel-headers-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8-s kernel-headers-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4 kernel-headers-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4-s kernel-headers-2.6.8-12-amd64-gene kernel-headers-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8 kernel-headers-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-s kernel-headers-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4 kernel-headers-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4-s kernel-image-2.6-amd64-generic kernel-image-2.6-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6-em64t-p4-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-generi kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-generi kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4-smp kernel-patch-2.4.27-ia64 systemimager-kernel-ia64 I am also seeing a series beginning like this: nvidia-kernel* WHICH kernel will make best use of my system? Of those listed, kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp. But you probably don't want any of those listed. WHY am I running 2.6.15 , when the newest I find available is 2.6.8-12 ? Your kernel is not an official Sarge kernel - it is a backported kernel for installation purposes. Try backports.org, for 2.6.15 kernels for Sarge. Since this box uses nvidia chipsets, what are the nvidia-kernel* packages about? Pre-compiled nvidia.ko modules, for use with the nvidia-glx 3D driver -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
* Jo Shields [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006:05:31:14:00:04+0100] scribed: helices wrote: Now that my new hp xw9300, dual opteron system is up and running, I give thanks to all of you who have steered me in the right direction. Thank you. Now, I have this kernel booting: # uname -a Linux odin 2.6.15-1-amd64-generic #2 Mon Mar 20 10:43:41 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux So, I am not yet running on both cpu's ; This is what I see: snip / kernel-image-2.6-amd64-generic kernel-image-2.6-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6-em64t-p4-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-generi kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-generi kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4-smp snip / WHICH kernel will make best use of my system? Of those listed, kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp. But you probably don't want any of those listed. snip / OK, I'll bite. WHICH kernel do you recommend? WHY? Thank you, for your participation in this issue. -- Best Regards, helices - Dare to fix things before they break . . . - Our capacity for understanding is inversely proportional to how much we think we know. The more I know, the more I know I don't know . . . -- signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
helices wrote: * Jo Shields [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006:05:31:14:00:04+0100] scribed: helices wrote: Now that my new hp xw9300, dual opteron system is up and running, I give thanks to all of you who have steered me in the right direction. Thank you. Now, I have this kernel booting: # uname -a Linux odin 2.6.15-1-amd64-generic #2 Mon Mar 20 10:43:41 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux So, I am not yet running on both cpu's ; This is what I see: snip / kernel-image-2.6-amd64-generic kernel-image-2.6-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6-em64t-p4-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-generi kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6.8-11-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6.8-11-em64t-p4-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-generi kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8 kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp kernel-image-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4 kernel-image-2.6.8-12-em64t-p4-smp snip / WHICH kernel will make best use of my system? Of those listed, kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp. But you probably don't want any of those listed. snip / OK, I'll bite. WHICH kernel do you recommend? WHY? I recommend application of common sense. I've already stated why you might already have a 2.6.15 system (requirement for a newer kernel for hardware reasons), that backports.org has 2.6.15 kernels on it, and that the kernel ending in -amd64-k8-smp is appropriate for you. Fill in the blanks. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
* Jo Shields [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006:05:31:14:12:17+0100] scribed: snip / Thank you, for your participation in these matters. I recommend application of common sense. Please, be patient with me. I am trying to get my brain around this whole amd64 thing. This is not immediately intuitive to me, especially since everything is in motion, and so many things are changing simultaneously. I've already stated why you might already have a 2.6.15 system Yes, I understand that. However, I used this to install: debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso I am under the impression that this is integral to the recent subsumption of amd64 into the standard debian repository; and, therefore, that I should follow this standard repository for etch/testing. Today, you advised that the kernel that that ISO installed did NOT come from the standard repository. I am confused. What am I missing? (requirement for a newer kernel for hardware reasons), OK, I understand what you wrote there; but, how could I have guessed that from your previous message? So, is that the whole story; that my