Re: transfer disk

[mick crane]

On 2018-04-10 04:48, Ben Caradoc-Davies wrote:

On 10/04/18 14:01, mick crane wrote:

hello,
Can you pop a hard disk that boots with a Debian installation on it 
into another entirely different PC and will the kernel try to make 
sense of its new hardware ?

mick


Mostly. I once had a disk that often moved between a desktop and
laptop. If the architecture is compatible (e.g. not amd64 <-> arm64)
then most likely it can be made to work. Common things that require
fixing:

- Disk uses Legacy (BIOS) boot and partitioning but support is not
enabled on the motherboard. Fix: turn on your motherboard
Compatibility Support Module or similar.

- Disk uses UEFI but ancient motherboard does not support it. 
Unfixable.


- Disk uses UEFI. Motherboard supports UEFI but has no boot entry and
disk may need to be manually selected. Running update-grub should fix.

- Motherboard has secure boot enabled and is password locked. Fixable
if you can unlock it.

- Failed boot because the kernel or graphics drivers do not like your
new hardware. Supply fallback options at the command line, like noapic
etc.

- Anyone using ancient kernels with Skylake or later is going to have
a bad time. A recent kernel should improve compatibility.

- Hardcoded device paths in /etc/fstab might need to be changed. Most
installers use UUIDs for portability.

- You might find yourself with no network, especially no wifi. If your
new hardware is supported (e.g. by non-free), get the .debs you need
on a thumb drive and install them.

It is usually safe to have unused drivers so feel free to plan ahead
and install all drivers you need before you migrate.

Kind regards,


thanks guys for scenarios, looks hopeful.

mick


--
Key ID4BFEBB31

Re: transfer disk

[Felix Miata]

mick crane composed on 2018-04-10 03:01 (UTC+0100):

> Can you pop a hard disk that boots with a Debian installation on it into 
> another entirely different PC and will the kernel try to make sense of 
> its new hardware ?

IME, if the chipset and CPU are Intel, it doesn't matter how new or old, booting
will be possible even with a minimal module set in the initrd. Xorg may or may
not work without a newer kernel or driver version, but it won't prevent booting.
Ethernet may or may not work, but simple reconfiguration for the different MAC
address usually fixes that. I have nothing using Wireless, so can't speak to
that. I've done this Intel to Intel type of transplant many times.

Putting a disk from an Intel system into a system with AMD, VIA or GeForce
chipset is almost certain to fail unless the initrd includes most drivers. This
leads me to believe that a minimal module set initrd created on one chipset type
and tried on any other chipset type is mostly likely doomed. However, when the
disk can be prepared in advance to ensure most modules are included in the
initrd, then the transplant should boot regardless, and only network and Xorg
and/or Wayland might need manual reconfiguration.
-- 
"Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Whatever else you
get, get wisdom." Proverbs 4:7 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: transfer disk

[David Wright]

On Tue 10 Apr 2018 at 03:01:56 (+0100), mick crane wrote:
> Can you pop a hard disk that boots with a Debian installation on it
> into another entirely different PC and will the kernel try to make
> sense of its new hardware ?

Yes, I used to build a system in one box and then install the drive in
another. This was in the days before initramfs; now you should make
sure you have   MODULES=most   in /etc/initramfs-tools/initramfs.conf
when (re)making it. I can't speak for BIOS/UEFI differences as my only
UEFI is a laptop.

Cheers,
David.

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 21:25:34 David Christensen wrote:

> On 04/09/18 07:30, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Monday 09 April 2018 09:51:37 Greg Wooledge wrote:
> >> On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 09:46:07AM -0400, rhkra...@gmail.com
> >>
> >> wrote:
> >>> To your original problem, have you tried going to a command line
> >>> and throwing in a couple =sync=s?  I would try that, maybe after
> >>> saving in your editor, and again maybe after open and / or saving
> >>> in the cnc program.
> >>
> >> As others have explained, the OS (Linux) keeps a cache of file
> >> contents that have been written by applications, but not yet
> >> committed to permanent storage.  If you "save" from within the text
> >> editor, then the saved contents should be immediately visible to
> >> other processes reading the file, regardless of whether it has been
> >> synced to disk. They'll simply get the cached version.
> >
> > Which is not happening after several hours and a hundred or more
> > edits. Which is why its so intermittent.
>
> On 04/09/18 02:53, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > Lots of people seem to like gedit, but its saves are the cause of
> > important configuration files being written back to disk with the
> > line order totally trashed, as if you had thrown it on the floor in
> > 512 byte pieces, then picked it back up and reassembled it in random
> > order. Then try to recover a 1400 LOC configuration file...
> >
> > Thats happened using gedit enough, on several different machines ...
>
> One editor failing would also make me suspect the editor.
>
>
> But two failing editors would make me suspect some common factor, such
> as a shared library and/or the kernel.
>
I'd buy that if the failures were similar.  They are not.
>
> Have you tested your hardware -- power supply, memory, and SSD?  Be
> sure to test the SSD before you touch any cables.  If it fails,
> re-seat and/or replace cables and test again.

I saw this once when the drive was a 2T piece of spinning rust. Way 
overkill for that machine, but a 1T is being used for amanda, here on 
this machine and its around 90% right now.  So at some 
point "/amandatapes" is going to find another terabyte.
>
> Have you tested your SSD hypothesis?  Say, by removing the SSD,
> cloning the SSD to another device, installing the other device, and
> then testing for the bug while running the other device?

I have a twin to that one, but only one handy sata port. So it would be 
an extended project to clone it to the other drive.  And since I saw it 
on spinning rust too, I'm not inclined to sharpen that finger just yet.

That machine has also ran about 7 cycles of memtest86 with no errors 
since I noticed it the first time.

> Can you reproduce the bug on hardware with ECC memory with no memory
> errors reported?

I don't have anything with ECC memory in it. That usually runs the mobo 
cost up quite a ways.

> Can you reproduce the bug on RAID1 with no RAID errors reported?

That would also demand another handy sata port.  I'll see if I can cobble 
something up if and when it does it again. Possible if it has a back 
panel sata connector I think.
>
> If you want to make it possible for others to find the bug, I would
> suggest:
>
> 1.  Build a machine with the minimum hardware, software, and
> configuration required to demonstrate the bug.  Document everything.
>
> 2.  Write a program or script that invokes the bug every time it runs
> on the demonstration machine.  If a program, include a Makefile.
>
> 3.  Post the demonstrator document, program, script, Makefile, etc.,
> to the relevant support communities.
>
> David

Thanks David.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: transfer disk

[Ben Caradoc-Davies]

On 10/04/18 14:01, mick crane wrote:

hello,
Can you pop a hard disk that boots with a Debian installation on it into 
another entirely different PC and will the kernel try to make sense of 
its new hardware ?

mick


Mostly. I once had a disk that often moved between a desktop and laptop. 
If the architecture is compatible (e.g. not amd64 <-> arm64) then most 
likely it can be made to work. Common things that require fixing:


- Disk uses Legacy (BIOS) boot and partitioning but support is not 
enabled on the motherboard. Fix: turn on your motherboard Compatibility 
Support Module or similar.


- Disk uses UEFI but ancient motherboard does not support it. Unfixable.

- Disk uses UEFI. Motherboard supports UEFI but has no boot entry and 
disk may need to be manually selected. Running update-grub should fix.


- Motherboard has secure boot enabled and is password locked. Fixable if 
you can unlock it.


- Failed boot because the kernel or graphics drivers do not like your 
new hardware. Supply fallback options at the command line, like noapic etc.


- Anyone using ancient kernels with Skylake or later is going to have a 
bad time. A recent kernel should improve compatibility.


- Hardcoded device paths in /etc/fstab might need to be changed. Most 
installers use UUIDs for portability.


- You might find yourself with no network, especially no wifi. If your 
new hardware is supported (e.g. by non-free), get the .debs you need on 
a thumb drive and install them.


It is usually safe to have unused drivers so feel free to plan ahead and 
install all drivers you need before you migrate.


Kind regards,

--
Ben Caradoc-Davies 
Director
Transient Software Limited 
New Zealand

Re: transfer disk

[Roberto C . Sánchez]

On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 03:01:56AM +0100, mick crane wrote:
> hello,
> Can you pop a hard disk that boots with a Debian installation on it into
> another entirely different PC and will the kernel try to make sense of its
> new hardware ?
> 
Sometimes "yes," sometimes "no". It depends on a variety of factors.
With additional details on the hardware involved (CPU, memory,
motherboard, expansion cards, etc.), someone might be able to give a
more definitive answer.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez

transfer disk

[mick crane]

hello,
Can you pop a hard disk that boots with a Debian installation on it into 
another entirely different PC and will the kernel try to make sense of 
its new hardware ?


mick
--
Key ID4BFEBB31

Re: I can't expand the Debian-partition

[David Christensen]

On 04/09/18 06:04, Gdsi wrote:

Hi all.
After copying a bulk files I felt the limitation of Debian-partition, and decided expand 
it, as a space on disk was. The partitions on disk placed so: sda2-Debian, sda3-swap.  I 
deleted the sda3-swap, and expand sda2-Debian, and create swap again.  I used 
"parted" with terminal. After all 'parted' and 'fdisk' are seeing increasing 
sda2-Debian and sda3-swap, but graphical file manager 'Thunar' don't seeing increasing 
sda2-Debian (i.e. its status-bar expose Free space: 733,9 MB) the size was before all 
changes .Besides this in the booting time are doing the check of disk, duration is 2 
min.If I execute:

---/home/user# fdisk /dev/sda--

there appear:

-Changes will remain in memory only, until you decide to write them.
Be careful before using the write command--

But after attempts executes  command  write:

---Command (m for help): w
The partition table has been altered.
Calling ioctl() to re-read partition table.
Re-reading the partition table failed.: Device or resource busy.
The kernel still uses the old table. The new table will be used at the next 
reboot or after you run partprobe(8) or kpartx(8)-
I don't know what may do. Give me any advices, please.


Run the following commands as root.  Cut and paste both the commands and 
their output to a reply:


# fdisk -l /dev/sda

# parted /dev/sda u s p free


David

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[David Christensen]

On 04/09/18 07:30, Gene Heskett wrote:

On Monday 09 April 2018 09:51:37 Greg Wooledge wrote:


On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 09:46:07AM -0400, rhkra...@gmail.com
wrote:

To your original problem, have you tried going to a command line
and throwing in a couple =sync=s?  I would try that, maybe after
saving in your editor, and again maybe after open and / or saving
in the cnc program.


