Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
On Thu, Sep 13, 2001 at 08:42:44AM -0500, Ardo van Rangelrooij wrote: Hi, I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. The intend of this proposal is not to simply take over the packages (although it might come to that), but to help in the maintenance of them. This sounds like a good Idea. Yes I'm late in this discussion but I do not follow debian-devel extremely regular and I missed this thread. :) As the first step I propose to add an Uploaders field to the package (once we have a list of people). I'd like to help. I have a lot of ideas for how to configure apache from other packages. Right now I have a special system at work but it is not very compatible with the apache one. I also maintain wwwconfig-common that does similar things. What I want is a better system because none of what I have mentioned works very well. Wwwconfig-common works but it should not exist at all because apache and the database tools should provide this functionality. :) See bug #112553 for my ideas of how things should be configured. http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=112553repeatmerged=yes Regards, // Ola Some of the other things this task force would do are - writing up guidelines for packaging Apache modules (a kind of policy doc) Great idea. Something like the debian-java policy. - migration to Apache 2 (IIRC an ITP for this has already been filed by somebody) I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. Just subscribed. :) Regards, // Ola Thanks, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- - Ola Lundqvist --- / [EMAIL PROTECTED] Björnkärrsgatan 5 A.11 \ | [EMAIL PROTECTED] 584 36 LINKÖPING | | +46 (0)13-17 69 83 +46 (0)70-332 1551 | | http://www.opal.dhs.org UIN/icq: 4912500 | \ gpg/f.p.: 7090 A92B 18FE 7994 0C36 4FE4 18A1 B1CF 0FE5 3DD9 / ---
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Martin F Krafft wrote: also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Thu, 13 Sep 2001 08:42:44AM) I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). count me in. I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. i can give you one easily. applying at lists.debian.org takes ages! how about [EMAIL PROTECTED] :) I'd appreciate that! As Debian Listmaster I don't like too small and unused lists. Thus first demonstrate need, e.g. by running an active list somewhere else, then ask for a regular Debian list. As an alternative Ardo could invent [EMAIL PROTECTED] as simple alias. Regards, Joey -- There are lies, statistics and benchmarks. Please always Cc to me when replying to me on the lists.
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Martin Schulze [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: As an alternative Ardo could invent [EMAIL PROTECTED] as simple alias. Out of curiosity: what is required in order for [EMAIL PROTECTED] to be distributed to several people? Is this automated? -- Marcelo | Dock-a-loodle-fod! [EMAIL PROTECTED] | -- Dyslexic roosters are a sad sight |(Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man)
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Fri, 14 Sep 2001 07:06:52PM -0500): Please do. Something like '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' or so? I'm still gonna file against lists.debian.org. Once that is created we can move over. Do you also support archiving? That would be really great. alright. doing so right now. if you could give me the email addys of the involved. - putting together a web page similar to that of the X Strike Force with a link to the packages and their bug lists, a todo list, etc. i can host. Great. Can you give all involved access? sure thing. *** PLEASE CONTACT ME DIRECTLY IF YOU NEED ACCESS *** - setting up a CVS archive somewhere ditto. Great. I'm sitting behind an analog line of 24k or so and I'll probably keep my own local CVS archive but will of course keep in sync with the official one. word up. Thanks for providing all this. :-) no problem. i do have to say a couple of things, mainly that my server is 4000 miles away. i can administer it fine, but if it goes down, then there may not be anything i can do for you. we'll just make it a temporary solution... i am not worried, just saying that we should not rely on it too much and keep backups at other places - easy to do with CVS... on a related note, i just got a change of pace for work and i am starting to question, how much activity i can contribute. i'll host all the stuff, and i'll be subscribed, but in terms of helping, i'll see what goes on, and jump in if i can. martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- i took an iq test and the results were negative. pgpPUNrhCMgjr.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Thu, 13 Sep 2001 10:33:39PM -0500): - filing a request for the mailing list i'll set one up. filing against lists.debian.org takes too long. - putting together a web page similar to that of the X Strike Force with a link to the packages and their bug lists, a todo list, etc. i can host. - setting up a CVS archive somewhere ditto. martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- it would be truly surprising if sound were not capable of suggesting colour, if colours could not give the idea of the melody, if sound and colour were not adequate to express ideas. -- claude debussy pgppSbO7YqvsR.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
