Re: regarding firewall discussion

[Jeremy Ardley]

On 31/5/22 10:17 am, mick crane wrote:
regarding firewall discussion I'm uncertain how firewalls are supposed 
to work.
I think the idea is that nothing is accepted unless it is in response 
to a request.
What's to stop some spurious instructions being sent in response to 
genuine request?


regards
mick



In the usual firewall tool iptables, you can tell it to accept related 
connections.
That is it remembers the host you just sent a request to and will let in 
new connections from that host on some other port


--
Jeremy



OpenPGP_signature
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: regarding firewall discussion

[Emanuel Berg]

mick crane wrote:

> regarding firewall discussion I'm uncertain how firewalls
> are supposed to work. I think the idea is that nothing is
> accepted unless it is in response to a request. What's to
> stop some spurious instructions being sent in response to
> genuine request?

Firewalls can have whitelists, blocklists, employ various
algorithms to determine what should pass and what should not
based on characteristics of the material but also factors such
as time, recent activity and so on - you can think of a lot of
things to do and try ...

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

regarding firewall discussion

[mick crane]

regarding firewall discussion I'm uncertain how firewalls are supposed 
to work.
I think the idea is that nothing is accepted unless it is in response to 
a request.
What's to stop some spurious instructions being sent in response to 
genuine request?


regards
mick

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[Edwin Zimmerman]

On 5/30/22 09:41, Greg Wooledge wrote:
> On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 07:13:54AM -0500, Tom Browder wrote:
>> No worries. All those responses about the subject IP now are the norm for a
>> bare-iron server ready for use by a customer, yours truly. It is the same
>> server I messed up the firewall with and locked myself out of. The OS has
>> been reinstalled and is ready for me to use again.
> Why are you installing a firewall on a web server *at all*?
Because it prevents accidental port exposure.  It's not uncommon to be running 
some other service other than the web server, and accidental configurations 
happen all the time.  A firewall is a simple security measure to contain such 
problems.

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[Edwin Zimmerman]

On 5/30/22 15:58, Joe wrote:
> You pick the programming language (and OS, and
> hardware platform) to suit the job to be done, not the other way
> around.
Absolutely spot on!  If you want to write a device driver, you need to look at 
the operating system the driver will run on and see what programming language 
the documentation suggests.  On linux, that will be either C or in a few new 
cases Rust.  A driver for Windows would most likely be written in C++.  I'm not 
familiar with programming Mac or mobile platforms, but I know they have their 
preferred languages as well.  If you are writing a user-space tool or program, 
you probably want to look in a different direction than C++.

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Emanuel Berg]

IL Ka wrote:

> With a non-interactive frontend you can install all packages
> and configure them with one script.

Right, and I happen to know exactly what I want, I want - from
the repos, with the default configuration - if by
configuration you mean install options - these programs

  feh
  mpv
  openbsd-cwm
  picom
  rtorrent
  tmux
  xpdf
  xterm
  zsh

I also want Emacs but I'll install that myself thank you since
I like a more recent version than the one found in the repos.
But I used that or the corresponding ones during that period
for several years so I know there's nothing wrong with it.

Any idea how that would look? I mean the feh-zsh list.

> There is a term "Configuration as code"

To me it's just a configuration file like all software has or
should have (like a man page and --help and --version
options), that's the first step, if you then would like to go
on and have a real programming language to do it (and more,
better etc) like Elisp for Emacs, Lua for mpv etc that sounds
great to me! CL for Debian maybe? Or Python since everyone
uses that. Or both, only not in combination ...

> There is a good explanation, and even a book!
> https://martinfowler.com/bliki/InfrastructureAsCode.html

Amazing!

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[Timothy M Butterworth]

On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 1:18 PM Susmita/Rajib  wrote:

> Hello!
>
> A wonderfully informative email indeed. It entices me to more specific
> questions.
>
> I would like to partially quote you to maintain a context for my reply.
>
> You said, "... C++ would be much easier to learn once you understand C ..."
> I learnt c, but didn't like it, as I didn't find a list of specific
> modules (or reusable example code-snippets) to achieve an objective.
> The header files are very, very complex and they can't be understood.
> The header files use machine language and push those obscure portions
> into tiny little black boxes, under the carpet, away from our sight. I
> used cscope to read the header files and understand them, but in vain.
> To me, c appears as a hodge podge of low level and high level
> programming languages. Not a complete programming language in itself.
> c language appears to encourage a complex ecosystem of numerous
> programmers coming from diverse fields, all working as individual
> parts of a very complex machinery.
> But c ecosystem appears to discourage a complete programmer who has a
> complete idea of the entire machinery and its individual components. A
> slight imbalance in super-specialisation could bring down an entire
> system.
>
> I was really excited by the scope provided by Java. It appeared so
> easy to me that I could easily build a functional program, to aid
> memorising alphabets abcd... in the reverse, "which alphabet came
> before which alphabet" using a random function, in a graphical
> environment.
>
> I had read that Java could be used to build an entire Operating System
> up by itself. In essence, therefore, device drivers as well.
> Unfortunately, that project of building an OS in Java was dropped long
> back. Java isn't used for building device drivers for the industry, so
> far as I have gathered.
>
> Regarding my note, "...  had a programming language been developed
> that could address both the lowest microprocessor(machine)-level to
> the most advanced user level programming, reading, comprehension and
> application  ...", you said, "... Python should be your choice! ..."
> Is it supposed to mean that theoretically, an entire OS could be built
> up from scratch using Python? Including device drivers?
> You said, "... there is even MicroPython for microcontrollers ...". So
> according to your comment, python should be able to build a device
> driver as well as an OS. And there already exist such implementations.
>
> I was trying to find out if c++ could be used to build device drivers.
> You said, "... Linux drivers are written in C, but technically you can
> mix languages: use C++ and link it against C ...". But I would request
> more specificity here:(a)  if c++ could be used without using any
> other programming language to build a device driver. (b)  If it is
> practised industrially.
>
> I often wonder aloud why c wasn't re-built to have the modularity and
> OOP structure of Java. It would definitely have helped. Yes, I know
> that the demand wasn't there, when programmers thought that 1024KB
> would address all problems of the world.
>
> But a language could be re-built to incorporate every programming
> need. Then aided by a huge library of code snippets, functions,
> objects, etc., like Oracle Java repository. But to reach the lowest
> level possible.
>

The problem with JAVA is Oracle. If you build something good that goes into
main stream use you risk Oracle suing you like they are with Google
Android.

I began learning python, but I am not sure if python could be used in
> place of Assembly (or machine) Language, addressing programming needs
> from the lowest to the highest level. Perhaps your notes answer my
> doubts. Would like to know more.
>
> For example, like Deepmind's Alpha Code AI, writing codes as per
> requirements, research is getting there.
> So I would like to develop an understanding of programming from the
> lowest level to the highest level. The way programming is approached
> in textbooks doesn't suit me. I can't have the flexibility to use
> programming like a cobweb or a network, jumping from lowest level to
> the highest level according to my need.
>
> I read that micropython is written in c. So it is just like
> circumlocuting to the same point from where it began.
>
> So confusing!
>
> Hope that some confusions shall be set aside in your subsequent posts.
>
> You also said, "... debian-gcc maintainers maintain the gcc package
> for Debian, they are not responsible for teaching people C or C++ ..."
>
> I didn't expect them to teach, but only to share their insights and
> information. In contrast, the debian-python group readily shared
> information with me on python.
>
> Best wishes,
> Rajib
>
>
>
>
> To: debian-user 
> Subject: Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached,
> if learning objectives are sought to be customised?
> From: IL Ka 
> Date: Mon, 30 May 2022 16:34:33 +0300
> Message-id: 

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[Timothy M Butterworth]

On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 1:24 PM Tom Browder  wrote:

> On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 09:03 IL Ka  wrote:
>
>> IMHO: It is better to have a firewall and block (policy -- drop) INPUT
>> and FORWARD by default.
>> And open only ports that must be opened.
>> This will help if you install some software that listens for 0.0.0.0 by
>> accident
>>
>
> From my limited research, that seems to be the prevailing view.
>
> -Tom
>

If you have firewalld try running:
`firewall-cmd --permanent --add-service=http`
`firewall-cmd --reload`

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[IL Ka]

>
>
> Noninteractive is the word! Thank you.
>
>
This is a technical term covered by debconf(7) :)
https://manpages.debian.org/bullseye/debconf-doc/debconf.7.en.html

The idea is covered here:
https://manpages.debian.org/bullseye/debconf-doc/debconf-devel.7.en.html


With a non-interactive frontend you can install all packages and configure
them with one script.

If you want to patch configuration (files in ``/etc``) you can use either
patch(1) or some VCS (like git).



> But obviously people can call it declarative if the like to,
> maybe a fancy word like that is what it takes to promote it.
>

There is a term "Configuration as code" (or "infrastructure as code"). The
idea is to describe your configuration using a text file, store it in VCS
and apply.

Lots of tools are available:

* Ansible
* Chef
* Puppet
* Terraform



>
> Anyway how does that work in practice? Maybe it is even
> described in the man page you refer to ...
>


debconf is covered in manpage. For best practices google for "configuration
as code".