As others have explained, the OS (Linux) keeps a cache of file 
contents that have been written by applications, but not yet

committed to permanent storage.  If you "save" from within the text
editor, then the saved contents should be immediately visible to
other processes reading the file, regardless of whether it has been
synced to disk. They'll simply get the cached version.


Which is not happening after several hours and a hundred or more
edits. Which is why its so intermittent.


On 04/09/18 02:53, Gene Heskett wrote:

Lots of people seem to like gedit, but its saves are the cause of
important configuration files being written back to disk with the
line order totally trashed, as if you had thrown it on the floor in
512 byte pieces, then picked it back up and reassembled it in random
order. Then try to recover a 1400 LOC configuration file...

Thats happened using gedit enough, on several different machines ...


One editor failing would also make me suspect the editor.


But two failing editors would make me suspect some common factor, such 
as a shared library and/or the kernel.



Have you tested your hardware -- power supply, memory, and SSD?  Be sure 
to test the SSD before you touch any cables.  If it fails, re-seat 
and/or replace cables and test again.



Have you tested your SSD hypothesis?  Say, by removing the SSD, cloning 
the SSD to another device, installing the other device, and then testing 
for the bug while running the other device?



Can you reproduce the bug on hardware with ECC memory with no memory 
errors reported?



Can you reproduce the bug on RAID1 with no RAID errors reported?


If you want to make it possible for others to find the bug, I would suggest:

1.  Build a machine with the minimum hardware, software, and 
configuration required to demonstrate the bug.  Document everything.


2.  Write a program or script that invokes the bug every time it runs on 
the demonstration machine.  If a program, include a Makefile.


3.  Post the demonstrator document, program, script, Makefile, etc., to 
the relevant support communities.



David

Re: hdmi from cable box in a Linux window?

[Felix Miata]

John Conover composed on 2018-04-09 16:14 (UTC-0700):
> 
> Is there a good way of getting hdmi from a cable TV box into a window
> on the Linux screen? Anyone done it?

> BTW, my NTSC->xawtv and an old Hauppauge card works fine, but the NTSC
> is being discontinued by my provider. I need a replacement.

If by "old Hauppage card" you mean a PC device to accept NTSC composite imput,
then use a device like:
https://www.zapals.com/mini-hdmi-to-av-converter-hdmi-to-rca-converter-adapter-with-usb-cable.html
or a more expensive one that has its own power supply or a wall wart. I think
mine cost around $30 5 or more years ago.
-- 
"Wisdom is supreme; therefore get wisdom. Whatever else you
get, get wisdom." Proverbs 4:7 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: mate-panel segfault

[songbird]

Liam O'Toole wrote:
>songbird wrote:
...
>>   i wish i had better answers for you than to suggest
>> upgrade.  so many changes have been made to MATE since
>> 1.16...  i'm not sure if the MATE devs would even get 
>> into trying to debug.
>
> Just to elaborate on that, MATE 1.18 is available in stretch-backports.
>
> https://packages.debian.org/stretch-backports/x11/mate-desktop-environment

  an excellent option as would be 1.20 if it ever gets
backported...  i didn't think anyone was working on
MATE backports so didn't even look.


  songbird

hdmi from cable box in a Linux window?

[John Conover]

Is there a good way of getting hdmi from a cable TV box into a window
on the Linux screen? Anyone done it?

Thanks,

John

BTW, my NTSC->xawtv and an old Hauppauge card works fine, but the NTSC
is being discontinued by my provider. I need a replacement.

-- 

John Conover, cono...@rahul.net, http://www.johncon.com/

Re: mate-panel segfault

[Liam O'Toole]

On 2018-04-09, songbird  wrote:
> Greg Marks wrote:
> ...
>> (The instruction pointer and the stack pointer values will vary,
>> as you'd expect.)  I am running Debian 9, Linux kernel 4.6.0-1-amd64
>> x86_64, with MATE 1.16.2 desktop; my computer has a PNY Quadro K620
>> 2GB Video Card and is running libdrm-nouveau2 version 2.4.74-1 and
>> xserver-xorg-video-nouveau version 1:1.0.13-3.
>>
>> Can anyone suggest what causes this issue and how to prevent it?
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Greg Marks
>
>   i wish i had better answers for you than to suggest
> upgrade.  so many changes have been made to MATE since
> 1.16...  i'm not sure if the MATE devs would even get 
> into trying to debug.
>
>
>   songbird

Just to elaborate on that, MATE 1.18 is available in stretch-backports.

https://packages.debian.org/stretch-backports/x11/mate-desktop-environment

Re: mate-panel segfault

[Liam O'Toole]

On 2018-04-09, Greg Marks  wrote:
> I've been having a minor but mildly annoying problem.  From time to
> time, the entire MATE desktop will flash, and all open windows remain
> open; however, the order in which their tabs appear in the bottom
> panel is randomly rearranged.  So, if I have 13 terminal windows open,
> I can no longer quickly bring the one I want to the front until I've
> arranged them back in the order in which I had them.  I think this
> only affects the Workspace I have open (but can't be completely
> certain).  It happens fairly infrequently.
>
> When this happens, I've discovered /var/log/syslog contains a message
> like this:
>
> debian kernel: [605512.613750] mate-panel[3844]:
> segfault at 1 ip 7f5c90049823 sp 7ffc68f6b6f0
> error 4 in libgtk-3.so.0.2200.11[7f5c8fca1000+70]
>
> (The instruction pointer and the stack pointer values will vary, as
> you'd expect.)  I am running Debian 9, Linux kernel 4.6.0-1-amd64
> x86_64, with MATE 1.16.2 desktop; my computer has a PNY Quadro K620
> 2GB Video Card and is running libdrm-nouveau2 version 2.4.74-1 and
> xserver-xorg-video-nouveau version 1:1.0.13-3.
>
> Can anyone suggest what causes this issue and how to prevent it?
>
> Best regards, Greg Marks
>

It looks very much like this bug:

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=884648

Re: install printer

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 15:45:34 Brian wrote:

> On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 15:32:05 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Monday 09 April 2018 15:18:38 Brian wrote:
> > > On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 05:55:04 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > > > On Monday 09 April 2018 03:24:40 mess-mate wrote:
> > > > > Hi,
> > > > > howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> > > > > Cups seems installed but what next.
> > > > > regards
> > > >
> > > > All of the setup tools are available by pointing your browser at
> > > > localhost:631.
> > >
> > > Depends on what you mean by "setup tools". The OP would be out of
> > > luck if printer-driver-hpcups was not installed.
> >
> > Your view is wider than mine, which only has x86 and r-pi stuff to
> > contend with. And ATM, I have no epson or hp printers. All connected
> > to this machine or at an ip address, and advertized by this cops
> > install, so all I've had to do to make them all usable from any
> > machine here is install the cups client and tell it to browse the
> > local net ip block.
> >
> > I should learn from Andy Capp, and just shaddup. :)
>
> Not really. It would be a poorer debian-user without well-intentioned
> engagement.

Maybe so, Brian, but in cases like this it would improve the overall 
quality of the answers. And that more often than not, is desirable.

IMNSHO of course...



-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: install printer

[Dan Purgert]

Brian wrote:
> On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 10:23:07 -, Dan Purgert wrote:
>
>> Georgi Naplatanov wrote:
>> > On 04/09/2018 10:24 AM, mess-mate wrote:
>> >> Hi,
>> >> howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
>> >> Cups seems installed but what next.
>> >> regards
>> >> 
>> >
>> >
>> > open http://localhost:631/ with your favorite browser and add the printer.
>> >
>> > By the way I couldn't see your printer there. It may not be supported by
>> > CUPS out of the box.
>> >
>> > http://www.openprinting.org/printers
>> 
>> It's an HP -- best bet would be checking hplip.
>
> Indeed, this is the most straightforward and trouble free way of
> getting the printing *and* scanning functions of the device working
> with 'hp-setup -i'.
>
> For printing, http://localhost:631/ plus printer-driver-hpcups is
> sufficient without hplip installed. Scanning would have to be set up
> separately with libsane-hpaio.

Ah right, hpcups is the one I was thinking of.  Been ages since I've run
HP anything, and back then the printers I had needed hplip (all-in-ones,
so the scanner was kind of "required" to work).


-- 
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5  4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281

Re: install printer

[Brian]

On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 15:32:05 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> On Monday 09 April 2018 15:18:38 Brian wrote:
> 
> > On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 05:55:04 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > > On Monday 09 April 2018 03:24:40 mess-mate wrote:
> > > > Hi,
> > > > howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> > > > Cups seems installed but what next.
> > > > regards
> > >
> > > All of the setup tools are available by pointing your browser at
> > > localhost:631.
> >
> > Depends on what you mean by "setup tools". The OP would be out of luck
> > if printer-driver-hpcups was not installed.
> 
> Your view is wider than mine, which only has x86 and r-pi stuff to 
> contend with. And ATM, I have no epson or hp printers. All connected to 
> this machine or at an ip address, and advertized by this cops install, 
> so all I've had to do to make them all usable from any machine here is 
> install the cups client and tell it to browse the local net ip block.
> 
> I should learn from Andy Capp, and just shaddup. :)

Not really. It would be a poorer debian-user without well-intentioned
engagement.

-- 
Brian.

Re: Clonado de Disco con dd

[Gonzalo L. Campos Medina]

Lo que te falta es redimensionar las particiones para que puedas
aprovechar todo el disco.

Saludos

El día 9 de abril de 2018, 11:54,   escribió:
> Lista:
>
> Buenas tardes, desde hace tanto que no escribia.
>
> Tengo una duda.
>
> Tengo un disco duro que ha comenzado a fallar intermitentemente.
> Decidi clonarlo por seguridad.
>
> El disco origen tien 160 Gb
> El disco destino tiene 2 Tb
>
> Lo clone con dd de la siguiente manera:
>
>  sudo dd if=/dev/sda of=/dev/sdb bs=1M
>
> Ha quedado clonado. ¿Ahora como le hago para usarlo en lugar el que ha
> comenzado a fallar?.
>
> debianeromx
>
> P.D. Gracias lista

Re: install printer

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 15:18:38 Brian wrote:

> On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 05:55:04 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Monday 09 April 2018 03:24:40 mess-mate wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > > howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> > > Cups seems installed but what next.
> > > regards
> >
> > All of the setup tools are available by pointing your browser at
> > localhost:631.
>
> Depends on what you mean by "setup tools". The OP would be out of luck
> if printer-driver-hpcups was not installed.

