Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
* Douglas Tutty [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006 Dec 14 06:07 -0600]: Package management is the cornerstone to Debian. The individual packages are installed by dpkg but how they're selected, managed, and have their dependancies resolved is the job of a package manager (that then run dpkg on each package in the right order). There's lots to learn here. Unless you go totally manual and just use dpkg you will probably use apt to fetch packages so you should read the apt HOWTO and the apt user's guide. Then if you use a front-end to apt (aptitude, or others) you should read the aptitude user's manual. I read a good paper last week on Debian. It posited that everyone assumes that package management is the cornerstone of Debian, but it is really the policy behind the packaging system that keeps the system cohesive and allows it to work at all. It further explained that other distributions copy or use apt, but miss on the policy aspect and soon fall apart, especially when upgrading. I've even seen this on some Debian derivatives. I second the motion on mc. When I do an install, I only put in the minimalist base system. I make sure I've got aptitude and get it set up, then I install mc. It can delve into tarballs, read html (and other formats with the right helper aps installed), provide a front-end to ftp and sftp, and includes a basic editor. In fact, if I'm on a system too small for vim I can do 90% of my daily tasks out of mc on a terminal. Absolutely! Midnight Commander should be part of the base install. Among the other cool things mc can do is allow you to look into a .deb archive by hitting Enter when the filename is highlighted, then scrolling down until INSTALL is highlighted and hitting Enter again. It will run dpkg -i on the package. Of course, no dependency resolution is done, but it's an easy way to install a one-off package. If you don't want to install the package, you can nagivate the files the package contains, perhaps browse docs, etc. It is truly the Swiss Army Chainsaw of system administration. - Nate -- Wireless | Amateur Radio Station N0NB | Successfully Microsoft Amateur radio exams; ham radio; Linux info @ | free since January 1998. http://www.qsl.net/n0nb/ | Debian, the choice of My Kawasaki KZ-650 SR @| a GNU generation! http://www.networksplus.net/n0nb/ | http://www.debian.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Thu, Dec 14, 2006 at 06:23:38AM -0600, Nate Bargmann wrote: * Douglas Tutty [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006 Dec 14 06:07 -0600]: Package management is the cornerstone to Debian. The individual packages are installed by dpkg but how they're selected, managed, and have their dependancies resolved is the job of a package manager (that then run dpkg on each package in the right order). There's lots to learn here. Unless you go totally manual and just use dpkg you will probably use apt to fetch packages so you should read the apt HOWTO and the apt user's guide. Then if you use a front-end to apt (aptitude, or others) you should read the aptitude user's manual. I read a good paper last week on Debian. It posited that everyone assumes that package management is the cornerstone of Debian, but it is really the policy behind the packaging system that keeps the system cohesive and allows it to work at all. It further explained that other distributions copy or use apt, but miss on the policy aspect and soon fall apart, especially when upgrading. I've even seen this on some Debian derivatives. In my mind, I link package management with the policy. On a recent thread (it may have been this one but I don't recall) I suggested to a debian newbie that after the install manual and debian reference, the policy manual and FHS should be the third thing read to really understand Debian. To keep the analogy, package managment is the cornerstone; its what the user sees. Debian policy is the morter that holds everything together. One can build a stone wall without morter but unless you build it differently it will fall apart. Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Wed, Dec 13, 2006 at 11:52:50PM -0600, Kent West wrote: Douglas Tutty wrote: The biggest thing I've learned is to install things a bit at a time; I'd agree with that. Lets say you choose aptitude, then you install that ... Then I install mc followed by lynx. Then ... documentation packages ... [then] exim4, mailx, mutt, and fetchmail The __last__ thing to install is X. But I usually install X and Icewm early on (just after lynx and ssh and sudo); I likes me graphical environment, yeppers. Then I toss on the fluff, KDE, OO.o, FF, T-Bird, etc. The problem is that sometimes installing a package breaks X for some reason. If you use a graphical app for package management, ensure that you can use a command line app when X breaks. YMMV. Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Thu, Dec 14, 2006 at 08:14:58AM -0500, Douglas Tutty wrote: On Wed, Dec 13, 2006 at 11:52:50PM -0600, Kent West wrote: Douglas Tutty wrote: The biggest thing I've learned is to install things a bit at a time; I'd agree with that. Lets say you choose aptitude, then you install that ... Then I install mc followed by lynx. Then ... documentation packages ... [then] exim4, mailx, mutt, and fetchmail The __last__ thing to install is X. But I usually install X and Icewm early on (just after lynx and ssh and sudo); I likes me graphical environment, yeppers. Then I toss on the fluff, KDE, OO.o, FF, T-Bird, etc. The problem is that sometimes installing a package breaks X for some reason. If you use a graphical app for package management, ensure that you can use a command line app when X breaks. I usually install X early, since if that breaks and makes the system so unusable that reinstallation is advised, I'd like to find out early. Of course I always do my package management in aptitude in the text console I get to with ctrl-alt-F1. -- hendrik -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 07:08:14PM +, andy wrote: Hi all I'm new to Debian - having run Slackware solidly since 8.1 I have become used to particular ways of maintaining my machine and also became used to a certasin belt--braces mentality. I loved Slackware, found tremendous respect for the stable way Pat Volkerding put it together and maintained it over the years. I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. Welcome. You've had lots of response but I'll add a few. I've never used slackware. I started with RH that I got basically free from a used book sale, then the RH upgrade wouldn't work on my old hardware so I switched to Debian while I was still a newbie. Remember that the steep part of the learning curve is where you make the fastest progress over time. Assuming that you really want to understand Debian and how it does things compared to what you're used to: After you have read the Release notes, Installation manual and the debian-reference, you should read the policy manual and the FHS that is attached to it. Package management is the cornerstone to Debian. The individual packages are installed by dpkg but how they're selected, managed, and have their dependancies resolved is the job of a package manager (that then run dpkg on each package in the right order). There's lots to learn here. Unless you go totally manual and just use dpkg you will probably use apt to fetch packages so you should read the apt HOWTO and the apt user's guide. Then if you use a front-end to apt (aptitude, or others) you should read the aptitude user's manual. I second the motion on mc. When I do an install, I only put in the minimalist base system. I make sure I've got aptitude and get it set up, then I install mc. It can delve into tarballs, read html (and other formats with the right helper aps installed), provide a front-end to ftp and sftp, and includes a basic editor. In fact, if I'm on a system too small for vim I can do 90% of my daily tasks out of mc on a terminal. The biggest thing I've learned is to install things a bit at a time; one major package (and its dependancies) and get it configured, then move on. Lets say you choose aptitude, then you install that and from then on use that untill you learn how to make it play nice with other package tools (see controversial recurrent threads on debian-user). Then I install mc followed by lynx. Then I make sure I've got all the documentation packages I want (e.g. the HOWTOs and man pages). When I'm ready for email I install exim4 (it works out of the box, don't worry about it), mailx, mutt, and fetchmail (again, one at a time in that order). The __last__ thing to install is X. Only when everything else is working. X only (xorg in Etch) and a basic window manager (I use icewm) untill it works fine from startx and only then add a display manager if you wish (e.g. gdm). I once had to reinstall due to a failed hard drive (now I use raid1 on my main system) and thought I'd just go ahead and select everthing that was installed prior to the crash. I ended up with the biggest mess. I didn't have time to figure out exactly what happened. I just reinstalled and went slow. It was easier than it seems since the base install only takes about 20 minutes. Enjoy. Doug. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
