date:20140626

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: "Ondřej Surý" 

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256

* Package name: dnssec-root-key
  Version : 20100715
  Upstream Author : ICANN/IANA
* URL : http://data.iana.org/root-anchors/
* License : Public Data (same as with root.zone)
  Programming Lang: None
  Description : This package contains DNSSEC root key

This package contains DNSSEC root key in all available
formats that all packages doing DNSSEC validation can
use as a common data source.
.
unbound-anchor is used to keep the root.key up-to-date
via RFC5011 mechanism.

- --

PERSONAL NOTE: I now maintain at least two packages that
need DNSSEC root.key (hash-slinger and getdns[1]).  There
are at least bind9, unbound and dnsmasq that can use this
as well.


1. Waiting for next upstream release with proper libtool
flags.
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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

Simon McVittie dixit quod...
>On 25/06/14 15:43, Svante Signell wrote:
>> Regarding mate desktop policykit-1 build-depends on libsystemd-login-dev
>> only for linux-any. What functionality is missing for other
>> architectures?
[...]
>In Debian 7, PolicyKit could answer the question "is Svante logged-in
>locally?" by asking ConsoleKit. ConsoleKit is no longer maintained

Can we have alternative dependencies that do not need to get
answers to these questions? This worked before *kit were even
invented, and this works on other OSes too.

Thanks,
//mirabilos


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Bug#752753: ITP: python-ldappool -- connection pool for python-ldap

2014-06-26 Thread Thomas Goirand

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Thomas Goirand 

* Package name: python-ldappool
  Version : 1.0
  Upstream Author : Mozilla Services 
* URL : https://github.com/mozilla-services/ldappool
* License : MPL-GPL2-LGPL2.1
  Programming Lang: Python
  Description : connection pool for python-ldap

 A simple connector pool for python-ldap. The pool keeps LDAP connectors alive
 and let you reuse them, drastically reducing the time spent to initiate a ldap
 connection.
 .
 The pool has useful features like:
  * transparent reconnection on failures or server restarts
  * configurable pool size and connectors timeouts
  * configurable max lifetime for connectors
  * a context manager to simplify acquiring and releasing a connector


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

Russ Allbery dixit quod...
>Simon McVittie  writes:
[ startx ]
>> a virtual console, a locked X screensaver is worthless, because someone
>> can just switch virtual console with Ctrl+Alt+Fn, press Ctrl+C and
>> they're in your shell session.
>
>This doesn't change anything else that you point out, but that's why you
>run startx & and then log out of the virtual console.

That, or "exec startx". (Is there any benefit of one vs. the other?)

For the record, I would be happy with a supported setup without systemd
that relied on using startx, and putting people into the "desktop" unix
groups manually.

Do note that, for upgrade scenarios, running jessie with sysvinit MUST
be supported anyway. (But I would prefer that we can do this even for
fresh installations and sid.)

bye,
//mirabilos

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Josselin Mouette

Le jeudi 26 juin 2014 à 08:31 +, Thorsten Glaser a écrit : 
> Can we have alternative dependencies that do not need to get
> answers to these questions? This worked before *kit were even
> invented, and this works on other OSes too.

No, it didn’t work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
shutting down the computer.

Other OSes (I assume you are talking about other desktop OSes such as
Android, Windows and MacOSX) have mechanisms similar to PolicyKit.

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Russ Allbery

Thorsten Glaser  writes:

> For the record, I would be happy with a supported setup without systemd
> that relied on using startx, and putting people into the "desktop" unix
> groups manually.

I don't think startx and fvwm are going anywhere, so, um, enjoy?  :)  fvwm
doesn't depend on anything systemd-related.

If you mean that you want this *with GNOME*, well, you're going to have to
talk to GNOME upstream, or MATE upstream, or start or join a development
group to maintain the necessary pieces.  Alas, they're not going to
magically appear because you've indicated that you would be happy with
them.

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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Andrew Shadura

On 26 June 2014 01:36, Marco d'Itri  wrote:
>> I used the word "Insidious" as I would have use "Stealth", because it's
>> happening slowly, without us noticing, that everything in Debian is
>> being locked with systemd. Soon, we'll have no choice.
> This is why you should stop fighting: systemd has won.

> http://qa.debian.org/popcon-graph.php?packages=systemd-sysv+upstart+openrc&show_installed=on&want_legend=on&want_ticks=on&from_date=2014-01-01&to_date=&hlght_date=&date_fmt=%25Y-%25m&beenhere=1

http://qa.debian.org/popcon-graph.php?packages=systemd-sysv+sysvinit&show_installed=on&want_legend=on&want_ticks=on&from_date=2014-01-01&to_date=&hlght_date=&date_fmt=%Y-%m&beenhere=1

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  Andrew


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

>No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
>shutting down the computer.

Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:

-r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*

I never understood why Debian doesn't.

bye,
//mirabilos


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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Matthias Urlichs

Hi,

Andrew Shadura:
> http://qa.debian.org/popcon-graph.php?packages=systemd-sysv+sysvinit&show_installed=on&want_legend=on&want_ticks=on&from_date=2014-01-01&to_date=&hlght_date=&date_fmt=%Y-%m&beenhere=1
> 
Sorry, but this only demonstrates that you don't know what you're talking about.

For a comparison that's even remotely meaningful you want sysvinit-core,
not sysvinit.

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Ansgar Burchardt

On 06/26/2014 11:34, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
>> No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
>> shutting down the computer.
> 
> Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:
> 
> -r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*
> 
> I never understood why Debian doesn't.

Google says the operator group also has (read) access to raw disk devices.

Those are totally unrelated: I want to allow local users to shut down
their computer when they go home or their laptop when it is no longer
needed, but without having to hand out read permissions for raw disk
devices.

The *BSD permission model only makes sense to me for central systems
never shut down or single user installations, but not for multi-user
desktop systems.

Ansgar

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:59 +0200, Ansgar Burchardt wrote:
> On 06/26/2014 11:34, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
> >> No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
> >> shutting down the computer.
> > 
> > Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:
> > 
> > -r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*
> > 
> > I never understood why Debian doesn't.
> 
> Google says the operator group also has (read) access to raw disk devices.

What about creating a unique group then, e.g. calling it it shutdown?


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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Wookey

+++ Svante Signell [2014-06-24 19:57 +0200]:
> 
> I strongly recommend the systemd-must-die package to prevent systemd
> components being installed when dist-upgrading without the user being
> aware.

Where is this package? I'm not finding it in testing or the pts?

Wookey
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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Josselin Mouette

Le jeudi 26 juin 2014 à 09:34 +, Thorsten Glaser a écrit : 
> >No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
> >shutting down the computer.
> 
> Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:
> 
> -r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*
> 
> I never understood why Debian doesn't.

You are entitled to the opinion that setuid is a good security design.

Thankfully, most of the Linux community disagrees with you.

-- 
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: :' :
`. `'
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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:20 +0100, Wookey wrote:
> +++ Svante Signell [2014-06-24 19:57 +0200]:
> > 
> > I strongly recommend the systemd-must-die package to prevent systemd
> > components being installed when dist-upgrading without the user being
> > aware.
> 
> Where is this package? I'm not finding it in testing or the pts?