Your view is wider than mine, which only has x86 and r-pi stuff to 
contend with. And ATM, I have no epson or hp printers. All connected to 
this machine or at an ip address, and advertized by this cops install, 
so all I've had to do to make them all usable from any machine here is 
install the cups client and tell it to browse the local net ip block.

I should learn from Andy Capp, and just shaddup. :)

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: install printer

[Brian]

On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 05:55:04 -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:

> On Monday 09 April 2018 03:24:40 mess-mate wrote:
> 
> > Hi,
> > howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> > Cups seems installed but what next.
> > regards
> 
> All of the setup tools are available by pointing your browser at 
> localhost:631.

Depends on what you mean by "setup tools". The OP would be out of luck
if printer-driver-hpcups was not installed.

-- 
Brian.

Re: install printer

[Brian]

On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 09:32:49 +0200, deloptes wrote:

> mess-mate wrote:
> 
> > Hi,
> > howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> > Cups seems installed but what next.
> > regards
> 
> use URL http://localhost:631 -> Administration -> Add Printer
> 
> it might be you need additional packages like hplip and/or hpijs

For the technique you are proposing (which is ok) hplip would be
overkill to set up printing. The only additional package needed
is printer-driver-hpcups.

-- 
Brian.

Clonado de Disco con dd

[debianero]

Lista:

Buenas tardes, desde hace tanto que no escribia.

Tengo una duda.

Tengo un disco duro que ha comenzado a fallar intermitentemente.
Decidi clonarlo por seguridad.

El disco origen tien 160 Gb
El disco destino tiene 2 Tb

Lo clone con dd de la siguiente manera:

 sudo dd if=/dev/sda of=/dev/sdb bs=1M

Ha quedado clonado. ¿Ahora como le hago para usarlo en lugar el que ha
comenzado a fallar?.

debianeromx

P.D. Gracias lista

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[songbird]

Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Monday 09 April 2018 06:18:18 songbird wrote:
>> Gene Heskett wrote:
>> > Greetings folks;
>> >
>> > Updodate Wheezy, realtime kernel because machine is running
>> > linuxcnc.
>> >
>> > Editor is geany and file is left open in the editor, and reloaded
>> > into linuxcnc as changes are made to the file, and saved but not
>> > closed.
>> >
>> > And eventually the updates made to the file are not actually saved,
>> > geany does not report an error and does say success by changing the
>> > filename font from red which tells me its been modified, back to
>> > black in the window top border, but does not actually update the
>> > file on the disk, and the only fix seems to be a reboot.
>> >
>> > Is this a known fault with some SSD's? Or???
>>
>>   i'm not familiar with geany or linuxcnc...  any options
>> in geany for save interval?
>
> I think 2 minutes.

  seems that isn't working, either a bug or you
have more than one copy of the same file open and
one hasn't changed and the other has?  or something
like that...


>>   what kind of file system? 
>
> ext4 w/journaling on.

  ok, so somewhat sane fs.  except you are using some
different hardware and perhaps that implementation
doesn't include all the fs options you think it may.
could be perhaps even ignoring some so...  ugh...
hard to debug.


>>   what are the mount options 
>
> defaults
>
>> in fstab?
> UUID=54273d27-b48f-4a73-9b4d-d3cd13c6ba79 / ext4 
> errors=remount-ro 01
>
>>type of SSD?
> kernel: [3.648318] scsi 0:0:0:0: Direct-Access ATA  SPCC 
> Solid State V3.7 PQ: 0 ANSI: 5
>
> Cheap on sale special from newegg. Lots quicker than spinning rust. 
> Currently 28% used ack df.

  yes, i'm on SSD finally too, love it so far.  by
the time i need to add more i should be able to get
a few TB for the same price of this one.


> Thanks songbird.

  curious though why no vi/vim.  :)


>>   a sync once in a while like other poster recommended
>> may be a help as it would also clear out any waiting io
>> but i'm not sure how much that may interfere with the
>> realtime aspects if you have some large chunks waiting.
>>
> I can only guess.  These files are generally not long, 100 lines or so if 
> I write it but if generated by a code generator, which has no knowledge 
> of the looping abilities of linuxcnc's RS-274-D translator, could make a 
> 40 meg file out of what should be less than 100 properly constructed 
> lines of gcode.

  no of course not, you'd not want to see flattened out 
loops like that!  :)

  for that small of files you are editing, a sync should
mean nothing to the system.  the other issue though is
how the system deals with cached io pages and that was
all i was concerned about if there was something else
going on that would have large io blocks waiting to get
written to disk.  doesn't sound like it to me.


>>   i've used ionice for some things to make sure they
>> don't interfere on an older system with limited
>> capacity.
>
> The heart of linuxcnc runs on one core of a multicore cpu, and something 
> like ionice would probably get locked out of that playpen and have no 
> effect. Any effect would probably encourage it to wreck an otherwise 
> purty part. It, LinuxCNC, supplies the motor signals to drive the 
> machine to sub-micron accuracy, but to do that it has to be able to 
> slice time into nanoseconds.

  sound like fun, but i'd be a bit worried to have
a machine that large driven by a relatively unshielded
pc of any kind.

  do they even have ECC memory in them?  eek!
shielded from cosmic rays?


>> my current machine is a screamer in comparison 
>> so i've not had to do that.
>
> Most of this stuff isn't the latest and greatest.  Old Dell's, or Atom 
> powered shoeboxes even. What matters is how steady a heartbeat it can 
> maintain when a beat of the heart might be needed every 25 nanoseconds, 
> and the atoms are the fastest kid in town for that. The biggest machine 
> is a 1500 lb lathe, and its being run by an r-pi-3b using mesa 
> interfaceing cards. Might be the only one on the planet.


> Thanks songbird.

  y.w. it does all sound like fun, but a bit too high
on the risk scale for me.  where something wrong might
involve spinning metal, i'd want to be a long ways away.
had someone behind me get hit by an exploding wood bowl
once in jr. high shop class.  not a fun time...


  songbird

Re: I can't expand the Debian-partition

[songbird]

Gdsi wrote:
> Hi all.
> After copying a bulk files I felt the limitation of Debian-partition, and 
> decided expand it, as a space on disk was. The partitions on disk placed so: 
> sda2-Debian, sda3-swap.  I deleted the sda3-swap, and expand sda2-Debian, and 
> create swap again.  I used "parted" with terminal. After all 'parted' and 
> 'fdisk' are seeing increasing sda2-Debian and sda3-swap, but graphical file 
> manager 'Thunar' don't seeing increasing sda2-Debian (i.e. its status-bar 
> expose Free space: 733,9 MB) the size was before all changes .Besides this in 
> the booting time are doing the check of disk, duration is 2 min.If I execute:
>
> ---/home/user# fdisk /dev/sda-- 
>
> there appear: 
>
> -Changes will remain in memory only, until you decide to write them.
> Be careful before using the write command--
>
> But after attempts executes  command  write: 
>
> ---Command (m for help): w
> The partition table has been altered.
> Calling ioctl() to re-read partition table.
> Re-reading the partition table failed.: Device or resource busy.
> The kernel still uses the old table. The new table will be used at the next 
> reboot or after you run partprobe(8) or kpartx(8)-
> I don't know what may do. Give me any advices, please.

  reading along there, it says to reboot or use ...  the
simple answer to me is to reboot.

  you have backups and rescue media if needed right?


  songbird

Re: Plantage bizarre

[BERTRAND Joël]

Daniel Caillibaud a écrit :
> Le 09/04/18 à 18:45, BERTRAND Joël  a écrit :
> BJ>   Avec un MTU de 1492, qu'est-ce que ça donne ? Ça fleure bon le
> BJ> ping bloqué quelque part.
> 
> Ça change rien, avec quelques valeurs inférieures non plus (testé 1400, 1200
> & 1000).
> 
> Merci pour la suggestion (j'aurais dû penser à essayer ça).

Bon. Quid de la résolution de nom IPv6 ? La plupart des opérateurs
(même pro), ne savent pas la gérer correctement. J'ai eu ce genre de
problème jusqu'à ce que j'ai collé en dur les chemins IPv6.

En d'autres termes, est-ce que le problème persiste en désactivant IPv6
sur le poste en question ?

Cordialement,

JKB

Re: Plantage bizarre

[Daniel Caillibaud]

Le 09/04/18 à 18:45, BERTRAND Joël  a écrit :
BJ> Avec un MTU de 1492, qu'est-ce que ça donne ? Ça fleure bon le
BJ> ping bloqué quelque part.

Ça change rien, avec quelques valeurs inférieures non plus (testé 1400, 1200
& 1000).

Merci pour la suggestion (j'aurais dû penser à essayer ça).

-- 
Daniel

L'eau conduit l'électricité, mais si tu mets du vin dedans, 
elle a plus le droit de conduire.
Brèves de comptoir (rapportée par Jean-Marie Gourio)

Re: how do i tell usb to leave keyboard alone?

[Curt]

On 2018-04-08, songbird  wrote:
> Brian wrote:
> ...
>> You could resolve the idea that sane is involved with
>>
>> apt purge libsane
>
>   that takes out:
>
>colord
>hplip
>libsane
>printer-driver-postscript-hp


He probably means you purge it, then see, then know (at which point
reinstallation is, of course, your option and your right).

The purge is a troubleshooting measure, not a definitive renouncement.

>   which 3 out of the 4 i do use.
>
>   i've removed every *sane* package i can without taking
> out things i actually use.  that was my first approach
> to dealing with it before i got into other angles.
>
>   all ok this afternoon so far...  :)
>
>   songbird
>
>


-- 
"Poor juvenile solutions, explaining nothing. No need then for caution, we may
reason on to our heart’s content, the fog won’t lift." --Samuel Beckett

ACPI Error on boot

[Anil Duggirala]

hello, 
I am getting an error on boot in my dual boot Win 10-Debian 9 system, 
ACPI Error: Cannot release Mutex [PATM], not acquired (20160831/exmutex-393)
ACPI Error: Method parse/execution failed [\_SB.PCI0.LPCB.ECDV._Q66] (Node 
9346529f5960), AE_AML_MUTEX_NOT_ACQUIRED (20160831/psparse-543)
Could someone tell me what this error means,
thanks a lot,

Anil

Re: etherape - why removed?

