Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
On Sat, Jan 24, 2009 at 16:39, Micha Feigin wrote: > On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 06:29:56 +1030 > Arthur Marsh wrote: > >> Marc Shapiro wrote, on 2009-01-25 04:50: >> > I posted this under the original thread, but since there were no >> > responses I figured that most readers had already determined that they >> > could not help with that problem and so did not read the post. Since >> > this is a totally different track to solving my problem I felt a new >> > subject was in order. >> > >> > Florian Kulzer wrote: >> > > I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the >> > > sis driver. >> > >> > I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from >> > the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my >> > first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting >> > a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not >> > recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is good, >> > bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money >> > and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does >> > the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, >> > specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB >> > for only $10.00 more. I don't mind the extra $10 for double to >> > quadruple the memory and a faster core, but is this a good board with >> > solid support? With rebates, these boards are going for $29.99 to >> > $39.99. Are there better boards that can be had for similar prices? Is >> > there a different line that I should look into? I don't want to start >> > any religious wars over what is the best graphics card. I just need a >> > solid card that works and doesn't have issues like the onboard Sis >> > chips seem to have. >> > >> > > My personal experience is that intel, ati and nvidia one or two generations > back all work ok with the free drivers, none provide real 3d performance. > > As far as I know ati drivers are open but problematic. Nvidia's are closed but > work pretty well. I would say they are wonderful for the cards they fully support. It is true that many newer cards have little support so far, but they are moving pretty fast. > intel cards are pretty mediocre (especially the x3100 that comes on a lot of > cheap laptops these days). Maybe mediocre in power by modern ATI/Nvidia standards, but my brand-new Intel board has a x3100, and it has been very well behaved, and it runs ioquake3 (improved version of the Quake III engine) beautifully (the 3000, no "x", is a very sad little chip, however). I haven't yet tested heavier games on this system. > It's worth buying a standalone card as it uses it's own memory and not shared > memory. Personally I would go with nvidia and the proprietary drivers (if you > don't mind non-free). > >> I know the feeling, since a family member has an HP machine with an >> on-board SiS graphics chip-set. >> >> As I had an AGP motherboard, I used a second hand ATI Radeon 9200 SE >> which works well with the Free "radeon" driver in package >> xserver-xorg-video-radeon. I ran a passively cooled Radeon 9550 (OSS drivers) for a long time; it was wonderful. I don't run it now, simply because I have decent onboard Video, and Intel drivers are at the forefront of Xorg/Mesa innovation. Cheers, Kelly Clowers -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
On 01/24/2009 05:07 PM, Marc Shapiro wrote: Ron Johnson wrote: IMNSHO, unless this is a *workstation* where you do lots of OpenGL visualization, or you are dual-booting to play Crysis, Linux users just don't *need* uber-video performance. Thus, I go for good-enough-but-silent over raw power which is overkill 99.999% of the time (especially if you use the nvidia driver). > So, the 8400 has a fan for cooling and the 7200 is passively cooled? As you mentioned in your earlier email, some 7200s *are* actively cooled. And this link shows that some 8xxx cards are passively cooled. http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010380048+1305520548+1069609641+1295318921+106791921&Configurator=&Subcategory=48&description=&Ntk=&SpeTabStoreType=&srchInDesc= So, it's dependent on what the manufacturer wants to do with that particular card. NOTE Maybe I was wrong about the 8400GS. http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=nvidia_vdpau_gpu&num=1 -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "I am not surprised, for we live long and are celebrated poopers." -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
