Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
Mike Mueller wrote: Colin Watson wrote: Vineet explained this above. The rsh - ssh symlink is a feature of the Debian ssh package, and one which I'd advise you not to rely on. OK. (I sense a learning opportunity is headed my way :-) Try this command: /usr/sbin/update-alternatives --display rsh A while back I posted this note. It might help in getting up to speed with the alternatives system. A short tutorial on the subject. http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2002/debian-user-200208/msg02808.html HTH, Bob pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
On Sun, 15 Jun 2003 00:02:02 -0600 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Proulx) wrote: A while back I posted this note. It might help in getting up to speed with the alternatives system. A short tutorial on the subject. http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2002/debian-user-200208/msg02808.html You were in fine form that day. :) I've bookmarked it. Kevin P.S. Vim rules -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
On Friday 13 June 2003 12:23, Colin Watson wrote: CVS_RSH, as the name suggests, defaults to rsh. This is a compile-time option in the cvs package, but Debian just leaves this at the upstream default of rsh. OK. Then alternatives substitutes ssh. On the other commercial distro system rsh _is_ available, it got used and refused at the Debian CVS server. The I set CVS_RSH=ssh; export CVS_RSH on the commercial distro and the Debian CVS server is happy. When doing CVS checkouts from Debian boxes, CVS uses rsh which is really ssh - so no need to set CVS_RSH (for now). At the moment the ssh package installs an rsh symlink pointing to ssh; as I've just explained, this may change and you should explicitly set CVS_RSH=ssh if that's what you want. See the Connecting with rsh node in 'info cvs' for more information on CVS_RSH. I don't want to change CVS on Debian. I want to understand why I don't have to set CVS_RSH on Debian. Vineet explained this above. The rsh - ssh symlink is a feature of the Debian ssh package, and one which I'd advise you not to rely on. OK. (I sense a learning opportunity is headed my way :-) Cheers, Thanks all, for clearing that up. -- Mike Mueller -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
On Friday 13 June 2003 13:39, Mark Ferlatte wrote: Colin Watson said on Fri, Jun 13, 2003 at 06:29:22PM +0100: Right now, everything that has silly default settings to use rsh automatically uses ssh, which means that things Just Work in a secure environment. If this happens, would it be possible to change all of the upstream defaults to use ssh instead of rsh instead? Well, you have to do this on every other system anyway (see the confusion in this very thread) ... I dunno. One of the reasons that my company standardized on Debian is that we _don't_ have to do stupid things like this all the time; we can trust that the Debian maintainer has put some thought into their part of the system, and that it's setup in a sane fashion by default. Since, for _most_ (not all) people, using rsh in insane, this seems like a step in the wrong direction to me. I standardized on Debian too. But I've got to work with the red distro too. Things no longer just worked and I can no longer be blissfully ignorant of why things just work better in Debian. (I learned about UID and GID values differing between distros and how that affects NFS file ownership yesterday.) Obviously, if this gets changed, we'll adapt, so it's exactly a huge big deal, but this is functionality that I was actually happy to see present in Debian, and would be sad to see removed. It sounds like the Debian maintainers are adapting to the openssh project removing rsh support. If so, Debians have no choice in the matter then. -- Mike Mueller -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
* Mike M ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030612 21:48]: I've set up several Debian systems and loaded the cvs package on them. I've had no problem using: $ cvs -d :ext:[EMAIL PROTECTED]:/home/cvsrep checkout myproject Now I have to do some work on a RH8 box to solve a particular problem. I found that I had to do this: $ CVS_RSH=ssh; export CVS_RSH to get the command above to work. On the Debian system, when I query evironments vars, I do not set CVS_RSH set. Why do the Debian systems allow the :ext: access method to work without having the CVS_RSH var set? The default is to use rsh. If you've installed ssh, but not rsh-client, then /usr/bin/rsh is a symlink to ssh. (Well, indirectly, anyway, through the alternatives system). So when cvs invokes rsh on your debian box, it gets ssh. good times, Vineet -- http://www.doorstop.net/ -- They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. --Benjamin Franklin signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
On Thu, Jun 12, 2003 at 11:46:49PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote: * Mike M ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030612 21:48]: On the Debian system, when I query evironments vars, I do not set CVS_RSH set. Why do the Debian systems allow the :ext: access method to work without having the CVS_RSH var set? The default is to use rsh. If you've installed ssh, but not rsh-client, then /usr/bin/rsh is a symlink to ssh. (Well, indirectly, anyway, through the alternatives system). ... for now, anyway. There's a bug report asking for this to be removed since ssh no longer implements the rsh fallback that it used to implement; I'm inclined to agree, so it may disappear soon. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
On Friday 13 June 2003 04:42, Colin Watson wrote: On Thu, Jun 12, 2003 at 11:46:49PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote: * Mike M ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030612 21:48]: On the Debian system, when I query evironments vars, I do not set CVS_RSH set. Why do the Debian systems allow the :ext: access method to work without having the CVS_RSH var set? The default is to use rsh. If you've installed ssh, but not rsh-client, then /usr/bin/rsh is a symlink to ssh. (Well, indirectly, anyway, through the alternatives system). ... for now, anyway. There's a bug report asking for this to be removed since ssh no longer implements the rsh fallback that it used to implement; I'm inclined to agree, so it may disappear soon. Where and how is the defaulting done? CVS compile option? Config file? Ask the package maintainer? I don't want to change CVS on Debian. I want to understand why I don't have to set CVS_RSH on Debian. Thanks, -- Mike Mueller -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