There is a good explanation, and even a book!

https://martinfowler.com/bliki/InfrastructureAsCode.html

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Emanuel Berg]

Dan Ritter wrote:

>>> You can do it with puppet, chef, ansible, salt... 
>>>
>>> You can go further into it with guix and nix.
>>>
>>> It can be quite a lot of work
>> 
>> Okay, but why so, since it looks like the task to be done
>> is just a config file that's iterated by a script and
>> boiled down to suitable commands that are well-known, not
>> the least because we are used to do them manually?
>
> For the very obvious reason that there is one major
> additional task to go from "I have configured this machine
> the way I want it" to "This machine's configuration is now
> encoded in a language I needed to learn for the purpose" --
> and a second task to go to "and it can be generalized to run
> on multiple machines".
>
> So if you're doing it for one machine, you effectively have
> to do it twice; if you're doing it for N machines, you have
> to do it about 2 and a half times. If N is much larger than
> 3, you win.

... what do you mean?

It's the same package manager on all N system, you only need
to do it once.

Also, there is no need to encode the configuration in any
advanced "language", it can be basic configuration like for
xpdf or mpv or whatever.

OTOH if you want a real programming language and environment
for configuration and extension (e.g., Elisp for Emacs, Lua
for mpv etc) that's doable as well, no doubt.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Dan Ritter]

Emanuel Berg wrote: 
> Dan Ritter wrote:
> 
> > You can do it with puppet, chef, ansible, salt... 
> >
> > You can go further into it with guix and nix.
> >
> > It can be quite a lot of work
> 
> Okay, but why so, since it looks like the task to be done is
> just a config file that's iterated by a script and boiled down
> to suitable commands that are well-known, not the least
> because we are used to do them manually?

For the very obvious reason that there is one major additional
task to go from "I have configured this machine the way I want
it" to "This machine's configuration is now encoded in a
language I needed to learn for the purpose" -- and a second task
to go to "and it can be generalized to run on multiple
machines".

So if you're doing it for one machine, you effectively have to
do it twice; if you're doing it for N machines, you have to do
it about 2 and a half times. If N is much larger than 3, you
win.

-dsr-

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Emanuel Berg]

IL Ka wrote:

> You are probably looking for unattended installation and
> configuration using "noninteractive" dbconf frontend.
> https://manpages.debian.org/bullseye/debconf-doc/debconf.7.en.html#Unattended_Package_Installation

Noninteractive is the word! Thank you. 

But obviously people can call it declarative if the like to,
maybe a fancy word like that is what it takes to promote it.
Now why every that would be needed, since it's such a basic
idea (the config file) and it's present for everything else
already ... but evidently.

Anyway how does that work in practice? Maybe it is even
described in the man page you refer to ...

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: OBS sur Debian pas de visuel pour la capture d'écran

[Bertrand Delaunay]

Le 30/05/2022 à 08:53, Haricophile a écrit :

Le Sun, 29 May 2022 22:28:00 +0200,
firenze...@orange.fr a écrit :


Bonjour à tous,

Je voudrais utiliser OBS sur Debian pour faire des tutoriels vidéos.

Mais quand je veux filmer tout ce qui ce passe sur mon écran (Capture
d'écran XSHM), je n'ai rien en aperçu à part mon curseur qui se
balade sur fond noir. J'utilise le serveur graphique Wayland,
j'ignore si ça a un impact sur OBS.


Si Wayland pose problème, ce qui me semble fort possible vu que
justement la gestion de l'affichage diffère beaucoup, pourquoi ne pas
utiliser Xorg ? Je ne sais pas ce que tu utilise comme bureau, mais à
priori ils fonctionnent tous si tu lance ta session avec Xorg.



Et effectivement,l'aperçu de la capture d'écran s'affiche bien dans OBS 
sous une session Xorg.OBS Studio ne semble pas encore entièrement 
supporter Wayland, du moins dans sa version Debian.

Re: Why is heyu not in debian?

[gene heskett]

On Monday, 30 May 2022 11:18:34 EDT David Wright wrote:
> On Mon 30 May 2022 at 11:00:50 (-0400), The Wanderer wrote:
> > On 2022-05-30 at 10:49, gene heskett wrote:
> > > I have been useing it, or writing its functions to talk to a cm-11a
> > > interface to all the X10 modules for remoting and automating things
> > > about the house, since back in the 80's. Suffering from 2, 2T
> > > seagate
> > > failures in the last 2 months, the rebuild of a workiing system and
> > > all its backups has been slow. I *think* I still have a working
> > > CM-11a, but its recently come to my attention that there is now an
> > > arduino kit to emulate the CM-11a. That removes the lack of a
> > > computer to line power interface that for some unk reason, has not
> > > been available from X10 for about 20 years now.  We can now make
> > > our
> > > own.
> > > 
> > > So I issued a 'sudo apt install heyu", only to have apt report it
> > > couldn't find such a critter.
> > > 
> > > Why is that?
> > 
> > A bit of Googling finds https://sources.debian.org/src/heyu/ , which
> > in turn (via the version-specific sub-pages) finds
> > https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/heyu , which shows that this *was* in
> > Debian a long time ago; specifically, it was part of slink and
> > potato,
> > and the last version included was both x86-only and packaged back in
> > 2001.
> > 
> > I've looked for packages.debian.org information on it, but found
> > nothing.
> But grepping x10 does bring up something called bottlerocket. Be aware
> that googling throws up a lot of other "bottlerocket"s.
> 
> Package: bottlerocket
> 
> Description-en: Utility to control X10 Firecracker devices for home
> automation A command-line utility to interact with the Firecracker
> version of X10's home control devices (wireless home automation to
> control lights, cameras, appliances via a small transmitter that plugs
> into the standard RS-232 serial port of a computer).

I am somewhat fam with that device but it adds another iffy link between 
the computer and the power line via some sort of a slow, not quite wifi 
radio. The CM-11a is a direct connection and considerably more dependable 
in addition to having enough memory to execute your christmas lights on 
and off at dusk to full dark for a whole year at a time. Without heyu's 
attention.

>   Also included is rocket launcher, a graphical frontend to
> bottlerocket. If you want this functionality you should have wish
> (tk8.3 or tk8.4 - the Tcl/Tk interpreter) installed.
> 
> The pages on the heyu website appear to be rather ancient.

Their mailing list is somewhat fresher if you can find it.

Its a mature app, real developement was done

capabilities limited by the makers of the powerline hardware. Several 
other hardware makers have come, and some gone in the last 3 decades, and 
heyu has learned how to handle most of them.  I just built the latest 
tarball and installed it, seems to work ok with my limited choice of 
hardware.

> There are people active, eg for the Pi:
> https://forums.raspberrypi.com/viewtopic.php?t=327319
> 
> Cheers,
> David.

Thank you David.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

Re: Why is heyu not in debian?

[gene heskett]

On Monday, 30 May 2022 11:00:50 EDT The Wanderer wrote:
> On 2022-05-30 at 10:49, gene heskett wrote:
> > Greetings all;
> > 
> > I have been useing it, or writing its functions to talk to a cm-11a
> > interface to all the X10 modules for remoting and automating things
> > about the house, since back in the 80's. Suffering from 2, 2T seagate
> > failures in the last 2 months, the rebuild of a workiing system and
> > all its backups has been slow. I *think* I still have a working
> > CM-11a, but its recently come to my attention that there is now an
> > arduino kit to emulate the CM-11a. That removes the lack of a
> > computer to line power interface that for some unk reason, has not
> > been available from X10 for about 20 years now.  We can now make our
> > own.
> > 
> > So I issued a 'sudo apt install heyu", only to have apt report it
> > couldn't find such a critter.
> > 
> > Why is that?
> 
> A bit of Googling finds https://sources.debian.org/src/heyu/ , which in
> turn (via the version-specific sub-pages) finds
> https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/heyu , which shows that this *was* in
> Debian a long time ago; specifically, it was part of slink and potato,
> and the last version included was both x86-only and packaged back in
> 2001.
> 
> I've looked for packages.debian.org information on it, but found
> nothing.
> 
> 
> More Googling revealed that what appears to be you yourself responded
> to someone asking about why heyu was not in Debian, back in 2005:
> 
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2005/03/msg02525.html
> 
> That answer implies that the removal might have been for licensing
> reasons. https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2002/12/msg00073.html
> (from 2002) seems to support that idea, and references bug #149128.
> 
> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=149128 indicates what
> happened, but doesn't contain much explanation as to why; it would
> seem fine to have moved heyu into non-free, rather than removing it
> from the archive entirely.
> 
> My best guess remains that the package maintainer decided (perhaps for
> that licensing reason) to not continue maintaining it, and so it wound
> up being dropped.

I faintly remember something like that, but I believe the license has now 
been changed to gplv2, which should remove that objection. I just dl'd 
the latest tarball, ./Configured it, sudo make install, and it thinks its 
working. So it seems to build/install on modern hardware.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[IL Ka]

>
>
> The header files are very, very complex and they can't be understood.
>
No reason to read header files.
Both C and C++ have ANSI standards, which developers code against.
Just read standard and do not bother with reading header files.
But start with a good book.

