Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, [iso-8859-1] Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote:
If someone is going to evaluate an entire distribution on a prompt
(even if there are other factors), I'm not going to be upset if they
don't choose Debian.
I'm no talking about just the prompt. We're talking about good and
comfortable defaults, default settings should be like suggestions
of how things can be done. Good defaults is very important in a
distribution, IMHO.
IMO, debian HAS good defaults. clean simple without a lot of stuff to
undo when you want to customise it to YOUR preferred settings.
Making default settings too pretty/complex tends to stifle both learning
creativity...instead of just one thing to learn/change at a time, you
have to undo a lot of changes (or at least learn what they do) or risk
breaking a working setup.
Standard? What standard? Is this...
# _
POSIX? =)
'$' and '#' are the standard for sh and have been since sh was written.
nearly every unix/linux book will have those prompts in any examples.
The default prompt should only display the cwd, the host, and perhaps de
user...
*my* preferred prompt should only display the wd, the host, the time,
and the user.
the default prompt should be the standard, plain simple as it is.
at most, there should be a bunch of commented-out PS1= lines in
/etc/skel/.bashrc or in /etc/profile (and ditto for csh's config files,
etc) providing samples. Or just a pointer to /usr/doc/{bash,csh,zsh,...}
craig
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Re: IMPORTANT: RSA Data Security Challenge participants please read
On Tue, 25 Feb 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: It was OK for us to participate as [EMAIL PROTECTED] in the RSA Data Security Challenge as long as we didn't have any chance of beating the Linux group. It looks as if we do have a chance. It would be real embarassing to beat them. So please, if you are participating, change your reporting address to [EMAIL PROTECTED] NOW. I have asked the statistics-keepers to add the figure for [EMAIL PROTECTED] to that for [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Well, even though I support and use Debian, I am running a client compiled for aix 3.2.5 (RS6K 370) 1MKeys in 37 seconds... just better than a p100. Should I chalk that one up for an ibm/aix group? All the win95 clients... you want microsoft to get credit for them? Just Wondering, Walter L. Preuninger II -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: wu-ftpd to do virtuals
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said: Can anyone tell me what is required to do virtual ftp sites with the standard wu-ftpd distributed on debian ? Nothing. You can't. There is some support for virtual ftp sites in wu-ftpd-2.4.2-beta-11, which can be gotten from wuarchive.wustl.edu I've also got some patches (against debian's wu-ftpd and the beta above) that provide virtual ftp site functionality at: http://www.cuug.ab.ca:8001/~barkers/programs/ -- Scott Barker Linux Consultant [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.cuug.ab.ca:8001/~barkers/ (under construction) [ I try to reply to all e-mail within 3 days. If you don't ] [ get a response by then, I probably didn't get your e-mail. ] [ Unsolicited commercial and junk e-mail will be proof-read for US$100 ] I think Congress has spent enough time on ethics. I think its time they moved on to something else. - Richard M. Nixon -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: IMPORTANT: RSA Data Security Challenge participants please read
At 01:00 PM 2/26/97 PST, Bruce Perens wrote: 1. Do we want it? Do we really want free software to be associated with code-breaking in the eyes of the uneducated public? I'm not sure that would not hurt us. Just think about the articles on a government code being broken using a hacker tool called Debian. Also, some of the people participating most likely don't have permission to use their employer's machines for outside cryptography projects (I'm thinking of a certain person at a U.S. military facility). I don't want to be around when that gets exposed. Well Bruce, you've given them a head start to find [EMAIL PROTECTED] already by posting to a public mailing list :-) Seriously though, the whole idea is that it's just a project to beat the cryptography and say that it _can_ be cracked - fair enough, over a long time, but it can still be cracked nevertheless. If anyone cracks it then it brings an awareness to the government about the potential of computers and their need for new cryptograhy. 2. Does it hurt us in other ways? For example, will we be perceived as working against people we should be working with? IMO no. Who in the Linux world hasn't heard of Debian? When a person decides to run Linux they basically have a a few coices; Debian, Redhat and Slackware - I can't think of any others that are as popular! So if everyone knows or has heard that Debian is a Linux distribution we'll always be associated with linuxnet. 3. Are there better ways for us to spend our time? I sure think so. Bruce, please :-) You've got to consider that some of us administrators don't have things going wrong, aren't busy and need something to do or just don't have lives in general - so this is something along the lines of a big gettogether :-) It's a compuational challenge. It doesn't matter where we are on any list on the stats - it's who gets the correct keyspace who gets the price. If I started under my own email address and cracked it I'd laugh at all of you and keep the money for myself (oh alright, I'd donate $1 to Debian and $1 to Linux:-). Having said that, we could form our own syndicate and split the winnings between ourselves, but we're about that - we're doing it under the Debian name which I consider to be the best thing we can do for the project. In fact, I'd like to see more involvment in things as the Debian name - as I said before, if we exploit our name a bit we may start getting donations of machines from big companies like other groups. Just my 2 cents worth. -- ___ Karl Ferguson, Tower Networking Pty Ltd [EMAIL PROTECTED] t/a STAR Online Services [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tel: +61-9-455-3446 Fax: +61-9-455-2776 http://www.star.net.au ___ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: /dev/cua2 - modem problems! help!