system requires kernel functionality NOT available prior to 2.6.15 ??? If I know this, then much else follows naturally ... that backports.org has 2.6.15 kernels on it, Yes, you did make that clear. Is the backports.org path preferable to debian standard `experimental'? WHY? Is this documented somewhere? I have not found any FAQ regarding this ... Sometime in my i386 past, I ended up with a totally messed up system, by following backports.org, and later trying to upgrade back into standard repository, once newer packages were available there. That, to my simple mind, was NOT a good `application of common sense' ; and that the kernel ending in -amd64-k8-smp is appropriate for you. OK. I was not even sure about `smp', because I have read something stating that my system is not exactly `smp'; rather, something more parallel than symmetric -- but, I probably misunderstood this? Fill in the blanks. Thank you. You obviously have been doing this amd64 stuff for quite some time! I am the newbie. As a newbie, I try very hard to err on the side of caution; until such time as I know enough to be dangerous. Am I there yet? -- Best Regards, helices - Dare to fix things before they break . . . - Our capacity for understanding is inversely proportional to how much we think we know. The more I know, the more I know I don't know . . . -- signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
helices wrote: * Jo Shields [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006:05:31:14:12:17+0100] scribed: snip / Thank you, for your participation in these matters. I recommend application of common sense. Please, be patient with me. I am trying to get my brain around this whole amd64 thing. This is not immediately intuitive to me, especially since everything is in motion, and so many things are changing simultaneously. I've already stated why you might already have a 2.6.15 system Yes, I understand that. However, I used this to install: debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso I am under the impression that this is integral to the recent subsumption of amd64 into the standard debian repository; and, therefore, that I should follow this standard repository for etch/testing. Today, you advised that the kernel that that ISO installed did NOT come from the standard repository. I am confused. What am I missing? (requirement for a newer kernel for hardware reasons), OK, I understand what you wrote there; but, how could I have guessed that from your previous message? So, is that the whole story; that my system requires kernel functionality NOT available prior to 2.6.15 ??? If I know this, then much else follows naturally ... that backports.org has 2.6.15 kernels on it, Yes, you did make that clear. Is the backports.org path preferable to debian standard `experimental'? WHY? Is this documented somewhere? I have not found any FAQ regarding this ... Sometime in my i386 past, I ended up with a totally messed up system, by following backports.org, and later trying to upgrade back into standard repository, once newer packages were available there. That, to my simple mind, was NOT a good `application of common sense' ; and that the kernel ending in -amd64-k8-smp is appropriate for you. OK. I was not even sure about `smp', because I have read something stating that my system is not exactly `smp'; rather, something more parallel than symmetric -- but, I probably misunderstood this? You misunderstood. More than 1 core - SMP kernel. End of story. Fill in the blanks. Thank you. You obviously have been doing this amd64 stuff for quite some time! I am the newbie. As a newbie, I try very hard to err on the side of caution; until such time as I know enough to be dangerous. Am I there yet? Nothing so far is AMD64-specific. The list of kernels you got from dpkg showed 2.6.8 and 2.4.27 - these are from Debian Sarge (stable). If you do not wish to run Debian Sarge (stable), then you need to alter your /etc/apt/sources.list file to point to a valid Etch or Sid server, in which case valid linux-image packages will be shown, including an SMP kernel for your hardware. If you *DO* want to run Debian Sarge, then you want to either use an SMP kernel from Sarge (i.e. 2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp, if it fully supports your hardware), or an SMP kernel *for* Sarge, i.e. from backports.org (linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp). Nothing so far is AMD64-specific. If you are running a server, as intended for a production service, then you are STRONGLY recommended to run a stable service - i.e. using Debian Sarge (stable). If you are running a desktop machine for your own use, then you may consider using Etch (testing) or Sid (unstable), which frequently break. Nothing so far is AMD64-specific. Now, the AMD64-specific part. Debian Sarge, officially, supports 12 architectures - which does NOT include AMD64. Debian Etch *DOES* support AMD64, but has not yet been released, and like any work in progress, is highly prone to issues. There exists an unofficial port of Debian Sarge to AMD64, as obtainable from amd64.debian.net - this is, however, potentially home to unforseen bugs. I run a production service using Unofficial AMD64 Sarge, but your mileage may vary. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wednesday 31 May 2006 14:06, helices wrote:
WHICH kernel will make best use of my system?
Of those listed, kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp. But you probably
don't want any of those listed.
snip /
OK, I'll bite. WHICH kernel do you recommend? WHY?
The best kernel for your system is always one you have compiled yourself.