Studying C by reading header files is like studying linux by reading kernel
source code instead of man pages)


> To me, c appears as a hodge podge of low level and high level
> programming languages.

Yes, C is a pretty low level language. Do not use it to build websites or
mobile bank clients: it is possible, but not convenient.



> I was really excited by the scope provided by Java. It appeared so
> easy to me that I could easily build a functional program, to aid
> memorising alphabets abcd... in the reverse, "which alphabet came
> before which alphabet" using a random function, in a graphical
> environment.
>
Java is a good language (Kotlin also good and has full interop with Java)
Debian provides OpenJDK package and could be used to do Java development.
Intellij Idea Community edition is a free IDE for Java that also works on
Debian.

Many enterprise systems and mobile applications (Android is based on Linux)
are written on Java and Kotlin.


>
> I had read that Java could be used to build an entire Operating System
> up by itself. In essence, therefore, device drivers as well.
>
Well, any turing-complete language could be used to build anything (this is
what CS professors tell us)
The question is whether it is convenient or not, and how much time does
it take.

If you have unlimited time and do not care about performance, you can write
OS on bash:
just create an LLVM backend that compiles bash to the assembler for your
CPU.


Once there was a specification of CPU to run JVM on (google for "picoJava")
Not sure if it exists IRL, but if it does -- you can run Java on bare
metal:)



> Unfortunately, that project of building an OS in Java was dropped long
> back. Java isn't used for building device drivers for the industry, so
> far as I have gathered.
>

There are several problems with high level languages for driver development.
* Garbage collection complicates direct memory management (and many devices
use MMIO) and also makes code less predictable (you can't predict when
memory will be freed)
* Most OSes have C API, and Java-C interop is awkward
* To run Java you need to either run JVM in the kernel or compile Java to
the native code (JVM compiles Java to the native code while running (JIT)
but not before)
Technically, you can run JVM in the kernel (there are several virtual
machines in the kernel already: for AML, ebpf etc) but it will pollute the
kernel and sounds like an anecdote.
Even java code compiled into the native code needs runtime (for GC) and
nobody will add such runtime to the kernel.

Most kernel developers are happy with "C" and suggesting them to use Java
for kernel development is like suggesting Linux sysadmin to use Windows:
probably a bad idea.

While in theory any language can be used for anything, practically there is
no one language to fit it all.

People use one language to build a website and another language to write
device drivers.



> Is it supposed to mean that theoretically, an entire OS could be built
> up from scratch using Python? Including device drivers?
>

That means you can build a robot and program it in Python.

Honestly, I do not think device drivers are the right things to start
programming with.
Find a language that you like (be it Java, Python,  C#, Ruby, whatever) and
write software!



> You said, "... Linux drivers are written in C, but technically you can
> mix languages: use C++ and link it against C ...". But I would request
> more specificity here:(a)  if c++ could be used without using any
> other programming language to build a device driver. (b)  If it is
> practised industrially.
>

In OS X (Apple) they have "DriverKit": C++ (class-based) API to write
drivers.
Other mainstream OSes provide C API for drivers, but again: C++ is backward
compatible with C in most cases.

C++ provides "extern "C"" to export symbols to C and can also call any C
function, so yes: you can write a driver with C++ even for Linux,
but probably you would need to disable some C++ features (like Exceptions,
probably RTTI etc).
Doing so is very hackish.

Also note that Linus hates C++. If you want to read lots of bad words, ask
him about C++ in kernel development (please, dont)


I often wonder aloud why c wasn't re-built to have the modularity and
> OOP structure of Java.

If you want to change language heavily, you have choices:
* Break backward compatibility and lose an uncountable number of code lines
and years of development. This is not what you want to do.
* Increase language complexity (this is what happened with C++). And
complex language means bugs. And bugs in kernel are unacceptable.

OOP (you mean classes, right?) is also controversial. Sometimes it is
useful, sometimes not. Stallman hates 

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[Joe]

On Mon, 30 May 2022 22:31:56 +0530
"Susmita/Rajib"  wrote:


>  To me, c appears as a hodge podge of low level and
> high level programming languages. Not a complete programming language
> in itself. c language appears to encourage a complex ecosystem of
> numerous programmers coming from diverse fields, all working as
> individual parts of a very complex machinery.

C is a language core, very low level and the implementation can be very
fast, almost one-to-one with assembler.

It is completely useless by itself, and will only actually do things
with the assistance of libraries. It requires a library to read a
keyboard, write to a screen etc. There is a set of standard libraries
provided with any C implementation.

> But c ecosystem appears to discourage a complete programmer who has a
> complete idea of the entire machinery and its individual components. A
> slight imbalance in super-specialisation could bring down an entire
> system.

If you're saying there should be a definitive set of libraries, and
nobody should ever be permitted to extend this set, I think you're on a
non-starter. C itself is fully defined and easy to learn. The idea of
learning the functions and interfaces of every library ever written for
C is not a trivial one, and when you finish you'll find another few
thousand were written while you were doing it.
> 
> I was really excited by the scope provided by Java. It appeared so
> easy to me that I could easily build a functional program, to aid
> memorising alphabets abcd... in the reverse, "which alphabet came
> before which alphabet" using a random function, in a graphical
> environment.
> 
> I had read that Java could be used to build an entire Operating System
> up by itself.

That is exactly what C was written to do, specifically in order to
write Unix. See Ken Thompson and Dennis Ritchie.

> In essence, therefore, device drivers as well.
> Unfortunately, that project of building an OS in Java was dropped long
> back. Java isn't used for building device drivers for the industry, so
> far as I have gathered.

I've seen a device driver written in Delphi, which is a visual OO
Pascal. That's hardly assembly language. I rather suspect that device
drivers are written in whatever way suits the programmer, rather than
using a particularly specified language.
> 

>  But I would request
> more specificity here:(a)  if c++ could be used without using any
> other programming language to build a device driver. (b)  If it is
> practised industrially.

Why is this important to you? If you plan to spend much time writing
device drivers yourself, you will find out for yourself the most
practical way to do it. You pick the programming language (and OS, and
hardware platform) to suit the job to be done, not the other way
around.
> 
> I often wonder aloud why c wasn't re-built to have the modularity and
> OOP structure of Java. 

Isn't that basically what Stroustrup did, arguably not in the best
possible way? C++ is much older than Java, which almost certainly drew
heavily on experience with C++. But Java was designed as an interpreted
language, like Pascal, and while it can be compiled to machine code,
that wasn't really the intended usage, so it's not really built for
speed.

> Yes, I know
> that the demand wasn't there, when programmers thought that 1024KB
> would address all problems of the world.

C was written when 64K of RAM was typical, for the early minicomputers.
> 
> But a language could be re-built to incorporate every programming
> need. Then aided by a huge library of code snippets, functions,
> objects, etc., like Oracle Java repository. But to reach the lowest
> level possible.
> 
It seems to me you've pretty much described C, as well as what you said
was wrong with it.

As an aside, I've always found the best way of learning a new language
was to have a project of my own and to use the language manuals to find
out how to achieve what I needed to do. I learned Pascal on the BBC
Micro in writing a simple business program (no practical spreadsheet
for 32K of RAM), and my first C program wasn't Hello World, it was a
recursive program using pointers to optimally fit audio tracks on
cassettes.

-- 
Joe

Re: Problema De Login en debian

[Antonio Galicia]

El lun, 30 may 2022 a la(s) 09:54, Antonio Munno (munnoanto...@gmail.com)
escribió:

> Estimados : Acudo a Uds. para pedirles ayuda. Desde la terminal de un
> Debian 6, ingreso como usuario root y contraseña correcta y me devuelve el
> login, sin darme ningun error. No es contraseña equivocada ni login
> incorrecto. Simplemente, hace un "clear screen" y me vuelve a
> pedir usuario.¿alguna idea?
>

Entra con un usuario distinto y haces "su" a la cuenta de root para revisar
lo que puede estar pasando. Ese comportamiento puede ocurrir por un
problema que no deja arrancar el shell o que el shell termina de manera
inesperada. Si persiste el problema puedes entrar siguiendo el
procedimiento de entrar sin contraseña como cuando no tienes la contraseña
y revisar los logs en busca del que mata el inicio de sesion

Para iniciar sin contraseña al momento que presenta el menú de grub agregar
init=/bin/bash

 Saludos,
 Antonio Galicia

Eram quod es, eris quod sum
--


 Saludos,
 Antonio Galicia

Eram quod es, eris quod sum

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Emanuel Berg]

Mike Kupfer wrote:

> I have half of that, sort of. A static file has 1 package
> name per line, and each line has a usage tag like "base",
> "dev", or "emacs-build", and distro tags, like "deb10" or
> "f25". I run a script, telling it the usage and distro, and
> it spits out a list of packages. I usually redirect the list
> to a file, review and maybe edit it, and do something like
> "apt install $(cat tmp/pkgs)".
>
> I don't have the half that deletes unwanted packages, but
> that's not functionality I feel a need for.

Feel free to share, I forgot to say.