Not in any official Debian repo unfortunately:

http://users.unixforge.de/~tglaser/debs/dists/etch/wtf/Pkgs/mirabilos-support/




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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Wookey

+++ Matthias Urlichs [2014-06-26 11:58 +0200]:
> Hi,
> 
> Andrew Shadura:
> > http://qa.debian.org/popcon-graph.php?packages=systemd-sysv+sysvinit&show_installed=on&want_legend=on&want_ticks=on&from_date=2014-01-01&to_date=&hlght_date=&date_fmt=%Y-%m&beenhere=1
> > 
> Sorry, but this only demonstrates that you don't know what you're talking 
> about.
> 
> For a comparison that's even remotely meaningful you want sysvinit-core,
> not sysvinit.

http://qa.debian.org/popcon-graph.php?packages=systemd-sysv+sysvinit-core&show_installed=on&want_legend=on&want_ti%20+cks=on&from_date=2014-01-01&to_date=&hlght_date=&date_fmt=%Y-%m&beenhere=1

Which shows about a change from 'peak sysvinit-core' in mid-april:

  Mid april  Now
sysvinit-core:89% 81%
systemd-sysv: 6%  19%

Which seems plausible.

Wookey
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Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

Hi everyone,

I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
some more background on the bugs filled.

I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.

We have several options to do here:

1. Ask upstream to re-license the software to different free license
- BSD or MIT/Expat is the closest one.

2. Show that the software in question does come from "PHP Group",
f.e. software based on src:php5 sources. Most notable example is
src:php-json which is copy of ext/json/ adapted to libjson-c-dev
instead of the included JSON-IS-EVIL library.

3. We remove the source packages from Debian.

One more note: PHP is *not* compatible with GPL[1]. If you have
sources that combine PHP-licensed source with GPL-licenced
source the result is not distributable. That includes linking GPL
library to PHP licenced source (e.g. libreadline as most notable
example of GPL library).

While doing the copyright research I have found two such examples
and Ansgar was that kind that he filled: #752625 and #752627

Full list of bugs filled under this:
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?users=ondrej%40debian.org&tag=php-license-3.01

If you feel to dispute this please take your *well-formed* and
*well-thought*
arguments to debian-legal.

Ondrej
[1]
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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:45 +0100, Wookey wrote:
> +++ Matthias Urlichs [2014-06-26 11:58 +0200]:
> > Hi,

> Which shows about a change from 'peak sysvinit-core' in mid-april:
> 
>   Mid april  Now
> sysvinit-core:89% 81%
> systemd-sysv: 6%  19%

A question: If you uninstall a package is that reflected in the popcon
graphs too?



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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Dimitri John Ledkov

On 26 June 2014 12:00, Ondřej Surý  wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
> some more background on the bugs filled.
>
> I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
>

Can ftp-masters or you summarise the logic argumentation behind the
above conclusion?

> We have several options to do here:
>
> 1. Ask upstream to re-license the software to different free license
> - BSD or MIT/Expat is the closest one.
>
> 2. Show that the software in question does come from "PHP Group",
> f.e. software based on src:php5 sources. Most notable example is
> src:php-json which is copy of ext/json/ adapted to libjson-c-dev
> instead of the included JSON-IS-EVIL library.
>
> 3. We remove the source packages from Debian.
>
> One more note: PHP is *not* compatible with GPL[1]. If you have
> sources that combine PHP-licensed source with GPL-licenced
> source the result is not distributable. That includes linking GPL
> library to PHP licenced source (e.g. libreadline as most notable
> example of GPL library).
>
> While doing the copyright research I have found two such examples
> and Ansgar was that kind that he filled: #752625 and #752627
>
> Full list of bugs filled under this:
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?users=ondrej%40debian.org&tag=php-license-3.01
>
> If you feel to dispute this please take your *well-formed* and
> *well-thought*
> arguments to debian-legal.
>

Why debian-legal, and not here / with you & ftp-masters ?

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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable



On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:09, Dimitri John Ledkov wrote:
> On 26 June 2014 12:00, Ondřej Surý  wrote:
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
> > some more background on the bugs filled.
> >
> > I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> > and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> > suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> > that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
> >
> 
> Can ftp-masters or you summarise the logic argumentation behind the
> above conclusion?

https://ftp-master.debian.org/REJECT-FAQ.html

You have a PHP add-on package (any php script/"app"/thing, not PHP
itself) and it's licensed only under the standard PHP license. That
license, up to the 3.x which is actually out, is not really usable for
anything else than PHP itself. I've mailed our -legal list about that
and got only one response, which basically supported my view on this.
Basically this license talks only about PHP, the PHP Group, and includes
Zend Engine, so its not applicable to anything else. And even worse,
older versions include the nice ad-clause.

One good solution here is to suggest a license change to your upstream,
as they clearly wanted a free one. LGPL or BSD seems to be what they
want.

And https://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2005/08/msg00128.html

I tried to raise the same argument again:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2014/06/msg0.html

> > We have several options to do here:
> >
> > 1. Ask upstream to re-license the software to different free license
> > - BSD or MIT/Expat is the closest one.
> >
> > 2. Show that the software in question does come from "PHP Group",
> > f.e. software based on src:php5 sources. Most notable example is
> > src:php-json which is copy of ext/json/ adapted to libjson-c-dev
> > instead of the included JSON-IS-EVIL library.
> >
> > 3. We remove the source packages from Debian.
> >
> > One more note: PHP is *not* compatible with GPL[1]. If you have
> > sources that combine PHP-licensed source with GPL-licenced
> > source the result is not distributable. That includes linking GPL
> > library to PHP licenced source (e.g. libreadline as most notable
> > example of GPL library).
> >
> > While doing the copyright research I have found two such examples
> > and Ansgar was that kind that he filled: #752625 and #752627
> >
> > Full list of bugs filled under this:
> > https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?users=ondrej%40debian.org&tag=php-license-3.01
> >
> > If you feel to dispute this please take your *well-formed* and
> > *well-thought*
> > arguments to debian-legal.
> >
> 
> Why debian-legal, and not here / with you & ftp-masters ?

The initial conclusion came from debian-legal, and I think it's
futile to discuss that with ftp-masters when I already done that.
And as you can see in the initial conversation in the bug report
I was against the removal, but in the end they have convinced
me that licensing anything not-being-PHP under PHP License
is just no-goer.

O.
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Re: Bug#752614: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Mike Gabriel


Hi Ondřej,

On  Do 26 Jun 2014 13:00:12 CEST, Ondřej Surý wrote:


I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.


Can you provide some evidence why you think this applies to smarty3?

Smarty3 is licensed under LGPL-2.1+ so I am hesitant to belief that  
this bug actually affects Smarty3.


Please enlighten me!
Mike
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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:36, Faidon Liambotis wrote:
> On 06/26/14 14:00, Ondřej Surý wrote:
> > I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
> > some more background on the bugs filled.
> >
> > I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> > and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> > suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> > that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
> 
> Could you elaborate on the reasoning of that? Neither your email to 
> -devel nor the one to -legal[1] explains why you think so and whatever 
> it is, I think it's far from obvious. I think an outcome that results in 
> a mass (RC) bug filing needs to be better documented than that -- and 
> btw, you're supposed to mail debian-devel *before* you do so, not after; 
> cf. developer's reference 7.1.1.

Don't shoot the messenger, I just did the dirty work.

I have discussed this with ftp-masters and release team before
filling the bugs, arguing heavily in disagreement with ftp-master's
REJECT FAQ - the PHP License REJECT is there since 2005.

