Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Mon, 09 May 2011 00:12:23 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 13:28, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: There is a point when I don't care about being right or wrong, I made my say and I'll not argue over trivial things with people who I'd really rather get along with. Fine, but doing so in a public (and mostly technical) mailing list generates other people reply to your considerations about a web service that has been there providing a useful service since years. I mentioned problems with the service, both here-and-now problems and potential issues about the future. That does not mean that I intend to debate the subject for three days over tens of posts. As I see it, you did more than just noting the tinyurl service was having any kind problem at your side or stating your concerns about its usage privacy issues. Again, I think your response was a bit exaggerated. I'm not trying to force anyone, nor am I making blame. I am giving tangible arguments in favour of my position. If someone wishes to disregard my arguments, even if it is to my detriment and the detriment of the fine archives, so be it. You are charging against Tinyurl and blaming over it because of some obscure privacy concerns you have... but you are writing on a public mailing list, you use Gmail and you still worry about privacy? That makes no sense. Feel free to ignore the privacy aspects if they don't concern you. I'm concerned about privacy but clicking on a tinyurl link is not what I take for that. How about the ability to mask a malicious link? Irrelevant, as _any link_ (shortened or not) can be easily bypassed and point to a malicious site. How about adding redundant layers to an already tenuous HTTP connection? Today's Internet is plenty of add-on layers, most of them useless. How about the future viability of the links when the shortening service has a server failure, or goes out of business, is bought, or hacked, or shut down by law? Again, *any* web URI can fail because of the same things. Should we care about all of the possibilities that can make a link is not functioning anymore? We can go crazy... I used the Gmail argument because is a service that you are using but apparently you are also much worried about your privacy. That's an oxymoron. Probably by using Gmail's e-mail service you are being more watched than by following a tinyurl link. I use Gmail for public mailing lists. I have my private and business mail at my own domain dotancohen.com. And the same argument can be taken by people who use tinyurl services: they use it on mailing lists but not for their personal or business e- mail communication. I believe there is nothing wrong in using them. Heck, this is the web! Most of the plain URIs are not available anymore because people closes their sites and they stop caring about making a redirect to the new ones. Links dead, regardless of the usage of URL shortening services or no. That's a red herring argument. Do you also not wear a seatbelt because we are all going to die anyway? Same argument. No, it's not. I'm just using an ad-hominem argument: what you say that is bad for tinyurl is also bad for any other URI. So why use it? To make a bunch of text short. To give the reader some sort of usability (there are e-mail clients that do not wrap well a long formatted URL or they even broke the full link). To provide clarity to the whole message. The shortening services do not provide clarity. Nor plain URLs do. I hope you've heard about phishing and what it involves. Here is a clear URL: http://dotancohen.com/eng/noah_ergonomic_keyboard_layout.html You know where it is going, and the topic under discussion. You might recognize the domain name if it is a common one and base your trust on that. I'll open links to http://debian.org, but I won't open links to http://debian.on.nimp.org and seeing the URL is critical in that decision. No, I don't know if that URL is a trusted source or not. I don't know you, nor I don't know if your webserver has been cracked by someone or if it contains malware on it... in fact no one can know it beforehand. Here is a non-clear URL: http://tinyurl.com/2ajjgt Where does that go? Yes, I know about the preview feature. I still have to invoke tinyurl to invoke the preview feature. I don't care where it goes. But _I do care_ if someone on this list points to me to that URI, shortened or not. Someone that is replying to me in order to help me. There is a saying that says: When the wise man points at the moon, the idiot looks at the finger. In brief, I think that Tinyurl is no the main question here. I counter with the saying When the sage lifts his book, the slave lowers his pen. Tinyurl gives no benefit and [causes problems || has the potential to cause problems]. Tinyurl may give you no benefit at all, but showing a little of respect to what others are using is the
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Sunday 08 May 2011 22:12:23 Dotan Cohen wrote: That does not mean that I intend to debate the subject for three days over tens of posts. So why are you doing it?? Here's a revolutionary idea: you could let someone else have the last word and get on with your life. No-one but you yourself is making you debate the subject. Lisi -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/201105091507.46827.lisi.re...@gmail.com