I would like to help. Well, Apache and its related stuff is big enough to require an special work. El 13 Sep 2001 a las 08:42AM -0500, Ardo van Rangelrooij escribio: Hi, I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. The intend of this proposal is not to simply take over the packages (although it might come to that), but to help in the maintenance of them. As the first step I propose to add an Uploaders field to the package (once we have a list of people). Some of the other things this task force would do are - writing up guidelines for packaging Apache modules (a kind of policy doc) - migration to Apache 2 (IIRC an ITP for this has already been filed by somebody) I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. Thanks, Ardo -- Lee la comparecencia de Kriptopolis ante el Senado acerca de la LSSI, es importante. http://www.kriptopolis.com/26525278.html Andres Seco Hernandez- [EMAIL PROTECTED] MCP ID 445900 - http://andressh.alamin.org GnuPG public information: pub 1024D/3A48C934 E61C 08A9 EBC8 12E4 F363 E359 EDAC BE0B 3A48 C934 -- Alamin GSM SMS Gateway - http://www.alamin.org Debian GNU/Linux - http://www.debian.org Grupo de Usuarios de GNU/Linux de Guadalajara y alrededores - http://gulalcarria.sourceforge.net -- pgpRp5QO33ib6.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Andres Seco Hernandez writes: Well, Apache and its related stuff is big enough to require an special work. I've been very unhappy in the /etc/init.d/apache script - I'd like if it would check the configuration before stop or restart and if it would be possible to start Apache with option -X for testing purposes. I'm in the middle of NM process but I'm willing to contribute my own script (which needs cleaning before publishing) whether I'll become a developer or not. If my script is accepted, that is. -- #!/usr/bin/perl -w --Ari Makela [EMAIL PROTECTED] # # http://arska.org/hauva/ # # Sailing is, after all, a kind of grace, a kind of magic. - Phil Berman
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Ari Makela [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Andres Seco Hernandez writes: Well, Apache and its related stuff is big enough to require an special work. I've been very unhappy in the /etc/init.d/apache script - I'd like if it would check the configuration before stop or restart and if it would be possible to start Apache with option -X for testing purposes. If you need to start it with -X, just do it by hand. That's what I do when I'm hacking on mod_dtcl. I'm not really sure that modes of operation belong in init.d scripts... Ciao, -- David N. Welton Consulting: http://www.dedasys.com/ Free Software: http://people.debian.org/~davidw/ Apache Tcl: http://tcl.apache.org/ Personal: http://www.efn.org/~davidw/
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
David N. Welton writes: If you need to start it with -X, just do it by hand. That's what I do when I'm hacking on mod_dtcl. I'm not really sure that modes of operation belong in init.d scripts... Possibly, that's just a question of policy. However, I do feel that having it in the init script would help novices. However, checking the configuration before stopping Apache is crucial. -- #!/usr/bin/perl -w --Ari Makela [EMAIL PROTECTED] # # http://arska.org/hauva/ # # Sailing is, after all, a kind of grace, a kind of magic. - Phil Berman
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
On Thu, 13 Sep 2001, Ardo van Rangelrooij wrote: T.Pospisek's MailLists ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Thu, 13 Sep 2001, Ardo van Rangelrooij wrote: I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. I agree. I can't remember the last time I did a apt-get install apache an I still had a running webserver. I would think this is mostly due to the maintainer having too much work on his hands and so not being able to finetune the upgrade process. Apache is a very popular package and so IMHO it would be good if it'd be in a perfect shape. So I can count you in as a volunteer? As much as I'd like to - no, I've got too much on my hands with other stuff. But be sure that I'll send in the occassional patch or improvement suggestion. *t Tomas Pospisek SourcePole - Linux Open Source Solutions http://sourcepole.ch Elestastrasse 18, 7310 Bad Ragaz, Switzerland Tel: +41 (81) 330 77 11
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