Ondrej
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Re: Bug#752614: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:56, Ondřej Surý wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:52, Mike Gabriel wrote:
> > Hi Ondřej,
> > 
> > On  Do 26 Jun 2014 13:00:12 CEST, Ondřej Surý wrote:
> > 
> > > I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> > > and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> > > suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> > > that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
> > 
> > Can you provide some evidence why you think this applies to smarty3?
> > 
> > Smarty3 is licensed under LGPL-2.1+ so I am hesitant to belief that  
> > this bug actually affects Smarty3.
> 
> Files: development/lexer/LexerGenerator/Lexer.php
> Copyright:
>  2006, Gregory Beaver
> License: PHP License 3.01, http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt
>  This source file is subject to version 3.01 of the PHP license
>  that is available through the world-wide-web at the following URI:
>  http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt. If you did not receive a copy of
>  the PHP License and are unable to obtain it through the web, please
>  send a note to lice...@php.net so we can mail you a copy immediately.
> 
> Files: development/lexer/Exception.php
> Copyright:
>  2006, Gregory Beaver
> License: PHP License 3.0, http://www.php.net/license/3_0.txt
>  This source file is subject to version 3.0 of the PHP license
>  that is available through the world-wide-web at the following URI:
>  http://www.php.net/license/3_0.txt. If you did not receive a copy of
>  the PHP License and are unable to obtain it through the web, please
>  send a note to lice...@php.net so we can mail you a copy immediately.
> 
> And two more undocumented:

./development/lexer/ParserGenerator/State.php: * @license   
http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt  PHP License 3.01
./development/lexer/ParserGenerator/Parser.php: * @license   
http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt  PHP License 3.01

Cheers,
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Re: Bug#752614: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:52, Mike Gabriel wrote:
> Hi Ondřej,
> 
> On  Do 26 Jun 2014 13:00:12 CEST, Ondřej Surý wrote:
> 
> > I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> > and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> > suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> > that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
> 
> Can you provide some evidence why you think this applies to smarty3?
> 
> Smarty3 is licensed under LGPL-2.1+ so I am hesitant to belief that  
> this bug actually affects Smarty3.

Files: development/lexer/LexerGenerator/Lexer.php
Copyright:
 2006, Gregory Beaver
License: PHP License 3.01, http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt
 This source file is subject to version 3.01 of the PHP license
 that is available through the world-wide-web at the following URI:
 http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt. If you did not receive a copy of
 the PHP License and are unable to obtain it through the web, please
 send a note to lice...@php.net so we can mail you a copy immediately.

Files: development/lexer/Exception.php
Copyright:
 2006, Gregory Beaver
License: PHP License 3.0, http://www.php.net/license/3_0.txt
 This source file is subject to version 3.0 of the PHP license
 that is available through the world-wide-web at the following URI:
 http://www.php.net/license/3_0.txt. If you did not receive a copy of
 the PHP License and are unable to obtain it through the web, please
 send a note to lice...@php.net so we can mail you a copy immediately.

And two more undocumented:

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Bug#752764: ITP: python-django-pyscss -- makes it easier to use PySCSS in Django

2014-06-26 Thread Thomas Goirand

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Thomas Goirand 

* Package name: python-django-pyscss
  Version : 1.0.0
  Upstream Author : Fusionbox, Inc. 
* URL : https://github.com/fusionbox/django-pyscss
* License : BSD-2-clause
  Programming Lang: Python
  Description : makes it easier to use PySCSS in Django

 Django-pyscss is a collection of tools for making it easier to use pyScss
 within Django. It overwrites the import system to use Django's staticfiles
 app. This way you can import SCSS files from any app (or any file that's
 findable by the STATICFILES_FINDERS) with no hassle. It provides a
 django-compressor precompile filter class so that you can easily use pyScss
 with django-compressor without having to bust out to the shell. This has the
 added benefit of removing the need to configure pyScss through its
 command-line arguments AND makes it possible for the exceptions and warnings
 that pyScss emits to bubble up to your process so that you can actually know
 what's going on.


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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Faidon Liambotis


On 06/26/14 14:00, Ondřej Surý wrote:

I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
some more background on the bugs filled.

I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.


Could you elaborate on the reasoning of that? Neither your email to 
-devel nor the one to -legal[1] explains why you think so and whatever 
it is, I think it's far from obvious. I think an outcome that results in 
a mass (RC) bug filing needs to be better documented than that -- and 
btw, you're supposed to mail debian-devel *before* you do so, not after; 
cf. developer's reference 7.1.1.


Besides the importance of the bug filing itself and removing half of PHP 
from Debian (including packages such as php-memcached!), I have another 
point to make: as you're well aware, we're in the progress of packaging 
Facebook's HHVM, which is a new runtime engine for PHP that is gaining 
some popularity[2].


HHVM is heavily based on PHP and both the parts that are forked from PHP 
and the parts that were originally written by Facebook (e.g. the VM 
engine) are licensed either under the PHP 3.01 or the Zend 2.00 licenses.


Facebook's lawyers clearly think it's okay, and I do too, FWIW. They do 
avoid direct and indirect GPL dependencies of course, but I frankly 
can't see why the PHP license here would be problematic.


Regards,
Faidon

1: <1401193085.24090.121958581.5b64c...@webmail.messagingengine.com>
2: We intend of switching Wikimedia's infrastructure to HHVM in the 
upcoming quarter, for instance.



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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Jean-Christophe Dubacq

[ ⏰ 26/06/2014 12:05 ] [ ✎ Svante Signell ]
> On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:59 +0200, Ansgar Burchardt wrote:
>> On 06/26/2014 11:34, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
 No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
 shutting down the computer.
>>>
>>> Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:
>>>
>>> -r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*
>>>
>>> I never understood why Debian doesn't.
>>
>> Google says the operator group also has (read) access to raw disk devices.
> 
> What about creating a unique group then, e.g. calling it it shutdown?

So that students can do eg ssh mybuddymachine /sbin/shutdown ?

(and they need to be able to shutdown their own machine, power is not free).

This is simply a long-standing bug in Linux that you got used to (or got
used to its workarounds), but as a solution now exists, the status quo
is threatened.

Sincerely,
-- 
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Re: Bug#752532: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Sergey B Kirpichev

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 01:00:12PM +0200, Ondřej Surý wrote:
> 3. We remove the source packages from Debian.

Can you kindly explain why?  Is the PHP license is non-free?  If so,
why?  If not - let's lower the bugs severity.

I see only *one* reply from debian-legal here:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2005/08/threads.html#00128

And this reply is not strictly suggests to do such (insane) thing.

-->8--
> So, looking at such packages in NEW - what do you guys suggest to do?
> *I* tend to go and kick them out.

I would probably let it pass
-->8--

Most authors will ignore such artifical license "issues", coming
from the Debian, especially as this is not a problem for other distributions.

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Re: Bug#752614: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Mike Gabriel

Hi Ondřej

On  Do 26 Jun 2014 13:56:34 CEST, Ondřej Surý wrote:

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:56, Ondřej Surý wrote:

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:52, Mike Gabriel wrote:
> Hi Ondřej,
>
> On  Do 26 Jun 2014 13:00:12 CEST, Ondřej Surý wrote:
>
> > I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> > and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> > suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> > that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
>
> Can you provide some evidence why you think this applies to smarty3?
>
> Smarty3 is licensed under LGPL-2.1+ so I am hesitant to belief that
> this bug actually affects Smarty3.

Files: development/lexer/LexerGenerator/Lexer.php
Copyright:
 2006, Gregory Beaver
License: PHP License 3.01, http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt
 This source file is subject to version 3.01 of the PHP license
 that is available through the world-wide-web at the following URI:
 http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt. If you did not receive a copy of
 the PHP License and are unable to obtain it through the web, please
 send a note to lice...@php.net so we can mail you a copy immediately.