Re: URL shortening (was Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list)
On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 01:33, Arno Schuring aelschur...@hotmail.com wrote: However, this mailing list is archived. That means that links given on this mailing list are not simply fire-and-forget, they should be able to be resolved years from now. And while we cannot guarantee that any link remains valid, it is foolish to assume URL shorteners outlive the target website. In other words, please do not use (unnecessary) URL mangling. It needlessly makes your message useless for posterity. There were actually a few cases of these link-shortening services going under. Tr.im went under and was bought, Canonical and Google both bought and saved one (I don't remember the names) and for a while bit.ly was under threat for violating Sharia law. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktimlf1tt_n_0w5s5fpcp6t_k0a_...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 23:34, Heddle Weaver weaver2wo...@gmail.com wrote: I appreciate your willingness to help, don't get me wrong. But just as I am here to learn, I thought that you might also be interested in learning the error of using url-shortening services. Oh, I remember you now. Have we a history? I apologise if I stepped on toes or tried to teach the old dog new tricks. I'm always keen to learn. Where's the trick? Don't use URL-shortening services. But in any case, even if I am fantasising about tracking or advertising, the links are most certainly broken. I click on both of them and they lead me straight to the target, every time. Broken browser? Possibly a broken browser, poisoned hosts file or DNS, a selective firewall at work, or 100 other problems on my end (though none of those would give HTTP error 500). But that only reinforces my position: HTTP is already a tenuous protocol, why add more fragile links to the chain? In any case, this situation has already absorbed too much of my time. Agreed. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktik4j7l-+mkugwkwitpgp-xdxfo...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 07:50, Freeman hew...@gmail.com wrote: Craigevil is very cool but his sources.list has open lines so I cleaned it up, I hope. It's late here. Check it. Especailly for something that wrapped. That's great, thanks! I will go cherry-pick through there. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/BANLkTiny0b2v_bZd1WijV6Y=n865tmy...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 12:41, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: I just tried tinyurl with wget and got the same IP address (and 200 response) as you. I didn't check the links, though. Then? Are you still getting trouble to reach the tinyurl web site? If yes, there could be a filter/proxy in between of you and the website, that is, your ISP. I didn't try the links. There is a point when I don't care about being right or wrong, I made my say and I'll not argue over trivial things with people who I'd really rather get along with. That's a different issue. There is nothing that needs to be teached here because we are talking about preferences. You don't like tinyurl and that's okay, no one can blame you for that, but in the same way you can't also blame others for use it... even less when that person was willing to help you. No, this is not a matter of preference. Sure it is. Nobody can force a user to use one or other method to post into this list. You can follow the link or not, that's up to you, but blaming someone -that is trying to help you- for using tinyurl (or any other of those URL shortening services) is like an overreaction. I'm not trying to force anyone, nor am I making blame. I am giving tangible arguments in favour of my position. If someone wishes to disregard my arguments, even if it is to my detriment and the detriment of the fine archives, so be it. There is no reason to pipe the links through some third party service that is unreliable and may, either through malice stupidity or hacking, compromise either the user's ability to connect to the site or perform undesirable actions (tracking, advertising, drive-by malware). Could TinyURL never be hacked? Sold? Forget to pay their hosting bill? Hardware failure? Network failure? Oh, come on! That argument is very flawed. Should we stop of using Gmail e-mail service because of the same? :-) Strawman. Gmail or any other email provider is providing an essential service: at most we could replace Gmail with a different email provider. That is not a link that can be taken out of the chain. Tinyurl, though, adds redundant links to the chain and they provide absolutely no benefit. So why use them? What is the benefit? Tinyurl, bit.ly and such have its use (mostly for twitter and sending SMS messages that enforce you a policy of limited characters) but using them in a mailing list is something is only up to the poster, not me, nor you... there is no one point in Debian mailing list netiquette stating the opposite. I don't read the Debian list on Twitter nor via SMS. Do you really believe that is such a viable use case that the benefits of a shorter URL outweigh the detriment? What advantage exists at all to use tinyURL? It does not have to exist any. So why use it? -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktimswil7z51g+s01daoideft4kg...