On Sun, 25 Jan 2009 06:29:56 +1030 Arthur Marsh wrote: > Marc Shapiro wrote, on 2009-01-25 04:50: > > I posted this under the original thread, but since there were no > > responses I figured that most readers had already determined that they > > could not help with that problem and so did not read the post. Since > > this is a totally different track to solving my problem I felt a new > > subject was in order. > > > > Florian Kulzer wrote: > > > I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the > > > sis driver. > > > > I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from > > the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my > > first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting > > a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not > > recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is good, > > bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money > > and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does > > the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, > > specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB > > for only $10.00 more. I don't mind the extra $10 for double to > > quadruple the memory and a faster core, but is this a good board with > > solid support? With rebates, these boards are going for $29.99 to > > $39.99. Are there better boards that can be had for similar prices? Is > > there a different line that I should look into? I don't want to start > > any religious wars over what is the best graphics card. I just need a > > solid card that works and doesn't have issues like the onboard Sis > > chips seem to have. > > > My personal experience is that intel, ati and nvidia one or two generations back all work ok with the free drivers, none provide real 3d performance. As far as I know ati drivers are open but problematic. Nvidia's are closed but work pretty well. intel cards are pretty mediocre (especially the x3100 that comes on a lot of cheap laptops these days). It's worth buying a standalone card as it uses it's own memory and not shared memory. Personally I would go with nvidia and the proprietary drivers (if you don't mind non-free). > I know the feeling, since a family member has an HP machine with an > on-board SiS graphics chip-set. > > As I had an AGP motherboard, I used a second hand ATI Radeon 9200 SE > which works well with the Free "radeon" driver in package > xserver-xorg-video-radeon. > > If considering an ATI graphics card you will probably want to find out > what chip-set the cards you are looking at use. > > The "radeon" driver supports *some* ATI graphics cards using PCI > Express, others are supported in the Free "radeonhd" driver in package > xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd. > > If you have these packages installed, look at the manual pages for > "radeon" and "radeonhd" and web pages: > > http://wiki.x.org/wiki/radeon > http://wiki.x.org/wiki/radeonhd > http://wiki.x.org/wiki/RadeonFeature > > to find what chip-sets and features are supported. > > Arthur. > > -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
Ron Johnson wrote: IMNSHO, unless this is a *workstation* where you do lots of OpenGL visualization, or you are dual-booting to play Crysis, Linux users just don't *need* uber-video performance. Thus, I go for good-enough-but-silent over raw power which is overkill 99.999% of the time (especially if you use the nvidia driver). So, the 8400 has a fan for cooling and the 7200 is passively cooled? -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
On 01/24/2009 02:58 PM, Marc Shapiro wrote: Ron Johnson wrote: On 01/24/2009 12:20 PM, Marc Shapiro wrote: I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is good, bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB I'd go with the 7200GS, because (a) I know it works well, and (b) nvidia played games with some of the 8400 naming conventions. IOW, some weren't as fast as the 7xxx cards. Also, it's more likely that you can get passively-cooled 7xxx cards. The specs for the cards, as posted on the Fry's site are: * Interface: PCI Express x16 * Chipset Manufacturer: NVIDIA * GPU: GeForce 7200GS * Core clock: 350MHz * Memory Clock: 666MHz * Memory Size: 256MB GDDR2 * Memory Interface: 64-bit * 3D: API * DirectX: DirectX 9 * OpenGL: OpenGL 2.0 * Ports: D-SUB, DVI, TV-Out, S-Video Out * RAMDAC: 400 MHz * Max Resolution: 2048 x 1536 * SLI Supported: No * Cooler: With Fan IMNSHO, unless this is a *workstation* where you do lots of OpenGL visualization, or you are dual-booting to play Crysis, Linux users just don't *need* uber-video performance. Thus, I go for good-enough-but-silent over raw power which is overkill 99.999% of the time (especially if you use the nvidia driver). Thus, I bough a card very similar to one of these: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010380048+1305520548+1069609641+106790717+1295318921&Configurator=&Subcategory=48&description=&Ntk=&SpeTabStoreType=&srchInDesc= and * Interface: PCI Express x16 * GPU: GeForce 8400GS * Core clock: 459MHz * Memory Clock: 800MHz * Memory Size: 512MB * Memory Interface: 64-bit * Memory Type: GDDR2 * DirectX: DirectX 10 * OpenGL: OpenGL 2.0 * Ports: 1 x D-SUB, 1 x DVI, TV-Out HDTV, S-Video * RAMDAC: 400 MHz * Max Resolution: 2048 x 1536 * RoHS Compliant: Yes * HDCP Ready: Yes so the 8400GS would seem to have a higher core clock and memory clock, as well as twice the memory. Are you saying that even with the higher specs that it may not run as fast, Or, it might! or that some 8400s actually did not have the higher specs? Yes. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "I am not surprised, for we live long and are celebrated poopers." -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