Files: development/lexer/Exception.php
Copyright:
 2006, Gregory Beaver
License: PHP License 3.0, http://www.php.net/license/3_0.txt
 This source file is subject to version 3.0 of the PHP license
 that is available through the world-wide-web at the following URI:
 http://www.php.net/license/3_0.txt. If you did not receive a copy of
 the PHP License and are unable to obtain it through the web, please
 send a note to lice...@php.net so we can mail you a copy immediately.

And two more undocumented:

./development/lexer/ParserGenerator/State.php: * @license
http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt  PHP License 3.01
./development/lexer/ParserGenerator/Parser.php: * @license
http://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt  PHP License 3.01

Cheers,

Ah dang... my Git working copy was on the "squeeze" branch...

I get what you are up to...

Actually, I guess you have spotted three embedded libraries, as well.  
Will take a look at that next week.

light+love
Mike
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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Neil Williams

On Thu, 26 Jun 2014 13:02:15 +0200
Svante Signell  wrote:

> On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:45 +0100, Wookey wrote:
> > +++ Matthias Urlichs [2014-06-26 11:58 +0200]:
> > > Hi,
> 
> > Which shows about a change from 'peak sysvinit-core' in mid-april:
> > 
> >   Mid april  Now
> > sysvinit-core:89% 81%
> > systemd-sysv: 6%  19%
> 
> A question: If you uninstall a package is that reflected in the popcon
> graphs too?

Yes, of course it is, if that system has popularity-contest enabled.

-- 


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=
http://www.linux.codehelp.co.uk/



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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Charles Plessy

Le Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 01:53:48PM +0200, Ondřej Surý a écrit :
> On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 13:36, Faidon Liambotis wrote:
> > On 06/26/14 14:00, Ondřej Surý wrote:
> > > I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
> > > some more background on the bugs filled.
> > >
> > > I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> > > and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> > > suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> > > that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
> > 
> > Could you elaborate on the reasoning of that? Neither your email to 
> > -devel nor the one to -legal[1] explains why you think so and whatever 
> > it is, I think it's far from obvious. I think an outcome that results in 
> > a mass (RC) bug filing needs to be better documented than that -- and 
> > btw, you're supposed to mail debian-devel *before* you do so, not after; 
> > cf. developer's reference 7.1.1.
> 
> Don't shoot the messenger, I just did the dirty work.
> 
> I have discussed this with ftp-masters and release team before
> filling the bugs, arguing heavily in disagreement with ftp-master's
> REJECT FAQ - the PHP License REJECT is there since 2005.

Hi Ondrej,

sorry for not having answered your email on debian-legal despite agreeing with
your point of view.  Given my long history of fighting with the FTP team, I was
worried that my opinion would count peanuts or even have the opposite effect as
intended.

This said, while the PHP license is definitely a poor choice for software that
is not produced by the PHP group, I do not see how it can make the software
unredistributable.

If your disagreement with the FTP team is unresolvable, and if you have time,
maybe you can try to open a ticket for a resolution by the Technical Comittee ?

Have a nice day,

-- 
Charles Plessy
Tsurumi, Kanagawa, Japan


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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

Hi Charles,

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 14:27, Charles Plessy wrote:

> If your disagreement with the FTP team is unresolvable, and if you have
> time, maybe you can try to open a ticket for a resolution by the Technical
> Comittee ?

I don't think that falls under tech-ctte jurisdiction under Chapter 8.1
of
Debian Constitution. Ccing Debian Secretary...

I guess such overruling would need a GR.

Ondrej
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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 14:03 +0200, Jean-Christophe Dubacq wrote:
> [ ⏰ 26/06/2014 12:05 ] [ ✎ Svante Signell ]
> > On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:59 +0200, Ansgar Burchardt wrote:
> >> On 06/26/2014 11:34, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
>  No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
>  shutting down the computer.
> >>>
> >>> Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:
> >>>
> >>> -r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*
> >>>
> >>> I never understood why Debian doesn't.
> >>
> >> Google says the operator group also has (read) access to raw disk devices.
> > 
> > What about creating a unique group then, e.g. calling it it shutdown?
> 
> So that students can do eg ssh mybuddymachine /sbin/shutdown ?

Of course with the additional check that the students are logged in to
that box locally, did I forget to mention that?

Another point is of course is that if you are locally connected to
your/somebody else's computer nothing is hindering you from pushing the
on/off button or pull the plug (except physically). Is shutting off a
computer really a problem, normally multi-available ones are always on?


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Simon McVittie

On 26/06/14 13:33, Svante Signell wrote:
> Of course with the additional check that the students are logged in to
> that box locally, did I forget to mention that?

Apparently yes. So you'll still need some solution to "is this user
local?" - either an implementation of the systemd-logind API (preferred,
at this point, if you want anything you didn't write to talk to it), an
implementation of the ConsoleKit API, something else that uses a PAM
module as its basis for tracking who is logged in locally/remotely, or
something involving utmp/wtmp/other traditions.

utmp(5) says "many system programs (foolishly) depend on its integrity"
so be very careful with security implications if you go that way. I
wouldn't want anything relying on utmp for its security on my systems.

> Another point is of course is that if you are locally connected to
> your/somebody else's computer nothing is hindering you from pushing the
> on/off button or pull the plug (except physically). Is shutting off a
> computer really a problem, normally multi-available ones are always on?

That's valid, and is exactly the rationale for a recent systemd version
(post-wheezy, I think) changing its default policy to "locally-logged-in
users may power off even if there are other users logged in; non-local
users must authenticate as root-equivalent". Recent GNOME will give you
an "are you sure?" prompt if there are other users logged in, but no
more than that. Earlier systemd versions matched the previous behaviour
with ConsoleKit, which was "a local user may power off without
root-equivalent authentication, but only if they are the only one
logged-in".

The reason I say "its default policy" is that the reason PolicyKit has
that name is that apps only provide a *default* policy, and distributors
and sysadmins can override it with an alternative policy (more lenient,
more strict, group-based, time-based, whatever) if the default is
unacceptable for their environment. A "kiosk" or shared-computer-lab
installation might override logind's default policy with one requiring
root-equivalence to power off, for instance.

tl;dr: these frameworks were not invented just to troll you, they do
have a purpose :-)

S

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how do I treat an un-owned leftover directory?

2014-06-26 Thread Dennis van Dok

Hi,

my packages igtf-policy-bundle has piuparts errors[1].

I'm symlinking files to /etc/grid-security/certificates/ on
installation, and everything but the directories themselves are removed
on package removal.

I guess I could remove these directories if they are completely empty
after package removal, but I don't really own the directories. The use
of these directories is an established convention with grid computing
software.

I would appreciate your advice!

Best,

Dennis van Dok


1. https://piuparts.debian.org/sid/source/i/igtf-policy-bundle.html


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Re: how do I treat an un-owned leftover directory?