On Thu, Sep 13, 2001 at 10:33:39PM -0500, Ardo van Rangelrooij wrote: Martin F Krafft ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Thu, 13 Sep 2001 08:42:44AM) I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). count me in. Excellent! There are a couple of things we can start with: - filing a request for the mailing list - putting together a web page similar to that of the X Strike Force with a link to the packages and their bug lists, a todo list, etc. - an NMU of the packages with an Uploaders field in the control file (see the thread about multiple maintainers per package on this list) - setting up a CVS archive somewhere If I interpret all the responses correctly there're four people on the task force. I propose we all go over the bug list and make an inventory in terms of difficulty to solve. That should give us a better idea of the status and how much we can do before the freeze. I'm keen to help (and have been slowly working on a second NMU of Apache to fix some of the current bugs), but I'd really like to see something from Johnnie saying this was ok. It's not exactly polite to hijack someones package with no input from them. A strike force is different than just doing the odd NMU IMO. J. -- /\ | Incest is best. | | http://www.blackcatnetworks.co.uk/ | \/
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
On Fri, Sep 14, 2001 at 11:32:27AM +0300, Ari Makela wrote: If you need to start it with -X, just do it by hand. That's what I do when I'm hacking on mod_dtcl. I'm not really sure that modes of operation belong in init.d scripts... Possibly, that's just a question of policy. However, I do feel that having it in the init script would help novices. However, checking the configuration before stopping Apache is crucial. Yes, so long as you can bring it down knowing that it wont start up again, if you need to. For example, you can do the following for start, stop, and restart: if [ /usr/bin/apachectl configtest ]; then if [ /usr/bin/apachectl start ]; then echo started. else echo failed to start. fi else echo The configuration is not valid. Please repair. fi I can't get to it at the moment, but I have flushed out an init script like this, and its reasuring to see Configuration OK (from configtest) when it starts up. But you *must* have a force-stop or similar; don't withhold people from being able to shut down if they really must, but make sure they know its going to take some work to start up again. Yours, James -- James Bromberger james_AT_rcpt.to www.james.rcpt.to Remainder moved to http://www.james.rcpt.to/james/sig.html pgpE3X51G2Z81.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Martin F Krafft ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Thu, 13 Sep 2001 10:33:39PM -0500): - filing a request for the mailing list i'll set one up. filing against lists.debian.org takes too long. Please do. Something like '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' or so? I'm still gonna file against lists.debian.org. Once that is created we can move over. Do you also support archiving? That would be really great. - putting together a web page similar to that of the X Strike Force with a link to the packages and their bug lists, a todo list, etc. i can host. Great. Can you give all involved access? - setting up a CVS archive somewhere ditto. Great. I'm sitting behind an analog line of 24k or so and I'll probably keep my own local CVS archive but will of course keep in sync with the official one. Thanks for providing all this. :-) Regards, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Jonathan McDowell ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Thu, Sep 13, 2001 at 10:33:39PM -0500, Ardo van Rangelrooij wrote: Martin F Krafft ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Thu, 13 Sep 2001 08:42:44AM) I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). count me in. Excellent! There are a couple of things we can start with: - filing a request for the mailing list - putting together a web page similar to that of the X Strike Force with a link to the packages and their bug lists, a todo list, etc. - an NMU of the packages with an Uploaders field in the control file (see the thread about multiple maintainers per package on this list) - setting up a CVS archive somewhere If I interpret all the responses correctly there're four people on the task force. I propose we all go over the bug list and make an inventory in terms of difficulty to solve. That should give us a better idea of the status and how much we can do before the freeze. I'm keen to help (and have been slowly working on a second NMU of Apache to fix some of the current bugs), but I'd really like to see something from Johnnie saying this was ok. It's not exactly polite to hijack someones package with no input from them. A strike force is different than just doing the odd NMU IMO. I completely agree. I really would like Johnie to be involved in this. But sofar we've heard or read nothing from him. Nothing in response to the original problem statement and nothing in response to this proposal. How long should we wait? A week, a month, ...? His last message was from July 17 and he's not marked as being on vacation. Like I said in the proposal it's not the intention to simply take over. We're not going to remove his name as maintainer. For now I see this as an organized NMU action. The number of bugs is simply to large to have only a single person working on it. I really would like to get as much done as possible before the freeze. Thanks, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9
proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Hi, I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. The intend of this proposal is not to simply take over the packages (although it might come to that), but to help in the maintenance of them. As the first step I propose to add an Uploaders field to the package (once we have a list of people). Some of the other things this task force would do are - writing up guidelines for packaging Apache modules (a kind of policy doc) - migration to Apache 2 (IIRC an ITP for this has already been filed by somebody) I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. Thanks, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Sounds like a good idea. I would also be willing to help out if anything is needed from the ASF, although I'm not involved with the server project itself. -- David N. Welton Consulting: http://www.dedasys.com/ Free Software: http://people.debian.org/~davidw/ Apache Tcl: http://tcl.apache.org/ Personal: http://www.efn.org/~davidw/
Re: (forw) [ardo@debian.org: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force]
From: Ardo van Rangelrooij [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Johnie Ingram [EMAIL PROTECTED], debian-devel@lists.debian.org Subject: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force Hi, I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. The intend of this proposal is not to simply take over the packages (although it might come to that), but to help in the maintenance of them. Yes, the bug list is huge. I'm not subscribed to -devel, but this thread was mentioned on IRC and thus forwarded to me. As the first step I propose to add an Uploaders field to the package (once we have a list of people). Some of the other things this task force would do are - writing up guidelines for packaging Apache modules (a kind of policy doc) - migration to Apache 2 (IIRC an ITP for this has already been filed by somebody) What is 'not on a cold day in hell'? ;) Thom May ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) and myself are maintaining apache2. If you want to email anything related, [EMAIL PROTECTED] is the address; that goes to both of us. Currently it's not in Debian because Thom's laptop has blown up. He did very extensive hacking on said laptop (which was really cool), and it's back in the UK (irony, since he's a Pom backpacker here in .au) getting fixed. There were no backups or anything, so I'm just waiting from some stuff from Thom's tree. In the meantime, I've toyed with modperl-2.0 and php4 for apache2. I got a successful install of php4 after an apache2 install, but I need to do silly build and apache2 voodoo to get it integrated. I'm currently working on it, but I don't exactly have a lot of time. The current place for my packages is http://kabuki.sfarc.net/apache2/README. Note that this is strictly non-US due to modules/ssl and modules/tls in the apache2 source. These packages don't include mod_perl2 and php4; if you want you can grab them from CVS and attempt to build. I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. Feel free, but apache2 is nowhere near ready for prime-time. Hell, they haven't even agreed on a release that should be a beta candidate since 2.0.18, which was ... a long time ago. I'd give it probably more than a year before I even thought about letting it loose in production. I also got bored a while ago, and discovered that 2.0.24 builds cleanly (and works) on Progeny. :) d (CC all replies to me as I'm not on -devel). -- Daniel Stone[EMAIL PROTECTED] jem I got Linux for Christmas... but it don't work... I'm taking it back to the shops jem I got Debian from Dad, RedHat from Mum, and slackware from my brother... he's no brother of mine no more
Re: (forw) [ardo@debian.org: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force]