Douglas Tutty wrote: The biggest thing I've learned is to install things a bit at a time; I'd agree with that. Lets say you choose aptitude, then you install that ... Then I install mc followed by lynx. Then ... documentation packages ... [then] exim4, mailx, mutt, and fetchmail The __last__ thing to install is X. But I usually install X and Icewm early on (just after lynx and ssh and sudo); I likes me graphical environment, yeppers. Then I toss on the fluff, KDE, OO.o, FF, T-Bird, etc. -- Kent West Westing Peacefully http://kentwest.blogspot.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On 11 Dec 2006, andy wrote: Andrew Sackville-West wrote: On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 09:48:18PM +, andy wrote: Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? mplayer is in unstable, but I don't know about etch. You can also get it, along with various codecs of questionable legality from [1]www.debian-multimedia.org. I believe he's also got acroread. Have a look at vlc. I find it does more than mplayer - in particular, it allows you to move back and forth easily or speed up the playing. I find that xpdf does almost everything that acrobat does and is probably easier to use. Keyjnote is prettier but slower. A final thought; look at wajig for managing packages; it integrates dpkg and apt-get and works better than aptitude for me. Anthony -- Anthony Campbell - [EMAIL PROTECTED] Microsoft-free zone - Using Linux Gnu-Debian http://www.acampbell.org.uk (blog, book reviews, on-line books and sceptical articles) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
Anthony Campbell wrote: On 11 Dec 2006, andy wrote: Andrew Sackville-West wrote: On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 09:48:18PM +, andy wrote: Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? mplayer is in unstable, but I don't know about etch. You can also get it, along with various codecs of questionable legality from [1]www.debian-multimedia.org. I believe he's also got acroread. Have a look at vlc. I find it does more than mplayer - in particular, it allows you to move back and forth easily or speed up the playing. I find that xpdf does almost everything that acrobat does and is probably easier to use. Keyjnote is prettier but slower. A final thought; look at wajig for managing packages; it integrates dpkg and apt-get and works better than aptitude for me. Anthony To Nate, Anthony, John, Andrei, others: Thanks for your welcomes and recommendations. I look forward to getting to know the new system. As I said I am very impressed, although a bit confused too as I learn my way around. I haven't used Gnome since RH 7.2 preferring XFce throughout my Slackware days, so I am becoming familiar with both Gnome and Debian. In the weeks to come no doubt I will have found a number of questions to pursue, but so far the docs seem pretty comprehensive which will be a big help. Once again - thanks all. Cheers A
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Mon, 2006-12-11 at 17:10 -0600, Nate Bargmann wrote: I would probably expunge mplayer from my systems except for all the .wmv files people like to send. :-| Keep an eye on future upgrades, most players uses ffmpeg but not all are updated (xine, gstreamer-ffmpeg etc.) to include the recent improvements for playing back wmv without any nasty proprietary codecs. -- Cheers, Sven Arvidsson http://www.whiz.se PGP Key ID 760BDD22 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
andy wrote: Thanks for your welcomes and recommendations. I look forward to getting to know the new system. As I said I am very impressed, although a bit confused too as I learn my way around. I haven't used Gnome since RH 7.2 preferring XFce throughout my Slackware days, so I am becoming familiar with both Gnome and Debian. It's great that you're trying out Gnome, but you can run any environment you want. For example, aptitude install xfce4 should install XFce for you, or aptitude install kde should install KDE for you, or aptitude install icewm wmaker ion should install those three window managers for you. You're probably launching X via gdm; the gdm login window should have a menu item somewhere for choosing which environment you want to log into. Mix and match; try 'em all; have fun! -- Kent West Westing Peacefully http://kentwest.blogspot.com -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 12 December 2006 06:45, Re: andy [EMAIL PROTECTED] was heard to say: Thanks for your welcomes and recommendations. I look forward to getting to know the new system. As I said I am very