Get yourself some kernel sources from kernel.org, the .config file for the
kernel you are currently using, and the output of lsmod. Do `make oldconfig`
{which will ask you a series of questions about any new features that were
not in the kernel version to which your existing .config applies; you may as
well just accept the defaults} and then `make menuconfig`. Enable SMP,
hard-compile in any modules you want to be hard-compiled in, and disable
drivers for any hardware you know you haven't got and aren't going to get in
future.
After that you can compile your kernel with make-kpkg and install it. Don't
forget to run /sbin/lilo if you are using that, or whatever the alternative
is if you are using grub.
The worst you can do if you mess up is cause your system to need booting from
a CD. Then you'll have to mount your system, chroot in and sort out the
bootloader configuration. It sounds a lot more painful than it really is.
Final piece of advice: if you're running apache2 and PHP on a box with
multiple processors, make even surer than usual to use the prefork version!
--
AJS
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Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 03:17:08PM +0100, Adam Stiles wrote:
The best kernel for your system is always one you have compiled yourself.
I think that's a load of crap. The majority of systems work perfectly
with one of the debian provided kernels.
Get yourself some kernel sources from kernel.org, the .config file for the
kernel you are currently using, and the output of lsmod. Do `make oldconfig`
{which will ask you a series of questions about any new features that were
not in the kernel version to which your existing .config applies; you may as
well just accept the defaults} and then `make menuconfig`. Enable SMP,
hard-compile in any modules you want to be hard-compiled in, and disable
drivers for any hardware you know you haven't got and aren't going to get in
future.
If you go to kernel.org then security updates become your problem to
track, while if you use the debian kernels, debian will track them for
you and patch in the fixes. This saves an awful lot of trouble for most
people.
Overall, I think it is very bad advice.
Len Sorensen
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Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
* Lennart Sorensen [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006:05:31:11:37:10-0400] scribed: snip / If you go to kernel.org then security updates become your problem to track, while if you use the debian kernels, debian will track them for you and patch in the fixes. This saves an awful lot of trouble for most people. Overall, I think it is very bad advice. This IS an issue for me. I will not track this manually; but, I will follow apt recommendations. So, how is this tracked for kernels at backports.org? -- Best Regards, helices - Dare to fix things before they break . . . - Our capacity for understanding is inversely proportional to how much we think we know. The more I know, the more I know I don't know . . . -- signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 03:17:08PM +0100, Adam Stiles wrote: The best kernel for your system is always one you have compiled yourself. I think that's a load of crap. The majority of systems work perfectly with one of the debian provided kernels. I agree, mostly. If you use a packaged kernel, you end up with the same compiled code and drivers that you would have if you compiled it yourself. However you sometimes need drivers that aren't compiled in or modules included with the packaged ones. Ndiswrapper and mppe are two that come to mind. In this case, you have to get the patches for these, which are in dselect, and compile your own kernel. Get yourself some kernel sources from kernel.org, the .config file for There isn't a need to do this even if you want to compile your own kernel. You should really install kernel-package; this will give you the tool make-kpkg, which should be used to make kernels in Debian. It will work with source packages (linux-source-2.6.x) that are installed through dselect, and will create debs of the kernel image and headers. After all that trouble, you might find that the sources won't compile, or you might end up with no console or even no boot disk, because you didn't select the driver for your SCSI card, etc. It is best to start off with a packaged kernel until you get the hang of building your own for your machine. -- Bhaskar S. Manda
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 10:57:24AM -0500, helices wrote: This IS an issue for me. I will not track this manually; but, I will follow apt recommendations. So, how is this tracked for kernels at backports.org? The maintainers of backports.org will _hopefully_ be tracking whichever debian kernel they backported wihtin resonable time. So far they have been doing that rather well for the kernel packages. They seem to be updated within a few days at most. If you were to simply run etch (which for amd64 would be the lowest version to officially be debian), then it would have the new kernels from security.debian.org automatically. If you use the unofficial sarge release, then you would still get security fixes from debian. If you add backports.org then you will have to hope the backports.org maintainers keep up on things. For a production system I would be a bit torn on wether to jump to etch because it is official and supported by debian proper, or stick with plain sarge unofficial, or use sarge + backports. I am not sure. Certainly 2.6.8 kernel is a bit of a pain for the majority of amd64 systems, since they are usually rather new. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
Hi Adam:
I extrapolate your indications to my case (hope to the benefit of others too)
of installed debian 64 testing from etch beta 2 release, choosing
linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-generic.