[Eduardo M KALINOWSKI]

On seg, 09 abr 2018, Hans wrote:

I am regularly building my own kali-linux versions


That's a particular use case, but I'd just like to add that for a  
regular user, a package disappearing from testing may not have an  
immediate effect. The package won't be uninstalled just because it's  
no longer in the repository; the user will remain with the version he  
had installed. Some time in the future a dependency problem might make  
that version incompatible with newer versions of other packages  
(generally libraries) and only then the user might need to remove the  
package.

--
Eduardo M KALINOWSKI
edua...@kalinowski.com.br

Re: Ideal place to set environment variables

[David Wright]

On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 08:32:00 (-0400), Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Sat, Apr 07, 2018 at 11:47:19AM +0100, Jonathan de Boyne Pollard wrote:

… a post that doesn't seem to have made it to the archives.
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2018/04/author.html

> > 
> >   
> 
> Really? :-(
> 
> > 
> > 
> > The $ metacharacter is documented in the FreeBSD
> >   manual page that I pointed to before, alongside a ~
> >   metacharacter which yields your desired result fairly trivially. 
> 
> OK.  I confess I only looked at the "setenv" section which says "A
> comma-separated list of environment variables and values to which they
> are to be set."  Then jumped to the bottom to look for examples, of
> which there are zero.
> 
> I guess I should have read every single sentence, to find the part
> about `~' and `$'.  That looks sufficient for all the real-world
> cases I've seen.

Looks to me like a bug in the man page. That paragraph doesn't
belong under "Authentication".
https://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?query=login.conf

Cheers,
David.

Re: etherape - why removed?

[David Wright]

On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 16:31:12 (+0200), Hans wrote:
> Hi Roberto and the Wanderer for making some things clear. My fault, that I 
> interpreted the website of tracker not correctly. 
> 
> However, it is not understandable for me, why a package has to be removed 
> (due 
> to a bug) instead of keeping the last running version, and then, when a newer 
> and running version exists, to substitute the latest running version with the 
> higher version. 
> 
> Or equals, subtitute the latest running version with a fixed version. To 
> remove a defektive version completely in testing is IMHO not the best way.
> 
> Please excuse, I do not want to mourn about this philosophy, I just wondered 
> about it.  :)
> 
> On the other side, this might be the best way, and I suppose a lot of people 
> had thought a long more time about this than me!

To me it appears that you expect "testing" to be a rolling release
that's more up-to-date than "stable". It isn't that. It's an attempt
to build what will become the next "stable" after release day.
As such, the rules are different.

If you install testing, you're expected to understand that and take
account of it in the way you upgrade (and maintain security of)
your system. (That's the short answer.)

Cheers,
David.

Re: Plantage bizarre

[BERTRAND Joël]

Daniel Caillibaud a écrit :
> Le 04/04/18 à 08:35, Daniel Caillibaud  a écrit :
> DC> Bonjour,
> DC> 
> DC> J'ai changé de FAI hier, ça n'a probablement rien à voir mais y'a quand
> DC> même un truc louche coté réseau [1].
> 
> C'est surtout lui qui me dérange au quotidien, difficile de bosser avec 
> d'autres sans avoir accès au dépôt de code commun.
> 
> J'ai pas réglé mon pb d'hibernation, ça refuse toujours de se réveiller de
> tps en tps, mais c'est pas très souvent, et ça arrivait déjà de temps à
> autres. 
> Et depuis qq jours j'ai eu un seul plantage violent (changer le câble 
> réseau de carte, cf +loin).
> 
> Ce qui est vraiment gênant pour moi, c'est l'impossibilité de causer à
> github :
> 
> - git+ssh : connexion coupée. github répond pas au handshake ssh (bloqué
>   sur "expecting SSH2_MSG_KEX_ECDH_REPLY"), si je force un cipher aes ça va
>   un peu plus loin et termine avec "Connection to github.com closed by
>   remote host" + "fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly"
> 
> - interface web : login impossible avec firefox, difficile avec chrome
>   (faut insister au login, et ensuite plein de requêtes se prennent du
>   net::ERR_CONNECTION_RESET)
> 
> mais
> 
> - ça fonctionne bien avec d'autres dépôts git (aussi en git+ssh avec la
>   même clé) depuis cette machine
> - pas vu d'autres pbs depuis le browser (testé d'autres trucs en https 
>   qui font pas mal d'ajax)
> - ça fonctionne bien depuis mon laptop, testé en filaire avec la même
>   debian stretch, même clé ssh, ipv4 forcé, j'ai même testé la modif de la
>   mac de mon desktop pour lui coller celle du portable, utilisé le même
>   câble RJ45 sur le même port de la box, rien n'y fait, **laptop ok et
>   desktop ko !**
> 
> Le seul truc qui change est le chipset de la carte réseau, mais pourquoi ça
> ne coince que vers github, et pourquoi ça marchait le matin et plus
> l'aprèm, mystère…
> 
> J'ai vérifié, les 2 PC ont la même conf réseau, tout en automatique, MTU à
> 1500.

Bonsoir,

Avec un MTU de 1492, qu'est-ce que ça donne ? Ça fleure bon le ping
bloqué quelque part.

Bien cordialement,

JKB

Re: Plantage bizarre

[Daniel Caillibaud]

Le 04/04/18 à 08:35, Daniel Caillibaud  a écrit :
DC> Bonjour,
DC> 
DC> J'ai changé de FAI hier, ça n'a probablement rien à voir mais y'a quand
DC> même un truc louche coté réseau [1].

C'est surtout lui qui me dérange au quotidien, difficile de bosser avec 
d'autres sans avoir accès au dépôt de code commun.

J'ai pas réglé mon pb d'hibernation, ça refuse toujours de se réveiller de
tps en tps, mais c'est pas très souvent, et ça arrivait déjà de temps à
autres. 
Et depuis qq jours j'ai eu un seul plantage violent (changer le câble 
réseau de carte, cf +loin).

Ce qui est vraiment gênant pour moi, c'est l'impossibilité de causer à
github :

- git+ssh : connexion coupée. github répond pas au handshake ssh (bloqué
  sur "expecting SSH2_MSG_KEX_ECDH_REPLY"), si je force un cipher aes ça va
  un peu plus loin et termine avec "Connection to github.com closed by
  remote host" + "fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly"

- interface web : login impossible avec firefox, difficile avec chrome
  (faut insister au login, et ensuite plein de requêtes se prennent du
  net::ERR_CONNECTION_RESET)

mais

- ça fonctionne bien avec d'autres dépôts git (aussi en git+ssh avec la
  même clé) depuis cette machine
- pas vu d'autres pbs depuis le browser (testé d'autres trucs en https 
  qui font pas mal d'ajax)
- ça fonctionne bien depuis mon laptop, testé en filaire avec la même
  debian stretch, même clé ssh, ipv4 forcé, j'ai même testé la modif de la
  mac de mon desktop pour lui coller celle du portable, utilisé le même
  câble RJ45 sur le même port de la box, rien n'y fait, **laptop ok et
  desktop ko !**

Le seul truc qui change est le chipset de la carte réseau, mais pourquoi ça
ne coince que vers github, et pourquoi ça marchait le matin et plus
l'aprèm, mystère…

J'ai vérifié, les 2 PC ont la même conf réseau, tout en automatique, MTU à
1500.

1) desktop

eth1: flags=4163  mtu 1500
inet 192.168.1.54  netmask 255.255.255.0  broadcast 192.168.1.255
inet6 fe80::3285:a9ff:fe05:ff91  prefixlen 64  scopeid 0x20
ether 30:85:a9:05:ff:91  txqueuelen 1000  (Ethernet)
RX packets 437534  bytes 439004723 (418.6 MiB)
RX errors 0  dropped 3  overruns 0  frame 0
TX packets 259013  bytes 63054413 (60.1 MiB)
TX errors 0  dropped 0 overruns 0  carrier 17  collisions 0


2) laptop

eth0: flags=4163  mtu 1500
inet 192.168.1.54  netmask 255.255.255.0  broadcast 192.168.1.255
inet6 fe80::3285:a9ff:fe05:ff91  prefixlen 64  scopeid 0x20
ether 30:85:a9:05:ff:91  txqueuelen 1000  (Ethernet)
RX packets 9512  bytes 10664033 (10.1 MiB)
RX errors 1  dropped 0  overruns 0  frame 1
TX packets 4932  bytes 647143 (631.9 KiB)
TX errors 0  dropped 0 overruns 0  carrier 5  collisions 0


Après pas mal de tests et qq échanges avec github, j'ai vu que git+ssh est
impossible sur un seul dépôt, sur les autres ça passe si je force le cipher
(mais pas sans le forcer) avec
  env GIT_SSH_COMMAND="ssh -v -o Ciphers=aes256-ctr" git maCommande

J'ai comme l'impression que github n'y est pas pour grand chose :
- je doute que leur sshd réagisse différement si c'est même ip, même clé,
  même mac
- en testant avec l'autre carte réseau (avant de l'enlever), le desktop 
  s'est figé complètement lorsque j'ai changé le cable de carte réseau, 
  rien dans les logs.
mais je comprends pas du tout comment un pb hard/soft sur mon desktop
pourrait donner ce comportement (≠ suivant dépôt et cipher)

J'ai ensuite viré l'autre carte réseau (PCI, qui servait pas avant ces tests) 
pour que cette carte intégrée se retrouve toute seule et en eth0, ça change 
rien (assez logique mais au moins c'est sûr).

J'ai ensuite désactivé dans le bios la carte réseau gigabit intégrée (realtek 
8139) et rebranché la vieille SMC1211 PCI (100Mbps), l'interface 
veut plus monter, dmesg raconte

[   33.425019] IPv6: ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): enp4s0: link is not ready
[   33.425072] genirq: Flags mismatch irq 0. 0080 (enp4s0) vs. 00015a00 
(timer)
[   64.164910] EXT4-fs (dm-8): mounted filesystem with ordered data mode. Opts: 
(null)
[  155.754405] IPv6: ADDRCONF(NETDEV_UP): enp4s0: link is not ready
[  155.754462] genirq: Flags mismatch irq 0. 0080 (enp4s0) vs. 00015a00 
(timer)

Donc y'aurait bien un pb soft ou hard autour du réseau sur cette machine, 
mais je vois pas trop quoi (ni pourquoi ce serait arrivé subitement au 
changement de box).