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Emanuel Berg]

Dan Ritter wrote:

> You can do it with puppet, chef, ansible, salt... 
>
> You can go further into it with guix and nix.
>
> It can be quite a lot of work

Okay, but why so, since it looks like the task to be done is
just a config file that's iterated by a script and boiled down
to suitable commands that are well-known, not the least
because we are used to do them manually?

Yes, ironic ...

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[Tom Browder]

On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 09:03 IL Ka  wrote:

> IMHO: It is better to have a firewall and block (policy -- drop) INPUT and
> FORWARD by default.
> And open only ports that must be opened.
> This will help if you install some software that listens for 0.0.0.0 by
> accident
>

>From my limited research, that seems to be the prevailing view.

-Tom

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[Tom Browder]

On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 08:42 Greg Wooledge  wrote:
..

> Unless this machine is more than just a web server...?


It does serve other purposes.

Re: Problema De Login en debian

[fernando sainz]

El lun, 30 may 2022 a las 16:54, Antonio Munno ()
escribió:

> Estimados : Acudo a Uds. para pedirles ayuda. Desde la terminal de un
> Debian 6, ingreso como usuario root y contraseña correcta y me devuelve el
> login, sin darme ningun error. No es contraseña equivocada ni login
> incorrecto. Simplemente, hace un "clear screen" y me vuelve a
> pedir usuario.¿alguna idea?
>
> desde ya, muchas gracias.
>
>

Hola.
Cuando  dices "terminal de debian" a qué te refieres , al gdm, kdm o
equivalente o a la terminal de texto que se abre al pulsar Ctrl+Alt+1 o F2
Si es el gdm ( o cualquier display manager) normalmente no deja entrar como
root (se puede configurar, pero no es aconsejable) Lo suyo es entrar con un
usuario normal y luego usar  "su" o "sudo" para ejecutar las ordenes  que
requieran privilegios de root.

Si te falla en el  tty1 o tty2 (Ctrl+Alt+F1) ahí si tienes un problema.

S2.











>
>
>
>
> *Este mensaje puede contener información confidencial y/o amparada porel
> secreto profesional. Si usted ha recibido esta comunicación porerror, por
> favor comuníquese al (54-11) 4983-8669 enforma inmediata, y elimínelo de su
> sistema. No deberá copiar la citadainformación ni divulgar su contenido a
> persona alguna. *
>
>
> *Este no es un medio utilizado para contraerobligaciones contractuales,
> excepto que, previamente, asi se hubierapactado por escrito.*
>
>
> Ing. Antonio Munno
> UTNBA Mat.4373
>
>

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[Susmita/Rajib]

Hello!

A wonderfully informative email indeed. It entices me to more specific
questions.

I would like to partially quote you to maintain a context for my reply.

You said, "... C++ would be much easier to learn once you understand C ..."
I learnt c, but didn't like it, as I didn't find a list of specific
modules (or reusable example code-snippets) to achieve an objective.
The header files are very, very complex and they can't be understood.
The header files use machine language and push those obscure portions
into tiny little black boxes, under the carpet, away from our sight. I
used cscope to read the header files and understand them, but in vain.
To me, c appears as a hodge podge of low level and high level
programming languages. Not a complete programming language in itself.
c language appears to encourage a complex ecosystem of numerous
programmers coming from diverse fields, all working as individual
parts of a very complex machinery.
But c ecosystem appears to discourage a complete programmer who has a
complete idea of the entire machinery and its individual components. A
slight imbalance in super-specialisation could bring down an entire
system.

I was really excited by the scope provided by Java. It appeared so
easy to me that I could easily build a functional program, to aid
memorising alphabets abcd... in the reverse, "which alphabet came
before which alphabet" using a random function, in a graphical
environment.

I had read that Java could be used to build an entire Operating System
up by itself. In essence, therefore, device drivers as well.
Unfortunately, that project of building an OS in Java was dropped long
back. Java isn't used for building device drivers for the industry, so
far as I have gathered.

Regarding my note, "...  had a programming language been developed
that could address both the lowest microprocessor(machine)-level to
the most advanced user level programming, reading, comprehension and
application  ...", you said, "... Python should be your choice! ..."
Is it supposed to mean that theoretically, an entire OS could be built
up from scratch using Python? Including device drivers?
You said, "... there is even MicroPython for microcontrollers ...". So
according to your comment, python should be able to build a device
driver as well as an OS. And there already exist such implementations.

I was trying to find out if c++ could be used to build device drivers.
You said, "... Linux drivers are written in C, but technically you can
mix languages: use C++ and link it against C ...". But I would request
more specificity here:(a)  if c++ could be used without using any
other programming language to build a device driver. (b)  If it is
practised industrially.

I often wonder aloud why c wasn't re-built to have the modularity and
OOP structure of Java. It would definitely have helped. Yes, I know
that the demand wasn't there, when programmers thought that 1024KB
would address all problems of the world.

But a language could be re-built to incorporate every programming
need. Then aided by a huge library of code snippets, functions,
objects, etc., like Oracle Java repository. But to reach the lowest
level possible.

I began learning python, but I am not sure if python could be used in
place of Assembly (or machine) Language, addressing programming needs
from the lowest to the highest level. Perhaps your notes answer my
doubts. Would like to know more.

For example, like Deepmind's Alpha Code AI, writing codes as per
requirements, research is getting there.
So I would like to develop an understanding of programming from the
lowest level to the highest level. The way programming is approached
in textbooks doesn't suit me. I can't have the flexibility to use
programming like a cobweb or a network, jumping from lowest level to
the highest level according to my need.

I read that micropython is written in c. So it is just like
circumlocuting to the same point from where it began.

So confusing!

Hope that some confusions shall be set aside in your subsequent posts.

You also said, "... debian-gcc maintainers maintain the gcc package
for Debian, they are not responsible for teaching people C or C++ ..."

I didn't expect them to teach, but only to share their insights and
information. In contrast, the debian-python group readily shared
information with me on python.

Best wishes,
Rajib




To: debian-user 
Subject: Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached,
if learning objectives are sought to be customised?
From: IL Ka 
Date: Mon, 30 May 2022 16:34:33 +0300
Message-id: <[]
CAHv=rm2ykzdjozjsqpc7gvjmdry1o6-xranxvcdgw_cqt--...@mail.gmail.com>
In-reply-to: <[]
caeg4czwmot23cvnbg_rrag0gbwciot-up2v117tzg+knf2c...@mail.gmail.com>
References: <[]
caeg4czwmot23cvnbg_rrag0gbwciot-up2v117tzg+knf2c...@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
 [   ...   snip   ...   ]

Re: Choix d'un gestionnaire de mots de passe

[hamster]

Le 30/05/2022 à 16:53, Erwann Le Bras a écrit :

bonjour

J'utilise keepass car multiplate-forme et accessible de partout grâce à 
mon serveur ownCloud.


l'App pour Android est une tuerie ; je rame un peu sous Linux pour 
l'autocompletion des mots de passe sous Firefox avec keepasshttp.


J'ai eu les memes soucis, qui ont été résolus en passant a keepassXC.

je testerai donc keepassXC au vu des retours que j'ai. La base reste 
compatible avec Keepass?


Oui, par contre les extensions ne sont pas les memes. Il faut prendre 
KeePassXC-Browser pour firefox et keepassxc-mail pour thunderbird.

https://github.com/kkapsner/keepassxc-mail

Re: segurança em diretório (pasta)

[Tiago T. Barrionuevo]

Na verdade o Veracrypt não encripta diretório.
Ele encripta partição ou então cria um volume encriptado (um arquivo no
seu sistema) onde você pode colocar seus diretórios/arquivos.
A desvantagem disso é que você tem que prealocar o espaço em disco
enquanto que encriptação de diretório não.

debian.jb...@simplelogin.co wrote on 5/30/22 11:51 AM:
> Também tens o veracrypt. Eu uso-o com um pendrive encriptado mais
> também pode fazer diretórios e está disponível em windows e mac alén
> do Linux.
>
> Cá tens um video sob dele (em inglês):
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C25VWAGl7Tw
>
>
>
> Roberto Mallo
> Audio Engineer & Musician
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  Mensagem original 
> On 30/05/2022, 15:32, Tiago T. Barrionuevo - tiago.bar at gmail.com <
> dcjpwexhwlccicjvbjtoszfu...@simplelogin.co> wrote:
>
>
> Conheço o cryptomator. Leonardo S. S. da Rocha wrote on 5/30/22
> 10:32 AM: > Olá meus amig@s, bom dia! > > Encontrei algumas coisas
> com pesquisa mas resolvi consultar a > comunidade. Quero encriptar
> (colocar senha) um diretório (pasta) no > debian. Utilizo o gnome
> e encontrei coisas como: > > Gnome Encfs Manager > > encontrei
> também sobre o Cryptkeeper. > > Alguém conhece as ferramentas que
> mencionei aqui ou tem uma outra para > recomendar? A ideia é ter
> um diretório local para guardar coisas como > Chaves SSH, GPG e
> códigos de recuperação de contas como google, mega e > Twitter. >
> > Agradeço as sugestões, > > Forte abraço e ótima semana à tod@s.
> > > Leonardo Rocha. > > 
>

Re: Problema De Login en debian

[Juan Acuna A.]

