Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Kent West]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 1:31 PM, Kent West  wrote:
>
>
> Normal Jessie install, but when it came time to do the "tasksel"-looking
> stage within the installer, I uninstalled everything.
>

*unselected everything


-- 
Kent West<")))><
Westing Peacefully - http://kentwest.blogspot.com

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Kent West]

On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 12:40 PM, Fungi4All <fungil...@protonmail.com>
wrote:

> From: we...@acu.edu
> To: debian users <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>
> Both fresh minimal installs of Jessie.
>
> Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk" just after
> grub, requiring holding the power button for 8 seconds to power off. Then
> power on, and it boots normally.
>
>
> what do you mean minimal install, can you be more specific?
>

Normal Jessie install, but when it came time to do the "tasksel"-looking
stage within the installer, I uninstalled everything. After the install I
then manually installed x-window-system-core, xfce4, firefox-esr,
libreoffice, ssh, and a few other utilities like rsycn and cups.


> was the disk/partition clean or did you install on top of another
> installation?
>

The machine shipped with Windows, but during the partitioning stage of the
Jessie install I told it to do the Guided, using entire disk, and then
tweaked that manually a bit.


> the last Jessie linux kernel was updated a couple of months ago, I doubt
> they have left any Dell hardware out.
>

Yeah, but apparently what ships with the Jessie installation is a 3.16. I
upgraded the system to stretch, thereby getting a 4.19 kernel, and the
problem so far(!, after five successful boots) has gone away.


> Newish is probably something made in 2016?
>

2016/06/30


>
> Dell-freak
>
>  Original Message 
> Subject: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot
> Local Time: April 26, 2017 6:21 PM
> UTC Time: April 26, 2017 3:21 PM
> From: we...@acu.edu
> To: debian users <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
>
> Two identical newish Dell desktops. Configured for non-legacy, UEFI-only
> booting. No Secure-Boot or Fast Boot.
>
> Both fresh minimal installs of Jessie.
>
> Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk" just after
> grub, requiring holding the power button for 8 seconds to power off. Then
> power on, and it boots normally.
>
> Suggestions?
>
> --
> Kent West<")))><
> Westing Peacefully - http://kentwest.blogspot.com
>
>
>


-- 
Kent West<")))><
Westing Peacefully - http://kentwest.blogspot.com

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Kent West]

On Wed, Apr 26, 2017 at 7:37 PM, Ben Caradoc-Davies 
wrote:

> On 27/04/17 05:44, Don Armstrong wrote:
>
>> Your newish hardware may require a backported kernel to function reliably.
>>
>
> This. Any recent Dell machine will likely have a Skylake or Kaby Lake CPU
> and a bad time on the stock jessie kernel, especially if using the iGPU.
> Please install a 4.9.18 kernel from jessie backports or upgrade to stretch
> RC3 (almost the new stable) for the same kernel.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> --
> Ben Caradoc-Davies 
> Director
> Transient Software Limited 
> New Zealand
>
>
I changed my /etc/apt/sources.list file to have the first two jessie lines
duplicated above them, only with "stretch" instead of "jessie", and then
did an "aptitude update" and "aptitude dist-upgrade". The upgrade to
stretch took me from a 3.16.0-4adm64 kernel to a 4.9.0-2amd64 kernel, and I
have been able to boot now five times in a row without a freeze.

I believe perhaps you've solved it for me. Thanks!


-- 
Kent West<")))><
Westing Peacefully - http://kentwest.blogspot.com

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Fungi4All]

From: we...@acu.edu
To: debian users <debian-user@lists.debian.org>

Both fresh minimal installs of Jessie.

Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk" just after grub, 
requiring holding the power button for 8 seconds to power off. Then power on, 
and it boots normally.

what do you mean minimal install, can you be more specific?

was the disk/partition clean or did you install on top of another installation?
the last Jessie linux kernel was updated a couple of months ago, I doubt they 
have left any Dell hardware out.
Newish is probably something made in 2016?

Dell-freak

 Original Message ----
Subject: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot
Local Time: April 26, 2017 6:21 PM
UTC Time: April 26, 2017 3:21 PM
From: we...@acu.edu
To: debian users <debian-user@lists.debian.org>

Two identical newish Dell desktops. Configured for non-legacy, UEFI-only 
booting. No Secure-Boot or Fast Boot.

Both fresh minimal installs of Jessie.

Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk" just after grub, 
requiring holding the power button for 8 seconds to power off. Then power on, 
and it boots normally.

Suggestions?

--

Kent West <")))><
Westing Peacefully - http://kentwest.blogspot.com

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Don Armstrong]

On Wed, 26 Apr 2017, Kent West wrote:
> In /etc/default/grub, I commented out the line that mentioned "quiet",
> and in the next line, added between the quotes "nomodeset", ran
> "update-grub", and rebooted.
>
> Frozen

Presumably there was more output than just "initializing ramdisk".

But in any event, once you do get it booted, installing a newer kernel
from jessie-backports will likely resolve some (or all) of this issue.


-- 
Don Armstrong  https://www.donarmstrong.com

To punish me for my contempt of authority, Fate has made me an
authority myself
 -- Albert Einstein

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Ben Caradoc-Davies]

On 27/04/17 05:44, Don Armstrong wrote:

Your newish hardware may require a backported kernel to function reliably.