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Sun, 08 May 2011 09:42:49 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 12:41, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: I just tried tinyurl with wget and got the same IP address (and 200 response) as you. I didn't check the links, though. Then? Are you still getting trouble to reach the tinyurl web site? If yes, there could be a filter/proxy in between of you and the website, that is, your ISP. I didn't try the links. You said (sic) The tinyurl server is giving a 500 error. There is a point when I don't care about being right or wrong, I made my say and I'll not argue over trivial things with people who I'd really rather get along with. Fine, but doing so in a public (and mostly technical) mailing list generates other people reply to your considerations about a web service that has been there providing a useful service since years. No, this is not a matter of preference. Sure it is. Nobody can force a user to use one or other method to post into this list. You can follow the link or not, that's up to you, but blaming someone -that is trying to help you- for using tinyurl (or any other of those URL shortening services) is like an overreaction. I'm not trying to force anyone, nor am I making blame. I am giving tangible arguments in favour of my position. If someone wishes to disregard my arguments, even if it is to my detriment and the detriment of the fine archives, so be it. You are charging against Tinyurl and blaming over it because of some obscure privacy concerns you have... but you are writing on a public mailing list, you use Gmail and you still worry about privacy? That makes no sense. There is no reason to pipe the links through some third party service that is unreliable and may, either through malice stupidity or hacking, compromise either the user's ability to connect to the site or perform undesirable actions (tracking, advertising, drive-by malware). Could TinyURL never be hacked? Sold? Forget to pay their hosting bill? Hardware failure? Network failure? Oh, come on! That argument is very flawed. Should we stop of using Gmail e-mail service because of the same? :-) Strawman. Gmail or any other email provider is providing an essential service: at most we could replace Gmail with a different email provider. That is not a link that can be taken out of the chain. Tinyurl, though, adds redundant links to the chain and they provide absolutely no benefit. So why use them? What is the benefit? I used the Gmail argument because is a service that you are using but apparently you are also much worried about your privacy. That's an oxymoron. Probably by using Gmail's e-mail service you are being more watched than by following a tinyurl link. Tinyurl, bit.ly and such have its use (mostly for twitter and sending SMS messages that enforce you a policy of limited characters) but using them in a mailing list is something is only up to the poster, not me, nor you... there is no one point in Debian mailing list netiquette stating the opposite. I don't read the Debian list on Twitter nor via SMS. Do you really believe that is such a viable use case that the benefits of a shorter URL outweigh the detriment? I believe there is nothing wrong in using them. Heck, this is the web! Most of the plain URIs are not available anymore because people closes their sites and they stop caring about making a redirect to the new ones. Links dead, regardless of the usage of URL shortening services or no. What advantage exists at all to use tinyURL? It does not have to exist any. So why use it? To make a bunch of text short. To give the reader some sort of usability (there are e-mail clients that do not wrap well a long formatted URL or they even broke the full link). To provide clarity to the whole message. There is a saying that says: When the wise man points at the moon, the idiot looks at the finger. In brief, I think that Tinyurl is no the main question here. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.05.08.10.28...@gmail.com
Re: URL shortening (was Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list)