Revisa el driver de video que esté con la versión correcta

suena a eso el problema


saludos


On 5/30/22 10:37, Antonio Munno wrote:
Estimados : Acudo a Uds. para pedirles ayuda. Desde la terminal de un 
Debian 6, ingreso como usuario root y contraseña correcta y me 
devuelve el login, sin darme ningun error. No es contraseña equivocada 
ni login incorrecto. Simplemente, hace un "clear screen" y me vuelve a 
pedir usuario.¿alguna idea?


desde ya, muchas gracias.

/Este mensaje puede contener información confidencial y/o amparada por
el secreto profesional. Si usted ha recibido esta comunicación por
error, por favor comuníquese al (54-11) 4983-8669 en
forma inmediata, y elimínelo de su sistema. No deberá copiar la citada
información ni divulgar su contenido a persona alguna. /
/Este no es un medio utilizado para contraer
obligaciones contractuales, excepto que, previamente, asi se hubiera
pactado por escrito./


Ing. Antonio Munno
UTNBA Mat.4373


--
Juan Acuña Alvarez
  Administrador de Sistemas
  Instituto de Física
  Campus San Joaquín
  Pontificia Universidad Católica de Chile
  Vicuña Mackenna 4860, Macul
  Zipcode 7820436
  Teléfono: +562 2354 7155

Re: duvida atualização instalador

[Yuri Musachio]

Amigo, imagino que não seja possível.

A ideia de um usb bootavel é a mesma que o cd/dvd… Quando você criar/queima o 
pen drive, ele meio que “lacra” em volta dizendo onde é o bit inicial e final 
pras instruções daquela iso que você criou. Logo, se baixou a versão 10.2 
(Buster) e quer ela atualizada, isso só será possível durante a instalação se 
estiver conectado a internet. Ele verifica quais são os pacotes (seja uma iso 
completa que tenha baixado ou uma netinst), e atualiza eles durante a 
instalação.
Isso é diferente de você baixar uma imagem “testing” onde ela sempre será 
testing, e aquela imagem dará pra ser usada pra sempre.
Poderia existir uma imagem sem a versão do SO, mas só apenas “stable” como 
existe hoje com a testing/sid.

Vitor, isso não seria um “apt upgrade” na imagem já gravada no pen drive, mas 
talvez pudesse servir pro seu uso. Eu particularmente uso apenas a Testing e 
(pro meu uso) sempre funcionou de boa.





Best,

> On 27 May 2022, at 21:47, Vitor Hugo  wrote:
> 
> Boa tarde,
> 
> Estou com uma duvida se eu fizer um USB de instalação da media do Debian e 
> aplicar um "apt-get upgrade" os pacotes do USB de instalação serão 
> atualizados?
> 
> Assim na próxima instalação ou antes da instalação executar a atualização dos 
> pacotes antes de instalar o sistema as versões mais novas serão instaladas 
> automaticamente?
> 
> Obrigado.
> 

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[rhkramer]

On Monday, May 30, 2022 08:56:56 AM Susmita/Rajib wrote:
> Assuming that OO is an abbreviation of Object Oriented, your email
> whets appetite but doesn't quench it. I would have definitely been
> helped by answers to my specific queries.

I don't know if you will help this very much, but I'll point out that there is 
a group / mailing list (s...@lists.isocpp.org) which seems to focus on 
developing materials (and methods, iiuc) of teaching C++.

It is a low traffic group, and they might not be interested in answering 
specific 
questions from a learner, but (1) they might be (or somebody on the list might 
be -- or point you to one or more other lists, and/or (2) they might be 
interested in your feedback on your experiences as you try to learn C++.

Re: Why is heyu not in debian?

[David Wright]

On Mon 30 May 2022 at 11:00:50 (-0400), The Wanderer wrote:
> On 2022-05-30 at 10:49, gene heskett wrote:
> 
> > I have been useing it, or writing its functions to talk to a cm-11a 
> > interface to all the X10 modules for remoting and automating things
> > about the house, since back in the 80's. Suffering from 2, 2T seagate
> > failures in the last 2 months, the rebuild of a workiing system and
> > all its backups has been slow. I *think* I still have a working
> > CM-11a, but its recently come to my attention that there is now an
> > arduino kit to emulate the CM-11a. That removes the lack of a
> > computer to line power interface that for some unk reason, has not
> > been available from X10 for about 20 years now.  We can now make our
> > own.
> > 
> > So I issued a 'sudo apt install heyu", only to have apt report it 
> > couldn't find such a critter.
> > 
> > Why is that?
> 
> A bit of Googling finds https://sources.debian.org/src/heyu/ , which in
> turn (via the version-specific sub-pages) finds
> https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/heyu , which shows that this *was* in
> Debian a long time ago; specifically, it was part of slink and potato,
> and the last version included was both x86-only and packaged back in 2001.
> 
> I've looked for packages.debian.org information on it, but found nothing.

But grepping x10 does bring up something called bottlerocket. Be aware
that googling throws up a lot of other "bottlerocket"s.

Package: bottlerocket

Description-en: Utility to control X10 Firecracker devices for home automation
  A command-line utility to interact with the Firecracker version of
  X10's home control devices (wireless home automation to control lights,
  cameras, appliances via a small transmitter that plugs into the standard
  RS-232 serial port of a computer).
  .
  Also included is rocket launcher, a graphical frontend to bottlerocket.
  If you want this functionality you should have wish (tk8.3 or tk8.4 - the
  Tcl/Tk interpreter) installed.

The pages on the heyu website appear to be rather ancient.
There are people active, eg for the Pi:
https://forums.raspberrypi.com/viewtopic.php?t=327319

Cheers,
David.

Re: Problema De Login en debian

[Camaleón]

El 2022-05-30 a las 11:37 -0300, Antonio Munno escribió:

> Estimados : Acudo a Uds. para pedirles ayuda. Desde la terminal de un
> Debian 6, ingreso como usuario root y contraseña correcta y me devuelve el
> login, sin darme ningun error. No es contraseña equivocada ni login
> incorrecto. Simplemente, hace un "clear screen" y me vuelve a
> pedir usuario.¿alguna idea?

Habrás iniciado bien en la terminal pero sin cargar entorno gráfico.
Prueba con «startx» (mejor desde tu usaurio) si lo que quieres es 
cargar el escritorio.

Saludos,

-- 
Camaleón 

Reparar Disco duro?

[latincom]

Hola

En una Laptop Dell, dual boot; instale Bulleyes primero, y luego Slackware!

Las particiones las hice con Debian; y ambas dan error, en Slackware lo
corregi con Lilo. pero en Debian, no encuentro como reparalo.

Que herramientas que de verdad funcionen estan disponibles en Bulleyes?

--
Desde hace algun tiempo, desaparecio Lilo del instalador y ahora ni
siquiera se puede instalar Grub en una particion!

Como le hacen para NO usar Grub y SI usar Lilo?

Gracias.

Latin.

Reparar Disco duro?

[latincom]

Hola

En una Laptop Dell, dual boot; instale Bulleyes primero, y luego Slackware!

Las particiones las hice con Debian; y ambas dan error, en Slackware lo
corregi con Lilo. pero en Debian, no encuentro como reparalo.

Que herramientas que de verdad funcionen estan disponibles en Bulleyes?

--
Desde hace algun tiempo, desaparecio Lilo del instalador y ahora ni
siquiera se puede instalar Grub en una particion!

Como le hacen para NO usar Grub y SI usar Lilo?

Gracias.

Latin.

Re: Why is heyu not in debian?

[The Wanderer]

On 2022-05-30 at 10:49, gene heskett wrote:

> Greetings all;
> 
> I have been useing it, or writing its functions to talk to a cm-11a 
> interface to all the X10 modules for remoting and automating things
> about the house, since back in the 80's. Suffering from 2, 2T seagate
> failures in the last 2 months, the rebuild of a workiing system and
> all its backups has been slow. I *think* I still have a working
> CM-11a, but its recently come to my attention that there is now an
> arduino kit to emulate the CM-11a. That removes the lack of a
> computer to line power interface that for some unk reason, has not
> been available from X10 for about 20 years now.  We can now make our
> own.
> 
> So I issued a 'sudo apt install heyu", only to have apt report it 
> couldn't find such a critter.
> 
> Why is that?

A bit of Googling finds https://sources.debian.org/src/heyu/ , which in
turn (via the version-specific sub-pages) finds
https://tracker.debian.org/pkg/heyu , which shows that this *was* in
Debian a long time ago; specifically, it was part of slink and potato,
and the last version included was both x86-only and packaged back in 2001.

I've looked for packages.debian.org information on it, but found nothing.


More Googling revealed that what appears to be you yourself responded to
someone asking about why heyu was not in Debian, back in 2005:

https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2005/03/msg02525.html

That answer implies that the removal might have been for licensing
reasons. https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2002/12/msg00073.html
(from 2002) seems to support that idea, and references bug #149128.

https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=149128 indicates what
happened, but doesn't contain much explanation as to why; it would seem
fine to have moved heyu into non-free, rather than removing it from the
archive entirely.