On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Jim Fetters wrote: problem: modem on /dev/cua2 is slow. when you type, it takes 5-7 seconds to get an echo back from the AT commands on modem. symptoms: modem works fine when i boot into windows 95, also modem worked great under Slackware 2.0 (my previous install). dip doesn't work anymore, i can ATDT to my local internet provider, but it connects and there is a strange delay, and it only seems to want to return small chunks of words (12 chars or less), most of the data is missing. once again, everything works fine under win95, and when i had slackware up and running i never ever had a problem with the modem. (USR Sportster 28800) any advice? 1. use /dev/ttyS2 rather than /dev/cua2 - the cua devices are essentially obsolete. check to see that nothing else (getty, mgetty, etc) is trying to use the serial port on either the ttyS or cua device. the slowness may be being caused by some sort of locking/contention problem. 2. check that there's no IRQ or IO port conflict for the serial port. try 'cat /proc/interrupts' and 'cat /proc/ioports'. make sure they match a) your actual hardware (pull the machine apart if necessary) and b) your setserial commands in /etc/rc.boot/0setserial. if your sportster is an internal modem on ttyS2 (or dos COM3:), you will probably need to change it's IRQ so that it doesn't conflict with ttyS0 (COM1:). IRQs can NOT be shared. If possible, set it to an unused IRQ (5 or 7 work fine if you dont have a soundcard or other device using that IRQ...don't worry about the printer, linux uses polled IO for the printers by default rather than interrupt driven) If your internal modem doesn't allow you to change the IRQ, then try changing the IRQ on ttyS0 instead. 3. try using irqtune (in the hwtools package, i believe) to optimise the interrupt priorities for the serial ports. 4. make sure that the serial driver is either compiled into the kernel, or 'serial' is listed in /etc/modules. this will prevent kerneld from unloading the serial module (and thus losing the setserial config) whenever the serial ports have been unused for a while. craig -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
Chris Walker:
I'm not sure about the situation in unstable, but in stable neither the
menu package, or fvwm2 seem to provide /etc/menu-methods/fvwm2.
This file is available in /usr/doc/menu/examples. Because of this, the
menu is not updated by default. Is this the case in unstable or should I
report it as a bug?
Having copied the example file over, the result is excellent and should
be a selling point for Debian. Well done.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] ~dpkg -S /etc/menu-methods/fvwm2
fvwm2: /etc/menu-methods/fvwm2
[EMAIL PROTECTED] ~dpkg -s fvwm2 |grep Version:
Version: 2.0.45-BETA-1
So no need to file a bug report, just wait until the new fvwm2 gets into
stable..
Oh yeah, check out my cool prompt ;-)
--
#!/usr/bin/perl -i$=0;$=0;exec/bin/sh'achmod [EMAIL PROTECTED]
$_=echo '#!/usr/bin/suidperl -U\n$^I 2755aa;s=a= $ENV{HOME}/Imroot;=g;exec$_
# Get root in 30 seconds or less. Fix this hole: upgrade to perl 5.003 today..
How appropriate, you fight like a cow. - - Guybrush Threepwood
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Re: IMPORTANT: RSA Data Security Challenge participants please read
Bruce: From: Mike Neuffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] So far the only thing that Bruce accomplished with his uncoordinated action is that numerous hosts dropped entirely out of the key-search. Big deal. They have years to go. We might ask ourselves some questions about this kind of publicity. 1. Do we want it? Do we really want free software to be associated with code-breaking in the eyes of the uneducated public? I'm not sure that would not hurt us. Just think about the articles on a government code being broken using a hacker tool called Debian. Also, some of the people participating most likely don't have permission to use their employer's machines for outside cryptography projects (I'm thinking of a certain person at a U.S. military facility). I don't want to be around when that gets exposed. I don't think anyone is going to present it that way. Good, strong cryptography solves an awful lot of problems. We have been using PGP extensively within the Debian project. The reason RSA is sponsoring this is to prove a political point -- the U.S. export controls cost them real money. 2. Does it hurt us in other ways? For example, will we be perceived as working against people we should be working with? The real purpose of the contest is to crunch numbers and prove a political point. A little bit of rivalry helps, I think. Anyways, nobody has alot invested in this and I really doubt that many egos were being bent out of shape by the debian entry. Except maybe Bruce's? :-) 3. Are there better ways for us to spend our time? I sure think so. I thought it was sort of cool. Considering how negative much of the discussion in the mailing lists has been lately (ie. debmake vs. debstd, RPM vs. deb, etc.) -- I was impressed by how the Debian community was able to come together for some fun and games. Bruce, don't spend all your time worrying about how Debian is going to be viewed by the rest of the Linux community. The main reason I use Debian is not for the quality of the distribution. Instead, I use it because it has a real user and developer community. I suspect that's why most people here use it too. Red Hat doesn't stand up to the same criteria. I believe the role of the leader of the Debian project should be more like being the mayor of the community, with the board of directors acting like city counsel-people. The real strength of the Debian is in building a strong community. Therefore, I don't think that it is very constructive when the leader independently scuttles a project the community was solidly behind without even consulting anyone. Other than that, you're doing a good job as a leader. That's my take on it anyways... Cheers, - Jim pgp7ORoLAMKLW.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: HD prob - bad inodes
I am using the I/O controller which is built into the motherboard. My BIOS is set to LBA mode. Get the Large HD HOWTO from sunsite or from the newsgroup linux.answers. I would think it's PM and Linux disk geometry conflict. But it's hard to tell since I don't run PM. I fixed the problem... It was a faulty setting in the CMOS config. I reset the config to the defaults and everything is spiffy. -Paul H -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: pine produces segmentation faults (fwd)
Hi, Bruce == Bruce Perens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: From William Chow [EMAIL PROTECTED] Time to RTFM, there, Corey. Bruce That's RTM on this list, please. What, You don't think our manuals are Fine? ;-) manoj -- ...The Universe is thronged with fire and light, And we but smaller suns, which, skinned, trapped and kept Enshrined in blood and precious bones, hold back the night. Ray Bradbury Manoj Srivastava url:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Mobile, Alabama USAurl:http://www.datasync.com/%7Esrivasta/ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
Yoav Cohen-Sivan:
It seems that Debian is taking a rather different philosophy on
pre-configured packages than other distributions, such as RedHat. What I
mean is that after installation of RedHat you have a more or less
pre-tailored system setup. You can start tweaking your heart out but the
basics are already there. Debian comes up in a much rawer form after
install
I find your viewpoint interesting, becuase when I installed debian half a
year ago, coming from a redhat background, my reaction was exactly the
opposite.
When you install a redhat package, like a sendmail or smail or bind or
apache, redhat does try to set up reasonable defaults.. but it doesn't go so
far as prompting you for how you want smail set up, or what you're going
to be using your name server for, or how you want apache configured. Redhat
just plops down config files that you have to find and edit.