On Sun, May 08, 2011 at 09:28:54AM +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: There were actually a few cases of these link-shortening services going under. Tr.im went under and was bought, Canonical and Google both bought and saved one (I don't remember the names) and for a while bit.ly was under threat for violating Sharia law. In what respect? -- Bob Holtzman Key ID: 8D549279 If you think you're getting free lunch, check the price of the beer signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Sun, May 8, 2011 at 13:28, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, 08 May 2011 09:42:49 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: On Sat, May 7, 2011 at 12:41, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: I just tried tinyurl with wget and got the same IP address (and 200 response) as you. I didn't check the links, though. Then? Are you still getting trouble to reach the tinyurl web site? If yes, there could be a filter/proxy in between of you and the website, that is, your ISP. I didn't try the links. You said (sic) The tinyurl server is giving a 500 error. Right, at the beginning of the thread. There is a point when I don't care about being right or wrong, I made my say and I'll not argue over trivial things with people who I'd really rather get along with. Fine, but doing so in a public (and mostly technical) mailing list generates other people reply to your considerations about a web service that has been there providing a useful service since years. I mentioned problems with the service, both here-and-now problems and potential issues about the future. That does not mean that I intend to debate the subject for three days over tens of posts. I'm not trying to force anyone, nor am I making blame. I am giving tangible arguments in favour of my position. If someone wishes to disregard my arguments, even if it is to my detriment and the detriment of the fine archives, so be it. You are charging against Tinyurl and blaming over it because of some obscure privacy concerns you have... but you are writing on a public mailing list, you use Gmail and you still worry about privacy? That makes no sense. Feel free to ignore the privacy aspects if they don't concern you. How about the ability to mask a malicious link? How about adding redundant layers to an already tenuous HTTP connection? How about the future viability of the links when the shortening service has a server failure, or goes out of business, is bought, or hacked, or shut down by law? I used the Gmail argument because is a service that you are using but apparently you are also much worried about your privacy. That's an oxymoron. Probably by using Gmail's e-mail service you are being more watched than by following a tinyurl link. I use Gmail for public mailing lists. I have my private and business mail at my own domain dotancohen.com. I believe there is nothing wrong in using them. Heck, this is the web! Most of the plain URIs are not available anymore because people closes their sites and they stop caring about making a redirect to the new ones. Links dead, regardless of the usage of URL shortening services or no. That's a red herring argument. Do you also not wear a seatbelt because we are all going to die anyway? Same argument. So why use it? To make a bunch of text short. To give the reader some sort of usability (there are e-mail clients that do not wrap well a long formatted URL or they even broke the full link). To provide clarity to the whole message. The shortening services do not provide clarity. Here is a clear URL: http://dotancohen.com/eng/noah_ergonomic_keyboard_layout.html You know where it is going, and the topic under discussion. You might recognize the domain name if it is a common one and base your trust on that. I'll open links to http://debian.org, but I won't open links to http://debian.on.nimp.org and seeing the URL is critical in that decision. Here is a non-clear URL: http://tinyurl.com/2ajjgt Where does that go? Yes, I know about the preview feature. I still have to invoke tinyurl to invoke the preview feature. There is a saying that says: When the wise man points at the moon, the idiot looks at the finger. In brief, I think that Tinyurl is no the main question here. I counter with the saying When the sage lifts his book, the slave lowers his pen. Tinyurl gives no benefit and [causes problems || has the potential to cause problems]. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktinpixyu9vbte6jdu0be_w-62nj...@mail.gmail.com
Re: URL shortening (was Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list)
On Sb, 07 mai 11, 00:33:59, Arno Schuring wrote: In other words, please do not use (unnecessary) URL mangling. It needlessly makes your message useless for posterity. +1 Regards, Andrei -- Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, 06 May 2011 23:07:15 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: I just tried tinyurl with wget and got the same IP address (and 200 response) as you. I didn't check the links, though. Then? Are you still getting trouble to reach the tinyurl web site? If yes, there could be a filter/proxy in between of you and the website, that is, your ISP. That's a different issue. There is nothing that needs to be teached here because we are talking about preferences. You don't like tinyurl and that's okay, no one can blame you for that, but in the same way you can't also blame others for use it... even less when that person was willing to help you. No, this is not a matter of preference. Sure it is. Nobody can force a user to use one or other method to post into this list. You can follow the link or not, that's up to you, but blaming someone -that is trying to help you- for using tinyurl (or any other of those URL shortening services) is like an overreaction. There is no reason to pipe the links through some third party service that is unreliable and may, either through malice stupidity or hacking, compromise either the user's ability to connect to the site or perform undesirable actions (tracking, advertising, drive-by malware). Could TinyURL never be hacked? Sold? Forget to pay their hosting bill? Hardware failure? Network failure? Oh, come on! That argument is very flawed. Should we stop of using Gmail e-mail service because of the same? :-) Tinyurl, bit.ly and such have its use (mostly for twitter and sending SMS messages that enforce you a policy of limited characters) but using them in a mailing list is something is only up to the poster, not me, nor you... there is no one point in Debian mailing list netiquette stating the opposite. What advantage exists at all to use tinyURL? It does not have to exist any. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.05.07.09.41...@gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 04:54, Stephen Powell zlinux...@wowway.com wrote: There is a sample /etc/apt/sources.list file on my kernel-building web page: http://users.wowway.com/~zlinuxman/Kernel.htm Look for it under Step 1: Update Your sources.list File That is a terrific page, Stephen. Thank you! -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktimjdndvwrzk7xgjvsj9kt4vcc0...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 12:57, Heddle Weaver weaver2wo...@gmail.com wrote: The tinyurl server is giving a 500 error. Why on earth would you add an unreliable, third-party link to the already fragile chain of HTTP? It didn't then and it doesn't now. Still is for me. I for one do not want tinyurl or any other company tracking what I do online ?? , injecting advertising, ?? and breaking links that they don't like. ?? Please post a direct link. A direct link to what? I don't need this third-party irrelevant company knowing where I browse, furthermore I don't need to follow a blind link to goatse. Ghostery is pretty good at it's job. It most certainly is. I use it too. I don't think you'll find you are being tracked through that medium. We don't need the possibility of being tracked. Why are you so adamant about using blind links which break (I cannot access them) instead of linking to the correct page? I have no idea where the other fantasies come from. Prudence, not fantasy. Unless _you_ happen to live in a world of unicorns, but I certainly don't. Well, those two links had the information you were after taking me less than a minute with Google to obtain them for you (for some reason), but if you aren't even prepared to follow them, there's not much anybody can do to help you. I appreciate your willingness to help, don't get me wrong. But just as I am here to learn, I thought that you might also be interested in learning the error of using url-shortening services. I apologise if I stepped on toes or tried to teach the old dog new tricks. But in any case, even if I am fantasising about tracking or advertising, the links are most certainly broken. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktik+wnim7hr2gm0gl5xkoncxfdr...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, 06 May 2011 14:02:47 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 12:57, Heddle Weaver weaver2wo...@gmail.com wrote: The tinyurl server is giving a 500 error. Why on earth would you add an unreliable, third-party link to the already fragile chain of HTTP? It didn't then and it doesn't now. Still is for me. It works here but anyway, you can use a TinyURL decoder: http://kiserai.net/turl.pl Please post a direct link. A direct link to what? I don't need this third-party irrelevant company knowing where I browse, furthermore I don't need to follow a blind link to goatse. (...) Well, Dotan, nowadays those URL shortening services are very popular and despite we like it or not (I barely use them) if someone here (I think this mailing list can be considered as a trusted source) sends you a link with information to your issue it's not very polite to reply in the way you did. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.05.06.12.28...@gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 15:28, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: Still is for me. It works here but anyway, you can use a TinyURL decoder: http://kiserai.net/turl.pl Still 500. That's a server error, not a network error. I'm surprised that it works for anybody. All I can think of here is geographic load balancing, and my geographic server must be down. Please post a direct link. A direct link to what? I don't need this third-party irrelevant company knowing where I browse, furthermore I don't need to follow a blind link to goatse. I thought that you were asking me for a direct link to some website backing up my viewpoints against using URL shortening services. You had removed the preceding sign of the text, so I thought that was your text. Well, Dotan, nowadays those URL shortening services are very popular and despite we like it or not (I barely use them) if someone here (I think this mailing list can be considered as a trusted source) sends you a link with information to your issue it's not very polite to reply in the way you did. Word documents are also very popular. If someone were to format his reply in a Word document and send it to the Debian list do you not think it to be appropriate to teach them the error of their ways? Or is popularity vindication for error here? -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktik1zkc9zftk1bin8wybbmc9rtf...