Hardware: TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi
card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd
in raid1 from debian. All that functioning.
Aim: to have a worksation for crunching numbers, i.e. no gui, no sound, but
equipper for X with a flexible window manager like mwm. At present it is twm
and nothing else is offered. When all ok, i have to compile some special
applications in OpenGL as pre-computation. Finally, computations with mpqc,
already available for debian unstable 64.
Question: should I compile kernel from the present situation or it should be
better replace before that actual kernel with a smp kernel (or it is
immaterial)?
Additional question: should hardware change, like additional ram, etc, I guess
that the kernel has to be recompiled. True?
Thanks a lot. I am no expert in computer science, just user who is looking for
the highes floating point he can afford.
francesco pietra
On Wednesday 31 May 2006 16:17, Adam Stiles wrote:
On Wednesday 31 May 2006 14:06, helices wrote:
WHICH kernel will make best use of my system?
Of those listed, kernel-image-2.6.8-12-amd64-k8-smp. But you probably
don't want any of those listed.
snip /
OK, I'll bite. WHICH kernel do you recommend? WHY?
The best kernel for your system is always one you have compiled yourself.
Get yourself some kernel sources from kernel.org, the .config file for the
kernel you are currently using, and the output of lsmod. Do `make
oldconfig` {which will ask you a series of questions about any new features
that were not in the kernel version to which your existing .config applies;
you may as well just accept the defaults} and then `make menuconfig`.
Enable SMP, hard-compile in any modules you want to be hard-compiled in,
and disable drivers for any hardware you know you haven't got and aren't
going to get in future.
After that you can compile your kernel with make-kpkg and install it.
Don't forget to run /sbin/lilo if you are using that, or whatever the
alternative is if you are using grub.
The worst you can do if you mess up is cause your system to need booting
from a CD. Then you'll have to mount your system, chroot in and sort out
the bootloader configuration. It sounds a lot more painful than it really
is.
Final piece of advice: if you're running apache2 and PHP on a box with
multiple processors, make even surer than usual to use the prefork
version!
--
AJS
--
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Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 05:08:35PM +0200, Francesco Pietra wrote: Hi Adam: I extrapolate your indications to my case (hope to the benefit of others too) of installed debian 64 testing from etch beta 2 release, choosing linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-generic. Hardware: TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd in raid1 from debian. All that functioning. Aim: to have a worksation for crunching numbers, i.e. no gui, no sound, but equipper for X with a flexible window manager like mwm. At present it is twm and nothing else is offered. When all ok, i have to compile some special applications in OpenGL as pre-computation. Finally, computations with mpqc, already available for debian unstable 64. Question: should I compile kernel from the present situation or it should be better replace before that actual kernel with a smp kernel (or it is immaterial)? Additional question: should hardware change, like additional ram, etc, I guess that the kernel has to be recompiled. True? Thanks a lot. I am no expert in computer science, just user who is looking for the highes floating point he can afford. Simepl solution: apt-get install linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-k8 or maybe linux-image-2.6.16-2-amd64-k8 (whichever is the currently available one). You might even be able to do: apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8, which will auto depend on whatever is current which is the simplest way to go. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
Thank you, for your participation in these matters. * Lennart Sorensen [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006:05:31:12:04:30-0400] scribed: snip / If you were to simply run etch (which for amd64 would be the lowest version to officially be debian), then it would have the new kernels from security.debian.org automatically. If you use the unofficial sarge release, then you would still get security fixes from debian. If you add backports.org then you will have to hope the backports.org maintainers keep up on things. For a production system I would be a bit torn on wether to jump to etch because it is official and supported by debian proper, or stick with plain sarge unofficial, or use sarge + backports. I am not sure. Certainly 2.6.8 kernel is a bit of a pain for the majority of amd64 systems, since they are usually rather new. I thought that I AM following etch ?!?! I used this to install: debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso When that was done, my sources.list was this: deb cdrom:[Debian GNU/Linux testing _Etch_ - Official Snapshot amd64 Binary-1 (20060314)]/ etch main deb http://mirror.espri.arizona.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ etch main deb-src http://mirror.espri.arizona.