Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
(CCed to the bemused one because of the massive delay in posting a reply) On Thu, Nov 13, 2003 at 11:24:40AM +, John Peter wrote: Mark Healey wrote: I then made and make installed the module. Now I need to know what lines I have to add to what files to get the module working. Well, now it's easy - just edit /etc/modules and add the name of the compiled module. It will be loaded at boot from then on. In case something has gone awry however, check to see if the .o that you made is in /lib/modules/kernel version/ somewhere. If you aren't sure what the .o name is, you could do $ find . -name \*.o |sort /tmp/before build process $ find . -name \*.o |sort /tmp/after $ diff /tmp/before /tmp/after ...to find out. When I install new modules in my system, I tend to copy the .o into /lib/modules manually, run depmod -a, and add it into /etc/modules if I want it on-boot. (surely however this shouldn't be necessary, and it should be autoloaded when something tries to use the eth interface?) -- Jon Dowland http://jon.dowland.name/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
(CCed to original poster due to the massive delay in posting a reply... apologies if this is annoying) On Thu, Nov 13, 2003 at 12:53:11AM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:31:35 +, Jonathan Dowland wrote: getting a .o kernel module for your NIC into the debian install process. This is what I wanted to know in the first place. It isn't covered in the install manual. Thats right - it isn't strictly speaking part of the install software, although it is a common need so perhaps should be documented (I think the new installer in beta provides official support for this). if you press ALT+Fn (n being 2 or more) during the installation process you get a terminal. There is a small set of unix tools available here to do stuff in the background. You could mount a cdrom/floppy with the .o on from this window, and modprobe it into the installer's kernel. -- Jon Dowland http://jon.dowland.name/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
After not getting any instructions on how to compile a module that didn't come with the source into a kernel I gave up and decided to just do the nic module as installable. Since I had the source for the new kernel I went ahead and compiled it by Kents 10 step list. I left the things I didn't understand at their default value. It booted and seems to run as before. I then made the nic module and make installed it. Appearantly there is no autodetect feature so I need to know what I lines to add to what files to get my networking up. It is a DSL connection with a static IP address. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Mon, Nov 03, 2003 at 10:45:09PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: I recieved many suggestions to remedy the problem, non of them easy. I've decided to try to recompile the latest kernel. I figure that it would be nice to have the latest kernel with support for only the hardware I have (or think I might add in the future) and none for what I won't ever have. But, this is hacker level stuff I've never done, so I'm going to need a whole-lotta help. What is currently on the machine you wish to convert to debian? I'd advise against compiling a new kernel at this stage, but I don't know which suggestions you have deemed hard. It all depends on the specifics involved but I would recommend somehow getting a .o kernel module for your NIC into the debian install process. This can be done by putting it on a hard drive and mounting it, a floppy disk or another cd-rom. Obtaining the .o depends entirely on the drivers in question - you may need some kernel-sources corresponding to the kernel version on the debian cd (3.0 has the boot-floppies-2.4 kernel or something) and then build the module with it, or the vendor might distribute x86 binaries already. Can you tell us more about the model of the NIC and the drivers that are supplied? -- Jon Dowland http://jon.dowland.name/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:31:35 +, Jonathan Dowland wrote: On Mon, Nov 03, 2003 at 10:45:09PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: I recieved many suggestions to remedy the problem, non of them easy. I've decided to try to recompile the latest kernel. I figure that it would be nice to have the latest kernel with support for only the hardware I have (or think I might add in the future) and none for what I won't ever have. But, this is hacker level stuff I've never done, so I'm going to need a whole-lotta help. What is currently on the machine you wish to convert to debian? It's blank. I'd advise against compiling a new kernel at this stage, but I don't know which suggestions you have deemed hard. Here's the story. I installed with disk 1 and my onboard Broadcom 4401 nic isn't supported. I asked on this list for help and was told by numerous people that later kernels supported it and that I should get the latest and compile it. I thought that this was excessively geeky since I had managed to install support for this card as a module under Redhat. But I figured that I might learn something. Anyway this has been a huge pain in the ass since the machine has no networking and consequently no apt-get (which I've been led to believe is a package retreiver). After burning a bunch of CD's I finally got all the requirements installed and installed and compiled 2.4.22. I then made and make installed the module. Now I need to know what lines I have to add to what files to get the module working. It all depends on the specifics involved but I would recommend somehow getting a .o kernel module for your NIC into the debian install process. This is what I wanted to know in the first place. It isn't covered in the install manual. This can be done by putting it on a hard drive and mounting it, a floppy disk or another cd-rom. I was never asked during the install process if I had any modules on other media to add. Obtaining the .o depends entirely on the drivers in question - you may need some kernel-sources corresponding to the kernel version on the debian cd (3.0 has the boot-floppies-2.4 kernel or something) and then build the module with it, or the vendor might distribute x86 binaries already. Can you tell us more about the model of the NIC and the drivers that are supplied? Broadcom 4401, it is only distributed as source or a Redhat RPM. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 08:31:35 +, Jonathan Dowland wrote: On Mon, Nov 03, 2003 at 10:45:09PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: I recieved many suggestions to remedy the problem, non of them easy. I've decided to try to recompile the latest kernel. I figure that it would be nice to have the latest kernel with support for only the hardware I have (or think I might add in the future) and none for what I won't ever have. But, this is hacker level stuff I've never done, so I'm going to need a whole-lotta help. What is currently on the machine you wish to convert to debian? It's blank. I'd advise against compiling a new kernel at this stage, but I don't know which suggestions you have deemed hard. Here's the story. I installed with disk 1 and my onboard Broadcom 4401 nic isn't supported. I asked on this list for help and was told by numerous people that later kernels supported it and that I should get the latest and compile it. I thought that this was excessively geeky since I had managed to install support for this card as a module under Redhat. But I figured that I might learn something. Anyway this has been a huge pain in the ass since the machine has no networking and consequently no apt-get (which I've been led to believe is a package retreiver). After burning a bunch of CD's I finally got all the requirements installed and installed and compiled 2.4.22. I then made and make installed the module. Now I need to know what lines I have to add to what files to get the module working. Well, now it's easy - just edit /etc/modules and add the name of the compiled module. It will be loaded at boot from then on. Cheers John -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: After not getting any instructions on how to compile a module that didn't come with the source into a kernel I gave up and decided to just do the nic module as installable. Since I had the source for the new kernel I went ahead and compiled it