impressed, although a bit confused too as I learn my way around. I'll throw in my .02FRNs about package management. I like dselect. It's the command-line Neanderthal of front-ends to apt, but I think the granularity of package selection and dependency suggestions is far better than aptitude. I tried tasksel once, not again thank you. I haven't used Gnome since RH 7.2 preferring XFce throughout my Slackware days, so I am becoming familiar with both Gnome and Debian. Why? Debian has XFce, there's no need for you to have to learn both a new package management system and a new desktop environment at the same time. I think I've got 5 or 6 different window manager systems on my laptop right now. Twm, WindowLab (which is great for kiosk or other restricted user use), GNOME, KDE, OLWM for nostalgia from when I first learned UNIX, etc. Yep, there it is: pool/main/x/xfce4/xfce4_4.3.99.1_all.deb In the weeks to come no doubt I will have found a number of questions to pursue, but so far the docs seem pretty comprehensive which will be a big help. I remember when I was first told about the /usr/share/doc/ directory. What a revelation! Once again - thanks all. Come back anytime. Curt- - -- September 11th, 2001 The proudest day for gun control and central planning advocates in American history -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iQEVAwUBRX67vC9Y35yItIgBAQKciwf/U2xtPkjkUoAhLV7RCr+xZMP70vdtSkju Tsct8ZgBbq+JHPnHTv2taMQN7QS7Jd/y/tnZNem6y9QT/ZdRbCJB4BJBCAgLxzim QvNWIlB/ncOnIJ1aDgrQmEgcWPOUyv2BMf6IJKwd2lN1Er21wV2i5adla8kqO5QS nCPFgja7DBY8tH0WcbduBqz/zbA/IIOOkSKC3IYaodlDS4uA/mzCETTeo7nDg/AP 9SBOAFJRiDnPLZPTHiVflJ1H1UWTrYSdtOHXmiFSzMN0acnSkuvWb1POm2ZUWxpj 78fps1jRtVrcaK9Ja2tnQ2iJ9HL8EA0vNUNE9eqWBnPVpr7tK3dSDw== =MK3M -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Tue, Dec 12, 2006 at 09:24:53AM -0500, Curt Howland wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 12 December 2006 06:45, Re: andy [EMAIL PROTECTED] was heard to say: I haven't used Gnome since RH 7.2 preferring XFce throughout my Slackware days, so I am becoming familiar with both Gnome and Debian. Why? Debian has XFce, there's no need for you to have to learn both a new package management system and a new desktop environment at the same time. I think I've got 5 or 6 different window manager systems on my laptop right now. Twm, WindowLab (which is great for kiosk or other restricted user use), GNOME, KDE, OLWM for nostalgia from when I first learned UNIX, etc. And gdm even lets you choose your window manager before you log in! Yep, there it is: pool/main/x/xfce4/xfce4_4.3.99.1_all.deb -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Mon, 2006-12-11 at 19:08 +, andy wrote: Hi all I'm new to Debian - having run Slackware solidly since 8.1 I have become used to particular ways of maintaining my machine and also became used to a certasin belt--braces mentality. I loved Slackware, found tremendous respect for the stable way Pat Volkerding put it together and maintained it over the years. So, this is my first venture forth into Debian and using Etch with Gnome as my DE, with 1Gb RAM, a P4 processor and 200Gb HDD I am feeling well equipped to ride the obvious and demonstrable pleasures that GNU/Linux Debian Etch brings the user. This is *so* very cool. Being one who still has a subscription to Slackware, I agree. I have been running Sid (Unstable). For quite a while I have been impressed by the one thing Debian gets right: Install ONCE, incremental update from there on. Unless something catastrophic comes along, you need not re-install, even to re-deploy. Well done any developers who read this - thanks for building this: this is a rush!! I love apt-get and how stable the system seems to be, and responsive too. I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I am seriously impressed with this system and just wanted to introduce myself. Lots to learn - lots of fun to be had: this is what computing was meant to be ... wheee :D Don't ever let me catch you thinking otherwise... even when thing go wrong with an upgrade. Usually 99.99% of bad happeneing in Debian can be fixed by calmly explaining the problem. There are those fo us here that have literally recovered a Debian machine from a completely lost /var partition, to the point where it actually was in better shape than before. I have done it, so has the current Editor in Chief for the Linux Journal Nicolas Petreley. Lotsa fun. -- greg, [EMAIL PROTECTED] The technology that is Stronger, better, faster: Linux signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On Tuesday 12 December 2006 20:09, [EMAIL PROTECTED] was heard to say: And