Je suis passé du kernel 4.9.0-4-amd64 à 4.13.0-0.bpo.1-amd64, ça change 
rien non plus…

Le pb tcp vu par wireshark, en résumé

1) browser
github => clientTLSv1.2 117 [TCP ACKed unseen segment] , Change 
Cipher Spec, Encrypted Handshake Message
TLSv1.2 97  [TCP ACKed unseen segment] , Encrypted 
Alert
TCP 66  [TCP ACKed unseen segment] 443 → 39226 
[RST, ACK] Seq=3692 Ack=3198 Win=35840 Len=0 

Re: etherape - why removed?

[Hans]

Am Montag, 9. April 2018, 17:48:21 CEST schrieb The Wanderer:
Hi The Wanderer,

thank you for this detailed and very informative response. I think, this makes 
everything clear for me, and my little question is solved. 

However, I will read your message severalt times, so I do understand it fully, 
and I will think about your arguments. At the first glance they are logical 
and accountable on the other hand, and I suppose, you will understand this, it 
is irritating, that a package suddenly disappears.

I am regularly building my own kali-linux versions, and when an important 
package like etherape suddenly disappears, this is sad. 

Of course, the solution is, to put the latest running package into the 
package-chroot of the life-build environment.

But it is good to have taĺked about this, I think others read interested this 
thing, too.

So, thank you and and all others for the help and clearance and 

have a very nice week!

Best regards

Hans  


> I'm not entirely clear which version(s) you're referring to by each of
> these, WRT "the version in stable", "the version (which was) in
> testing", and "the version in unstable".
> 
> The version in stable does not get removed; it's still there, in stable.
> 
> The version in testing can't be retained, because it had a bug which
> would have made releasing it as part of the next stable inappropriate,
> and the entire purpose of testing is to develop into the form which will
> become the next stable.
> 
> When a package version in testing develops a bug which is unsuitable for
> stable, restoring the version from stable into testing would not be a
> good idea, because it would mean that someone who had already installed
> the (higher) version from testing would see the version number available
> in testing go *down*; such a person would never see the stable version
> listed as a possible upgrade. The confusion which results from version
> numbers going backwards and forwards is almost never worth it.
> 
> All else being equal, a package in unstable will eventually make it into
> testing - but the purpose of unstable is to make it possible to detect
> bugs in packages which haven't made it into testing yet, so that those
> bugs never make it into testing. Letting a package skip the unstable
> period and go right into testing would defeat the purpose, and would
> mean that it's *more* likely that the package in testing would turn out
> to have a bug that would cause it to need to be removed.
> 
> > Or equals, subtitute the latest running version with a fixed
> > version.
> 
> Where is this fixed version supposed to come from?
> 
> When a fixed version is created, it's always possible that the fix will
> introduce another bug, which wasn't present before. In order to make it
> possible to detect such bugs and keep them from getting into testing,
> new versions have to go into unstable first; they only get migrated to
> testing after they've had a while to "cook" in unstable.
> 
> To permit a package version to go directly into testing, without passing
> through unstable first, would defeat the entire purpose of having there
> be an "unstable" in the first place.
> 
> > To remove a defektive version completely in testing is IMHO not the
> > best way.
> 
> When the defective version introduces problems for other packages,
> keeping it around can be worse than removing it. That is in fact one of
> the criteria for deciding to remove a package from testing.
> 
> If I read you correctly, you're suggesting that when this happens, the
> "last known good" version should be reintroduced, rather than remove the
> package entirely.
> 
> Unfortunately, there are at least two reasons why this would not work
> well in practice.
> 
> One is the problem with package version numbers effectively going
> backwards, as mentioned above.
> 
> The other is about package dependency relationships. For example, if the
> "last known good" version (from stable) depends on an old version of a
> particular library, and the version of that library in testing is too
> new to work with the package from stable, bringing back the stable
> version would require bringing back that old library - and that would
> require removing all the package which depend on the new version.
> 
> Basically, the idea isn't impossible, but it would introduce far more
> problems than it would solve.

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[tomas]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 10:13:21AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Monday 09 April 2018 09:46:07 rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:

[...]

> > To your original problem, have you tried going to a command line and
> > throwing in a couple =sync=s?  I would try that, maybe after saving in
> > your editor, and again maybe after open and / or saving in the cnc
> > program.
>
> I wasn't schmardt enough to think of that before I rebooted it from here 
> in the house last night. I shoulda.

Rebooting should do a sync as well (in fact, any attempt at a clean
unmount). So this shouldn't be the problem either.

Cheers
- -- t
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlrLlIMACgkQBcgs9XrR2kba5ACeMgPWZHAjWd3fDbIvS+OuHdXL
BvwAn3XSCiA6be2jxmzpf2mYN6wnyuPt
=btYw
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Re: Bloquer un TLD sous Postfix

[Daniel Caillibaud]

Le 07/04/18 à 02:46, "Ph. Gras"  a écrit :
PG> Bonjour,
PG> 
PG> > Je déconseille fortement ce genre de filtrage sauvage ;-)  
PG> 
PG> les remontrances de Daniel me semblent infondées et parfaitement
PG> déplacées.

C'est pas des remontrances, juste qu'amha mettre du filtrage en dur n'est
pas à conseiller, pour les raisons que je détaillais.

Ensuite, ça reste un conseil, que personne n'est obligé de suivre, encore
heureux que chacun puisse configurer son smtp comme il l'entend.

Amicalement,

-- 
Daniel

On n'a rien à gagner à emmerder les gens qui n'ont rien à perdre.
Frédéric Dard (Les pensées de San-Antonio)

Re: etherape - why removed?

[The Wanderer]

On 2018-04-09 at 10:31, Hans wrote:

> Hi Roberto and the Wanderer for making some things clear. My fault,
> that I interpreted the website of tracker not correctly.
> 
> However, it is not understandable for me, why a package has to be
> removed (due to a bug) instead of keeping the last running version,
> and then, when a newer and running version exists, to substitute the
> latest running version with the higher version.

I'm not entirely clear which version(s) you're referring to by each of
these, WRT "the version in stable", "the version (which was) in
testing", and "the version in unstable".

The version in stable does not get removed; it's still there, in stable.

The version in testing can't be retained, because it had a bug which
would have made releasing it as part of the next stable inappropriate,
and the entire purpose of testing is to develop into the form which will
become the next stable.

When a package version in testing develops a bug which is unsuitable for
stable, restoring the version from stable into testing would not be a
good idea, because it would mean that someone who had already installed
the (higher) version from testing would see the version number available
in testing go *down*; such a person would never see the stable version
listed as a possible upgrade. The confusion which results from version
numbers going backwards and forwards is almost never worth it.

All else being equal, a package in unstable will eventually make it into
testing - but the purpose of unstable is to make it possible to detect
bugs in packages which haven't made it into testing yet, so that those
bugs never make it into testing. Letting a package skip the unstable
period and go right into testing would defeat the purpose, and would
mean that it's *more* likely that the package in testing would turn out
to have a bug that would cause it to need to be removed.

> Or equals, subtitute the latest running version with a fixed
> version.

Where is this fixed version supposed to come from?

When a fixed version is created, it's always possible that the fix will
introduce another bug, which wasn't present before. In order to make it
possible to detect such bugs and keep them from getting into testing,
new versions have to go into unstable first; they only get migrated to
testing after they've had a while to "cook" in unstable.

To permit a package version to go directly into testing, without passing
through unstable first, would defeat the entire purpose of having there
be an "unstable" in the first place.

> To remove a defektive version completely in testing is IMHO not the
> best way.

When the defective version introduces problems for other packages,
keeping it around can be worse than removing it. That is in fact one of
the criteria for deciding to remove a package from testing.

If I read you correctly, you're suggesting that when this happens, the
"last known good" version should be reintroduced, rather than remove the
package entirely.

Unfortunately, there are at least two reasons why this would not work
well in practice.

One is the problem with package version numbers effectively going
backwards, as mentioned above.

The other is about package dependency relationships. For example, if the
"last known good" version (from stable) depends on an old version of a
particular library, and the version of that library in testing is too
new to work with the package from stable, bringing back the stable
version would require bringing back that old library - and that would
require removing all the package which depend on the new version.

Basically, the idea isn't impossible, but it would introduce far more
problems than it would solve.

-- 
   The Wanderer

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all
progress depends on the unreasonable man. -- George Bernard Shaw



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Greg Wooledge]

On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 10:30:58AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Monday 09 April 2018 09:51:37 Greg Wooledge wrote:
> > As others have explained, the OS (Linux) keeps a cache of file
> > contents that have been written by applications, but not yet committed
> > to permanent storage.  If you "save" from within the text editor, then
> > the saved contents should be immediately visible to other processes
> > reading the file, regardless of whether it has been synced to disk. 
> > They'll simply get the cached version.
> 
> Which is not happening after several hours and a hundred or more edits. 
> Which is why its so intermittent.

This is why some people are guessing that the problem lies in the
text editor -- it hasn't *actually* saved the content (via kernel
write() calls) yet.

Of course there are many other possible explanations.  You might have
thought you saved, but you actually didn't (classic PEBKAC).  You might
be catting the wrong file, different from the one that's being edited.
The editor might have been invoked to edit a temporary file within some
kind of version control environment, with your changes not actually
being submitted to the VCS until the editor terminates.

It's unlikely to be an issue with the actual storage hardware.

Re: etherape - why removed?

[Hans]

Hi Roberto and the Wanderer for making some things clear. My fault, that I 
interpreted the website of tracker not correctly. 

However, it is not understandable for me, why a package has to be removed (due 
to a bug) instead of keeping the last running version, and then, when a newer 
and running version exists, to substitute the latest running version with the 
higher version. 

Or equals, subtitute the latest running version with a fixed version. To 
remove a defektive version completely in testing is IMHO not the best way.

Please excuse, I do not want to mourn about this philosophy, I just wondered 
about it.  :)

On the other side, this might be the best way, and I suppose a lot of people 
had thought a long more time about this than me!

Best regards

Hans
  

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 09:51:37 Greg Wooledge wrote:

> On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 09:46:07AM -0400, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:
> > To your original problem, have you tried going to a command line and
> > throwing in a couple =sync=s?  I would try that, maybe after saving
> > in your editor, and again maybe after open and / or saving in the
> > cnc program.
>
> As others have explained, the OS (Linux) keeps a cache of file
> contents that have been written by applications, but not yet committed
> to permanent storage.  If you "save" from within the text editor, then
> the saved contents should be immediately visible to other processes
> reading the file, regardless of whether it has been synced to disk. 
> They'll simply get the cached version.