So when I installed debian, I was pleasantly suprised to find all these
packages prompting me for configuration information in their postinst
scripts, and I ended up with a working system with all the necessary daemons
configured much faster than I expected.
I do notice that all the counterexamples I gave are for daemons, not the
interactive programs like X and fvwm that a new user is going to be faced
with. You you may well be right about debian catering to the more technical
crowd. But with new additions like the debian menu system and so on, I see
debian stating to provide easier configuration for the interactive stuff as
well.
--
#!/usr/bin/perl -i$=0;$=0;exec/bin/sh'achmod [EMAIL PROTECTED]
$_=echo '#!/usr/bin/suidperl -U\n$^I 2755aa;s=a= $ENV{HOME}/Imroot;=g;exec$_
# Get root in 30 seconds or less. Fix this hole: upgrade to perl 5.003 today..
How appropriate, you fight like a cow. - - Guybrush Threepwood
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Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Yoav Cohen-Sivan wrote: Debian comes up in a much rawer form after install - for instance, no prompt beyond the basic # for root and $ for the user (RedHat gives you the now famous username /home/username$ prompt). # and $ are standard/expected prompts. if you want something different, customise it yourself. I think you are missing my point. I'm not just talking about the prompt or X11 or any other specific package, but the whole shabam. No, i'm not missing your point at all. I just happen to disagree with it. One of the things I *like* about debian is that it doesn't inflict anyone else's aesthetic tastes on me. I don't have to edit a lot of configuration files to undo some hideously garish display - it's plain and simple and I can uglify/prettify it according to my own personal (bad) taste rather than someone else's. Also, a developer's time is better spent on making sure the package WORKS rather than making it conform to some aesthetic standard which appeals to everyone (which, btw, is impossible...doing graphic design by concensus leads to blandness - and blandness is inherently offensive) debian has a 'menu' package which all other packages can use to register [...deleted...] Not all packages are using menu yet, but most are. Yes, I know about this - I found it out a few days ago, BUT, you are again missing my point that in *my*, yes, *my* view it would be an advantage to have some sort of nice default setup instead of a bare-bones system. What you want is there. Install the menu package, and all packages which use it WILL appear in the menu. You don't HAVE to customise the menus (but you can if you want to) What more do you want? Yes, all the tools are in place to help me customize but the system is still bare-bones. So what's missing? What would you like to do? How would you like the system to appear? I don't know about you, but I am into Linux as a hobby - I only have a few hours a week to devote to it. I *will* get around to learning all the intricacies and I *will* configure it to my own tastes, but in the meantime, while I am learning all the functions I would prefer a nicer setup. So start by learning what you need to know to have a nicer setup. If you dont have the time to trace through all the documentation to find out exactly what needs to be done, then at least skim the docs to get an overview of how it works and ask specific how do I questions on debian-user. not only will it be more satisfying to have done it by yourself (with or without help from the mailing lists), but you'll also learn a lot faster as you will have the positive reinforcement of seeing the changes you make actually have an affect on the system. You WON'T get that if it's all spoon-fed to you. My complaints have to do with the fact that for someone taking Linux as a hobby, as opposed to it being a part of his work or very soul, Debain seems to neglect the fact that I can't learn it all in 3 days/weeks/whatever yet still would like a simple working system while I go through the ropes. Nobody can learn it all in 3 days or 3 months or whatever. I've been using, working, and playing with linux for over 3 years and I still dont know anywhere near all there is to know about it (that's one of the things i like about unix - i'll never get bored of it) What you do have with debian is a solid, stable operating system which wont fall over on you while you learn it. You can break it and make it crash if you want but at least you know that it's something YOU did (and can therefore UN-DO) rather than something inherently broken in the system which you can't fix. and that, IMO, is worth it's (virtual) weight in goldor PPro200 CPU's whichever is worth more at the time. craig -- This message was delayed because the list mail delivery agent was down.
Thank you very much (was: Extremely rare Apache configuration)
Hello guys, I just want to express publicly my gratitude to all of you (direct recipients of this message) for having pointed me in the right direction regarding the question I posted today to debian-user: Can one proxy server be configured to go through another proxy server for certain addresses??? All of you recommended to use Squid, and let me tell you something about it: Squid is a miracle!!! I am really impressed with it and how configurable it is. Credits also go to Debian GNU/Linux and its developers for having a Squid package that works out of the box. Once again: thank you very much. Regards, Eloy.- -- Eloy A. Paris Information Technology Department Rockwell Automation de Venezuela Telephone: +58-2-9432311 Fax: +58-2-9431645 Cel.: +58-16-234700 Where does this path lead? said Alice Depends on where you want to go. Said the cat (Alice in Wonderland, by Lewis Carroll.) -- This message was delayed because the list mail delivery agent was down.
Re: IMPORTANT: RSA Data Security Challenge participants please read
From: John T. Larkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Harvey Mudd should be producing somewhere between 3 and 4 M kps by tomarrow. Right now, most of us are running under [EMAIL PROTECTED], but we can change that if Bruce still disagrees with our possition. I asked the people at Zero to lump our points in with those for [EMAIL PROTECTED] . They are either doing that or just deleting our submissions from the log, I'm not sure. I was hoping to have the proxy set up first so you could also ask them to transfer the points to the www.debian.org machine and the debian.org domain. Would you ask them that, too? (when the proxy is running) Brian ( [EMAIL PROTECTED] ) --- Generated by Signify v1.01. For this and more, visit http://www.verisim.com/ -- This message was delayed because the list mail delivery agent was down.