gdm even lets you choose your window manager before you log in! kdm also does, which is what I use. Usually I use KDE, unless I'm on my backup machine in which case I use WindowLab or one of the other minimalist managers just because 350MHz and 128MB ram just isn't all that much machine any more. It's important to note that xdm, the default login manager, does NOT have a window manager selection list! Curt- - -- September 11th, 2001 The proudest day for gun control and central planning advocates in American history -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iQEVAwUBRX9ufS9Y35yItIgBAQLewgf/Z9c8dQNMak62KIZmT0T88XA1kM4CZzCc 6eB4bioW+wgE4Y27X6vH0OQH9F1YyyISH8vIL6xzXWQGbCFiKLuizitUG2RPgw1a BFTEZFPXP7D7Pjd5XTJ7RtbMf297QB4c2YhoCJzhS7mokMBi+/CCxP1Yg3vyP513 QbSM4mh3sD9hk/moMSzZVO/k2lrpZ6RycW+khOdrzm9fR1LCV8Kz8rgFxa99xX+T iXQxkHNQq3pQEZvBk3sMOWbbmTemj2jI9eTUuJFmS3sfJYeccGKMlwWW2LzSfMiZ V2d/fE30+wGNtMdqTZY2ZJ7WfdWc3yzBQHz1d31TKXMbifPLivA8eA== =2md/ -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
hello andy, A document that is very handy Debian Reference apt-get install debian-reference-en link for file brower : /usr/share/doc/Debian/reference/reference.en.html regards : peter colton On Monday 11 December 2006 19:08, andy wrote: Hi all I'm new to Debian - having run Slackware solidly since 8.1 I have become used to particular ways of maintaining my machine and also became used to a certasin belt--braces mentality. I loved Slackware, found tremendous respect for the stable way Pat Volkerding put it together and maintained it over the years. So, this is my first venture forth into Debian and using Etch with Gnome as my DE, with 1Gb RAM, a P4 processor and 200Gb HDD I am feeling well equipped to ride the obvious and demonstrable pleasures that GNU/Linux Debian Etch brings the user. This is *so* very cool. Well done any developers who read this - thanks for building this: this is a rush!! I love apt-get and how stable the system seems to be, and responsive too. I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I am seriously impressed with this system and just wanted to introduce myself. Lots to learn - lots of fun to be had: this is what computing was meant to be ... wheee :D -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
Peter Colton wrote: hello andy, A document that is very handy Debian Reference apt-get install debian-reference-en link for file brower : /usr/share/doc/Debian/reference/reference.en.html regards : peter colton On Monday 11 December 2006 19:08, andy wrote: Hi all I'm new to Debian - having run Slackware solidly since 8.1 I have become used to particular ways of maintaining my machine and also became used to a certasin belt--braces mentality. I loved Slackware, found tremendous respect for the stable way Pat Volkerding put it together and maintained it over the years. So, this is my first venture forth into Debian and using Etch with Gnome as my DE, with 1Gb RAM, a P4 processor and 200Gb HDD I am feeling well equipped to ride the obvious and demonstrable pleasures that GNU/Linux Debian Etch brings the user. This is *so* very cool. Well done any developers who read this - thanks for building this: this is a rush!! I love apt-get and how stable the system seems to be, and responsive too. I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I am seriously impressed with this system and just wanted to introduce myself. Lots to learn - lots of fun to be had: this is what computing was meant to be ... wheee :D Hey Peter Thanks for that link - very useful. That's the home-page for my Galeon browser. Lots of reading. Give me a few hours to work my way through that :) Cheers A -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
congrats andy and welcome! On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 07:48:13PM +, andy wrote: Debian Etch brings the user. This is *so* very cool. word to the wise. do some reading and get a knowledge of the differences between etch and testing and stable and tracking the various flavors of deb. As you are a new deb user, may I respectfully suggest that you set up apt to track etch and not testing at this point. current testing is about to become the etch stable release and so if you track Etch you will likely face little breakage at this time. however, if you track testing, then when etch becomes Stable you will likely face lots of churn and breakage in the testing branch. not fun for someone unfamiliar with deb. there are many discussions/wars about this topic in the archives of this list with many analogies to help someone understand this topic. Well done any developers who read this - thanks for