Which is not happening after several hours and a hundred or more edits. 
Which is why its so intermittent.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: How to limit udisks2 rules to a specific device?

[Mikhail Morfikov]

On 2018-04-09 12:30, Richard Hector wrote:
> On 09/04/18 04:50, Mikhail Morfikov wrote:
>> When it comes to mounting devices, I have two simple rules:
>> 1) only root can do it.
>> 2) in some cases only defined users can mount some specific devices.
>>
>> So I want to forbid all users (except root) to access all devices that people
>> can possibly plug into a USB port. But devices can be distinguished by, for
>> instance, some serial number (or something else). I have a USB drive, and I 
>> want
>> it to be accessed and mounted by my regular user without asking me for 
>> password
>> each time I do so.
> 
> I assume faking the serial number is too difficult to be worried about?
> 
> Richard
> 
I know little about faking the serial number of a device, but it was just an
example. There're lots of things a device can be matched against, and also you
can give different privileges to users even when they operate on the same 
device.

And, of course, remember that the message, which is returned to a user, is "Not
authorized to perform operation", and not "Not authorized to perform operation
due to not whitelisted serial number". :) So it could be difficult to know why
you're not able to mount such device in my system.

Anyways, I've manged to install the experimental version of policykit. It works
well, and I was able to set everything in the way I wanted.



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: etherape - why removed?

[The Wanderer]

On 2018-04-09 at 10:12, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:

> On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 04:04:46PM +0200, Hans wrote:
> 
>> Hi, I am still confused about debian package philosophie.
>> 
>> I can see, etherape is migrated successfull to testing, and now it
>> is removed without a reason. It looks like there is an automatismn
>> behind this. Debian- Tracker showed no clear information - or I did
>> not recognize it.
> 
> The package information is located here:
> 
> https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/etherape

There's also https://qa.debian.org/excuses.php?package=etherape, which
I"m pretty sure I've seen provide useful information when the tracker
page didn't, at least once in the past.

In this case it appears to provide the same information, but perhaps
some people might find the presentation more approachable or
understandable.

-- 
   The Wanderer

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all
progress depends on the unreasonable man. -- George Bernard Shaw



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Stefan Monnier]

>> A big, rapidly blinking BLOCK cursor would help these old eyes find
>> it a lot easier.  But in 20  years thats fallen out of style, dammit.

100% idle state is important to reduce power consumption, so blinking
while otherwise idle is to be avoided in general, yes.  But it's OK to
blink when there's other activity.  E.g. in Emacs, after execution of
a command by default the cursor blinks (by default) for upto
`blink-cursor-blinks` after which it stays solid.

> The cursor is a function of the terminal, not of the text editor
> running inside the terminal.

That's only for those editor that run within a text-terminal (and even
in those cases, the editor can decide to control the cursor's blinking.
Emacs currently doesn't, but I use a local patch which does let it do
so, so it obeys `blink-cursor-blinks`, `blink-cursor-interval`, and
`blink-cursor-delay` rather than).


Stefan

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 09:46:07 rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:

> On Monday, April 09, 2018 05:53:18 AM Gene Heskett wrote:
> > What else is a good editor? And lets not start yet another vim vs
> > emacs war. kwrite and kate come to mind. I'm running Trinity
> > Desktop, maybe I should check them out. Whatever, needs to be able
> > to have several files open so I can just click back and forth on the
> > tabs as I usually separate the files into what uses which cutting
> > tool.
>
> I use kate and kwrite (on Wheezy) for some of my important things (my
> askSam workalike mashup), nedit and some others for other purposes.
>
> kate and kwrite both allow multiple files to be open, but, instead of
> tabs, you can (with an option--maybe on the menu) have an additional
> panel on the left hand side of the screen showing you all the files
> open in that instance and allowing you to click on any one of them to
> switch to that file.
>
> To your original problem, have you tried going to a command line and
> throwing in a couple =sync=s?  I would try that, maybe after saving in
> your editor, and again maybe after open and / or saving in the cnc
> program.

I wasn't schmardt enough to think of that before I rebooted it from here 
in the house last night. I shoulda.

Thanks rhkramer.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: etherape - why removed?

[Roberto C . Sánchez]

On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 04:04:46PM +0200, Hans wrote:
> Hi,
>  I am still confused about debian package philosophie.
> 
> I can see, etherape is migrated successfull to testing, and now it is removed 
> without a reason. It looks like there is an automatismn behind this. Debian-
> Tracker showed no clear information - or I did not recognize it. 
>   

The package information is located here:

https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/etherape

If you look at the "testing migrations" information, two bugs are
referenced: #885796, #894313

If you click the link for the news entry "[2018-04-07] etherape REMOVED
from testing" then you will see that it references the same two bugs.

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=885796
https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=894313

Both of those bugs have release-critical severity. They make the package
version against which those bugs are filed unsuitable for release. Since
the intent of the testing distribution is to serve as the preparatory
area for the next stable release, the package must be removed after some
time without the bugs being fixed.

> Similar thing I can see from time to time: A package is working in stable, 
> then it is removed in testing, but appears in unstable at higher version 
> again. Why then not let the higher version in testing be alive? 
> 
The reason for this is the same as I gave above.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 06:18:18 songbird wrote:

> Gene Heskett wrote:
> > Greetings folks;
> >
> > Updodate Wheezy, realtime kernel because machine is running
> > linuxcnc.
> >
> > Editor is geany and file is left open in the editor, and reloaded
> > into linuxcnc as changes are made to the file, and saved but not
> > closed.
> >
> > And eventually the updates made to the file are not actually saved,
> > geany does not report an error and does say success by changing the
> > filename font from red which tells me its been modified, back to
> > black in the window top border, but does not actually update the
> > file on the disk, and the only fix seems to be a reboot.
> >
> > Is this a known fault with some SSD's? Or???
>
>   i'm not familiar with geany or linuxcnc...  any options
> in geany for save interval?

I think 2 minutes.
>
>   what kind of file system? 

ext4 w/journaling on.
>   what are the mount options 

defaults

> in fstab?
UUID=54273d27-b48f-4a73-9b4d-d3cd13c6ba79 / ext4 
errors=remount-ro 01

>type of SSD?
kernel: [3.648318] scsi 0:0:0:0: Direct-Access ATA  SPCC 
Solid State V3.7 PQ: 0 ANSI: 5

Cheap on sale special from newegg. Lots quicker than spinning rust. 
Currently 28% used ack df.

Thanks songbird.
>   a sync once in a while like other poster recommended
> may be a help as it would also clear out any waiting io
> but i'm not sure how much that may interfere with the
> realtime aspects if you have some large chunks waiting.
>
I can only guess.  These files are generally not long, 100 lines or so if 
I write it but if generated by a code generator, which has no knowledge 
of the looping abilities of linuxcnc's RS-274-D translator, could make a 
40 meg file out of what should be less than 100 properly constructed 
lines of gcode.

>   i've used ionice for some things to make sure they
> don't interfere on an older system with limited
> capacity.

The heart of linuxcnc runs on one core of a multicore cpu, and something 
like ionice would probably get locked out of that playpen and have no 
effect. Any effect would probably encourage it to wreck an otherwise 
purty part. It, LinuxCNC, supplies the motor signals to drive the 
machine to sub-micron accuracy, but to do that it has to be able to 
slice time into nanoseconds.

> my current machine is a screamer in comparison 
> so i've not had to do that.

Most of this stuff isn't the latest and greatest.  Old Dell's, or Atom 
powered shoeboxes even. What matters is how steady a heartbeat it can 
maintain when a beat of the heart might be needed every 25 nanoseconds, 
and the atoms are the fastest kid in town for that. The biggest machine 
is a 1500 lb lathe, and its being run by an r-pi-3b using mesa 
interfaceing cards. Might be the only one on the planet.

>
>   songbird

Thanks songbird.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

etherape - why removed?

[Hans]

Hi,
 I am still confused about debian package philosophie.

I can see, etherape is migrated successfull to testing, and now it is removed 
without a reason. It looks like there is an automatismn behind this. Debian-
Tracker showed no clear information - or I did not recognize it. 
  
Similar thing I can see from time to time: A package is working in stable, 
then it is removed in testing, but appears in unstable at higher version 
again. Why then not let the higher version in testing be alive? 

Now I am using debian for more than 10 years, but there still some very little 
things, I believe, I will never understand. :) On the other hand, though these 
few little things, debian makes me always happy!

Have fun!

Hans

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Greg Wooledge]

On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 09:46:07AM -0400, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:
> To your original problem, have you tried going to a command line and throwing 
> in a couple =sync=s?  I would try that, maybe after saving in your editor, 
> and 
> again maybe after open and / or saving in the cnc program.

As others have explained, the OS (Linux) keeps a cache of file contents
that have been written by applications, but not yet committed to
permanent storage.  If you "save" from within the text editor, then the
saved contents should be immediately visible to other processes reading
the file, regardless of whether it has been synced to disk.  They'll
simply get the cached version.

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[rhkramer]

On Monday, April 09, 2018 05:53:18 AM Gene Heskett wrote:
> What else is a good editor? And lets not start yet another vim vs emacs
> war. kwrite and kate come to mind. I'm running Trinity Desktop, maybe I
> should check them out. Whatever, needs to be able to have several files
> open so I can just click back and forth on the tabs as I usually
> separate the files into what uses which cutting tool.

I use kate and kwrite (on Wheezy) for some of my important things (my askSam 
workalike mashup), nedit and some others for other purposes.

kate and kwrite both allow multiple files to be open, but, instead of tabs, you 
can (with an option--maybe on the menu) have an additional panel on the left 
hand side of the screen showing you all the files open in that instance and 
allowing you to click on any one of them to switch to that file.

To your original problem, have you tried going to a command line and throwing 
in a couple =sync=s?  I would try that, maybe after saving in your editor, and 
again maybe after open and / or saving in the cnc program.

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Greg Wooledge]

On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 09:32:14AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> A big, rapidly blinking 
> BLOCK cursor would help these old eyes find it a lot easier. But in 20 
> years thats fallen out of style, dammit.