Ron Johnson wrote: On 01/24/2009 12:20 PM, Marc Shapiro wrote: I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is good, bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB I'd go with the 7200GS, because (a) I know it works well, and (b) nvidia played games with some of the 8400 naming conventions. IOW, some weren't as fast as the 7xxx cards. Also, it's more likely that you can get passively-cooled 7xxx cards. The specs for the cards, as posted on the Fry's site are: * Interface: PCI Express x16 * Chipset Manufacturer: NVIDIA * GPU: GeForce 7200GS * Core clock: 350MHz * Memory Clock: 666MHz * Memory Size: 256MB GDDR2 * Memory Interface: 64-bit * 3D: API * DirectX: DirectX 9 * OpenGL: OpenGL 2.0 * Ports: D-SUB, DVI, TV-Out, S-Video Out * RAMDAC: 400 MHz * Max Resolution: 2048 x 1536 * SLI Supported: No * Cooler: With Fan and * Interface: PCI Express x16 * GPU: GeForce 8400GS * Core clock: 459MHz * Memory Clock: 800MHz * Memory Size: 512MB * Memory Interface: 64-bit * Memory Type: GDDR2 * DirectX: DirectX 10 * OpenGL: OpenGL 2.0 * Ports: 1 x D-SUB, 1 x DVI, TV-Out HDTV, S-Video * RAMDAC: 400 MHz * Max Resolution: 2048 x 1536 * RoHS Compliant: Yes * HDCP Ready: Yes so the 8400GS would seem to have a higher core clock and memory clock, as well as twice the memory. Are you saying that even with the higher specs that it may not run as fast, or that some 8400s actually did not have the higher specs? -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
On 01/24/2009 12:20 PM, Marc Shapiro wrote: I posted this under the original thread, but since there were no responses I figured that most readers had already determined that they could not help with that problem and so did not read the post. Since this is a totally different track to solving my problem I felt a new subject was in order. Florian Kulzer wrote: > I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the > sis driver. I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is good, bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB I'd go with the 7200GS, because (a) I know it works well, and (b) nvidia played games with some of the 8400 naming conventions. IOW, some weren't as fast as the 7xxx cards. Also, it's more likely that you can get passively-cooled 7xxx cards. for only $10.00 more. I don't mind the extra $10 for double to quadruple the memory and a faster core, but is this a good board with solid support? With rebates, these boards are going for $29.99 to $39.99. Are there better boards that can be had for similar prices? Is there a different line that I should look into? I don't want to start any religious wars over what is the best graphics card. I just need a solid card that works and doesn't have issues like the onboard Sis chips seem to have. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA "I am not surprised, for we live long and are celebrated poopers." -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
Marc Shapiro wrote, on 2009-01-25 04:50: I posted this under the original thread, but since there were no responses I figured that most readers had already determined that they could not help with that problem and so did not read the post. Since this is a totally different track to solving my problem I felt a new subject was in order. Florian Kulzer wrote: > I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the > sis driver. I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is good, bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB for only $10.00 more. I don't mind the extra $10 for double to quadruple the memory and a faster core, but is this a good board with solid support? With rebates, these boards are going for $29.99 to $39.99. Are there better boards that can be had for similar prices? Is there a different line that I should look into? I don't want to start any religious wars over what is the best graphics card. I just need a solid card that works and doesn't have issues like the onboard Sis chips seem to have. I know the feeling, since a family member has an HP machine with an on-board SiS graphics chip-set. As I had an AGP motherboard, I used a second hand ATI Radeon 9200 SE which works well with the Free "radeon" driver in package xserver-xorg-video-radeon. If considering an ATI graphics card you will probably want to find out what chip-set the cards you are looking at use. The "radeon" driver supports *some* ATI graphics cards using PCI Express, others are supported in the Free "radeonhd" driver in package xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd. If you have these packages installed, look at the manual pages for "radeon" and "radeonhd" and web pages: http://wiki.x.org/wiki/radeon http://wiki.x.org/wiki/radeonhd http://wiki.x.org/wiki/RadeonFeature to find what chip-sets and features are supported. Arthur. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Vidio card recommendation needed (was:Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny)
I posted this under the original thread, but since there were no responses I figured that most readers had already determined that they could not help with that problem and so did not read the post. Since this is a totally different track to solving my problem I felt a new subject was in order. Florian Kulzer wrote: > I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the > sis driver. I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is good, bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB for only $10.00 more. I don't mind the extra $10 for double to quadruple the memory and a faster core, but is this a good board with solid support? With rebates, these boards are going for $29.99 to $39.99. Are there better boards that can be had for similar prices? Is there a different line that I should look into? I don't want to start any religious wars over what is the best graphics card. I just need a solid card that works and doesn't have issues like the onboard Sis chips seem to have. -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