If you do create those directories in {pre,post}inst, you should
check if they are empty in {pre,post}rm and remove them
after unlinking the stuff you have linked in.

e.g. just cleanup after your package on purge

Ondrej

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014, at 14:45, Dennis van Dok wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> my packages igtf-policy-bundle has piuparts errors[1].
> 
> I'm symlinking files to /etc/grid-security/certificates/ on
> installation, and everything but the directories themselves are removed
> on package removal.
> 
> I guess I could remove these directories if they are completely empty
> after package removal, but I don't really own the directories. The use
> of these directories is an established convention with grid computing
> software.
> 
> I would appreciate your advice!
> 
> Best,
> 
> Dennis van Dok
> 
> 
> 1. https://piuparts.debian.org/sid/source/i/igtf-policy-bundle.html
> 
> 
> -- 
> D.H. van Dok :: System administrator :: www.nikhef.nl/grid ::
> Phone +31 20 592 22 28 :: http://www.nikhef.nl/~dennisvd/
> 
> 
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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

Wookey wrote:
>+++ Matthias Urlichs [2014-06-26 11:58 +0200]:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Andrew Shadura:
>> > [14]http://qa.debian.org/popcon-graph.php?packages=systemd-sysv+sysvinit&show_installed=on&want_legend=o
>n&want_ticks=on&from_date=2014-01-01&to_date=&hlght_date=&date_fmt=%Y-%m&beenhere=1
>> >
>> Sorry, but this only demonstrates that you don't know what you're talking 
>> about.
>>
>> For a comparison that's even remotely meaningful you want sysvinit-core,
>> not sysvinit.
>
>[15]http://qa.debian.org/popcon-graph.php?packages=systemd-sysv+sysvinit-core&show_installed=on&want_legend=
>on&want_ti%20+cks=on&from_date=2014-01-01&to_date=&hlght_date=&date_fmt=%Y-%m&beenhere=1
>
>Which shows about a change from 'peak sysvinit-core' in mid-april:
>
>  Mid april  Now
>sysvinit-core:89% 81%
>systemd-sysv: 6%  19%
>
>Which seems plausible.

Except that sysvinit-core was not in stable and older,
so youâd want to add those numbers.


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Bug#752771: ITP: r-cran-batchjobs -- GNU R batch computing

2014-06-26 Thread Andreas Tille

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Andreas Tille 

* Package name: r-cran-batchjobs
  Version : 1.2
  Upstream Author : Bernd Bischl 
* URL : http://cran.r-project.org/web/packages/BatchJobs/
* License : BSD
  Programming Lang: GNU R
  Description : GNU R batch computing
 This GNU R package Provides Map, Reduce and Filter variants to generate
 jobs on batch computing systems like PBS/Torque, LSF, SLURM and Sun Grid
 Engine.  Multicore and SSH systems are also supported. For further
 details see the project web page.


Remark: This is a precondition to upgrade other R packages.  The package
is maintained by the Debian Science team at

   svn://anonscm.debian.org/debian-med/trunk/packages/R/r-cran-batchjobs/trunk/


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

Svante Signell wrote:
>On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:59 +0200, Ansgar Burchardt wrote:
>> On 06/26/2014 11:34, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
>> >> No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
>> >> shutting down the computer.
>> >
>> > Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:
>> >
>> > -r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*
>> >
>> > I never understood why Debian doesn't.
>>
>> Google says the operator group also has (read) access to raw disk devices.

Yes well, this is a Unix thing. The operator is the person
operating the physical disc.

>What about creating a unique group then, e.g. calling it it shutdown?

That, and/or creating a user account called shutdown, which would
also remove the objection against the suid bit, which I find a bit
irritating because the objection is done absolutely blindly (this
is not a _security_ feature but a _workability_ feature). Or it
could be a sudoers entry. The possibilities are a lot.

bye,
//mirabilos

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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Wookey

+++ Svante Signell [2014-06-26 12:31 +0200]:
> On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:20 +0100, Wookey wrote:
> > +++ Svante Signell [2014-06-24 19:57 +0200]:
> > > 
> > > I strongly recommend the systemd-must-die package to prevent systemd
> > > components being installed when dist-upgrading without the user being
> > > aware.
> > 
> > Where is this package? I'm not finding it in testing or the pts?
> 
> Not in any official Debian repo unfortunately:
> 
> http://users.unixforge.de/~tglaser/debs/dists/etch/wtf/Pkgs/mirabilos-support/

Can it be uploaded please? As has been observed, there is a reasonable
number of people who would like an easy way to control explicitly
when/if they change to systemd for pid 1. Having to get it from a
separate repo should not be necessary.

Wookey
-- 
Principal hats:  Linaro, Emdebian, Wookware, Balloonboard, ARM
http://wookware.org/


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

Jean-Christophe Dubacq wrote:

>So that students can do eg ssh mybuddymachine /sbin/shutdown ?
>
>(and they need to be able to shutdown their own machine, power is not free).

Why do people always think that a proposal will automatically
exclude all others?

In your student scenario, you do *not* add them to the shutdown
group (or you show some trust into them). In your scenario, you
use all those *kit (or their successors) packages. You are what
those GNOME/systemd people target their new things at.

But neither you nor Svante/me are the *only* use cases. Rather,
both coexist. Just as I do not want to tell you to add all your
students to the shitdown group, which would be inappropriate, I
do not want to be told to use systemd, just to shut down a box.
Use the right tool for the job.

Again: variatio delectat, and I'm all for freedom of choice here.

bye,
//mirabilos

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

Simon McVittie wrote:
>tl;dr: these frameworks were not invented just to troll you, they do
>have a purpose :-)

Yes, I fully agree. But _please_ also realise that there are people,
a non-neglibile number of them, for whom these frameworks are not an
improvement, and who wish to be not forced to use them.

Thank you.

bye,
//mirabilos

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Ansgar Burchardt

Hi,

On 06/26/2014 14:33, Svante Signell wrote:
> On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 14:03 +0200, Jean-Christophe Dubacq wrote:
>> [ ⏰ 26/06/2014 12:05 ] [ ✎ Svante Signell ]
>>> On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 11:59 +0200, Ansgar Burchardt wrote:
 On 06/26/2014 11:34, Thorsten Glaser wrote:
>> No, it didn't work. You had to be root for operations as simple as
>> shutting down the computer.
>
> Only on Debian. OpenBSD and MirBSD have:
>
> -r-sr-x---  1 root  operator  122716 Sep 10  2013 /sbin/shutdown*
>
> I never understood why Debian doesn't.

 Google says the operator group also has (read) access to raw disk devices.
>>>
>>> What about creating a unique group then, e.g. calling it it shutdown?
>>
>> So that students can do eg ssh mybuddymachine /sbin/shutdown ?
> 
> Of course with the additional check that the students are logged in to
> that box locally, did I forget to mention that?

And for that you need to keep track of sessions via something like
systemd-logind, ConsoleKit, utmp or something else, whatever developers
decide to use. Mostly they seem to settle on systemd-logind.

So, we end with a system that works for both simple (single-user) and
more complex setups (multi-user, multi-seat).

The question then is: "I have a system that works for both simple and
complex setups. Should I implement (continue to maintain) a second
system that only works for simple setups?"

Some upstreams have decided that they have not the resources and
interest to maintain a second system; they end with a dependency on systemd.

Sometimes they keep code for the old system, but don't write code to
fallback to it at runtime. So one has to decide at build time which
system to support. Maintainers might choose to enable the system that
works both setups[1] -- again ending with a systemd dependency, but
still working on *BSD where the alternative (less capable) system in
chosen instead.

  [1] It might be possible to build two alternative versions like done
  with, for example, vim. But maintainers might choose not to do so
  for the same reasons upstream -- not enough resources and lack of
  interest of involved people.

So, if people care about support for mechanisms that don't rely on
systemd-logind and only support a subset of configurations, they need to
join upstream projects. Just stomping with your foot does not work: sign
up to maintain support for non-systemd setups and implement fallback
code from one system to another where needed instead.

> Another point is of course is that if you are locally connected to
> your/somebody else's computer nothing is hindering you from pushing the
> on/off button or pull the plug (except physically). Is shutting off a
> computer really a problem, normally multi-available ones are always on?

Shutting the system down is just one example: you can go on with access
to audio devices and USB ports (and connected media) in multi-seat
configurations and so on.