building this: this is a rush!! I love apt-get and how stable the system seems to be, and responsive too. I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I am seriously impressed with this system and just wanted to introduce myself. Lots to learn - lots of fun to be had: this is what computing was meant to be ... indeed! wheee :D happy deb'ing A signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 07:08:14PM +, andy wrote: Hi all I'm new to Debian - having run Slackware solidly since 8.1 I have become Hi Andy, welcome to Debian. as of today the next stable release 'etch' has gone into 'freeze', this is the last stage before it is released as 'stable'. So, if you are running Sarge, you may want to read the etch release notes before upgrading. If you are running 'testing', you can fix your /etc/apt/sources.list to read 'etch' so that you upgrade and stay with 'stable' when its released or you'll stay with 'testing'. 'testing' is usually most useable a few months after a release. This is because things are being added after the release to fix things that could not be added because of the 'freeze'. The other thing about testing is that packages get taken out from time to time and are not replaced in a timely manner. Unstable or sid is were all bugfixes go, so if there is a bugfix it enters unstable and in about 10 days, if all goes well it may enter 'testing'. I said 'may' because there are multiple conditions that allow a package or a group of packages to migrate into testing. So if you want 24/7 rock solid dead easy - go with stable. If you want fast bugfixes but not dead easy - go with unstable. If you want somewhat easy and newer that stable then go with testing. All these choices has consequenes. But if you start with stable, if will allow an easier time to get used to 'the Debian way'. used to particular ways of maintaining my machine and also became used to a certasin belt--braces mentality. I loved Slackware, found tremendous respect for the stable way Pat Volkerding put it together and maintained it over the years. Much props to Mr. Slack! Every pioneer who paved the way had a hard road to pave that is littered with blood sweat and tears. We stand on the shoulders of giants. So, this is my first venture forth into Debian and using Etch with Gnome as my DE, with 1Gb RAM, a P4 processor and 200Gb HDD I am feeling well equipped to ride the obvious and demonstrable pleasures that GNU/Linux Debian Etch brings the user. This is *so* very cool. Well that system will able to do anything like compiz, beryl, mythtv, or other hi cpu stuff. Have fun! Well done any developers who read this - thanks for building this: this is a rush!! I love apt-get and how stable the system seems to be, and responsive too. I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I am seriously impressed with this system and just wanted to introduce myself. Lots to learn - lots of fun to be had: this is what computing was meant to be ... There are many sources of info: here is one. irc.debian.org on #debian using irssi (my choice). wiki.debian.org has expanded this year into a great resource. /usr/share/doc/ is where all documentation is. watch for any file that has 'debian' in the name for debian added notes. apt-file is cool for finding stuff. aptitude is the tool for most folks to install. apt-get or dpkg maybe needed to do surgery. apt-cache is useful. aptitude remove: remove application files and documentation aptitude purge: remove application files, documentation and configuration file(/etc). aptitude upgrade: used for updating packages aptitude dist-upgrade: used for adding, removing and updating packages (this is a rough definition--read apt-get or aptitude man pages for more info) almost forgot: www.debian-administration.org a site by a DD(debian developers) which has cool stuff. And planet.debian.org to get the latest Gossi^H^H^HNews on all thing Debian. Cheers, Kev -- | .''`. == Debian GNU/Linux == | my web site: | | : :' : The Universal | debian.home.pipeline.com | | `. `' Operating System| go to counter.li.org and | | `-http://www.debian.org/ |be counted! #238656 | | my keysever: pgp.mit.edu | my NPO: cfsg.org | signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Mon, 2006-12-11 at 19:08 +, andy wrote: I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I'm not sure what kind of docs you're looking for, but I suggest you check out http://www.debian-administration.org/ There are tons of useful, interesting, and cool tips for working with Debian there. -- Cheers, Sven Arvidsson http://www.whiz.se PGP Key ID 760BDD22 signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