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ etch main # Line commented out by installer because it failed to verify: # deb http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main deb-src http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main Subsequently, I started a thread here about sources.list. Due to advice from that thread, I changed to this: # Security updates deb http://security.debian.org/ stable/updates contrib main non-free deb http://secure-testing.debian.net/debian-secure-testing etch/security-updates contrib main non-free deb-src http://secure-testing.debian.net/debian-secure-testing etch/security-updates contrib main non-free # debain-amd64 deb ftp://debian.csail.mit.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free deb ftp://ftp.at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirror.espri.arizona.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free # Packages deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ testing contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ unstable contrib main non-free # Source deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ stable contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ testing contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ unstable contrib main non-free I brought in sarge so that I could get kde running. So, perhaps, I do NOT have my sources.list properly configured yet? What do you think? -- Best Regards, helices - Dare to fix things before they break . . . - Our capacity for understanding is inversely proportional to how much we think we know. The more I know, the more I know I don't know . . . -- signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
Hi Len: I went on immediately with your suggestion about the kernel, however, with my present /etc/apt/sources.list: deb http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main deb ftp://ftp.nl.debian.org/debian/ etch main contrib non-free (the equivalent deb-src are commented) command #apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8 returns Couldn' find . Is any error in my sources.list? Otherwise, where to look for (nl or other country?)? Thank you francesco pietra On Wednesday 31 May 2006 18:08, Lennart Sorensen wrote: On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 05:08:35PM +0200, Francesco Pietra wrote: Hi Adam: I extrapolate your indications to my case (hope to the benefit of others too) of installed debian 64 testing from etch beta 2 release, choosing linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-generic. Hardware: TWO 264 amd64-opteron on Tyan K8WE 2895 plus video card and scsi card for external scsi chain composed of hd, CD, and scanner ; plus TWO hd in raid1 from debian. All that functioning. Aim: to have a worksation for crunching numbers, i.e. no gui, no sound, but equipper for X with a flexible window manager like mwm. At present it is twm and nothing else is offered. When all ok, i have to compile some special applications in OpenGL as pre-computation. Finally, computations with mpqc, already available for debian unstable 64. Question: should I compile kernel from the present situation or it should be better replace before that actual kernel with a smp kernel (or it is immaterial)? Additional question: should hardware change, like additional ram, etc, I guess that the kernel has to be recompiled. True? Thanks a lot. I am no expert in computer science, just user who is looking for the highes floating point he can afford. Simepl solution: apt-get install linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-k8 or maybe linux-image-2.6.16-2-amd64-k8 (whichever is the currently available one). You might even be able to do: apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8, which will auto depend on whatever is current which is the simplest way to go. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 06:05:20PM +0200, Francesco Pietra wrote: Hi Len: I went on immediately with your suggestion about the kernel, however, with my present /etc/apt/sources.list: deb http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main deb ftp://ftp.nl.debian.org/debian/ etch main contrib non-free That looks fine, although I would use http:// instead (as in http://ftp.nl) since it is faster in general. (the equivalent deb-src are commented) command #apt-get install linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8 Hmm. Well I should have said linux-image-2.6-amd-k8-smp anyhow. I just looked and found this on the site: http://ftp.nl.debian.org/debian/pool/main/l/linux-2.6/linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp_2.6.15-8_amd64.deb So the site does have a pakcage named linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp for at least 2.6.15. Looking at the Packages.gz for amd64 in etch on the server, it says the version it should be using is 2.6.15-8, which is the package above. So it should be working. Make sure you did apt-get update recently. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 11:20:30AM -0500, helices wrote: I thought that I AM following etch ?!?! I used this to install: debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso When that was done, my sources.list was this: deb cdrom:[Debian GNU/Linux testing _Etch_ - Official Snapshot amd64 Binary-1 (20060314)]/ etch main That Image is too old. That I believe predates amd64 becoming official, or at least would be very close to the transition time. You probably at least want to remove the cdrom entry from sources.list deb http://mirror.espri.arizona.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ etch main deb-src http://mirror.espri.arizona.