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, 06 May 2011 15:47:42 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 15:28, Camaleón wrote: Still is for me. It works here but anyway, you can use a TinyURL decoder: http://kiserai.net/turl.pl Still 500. That's a server error, not a network error. I'm surprised that it works for anybody. All I can think of here is geographic load balancing, and my geographic server must be down. What host is giving you that error? Yes, http://tinyurl.com; works for me: sm01@stt008:~$ wget http://tinyurl.com --2011-05-06 15:25:11-- http://tinyurl.com/ Resolving tinyurl.com... 195.66.135.139, 195.66.135.140 Connecting to tinyurl.com|195.66.135.139|:80... connected. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK Length: unspecified [text/html] Saving to: `index.html.1' [ = ] 9,299 --.-K/s in 0.08s 2011-05-06 15:25:11 (114 KB/s) - `index.html.1' saved [9299] Well, Dotan, nowadays those URL shortening services are very popular and despite we like it or not (I barely use them) if someone here (I think this mailing list can be considered as a trusted source) sends you a link with information to your issue it's not very polite to reply in the way you did. Word documents are also very popular. If someone were to format his reply in a Word document and send it to the Debian list do you not think it to be appropriate to teach them the error of their ways? Or is popularity vindication for error here? That's a different issue. There is nothing that needs to be teached here because we are talking about preferences. You don't like tinyurl and that's okay, no one can blame you for that, but in the same way you can't also blame others for use it... even less when that person was willing to help you. Greetings, -- Camaleón -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/pan.2011.05.06.13.32...@gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 16:32, Camaleón noela...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, 06 May 2011 15:47:42 +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: On Fri, May 6, 2011 at 15:28, Camaleón wrote: Still is for me. It works here but anyway, you can use a TinyURL decoder: http://kiserai.net/turl.pl Still 500. That's a server error, not a network error. I'm surprised that it works for anybody. All I can think of here is geographic load balancing, and my geographic server must be down. What host is giving you that error? Yes, http://tinyurl.com; works for me: sm01@stt008:~$ wget http://tinyurl.com --2011-05-06 15:25:11-- http://tinyurl.com/ Resolving tinyurl.com... 195.66.135.139, 195.66.135.140 Connecting to tinyurl.com|195.66.135.139|:80... connected. HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 200 OK Length: unspecified [text/html] Saving to: `index.html.1' [ = ] 9,299 --.-K/s in 0.08s 2011-05-06 15:25:11 (114 KB/s) - `index.html.1' saved [9299] I just tried tinyurl with wget and got the same IP address (and 200 response) as you. I didn't check the links, though. Word documents are also very popular. If someone were to format his reply in a Word document and send it to the Debian list do you not think it to be appropriate to teach them the error of their ways? Or is popularity vindication for error here? That's a different issue. There is nothing that needs to be teached here because we are talking about preferences. You don't like tinyurl and that's okay, no one can blame you for that, but in the same way you can't also blame others for use it... even less when that person was willing to help you. No, this is not a matter of preference. There is no reason to pipe the links through some third party service that is unreliable and may, either through malice stupidity or hacking, compromise either the user's ability to connect to the site or perform undesirable actions (tracking, advertising, drive-by malware). Could TinyURL never be hacked? Sold? Forget to pay their hosting bill? Hardware failure? Network failure? What advantage exists at all to use tinyURL? -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/banlktikbu-ooob8k0x9vtcx_ovpg5ek...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On 6 May 2011 21:02, Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: Big snip I appreciate your willingness to help, don't get me wrong. But just as I am here to learn, I thought that you might also be interested in learning the error of using url-shortening services. Oh, I remember you now. I apologise if I stepped on toes or tried to teach the old dog new tricks. I'm always keen to learn. Where's the trick? But in any case, even if I am fantasising about tracking or advertising, the links are most certainly broken. I click on both of them and they lead me straight to the target, every time. Broken browser? In any case, this situation has already absorbed too much of my time. Regards, Weaver. -- Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. — Lucius Annæus Seneca. Terrorism, the new religion.