Sven Arvidsson wrote: On Mon, 2006-12-11 at 19:08 +, andy wrote: I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I'm not sure what kind of docs you're looking for, but I suggest you check out http://www.debian-administration.org/ There are tons of useful, interesting, and cool tips for working with Debian there. Thanks for the link - bookmarked. :) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
Kevin Mark wrote: On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 07:08:14PM +, andy wrote: Hi all I'm new to Debian - having run Slackware solidly since 8.1 I have become Hi Andy, welcome to Debian. as of today the next stable release 'etch' has gone into 'freeze', this is the last stage before it is released as 'stable'. So, if you are running Sarge, you may want to read the etch release notes before upgrading. If you are running 'testing', you can fix your /etc/apt/sources.list to read 'etch' so that you upgrade and stay with 'stable' when its released or you'll stay with 'testing'. 'testing' is usually most useable a few months after a release. This is because things are being added after the release to fix things that could not be added because of the 'freeze'. The other thing about testing is that packages get taken out from time to time and are not replaced in a timely manner. Unstable or sid is were all bugfixes go, so if there is a bugfix it enters unstable and in about 10 days, if all goes well it may enter 'testing'. I said 'may' because there are multiple conditions that allow a package or a group of packages to migrate into testing. So if you want 24/7 rock solid dead easy - go with stable. If you want fast bugfixes but not dead easy - go with unstable. If you want somewhat easy and newer that stable then go with testing. All these choices has consequenes. But if you start with stable, if will allow an easier time to get used to 'the Debian way'. used to particular ways of maintaining my machine and also became used to a certasin belt--braces mentality. I loved Slackware, found tremendous respect for the stable way Pat Volkerding put it together and maintained it over the years. Much props to Mr. Slack! Every pioneer who paved the way had a hard road to pave that is littered with blood sweat and tears. We stand on the shoulders of giants. So, this is my first venture forth into Debian and using Etch with Gnome as my DE, with 1Gb RAM, a P4 processor and 200Gb HDD I am feeling well equipped to ride the obvious and demonstrable pleasures that GNU/Linux Debian Etch brings the user. This is *so* very cool. Well that system will able to do anything like compiz, beryl, mythtv, or other hi cpu stuff. Have fun! Well done any developers who read this - thanks for building this: this is a rush!! I love apt-get and how stable the system seems to be, and responsive too. I am still on a very steep learning curve, so would welcome anyone's steer in terms of learning how to optimise my system and good documentation for a Debian-n00b. I am seriously impressed with this system and just wanted to introduce myself. Lots to learn - lots of fun to be had: this is what computing was meant to be ... There are many sources of info: here is one. irc.debian.org on #debian using irssi (my choice). wiki.debian.org has expanded this year into a great resource. /usr/share/doc/ is where all documentation is. watch for any file that has 'debian' in the name for debian added notes. apt-file is cool for finding stuff. aptitude is the tool for most folks to install. apt-get or dpkg maybe needed to do surgery. apt-cache is useful. aptitude remove: remove application files and documentation aptitude purge: remove application files, documentation and configuration file(/etc). aptitude upgrade: used for updating packages aptitude dist-upgrade: used for adding, removing and updating packages (this is a rough definition--read apt-get or aptitude man pages for more info) almost forgot: www.debian-administration.org a site by a DD(debian developers) which has cool stuff. And planet.debian.org to get the latest Gossi^H^H^HNews on all thing Debian. Cheers, Kev Thanks Kev Yep - I've checked: I am already running etch as the repos for apt sources. Thanks. Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? Thanks A