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ etch main # Line commented out by installer because it failed to verify: # deb http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main deb-src http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main Subsequently, I started a thread here about sources.list. Due to advice from that thread, I changed to this: # Security updates deb http://security.debian.org/ stable/updates contrib main non-free deb http://secure-testing.debian.net/debian-secure-testing etch/security-updates contrib main non-free deb-src http://secure-testing.debian.net/debian-secure-testing etch/security-updates contrib main non-free # debain-amd64 deb ftp://debian.csail.mit.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free deb ftp://ftp.at.debian.org/debian-amd64/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirror.espri.arizona.edu/debian-amd64/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free Get rid of those, if you are using etch. They are of no use and might cause problems (although most likely they will do nothing). # Packages deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ testing contrib main non-free deb ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ unstable contrib main non-free # Source deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ sarge contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ etch contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ stable contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ testing contrib main non-free deb-src ftp://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ unstable contrib main non-free Seems ok. I brought in sarge so that I could get kde running. Well I guess some of the old sarge packages would work until everything makes it into etch, although then again some might not work. Not sure. So, perhaps, I do NOT have my sources.list properly configured yet? What do you think? It does look like it should work. Unfortunately having installed with what is probably the wrong or at least too old cd image might be a problem. Etch does change a lot right now. Len Sorensen -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
* Lennart Sorensen [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006:05:31:13:15:19-0400] scribed: On Wed, May 31, 2006 at 11:20:30AM -0500, helices wrote: I thought that I AM following etch ?!?! I used this to install: debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso When that was done, my sources.list was this: deb cdrom:[Debian GNU/Linux testing _Etch_ - Official Snapshot amd64 Binary-1 (20060314)]/ etch main That Image is too old. That I believe predates amd64 becoming official, or at least would be very close to the transition time. snip / That being as it may, I started here: http://www.us.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/ and clicked on [amd64] under netinst CD image (100-150 MB). Near as I can tell, that IS the official debian way-to-go ... Well I guess some of the old sarge packages would work until everything makes it into etch, although then again some might not work. Not sure. I am counting on that ... So, perhaps, I do NOT have my sources.list properly configured yet? What do you think? It does look like it should work. Unfortunately having installed with what is probably the wrong or at least too old cd image might be a problem. Etch does change a lot right now. EUREKA !!! I have been querying dpkg with '*kernel*'; and, the applicable kernel images do NOT contain the string 'kernel' ; # COLUMNS=200 dpkg -l '*linux-image*' | sed 's!^!!;s! .*$!!' | grep amd64 linux-image-2.6-amd64-generic linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp linux-image-2.6-vserver-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6-xen-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6-xen-vserver-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-generic linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp linux-image-2.6.16-1-amd64-generic linux-image-2.6.16-1-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6.16-1-amd64-k8-smp linux-image-2.6.16-2-amd64-generic linux-image-2.6.16-2-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6.16-2-amd64-k8-smp linux-image-2.6.16-2-vserver-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6.16-2-xen-amd64-k8 linux-image-2.6.16-2-xen-vserver-amd64-k8 linux-image-amd64-generic linux-image-amd64-k8 linux-image-amd64-k8-smp linux-image-vserver-amd64-k8 linux-image-xen-amd64-k8 linux-image-xen-vserver-amd64-k8 Oddly enough, I did this: # sudo aptitude -P install linux-image-amd64-k8-smp Which did this: Get:1 ftp://mirrors.kernel.org etch/main linux-image-2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp 2.6.15-8 [15.4MB] And, this: Setting up linux-image-2.6-amd64-k8-smp (2.6.15-8) ... Setting up linux-image-amd64-k8-smp (2.6.15-8) ... After reboot, I see this: # uname -a Linux odin 2.6.15-1-amd64-k8-smp #2 SMP Mon Mar 20 11:41:50 UTC 2006 x86_64 GNU/Linux So, which kernel version is this? 2.6.15-1 -- OR -- 2.6.15-8 Otherwise, I now have a system with BOTH cpu's in gear ; Thank you, for your participation ... -- Best Regards, helices - Dare to fix things before they break . . . - Our capacity for understanding is inversely proportional to how much we think we know. The more I know, the more I know I don't know . . . -- signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: which kernel for dual opteron ???
Really depends on if you are running Sarge or Etch and what chip set your motherboard uses, and if you are running dual processors?. If you are new - I would recommend Sarge. Karl Schmidt EMail [EMAIL PROTECTED] Transtronics, Inc. WEB http://xtronics.com 3209 West 9th StreetPh (785) 841-3089 Lawrence, KS 66049 FAX (785) 841-0434 Never let school interfere with your education. - Mark Twain -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