Re: IMPORTANT: RSA Data Security Challenge participants please read
Bruce, don't spend all your time worrying about how Debian is going to be viewed by the rest of the Linux community. Uh, sorry, this is my job within the project. We've been really careful to maintain good relations with the other Linux distributions and free software producers. Messing them up over something so trivial as this just doesn't seem worth it. Bruce -- Bruce Perens K6BP [EMAIL PROTECTED] 510-215-3502 Finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP public key. PGP fingerprint = 88 6A 15 D0 65 D4 A3 A6 1F 89 6A 76 95 24 87 B3 -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: java for linux
Yes, its name is guavac. You can get it at both debian and MIT Thanks -- From: Seth Reinosa[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 1997 12:25 PM To: debian linux questions Subject: java for linux Is ther a compiler for java for linux? [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.eznet.net/~seth Thanx and may God Bless you Seth R -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Thu, 27 Feb 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, [iso-8859-1] Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote: If someone is going to evaluate an entire distribution on a prompt (even if there are other factors), I'm not going to be upset if they don't choose Debian. I'm no talking about just the prompt. We're talking about good and comfortable defaults, default settings should be like suggestions of how things can be done. Good defaults is very important in a distribution, IMHO. IMO, debian HAS good defaults. clean simple without a lot of stuff to undo when you want to customise it to YOUR preferred settings. Making default settings too pretty/complex tends to stifle both learning creativity...instead of just one thing to learn/change at a time, you have to undo a lot of changes (or at least learn what they do) or risk breaking a working setup. I wonder if it would be possible to make a package that included a good degree of the typical customizations? I have setup 3 debian machines right from the ftp server in the past month and there are things I change right off the bat, the prompt is one, the .inputrc (to include home/end keys) some of the aliases, enable color ls etc Stifling learning is one thing, but having to do the same setup again and again is pain -- which is why I wonder if a package could be made? Jason -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Life, The Universe Debian (was Re: Unstable vs. Stable)
On 24 Feb 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ed writes: ...once I had a working system of X/lesstif/latex/gcc and a lot of utils I couldn't see the point in upgrading. That's fine if you never intend to add any new packages. If you do, eventually you will be forced to upgrade do to changes in libc, the kernel, perl, etc. It is my understanding from what I've read on this list that it is pretty much impossible to upgrade an old installation like mine without re-installing. certainly not! upgrading from an old installation to the latest stable or unstable isn't as easy as it could should be but it is fairly straightforward. The worst you're likely to run into are dependancy problems. Brute-force repetition of Install followed by Config in dselect several times (until there are no errors reported) will get you through this. You'll get bored after the 3rd or 5th iteration of this, so then you'll want to know how to use dpkg. Just look on the dselect screen, make a note of which packages are failing because they depend on some other package which hasn't been installed yet, and install the dependancies by hand with dpkg. e.g. if several packages require the new libc and several others require the new perl, then exit to the shell prompt and (assuming you have a mirror or cd of debian mounted at /debian) type something like: cd /debian/unstable/binary-i386 (or cd /debian/stable/binary-i386) dpkg -i base/libc5_5.4.20-1.deb interpreters/perl_5.003.07-6.deb if these also fail because of dependancies (e.g. libc5 may need a newer ldso) then install them with dpkg too. Use 'ls' or 'find' to find out the exact filenames of the packages you want to install - most of them will be found in logically sensible directories (e.g. most libraries go in libs/, interpreters like perl go in interpreters/ etc) Once you've done that, run dselect and go through the automated Install again. If necessary, repeat the above until you get a clean (no errors) install. It's actually quite straight-forward and simple. All those error messages flashing by on the screen make it *look* far more serious a problem than it really is. The key thing to remember is DON'T PANIC! :-) (and always know where your towel is) Craig -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Thu, 27 Feb 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Yoav Cohen-Sivan wrote: Debian comes up in a much rawer form after install - for instance, no prompt beyond the basic # for root and $ for the user (RedHat gives you the now famous username /home/username$ prompt). # and $ are standard/expected prompts. if you want something different, customise it yourself. I think you are missing my point. I'm not just talking about the prompt or X11 or any other specific package, but the whole shabam. No, i'm not missing your point at all. I just happen to disagree with it. One of the things I *like* about debian is that it doesn't inflict anyone else's aesthetic tastes on me. I don't have to edit a lot of configuration files to undo some hideously garish display - it's plain and simple and I can uglify/prettify it according to my own personal (bad) taste rather than someone else's. I agree entirely with this. What might be nice is if there were mini howtos available on setting up some of the possible options. Say for instance color in an xterm. I have seen alot of traffic about this one (which I save for when I might actually get around to trying to set this up). Another example would be changing the prompt. Not everyone who installs Debian as a newbie knows how to do these things, and quite often what seems straight forward to the experienced *nix users is only that straight forward due to years of experience I am sure the required information is in the man pages, but sometimes you just don't know where to look. Unfortunately, this type of documentation generally doesn't sound like much fun to create (as if any type of documentation was ``fun'' to create). Scott -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Jason Gunthorpe wrote: On Thu, 27 Feb 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, [iso-8859-1] Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote: If someone is going to evaluate an entire distribution on a prompt (even if there are other factors), I'm not going to be upset if they don't choose Debian. I'm no talking about just the prompt. We're talking about good and comfortable defaults, default settings should be like suggestions of how things can be done. Good defaults is very important in a distribution, IMHO. IMO, debian HAS good defaults. clean simple without a lot of stuff to undo when you want to customise it to YOUR preferred settings. Making default settings too pretty/complex tends to stifle both learning creativity...instead of just one thing to learn/change at a time, you have to undo a lot of changes (or at least learn what they do) or risk breaking a working setup. I wonder if it would be possible to make a package that included a good degree of the typical customizations? I have setup 3 debian machines right from the ftp server in the past month and there are things I change right off the bat, the prompt is one, the .inputrc (to include home/end keys) some of the aliases, enable color ls etc The problem with this is that the defaults the package developer likes are unlikely to conform to the particular taste of every user. This sounds like a good option for an individual to create for their particular needs. Might be a neat idea... It would certainly speed the process up when doing installations on multiple machines. Stifling learning is one thing, but having to do the same setup again and again is pain -- which is why I wonder if a package could be made? Jason -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: IMPORTANT: RSA Data Security Challenge participants please