Florian Kulzer wrote: I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the sis driver. I don't think that I have actually purchased a video card separate from the PC, or motherboard since my TRS-8- Model III died and I bought my first PC compatible. That would have been about 26 years ago. Getting a new board might not be that bad of an idea, but, as I have not recently had to make such a purchase I have not looked into what is god, bad, works with Linux, etc. I am not looking to spend a lot of money and I don't need a fancy gamers board. I just need something that does the job. I noticed that Fry's has several inexpensive EVGA boards, specifically a 7200GS w/128MB or 256MB PCI-Express and an 8400GS w/512MB for only $10.00 more. I don't mind the extra $10 for double to quadruple the memory and a faster core, but is this a good board with solid support? With rebates, these boards are going for $29.99 to $39.99. Are there better boards that can be had for similar prices? Is there a different line that I should look into? I don't want to start any religious wars over what is the best graphics card. I just need a solid card that works and doesn't have issures like the onboard Sis chips seem to have. *EVGA 8400GS Video Card (PCI-Express, 512MB)* -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
>> > It worked fine in Etch and I really don't want to spend money on a new > card if I don't have to. > if it was working in etch it's well supported. I have experienced similar problems when changing Xorg versions. Finally I read a bit about the new Xorg config and fixed it myself. The worse case would be that after the upgrade you finshed with some missing dependencies or broken libraries and so on ... What did /var/log/Xorg.0.log say? at least vesa should be working with any card if you've installed the xorg-vesa package regards -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
On Wed, 21 Jan 2009 19:27:05 +0100 Florian Kulzer wrote: ... > You can use the web interface of the BTS to send a follow-up message, I know Florian knows this, but just FTR: this can also be accomplished by simply sending mail to nnn...@bugs.debian.org Celejar -- mailmin.sourceforge.net - remote access via secure (OpenPGP) email ssuds.sourceforge.net - A Simple Sudoku Solver and Generator -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
Florian Kulzer wrote: On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 20:21:19 -0800, Marc Shapiro wrote: Florian Kulzer wrote: Maybe this is related: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=474504 This seems to be exactly the problem that I am having. If this problem has been around since at least April of last year and had not been resolved by August, you would think that there would be more emphasis on trying to resolve it. You can use the web interface of the BTS to send a follow-up message, stating that you have the problem, too. Ask if there is any possibility that this can be addressed before the release of Lenny and what you can do to help. The maintainers will let know what kind of information you can contribute if someone starts working on the problem. You can also check out http://bugs.freedesktop.org to see if anything relevant has happened upstream since last May. I have not, yet posted a bug report Yon can try if Xorg from experimental and/or kernel 2.6.28 improve the situation. (Did you try to put additional options into xorg.conf as I suggested earlier?) I have tried all options, one at a time, that seem to apply to my chipset. I also tried the VESA driver with its options. Unfortunately, none of this produced any change in behavior. I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the sis driver. It worked fine in Etch and I really don't want to spend money on a new card if I don't have to. -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 20:21:19 -0800, Marc Shapiro wrote: > Florian Kulzer wrote: >> Maybe this is related: >> >> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=474504 >> > This seems to be exactly the problem that I am having. If this problem > has been around since at least April of last year and had not been > resolved by August, you would think that there would be more emphasis on > trying to resolve it. Nobody had time to look into in April/May, and then it probably got forgotten, as new bugs and work came in for the X maintainers. The release freeze does not help either. >I would think that others would have come across > this bug and want to have it fixed. The fact that nobody inquired about the status or sent a "me too" report probably contributed to the fact that the bug was not given a higher priority. > It makes things much harder in my > household, that's for sure. How do I follow