My best guess remains that the package maintainer decided (perhaps for
that licensing reason) to not continue maintaining it, and so it wound
up being dropped.

-- 
   The Wanderer

The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all
progress depends on the unreasonable man. -- George Bernard Shaw



signature.asc
Description: OpenPGP digital signature

Re: segurança em diretório (pasta)

[debian . jb76r]

Também tens o veracrypt. Eu uso-o com um pendrive encriptado mais também pode 
fazer diretórios e está disponível em windows e mac alén do Linux.

Cá tens um video sob dele (em inglês): 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C25VWAGl7Tw

Roberto Mallo
Audio Engineer & Musician

 Mensagem original 
On 30/05/2022, 15:32, Tiago T. Barrionuevo - tiago.bar at gmail.com wrote:

> Conheço o cryptomator. Leonardo S. S. da Rocha wrote on 5/30/22 10:32 AM: > 
> Olá meus amig@s, bom dia! > > Encontrei algumas coisas com pesquisa mas 
> resolvi consultar a > comunidade. Quero encriptar (colocar senha) um 
> diretório (pasta) no > debian. Utilizo o gnome e encontrei coisas como: > > 
> Gnome Encfs Manager > > encontrei também sobre o Cryptkeeper. > > Alguém 
> conhece as ferramentas que mencionei aqui ou tem uma outra para > recomendar? 
> A ideia é ter um diretório local para guardar coisas como > Chaves SSH, GPG e 
> códigos de recuperação de contas como google, mega e > Twitter. > > Agradeço 
> as sugestões, > > Forte abraço e ótima semana à tod@s. > > Leonardo Rocha. > >

Re: duvida atualização instalador

[debian . jb76r]

Olá,

Isso seria de certo uma solução, mais eu não sei se é possivel com um pendrive 
de instalação. Eu só fiz isso com um liveUSB.

Roberto Mallo
Audio Engineer & Musician

 Mensagem original 
On 30/05/2022, 13:36, luigui - lucapgil at gmail.com wrote:

> Bom dia pessoal!
>
> Introduzindo um persistence no pen-drive nao poderia ser a solucao?
>
> Att
>
> Luigui
>
> On 28/05/2022 19:03, Vitor Hugo wrote:
>
>> Entendo, porem se tiver muitas instalações um USB atualizado ajudaria um 
>> pouco.
>>
>> Em 28/05/2022 06:30, debian.jb...@simplelogin.co escreveu:
>>
>>> Olá Vitor,
>>>
>>> Se não lembro mal (a minha última instalação do Debian foi há 2 meses) não 
>>> precisas de usar o apt no USB se tens conexão à internet. Há um paso da 
>>> inatalação no que o próprio instalador pesquisa pacotes mais recentes nos 
>>> repositorios e faz o upgrade se os atopar.
>>>
>>> Saudações,
>>>
>>> Roberto Mallo
>>> Audio Engineer & Musician
>>>
>>>  Mensagem original 
>>> A 27/05/2022, 17:11, Vitor Hugo - vitorhugo60 at hotmail.com < 
>>> jisohsjvvkdmbthckvy...@simplelogin.co > escreveu:
>>>
>>> Boa tarde,
>>>
>>> Estou com uma duvida se eu fizer um USB de instalação da media do
>>> Debian
>>> e aplicar um "apt-get upgrade" os pacotes do USB de instalação serão
>>> atualizados?
>>>
>>> Assim na próxima instalação ou antes da instalação executar a
>>> atualização dos pacotes antes de instalar o sistema as versões mais
>>> novas serão instaladas automaticamente?
>>>
>>> Obrigado.

Problema De Login en debian

[Antonio Munno]

Estimados : Acudo a Uds. para pedirles ayuda. Desde la terminal de un
Debian 6, ingreso como usuario root y contraseña correcta y me devuelve el
login, sin darme ningun error. No es contraseña equivocada ni login
incorrecto. Simplemente, hace un "clear screen" y me vuelve a
pedir usuario.¿alguna idea?

desde ya, muchas gracias.





*Este mensaje puede contener información confidencial y/o amparada porel
secreto profesional. Si usted ha recibido esta comunicación porerror, por
favor comuníquese al (54-11) 4983-8669 enforma inmediata, y elimínelo de su
sistema. No deberá copiar la citadainformación ni divulgar su contenido a
persona alguna. *


*Este no es un medio utilizado para contraerobligaciones contractuales,
excepto que, previamente, asi se hubierapactado por escrito.*


Ing. Antonio Munno
UTNBA Mat.4373

Re: Choix d'un gestionnaire de mots de passe

[Erwann Le Bras]

bonjour

J'utilise keepass car multiplate-forme et accessible de partout grâce à 
mon serveur ownCloud.


l'App pour Android est une tuerie ; je rame un peu sous Linux pour 
l'autocompletion des mots de passe sous Firefox avec keepasshttp.


je testerai donc keepassXC au vu des retours que j'ai. La base reste 
compatible avec Keepass?



Pour avoir testé
 :

 * PasswordSafe reste très basique et j'ai cru comprendre très Windows
   mais c'est celui que j'utilise au bureau (préconisation historique
   employeur)
 * MS Vault est trop compliqué ou pas compris son mode de fonctionnement



Keepass c'est un gestionnaire de mot de passe, pas en encrypteur de fichier.
Pour ça tu peux regarder du côté de veracrypt qui te permets sous 
Windows et Linux de créer un conteneur transparent pour le système hôte  
dans lequel du peux y mettre tes fichiers.

C'est entièrement utilisable en ligne de commande.
Je l'utilise pour stocker mes fichiers persos au bureau (Windows) pour 
ne pas les laisser traîner sur le PC. A la maison, je  branche la clé 
sur ma Debian et lance un .sh qui me l'ouvre et me sauvegarde le 
contenu. Seul le mot de passe est indiqué à la main.

Ya un paquet pour Debian chez l'éditeur.

Erwann

Bonjour la liste,

Quel est votre gestionnaire de mot de passe préféré et pourquoi ?

Je suis en train de tester keepass qui semble pas mal foutu,
néanmoins, une interface uniquement en ligne de commande ne serait pas
pour me déplaire.

J'ai aussi envisagé de chiffrer tout simplement un fichier
texte...l'idéal serait un outil en ligne de commande, avec quelques
fonctionnalités un peu sexy de haut niveau pour se faciliter la
manœuvre, je ne sais pas si ça existe ?

Merci pour vos retours !


amitiés,

--

Erwann

Why is heyu not in debian?

[gene heskett]

Greetings all;

I have been useing it, or writing its functions to talk to a cm-11a 
interface to all the X10 modules for remoting and automating things about 
the house, since back in the 80's. Suffering from 2, 2T seagate failures 
in the last 2 months, the rebuild of a workiing system and all its 
backups has been slow. I *think* I still have a working CM-11a, but its 
recently come to my attention that there is now an arduino kit to emulate 
the CM-11a. That removes the lack of a computer to line power interface 
that for some unk reason, has not been available from X10 for about 20 
years now.  We can now make our own.

So I issued a 'sudo apt install heyu", only to have apt report it 
couldn't find such a critter.

Why is that?

Thanks all.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis

Re: segurança em diretório (pasta)

[Tiago T. Barrionuevo]

Conheço o cryptomator.

Leonardo S. S. da Rocha wrote on 5/30/22 10:32 AM:
> Olá meus amig@s, bom dia!
>
> Encontrei algumas coisas com pesquisa mas resolvi consultar a
> comunidade. Quero encriptar (colocar senha) um diretório (pasta) no
> debian. Utilizo o gnome e encontrei coisas como:
>
> Gnome Encfs Manager
>
> encontrei também sobre o Cryptkeeper.
>
> Alguém conhece as ferramentas que mencionei aqui ou tem uma outra para
> recomendar? A ideia é ter um diretório local para guardar coisas como
> Chaves SSH, GPG e códigos de recuperação de contas como google, mega e
> Twitter.
>
> Agradeço as sugestões,
>
> Forte abraço e ótima semana à tod@s.
>
> Leonardo Rocha.
>
>

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[Emanuel Berg]

Susmita/Rajib wrote:

> I have been on and off my idea to self-learn
> c++ programming.

Just do it ...

-- 
underground experts united
https://dataswamp.org/~incal

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[IL Ka]

IMHO: It is better to have a firewall and block (policy -- drop) INPUT and
FORWARD by default.
And open only ports that must be opened.
This will help if you install some software that listens for 0.0.0.0 by
accident

On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 4:42 PM Greg Wooledge  wrote:

> On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 07:13:54AM -0500, Tom Browder wrote:
> > No worries. All those responses about the subject IP now are the norm
> for a
> > bare-iron server ready for use by a customer, yours truly. It is the same
> > server I messed up the firewall with and locked myself out of. The OS has
> > been reinstalled and is ready for me to use again.
>
> Why are you installing a firewall on a web server *at all*?
>
> The only thing you need to secure is your ssh access, and that's
> usually done in the /etc/ssh/sshd_config file, either by setting
> up key access only, or by restricting the source IPs who can connect.
>
> The web service is supposed to be open to the whole world.  That's
> why it's called the World Wide Web.
>
> Unless this machine is more than just a web server...?
>
>

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[Greg Wooledge]

On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 07:13:54AM -0500, Tom Browder wrote:
> No worries. All those responses about the subject IP now are the norm for a
> bare-iron server ready for use by a customer, yours truly. It is the same
> server I messed up the firewall with and locked myself out of. The OS has
> been reinstalled and is ready for me to use again.