At 07:03 PM 25/02/97 PST, Bruce Perens wrote: It was OK for us to participate as [EMAIL PROTECTED] in the RSA Data Security Challenge as long as we didn't have any chance of beating the Linux group. It looks as if we do have a chance. It would be real How did [EMAIL PROTECTED] become _the_ Linux group? These guys don't even have a web server or actual hosts in their domain. Now if this address was tied to Linux International or maybe linux.org, then they might justifiably be considered a representative of the entire Linux community. But I don't see why the Debian group should subsume our participation in deference to George Shearer and his LAME Communications Corp. I will continue to run my one rc5 client with [EMAIL PROTECTED]. We are a hundred times more of ligitimate a Linux group; and it's fun being able to help get the word out on my favorite Linux distribution. Bruce, please reconsider your decision. Thanks. p.s. See InterNIC and DNS info at the end of this message. -- Carl Privitt / [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 817-778-7722 / SageNet Systems Administrator % whois linuxnet.org. LAME Communications Corp. (LINUXNET4-DOM) 7350 Capri Way Suite 7 Maineville, OH 45039 USA Domain Name: LINUXNET.ORG Administrative Contact, Technical Contact, Zone Contact: Shearer, George (GS206) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (513) 326-6000 (FAX) (513) 326-6030 Billing Contact: Shearer, George (GS206) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (513) 326-6000 (FAX) (513) 326-6030 Record last updated on 14-Nov-96. Record created on 31-Jul-96. Domain servers in listed order: DOCSWORKBOX.LAME.ORG 207.78.255.254 NS1.ONE.NET 206.112.192.104 NS2.ONE.NET 206.112.192.110 The InterNIC Registration Services Host contains ONLY Internet Information (Networks, ASN's, Domains, and POC's). Please use the whois server at nic.ddn.mil for MILNET Information. % dig @ns1.one.net. linuxnet.org. axfr ; DiG 2.2 @ns1.one.net. linuxnet.org. axfr ; (1 server found) linuxnet.org. 86400 SOA DocsWorkBox.LaMe.ORG. doc.Lame.ORG. ( 1996111401 ; serial 10800 ; refresh (3 hours) 3600; retry (1 hour) 604800 ; expire (7 days) 86400 ) ; minimum (1 day) linuxnet.org. 86400 NS DocsWorkBox.LaMe.ORG. linuxnet.org. 86400 NS NS1.ONE.NET. linuxnet.org. 86400 NS NS2.ONE.NET. linuxnet.org. 86400 MX 20 mail.one.net. linuxnet.org. 86400 MX 30 uucp.one.net. linuxnet.org. 86400 MX 10 DocsWorkBox.LaMe.ORG. irc.linuxnet.org. 86400 CNAME DocsDontGiveAShitBox.LaMe.ORG. linuxnet.org. 86400 SOA DocsWorkBox.LaMe.ORG. doc.Lame.ORG. ( 1996111401 ; serial 10800 ; refresh (3 hours) 3600; retry (1 hour) 604800 ; expire (7 days) 86400 ) ; minimum (1 day) ;; Received 9 answers (9 records). ;; FROM: granite to SERVER: 206.112.192.104 ;; WHEN: Wed Feb 26 19:38:04 1997 -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Scott Stanley wrote: On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Jason Gunthorpe wrote: On Thu, 27 Feb 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: I wonder if it would be possible to make a package that included a good degree of the typical customizations? I have setup 3 debian machines right from the ftp server in the past month and there are things I change right off the bat, the prompt is one, the .inputrc (to include home/end keys) some of the aliases, enable color ls etc The problem with this is that the defaults the package developer likes are unlikely to conform to the particular taste of every user. This sounds like a good option for an individual to create for their particular needs. Might be a neat idea... It would certainly speed the process up when doing installations on multiple machines. This is true, but the installation of the package is up to the Debian user, it's not forced, there could even be multiple conflicting packages with conflicting UI styles : Encourage a 'learn by example' type of approach. Jason -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Jason Gunthorpe wrote: On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Scott Stanley wrote: On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Jason Gunthorpe wrote: On Thu, 27 Feb 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: I wonder if it would be possible to make a package that included a good degree of the typical customizations? I have setup 3 debian machines right from the ftp server in the past month and there are things I change right off the bat, the prompt is one, the .inputrc (to include home/end keys) some of the aliases, enable color ls etc The problem with this is that the defaults the package developer likes are unlikely to conform to the particular taste of every user. This sounds like a good option for an individual to create for their particular needs. Might be a neat idea... It would certainly speed the process up when doing installations on multiple machines. This is true, but the installation of the package is up to the Debian user, it's not forced, there could even be multiple conflicting packages with conflicting UI styles : Encourage a 'learn by example' type of approach. Several conflicting packages might work... But it is easy to install a package and still not learn anything about how these defaults are actually set up (or what files were even added to the system for that matter.) This would significantly speed up setting up a system, but will only promote learning if the changes are brought to the installers attention. If an explanation of how the defaults were set was placed in /usr/doc as part of the package, this might be work (I am sure there is a good way to find out what files are included in a package without this documentation, but that brings another variable into the learning curve) Scott -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: pine produces segmentation faults (fwd)
On 26 Feb 1997, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
Hi,
Bruce == Bruce Perens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
From William Chow [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Time to RTFM, there, Corey.
Bruce That's RTM on this list, please.
What, You don't think our manuals are Fine? ;-)
manoj
--
void read_the_f_cking_manual(void)
{
char RTFM[] = Read the fine manual;
cout Hello, this the the polite and censored helper edition endl;
cout Please RTFM endl;
}
main()
{
while (1)
{
read_the_f_cking_manual();
}
}
:w! help.cc
$ g++ -g -o help.cc
$ help
On my system, the above chain of commands will invariably produce a
segfault because my machine refuses to allocate memory properly to RTFM.