This. Any recent Dell machine will likely have a Skylake or Kaby Lake 
CPU and a bad time on the stock jessie kernel, especially if using the 
iGPU. Please install a 4.9.18 kernel from jessie backports or upgrade to 
stretch RC3 (almost the new stable) for the same kernel.


Kind regards,

--
Ben Caradoc-Davies 
Director
Transient Software Limited 
New Zealand

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Felix Miata]

Kent West composed on 2017-04-26 13:35 (UTC-0500):

> Don Armstrong wrote:

>> On Wed, 26 Apr 2017, Kent West wrote:

>> > Two identical newish Dell desktops. Configured for non-legacy, UEFI-only
>> > booting. No Secure-Boot or Fast Boot.

>> > Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk"

>> This usually is indicative of a video driver (or some other driver)
>> issue.

>> Try booting without the quiet option, and possibly with nomodeset, and
>> see if it works. [You'll have to edit the grub command line to do this.]

>> Your newish hardware may require a backported kernel to function reliably.

> In /etc/default/grub, I commented out the line that mentioned "quiet", and
> in the next line, added between the quotes "nomodeset", ran "update-grub",
> and rebooted.

> Frozen

"Edit the grub command command line" was meant to be done on the fly, a
temporary test, done at the grub menu at boot time. Removing quiet allows boot
messages to appear that may provide clues to what is or is not happening.
Nomodeset is a crutch that should usually be done all by itself and only when
the problem encountered is known to be (Xorg usually) video-related.

Your Grub menu should have a failsafe selection. Have you tried selecting it?

Adding noresume to the cmdline at boot time might be a useful diagnostic.
-- 
"The wise are known for their understanding, and pleasant
words are persuasive." Proverbs 16:21 (New Living Translation)

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409 ** a11y rocks!

Felix Miata  ***  http://fm.no-ip.com/

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Kent West]

On Wed, Apr 26, 2017 at 12:44 PM, Don Armstrong  wrote:

> On Wed, 26 Apr 2017, Kent West wrote:
> > Two identical newish Dell desktops. Configured for non-legacy, UEFI-only
> > booting. No Secure-Boot or Fast Boot.
>
> [...]
>
> > Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk"
>
> This usually is indicative of a video driver (or some other driver)
> issue.
>
> Try booting without the quiet option, and possibly with nomodeset, and
> see if it works. [You'll have to edit the grub command line to do this.]
>
> Your newish hardware may require a backported kernel to function reliably.
>
>
>
In /etc/default/grub, I commented out the line that mentioned "quiet", and
in the next line, added between the quotes "nomodeset", ran "update-grub",
and rebooted.

Frozen

Thanks, anyway!

-- 
Kent

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Don Armstrong]

On Wed, 26 Apr 2017, Kent West wrote:
> Two identical newish Dell desktops. Configured for non-legacy, UEFI-only
> booting. No Secure-Boot or Fast Boot.

[...]

> Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk"

This usually is indicative of a video driver (or some other driver)
issue.

Try booting without the quiet option, and possibly with nomodeset, and
see if it works. [You'll have to edit the grub command line to do this.]

Your newish hardware may require a backported kernel to function reliably.


-- 
Don Armstrong  https://www.donarmstrong.com

I will not make any deals with you. I've resigned. I will not be
pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My
life is my own. I resign.
 -- Patrick McGoohan as Number 6 in "The Prisoner"

Re: Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Cindy-Sue Causey]

On 4/26/17, Kent West  wrote:
> Two identical newish Dell desktops. Configured for non-legacy, UEFI-only
> booting. No Secure-Boot or Fast Boot.
>
> Both fresh minimal installs of Jessie.
>
> Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk" just after
> grub, requiring holding the power button for 8 seconds to power off. Then
> power on, and it boots normally.
>
> Suggestions?


This is one of those seat of my pants observations. It might not
explain your case, but it might be something reasonable to check off a
debug list. This is the Debian-User thread I saw in last couple days:

https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2017/04/msg00665.html

This part particularly caught my eye:

+++ BEGIN GREG'S QUOTE +++

Before systemd, booting was a much more linear process.  Subsystems
would be brought up one by one, and when enough of them were ready,
you'd get a login prompt.

Now, however, the highly parallelized systemd boot means multiple
subsystems are being brought up simultaneously, and some of them are
still initializing when the login prompt is displayed.  If you're also
seeing their output, what this means is *sometimes*, depending on how
the race conditions play out, you might get system output *after* the login
prompt has already been displayed.

+++ END GREG'S QUOTE +++

The quote goes on and made total *cognitive* sense to my poor brain.
Again, it might not explain your case, but the topic *is* about boot
up. A successful boot sometimes and not others falls right in line
with Greg's observation there. It very much sounds reasonable for a
third thread out here, to, that is already a to-do to find and update.
:)

Just thinking out loud.. :)

Cindy :)
-- 
Cindy-Sue Causey
Talking Rock, Pickens County, Georgia, USA

* runs with duct tape *

Jessie Hangs Every Other Boot

[Kent West]

Two identical newish Dell desktops. Configured for non-legacy, UEFI-only
booting. No Secure-Boot or Fast Boot.

Both fresh minimal installs of Jessie.

Every other boot results in a hang at "Initializing Ramdisk" just after
grub, requiring holding the power button for 8 seconds to power off. Then
power on, and it boots normally.

Suggestions?

-- 
Kent West<")))><
Westing Peacefully - http://kentwest.blogspot.com