up on this and try to get > it resolved. I have never had to file a bug report, so I really don't > know how to proceed. You can use the web interface of the BTS to send a follow-up message, stating that you have the problem, too. Ask if there is any possibility that this can be addressed before the release of Lenny and what you can do to help. The maintainers will let know what kind of information you can contribute if someone starts working on the problem. You can also check out http://bugs.freedesktop.org to see if anything relevant has happened upstream since last May. Yon can try if Xorg from experimental and/or kernel 2.6.28 improve the situation. (Did you try to put additional options into xorg.conf as I suggested earlier?) I would probably be tempted to buy an nvidia or ati card and dump the sis driver. -- Regards,| http://users.icfo.es/Florian.Kulzer Florian | -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
Florian Kulzer wrote: Maybe this is related: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=474504 This seems to be exactly the problem that I am having. If this problem has been around since at least April of last year and had not been resolved by August, you would think that there would be more emphasis on trying to resolve it. I would think that others would have come across this bug and want to have it fixed. It makes things much harder in my household, that's for sure. How do I follow up on this and try to get it resolved. I have never had to file a bug report, so I really don't know how to proceed. -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 18:59:12 -0800, Marc Shapiro wrote: > Florian Kulzer wrote: >> On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 07:37:41 -0800, Marc Shapiro wrote: [...] >>> I have checked, and most of the xserver-xorg-video-* files are >>> installed. Specifically, xserver-xorg-video-all, >>> xserver-xorg-video-sis, and xserver-xorg-video-vesa are all >>> installed. How do I instruct xorg to use a specific driver. The >>> current xorg.conf file makes no mention of the driver to use. I >>> tried adding the line from my old xorg.conf file, to use the vesa >>> driver, but then I am back to X simply not loading. Is this >>> information kept in a different location now? It may well be that >>> if I can get X to use the vesa driver, as it did before, that these >>> problems, at least, will go away. Then I can concentrate on others, >>> like my digital camera. >>> >> >> AFAIK, it should still work to put >> >> Driver"vesa" >> >> into the Device section of /etc/X11/xorg.conf; maybe the newer vesa >> driver has a problem with your chipset. It might help to look at the >> output of >> >> grep -E '^\((EE|WW)\)|drivers' /var/log/Xorg.0.log >> >> after starting X in the two different configurations (with and without >> trying to enforce using the vesa driver). This should at least give us a >> better idea about the reason of the crashes with vesa and which problems >> the sis module might have. >> >> > This is what I get when I do NOT specify a driver: > > (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic" does not exist. > (WW) Open ACPI failed (/var/run/acpid.socket) (No such file or directory) > (II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//sis_drv.so > (WW) Configured Mouse: No Device specified, looking for one... Nothing unusual here and nothing that helps us. You could try some of the options mentioned in "man sis", e.g. Option "DRI" "false"; maybe one of them will restore your ability to switch VTs. The only other thing that I can think of is trying to catch the crash upon VT switch with a debugger as described here http://www.x.org/wiki/Development/Documentation/ServerDebugging and submitting the backtrace to the BTS. You should also have a look at the Xorg bugtracker; you seem to have run into a regression of the driver, which might be known already. There does not seem to be a -dbg package available for the sis driver, though. The slightly newer package from experimental might be worth a try, too. > This is what I get when I add 'Driver "vesa"' > > (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic" does not exist. > (WW) Open ACPI failed (/var/run/acpid.socket) (No such file or directory) > (II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so > (WW) VESA(0): Unable to estimate virtual size > 7: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b3ba8f] > 8: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b3c66e] Not sure what to make of this; unfortunately, the vesa package does not seem to have debugging symbols either. > In any case, whether X loads with the Sis driver and then I exit, or if > X never loads when I try to use the vesa driver, I always get the > following error: > >Emulator asked to make a suspect byte access to port 4 (0x0004); > terminating. Maybe this is related: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=474504 -- Regards,| http://users.icfo.es/Florian.Kulzer Florian | -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