Other sensitivity issues will also be catted to /dev/null :^)
Good day, brucy,
Will
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Re: IMPORTANT: RSA Data Security Challenge participants please read
Bruce, I feel I have to reply after reading some follow ups, including yours. It was OK for us to participate as [EMAIL PROTECTED] in the RSA Data Security Challenge as long as we didn't have any chance of beating the Linux group. It looks as if we do have a chance. It would be real Well Bruce, with all due respect, have you looked at the numbers? This linux group has been participating for 150 hours. We ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) have been participating for about 110... but they have 10 times the keyblocks! Doesn't that tell you something? I don't think there's a real chance of beating them. embarassing to beat them. So please, if you are participating, change your reporting address to [EMAIL PROTECTED] NOW. I have asked the statistics-keepers to add the figure for [EMAIL PROTECTED] to that for [EMAIL PROTECTED] . I'll change it as soon as someone explains to me what the heck is linuxnet. It's not linux.org. They don't have a web server, and a simple search using AltaVista reveals this is some sort of IRC network based on linux servers. They are NOT Linux. On the other hand I know what debian.org is... well, maybe. Isn't Debian about group collaboration worldwide? That's what the controversial press release said. I think THIS is worldwide collaboration. A LOT of people willing to put machine time to make a POLITICAL STATEMENT. The money? I don't care about it. If I'd care about the prize I'll be running the thing under [EMAIL PROTECTED] who knows? I may get lucky. But that's not it. I beleive in the Debian Project, and I prefer Debian over RedHat and others because of it's users (along with many incredible features it has)! If one of the machines I administer turns out to find the correct answer, I'm donating the money to Debian/FSF/Linux. You have made some really good bad-points about what the people may perceive about Debian if it wins. But I think we can make some really good good-points if that happens. We are not trying to beat Linux. We ARE (part of) Linux. We are Debian/GNU Linux. We are NOT RedHat/Slackware/whatever. We like them, but we are not them. Please reconsider. Marcelo Magallon -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Free Publicity via the RC5 Challenge
Also, with linuxnet at approx 70MKeys/sec and debian at about 10, we don't really have any chance of overtaking them. We could have overtaken them, for two reasons: 1. MKeys/sec is a misleading number. I was running 30 process on one computer in order to upload them with one ppp connection. Because the processes are many, all of them have an ultra low keys/sec count. Most users have ppp, I know other people who do run 16 processes at night. Users like me cause a low Keys/sec count. It is the keySpaces/day that really counts. linuxnet had only a 4.5 higher keySpace/day count. 2. We just started 3 days ago, that's not enough time to estimate our strength. People are still looking for client, others have not read the debian-user for 3 days. We were not yet ready to race. Once the race got intresting, I would have been motivated enough to masquerade three other computers. Users like me, are very important. We may not control 40 computers, but for sure, we will be searching for keys every day. Lots of would, and would, yes I know the song. I my opinion, linuxnet was in big trouble. Ioannis Tambouras [EMAIL PROTECTED], West Palm Beach, Florida Signed pgp-key on key server. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: 2.1* kernels
Herbert == Herbert Xu [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Herbert Bruce Perens wrote: I haven't had time to maintain AX.25 lately. I tried 2.1.x on my home system a few weeks ago, and IP forwarding appeared to be broken. Herbert It's not broken. You need to enable it by Herbert echo 1 /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forwarding May I ask where I can read about that sort of thing? The proc directory is a mystery. Karl M. Hegbloom [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.inetarena.com/~karlheg Debian GNU 1.2 Linux 2.0.29t
Re: Package configuration philosophy
On Thu, 27 Feb 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: So start by learning what you need to know to have a nicer setup. If you dont have the time to trace through all the documentation to find out exactly what needs to be done, then at least skim the docs to get an overview of how it works and ask specific how do I questions on debian-user. not only will it be more satisfying to have done it by yourself (with or without help from the mailing lists), but you'll also learn a lot faster as you will have the positive reinforcement of seeing the changes you make actually have an affect on the system. You WON'T get that if it's all spoon-fed to you. I personally think that this is very wrong. The classic `UNIX is for real men, so read all the F. man's, and howtos, etc'. I think that we should try to aim at the normal desktop user, not only the developers. Not only can the developers always changes whatever cames preconfigured, but it's also more instructive to have a good example. (I can learn more about customizing prompts with a `PS1=.\\$' than from a `' =) ). With good defaults, one can often adapt and reconfigure just without even looking the manpages. Don't think only at the developer. Think at one poor guy that works in an ISP with Linux, he doesn't programm in C, he don't like to read manuals. He's never touched an X resource. And he will never change its RedHat system... guess why... Nicolás Lichtmaier.- [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Why is PPP so screwed up!?!?!