On Fri, Sep 14, 2001 at 12:36:37AM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: From: Ardo van Rangelrooij [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Johnie Ingram [EMAIL PROTECTED], debian-devel@lists.debian.org Subject: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force Hi, I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. The intend of this proposal is not to simply take over the packages (although it might come to that), but to help in the maintenance of them. Yes, the bug list is huge. I'm not subscribed to -devel, but this thread was mentioned on IRC and thus forwarded to me. As the first step I propose to add an Uploaders field to the package (once we have a list of people). Some of the other things this task force would do are - writing up guidelines for packaging Apache modules (a kind of policy doc) - migration to Apache 2 (IIRC an ITP for this has already been filed by somebody) What is 'not on a cold day in hell'? ;) And you react like this exactly why? Perhaps I should have said 'could' instead of 'would' and make the second item 'support in migrating to Apache2'. I certainly didn't want to imply that you and Thom would be out of business because of this. But I'm sure that we cannot drop Apache2 in place and assume everything keeps working fine without a hitch. I was merely thinking that this task force could participate in testing and porting stuff over. There's no need to feel threatened by this proposal. You're work is appreciated. Thom May ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) and myself are maintaining apache2. If you want to email anything related, [EMAIL PROTECTED] is the address; that goes to both of us. Currently it's not in Debian because Thom's laptop has blown up. He did very extensive hacking on said laptop (which was really cool), and it's back in the UK (irony, since he's a Pom backpacker here in .au) getting fixed. There were no backups or anything, so I'm just waiting from some stuff from Thom's tree. In the meantime, I've toyed with modperl-2.0 and php4 for apache2. I got a successful install of php4 after an apache2 install, but I need to do silly build and apache2 voodoo to get it integrated. I'm currently working on it, but I don't exactly have a lot of time. The current place for my packages is http://kabuki.sfarc.net/apache2/README. Note that this is strictly non-US due to modules/ssl and modules/tls in the apache2 source. These packages don't include mod_perl2 and php4; if you want you can grab them from CVS and attempt to build. I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. Feel free, but apache2 is nowhere near ready for prime-time. Hell, they haven't even agreed on a release that should be a beta candidate since 2.0.18, which was ... a long time ago. I'd give it probably more than a year before I even thought about letting it loose in production. I didn't expect the migration to happen overnight. But there are certainly a lot of gotchas when moving to Apache2 which need to be sorted out and resolved. If we have a year to do this, all the better given the time certain things might take. I also got bored a while ago, and discovered that 2.0.24 builds cleanly (and works) on Progeny. Cool! :) d (CC all replies to me as I'm not on -devel). Done. Thanks, Ardo
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
On Thu, 13 Sep 2001, Ardo van Rangelrooij wrote: I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. I agree. I can't remember the last time I did a apt-get install apache an I still had a running webserver. I would think this is mostly due to the maintainer having too much work on his hands and so not being able to finetune the upgrade process. Apache is a very popular package and so IMHO it would be good if it'd be in a perfect shape. *t Tomas Pospisek SourcePole - Linux Open Source Solutions http://sourcepole.ch Elestastrasse 18, 7310 Bad Ragaz, Switzerland Tel: +41 (81) 330 77 11
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Thu, 13 Sep 2001 08:42:44AM) I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). count me in. I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. i can give you one easily. applying at lists.debian.org takes ages! how about [EMAIL PROTECTED] :) martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- first snow, then silence. this thousand dollar screen dies so beautifully. pgpKIi2mmI5n5.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: (forw) [ardo@debian.org: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force]
On Thu, Sep 13, 2001 at 11:01:49AM -0500, Ardo_Vanrangelrooij wrote: On Fri, Sep 14, 2001 at 12:36:37AM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: From: Ardo van Rangelrooij [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Johnie Ingram [EMAIL PROTECTED], debian-devel@lists.debian.org Subject: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force Hi, I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. The intend of this proposal is not to simply take over the packages (although it might come to that), but to help in the maintenance of them. Yes, the bug list is huge. I'm not subscribed to -devel, but this thread was mentioned on IRC and thus forwarded to me. As the first step I propose to add an Uploaders field to the package (once we have a list of people). Some of the other things this task force would do are - writing up guidelines for packaging Apache modules (a kind of policy doc) - migration to Apache 2 (IIRC an ITP for this has already been filed