by Kents 10 step list. I left the things I didn't understand at their default value. It booted and seems to run as before. I then made the nic module and make installed it. You should have been able to add the nic module during the 10-step procedure, and then you wouldn't have to make the nic module and make install it afterwards. While configuring your kernel (Step 6 in the Kent's 10-Step Procedure to Compiling a Debian Kernel portion of /usr/share/doc/kernel-package/README.gz), you need to go into the Network Device Support option, then probably Ethernet (1000Mbit), then put an M in front of Broadcom Tigon3 Support (assuming this is the correct driver for your Broadcom nic). After compilation and reboot, just modconf and add in the tg3 module (or for just this boot only, say for testing purposes, modprobe tg3). If the tg3 is not the correct driver for your Broadcom, I'm not sure what to tell you. If instead of recompiling the kernel again, you want to just use the module you compiled yourself, you should be able to add it to the kernel temporarily with modprobe module_name. You might need to run depmod first to check module dependencies. To add it more permanently, add the module_name to /etc/modules. This method may require other things as well, such as tinkering with /etc/modutils/aliases, but that's beyond me. -- Kent West ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 10:17:43 -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: After not getting any instructions on how to compile a module that didn't come with the source into a kernel I gave up and decided to just do the nic module as installable. Since I had the source for the new kernel I went ahead and compiled it by Kents 10 step list. I left the things I didn't understand at their default value. It booted and seems to run as before. I then made the nic module and make installed it. You should have been able to add the nic module during the 10-step procedure, and then you wouldn't have to make the nic module and make install it afterwards. While configuring your kernel (Step 6 in the Kent's 10-Step Procedure to Compiling a Debian Kernel portion of /usr/share/doc/kernel-package/README.gz), you need to go into the Network Device Support option, then probably Ethernet (1000Mbit), then put an M in front of Broadcom Tigon3 Support (assuming this is the correct driver for your Broadcom nic). That's the problem. My nic isn't listed. The Tigon3 is listed but not the 4401. I couldn't find out how to include a module that isn't listed but for which one has the source. Is there any significant reason to prefer having it in the kernel as opposed to just having it installed at boot? Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 12:56:20 -0800 (PST), Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 10:17:43 -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: After not getting any instructions on how to compile a module that didn't come with the source into a kernel I gave up and decided to just do the nic module as installable. Since I had the source for the new kernel I went ahead and compiled it by Kents 10 step list. I left the things I didn't understand at their default value. It booted and seems to run as before. I then made the nic module and make installed it. You should have been able to add the nic module during the 10-step procedure, and then you wouldn't have to make the nic module and make install it afterwards. While configuring your kernel (Step 6 in the Kent's 10-Step Procedure to Compiling a Debian Kernel portion of /usr/share/doc/kernel-package/README.gz), you need to go into the Network Device Support option, then probably Ethernet (1000Mbit), then put an M in front of Broadcom Tigon3 Support (assuming this is the correct driver for your Broadcom nic). That's the problem. My nic isn't listed. The Tigon3 is listed but not the 4401. I couldn't find out how to include a module that isn't listed but for which one has the source. Is there any significant reason to prefer having it in the kernel as opposed to just having it installed at boot? Ok, it is in /etc/modules and seems to be working. Now I just need to know where I put the ip address, gateway address, netmask (I don't know what this one does but my ISP assigned me one), and name server addresses for that card. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, Nov 13, 2003 at 01:41:46PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 12:56:20 -0800 (PST), Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 10:17:43 -0600, Kent West wrote: Is there any significant reason to prefer having it in the kernel as opposed to just having it installed at boot? Ok, it is in /etc/modules and seems to be working. Now I just need to know where I put the ip address, gateway address, netmask (I don't know what this one does but my ISP assigned me one), and name server addresses for that card. man ifconfig man route man resolv.conf If I remember correctly, you'll want to do the ifconfig first, specifying the ip address and netmask, then use route to specify the gateway. I think the commands should look something like this: ifconfig eth0 IP address netmask netmask up route add default gw gateway And the nameserver addresses go in /etc/resolv.conf Cheers! -- ,-. -ScruLoose- | Forward he cried from the rear; and the front rank died Please do not | and the General sat, and the lines on the map reply off-list. | moved from side to side. | - Pink Floyd `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: That's the problem. My nic isn't listed. The Tigon3 is listed but not the 4401. I couldn't find out how to include a module that isn't listed but for which one has the source. Is there any significant reason to prefer having it in the kernel as opposed to just having it installed at boot? If I understand what you're asking, you're asking the difference between built-in support and support via module. Having support built-in means the support is provided more immediately than if a module has to be built. I believe it also takes a bit less resources and is a bit faster as it's more integrated. Of course, that also means it's always eating up those resources, as opposed to a module that can be unloaded when it's not needed. Ok, it is in /etc/modules and seems to be working. Now I just need to know where I put the ip address, gateway address, netmask (I don't know what this one does but my ISP assigned me one), and name server addresses for that card. This means you've found a module for your nic? Whoo-hoo! The Debian way is to edit /etc/network/interfaces. It'll need to look something like this: # The loopback interface # automatically added when upgrading auto lo iface lo inet loopback # The first network card - this entry was created during the Debian installation # (network, broadcast and gateway are optional) # automatically added when upgrading auto eth0 iface eth0 inet static address 192.168.123.2 netmask 255.255.255.0 gateway 192.168.123.1 #iface eth0 inet dhcp If you were to use dhcp instead of a static address, you'd comment out the static lines and uncomment the dhcp line. Then to bring the interface up or down, just run /etc/init.d/networking start or /etc/init.d/networking stop. -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Got the networking going. WooHoo. Now I'm going to spend some time watching cartoons and if a few days start asking a bunch of questions to try to get my X working. One minor question set. 1) The backspace key doesn't work in vi. Is this some kind of terminal settings problem or an nvi problem (I'm used to vim). Is there a debian package for vim? Can I just install it without removing nvi without confusing anything? Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Op vr 14-11-2003, om 00:44 schreef Mark Healey: Got the networking going. WooHoo. Now I'm going to spend some time watching cartoons and if a few days start asking a bunch of questions to try to get my X working. One minor question set. 1) The backspace key doesn't work in vi. Is this some kind of terminal settings problem or an nvi problem (I'm used to vim). Is there a debian package for vim? Can I just install it without removing nvi without confusing anything? Yes you can. The vim package automagically installs it as the default editor. You can check this with update-alternatives --display vi This script manages the links in /etc/alternatives. Regards, Benedict -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: Got the networking going. WooHoo. Excellent. Now I'm going to spend some time watching cartoons and if a few days start asking a bunch of questions to try to get my X working. Or you could let the downloading occur while you're watching cartoons. Edit /etc/apt/sources.list to point to the repository from which you wish to install. Here's mine: # See sources.list(5) for more information, especialy # Remember that you can only use http, ftp or file URIs # CDROMs are managed through the apt-cdrom tool. #deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian stable main contrib non-free #deb http://non-us.debian.org/debian-non-US stable/non-US main contrib non-free #deb http://security.debian.org stable/updates main contrib non-free # Uncomment if you want the apt-get source function to work #deb-src http://http.us.debian.org/debian stable main contrib non-free #deb-src http://non-us.debian.org/debian-non-US stable non-US # UnStable deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main non-free contrib deb http://non-us.debian.org/debian-non-US unstable/non-US main contrib non-free # Stable deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ stable main non-free contrib deb http://non-us.debian.org/debian-non-US stable/non-US main contrib non-free deb http://security.debian.org/ stable/updates main contrib non-free This gives me a sid box (unstable), with security patches that are backported to stable, along with any packages in stable that for one reason or another are not available in unstable. One minor question set. 1) The backspace key doesn't work in vi. Is this some kind of terminal settings problem or an nvi problem (I'm used to vim). Is there a debian package for vim? Can I just install it without removing nvi without confusing anything? Sorry; I avoid vi as much as I can, and therefore know little about it. -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 21:34:57 -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 6 Nov 2003 13:09:24 -0500, ScruLoose wrote: First off. I am doing this because none of the kernels on the cds support my nic. Consequently, any suggestions that involve using apt-get isn't really helpful. Also, my X isn't working either so the same applies any graphical tools. One thing that helps in this regard is to keep different topics in different threads, and to title the subject line accordingly. For example, X issues might be titled something like X won't start for this newbie, and network issues might be titled something like 3c59x module loads, but can't ping. This also helps other users when they go searching the archives for answers to their similar dilemmas. So, what's wrong again with your X setup? I don't even want to think about the X problem until I get the networking up. My guess, right now, is that ATI changed their chipset. I'll really look into it later. Buying another nic card isn't an option either. Why? I vaguely remember someone saying they couldn't get to town to get a nic because they have a broken/missing accelerator cable. Fixed that. Perhaps that was you? Or is it because you can't afford one? Don't have the slots available for one? Several reasons. I'm afraid that the model listing on the box won't include any revision numbers indicating that it is actually broken for linux use (has happened to me before). I fear lots of reconfiguration difficulties when I remove it and try to move everything to the original nic (this has happened with OS/2). I also fear that even if I succeed to move back to the original card that there will be lots of vestigal crap missed that will make things difficult later. I've decided to roll my own (this is hacker shit that an ordinary user should never have to even think about) becasue none of the precompiled kernels match what I have very well. You're right; ordinary users shouldn't have to think about rolling their own if they're paying for service. However, if you're getting something free, sometimes you have to accept the flaws in that product. Debian coders are volunteers; I'm sure they'd love to have real paying jobs where they could scratch their itch and yours. Instead, they scratch their itch because they want to, and if you benefit from it, great!. And part of that itch scratching for many of them is to solve problems for you, but that's lower on the priority list for most. I certainly understand your frustration. I've been there a time or two. I've learned to blame the hardware manufacturers for not supporting Debian instead of blaming Debian for not supporting certain hardware. I hope that lesson has made me a better citizen of the Debian community. I realize that and I've been told that writing installers is considered scut work. But if it isn't fixed, Debian will remain a hackers distro. I would suggest (modestly?) that you read Kent's 10-Step Procedure to Compiling a Debian Kernel, which is the bottom section of README.gz in /usr/share/doc/kernel-package (you'll need to apt-get install kernel-package to ge this document). I hope that was a cruel joke. It also seems to be online here: Appearantly it was. http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2002/debian-user-200205/msg02951.html. It may not answer your questions, but it covers the things that I saw as issues. I'll give it a shot in the morning. This is more out of curiosity than anything else but is there a way to check what features are incorperated into a running kernel. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Hi Mark, * Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] [031107 18:32]: On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 21:34:57 -0600, Kent West wrote: snip lotsa stuff I would suggest (modestly?) that you read Kent's 10-Step Procedure to Compiling a Debian Kernel, which is the bottom section of README.gz in /usr/share/doc/kernel-package (you'll need to apt-get install kernel-package to ge this document). I hope that was a cruel joke. Or maybe Kent forgot you have no working nic... However, this translates to beg, borrow, buy or steal a kernel-package .deb file the same way that you managed to get the kernel source onto your machine. You can then install it with dpkg -i. It also seems to be online here: Appearantly it was. Regardless, you should install this package and use it to help you build a kernel that supports your nic. http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2002/debian-user-200205/msg02951.html. It may not answer your questions, but it covers the things that I saw as issues. I'll give it a shot in the morning. ... gotta love timezones. This is more out of curiosity than anything else but is there a way to check what features are incorperated into a running kernel. You can look at the config file. Any Debian packaged kernel will have a copy of its config file installed at /boot/config-`uname -r` where `uname -r` is what is the output of the same command when running the given kernel. eg for me: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~ 2% uname -r 2.6.0-test9-looxt93c1 So my kernels config file is /boot/config-2.6.0-test9-looxt93c1 I guess for you it will be something like /boot/config-2.4.18-bf2.4 or /boot/config-2.2.25-idepci Sorry I'm sure you said what kernel you you were running in an earlier email, but I don't remember now. Best of luck, Nick. -- Debian testing/unstable Linux twofish 2.6.0-test9-looxt93c1 i686 GNU/Linux signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 21:34:57 -0600, Kent West wrote: This is more out of curiosity than anything else but is there a way to check what features are incorperated into a running kernel. Sort of. In /boot you should have a config file that matches your kernel. For example, I'm currently running 2.4.18-k7, and I have a file /boot/config-2.4.18-k7. This is the configuration file that was used to compile this kernel. It's not exactly human-readable, but it almost is :-) For example, here's the mouse section: # # Mice # CONFIG_BUSMOUSE=m CONFIG_ATIXL_BUSMOUSE=m CONFIG_LOGIBUSMOUSE=m CONFIG_MS_BUSMOUSE=m CONFIG_MOUSE=m CONFIG_PSMOUSE=y CONFIG_82C710_MOUSE=m CONFIG_PC110_PAD=m According to it, all the mouse drivers are compiled as modules, except for the PS2 mouse, which is built-into the kernel. -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Fri, 2003-11-07 at 09:11, Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 21:34:57 -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 6 Nov 2003 13:09:24 -0500, ScruLoose wrote: First off. I am doing this because none of the kernels on the cds support my nic. Consequently, any suggestions that involve using apt-get isn't really helpful. Also, my X isn't working either so the same applies any graphical tools. I recognize this answer is coming rather late... first off: you don't need a network connection to install stuff. you can just as well download a package, bring it to some removable media, and carry it to the box in question. Then dpkg -i. Over here we call this the sneaker network. To make this easier, there is a package called apt-zip. Please note that you don't necessarily have to use zip disks. Any removable media will do, you can burn it to DVD or punch a paper tape. Doesn't matter. Next, I strongly suggest you build your kernel the debian way as has been pointed out in several posts. That's really easy. The above should enable you to install all the necessary packages. HTH, Schnobs -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