URL shortening (was Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list)
Dotan Cohen (dotanco...@gmail.com on 2011-05-06 23:07 +0300): No, this is not a matter of preference. There is no reason to pipe the links through some third party service [..] What advantage exists at all to use tinyURL? While I share your sentiment in general (I would never click on a tinyurl link without noscript), it does have its uses. Twitter and other character-impaired services come to mind. However, this mailing list is archived. That means that links given on this mailing list are not simply fire-and-forget, they should be able to be resolved years from now. And while we cannot guarantee that any link remains valid, it is foolish to assume URL shorteners outlive the target website. In other words, please do not use (unnecessary) URL mangling. It needlessly makes your message useless for posterity. Thanks, Arno -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20110507003359.36854...@neminis.loos.site
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Thu, May 05, 2011 at 11:04:22AM +0300, Dotan Cohen wrote: Obviously I've done something wrong because on a virgin Squeeze install /etc/apt/sources.list has no repos other than the disc! Can someone please send to me a copy of this file. Custom added repos are fine, I'll be able to figure it out. Thanks. Craigevil is very cool but his sources.list has open lines so I cleaned it up, I hope. It's late here. Check it. Especailly for something that wrapped. # Craigevil's Giant Debian /etc/apt/sources.list Updated May 3, 2011. Added # Mepis 11 repos. #This list is for Debian if you are using Ubuntu do not use this list. # If you notice any repos not working please let me know in irc in #smxi on # irc.oftc.net #See http://www.debian.org/ for information about Debian GNU/Linux. #Three Debian releases are available on the main site: #Debian 6.0, or Squeeze. Access this release through dists/stable #Debian 6.0 was released February 06, 2011. #Testing, or Wheezy. Access this release through dists/testing. The #current tested development snapshot is named wheezy. Packages which #have been tested in unstable and passed automated tests propogate to #this release. #Unstable, or sid. Access this release through dists/unstable. The #current development snapshot is named sid. Untested candidate #packages for future releases. #Older releases of Debian are at http://archive.debian.org/debian-archive # Some helpful links: # Debian GNU/Linux Installation Guide : # http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/i386/ # Secure APT - http://wiki.debian.org/SecureApt # Official Debian mirrors http://www.debian.org/mirror/list # Also at http://ftp.debian.org/debian/README.mirrors.txt # Debian oldstable repo http://archive.debian.org/debian/README # mentors.debian.net Helps you get your packages into Debian # http://mentors.debian.net # The Debian GNU/Linux FAQ - Basics of the Debian package management system # - http://www.debian.org/doc/FAQ/ch-pkg_basics.html # Debian newbie help documentation - NewbieDOC - # http://newbiedoc.berlios.de/wiki/Debian_newbie_help_documentation # Apt-Pinning for Beginners - http://jaqque.sbih.org/kplug/apt-pinning.html # aptitude user's manual - # http://algebraicthunk.net/~dburrows/projects/aptitude/doc/en/ # Search Debian -- Packages - http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages # apt-get.org: Unofficial APT repositories - http://www.apt-get.org/ # Debian-Database.ORG - Unofficial Debian Repositories Collected - # http://www.debian-database.org/?s=repos # UnofficialRepositories - Debian Wiki - # http://wiki.debian.org/UnofficialRepositories # Debian Sources List Generator - http://debgen.simplylinux.ch/ # smxi - unofficial Debian maintenance script # http://smxi.org/site/install.htm # Exoodles multimedia installer script http://tinyurl.com/2vjj3lp # Grokking Debian GNU/Linux - LinuxQuestions.org : # http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/blog/craigevil-176422/grokking-debian-gnu-linux-3073/ ## Start Repository List ## # ## OFFICIAL DEBIAN REPOS ## # ## Debian Unstable ## # Debian sid FAQ - http://wooledge.org/~greg/sidfaq.html # There is no security, volatile or backports repo for unstable. # Unstable Sid #deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main contrib non-free # Unstable Sources #deb-src http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ unstable main contrib non-free ## ## Experimental ## ## # Debian experimental http://wiki.debian.org/DebianExperimental #deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ experimental main contrib non-free ## ## Debian Testing ## ## # Testing #deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free #deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing main contrib non-free # Testing Security http://secure-testing-master.debian.net/ #deb http://security.debian.org wheezy/updates main contrib non-free #deb-src http://security.debian.org wheezy/updates main contrib non-free #Testing Proposed Updates #deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing-proposed-updates main contrib #non-free #deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ testing-proposed-updates main contrib #non-free ## ## Debian Stable ## ## #Stable #deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free #Stable Sources #deb-src http://http.us.