Ansgar

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Jean-Christophe Dubacq

[ ⏰ 26/06/2014 15:34 ] [ ✎ Thorsten Glaser ]
> Jean-Christophe Dubacq wrote:
> 
>> So that students can do eg ssh mybuddymachine /sbin/shutdown ?
>>
>> (and they need to be able to shutdown their own machine, power is not free).
> 
> Why do people always think that a proposal will automatically
> exclude all others?
> 
> In your student scenario, you do *not* add them to the shutdown
> group (or you show some trust into them). In your scenario, you
> use all those *kit (or their successors) packages. You are what
> those GNOME/systemd people target their new things at.
> 
> But neither you nor Svante/me are the *only* use cases. Rather,
> both coexist. Just as I do not want to tell you to add all your
> students to the shitdown group, which would be inappropriate, I
> do not want to be told to use systemd, just to shut down a box.
> Use the right tool for the job.

However, in your scenario, somebody will bug base-files asking that the
shutdown group be added to the base groups of everybody. I do not want
that. My ideal setup is that nobody has any groups but his own. I would
like audio and video groups removed for everybody. This is not needed
with the correct framework. I agree that this model may work for special
needs (fuse, maybe?).

So I say, if you want to use this kind of backward setup, install
systemd-equivs, setup whatever you need, modifying pam groups and
everything, like I used to setup the IRQ number for my sound card twenty
years ago, and be done with it.

Sincerely,
-- 
Jean-Christophe Dubacq

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Description: OpenPGP digital signature

systemd-must-die (was Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian)

Wookey worte:

>> [11]http://users.unixforge.de/~tglaser/debs/dists/etch/wtf/Pkgs/mirabilos-support/
>
>Can it be uploaded please? As has been observed, there is a reasonable
>number of people who would like an easy way to control explicitly
>when/if they change to systemd for pid 1. Having to get it from a
>separate repo should not be necessary.

If you wish, and ftpmasters agree, I can split this package off
the (larger) source package I made (which creates half a dozen
such metapackages, some just conflicting with stuff like systemd,
ncurses-term and puppet, some just depending on stuff I wish to
have installed on systems I touch so I do not have to interrupt
work every 5 minutes to add just another tool, and some with a
few tools and skeleton files), and upload it separately.

When I was new to Debian, waldi taught me about the cost of
new binary packages (I had originally a separate mksh-static
package, intended for use on the initrd). I do not know whether
the cost is prohibitive here. The package itself is absolutely
trivial, it just conflicts with anything systemd, and has no
content of its own. I believe it does not need to be in Debian
itself, technically, but I agree to upload it if its presence
is desired politically (even to wheezy-backports).

bye,
//mirabilos


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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Rens Houben

In other news for Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 02:33:49PM +0100, Wookey has been seen 
typing:
> +++ Svante Signell [2014-06-26 12:31 +0200]:
> > 
> > Not in any official Debian repo unfortunately:
> > 
> > http://users.unixforge.de/~tglaser/debs/dists/etch/wtf/Pkgs/mirabilos-support/
> 
> Can it be uploaded please? As has been observed, there is a reasonable
> number of people who would like an easy way to control explicitly
> when/if they change to systemd for pid 1. Having to get it from a
> separate repo should not be necessary.

I'd recommend naming it something just a *tad* less hysterically
antagonistic first.

> Wookey


-- 
Rens Houben   |opinions are mine
Resident linux guru and sysadmin  | if my employers have one
Systemec Internet Services.   |they'll tell you themselves
PGP key at http://proteus.systemec.nl/~shadur/shadur.key.asc


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Re: SV: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

On Jun 26, Wookey  wrote:

> Can it be uploaded please? As has been observed, there is a reasonable
> number of people who would like an easy way to control explicitly
> when/if they change to systemd for pid 1. Having to get it from a
apt-get install equivs

-- 
ciao,
Marco


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

On Thu, 2014-06-26 at 13:53 +0100, Simon McVittie wrote:
> On 26/06/14 13:33, Svante Signell wrote:
> > Of course with the additional check that the students are logged in to
> > that box locally, did I forget to mention that?
> 
> ... or
> something involving utmp/wtmp/other traditions.
> 
> utmp(5) says "many system programs (foolishly) depend on its integrity"
> so be very careful with security implications if you go that way. I
> wouldn't want anything relying on utmp for its security on my systems.

Maybe I'm naive but doesn't utmp(5) solve this problem?

who(1) tells me in clear-text if I'm logged in locally or remote:

Linux:
local remote or local
console,tty   pts/

~$ who
usr  tty1 2014-06-26 16:16
usr  :0   2014-06-24 19:33 (:0)
usr  pts/12014-06-25 15:19 (:0.0)
susr  pts/82014-06-26 16:24 (ip-address/hostname)

Hurd:
local remote
console, tty  ttyp
~$ who
loginconsole  2014-06-25 16:54
logintty12014-06-25 16:54 (tty1 to tty6)
usr  ttyp02014-06-25 19:33 (ip-address/hostname)

Here a special user named login is used for not yet logged in
terminals.

For kFreeBSD I dunno yet, have to check.

Are there serious security problems with ancient utmp that cannot be
solved?


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

On Jun 26, Thorsten Glaser  wrote:

> Yes, I fully agree. But _please_ also realise that there are people,
> a non-neglibile number of them, for whom these frameworks are not an
> improvement, and who wish to be not forced to use them.
A few people said this about udev as well. Now they use udev.

-- 
ciao,
Marco


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Alastair McKinstry


-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256

On 26/06/2014 15:33, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> On Jun 26, Thorsten Glaser  wrote:
>
>> Yes, I fully agree. But _please_ also realise that there are people,
>> a non-neglibile number of them, for whom these frameworks are not an
>> improvement, and who wish to be not forced to use them.
> A few people said this about udev as well. Now they use udev.
... and complain or suffer in silence. Don't take popcon as a measure of
people being
happy to use a critical dependency like udev. I've  udev installed on
some servers as a
dependency of many packages, but udev itself is disabled in scripts as
it keeps crashing
on my hardware. (Old powerpc server).



>
>
> --
> Alastair McKinstry, , ,
https://diaspora.sceal.ie/u/amckinstry
> A decent provision for the poor is the true test of civilization.
> ~Samuel Johnson, Boswell: Life of Johnson
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Bug#752788: ITP: r-cran-maxlik -- GNU R maximum likelihood estimation

2014-06-26 Thread Andreas Tille

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Andreas Tille 

* Package name: r-cran-maxlik
  Version : 1.2-0
  Upstream Author : Arne Henningsen 
* URL : http://cran.r-project.org/web/packages/maxLik/
* License : GPL
  Programming Lang: R
  Description : GNU R maximum likelihood estimation
 This GNU R package provides tools for maximum likelihood estimation.


Remark: This package is a precondition to run the unit tests of the new
version of r-cran-surveillance and will be maintained by the Debian Science
team at

   
svn://anonscm.debian.org/debian-science/packages/R/trunk/packages/r-cran-maxlik/trunk/


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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Steve Langasek

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 09:27:10PM +0900, Charles Plessy wrote:
> > I have discussed this with ftp-masters and release team before
> > filling the bugs, arguing heavily in disagreement with ftp-master's
> > REJECT FAQ - the PHP License REJECT is there since 2005.

> Hi Ondrej,

> sorry for not having answered your email on debian-legal despite agreeing
> with your point of view.  Given my long history of fighting with the FTP
> team, I was worried that my opinion would count peanuts or even have the
> opposite effect as intended.

> This said, while the PHP license is definitely a poor choice for software
> that is not produced by the PHP group, I do not see how it can make the
> software unredistributable.