The cursor is a function of the terminal, not of the text editor
running inside the terminal.

rxvt-unicode (the terminal I use on Debian) has a solid block cursor by
default.  You can make it blink by running "rxvt -bc", or by setting the
"cursorBlink" resource in your X resources.  I wouldn't call it *rapidly*
blinking (looks to be about 1 Hz), but it's blinking.  (I've also decided
that I don't care for it, and won't be using this option, but hey,
that's what *options* are for.)

Other terminals may or may not have similar options.

Re: Virtualização Windows 10 para Jogos

[Leandro Pereira]

Bom, acho que sem fazer GPU passthrough com VT-d não vai rolar jogar
na VM, vai ficar muito lento mesmo.

Leandro L. Pereira


Em 9 de abril de 2018 10:30, Nei Moreira  escreveu:
> Prezados,
>
> Bom dia!
> Venho mais uma vez consultar a experiência de vocês.
> Tenho um PC em "dual boot" Windows 10 e Debian. Este PC está com uma
> configuração razoável (RAM: 8GB; HD: 1TB; Vídeo: onboard).
> Neste último fim de semana, formatei o PC, instalei somente o Debian e
> virtualizei o Windows 10 através do Virtualbox, com intuito de manter o uso
> que fazia com a instalação do sistema como host.
> Para a maioria das atividades, está atendendo plenamente, mas apresentação
> gráfica ficou um pouco a desejar. Possuo alguns jogos para Windows 10
> (Diablo III e Plants VS Zobies GW) que rodavam bem no Win10 como host. Estou
> com receio de rodá-los no Win10 como guest.
> Vocês tem alguma experiência ou sugestão sobre o assunto?
> Abraço,
>
> Nei Moreira

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 09:02:55 Stefan Monnier wrote:

> >> So the actual disk isn't to blame (cat'ing a file that was just
> >> saved won't look at the disk anyway).
> >
> > Whats it look at 5+ minutes later?
>
> Same difference: if `cat` can't see it, then the change hasn't been
> received by the OS at all (even less so by the underlying disk).
>
> > The file had not been updated yet an hour later. Ext4's journal in
> > my understanding has a maximum of 5 minutes to sync?  Its now around
> > 10 hours later and has not yet been updated with the last two lines
> > I'd added.
>
> The changes you see in `cat`s output will be transferred to disk
> eventually, yes.  But those that aren't visible to `cat` just don't
> exist, as far as the OS is concerned.
>
> > What else is a good editor?
>
> Is that a trick question?
>
Twasn't intended to be.

However I did find (I actually read its man page!) an alias setting that 
makes nano do line at a time scrolling and installed it, so I'll try it 
when I get back to that project later today. nano hasn't made a mistake 
yet that I didn't do typeing in the wrong place. A big, rapidly blinking 
BLOCK cursor would help these old eyes find it a lot easier. But in 20 
years thats fallen out of style, dammit.
>
> Stefan



-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: I can't expand the Debian-partition

[tomas]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 09:04:56AM -0400, Gdsi wrote:
> Hi all.
> After copying a bulk files I felt the limitation of Debian-partition, and 
> decided expand it, as a space on disk was. The partitions on disk placed so: 
> sda2-Debian, sda3-swap.  I deleted the sda3-swap, and expand sda2-Debian, and 
> create swap again.  I used "parted" with terminal. After all 'parted' and 
> 'fdisk' are seeing increasing sda2-Debian and sda3-swap, but graphical file 
> manager 'Thunar' don't seeing increasing sda2-Debian (i.e. its status-bar 
> expose Free space: 733,9 MB) the size was before all changes .Besides this in 
> the booting time are doing the check of disk, duration is 2 min.If I execute:

I guess you have to tell your file system that
it can make use of that extra space. That's what
"resize2fs" is for (NOTE: I've assumed you have
an ext4 file system on sda2-Debian: otherwise
you'll need another command).

It will default to your (new) partition size, so
just giving it the device name should work.

Back up your valuable data first!

Cheers
- -- t
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlrLa0EACgkQBcgs9XrR2kY1rQCePW45Xw8Y1R6bLQt10EA/jfG0
WlwAn1O00jjna59G3V9vI92vG+SyPkcd
=+Uj4
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Virtualização Windows 10 para Jogos

[Nei Moreira]

Prezados,

Bom dia!
Venho mais uma vez consultar a experiência de vocês.
Tenho um PC em "dual boot" Windows 10 e Debian. Este PC está com uma
configuração razoável (RAM: 8GB; HD: 1TB; Vídeo: onboard).
Neste último fim de semana, formatei o PC, instalei somente o Debian e
virtualizei o Windows 10 através do Virtualbox, com intuito de manter o uso
que fazia com a instalação do sistema como host.
Para a maioria das atividades, está atendendo plenamente, mas apresentação
gráfica ficou um pouco a desejar. Possuo alguns jogos para Windows 10
(Diablo III e Plants VS Zobies GW) que rodavam bem no Win10 como host.
Estou com receio de rodá-los no Win10 como guest.
Vocês tem alguma experiência ou sugestão sobre o assunto?
Abraço,

Nei Moreira

Re: Client Debian Stretch 9 - Ansible - Docker - DemocracyOS OnPremises -- Serveur Distant Debian Stretch 9

[G2PC]

> Bonjour,
> Je n'ai pas avancé d'avantage pour installer DemocracyOS, avec OnPremises.
>
> Je cherche :
> - A configurer le fichier requirements.yml
> - A configurer SSH pour ansible.
> - A configurer /etc/ansible/hosts
> 
> - A configurer et comprendre inventories
> - A configurer playbook.yml

Le soucis a été contourné, avec Docker.
Moins de manipulations pour une installation standard avec deux
conteneur, DemocracyOS et MongoDB.

https://www.visionduweb.eu/wiki/index.php?title=Installer_DemocracyOS#Installer_DemocracyOS_avec_Docker

I can't expand the Debian-partition

[Gdsi]

Hi all.
After copying a bulk files I felt the limitation of Debian-partition, and 
decided expand it, as a space on disk was. The partitions on disk placed so: 
sda2-Debian, sda3-swap.  I deleted the sda3-swap, and expand sda2-Debian, and 
create swap again.  I used "parted" with terminal. After all 'parted' and 
'fdisk' are seeing increasing sda2-Debian and sda3-swap, but graphical file 
manager 'Thunar' don't seeing increasing sda2-Debian (i.e. its status-bar 
expose Free space: 733,9 MB) the size was before all changes .Besides this in 
the booting time are doing the check of disk, duration is 2 min.If I execute:

---/home/user# fdisk /dev/sda-- 

there appear: 

-Changes will remain in memory only, until you decide to write them.
Be careful before using the write command--

But after attempts executes  command  write: 

---Command (m for help): w
The partition table has been altered.
Calling ioctl() to re-read partition table.
Re-reading the partition table failed.: Device or resource busy.
The kernel still uses the old table. The new table will be used at the next 
reboot or after you run partprobe(8) or kpartx(8)-
I don't know what may do. Give me any advices, please.

Re: how do i tell usb to leave keyboard alone?

[songbird]

songbird wrote:
...

  was hopeful again, but still there this morning.  had
times where keyboard was dead for minutes at a time.
so upgraded hammer to sledge (command line to kernel 
via grub).

usbcore.autosuspend=-1

  not sure it will make any difference, but worth a try.


  songbird

Re: mate-panel segfault

[songbird]

Greg Marks wrote:
...
> (The instruction pointer and the stack pointer values will vary,
> as you'd expect.)  I am running Debian 9, Linux kernel 4.6.0-1-amd64
> x86_64, with MATE 1.16.2 desktop; my computer has a PNY Quadro K620
> 2GB Video Card and is running libdrm-nouveau2 version 2.4.74-1 and
> xserver-xorg-video-nouveau version 1:1.0.13-3.
>
> Can anyone suggest what causes this issue and how to prevent it?
>
> Best regards,
> Greg Marks

  i wish i had better answers for you than to suggest
upgrade.  so many changes have been made to MATE since
1.16...  i'm not sure if the MATE devs would even get 
into trying to debug.


  songbird

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Stefan Monnier]

>> So the actual disk isn't to blame (cat'ing a file that was just saved
>> won't look at the disk anyway).
> Whats it look at 5+ minutes later?

Same difference: if `cat` can't see it, then the change hasn't been
received by the OS at all (even less so by the underlying disk).

> The file had not been updated yet an hour later. Ext4's journal in my 
> understanding has a maximum of 5 minutes to sync?  Its now around 10 
> hours later and has not yet been updated with the last two lines I'd 
> added.

The changes you see in `cat`s output will be transferred to disk
eventually, yes.  But those that aren't visible to `cat` just don't
exist, as far as the OS is concerned.

> What else is a good editor?

Is that a trick question?


Stefan

Re: Ideal place to set environment variables

[Greg Wooledge]

On Sat, Apr 07, 2018 at 11:47:19AM +0100, Jonathan de Boyne Pollard wrote:
> 
>   

Really? :-(

> 
> 
> The $ metacharacter is documented in the FreeBSD
>   manual page that I pointed to before, alongside a ~
>   metacharacter which yields your desired result fairly trivially. 

OK.  I confess I only looked at the "setenv" section which says "A
comma-separated list of environment variables and values to which they
are to be set."  Then jumped to the bottom to look for examples, of
which there are zero.

I guess I should have read every single sentence, to find the part
about `~' and `$'.  That looks sufficient for all the real-world
cases I've seen.

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[songbird]

Gene Heskett wrote:
> Greetings folks;
>
> Updodate Wheezy, realtime kernel because machine is running linuxcnc.
>
> Editor is geany and file is left open in the editor, and reloaded into 
> linuxcnc as changes are made to the file, and saved but not closed.
>
> And eventually the updates made to the file are not actually saved, geany 
> does not report an error and does say success by changing the filename 
> font from red which tells me its been modified, back to black in the 
> window top border, but does not actually update the file on the disk, 
> and the only fix seems to be a reboot.
>
> Is this a known fault with some SSD's? Or???

  i'm not familiar with geany or linuxcnc...  any options
in geany for save interval?

  what kind of file system?  what are the mount options
in fstab?  type of SSD?

  a sync once in a while like other poster recommended
may be a help as it would also clear out any waiting io
but i'm not sure how much that may interfere with the
realtime aspects if you have some large chunks waiting.

  i've used ionice for some things to make sure they
don't interfere on an older system with limited
capacity.  my current machine is a screamer in comparison
so i've not had to do that.


  songbird

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[tomas]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Mon, Apr 09, 2018 at 05:53:18AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Sunday 08 April 2018 23:13:28 Stefan Monnier wrote:
> 
> > >> > And eventually the updates made to the file are not actually
> > >> > saved,
> > >>
> > >> Can you be more precise than "eventually"?
> > >
> > > Probably 100+ edits and saves over 4 or 5 hours.
> > >
> > >> More importantly: what makes you think they're not actually saved?
> > >
> > > Going to another shell and cat'ing the file shows the old contents.
> >
> > So the actual disk isn't to blame (cat'ing a file that was just saved
> > won't look at the disk anyway).
> 
> Whats it look at 5+ minutes later?
> 
> The file had not been updated yet an hour later. Ext4's journal in my 
> understanding has a maximum of 5 minutes to sync?  Its now around 10 
> hours later and has not yet been updated with the last two lines I'd 
> added.