Florian Kulzer wrote: On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 07:37:41 -0800, Marc Shapiro wrote: Bibek Paudel wrote: I haven't seen your error messages in detail but I have seen a couple of similar problems after the etch-lenny upgrade. please see if the proper drivers are installed. i found that the xserver-xorg-video-* packages are generally missing after the upgrade. please try installing them, esp the ones for your graphics/video card. xserver-xorg-video-all should do for most cases. hope that helps, bibek I have checked, and most of the xserver-xorg-video-* files are installed. Specifically, xserver-xorg-video-all, xserver-xorg-video-sis, and xserver-xorg-video-vesa are all installed. How do I instruct xorg to use a specific driver. The current xorg.conf file makes no mention of the driver to use. I tried adding the line from my old xorg.conf file, to use the vesa driver, but then I am back to X simply not loading. Is this information kept in a different location now? It may well be that if I can get X to use the vesa driver, as it did before, that these problems, at least, will go away. Then I can concentrate on others, like my digital camera. AFAIK, it should still work to put Driver"vesa" into the Device section of /etc/X11/xorg.conf; maybe the newer vesa driver has a problem with your chipset. It might help to look at the output of grep -E '^\((EE|WW)\)|drivers' /var/log/Xorg.0.log after starting X in the two different configurations (with and without trying to enforce using the vesa driver). This should at least give us a better idea about the reason of the crashes with vesa and which problems the sis module might have. This is what I get when I do NOT specify a driver: (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic" does not exist. (WW) Open ACPI failed (/var/run/acpid.socket) (No such file or directory) (II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//sis_drv.so (WW) Configured Mouse: No Device specified, looking for one... This is what I get when I add 'Driver "vesa"' (WW) The directory "/usr/share/fonts/X11/cyrillic" does not exist. (WW) Open ACPI failed (/var/run/acpid.socket) (No such file or directory) (II) Loading /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so (WW) VESA(0): Unable to estimate virtual size 7: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b3ba8f] 8: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b3c66e] In any case, whether X loads with the Sis driver and then I exit, or if X never loads when I try to use the vesa driver, I always get the following error: Emulator asked to make a suspect byte access to port 4 (0x0004); terminating. This seems like it must be a strong indicator of the problem and must mean something to someone. -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 07:37:41 -0800, Marc Shapiro wrote: > Bibek Paudel wrote: >> I haven't seen your error messages in detail but I have seen a couple >> of similar problems after the etch-lenny upgrade. please see if the >> proper drivers are installed. i found that the xserver-xorg-video-* >> packages are generally missing after the upgrade. please try >> installing them, esp the ones for your graphics/video card. >> xserver-xorg-video-all should do for most cases. >> >> hope that helps, >> bibek > I have checked, and most of the xserver-xorg-video-* files are > installed. Specifically, xserver-xorg-video-all, > xserver-xorg-video-sis, and xserver-xorg-video-vesa are all installed. > How do I instruct xorg to use a specific driver. The current xorg.conf > file makes no mention of the driver to use. I tried adding the line > from my old xorg.conf file, to use the vesa driver, but then I am back > to X simply not loading. Is this information kept in a different > location now? It may well be that if I can get X to use the vesa > driver, as it did before, that these problems, at least, will go away. > Then I can concentrate on others, like my digital camera. AFAIK, it should still work to put Driver"vesa" into the Device section of /etc/X11/xorg.conf; maybe the newer vesa driver has a problem with your chipset. It might help to look at the output of grep -E '^\((EE|WW)\)|drivers' /var/log/Xorg.0.log after starting X in the two different configurations (with and without trying to enforce using the vesa driver). This should at least give us a better idea about the reason of the crashes with vesa and which problems the sis module might have. -- Regards,| http://users.icfo.es/Florian.Kulzer Florian | -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
> > I have checked, and most of the xserver-xorg-video-* files are installed. > Specifically, xserver-xorg-video-all, xserver-xorg-video-sis, and > xserver-xorg-video-vesa are all installed. How do I instruct xorg to use a > specific driver. A couple of years back, I remember xorg.conf having lines specifying the driver but these days, all i see is "configured device" and I don't know if some other file points to the driver or if things have changed to something else. As i can see that you had success in starting the X server, i guess you'd have to wait for somebody else to reply this thread. If I were in your position, I'd try reinstalling the driver and running "dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg" to see if it works. I can understand the problems you're having and hope that someone who has seen a problem like this before would be able to suggest some solution. bibek
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