Agreed.  There is nothing in these licenses that makes the software
undistributable; it just requires the distributor to attach *false
statements* to it as part of distribution.

I have no objection to the ftp team's decision to treat this as an automatic
reject on this basis - I don't think a license that requires us to make
false statements is suitable for main - but it's wrong to claim that these
works are undistributable.

-- 
Steve Langasek   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/
slanga...@ubuntu.com vor...@debian.org

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Bug#752792: ITP: binpac -- language for describing and generating network protocol parsers

2014-06-26 Thread Raúl Benencia

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Raúl Benencia 

* Package name: binpac
  Version : 0.42
  Upstream Author : Bro Development Team 
* URL : http://bro.org/sphinx/components/binpac/README.html
* License : BSD
  Programming Lang: C++
  Description : language for describing and generating network protocol 
parsers

BinPAC is a high level language for describing network protocol parsers and
generate C++ code. The user has to provide a .pac file following the PAC
grammar and BinPAC will generate its corresponding .cc and .h files.

BinPAC is maintained and distributed with the Bro Network Security Monitor
distribution, however, the generated parsers may be used with other
programs besides Bro.


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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Paul Wise

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 10:58 PM, Alastair McKinstry wrote:

> udev itself is disabled in scripts as it keeps crashing
> on my hardware. (Old powerpc server).

Which bug number is this?

-- 
bye,
pabs

http://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise


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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

On Jun 26, Steve Langasek  wrote:

> I have no objection to the ftp team's decision to treat this as an automatic
> reject on this basis - I don't think a license that requires us to make
> false statements is suitable for main - but it's wrong to claim that these
> works are undistributable.
Reality check #1: it is quite obvious that even if anybody else accepts 
this interpretation then nobody cares.
Reality check #2: Debian would not be viable without major packages like 
PHP support for imagemagick or memcached, if we do we may as well remove 
the the whole language.

-- 
ciao,
Marco


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Re: systemd-must-die (was Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian)

2014-06-26 Thread Alessio Treglia

On 26 Jun 2014 15:05, "Thorsten Glaser"  wrote:
> content of its own. I believe it does not need to be in Debian
> itself, technically, but I agree to upload it if its presence
> is desired politically (even to wheezy-backports).
>

Personally I would love it.

Cheers.

-- 
Alessio

Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Steve Langasek

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 02:36:18PM +0300, Faidon Liambotis wrote:
> On 06/26/14 14:00, Ondřej Surý wrote:
> >I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
> >some more background on the bugs filled.

> >I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
> >and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
> >suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
> >that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.

> Could you elaborate on the reasoning of that? Neither your email to -devel
> nor the one to -legal[1] explains why you think so and whatever it is, I
> think it's far from obvious. I think an outcome that results in a mass (RC)
> bug filing needs to be better documented than that -- and btw, you're
> supposed to mail debian-devel *before* you do so, not after; cf. developer's
> reference 7.1.1.

> Besides the importance of the bug filing itself and removing half of PHP
> from Debian (including packages such as php-memcached!), I have another
> point to make: as you're well aware, we're in the progress of packaging
> Facebook's HHVM, which is a new runtime engine for PHP that is gaining some
> popularity[2].

Furthermore, there are bugs in the actual MBF that's been filed here.  Bug
#752639 was filed against php-imlib, which gives the PHP license as one of
*two* options under which the work can be distributed - LGPL is the other,
and is in practice the one that's in effect for Debian.

So I think we need a review here of the MBF methodology, because the
problems with the PHP License were already identified and worked through in
the archive a decade ago - so a lot of these bugs are probably false
positives.

-- 
Steve Langasek   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/
slanga...@ubuntu.com vor...@debian.org


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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

Steve,

I did hand checked all copyright files in question and while php-imlib might 
have slipped me, I am quite sure that your claim about "lot of these" is false, 
since php-imlib is not the only package under dual licensing I have seen.

I do apologize for filling bug against php-imlib though.

O.
-- 
Ondřej Surý 
Knot DNS (https://www.knot-dns.cz/) – a high-performance DNS server

> On 26. 6. 2014, at 19:29, Steve Langasek  wrote:
> 
>> On Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 02:36:18PM +0300, Faidon Liambotis wrote:
>>> On 06/26/14 14:00, Ondřej Surý wrote:
>>> I should have done this earlier before cloning the bugs, so here's
>>> some more background on the bugs filled.
> 
>>> I did have a quite long and extensive chat with FTP Masters
>>> and our conclusion was that PHP License (any version) is
>>> suitable only for software that comes directly from "PHP Group",
>>> that basically means only PHP (src:php5) itself.
> 
>> Could you elaborate on the reasoning of that? Neither your email to -devel
>> nor the one to -legal[1] explains why you think so and whatever it is, I
>> think it's far from obvious. I think an outcome that results in a mass (RC)
>> bug filing needs to be better documented than that -- and btw, you're
>> supposed to mail debian-devel *before* you do so, not after; cf. developer's
>> reference 7.1.1.
> 
>> Besides the importance of the bug filing itself and removing half of PHP
>> from Debian (including packages such as php-memcached!), I have another
>> point to make: as you're well aware, we're in the progress of packaging
>> Facebook's HHVM, which is a new runtime engine for PHP that is gaining some
>> popularity[2].
> 
> Furthermore, there are bugs in the actual MBF that's been filed here.  Bug
> #752639 was filed against php-imlib, which gives the PHP license as one of
> *two* options under which the work can be distributed - LGPL is the other,
> and is in practice the one that's in effect for Debian.
> 
> So I think we need a review here of the MBF methodology, because the
> problems with the PHP License were already identified and worked through in
> the archive a decade ago - so a lot of these bugs are probably false
> positives.
> 
> -- 
> Steve Langasek   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
> Debian Developer   to set it on, and I can move the world.
> Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/
> slanga...@ubuntu.com vor...@debian.org

Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Steve Langasek

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 07:26:05PM +0200, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> On Jun 26, Steve Langasek  wrote:

> > I have no objection to the ftp team's decision to treat this as an automatic
> > reject on this basis - I don't think a license that requires us to make
> > false statements is suitable for main - but it's wrong to claim that these
> > works are undistributable.
> Reality check #1: it is quite obvious that even if anybody else accepts 
> this interpretation then nobody cares.

Ah good, argumentum ad populum, I was getting sick of Debian having
principles anyway.

> Reality check #2: Debian would not be viable without major packages like 
> PHP support for imagemagick or memcached, if we do we may as well remove 
> the the whole language.

Well, you won't hear any objections from *me* to the idea of removing PHP
from the archive.

-- 
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Debian Developer   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/
slanga...@ubuntu.com vor...@debian.org


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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Matthias Urlichs

Hi,

Steve Langasek:
> Ah good, argumentum ad populum, I was getting sick of Debian having
> principles anyway.
> 
The point is that absolutely nobody else seems to be interested in this
strange licensing situation. Debian itself had the "problem" for YEARS and
nobody noticed.

Thus, reality check #3: This license contains some strange terms that make
it look like it doesn't really apply to the software it's distributed with,
but QUITE OBVIOUSLY the author of the software in question thought other-
wise, and there is no actual legal problem (nobody else is complaining
about the license, much less threatening to revoke permissions, much less
suing somebody).

Thus², while we're in a reasonably good position to convince Upstream to
fix that problem, filing RC bugs and thus making PHP unuseable in Debian
is certainly going to be regarded as typical Debian principles-above-all
overkill but unlikely to be helpful to anybody.

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Re: MATE 1.8 has now fully arrived in Debian

2014-06-26 Thread Russ Allbery

Thorsten Glaser  writes:

> Yes, I fully agree. But _please_ also realise that there are people,
> a non-neglibile number of them, for whom these frameworks are not an
> improvement, and who wish to be not forced to use them.