* Mark Healey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I've managed to get the tarball for 2.4.22 which is what kernel.org says is the latest stable one. Seriously -- get kernel-source-2.4.22. I fought with the stock kernel for weeks, and could not get it to work. It would compile, but hang partway through loading. With the same features the Debianised version runs like a top. Good luck Cam -- Cam Ellison Ph.D. R.Psych. From Roberts Creek on B.C.'s incomparable Sunshine Coast cam(at)ellisonet(dot)ca camellison(at)dccnet(dot)com cam(at)fleuryassociates(dot)com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Fri, Nov 07, 2003 at 12:11:37AM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 06 Nov 2003 21:34:57 -0600, Kent West wrote: I would suggest (modestly?) that you read Kent's 10-Step Procedure to Compiling a Debian Kernel, which is the bottom section of README.gz in /usr/share/doc/kernel-package (you'll need to apt-get install kernel-package to ge this document). I hope that was a cruel joke. Why do you say that? If you use apt-cdrom to set your apt sources.list so it points at your collection of woody CDs (also comment out or delete any references to network sources), you can apt-get install plenty of stuff without a network connection. Similarly, you could then use aptitude (I really like aptitude, and being ncurses-based, it doesn't need X). And you really will want to install the kernel-package package before you start actually compiling a kernel, so there's nothing cruel or inappropriate about referring you to docs that are included in that package. Depending on how many of the woody CDs you have, you can very likely use apt-get or aptitude to install all the packages that people have been suggesting. I used this method to install all the tools that are called for in the Very Verbose Guide to Compiling a Debian Kernel. Cheers! -- ,-. -ScruLoose- | If we do not believe in freedom of speech Please do not | for those we despise reply off-list. |we do not believe in it at all. | - Noam Chomsky `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 15:16:28 -0800, Cam Ellison wrote: * Mark Healey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I've managed to get the tarball for 2.4.22 which is what kernel.org says is the latest stable one. Seriously -- get kernel-source-2.4.22. I fought with the stock kernel for weeks, and could not get it to work. It would compile, but hang partway through loading. With the same features the Debianised version runs like a top. Unless I'm looking in the wrong place there are only packages up to 2.4.18. I Even googled kernel-source-2.4.22.deb and got nothing. Where is it? Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Fri, Nov 07, 2003 at 03:54:27PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 15:16:28 -0800, Cam Ellison wrote: * Mark Healey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I've managed to get the tarball for 2.4.22 which is what kernel.org says is the latest stable one. Seriously -- get kernel-source-2.4.22. I fought with the stock kernel for weeks, and could not get it to work. It would compile, but hang partway through loading. With the same features the Debianised version runs like a top. Unless I'm looking in the wrong place there are only packages up to 2.4.18. I Even googled kernel-source-2.4.22.deb and got nothing. Where is it? http://packages.debian.org/unstable/devel/kernel-source-2.4.22.html Hit the go to download page button, and pick a mirror. Never mind the fact that it's listed as an unstable package. It doesn't actually have any dependencies that make that an issue. (I compiled a kernel from this source under woody last week.) Your search was probably limited to stable if I guess right. And the google search would fail because the filename is actually kernel-source-2.4.22_2.4.22-3_all.deb Don't ask me about that naming scheme! ;-) Cheers! -- ,-. -ScruLoose- | Please do not | Bwahahaha-- I mean, oops. reply off-list. | `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Fri, Nov 07, 2003 at 03:54:27PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 15:16:28 -0800, Cam Ellison wrote: * Mark Healey ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: I've managed to get the tarball for 2.4.22 which is what kernel.org says is the latest stable one. Seriously -- get kernel-source-2.4.22. I fought with the stock kernel for weeks, and could not get it to work. It would compile, but hang partway through loading. With the same features the Debianised version runs like a top. Unless I'm looking in the wrong place there are only packages up to 2.4.18. I Even googled kernel-source-2.4.22.deb and got nothing. Where is it? This beats Google for finding official debs: http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages#search_packages Plug in kernel-source-2.4.22 and tell it to search in the testing distribution. -- Pigeon Be kind to pigeons Get my GPG key here: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=getsearch=0x21C61F7F pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, Nov 06, 2003 at 12:23:35AM -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: Exactly what is a kernel-image? A kernel-image is a pre-compiled kernel; it's the base, the core, of Debian GNU/Linux (and other Linux-based operating systems). This is in contrast to a kernel source tarball (a .tar.bz2, as you mention above), which must be configured and compiled. The source is what the programmers write. Then they (or you) compile it into a binary image. Installing a kernel-image is usually much easier than rolling your own. Of course, compiling your own kernel has its advantages, such as being customized to your hardware rather than being more generic, etc. And don't forget the option of getting a Debian kernel-source package, which has the advantage of coming with some (useful?) patches pre-applied. Download the kernel-source deb, dpkg -i the sucker, and it'll get untarred into the appropriate location, ready to configure/compile. Also check out The Very Verbose Guide to Updating and Compiling Your Debian Kernel http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=2949 Which I found to be very helpful when compiling my first kernel. About a week ago. (None of the precompiled kernel-image ones I tried would support my NIC) Cheers! -- ,-. -ScruLoose- | Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards Please do not |for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup. reply off-list. | `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, 6 Nov 2003 13:09:24 -0500, ScruLoose wrote: First off. I am doing this because none of the kernels on the cds support my nic. Consequently, any suggestions that involve using apt-get show that the suggestor is a moron who doesn't pay attention. Also, my X isn't working either so the same applies to people who suggest using some X program to fix the problem. Buying another nic card isn't an option either. Experience has shown that I'm going to have to include the above in every post. I've decided to roll my own (this is hacker shit that an ordinary user should never have to even think about) becasue none of the precompiled kernels match what I have very well. I've managed to get the tarball for 2.4.22 which is what kernel.org says is the latest stable one. I need instructions. Someone suggested: Also check out The Very Verbose Guide to Updating and Compiling Your Debian Kernel http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=2949 Which was close but unfortunately is apt-get and X dependent. Is there a site that has instructions in comparable depth that only depend on console apps? Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Thu, Nov 06, 2003 at 04:51:54PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 6 Nov 2003 13:09:24 -0500, ScruLoose wrote: First off. I am doing this because none of the kernels on the cds support my nic. Consequently, any suggestions that involve using apt-get show that the suggestor is a moron who doesn't pay attention. Also, my X isn't working either so the same applies to people who suggest using some X program to fix the problem. Or maybe some of the people offering you their suggestions (for free, remember) actually have a life and haven't been following your thread from the beginning. Buying another nic card isn't an option either. Fair enough. I felt the same way, and I got the damn thing to work. Experience has shown that I'm going to have to include the above in every post. Yep. Give people enough context that they can make an informed answer. Do not assume they've read preceding posts. Often they haven't. I've decided to roll my own (this is hacker shit that an ordinary user should never have to even think about) Well, if you're not prepared to spend the $15 on better-supported hardware... You've made your choice. Admittedly it's the same choice I made, but I didn't go around bitching about how it was all somebody's fault and how put-upon poor little me was about the whole thing. becasue none of the precompiled kernels match what I have very well. Yep. Again, that's my situation exactly. I had a NIC, the precompiled kernels didn't want to work with it, no X installed on machine... I've managed to get the tarball for 2.4.22 which is what kernel.org says is the latest stable one. You could instead get a kernel-source debian package. Rumour has it that they come already-patched, although I have no idea personally how significant the differences would be. And please don't tell me that I'm a) assuming you have apt working and b) a moron. You got the tarball somehow, right? Get the deb somehow. Once it's on the machine in question, dpkg -i filename.deb will install it (which in the case of a kernel-source package means that it'll unpack it into the appropriate /usr/src/ subdirectory for you). http://packages.debian.org is your starting point to manually download deb packages, and kernel-source packages depend on very little (nothing that's branch-specific, so you can go ahead and take the 2.4.22 even though it's listed as testing/unstable). I need instructions. Someone suggested: Yep. Someone was me. Also check out The Very Verbose Guide to Updating and Compiling Your Debian Kernel http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=2949 Which was close but unfortunately is apt-get and X dependent. Is there a site that has instructions in comparable depth that only depend on console apps? That guide is not dependent on apt-get OR X. Substitude make menuconfig for make xconfig, and ta-da, you can do it from the console. That fact is explicitly pointed out in the article. You might want to be careful throwing around terms like moron when you can't be bothered to actually _read_ the resources you've been offered. People in glass houses and all that. You _do_ need to install the tools mentioned in that article, but nobody really cares whether you apt-get them or download them onto another machine, put them on a CDR(W), and dpkg -i them onto the system you need them on. Or, much tidier, if you've got a Knoppix disk and your NIC works under Knoppix: you can boot knoppix, mount your hard drive read-write, download packages, reboot into Debian and dpkg -i to install them. Tidier yet, apt-get them off your CDs (if you have the woody CDs that include those packages, of course. I don't know what's on which disk). Whatever. Just use whatever method you used on your kernel-source tarball to get the relevant .deb files to the machine, install them, and quit insulting the people who are trying to help you. I had a NIC-not-supported problem just last week (on a machine with no X, by the way), and that worked for me. I didn't need that last step, though, because I wasn't tossing insults around in the first place. Giving debian a chance. With this attitude? -- ,-. -ScruLoose- | If fifty million people say a foolish thing, Please do not | it's still a foolish thing. reply off-list. | - Bertrand Russell `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: On Thu, 6 Nov 2003 13:09:24 -0500, ScruLoose wrote: First off. I am doing this because none of the kernels on the cds support my nic. Consequently, any suggestions that involve using apt-get show that the suggestor is a moron who doesn't pay attention. Whereas I might agree that the person is not paying attention, I don't believe I'd agree that s/he's a moron. There are lots of messages that go by on this list. If you mention something in a post, and four or twenty postings later in the same thread someone makes a comment even if he's been reading the thread all along, he may not remember that detail from four postings ago, particularly if he's been reading two or three other threads that are similar to the one in question. Also, from the post to which this message is a reply, I'm not sure if Mark Healy or ScruLoose wrote the paragraph mentioning a moron. We all make mistakes in quote attribution at times, and have been the victim of incorrect attribution. Also, my X isn't working either so the same applies to people who suggest using some X program to fix the problem. I know I've responded to Mark a time or two, maybe about X; maybe about the network; I just don't remember, and I don't keep the messages around too long, and I'm too lazy to go search the archives every time I need to remember a detail. If I've offended you by saying things that seem stupid to you, I apologize. It's not that I'm particularly stupid; it's that I can't remember who I told what when about what issue. One thing that helps in this regard is to keep different topics in different threads, and to title the subject line accordingly. For example, X issues might be titled something like X won't start for this newbie, and network issues might be titled something like 3c59x module loads, but can't ping. This also helps other users when they go searching the archives for answers to their similar dilemmas. So, what's wrong again with your X setup? Buying another nic card isn't an option either. Why? I vaguely remember someone saying they couldn't get to town to get a nic because they have a broken/missing accelerator cable. Perhaps that was you? Or is it because you can't afford one? Don't have the slots available for one? Experience has shown that I'm going to have to include the above in every post. Sorry I'm so dense. But yep, I need lots of repetition. I've decided to roll my own (this is hacker shit that an ordinary user should never have to even think about) becasue none of the precompiled kernels match what I have very well. You're right; ordinary users shouldn't have to think about rolling their own if they're paying for service. However, if you're getting something free, sometimes you have to accept the flaws in that product. Debian coders are volunteers; I'm sure they'd love to have real paying jobs where they could scratch their itch and yours. Instead, they scratch their itch because they want to, and if you benefit from it, great!. And part of that itch scratching for many of them is to solve problems for you, but that's lower on the priority list for most. I certainly understand your frustration. I've been there a time or two. I've learned to blame the hardware manufacturers for not supporting Debian instead of blaming Debian for not supporting certain hardware. I hope that lesson has made me a better citizen of the Debian community. I've managed to get the tarball for 2.4.22 which is what kernel.org says is the latest stable one. I need instructions. Someone suggested: Also check out The Very Verbose Guide to Updating and Compiling Your Debian Kernel http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=2949 Which was close but unfortunately is apt-get and X