by somebody) What is 'not on a cold day in hell'? ;) And you react like this exactly why? Perhaps I should have said 'could' instead of 'would' and make the second item 'support in migrating to Apache2'. I certainly didn't want to imply that you and Thom would be out of business because of this. But I'm sure that we cannot drop Apache2 in place and assume everything keeps working fine without a hitch. I was merely thinking that this task force could participate in testing and porting stuff over. There's no need to feel threatened by this proposal. You're work is appreciated. No, I don't feel at all threatened, it's just that apache2 is still in alpha and nowhere near ready to replace apache; not by a long shot. Thom May ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) and myself are maintaining apache2. If you want to email anything related, [EMAIL PROTECTED] is the address; that goes to both of us. Currently it's not in Debian because Thom's laptop has blown up. He did very extensive hacking on said laptop (which was really cool), and it's back in the UK (irony, since he's a Pom backpacker here in .au) getting fixed. There were no backups or anything, so I'm just waiting from some stuff from Thom's tree. In the meantime, I've toyed with modperl-2.0 and php4 for apache2. I got a successful install of php4 after an apache2 install, but I need to do silly build and apache2 voodoo to get it integrated. I'm currently working on it, but I don't exactly have a lot of time. The current place for my packages is http://kabuki.sfarc.net/apache2/README. Note that this is strictly non-US due to modules/ssl and modules/tls in the apache2 source. These packages don't include mod_perl2 and php4; if you want you can grab them from CVS and attempt to build. I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. Feel free, but apache2 is nowhere near ready for prime-time. Hell, they haven't even agreed on a release that should be a beta candidate since 2.0.18, which was ... a long time ago. I'd give it probably more than a year before I even thought about letting it loose in production. I didn't expect the migration to happen overnight. But there are certainly a lot of gotchas when moving to Apache2 which need to be sorted out and resolved. If we have a year to do this, all the better given the time certain things might take. I think that we need to maintain them separately for quite some time; even when apache2 *does* replace apache, we should still have an apache1 package. I also got bored a while ago, and discovered that 2.0.24 builds cleanly (and works) on Progeny. Cool! :) d (CC all replies to me as I'm not on -devel). Done. Thanks :) -d -- Daniel Stone[EMAIL PROTECTED] jem I got Linux for Christmas... but it don't work... I'm taking it back to the shops jem I got Debian from Dad, RedHat from Mum, and slackware from my brother... he's no brother of mine no more
Re: (forw) [ardo@debian.org: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force]
Daniel Stone ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Thu, Sep 13, 2001 at 11:01:49AM -0500, Ardo_Vanrangelrooij wrote: On Fri, Sep 14, 2001 at 12:36:37AM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: From: Ardo van Rangelrooij [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Johnie Ingram [EMAIL PROTECTED], debian-devel@lists.debian.org Subject: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force Hi, I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. The intend of this proposal is not to simply take over the packages (although it might come to that), but to help in the maintenance of them. Yes, the bug list is huge. I'm not subscribed to -devel, but this thread was mentioned on IRC and thus forwarded to me. As the first step I propose to add an Uploaders field to the package (once we have a list of people). Some of the other things this task force would do are - writing up guidelines for packaging Apache modules (a kind of policy doc) - migration to Apache 2 (IIRC an ITP for this has already been filed by somebody) What is 'not on a cold day in hell'? ;) And you react like this exactly why? Perhaps I should have said 'could' instead of 'would' and make the second item 'support in migrating to Apache2'. I certainly didn't want to imply that you and Thom would be out of business because of this. But I'm sure that we cannot drop Apache2 in place and assume everything keeps working fine without a hitch. I was merely thinking that this task force could participate in testing and porting stuff over. There's no need to feel threatened by this proposal. You're work is appreciated. No, I don't feel at all threatened, it's just that apache2 is still in alpha and nowhere near ready to replace apache; not by a long shot. I see. All the more reason to get the current version in a better shape as it will be around for quite a while. Thom May ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) and myself