Why are you installing a firewall on a web server *at all*?

The only thing you need to secure is your ssh access, and that's
usually done in the /etc/ssh/sshd_config file, either by setting
up key access only, or by restricting the source IPs who can connect.

The web service is supposed to be open to the whole world.  That's
why it's called the World Wide Web.

Unless this machine is more than just a web server...?

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[IL Ka]

Hello,


>  I have tried a couple of times, but debian-gcc team didn't
> respond to my earlier queries (but I shall post a copy of this one
> there too, just in case).


debian-gcc maintainers maintain the gcc package for Debian, they are not
responsible
for teaching people C or C++.

I suggest you start with Python: this language is very easy, there are lots
of books, videos and free courses
(coursera etc) and there is even MicroPython for microcontrollers.

If you really want to learn C, read "C in a nutshell" by O'reilly.
The book with a cow on the cover.

C++ would be much easier to learn once you understand C.
For C++ you can read "C++ programming language" by B. Stroustrup.

But C++ is hard, really.


> It would have been great, had a programming language been developed
> that could address both the lowest microprocessor(machine)-level to
> the most advanced user level programming, reading, comprehension and
> application. Perhaps, AI shall fulfil this need.
>
>
Python should be your choice!


(2)   object library resources, references, explanations, et al
>
For C++ you can use https://www.cplusplus.com/reference/ as reference
https://en.cppreference.com/w/ is also good, but for advanced usage


> (3)   Whether Eclipse could be used for c++
>
Yes. Also, Emacs, CLion or any other editor



> (4)   Whether Device Drivers and other lower-level programs could be
> designed with c++, like they are done in c or assembly level languages
> (I am aware that KDE was written in c++, but ...).
>

Linux drivers are written in C, but technically you can mix languages: use
C++ and link it against C.



> (5)   Whether optimisation tools like valgrind and gdb are available
> for c++ also
>
Yes, sure.

segurança em diretório (pasta)

[Leonardo S. S. da Rocha]

Olá meus amig@s, bom dia!

Encontrei algumas coisas com pesquisa mas resolvi consultar a
comunidade. Quero encriptar (colocar senha) um diretório (pasta) no
debian. Utilizo o gnome e encontrei coisas como:

Gnome Encfs Manager

encontrei também sobre o Cryptkeeper.

Alguém conhece as ferramentas que mencionei aqui ou tem uma outra para
recomendar? A ideia é ter um diretório local para guardar coisas como
Chaves SSH, GPG e códigos de recuperação de contas como google, mega e
Twitter.

Agradeço as sugestões,

Forte abraço e ótima semana à tod@s.

Leonardo Rocha.

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[IL Ka]

You are probably looking for unattended installation and
configuration using "noninteractive" dbconf frontend.
https://manpages.debian.org/bullseye/debconf-doc/debconf.7.en.html#Unattended_Package_Installation


On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 6:10 AM Emanuel Berg  wrote:

> Have a look at this blog post and program:
>
>   Managing OpenBSD installed packages declaratively
>
> https://dataswamp.org/~solene/2022-05-05-openbsd-declarative-packages-with-pkgset.html
>
> That's sure one idea, to have a config file (that's the
> "declarative" part) and then a script that converts that into
> commands of/to the traditional package manager to setup the
> system in accordance ...
>
> Anyone has that for Debian and Debian-like systems?
>
> --
> underground experts united
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal
>
>

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[Susmita/Rajib]

Dear Team DdB,

I write Team assuming that your team runs this company De-bruin.de,
and you are the boss. A boss doesn't reply to any and every email. So
...

I had the page translated. It said, "The biggest problem with the old
website was the open display of email addresses, making it easy for
SPAM senders and other malefactors to use it. I'm currently checking
different alternatives."

Yes, open email-IDs could potentially invite spams. But then, Google
blocks most spammers and I use plain text emails and receive emails
with blocked scripts. I don't work for an intel agency or a cutting
edge software company. So there isn't an incentive for the agency that
set up Google to spy on my emails. To be specific to your comment,
spammers are discouraged if their emails aren't responded to.

Earlier, Debian Lists used to jumble up email-IDs, but left the
practice way back.

Assuming that OO is an abbreviation of Object Oriented, your email
whets appetite but doesn't quench it. I would have definitely been
helped by answers to my specific queries.

Hope that I shall not be disheartened.

Best wishes,
Rajib



To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Subject: Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached,
if learning objectives are sought to be customised?
From: DdB 
Date: Mon, 30 May 2022 12:07:17 +0200
Message-id: <[]
5e885eae-e1f8-0936-43c3-c15971bad...@potentially-spam.de-bruyn.de>
In-reply-to: <[]
caeg4czwmot23cvnbg_rrag0gbwciot-up2v117tzg+knf2c...@mail.gmail.com>
References: <[]
caeg4czwmot23cvnbg_rrag0gbwciot-up2v117tzg+knf2c...@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,
[   ...   snip   ...   ]
DdB

Re: duvida atualização instalador

[luigui]

Bom dia pessoal!

Introduzindo um persistence no pen-drive nao poderia ser a solucao?

Att

Luigui

On 28/05/2022 19:03, Vitor Hugo wrote:
Entendo, porem se tiver muitas instalações um USB atualizado ajudaria 
um pouco.


Em 28/05/2022 06:30, debian.jb...@simplelogin.co escreveu:

Olá Vitor,

Se não lembro mal (a minha última instalação do Debian foi há 2 
meses) não precisas de usar o apt no USB se tens conexão à internet. 
Há um paso da inatalação no que o próprio instalador pesquisa pacotes 
mais recentes nos repositorios e faz o upgrade se os atopar.


Saudações,


Roberto Mallo
Audio Engineer & Musician






 Mensagem original 
A 27/05/2022, 17:11, Vitor Hugo - vitorhugo60 at hotmail.com < 
jisohsjvvkdmbthckvy...@simplelogin.co > escreveu:



    Boa tarde,

    Estou com uma duvida se eu fizer um USB de instalação da media do
    Debian
    e aplicar um "apt-get upgrade" os pacotes do USB de instalação serão
    atualizados?

    Assim na próxima instalação ou antes da instalação executar a
    atualização dos pacotes antes de instalar o sistema as versões mais
    novas serão instaladas automaticamente?

    Obrigado.

null

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Dan Ritter]

Emanuel Berg wrote: 
> Have a look at this blog post and program:
> 
>   Managing OpenBSD installed packages declaratively
>   
> https://dataswamp.org/~solene/2022-05-05-openbsd-declarative-packages-with-pkgset.html
> 
> That's sure one idea, to have a config file (that's the
> "declarative" part) and then a script that converts that into
> commands of/to the traditional package manager to setup the
> system in accordance ...
> 
> Anyone has that for Debian and Debian-like systems?

You can do it with puppet, chef, ansible, salt... 

You can go further into it with guix and nix.

It can be quite a lot of work, which is generally worthwhile if
you have many systems that need to be centrally controlled and
are similar to each other, or if you need to accurately
replicate a system many times.

For a single user's machine, it's unlikely to be rewarding
except intellectually.

-dsr-

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[Tom Browder]

On Mon, May 30, 2022 at 02:13 john doe  wrote:

> On 5/30/2022 12:26 AM, Tom Browder wrote:
> > On Sun, May 29, 2022 at 15:55 Greg Wooledge  wrote:


No worries. All those responses about the subject IP now are the norm for a
bare-iron server ready for use by a customer, yours truly. It is the same
server I messed up the firewall with and locked myself out of. The OS has
been reinstalled and is ready for me to use again.

If all is set as expected, I should be able to get http and https working
on it.

And I will certainly try to take care of most of the security concerns
expressed here.

For those of you with forensic curiosity so recently demonstrated, the new
server we are discussing is to replace mine currently operating at IP
173.208.182.170. It has been online for over two years. I believe it is
locked down pretty well.

Some websites there are:

novco1968tbs.com   # my Marine brother's TBS  class
usafa-1965.org # my college class
moody67a.org   # my pilot training class
nwflug.org
computertechnwf.org

The first three sites have entries very appropriate for US Memorial Day:
noting men who sacrificed their lives fighting for us.