dependent. Is there a site that has instructions in comparable depth that only depend on console apps? I would suggest (modestly?) that you read Kent's 10-Step Procedure to Compiling a Debian Kernel, which is the bottom section of README.gz in /usr/share/doc/kernel-package (you'll need to apt-get install kernel-package to ge this document). It also seems to be online here: http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2002/debian-user-200205/msg02951.html. It may not answer your questions, but it covers the things that I saw as issues. -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: I still think that the $15 NIC would be the easiest. Car has no accelerator cable. Wedge a screwdriver in the accelerator linkage at the carburetor to bring the engine to about 8200rpm, and with a little judicious use of the gear shift (manual easiest, but automatic works too), you can get to the store before the transmission gets thrown out the bottom of your car or your crankshaft snaps in two. Simple :-) -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Wed, 2003-11-05 at 08:56, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: I still think that the $15 NIC would be the easiest. Car has no accelerator cable. Wedge a screwdriver in the accelerator linkage at the carburetor to Boy, you're an old geezer, aren't you? Do any cars sold in the US last 10 years have carburetors? -- - Ron Johnson, Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jefferson, LA USA (Women are) like compilers. They take simple statements and make them into big productions. Pitr Dubovitch -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 at 06:35 GMT, Mark Healey penned: On Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:52:38 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: Mame cab? What is this beast? An arcade style video game cabinet. Mame is an emublator of old arcade games. http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade.htm http://www.mame.net/ That's what I thought you meant. I'm still confused as to how it relates to Debian, but *shrug* I'm sure it makes sense to you =) -- monique PLEASE don't CC me. Please. Pretty please with sugar on top. Whatever it takes, just don't CC me! I'm already subscribed!! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
OT: Was: Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Ron Johnson wrote: On Wed, 2003-11-05 at 08:56, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: I still think that the $15 NIC would be the easiest. Car has no accelerator cable. Wedge a screwdriver in the accelerator linkage at the carburetor to Boy, you're an old geezer, aren't you? Do any cars sold in the US last 10 years have carburetors? Less a function of old than of poor; my current vehicle is 13 years old, and the one before that was about the same age when I got this one. -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:47:46 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 at 06:35 GMT, Mark Healey penned: On Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:52:38 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: Mame cab? What is this beast? An arcade style video game cabinet. Mame is an emublator of old arcade games. http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade.htm http://www.mame.net/ That's what I thought you meant. I'm still confused as to how it relates to Debian, but *shrug* I'm sure it makes sense to you =) Gotta have a working PC inside, Debian is the distro I plan to use. With Redhat moving towards their Fedora scheme I figure that a move to Debian is the best way to avoid any more surprises from another comercial vendor. I've also noticed that most distros that are built upon another are built upon Debian, so it must be pretty good. Anyway I believe I should get kernel version 2.4.22. That's the latest stable one, right? Is there a .deb package (and where is it) or should I just get the .tar.bz2 one from kernel.org? I did find a HOWTO but it is pretty redhat centric and assumes that one has X running. My X doesn't work, I'm sure I'll be posting about that later. Is there a good clear debian centered HOWTO and where is it? BTW. Knoppix kicks ass. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 08:56:19 -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: I still think that the $15 NIC would be the easiest. Car has no accelerator cable. Wedge a screwdriver in the accelerator linkage at the carburetor Carbuwhater? This is a 32 year old car and it has EFI, analog but still. to bring the engine to about 8200rpm, and with a little judicious use of the gear shift (manual easiest, but automatic works too), you can get to the store before the transmission gets thrown out the bottom of your car or your crankshaft snaps in two. Simple :-) San Diego is a pretty spread out city. You don't get anywhere without getting on the freeway. I'll just wait for my cable to arrive in the mail and hope they send the right one. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 at 21:18 GMT, Mark Healey penned: With Redhat moving towards their Fedora scheme I figure that a move to Debian is the best way to avoid any more surprises from another comercial vendor. I've also noticed that most distros that are built upon another are built upon Debian, so it must be pretty good. Anyway I believe I should get kernel version 2.4.22. That's the latest stable one, right? I'm running 2.4.21, so I'm guessing 2.4.22 would be sufficiently recent =) Is there a .deb package (and where is it) or should I just get the .tar.bz2 one from kernel.org? Yup. Um, let's see. I would normally go to http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages and search from there, but it's giving me a malformed query error. What I normally do is download the kernel-source package, and that puts all the code in /usr/src. Of course, that method isn't terribly helpful to you at the moment. You could get the kernel.org stuff if you want; my impression is that debian maintainers add their own useful patches and whatnot on top of that, but I know I've run a custom-built kernel from kernel.org on a debian system in the past without trouble. I did find a HOWTO but it is pretty redhat centric and assumes that one has X running. My X doesn't work, I'm sure I'll be posting about that later. Is there a good clear debian centered HOWTO and where is it? Um. I know there are some debian-specific tools to make building a kernel easier, but I am lazy and still do things the way I learned to do them lo these many years ago. For one thing, the stock debian kernels use initrd, so I assume the debian tools create a kernel that uses initrd (but I don't know that for sure). I did just find this by googling on debian kernel build: http://docs.linux.cz/debian-faq/debian-faq-11.html BTW. Knoppix kicks ass. Indeed =) -- monique PLEASE don't CC me. Please. Pretty please with sugar on top. Whatever it takes, just don't CC me! I'm already subscribed!! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: On Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:47:46 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 at 06:35 GMT, Mark Healey penned: On Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:52:38 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: Mame cab? What is this beast? An arcade style video game cabinet. Mame is an emublator of old arcade games. http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade.htm http://www.mame.net/ That's what I thought you meant. I'm still confused as to how it relates to Debian, but *shrug* I'm sure it makes sense to you =) Gotta have a working PC inside, Debian is the distro I plan to use. With Redhat moving towards their Fedora scheme I figure that a move to Debian is the best way to avoid any more surprises from another comercial vendor. I've also noticed that most distros that are built upon another are built upon Debian, so it must be pretty good. Anyway I believe I should get kernel version 2.4.22. That's the latest stable one, right? Is there a .deb package (and where is it) or should I just get the .tar.bz2 one from kernel.org? I did find a HOWTO but it is pretty redhat centric and assumes that one has X running. My X doesn't work, I'm sure I'll be posting about that later. # apt-cache search kernel-image-2.4 . . . kernel-image-2.4.22-1-386 - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22 on 