are maintaining apache2. If you want to email anything related, [EMAIL PROTECTED] is the address; that goes to both of us. Currently it's not in Debian because Thom's laptop has blown up. He did very extensive hacking on said laptop (which was really cool), and it's back in the UK (irony, since he's a Pom backpacker here in .au) getting fixed. There were no backups or anything, so I'm just waiting from some stuff from Thom's tree. In the meantime, I've toyed with modperl-2.0 and php4 for apache2. I got a successful install of php4 after an apache2 install, but I need to do silly build and apache2 voodoo to get it integrated. I'm currently working on it, but I don't exactly have a lot of time. The current place for my packages is http://kabuki.sfarc.net/apache2/README. Note that this is strictly non-US due to modules/ssl and modules/tls in the apache2 source. These packages don't include mod_perl2 and php4; if you want you can grab them from CVS and attempt to build. I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. Feel free, but apache2 is nowhere near ready for prime-time. Hell, they haven't even agreed on a release that should be a beta candidate since 2.0.18, which was ... a long time ago. I'd give it probably more than a year before I even thought about letting it loose in production. I didn't expect the migration to happen overnight. But there are certainly a lot of gotchas when moving to Apache2 which need to be sorted out and resolved. If we have a year to do this, all the better given the time certain things might take. I think that we need to maintain them separately for quite some time; even when apache2 *does* replace apache, we should still have an apache1 package. Absolutely. I haven't looked at Apache2 at all yet, but I can imagine that the APIs have changed too, so every package build against Apache1 will have to have a separate binary build against Apache2. But I see the task force as a means to facilitate all this with guidelines for building and packaging, and testing, etc. to make the transition as smooth as possible. Thanks, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
David N. Welton ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: Sounds like a good idea. I would also be willing to help out if anything is needed from the ASF, although I'm not involved with the server project itself. Ok, thanks. Regards, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
T.Pospisek's MailLists ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: On Thu, 13 Sep 2001, Ardo van Rangelrooij wrote: I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). The current state of Apache and the recent need to fix at least some of the outstanding bugs led me to the conclusion a more active maintenance of these packages is needed. I agree. I can't remember the last time I did a apt-get install apache an I still had a running webserver. I would think this is mostly due to the maintainer having too much work on his hands and so not being able to finetune the upgrade process. Apache is a very popular package and so IMHO it would be good if it'd be in a perfect shape. So I can count you in as a volunteer? Thanks, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9
Re: proposal for an Apache (web server) task force
Martin F Krafft ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: also sprach Ardo van Rangelrooij (on Thu, 13 Sep 2001 08:42:44AM) I would like to propose to form an Apache (web server) task force to maintain the Apache packages currently maintained by Johnie Ingram (netgod) (and potentially related packages if the need arises). count me in. Excellent! There are a couple of things we can start with: - filing a request for the mailing list - putting together a web page similar to that of the X Strike Force with a link to the packages and their bug lists, a todo list, etc. - an NMU of the packages with an Uploaders field in the control file (see the thread about multiple maintainers per package on this list) - setting up a CVS archive somewhere If I interpret all the responses correctly there're four people on the task force. I propose we all go over the bug list and make an inventory in terms of difficulty to solve. That should give us a better idea of the status and how much we can do before the freeze. I also propose to set up a mailing list for this. i can give you one easily. applying at lists.debian.org takes ages! how about [EMAIL PROTECTED] :) martin; (greetings from the heart of the sun.) \ echo mailto: !#^.*|tr * mailto:; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Well, I would prefer a debian mailing list since it's rather debian related but thanks anyway for the offer. Until the list is created we can use debian-devel I guess. Thanks, Ardo -- Ardo van Rangelrooij home email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] home page: http://people.debian.org/~ardo PGP fp: 3B 1F 21 72 00 5C 3A 73 7F 72 DF D9 90 78 47 F9