Bibek Paudel wrote: I haven't seen your error messages in detail but I have seen a couple of similar problems after the etch-lenny upgrade. please see if the proper drivers are installed. i found that the xserver-xorg-video-* packages are generally missing after the upgrade. please try installing them, esp the ones for your graphics/video card. xserver-xorg-video-all should do for most cases. hope that helps, bibek I have checked, and most of the xserver-xorg-video-* files are installed. Specifically, xserver-xorg-video-all, xserver-xorg-video-sis, and xserver-xorg-video-vesa are all installed. How do I instruct xorg to use a specific driver. The current xorg.conf file makes no mention of the driver to use. I tried adding the line from my old xorg.conf file, to use the vesa driver, but then I am back to X simply not loading. Is this information kept in a different location now? It may well be that if I can get X to use the vesa driver, as it did before, that these problems, at least, will go away. Then I can concentrate on others, like my digital camera. Marc -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
I haven't seen your error messages in detail but I have seen a couple of similar problems after the etch-lenny upgrade. please see if the proper drivers are installed. i found that the xserver-xorg-video-* packages are generally missing after the upgrade. please try installing them, esp the ones for your graphics/video card. xserver-xorg-video-all should do for most cases. hope that helps, bibek
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
Marc Shapiro wrote: Marc Shapiro wrote: I decided that it was time to upgrade to Lenny so that I could use Firefox 3 since I have heard that might eliminate some of the lockups that I have been having. My box has a PC Chips K8 motherboard with SiS 760GX/964 Chipset and an Athlon XP 800+ CPU. This is what I have done: changed my etc/apt/sources.list to point to Lenny ran aptitude update ran aptitude install dpkg apt aptitude ran aptitude safe-upgrade I had to run this several times before it completed without errors and showed no packages still to be upgraded ran aptitude full-upgrade had to uninstall wine and sane to get this to run without errors ran startx got the following errors: (II) Module "ddc" already built-in (EE) Failed to load module "type1" (module does not exist, 0) (II) Module "ddc" already built-in Emulator asked to make a suspect byte access to port 4 (0x0004); terminating. Backtrace: 0: /usr/bin/X(xf86SigHandler+0x7e) [0x80c91ce] 1: [0xe420] 2: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(x_outb+0x57) [0xb7b21f17] 3: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so [0xb7b291d4] 4: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(X86EMU_exec+0xab) [0xb7b3871b] 5: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(xf86ExecX86int10+0x55) [0xb7b2ece5] 6: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libvbe.so(VBESaveRestore+0xb5) [0xb7f2ece5] 7: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b17a8f] 8: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b1866e] 9: /usr/bin/X(AddScreen+0x1f7) [ox8073db7] 10: /usr/bin/X(InitOutput+0x236) [0x8073db7] 11: /usr/bin/X(main+0x2b1) [0x8074591] 12: /lib/i686/cmov/libc.so.6(__libc_start_main+0xe5) [0xb7cec455] 13: /usr/bin/X(FontFileCompleteXLFD+0x21d) [0x8073a81] Fatal server error: Caught signal 11. Server aborting giving up. xinit: Connection reset by peer (errno 104): unable to connect to X server xinit: No such process (errno 3): Server error. Any help in getting X to run will be greatly appreciated. I am hoping that this is just a question of a manual config change, but I don't know enough about X configs to know where to start. Is there a known current problem with wine and sane? Wine is probably not much of an issue, but without sane my scanner is not going to function. OK. I can now get into X. Why worry about manually reconfiguring xserver-xorg when I can use dpkg-reconfigure, as it says in the comments at the top of the xorg.conf file, which I should have read first. But now I have another X problem. If I try to use Ctl-Alt-F1 (or any Fn key) to switch to a virtual console, then X dies. This is a big problem since my wife, my daughter and I are always logged onto this computer and we each have X sessions on separate vts. I use vt07, my wife is on vt08 and my daughter is on vt09. This way we can each have our own configuration, files, etc. and it only take a single key combination to switch between them. I really need help getting this working. Another thing to note is that after I get into X, even if I exit through my wm's exit command I get the error: Fatal server error: Caught signal 11. Server aborting Also, I am getting occasional artifacts on the X screen. This happened to me in Etch when I used the SiS driver, so I changed to the vesa driver and the artifacts went away. This doesn't even seem to be an option in the new xorg.conf file. Is it somewhere else? Something must be configured incorrectly, but I don't know what, or where. -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