386. kernel-image-2.4.22-1-586tsc - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22 on Pentium-Classic. kernel-image-2.4.22-1-686 - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22 on PPro/Celeron/PII/PIII/PIV. kernel-image-2.4.22-1-686-smp - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22 on PPro/Celeron/PII/PIII/PIV SMP. kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k6 - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22 on AMD K6/K6-II/K6-III. kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7 - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22 on AMD K7. kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7-smp - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22 on AMD K7 SMP. kernel-image-2.4.22-speakup - Linux kernel image for version 2.4.22-speakup . . . # apt-get install kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7 -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 18:00:11 -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: On Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:47:46 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 at 06:35 GMT, Mark Healey penned: On Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:52:38 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: Mame cab? What is this beast? An arcade style video game cabinet. Mame is an emublator of old arcade games. http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade.htm http://www.mame.net/ That's what I thought you meant. I'm still confused as to how it relates to Debian, but *shrug* I'm sure it makes sense to you =) Gotta have a working PC inside, Debian is the distro I plan to use. With Redhat moving towards their Fedora scheme I figure that a move to Debian is the best way to avoid any more surprises from another comercial vendor. I've also noticed that most distros that are built upon another are built upon Debian, so it must be pretty good. Anyway I believe I should get kernel version 2.4.22. That's the latest stable one, right? Is there a .deb package (and where is it) or should I just get the .tar.bz2 one from kernel.org? I did find a HOWTO but it is pretty redhat centric and assumes that one has X running. My X doesn't work, I'm sure I'll be posting about that later. # apt-cache search kernel-image-2.4 . . . . . . # apt-get install kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7 That would be nice if I had networking which I don't which is why I'm trying to build a new kernel in the first place. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 18:00:11 -0600, Kent West wrote: Anyway I believe I should get kernel version 2.4.22. That's the latest stable one, right? Is there a .deb package (and where is it) or should I just get the .tar.bz2 one from kernel.org? I did find a HOWTO but it is pretty redhat centric and assumes that one has X running. My X doesn't work, I'm sure I'll be posting about that later. # apt-cache search kernel-image-2.4 . . . . . . # apt-get install kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7 That would be nice if I had networking which I don't which is why I'm trying to build a new kernel in the first place. Ah, sorry. In that case, go get the .deb from here: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/base/kernel-image-2.4-k7.html using another machine that has networking. Drop the .deb file into a convenient location on your Debian box and run dpkg -i kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7 http://packages.debian.org/unstable/base/kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7.html (Of course you'll want to get the right flavor of kernel for your CPU; this one's for AMD Athlons and similar. Start here: http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages, and search for kernel-image-2.4.) -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 23:45:18 -0600, Kent West wrote: Mark Healey wrote: On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 18:00:11 -0600, Kent West wrote: Anyway I believe I should get kernel version 2.4.22. That's the latest stable one, right? Is there a .deb package (and where is it) or should I just get the .tar.bz2 one from kernel.org? I did find a HOWTO but it is pretty redhat centric and assumes that one has X running. My X doesn't work, I'm sure I'll be posting about that later. # apt-cache search kernel-image-2.4 . . . . . . # apt-get install kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7 That would be nice if I had networking which I don't which is why I'm trying to build a new kernel in the first place. Ah, sorry. In that case, go get the .deb from here: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/base/kernel-image-2.4-k7.html using another machine that has networking. Drop the .deb file into a convenient location on your Debian box and run dpkg -i kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7 http://packages.debian.org/unstable/base/kernel-image-2.4.22-1-k7.html (Of course you'll want to get the right flavor of kernel for your CPU; this one's for AMD Athlons and similar. Start here: http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages, and search for kernel-image-2.4.) Exactly what is a kernel-image? Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
Mark Healey wrote: On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 23:45:18 -0600, Kent West wrote: Anyway I believe I should get kernel version 2.4.22. That's the latest stable one, right? Is there a .deb package (and where is it) or should I just get the .tar.bz2 one from kernel.org? Ah, sorry. In that case, go get the .deb from here: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/base/kernel-image-2.4-k7.html (Of course you'll want to get the right flavor of kernel for your CPU; this one's for AMD Athlons and similar. Start here: http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages, and search for kernel-image-2.4.) Exactly what is a kernel-image? A kernel-image is a pre-compiled kernel; it's the base, the core, of Debian GNU/Linux (and other Linux-based operating systems). This is in contrast to a kernel source tarball (a .tar.bz2, as you mention above), which must be configured and compiled. The source is what the programmers write. Then they (or you) compile it into a binary image. Installing a kernel-image is usually much easier than rolling your own. Of course, compiling your own kernel has its advantages, such as being customized to your hardware rather than being more generic, etc. -- Kent -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Mon, Nov 03, 2003 at 10:45:09PM -0800, Mark Healey wrote: Many of you have read my saga of trying to install Debian and witnessed my frustration. The main problem is that my onboard nic isn't supported by the kernel on the CD and there is no module for it installed either. This left me with no networking so I couldn't use any of the clever debian install utilites. I recieved many suggestions to remedy the problem, non of them easy. ... Adding a $15 nic isn't easy? I've had problems with particular cards and have done this a number of times. It seems reasonable to expect you could be up and running, networking included, just with the default CD, then upgrade away after that. But maybe there's no PCI or ISA slots, or I'm obviously missing something. Good luck! Ken -- Ken Irving, Research Analyst, [EMAIL PROTECTED], 907-474-6152 Water and Environmental Research Center Institute of Northern Engineering University of Alaska, Fairbanks -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