Well, I've been working with Debian systems for over a year now and I've been able to get it to dial into my ISP about three times. Each time, I had to use route to make the default gateway to be the ip that I could get with ifconfig. EVERY person I've talked to who has tried getting dial-up ppp going on Debian has approached it like a heavyweight fighter preparing for a title fight. They spend a few days just mentally preparing for the ordeal. Then, when they finally DO get it working, I usually get some jubilant e-mail from them... something along the lines of Hey man!!! I actually got PPP going!. One of these people was a coworker I see often. He got it all working about two weeks ago. Then, his roommate had to use the modem so he unhooked the connection for a while. To this day, the coworker has not been able to reproduce the ONLY success he's ever had with ppp. So, today, I resolved to put this nonsense to rest. Being the local Debian guru, I told this coworker that I would figure out all of the changes that needed to be done to the base distribution in order to do get everything working smoothly. Now, having heard that you're supposed to be able to just edit /etc/ppp.chatscript and make a ppp_on_boot file, I figured I'd try that first. This is my saga: I editted /etc/ppp.chatscript to properly log into the dial-in server. Since /etc/ppp.options_out made reference to /dev/modem, I went to /dev and make a symlink from modem to ttyS0. (I know I could have edited the options file, but I wanted to leave the stock config files as pristine as possible to illustrate how screwed up the whole setup is). I moved the no_ppp_on_boot to ppp_on_boot. Lastly, I edited /etc/modules to include serial and ppp (although kerneld would probably load them on demand anyway... again, I wanted to roll out the red carpet for ppp). Then, I rebooted... The system started up... started pppd and the modem began dialing. I watched the whole show by periodically doing tail /var/log/messages. Chatscript logged in fine and started ppp on the other end. Then, the system hung up the phone. /var/log/messages reported Cannot determine ethernet address for proxy ARP. This is because proxyarp is uncommented /etc/ppp/options. Why? Beats me. So, to fix this error, I added -proxyarp to /etc/ppp.options_out and gave it a go again This time, /var/log/messages recorded that pppd received the local and remote IP addresses. I will refer to them as remoteIP and localIP. (As well as showing that the AppleTalk and IPX drivers had become aware of the connection, apparently). So, I tried pinging remoteIP and not a single packet came back (although I could see them getting sent out on the modem by watching the lights). Pinging localIP went fine, but didn't use the modem. Pinging anywhere on the server's network other than localIP. Doing an ifconfig (which paused for about 45 seconds... I've never had that happen before) showed the proper local and remote IP's for interface ppp0. Then, route -n reported: (Keep in mind that I'm using remoteIP and localIP in place of the real ones for easier reading...) Destination Gateway Genmask Flags Met Ref Use Iface remoteIP 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 UH 0 0 0 ppp0 127.0.0.1 0.0.0.0 255.0.0.0 U0 0 1 lo 0.0.0.0 remoteIP 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 ppp0 Which *seems* okay. I was a little concerned about not seeing a default in there, but route add default remoteIP metric 1, but that didn't cause anything new to show up in route -n. Lastly, after a couple minutes, the connection will drop, with /var/log/messages reporting: Excessive lack of response to LCP echo frames. Now, before you say that my dial-in server is messed up, let me point out that I'm able to dial into it with Win95 without incident. The server is a Debian box running a modem pool. Also, I tried dialing into a Cisco terminal server and all I got was Could not determine local IP address. Again, I don't have this problem with Win95. So, I have a few questions: 1 - Why is PPP this screwed up? Even if the ppp_on_boot thing *did* work, why is there no mention of it in the instal program? There are a lot of people out there who install Debian on their home systems and need to use ppp in order to add/update packages via ftp. Shouldn't a little more effort be made to make this a little simpler? I don't know of ANYONE who looks forward to attempting ppp on Linux without a sense of dread. 2 - How can I fix it in the short term? Does anyone know what I can do to be able to see the remote network? 3 - I think I'm resigned to the fact that this figgin' ppp catastrophe isn't going to get fixed unless I do it myself. I'm tenatively planning on writing a set of scripts and ppp.options files to allow people to easily configure their system as a dial-in server or as a home machine that dials into an ISP.
Quake 1.01 vs 1.06
Joey, I'm a bit confused about your debian quake packaging. When I first installed the debian quake (1.01), it wouldn't run with my DOS lib that I patched to the 1.06 level. I think we even exchanged email about it. Anyway, along comes a debian quake lib 1.06, but no new quake itself. And, the dependencies in the quake lib talk about squake (= 1.06) | xquake (= 1.06) It's as if maybe a new quake-1.06 debian file got lost? I run my mirror from ftp.debian.org. Here's an ls of debian/non-free: -rw-r--r-- 1 102481608 26014 Jan 13 04:48 pstotext_1.5-1.deb lrwxrwxrwx 1 102481608 36 Feb 12 04:56 quake-lib-stub_1.2.deb - ../binary-all/quake-lib-stub_1.2.deb -rw-r--r-- 1 102481608 8614798 Feb 8 03:09 quake-lib_1.06-1.deb -rw-r--r-- 1 102481608 325354 Jan 4 22:18 quake_1.01-4.deb -rw-r--r-- 1 102481608 44968 Dec 5 12:15 rel_1.3-1.deb Any ideas? ...RickM... -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
my zipper is stuck
how do I uncompress a progam that says guavac-0.2.5-linuxelf-bin.tar.gz [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.eznet.net/~seth Thanx and may God Bless you Seth R -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Package configuration philosophy
Joey == Joey Hess [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Joey So when I installed debian, I was pleasantly suprised to Joey find all these packages prompting me for configuration Joey information in their postinst scripts, and I ended up with a Joey working system with all the necessary daemons configured Joey much faster than I expected. Joey I do notice that all the counterexamples I gave are for Joey daemons, not the interactive programs like X and fvwm that a Joey new user is going to be faced with. You you may well be Joey right about debian catering to the more technical crowd. But Joey with new additions like the debian menu system and so on, I Joey see debian stating to provide easier configuration for the Joey interactive stuff as well. X windows customizations and prompt settings are much easier things for a newbie to learn to do than sendmail configuration, magicfilter and printcap setup, networking, ppp, diald, ... the list goes on, I can only imagine. It doesn't take as much expertise and knowledge to make the simple customizations as it does to configure all that other stuff about thingies that DOS never heard of. If things are not explicitly mentioned, a neophite may never discover them. The main thing would be to make the documantation easily accessable with a pointer to it's location, and a suggested reading order. Where do I begin? What should I read? What exists? Dwww provides a good way to get started reading; but how did I get dwww up and running if I need newbie documantation? Many will need to be bootstrapped. I've found that Midnight Commander is a wonderful tool for browsing /usr/doc, and I think it's really cool how it formats man pages and .html documents. It can see inside .deb packages too! Nifty. It compliments dselect fairly well. I really like the way the fvwm2 configuration is done, with the multiple files and hooks. I learned a lot from that. It will be interesting to see how a configuration GUI program can create menu files and suchlike. Will it use m4? I want to learn that. And I like the tip-of-the-login idea; It could use a 'fortunes' database, and maybe xmessage, sysnews, or motd??? Karl M. Hegbloom [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.inetarena.com/~karlheg Debian GNU 1.2 Linux 2.0.29t