-Tom

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[Curt]

On 2022-05-29, Greg Wooledge  wrote:
>
> Second, I cannot ping this IP address, nor can I telnet to port 80 of it.
> (Nor port 22.)
>

That's strange; I can ping it (I'm not in Kansas anymore):

curty@einstein:~$ ping  69.30.225.10
PING 69.30.225.10 (69.30.225.10) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 69.30.225.10: icmp_seq=1 ttl=51 time=110 ms
64 bytes from 69.30.225.10: icmp_seq=2 ttl=51 time=109 ms
64 bytes from 69.30.225.10: icmp_seq=3 ttl=51 time=110 ms
64 bytes from 69.30.225.10: icmp_seq=4 ttl=51 time=110 ms
64 bytes from 69.30.225.10: icmp_seq=5 ttl=51 time=109 ms
64 bytes from 69.30.225.10: icmp_seq=6 ttl=51 time=109 ms
^C
--- 69.30.225.10 ping statistics ---
6 packets transmitted, 6 received, 0% packet loss, time 5007ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 109.920/110.172/110.613/0.511 ms

Re: How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[DdB]

Hello,

short answer first:
There is no "one size fits all", it depends.

And there are VERY different levels of C++ programmers. I used to teach
entry level (with lots of playful fun) in about 2 weeks time to people
already familiar in C.

When i tried to learn it myself, it did cause a serious breakdown, bcoz
assimilating OO seamed incomprehensible at the time. Only after quite
some suffering (and 6 months abandonning the task) was my brain able to
get into it. And since, i loved OO (C++ not so much, coz developing
takes longer compared to other languages, of course, you gain
fine-grained control).

But, as always when engaging in learning: Use intelligence first to map
out your goals, your motivation/interests, and split your path into
several simpler steps, which (most importantly) allow yourself to keep
the motivation/fun factor high. You'll need quite some to withstand
inevitable crises during the learning process. ;-)

See: i did neither recommend a single book, nor suggest some special
exercise. But YOU should choose some.

best of luck
DdB

[testing] problème sortir de veille

[Gaëtan PERRIER]

Bonjour,

Depuis quelques temps la sortie de veille ne fonctionne plus correctement sur
mon Lenovo T420 sous testing.
Quand je ferme l'écran le système part bien en veille. Quand je réouvre l'écran
le système semble se réveiller (y a un bip, et le voyant veille s'éteint) mais
l'écran reste noir et le clavier ne semble pas fonctionnel.
Est-ce qu'il y a des choses qui ont changé à ce niveau ?

Gaëtan


signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part

Re: REvisiting "Tool for investigating dependency chains?"

[Richard Owlett]

On 05/29/2022 09:31 PM, David wrote:

On Mon, 30 May 2022 at 01:28, Richard Owlett  wrote:


berenger.mo...@neutralite.org responded with a discussion about using
aptitude's visual mode.

That has multiple problems:
1. My original goal description was inadequate.
2. My target environment has changed.
3. From his description I don't completely grok how to use aptitude's
   visual mode. The man page is not helpful as it is not intended to
   be a tutorial but more a reference work to refresh the memory of
   one already familiar with a specific tool. I searched for a
   tutorial covering the visual mode. *BUT* the ones I found only
   mentioned it in passing and all examples were pure command line.


https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2020/09/msg00296.html



I had forgotten that thread. Reading the complete thread will prevent me 
from duplicating work I've already done. Thank you.


It pointed to
[https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/aptitude/ch01s01s01.en.html]
which demonstrated that yesterday I had correctly invoked aptitude's 
visual mode. That I received a "black screen" in response suggests I 
have system problems - which I suspected.


I had already planned on installing current Debian on another machine.

How should learning to program in c++ be approached, if learning objectives are sought to be customised?

[Susmita/Rajib]

My dear Illustrious List Maintainers, Programmers and Senior members,

I have been on and off my idea to self-learn c++ programming.

I found that debian has a dedicated python list. But I wasn't able to
find a list for discussing c or c++. Surely, I must not be searching
properly. I have tried a couple of times, but debian-gcc team didn't
respond to my earlier queries (but I shall post a copy of this one
there too, just in case). c programming language is too difficult for
me to engage in, as I am not as gifted as a c programmer. Also, I
can't have the Object-Oriented programming toolkit and sample code
repository like Oracle Java repository.

It would have been great, had a programming language been developed
that could address both the lowest microprocessor(machine)-level to
the most advanced user level programming, reading, comprehension and
application. Perhaps, AI shall fulfil this need.

I learnt a tiny bit of Java programming, aided by the Eclipse IDE
and Oracle Java repository, which has exhaustive example codes and
object library resources, references, explanations, et al.

To me open-source c++ appeared to lack these resources. Surely, I am
not looking at the right direction.

Could I please be given a little more guidance on the following aspects please?:
(1)   exhaustive example codes
(2)   object library resources, references, explanations, et al
(3)   Whether Eclipse could be used for c++
(4)   Whether Device Drivers and other lower-level programs could be
designed with c++, like they are done in c or assembly level languages
(I am aware that KDE was written in c++, but ...).
(5)   Whether optimisation tools like valgrind and gdb are available
for c++ also

Please feel free to post any other general guidance and advice please,
considering that you are actually talking to a novice.

My regards and best wishes.
Rajib Bandopadhyay
An Open Source enthusiast

Certificat public et clé privée

[David BERCOT]

Bonjour,

J'utilise un certificat global d'authentification au format PKCS12.
Disons que celui-ci s'appelle MonCertificat.pkcs12 et que son mot de 
passe soit "azerty".


Je souhaite le transformer en un certificat public d'une part et 
extraire la clé privée d'autre part.


Jusqu'à récemment, j'utilisais les méthodes suivantes :
$ openssl pkcs12 -nocerts -in MonCertificat.p12 -out 
MonCertificat_clé-privée.pem
$ openssl pkcs12 -clcerts -nokeys -in MonCertificat.p12 -out 
MonCertificat_certificat-public.pem


J'obtiens maintenant l'erreur suivante :
Error outputting keys and certificates
C0320C0A787F:error:0308010C:digital envelope 
routines:inner_evp_generic_fetch:unsupported:../crypto/evp/evp_fetch.c:349:Global 
default library context, Algorithm (RC2-40-CBC : 0), Properties ()


Il suffit d'ajouter dans chaque ligne l'option -legacy pour que ça 
fonctionne (au cas où quelqu'un rencontrerait le même problème).


A ce moment-là, aucun souci pour générer le certificat public (on me 
demande bien sûr le mot de passe "azerty" pour créer celui-ci).


En revanche, pour la clé publique, j'ai le problème suivant :
$ openssl pkcs12 -nocerts -in MonCertificat.p12 -out 
MonCertificat_clé-privée.pem

Enter Import Password: azerty
Enter PEM pass phrase: mapassphrase
Verifying - Enter PEM pass phrase: mapassphrase

Tout marche bien sauf qu'il est impossible ensuite d'ouvrir ladite clé !
Le système m'indique que le mot de passe est incorrect (et j'ai bien sûr 
fait un certain nombre de tests)...


Auriez-vous une idée ?

Merci d'avance.

David.

Re: OBS sur Debian pas de visuel pour la capture d'écran

[Haricophile]

Le Sun, 29 May 2022 22:28:00 +0200,
firenze...@orange.fr a écrit :

> Bonjour à tous,
> 
> Je voudrais utiliser OBS sur Debian pour faire des tutoriels vidéos.
> 
> Mais quand je veux filmer tout ce qui ce passe sur mon écran (Capture
> d'écran XSHM), je n'ai rien en aperçu à part mon curseur qui se
> balade sur fond noir. J'utilise le serveur graphique Wayland,
> j'ignore si ça a un impact sur OBS.

Si Wayland pose problème, ce qui me semble fort possible vu que
justement la gestion de l'affichage diffère beaucoup, pourquoi ne pas
utiliser Xorg ? Je ne sais pas ce que tu utilise comme bureau, mais à
priori ils fonctionnent tous si tu lance ta session avec Xorg.

Re: Firewall blocking my new Debian 11 server ports 80 and 443

[john doe]

On 5/30/2022 12:26 AM, Tom Browder wrote:

On Sun, May 29, 2022 at 15:55 Greg Wooledge  wrote:
...

Thanks, Greg. It looks like my server was blocked from ports 80 and 443
upstream from it (as you and others suspected), so I asked my provider to
reinstall the OS and ensure it has public access to ports 80 and 443.



If I may, looks like this is over your head and I would suggest you to
do the following:
- Understand what is done on this server (installed pkgs, config ...)
- Start by securing remote access (see this thread on to do that for SSH)
- Get all of your set up working offline/locally
- Document yourself on how to do what you want (when exposing services
publically you can not guess/try)


In other words, familiorise yourself with what you have.

--
John Doe

Re: declarative (config file) way idea of handling the OS by way of the old system

[Timothy M Butterworth]

On Sun, May 29, 2022 at 11:10 PM Emanuel Berg  wrote:

> Have a look at this blog post and program:
>
>   Managing OpenBSD installed packages declaratively
>
> https://dataswamp.org/~solene/2022-05-05-openbsd-declarative-packages-with-pkgset.html
>
> That's sure one idea, to have a config file (that's the
> "declarative" part) and then a script that converts that into
> commands of/to the traditional package manager to setup the
> system in accordance ...
>
> Isn't that essentially how puppet works? I know it has a config file that
translates into commands and it can be used to install software packages.


> Anyone has that for Debian and Debian-like systems?
>
> --
> underground experts united
> https://dataswamp.org/~incal
>
>