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 09:48:18PM +, andy wrote: Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? mplayer is in unstable, but I don't know about etch. You can also get it, along with various codecs of questionable legality from www.debian-multimedia.org. I believe he's also got acroread. A Thanks A hey! you can't steal my sig!! ;-) signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 09:48:18PM +, andy wrote: Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? Debian has very strong rules about free software (read the DFSG) so you won't find these in the official repositories. You must add this to /etc/apt/sources.list deb http://www.debian-multimedia.org etch main This is an unofficial repository, but a very good one (as in everybody uses it ;) ). AFAIK the maintainer Christian Marillat is also a DD. Regards, Andrei -- If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. (Albert Einstein) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
Andrew Sackville-West wrote: On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 09:48:18PM +, andy wrote: Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? mplayer is in unstable, but I don't know about etch. You can also get it, along with various codecs of questionable legality from www.debian-multimedia.org. I believe he's also got acroread. A Thanks A hey! you can't steal my sig!! ;-) Got it - schweeet!! Thanks ... and here's your sig back: Andy ;)
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
Welcome! I too started with Slackware some ten years ago or so and in '99 started with Debian Slink, 2.1 and quickly moved to Potato, 2.2, when it was released. You will quickly discover the Debian Way to system administration. Debconf helps a lot amd packages generally have sensible defaults that are often more sensible than from upstream. System configuration files are in /etc and one trick I've learned is to check /etc/default first for configuration files. Also, get into /usr/share/doc/package_name and view the README.Debian file before anything else as it usually has essential information for getting started with a package. I've come to the conclusion that the original is still the best. I've tried several of the Debian derivatives and in my experience, they're fine until upgraded and then they seem to fall apart over time. Debian has remained the most usable distribution over the long-haul for me which is a testament to all of the hard work done by everyone in the Debian Community. - Nate -- Wireless | Amateur Radio Station N0NB | Successfully Microsoft Amateur radio exams; ham radio; Linux info @ | free since January 1998. http://www.qsl.net/n0nb/ | Debian, the choice of My Kawasaki KZ-650 SR @| a GNU generation! http://www.networksplus.net/n0nb/ | http://www.debian.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
* andy [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2006 Dec 11 15:50 -0600]: Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? I've found that kpdf of KDE does a good job with PDFs. Only infrequently does Acrobat do a better job. I would probably expunge mplayer from my systems except for all the .wmv files people like to send. :-| For other media like streaming audio, Audacious has become my new favorite. - Nate -- Wireless | Amateur Radio Station N0NB | Successfully Microsoft Amateur radio exams; ham radio; Linux info @ | free since January 1998. http://www.qsl.net/n0nb/ | Debian, the choice of My Kawasaki KZ-650 SR @| a GNU generation! http://www.networksplus.net/n0nb/ | http://www.debian.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Tue, Dec 12, 2006 at 12:48:30AM +0200, Andrei Popescu wrote: On Mon, Dec 11, 2006 at 09:48:18PM +, andy wrote: Am wondering how I go about getting mplayer and adobe acrobat? Any steers? Debian has very strong rules about free software (read the DFSG) so you won't find these in the official repositories. You must add this to /etc/apt/sources.list deb http://www.debian-multimedia.org etch main and don't forget to 'aptitude update' Regards, Andrei -- If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. (Albert Einstein) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Greetings and a minor rave!!
On Monday 11 December 2006 01:08 pm, andy wrote: Hi all I'm new to Debian - having run Slackware solidly since 8.1 I have become used to particular ways of maintaining my machine and also became used to a certasin belt--braces mentality. I loved Slackware, found ---stuff snipped--- I have been around here for a while so welcome aboard. If you have the aspirations to really understand what goes on withinthe Debian system there is one tool that I always recommend to newbies. It is mc or as it is really named Midnight Commander. It works from any Xwindows, kde, or Gnome, etc.screen or from the console equally well. It will undoubtedly prove extremely useful in MANY areas. Best wishes! -- John W. Foster -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