[Snipping most] On Tue, 04 Nov 2003 at 06:45 GMT, Mark Healey penned: I've decided to try to recompile the latest kernel. I figure that it would be nice to have the latest kernel with support for only the hardware I have (or think I might add in the future) and none for what I won't ever have. But, this is hacker level stuff I've never done, so I'm going to need a whole-lotta help. Have you ever written any code before, or even compiled anything? Just trying to establish a baseline of what you might know. Any downloads required are going to have to be done on my OS/2 machine and burned to a CD. One of my main concerns is that I don't want to have to go through a whole stack of CD becuasue I didn't get everything I need and have to go back. Don't suppose you have a zip drive or keychain usb drive sitting around? I currently have the default vanilla installation in the machine I plan to put Debian on (It's eventual home will be inside a Mame cab). Mame cab? What is this beast? I need to know what is part of the kernel source package? IDE hard drive support? Floppy support (even thought I don't have one installed I might in the future)? USB? Mouse, Serial and Paralell ports? All of the above will be part of the kernel source package. The only thing that wouldn't be part of this package would be third-party drivers that you could only get from the manufacturer. Or bleeding-edge patches and drivers that haven't made it into the kernel package yet. I'm also wondering if I will be able to boot into the old kernel if teh new one doesn't work? Yes, if you set lilo up properly. It may barf up messages about mismatched System.map files and whatnot, though. These are all my preliminary questions. I'm sure the answers will result in more questions so please be patient. I still think that the $15 NIC would be the easiest. Someone else's earlier suggestion about using Knoppix was also a pretty good one -- Knoppix's ability to detect stuff is nothing short of amazing to me. It even knew the exact model of the wireless USB mini-mouse I was using on a laptop. I bet you could boot up the latest version of Knoppix, have network support without having to manually configure a single thing, mount your hard drive, d/l the new kernel and compile it, etc, then afterwards boot off the hard drive. You would have to learn the chroot command and a couple of other arcane things, but you wouldn't have to burn through a bunch of CD-Rs. And did I mention Knoppix is sweet? -- monique PLEASE don't CC me. Please. Pretty please with sugar on top. Whatever it takes, just don't CC me! I'm already subscribed!! -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Tuesday 04 November 2003 18:52, Monique Y. Herman wrote: [...] Knoppix's ability to detect stuff is nothing short of amazing to me. [...] And did I mention Knoppix is sweet? Just love that Knoppix CD. Take it everywhere with me... Come to think of it, I never have to use it, so it obviously did right... -- richard -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Tue, Nov 04, 2003 at 10:52:38AM -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: On Tue, 04 Nov 2003 at 06:45 GMT, Mark Healey penned: I've decided to try to recompile the latest kernel. I figure that it would be nice to have the latest kernel with support for only the hardware I have (or think I might add in the future) and none for what I won't ever have. But, this is hacker level stuff I've never done, so I'm going to need a whole-lotta help. Have you ever written any code before, or even compiled anything? Just trying to establish a baseline of what you might know. FWIW, I compiled my first custom kernel very recently, following the Very Verbose Guide... http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=2949 ...and found the process remarkably painless. And I'm nobody's hacker. I once took a one-term class in C programming, but never wrote anything more sophisticated than a 25-line program to sort numbers into descending order. SNIP ... I bet you could boot up the latest version of Knoppix, have network support without having to manually configure a single thing, mount your hard drive, d/l the new kernel and compile it, etc, then afterwards boot off the hard drive. You would have to learn the chroot command and a couple of other arcane things, but you wouldn't have to burn through a bunch of CD-Rs. And did I mention Knoppix is sweet? I'll second this. It's what got me out of the exact same situation, just last week. The reason I compiled my first kernel, as mentioned above, was to make my NIC work. And I didn't even need to learn chroot to do it. (Boot knoppix, mount HD read-write, D/L kernel sources, reboot into Debian, compile new kernel, boot new kernel.) No doubt a $15 NIC would have been easier, but I'm a starving student and had already spent $25CDN (which I could ill afford) on the first one. Cheers! -- ,-. -ScruLoose- | To hell with Saddam Please do not | and may he quickly be joined by Bush. reply off-list. | - Salam Pax `-' pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: Going to give it another shot-need more help
On Tue, 4 Nov 2003 10:52:38 -0700, Monique Y. Herman wrote: [Snipping most] On Tue, 04 Nov 2003 at 06:45 GMT, Mark Healey penned: I've decided to try to recompile the latest kernel. I figure that it would be nice to have the latest kernel with support for only the hardware I have (or think I might add in the future) and none for what I won't ever have. But, this is hacker level stuff I've never done, so I'm going to need a whole-lotta help. Have you ever written any code before, or even compiled anything? Just trying to establish a baseline of what you might know. Not much. I did some C programming in OS/2 about 10 years ago. Just some little utilities. An occasional C program for CGI. Some Perl. A shitload of Rexx and macros in E (the macro language for the OS/2 text editor). I'm going to miss OS/2. The WPS is the best GUI ever. Any downloads required are going to have to be done on my OS/2 machine and burned to a CD. One of my main concerns is that I don't want to have to go through a whole stack of CD becuasue I didn't get everything I need and have to go back. Don't suppose you have a zip drive or keychain usb drive sitting around? No and one of the reasons I'm finally leaving OS/2 is that the USB support sucks. I currently have the default vanilla installation in the machine I plan to put Debian on (It's eventual home will be inside a Mame cab). Mame cab? What is this beast? An arcade style video game cabinet. Mame is an emublator of old arcade games. http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade.htm http://www.mame.net/ I still think that the $15 NIC would be the easiest. Car has no accelerator cable. Someone else's earlier suggestion about using Knoppix was also a pretty good one -- Knoppix's ability to detect stuff is nothing short of amazing to me. It even knew the exact model of the wireless USB mini-mouse I was using on a laptop. I bet you could boot up the latest version of Knoppix, have network support without having to manually configure a single thing, mount your hard drive, d/l the new kernel and compile it, etc, then afterwards boot off the hard drive. You would have to learn the chroot command and a couple of other arcane things, but you wouldn't have to burn through a bunch of CD-Rs. And did I mention Knoppix is sweet? I'll burn a Knoppix CD tomorrow and give it a shot. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Going to give it another shot-need more help
Many of you have read my saga of trying to install Debian and witnessed my frustration. The main problem is that my onboard nic isn't supported by the kernel on the CD and there is no module for it installed either. This left me with no networking so I couldn't use any of the clever debian install utilites. I recieved many suggestions to remedy the problem, non of them easy. I've decided to try to recompile the latest kernel. I figure that it would be nice to have the latest kernel with support for only the hardware I have (or think I might add in the future) and none for what I won't ever have. But, this is hacker level stuff I've never done, so I'm going to need a whole-lotta help. Any downloads required are going to have to be done on my OS/2 machine and burned to a CD. One of my main concerns is that I don't want to have to go through a whole stack of CD becuasue I didn't get everything I need and have to go back. I currently have the default vanilla installation in the machine I plan to put Debian on (It's eventual home will be inside a Mame cab). I need to know which tools I need. Here is what I know I will need and know that I have make gcc the .tar.gz of my nic drivers. I need to know what is part of the kernel source package? IDE hard drive support? Floppy support (even thought I don't have one installed I might in the future)? USB? Mouse, Serial and Paralell ports? I'm also wondering if I will be able to boot into the old kernel if teh new one doesn't work? These are all my preliminary questions. I'm sure the answers will result in more questions so please be patient. Mark Healey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Giving debian a chance. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