Re. Why is PPP so screwed up
For what it's worth, I got PPP up and going in about 5 minutes. ae ppp.option_out, ae ppp.chatscript and ae resolv.conf. No problem, and this was my first time ever dealing with linux. Once I get comfortable with it, I'm going to try WABI so I can put debian on this laptop. Matthew K. Lung Wake Forest School of Law [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: my zipper is stuck
To view the containts do: $ tar -zvtf guavac-0.2.5-linuxelf-bin.tar.gz To untar it do: $ tar -zxpvf guavac-0.2.5-linuxelf-bin.tar.gz Ioannis Tambouras [EMAIL PROTECTED], West Palm Beach, Florida Signed pgp-key on key server. On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Seth Reinosa wrote: how do I uncompress a progam that says guavac-0.2.5-linuxelf-bin.tar.gz [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://home.eznet.net/~seth Thanx and may God Bless you Seth R -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Quake 1.01 vs 1.06
RM == Rick Macdonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: RM Joey, I'm a bit confused about your debian quake packaging. RM When I first installed the debian quake (1.01), it wouldn't run RM with my DOS lib that I patched to the 1.06 level. I think we RM even exchanged email about it. RM Anyway, along comes a debian quake lib 1.06, but no new quake RM itself. There ARE new squake/xquake packages. They've been sitting in Incoming on master since quake-lib_1.06-1 showed up. Anyone know why they haven't moved into the main tree? -Larry -- Larry Daffner| Linux: Unleash the workstation in your PC! [EMAIL PROTECTED] / http://web2.airmail.net/vizzie/ The experimenter who does not know what he is looking for will not understand what he finds. --Claude Bernard -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: pine produces segmentation faults (fwd)
I cna dig the whole $user/.xinitrc but everythin was fine last week . . the machine was up and running for about a month also I only ran X as root as a test On Wed, 26 Feb 1997, Corey Allert wrote: also Xfree86 doesn't run properly .. . it will as root but as any other user X starts as if no window manager is set . . and typing startx -exec fvwm2 will bring up the correct gui but there is no command prompt in the xterm . . . freaky eh?? Time to RTFM, there, Corey. I suggest a good X book, i.e. X User's Guide by O'Reilly (volume 3 in the X series.) The reason why this isn't working is because your users don't have a ..xinitrc that contains a windows manager. Suggest you build a skeleton directory with a proper .xinitrc file, or edit the systemwide xinitrc to include a standard WM. As for the xterm bit, you're probably getting weird behaviour because the xterm probably doesn't have an attached to it in whatever startup file you have Probably also your systemwide xinitrc doesn't have th proper read permissions if your root directory contains no ..xinitrc file. Finally, you shouldn't be running X as root. This is probably in a FAQ. Will -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Quake 1.01 vs 1.06
Larry 'Daffy' Daffner:
There ARE new squake/xquake packages. They've been sitting in
Incoming on master since quake-lib_1.06-1 showed up. Anyone know why
they haven't moved into the main tree?
I don't know. I've gotten this reported by dozens of users. I've had a bug
report filed on quake about it. I've mailed Guy and tried to get some
explination, and it still sits there in incoming. It was uploaded on Feb
7th, I believe.
I uploaded a new version of quake 1.06 today, to fix a bug, and hopefully
get it processed and moved out of Incoming. I hope that it gets processed
within the next few days.
--
#!/bin/perl -sp0777iX+d*lMLa^*lN%0]dsXx++lMlN/dsM0j]dsj # RSA-3-lines-perl
$/=unpack('H*',$_);$_=`echo 16dio\U$kSK$/SM$n\EsN0p[lN*1 # Joey Hess
lK[d2%Sa2/d0$^Ixp|dc`;s/\W//g;$_=pack('H*',/((..)*)$/) # [EMAIL PROTECTED]
How appropriate, you fight like a cow. - - Guybrush Threepwood
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From: Manoj Srivastava [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 26 Feb 1997 23:57:44 -0600
In-Reply-To: Mark Eichin's message of 26 Feb 1997 22:17:00 -0500
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Hi,
Mark == Mark Eichin [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
This may be a simplification. Have you looked at the hoops one has
to go through to achieve this goal? Do we really expect the
Mark The list you mention isn't particularly relevant -- if a package
Mark specifically only works on one and not the other, then it should
Mark depend on one or the other, oh well. However, there are ways of
Mark handling these portably, and any big elisp packages worth
Mark packaging do, in fact, handle all of those -- gnus, w3, calc...
Mark I'm trying to make it *easier* for the debian-maintainer, not
Mark harder :-)
OK. I misunderstood your initial statement:
Mark-Old There are no plans to solve this non-problem :-) The high
Mark-Old level goal is that any package that depends on emacs works
Mark-Old with any and all of them. We should be able to accomplish
Mark-Old this.
My contention was merely that package maintainers should not be
the ones to attempt to accomplish this laudable goal; because in some
cases this would take extra-ordinary effort. (I'm not sure I have the
requisite skill either).
I'm glad we agree about the rest ;-).
manoj
--
The Diabolonian position is new to the London playgoer of today, but
not to lovers of serious literature. From Prometheus to the
Wagnerian Siegfried, some enemy of the gods, unterrified champion of
those oppressed by them, has always towered among the heroes of the
loftiest poetry. Shaw, On Diabolonian Ethics
Manoj Srivastava url:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Mobile, Alabama USAurl:http://www.datasync.com/%7Esrivasta/
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To: Mark Eichin [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Subject: Re: XEmacs, Emacs and elisp
In-reply-to: Your message of 26 Feb 1997 14:00:41 EST.
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Date: Wed, 26 Feb 1997 22:22:45 -0800
From: Philippe Troin [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] said:
I'm working on this issue right now with the current (new) xemacs
maintainer. We've already got the conflicts straightened out, we're
working on the byte-compiler issue. Anyone out there actually
installed both on a site before, and know how compatible the *really*
are from experience, rather than from theory? (Or have an xemacs doc
ref
xmcd and internet database servers.
Anybody got xmcd working? Any sign of a package? I would appear that xmcd has the advantage over Workman in that it works with servers to get playlists etc. -- Where's my spy camera? -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