That's fine for you to feel that way, but that feeling does not obligate
anyone else to do work, nor does it obligate upstreams who see code and
conceptual simplification benefits for dropping non-logind approaches to
maintain support they don't like.  If you want to be able to avoid new
frameworks that the general community of Linux developers feel materially
improve the quality of the Linux desktop experience, you're going to have
to get together with like-minded people and actually do the work, on an
ongoing basis.  Some of those upstreams have indicated willingness to keep
other interfaces provided someone is actively engaged with them about
those interfaces and doing development on them.  For other upstreams, you
may have to fork, or just say that people who don't want to use systemd
won't be able to use that software.

My family had a Betamax VCR.  The format was arguably much better than
VHS.  It didn't get support, maintaining both formats wasn't viable, and
it died.  We bought a VHS VCR.

That's not necessarily what's going to happen with systemd (in particular,
it's much easier to maintain multiple init infrastructures than multiple
commercial VCR tape formats).  But there's still work involved that
someone would have to do.  It's easy to express your disappointment on
mailing lists and much harder to say "here's the new infrastructure that
replaces PolicyKit and ConsoleKit, here's what it's going to be able to do
and what it isn't going to be able to do, here are the situations where
you'll just need to use logind instead, and here are patches to GNOME to
make it work properly."  Which is why no one's done that yet.

-- 
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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Clint Byrum

Excerpts from Matthias Urlichs's message of 2014-06-26 11:17:04 -0700:
> Hi,
> 
> Steve Langasek:
> > Ah good, argumentum ad populum, I was getting sick of Debian having
> > principles anyway.
> > 
> The point is that absolutely nobody else seems to be interested in this
> strange licensing situation. Debian itself had the "problem" for YEARS and
> nobody noticed.
> 
> Thus, reality check #3: This license contains some strange terms that make
> it look like it doesn't really apply to the software it's distributed with,
> but QUITE OBVIOUSLY the author of the software in question thought other-
> wise, and there is no actual legal problem (nobody else is complaining
> about the license, much less threatening to revoke permissions, much less
> suing somebody).
> 
> Thus², while we're in a reasonably good position to convince Upstream to
> fix that problem, filing RC bugs and thus making PHP unuseable in Debian
> is certainly going to be regarded as typical Debian principles-above-all
> overkill but unlikely to be helpful to anybody.
> 

Oh good, another discussion where we argue against our principles. I
was getting bored with all of those purely technical discussions about
systemd (PLEASE DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS JOKE).

If anyone has a better way to safeguard those to whom we distribute
software, please do speak up about it. I for one think our users choose
Debian because they can be sure their rights are being looked after.
Let's do what we can to help upstream rectify the situation, but lets
also be honest with our users while they respond.


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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable

2014-06-26 Thread Matthias Urlichs

Hi,

Clint Byrum:
> Oh good, another discussion where we argue against our principles.

I am not arguing against our principles. I am arguing against a panicked
"let's RC-bug half of our PHP infrastructure (and drop it from $NEXTSTABLE
because the situation won't be resolved until the release)" response which
is unlikely to be helpful to anybody. It would not be the first time we
'postpone' a licensing meltdown (GDFL, anybody?).

> If anyone has a better way to safeguard those to whom we distribute
> software, please do speak up about it.

I'd recommend that we safeguard our users against 'PHP' licensing problems
the same way I protect myself against a meteorite hitting me on my way to
work tomorrow, and for roughly the same reasons.

-- 
-- Matthias Urlichs


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Re: how do I treat an un-owned leftover directory?

2014-06-26 Thread Lars Wirzenius

On Thu, Jun 26, 2014 at 02:45:21PM +0200, Dennis van Dok wrote:
> I'm symlinking files to /etc/grid-security/certificates/ on
> installation, and everything but the directories themselves are removed
> on package removal.
> 
> I guess I could remove these directories if they are completely empty
> after package removal, but I don't really own the directories. The use
> of these directories is an established convention with grid computing
> software.

I think the following should work:

* Include the /etc/grid-security/certificates directory in your .deb.
* In postinst, add the symlinks.
* In prerm, remove the symlinks.

This way, the directory will be added and removed automatically by
dpkg, and it will be kept if any other package contains it or if there
are any files there other than the symlinks you remove.

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Re: Bug#752745: ITP: dnssec-root-key -- This package contains DNSSEC root key

2014-06-26 Thread Robert Edmonds

Ondřej Surý wrote:
> Package: wnpp
> Severity: wishlist
> Owner: "Ondřej Surý" 
> 
> * Package name: dnssec-root-key

Hm, I would maybe call this dnssec-root-anchors.  Technically there
should be very few copies of the root key :-)

Similarly, s/key/trust anchors/g in the descriptions?

>   Version : 20100715
>   Upstream Author : ICANN/IANA
> * URL : http://data.iana.org/root-anchors/

> * License : Public Data (same as with root.zone)

It might be nice to include a copy of this document in /usr/share/doc:

http://data.iana.org/root-anchors/draft-icann-dnssec-trust-anchor.txt

Since it looks like this is the only place where a schema is defined for
the root-anchors.xml file.

But I guess we would need a better (non-)license than this:

   Copyright (c) 2010 Internet Corporation For Assigned Names and
   Numbers.

>   Programming Lang: None
>   Description : This package contains DNSSEC root key
> 
> This package contains DNSSEC root key in all available
> formats that all packages doing DNSSEC validation can
> use as a common data source.
> .
> unbound-anchor is used to keep the root.key up-to-date
> via RFC5011 mechanism.
> 
> --
> 
> PERSONAL NOTE: I now maintain at least two packages that
> need DNSSEC root.key (hash-slinger and getdns[1]).  There
> are at least bind9, unbound and dnsmasq that can use this
> as well.
> 
> 
> 1. Waiting for next upstream release with proper libtool
> flags.

So, I wonder if this package should be responsible for providing the
root-anchors.xml file, and the bind9/unbound/dnsmasq/etc. packages
should be responsible for converting that from XML to whatever format
they use (and unfortunately it appears every different program uses a
different trust anchor format).

Or by "all available formats" do you mean that this source package
should take the root-anchors.xml file and generate several common
formats (at package build time?) and provide them in /usr/share
alongside the original root-anchors files from iana.org, so that DNSSEC
software packages don't need an XML dependency?  (Though, bind9 and
unbound-anchor already pull in XML parsing libraries, but e.g. dnsmasq
currently does not.)

Should we patch unbound-anchor so that its fallback mode (where it tries
to fetch files from https://data.iana.org/root-anchors/) can be made to
check file:///usr/share/dnssec-root-anchors/ first?  (And if so, it'd be
nice to upstream that.)

Should we do anything about the built-in static content in
unbound-anchor that would be duplicative of the content in this package?
I'm talking about this:

http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=users/edmonds/unbound.git;a=blob;f=smallapp/unbound-anchor.c;h=8ea4726b06313bf2f910d07f870d4e5350e25bce;hb=HEAD#l207

And this:

http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=users/edmonds/unbound.git;a=blob;f=smallapp/unbound-anchor.c;h=8ea4726b06313bf2f910d07f870d4e5350e25bce;hb=HEAD#l237

And, finally, is it known that the root DNSSEC key will be rolled over
with RFC 5011 semantics?

Anyway, consider this email an offer to co-maintain :-)

-- 
Robert Edmonds
edmo...@debian.org

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Re: Sources licensed under PHP License and not being PHP are not distributable