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free #Security Updates http://www.debian.org/security/ #deb http://security.debian.org/ squeeze/updates main contrib non-free # Please note: The debian-volatile project has been discontinued with the # Debian Squeeze release. # See http://lists.debian.org/debian-volatile-announce/2011/msg0.html # for details. # Debian Volatile is now squeeze-updates # Squeeze-updates deb http://mirrors.kernel.org/debian/ squeeze-updates main contrib non-free # Debian Stable Backports # For information
Need /etc/apt/sources.list
Obviously I've done something wrong because on a virgin Squeeze install /etc/apt/sources.list has no repos other than the disc! Can someone please send to me a copy of this file. Custom added repos are fine, I'll be able to figure it out. Thanks. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/BANLkTimFO32-i9D4Hg75=i7jz+abkvq...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 05/05/11 09:04, Dotan Cohen wrote: Obviously I've done something wrong because on a virgin Squeeze install /etc/apt/sources.list has no repos other than the disc! Can someone please send to me a copy of this file. Custom added repos are fine, I'll be able to figure it out. Thanks. :-) deb http://ftp.uk.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.uk.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free deb http://security.debian.org/ squeeze/updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://security.debian.org/ squeeze/updates main contrib non-free deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian squeeze-updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian squeeze-updates main contrib non-free - -- |_|0|_| | |_|_|0| Heghlu'Meh QaQ jajVam | |0|0|0| kuLa - | gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys 0xC100B4CA -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJNwlqsAAoJEOqHloDBALTKJQEH/ifRwK5+Jmzk0j14wRwkS52J i5XFXY+d1wJrxXKNbziTOyT1SKzbEaKZNjU0I+vOnIJCJPb+IFA2CZ8H//Kn9XYK FlpYF2rj9RLlajSbBeKbdfWsYTdrxFsxMU/sZ0nw725Qk/UJOHB2+nQookeU/7HX k12CII+IWZYPm3dtqSNw1Zm4X2VK1ommZuZ/NlXdsSCmlRzyXsJ+VXqafSxBHMpu 6De+j3kw+al1cNpuDaLLL1TJjLbEd32ZQGzakp8DI+PIwVNI/qO5Uws+ju6cL7gL R5odgZ0NeUIcIbmlebaVK/6htXEkW1qbdTbaN9CQ7KM2b6rR5FaGB0sXfGa+4IM= =v02g -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/4dc25aac.1080...@kulisz.net
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 11:07, kuLa deb...@kulisz.net wrote: deb http://ftp.uk.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.uk.debian.org/debian/ squeeze main contrib non-free deb http://security.debian.org/ squeeze/updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://security.debian.org/ squeeze/updates main contrib non-free deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian squeeze-updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.debian.org/debian squeeze-updates main contrib non-free Thank you! -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/BANLkTin6F=qBY7LzDQD5tXnn=nj49dj...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On 5 May 2011 18:04, Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: Obviously I've done something wrong because on a virgin Squeeze install /etc/apt/sources.list has no repos other than the disc! Can someone please send to me a copy of this file. Custom added repos are fine, I'll be able to figure it out. Thanks. Why not install netselect-apt and let that do it for you? Regards, Weaver. -- Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. — Lucius Annæus Seneca. Terrorism, the new religion.
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 14:44, Heddle Weaver weaver2wo...@gmail.com wrote: Why not install netselect-apt and let that do it for you? Regards, 1) I've never heard of it! 2) It doesn't seem to be on the disc, so I'd need a configured repo anyway. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/BANLkTi=lgyvtqoalvqszbnsdhzsphoa...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Need /etc/apt/sources.list
On Thu, 05 May 2011 11:27:38 -0400 (EDT), Dotan Cohen wrote: On Thu, May 5, 2011 at 14:44, Heddle Weaver weaver2wo...@gmail.com wrote: Why not install netselect-apt and let that do it for you? 1) I've never heard of it! 2) It doesn't seem to be on the disc, so I'd need a configured repo anyway. There is a sample /etc/apt/sources.list file on my kernel-building web page: http://users.wowway.com/~zlinuxman/Kernel.htm Look for it under Step 1: Update Your sources.list File -- .''`. Stephen Powell : :' : `. `'` `- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/130808308.396669.1304646864657.javamail.r...@md01.wow.synacor.com