On Fri, Jun 13, 2003 at 10:10:58AM -0400, Mike Mueller wrote: On Friday 13 June 2003 04:42, Colin Watson wrote: On Thu, Jun 12, 2003 at 11:46:49PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote: * Mike M ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030612 21:48]: On the Debian system, when I query evironments vars, I do not set CVS_RSH set. Why do the Debian systems allow the :ext: access method to work without having the CVS_RSH var set? The default is to use rsh. If you've installed ssh, but not rsh-client, then /usr/bin/rsh is a symlink to ssh. (Well, indirectly, anyway, through the alternatives system). ... for now, anyway. There's a bug report asking for this to be removed since ssh no longer implements the rsh fallback that it used to implement; I'm inclined to agree, so it may disappear soon. Where and how is the defaulting done? CVS compile option? Config file? Ask the package maintainer? CVS_RSH, as the name suggests, defaults to rsh. This is a compile-time option in the cvs package, but Debian just leaves this at the upstream default of rsh. At the moment the ssh package installs an rsh symlink pointing to ssh; as I've just explained, this may change and you should explicitly set CVS_RSH=ssh if that's what you want. See the Connecting with rsh node in 'info cvs' for more information on CVS_RSH. I don't want to change CVS on Debian. I want to understand why I don't have to set CVS_RSH on Debian. Vineet explained this above. The rsh - ssh symlink is a feature of the Debian ssh package, and one which I'd advise you not to rely on. Cheers, -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
Colin Watson said on Fri, Jun 13, 2003 at 09:42:07AM +0100: On Thu, Jun 12, 2003 at 11:46:49PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote: * Mike M ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030612 21:48]: On the Debian system, when I query evironments vars, I do not set CVS_RSH set. Why do the Debian systems allow the :ext: access method to work without having the CVS_RSH var set? The default is to use rsh. If you've installed ssh, but not rsh-client, then /usr/bin/rsh is a symlink to ssh. (Well, indirectly, anyway, through the alternatives system). ... for now, anyway. There's a bug report asking for this to be removed since ssh no longer implements the rsh fallback that it used to implement; I'm inclined to agree, so it may disappear soon. ARG! Why why why! Right now, everything that has silly default settings to use rsh automatically uses ssh, which means that things Just Work in a secure environment. If this happens, would it be possible to change all of the upstream defaults to use ssh instead of rsh instead? That just seems to be more work than it's worth, since by all rights rsh really only has certain limited and dubious-at-best uses, so the people who want it should be expected to have to perform a little additional configuration. M pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
On Fri, Jun 13, 2003 at 09:50:29AM -0700, Mark Ferlatte wrote: Colin Watson said on Fri, Jun 13, 2003 at 09:42:07AM +0100: On Thu, Jun 12, 2003 at 11:46:49PM -0700, Vineet Kumar wrote: * Mike M ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030612 21:48]: On the Debian system, when I query evironments vars, I do not set CVS_RSH set. Why do the Debian systems allow the :ext: access method to work without having the CVS_RSH var set? The default is to use rsh. If you've installed ssh, but not rsh-client, then /usr/bin/rsh is a symlink to ssh. (Well, indirectly, anyway, through the alternatives system). ... for now, anyway. There's a bug report asking for this to be removed since ssh no longer implements the rsh fallback that it used to implement; I'm inclined to agree, so it may disappear soon. ARG! Why why why! Because if you type 'rsh some-rsh-server' it does Weird Stuff because ssh doesn't know how to talk to rsh servers any more? Right now, everything that has silly default settings to use rsh automatically uses ssh, which means that things Just Work in a secure environment. If this happens, would it be possible to change all of the upstream defaults to use ssh instead of rsh instead? Well, you have to do this on every other system anyway (see the confusion in this very thread) ... I dunno. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: CVS_RSH for :ext: CVS access
Colin Watson said on Fri, Jun 13, 2003 at 06:29:22PM +0100: ARG! Why why why! Because if you type 'rsh some-rsh-server' it does Weird Stuff because ssh doesn't know how to talk to rsh servers any more? Seriously, how many people use rsh? If it's a lot, then cool. If it's just a few people, who know what they are doing, and have very specific reasons for using rsh, then they should be able to figure out that if they don't have the rsh package installed but do have ssh installed then things won't work. Right? Right now, everything that has silly default settings to use rsh automatically uses ssh, which means that things Just Work in a secure environment. If this happens, would it be possible to change all of the upstream defaults to use ssh instead of rsh instead? Well, you have to do this on every other system anyway (see the confusion in this very thread) ... I dunno. One of the reasons that my company standardized on Debian is that we _don't_ have to do stupid things like this all the time; we can trust that the Debian maintainer has put some thought into their part of the system, and that it's setup in a sane fashion by default. Since, for _most_ (not all) people, using rsh in insane, this seems like a step in the wrong direction to me. Obviously, if this gets changed, we'll adapt, so it's exactly a huge big deal, but this is functionality that I was actually happy to see present in Debian, and would be sad to see removed. M pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