If the file system stays mounted, this all is irrelevant: it's the
OS's job to present all applications a consistent view of the
file system. Once the writing application (Geany, or whatever) has
committed its write the modification should be visible, whether
the OS has committed its buffers to the storage or not.

> > Sounds like a bug in your text editor.

Yep, that would be my hunch too.

Cheers
- -- t
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlrLTkEACgkQBcgs9XrR2kYxKQCdEe0tomEdxB/RbDSbhhlItssk
GPUAnjaWd8Uid0K4/iJsWE9D+hmapd9s
=TeCh
-END PGP SIGNATURE-

Re: install printer

[Brian]

On Mon 09 Apr 2018 at 10:23:07 -, Dan Purgert wrote:

> Georgi Naplatanov wrote:
> > On 04/09/2018 10:24 AM, mess-mate wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >> howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> >> Cups seems installed but what next.
> >> regards
> >> 
> >
> >
> > open http://localhost:631/ with your favorite browser and add the printer.
> >
> > By the way I couldn't see your printer there. It may not be supported by
> > CUPS out of the box.
> >
> > http://www.openprinting.org/printers
> 
> It's an HP -- best bet would be checking hplip.

Indeed, this is the most straightforward and trouble free way of
getting the printing *and* scanning functions of the device working
with 'hp-setup -i'.

For printing, http://localhost:631/ plus printer-driver-hpcups is
sufficient without hplip installed. Scanning would have to be set up
separately with libsane-hpaio.

-- 
Brian.

Re: How to limit udisks2 rules to a specific device?

[Richard Hector]

On 09/04/18 04:50, Mikhail Morfikov wrote:
> When it comes to mounting devices, I have two simple rules:
> 1) only root can do it.
> 2) in some cases only defined users can mount some specific devices.
> 
> So I want to forbid all users (except root) to access all devices that people
> can possibly plug into a USB port. But devices can be distinguished by, for
> instance, some serial number (or something else). I have a USB drive, and I 
> want
> it to be accessed and mounted by my regular user without asking me for 
> password
> each time I do so.

I assume faking the serial number is too difficult to be worried about?

Richard



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: Help needed with home network configuration

[Dan Purgert]

Celejar wrote:
> On Sun, 8 Apr 2018 00:32:05 - (UTC)
> Dan Purgert  wrote:
>> If you have a device repeating a WiFi signal, it *will* use the same
>> channel as the upstream AP.  It *cannot* use a different channel.
>> 
>> In the event you have a dual-band AP, and the following conditions are
>> true
>> 
>>   - 5GHz uplink
>>   - 2.4 GHz for clients
>> 
>> Then you are not "repeating" the WiFi signal to the downstream client
>> devices (and the throughput losses I mentioned would not come into
>> play).
>
> There are also apparently some units (even consumer grade ones), that
> have two diferent radios both on (different) 5 GHz bands, so one could
> use one for client access and one for uplink (although I have no
> experience with this):

Well, nice that they're starting to do that ... it's still a Linksys, so
(not having any experience with it either), I'd lean toward it not being
that great of a device.

But then again, my views are skewed by dealing with equipment that'll
handle 50-60 (active) connections per radio (anything more, and there's
simply not enough bandwidth on the AP -- granted wave-2 ac / MU-MIMO is
quite interesting in that regard).

-- 
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5  4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281

Re: install printer

[Dan Purgert]

Georgi Naplatanov wrote:
> On 04/09/2018 10:24 AM, mess-mate wrote:
>> Hi,
>> howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
>> Cups seems installed but what next.
>> regards
>> 
>
>
> open http://localhost:631/ with your favorite browser and add the printer.
>
> By the way I couldn't see your printer there. It may not be supported by
> CUPS out of the box.
>
> http://www.openprinting.org/printers

It's an HP -- best bet would be checking hplip.


-- 
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5  4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281

Re: Help needed with home network configuration

[Dan Purgert]

Celejar wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Apr 2018 10:00:31 - (UTC)
> Dan Purgert  wrote:
>
>> Celejar wrote:
>> > On Tue, 3 Apr 2018 11:30:24 - (UTC)
>> > Dan Purgert  wrote:
>> >> [...]
>> >> 
>> >> Yep, you've got the terms right.  
>> >> 
>> >> Does the buffalo also provide wifi access to other clients close to it?
>> >> or is it JUST trying to pretend that it's a client device to the
>> >> TP-Link?
>> >
>> > I'm not using the Buffalo to provide wireless connectivity to any
>> > clients. The page I linked to does have instructions for doing that,
>> > but I don't need it.
>> 
>> Good deal.  Using the buffalo as a wifi repeater would kill throughput
>> for everything connected to it :)
>
> Yes, I did have that impression. I even worry about whether its
> repeating function is hurting wifi for everything on the 2.4 GHz band,
> even those connecting to the TP-Link, but I really don't have much on
> 2.4 to begin with, just a couple of legacy devices (printer, old
> Android phone) that don't support 5 GHz and aren't using much bandwidth.

Pretty much it boils down to "repeaters" ... well, repeat.  The smarter
ones these days (i.e. not linksys,etc) *MAY* only repeat when they have
a connected client.

Otherwise it's "Rx a frame [from the AP], Tx that frame". In effect,
this will halve the throughput capacity of your WLAN (on that channel /
frequency, anyway).


-- 
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5  4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281

Re: install printer

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 09 April 2018 03:24:40 mess-mate wrote:

> Hi,
> howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> Cups seems installed but what next.
> regards

All of the setup tools are available by pointing your browser at 
localhost:631.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: SSD's and many edits of a single file

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 08 April 2018 23:13:28 Stefan Monnier wrote:

> >> > And eventually the updates made to the file are not actually
> >> > saved,
> >>
> >> Can you be more precise than "eventually"?
> >
> > Probably 100+ edits and saves over 4 or 5 hours.
> >
> >> More importantly: what makes you think they're not actually saved?
> >
> > Going to another shell and cat'ing the file shows the old contents.
>
> So the actual disk isn't to blame (cat'ing a file that was just saved
> won't look at the disk anyway).

Whats it look at 5+ minutes later?

The file had not been updated yet an hour later. Ext4's journal in my 
understanding has a maximum of 5 minutes to sync?  Its now around 10 
hours later and has not yet been updated with the last two lines I'd 
added.

> Sounds like a bug in your text editor.

Maybe, its geany. Lots of people seem to like gedit, but its saves are 
the cause of important configuration files being written back to disk 
with the line order totally trashed, as if you had thrown it on the 
floor in 512 byte pieces, then picked it back up and reassembled it in 
random order. Then try to recover a 1400 LOC configuration file...

Thats happened using gedit enough, on several different machines here 
that its been expunged from my systems, all of them.

Nano would do what I need, but its half a screen jump scroll leads to 
mistakes on my part because its too easy to loose track of the cursor 
when it does scroll.

What else is a good editor? And lets not start yet another vim vs emacs 
war. kwrite and kate come to mind. I'm running Trinity Desktop, maybe I 
should check them out. Whatever, needs to be able to have several files 
open so I can just click back and forth on the tabs as I usually 
separate the files into what uses which cutting tool.

Advice checked out.

Thanks Stefan.

>
> Stefan



-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: add native support for bitlocker

[Darac Marjal]

On Sun, Apr 08, 2018 at 12:10:52PM +, Aaron Schneider wrote:

For work reasons, I keep some data on bitlocker-encrypted drives (FAT, FAT32, 
NTFS). Whenever I connect the drive to my debian computer, I have to manually 
mount it using dislocker from the shell. Would like the user interface did it 
for me, the same way it happens on Windows.

How can I properly file the feature request?


My first thought would be to hook dislocker into a udev rule. Presumably 
you have one drive (or a small handful) which you can uniquely identify 
(either by serial number or by filesystem UUID or similar). The idea is 
that you write a udev rule that, when udev sees that device, executes a 
script to decrypt the drive. Note that udev-executed scripts *should* 
return promptly so, if necessary, work in some sort of asyncronicity if 
you need to ask for a password or if decryption takes some time.



--
For more information, please reread.


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature

Resources ruilen?

[Paul van der Vlis]

Hallo,

Ik ben op zoek naar iemand buiten Groningen die resources in het
datacenter (of vergelijkbaar) met me wil ruilen. Dus jij krijgt
resources bij mij, en ik bij jouw. En wellicht kunnen we ook op een
andere manier samenwerken.

In eerste instantie denk ik aan een virtuele machine, maar het zou ook
een rackserver of VPS kunnen zijn.

Ik beschik over een afgesloten rack in TCN datahotel Groningen in de
zaal van Duocast, er is daar "groene stroom".
http://www.tcndatahotels.com/
https://duocast.nl/

Ik gebruik vooral Supermicro hardware met Debian en KVM/Qemu/libvirt
voor virtualisatie.

Groeten,
Paul


-- 
Paul van der Vlis Linux systeembeheer Groningen
https://www.vandervlis.nl/

Re: install printer

[Georgi Naplatanov]

On 04/09/2018 10:24 AM, mess-mate wrote:
> Hi,
> howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> Cups seems installed but what next.
> regards
> 


open http://localhost:631/ with your favorite browser and add the printer.

By the way I couldn't see your printer there. It may not be supported by
CUPS out of the box.

http://www.openprinting.org/printers

Kind regards
Georgi

Re: install printer

[deloptes]

mess-mate wrote:

> Hi,
> howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
> Cups seems installed but what next.
> regards

use URL http://localhost:631 -> Administration -> Add Printer

it might be you need additional packages like hplip and/or hpijs

regards

install printer

[mess-mate]

Hi,
howto installing my HP ENVY printer ?
Cups seems installed but what next.
regards