Marc Shapiro wrote: I decided that it was time to upgrade to Lenny so that I could use Firefox 3 since I have heard that might eliminate some of the lockups that I have been having. My box has a PC Chips K8 motherboard with SiS 760GX/964 Chipset and an Athlon XP 800+ CPU. This is what I have done: changed my etc/apt/sources.list to point to Lenny ran aptitude update ran aptitude install dpkg apt aptitude ran aptitude safe-upgrade I had to run this several times before it completed without errors and showed no packages still to be upgraded ran aptitude full-upgrade had to uninstall wine and sane to get this to run without errors ran startx got the following errors: (II) Module "ddc" already built-in (EE) Failed to load module "type1" (module does not exist, 0) (II) Module "ddc" already built-in Emulator asked to make a suspect byte access to port 4 (0x0004); terminating. Backtrace: 0: /usr/bin/X(xf86SigHandler+0x7e) [0x80c91ce] 1: [0xe420] 2: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(x_outb+0x57) [0xb7b21f17] 3: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so [0xb7b291d4] 4: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(X86EMU_exec+0xab) [0xb7b3871b] 5: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(xf86ExecX86int10+0x55) [0xb7b2ece5] 6: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libvbe.so(VBESaveRestore+0xb5) [0xb7f2ece5] 7: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b17a8f] 8: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b1866e] 9: /usr/bin/X(AddScreen+0x1f7) [ox8073db7] 10: /usr/bin/X(InitOutput+0x236) [0x8073db7] 11: /usr/bin/X(main+0x2b1) [0x8074591] 12: /lib/i686/cmov/libc.so.6(__libc_start_main+0xe5) [0xb7cec455] 13: /usr/bin/X(FontFileCompleteXLFD+0x21d) [0x8073a81] Fatal server error: Caught signal 11. Server aborting giving up. xinit: Connection reset by peer (errno 104): unable to connect to X server xinit: No such process (errno 3): Server error. Any help in getting X to run will be greatly appreciated. I am hoping that this is just a question of a manual config change, but I don't know enough about X configs to know where to start. Is there a known current problem with wine and sane? Wine is probably not much of an issue, but without sane my scanner is not going to function. OK. I can now get into X. Why worry about manually reconfiguring xserver-xorg when I can use dpkg-reconfigure, as it says in the comments at the top of the xorg.conf file, which I should have read first. But now I have another X problem. If I try to use Ctl-Alt-F1 (or any Fn key) to switch to a virtual console, then X dies. This is a big problem since my wife, my daughter and I are always logged onto this computer and we each have X sessions on separate vts. I use vt07, my wife is on vt08 and my daughter is on vt09. This way we can each have our own configuration, files, etc. and it only take a single key combination to switch between them. -- Marc Shapiro mshapiro...@yahoo.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Can't start X after upgrade to Lenny
I decided that it was time to upgrade to Lenny so that I could use Firefox 3 since I have heard that might eliminate some of the lockups that I have been having. My box has a PC Chips K8 motherboard with SiS 760GX/964 Chipset and an Athlon XP 800+ CPU. This is what I have done: changed my etc/apt/sources.list to point to Lenny ran aptitude update ran aptitude install dpkg apt aptitude ran aptitude safe-upgrade I had to run this several times before it completed without errors and showed no packages still to be upgraded ran aptitude full-upgrade had to uninstall wine and sane to get this to run without errors ran startx got the following errors: (II) Module "ddc" already built-in (EE) Failed to load module "type1" (module does not exist, 0) (II) Module "ddc" already built-in Emulator asked to make a suspect byte access to port 4 (0x0004); terminating. Backtrace: 0: /usr/bin/X(xf86SigHandler+0x7e) [0x80c91ce] 1: [0xe420] 2: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(x_outb+0x57) [0xb7b21f17] 3: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so [0xb7b291d4] 4: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(X86EMU_exec+0xab) [0xb7b3871b] 5: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libint10.so(xf86ExecX86int10+0x55) [0xb7b2ece5] 6: /usr/lib/xorg/modules//libvbe.so(VBESaveRestore+0xb5) [0xb7f2ece5] 7: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b17a8f] 8: /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers//vesa_drv.so [0xb7b1866e] 9: /usr/bin/X(AddScreen+0x1f7) [ox8073db7] 10: /usr/bin/X(InitOutput+0x236) [0x8073db7] 11: /usr/bin/X(main+0x2b1) [0x8074591] 12: /lib/i686/cmov/libc.so.6(__libc_start_main+0xe5) [0xb7cec455] 13: /usr/bin/X(FontFileCompleteXLFD+0x21d) [0x8073a81] Fatal server error: Caught signal 11. Server aborting giving up. xinit: Connection reset by peer (errno 104): unable to connect to X server xinit: No such process (errno 3): Server error. Any help in getting X to run will be greatly appreciated. I am hoping that this is just a question of a manual config change, but I don't know enough about X configs to know where to start. Is there a known current problem with wine and sane? Wine is probably not much of an issue, but without sane my scanner is not going to function. Thanks for any help. Marc -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
