How to updated after install? [Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?]
Thanks, Scott. See my notes interlineated below… On Dec 5, 2013, at 9:20 PM, Scott Ferguson scott.ferguson.debian.u...@gmail.com wrote: On 06/12/13 13:30, Rick Thomas wrote: Thanks to all who replied. I got lots of useful suggestions. The one that finally got me off the ground is this one… Somehow I missed it in all my googling. :) It didn't exist when you did your Googling. I wrote it *after* reading your post. Wow! Thanks! As noted, it was a tremendous help. https://wiki.debian.org/WordPress By *carefully* following *all* the instructions there, I was able to get a functioning WordPress v3.6.1 (latest available in the Debian Wheezy archives). I believe this will do the job for the time being. When I get some time I'll try and update the wiki to include instructions for installing WordPress for individual users (apache2-suexec-custom), and using Nginx instead of Apache (you'll note that the WordPress package doesn't automagically install Apache2, that's why). I'm looking forward to seeing and trying that when it arrives. There was some recent discussion on the mentors list about recruiting new folks to help with maintaining the Debian WordPress packages. I presume we won't see any updates past 3.6.1 until that issue is resolved? Yes, but it won't mean much, the existing package (see further down) will still work fine, it'll just require you to update WordPress once it's installed to be up-to-date with the latest stable upstream version. 3.6.1 is the version of WordPress *packaged* in the Debian WordPress package you installed. It can/should be updated to the latest version of WordPress (3.7.1) once installed (login to WordPress and look on the WordPress Dashboard). OK. I want to try updating: I log into my new wordpress site as admin. I see, in the upper left corner, there is a link labeled updates 2. There is also a double arrow circle icon and the numeral 2. Both places have the text two theme updates. They both link to http://macpro.rcthomas.org/blog/wp-admin/update-core.php; If I click one of them, I get to a page titled Wordpress Updates that says, You have the latest version of WordPress. The numeral 2 in both places does not change. Should I expect it to become 0 if updates had been installed? Also, it still identifies itself as Wordpress 3.6.1. Clearly there's something I'm overlooking. ??? The most recently baked Debian WordPress package has just been released, it includes v3.7.1[*1]. NOTE: *you* don't need it to upgrade to the latest version of WordPress. [*1]http://raphaelhertzog.com/2013/12/01/my-free-software-activities-in-november-2013/ If there's anything I can do as a non-developer -- such as, perhaps, testing new releases on a quick-turnaround basis with non-x86 architectures (I have PowerPC and ARM boxes that I can use for testing) Contact Raphael, I'm sure he'd appreciate the offer, and, you don't need to be a developer to package. OK. I will do that. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/70e8ba02-9adb-4e56-870d-14c68aaba...@pobox.com
Re: How to updated after install? [Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?]
On 06/12/13 19:27, Rick Thomas wrote:
Thanks, Scott. See my notes interlineated below…
Thanks, I appreciate the feedback/testing.
On Dec 5, 2013, at 9:20 PM, Scott Ferguson
scott.ferguson.debian.u...@gmail.com wrote:
On 06/12/13 13:30, Rick Thomas wrote:
snipped
There was some recent discussion on the mentors list about
recruiting new folks to help with maintaining the Debian
WordPress packages. I presume we won't see any updates past
3.6.1 until that issue is resolved?
Yes, but it won't mean much, the existing package (see further
down) will still work fine, it'll just require you to update
WordPress once it's installed to be up-to-date with the latest
stable upstream version.
3.6.1 is the version of WordPress *packaged* in the Debian
WordPress package you installed. It can/should be updated to the
latest version of WordPress (3.7.1) once installed (login to
WordPress and look on the WordPress Dashboard).
OK. I want to try updating: I log into my new wordpress site as
admin. I see, in the upper left corner, there is a link labeled
updates 2. There is also a double arrow circle icon and the
numeral 2. Both places have the text two theme updates. They
both link to
http://macpro.rcthomas.org/blog/wp-admin/update-core.php;
If I click one of them, I get to a page titled Wordpress Updates
that says, You have the latest version of WordPress. The numeral
2 in both places does not change. Should I expect it to become 0
if updates had been installed?
*If* upgrades have been installed. ;p
The 2 indicated are theme upgrades - upgrade WordPress first (though you
don't need to). You'll find those themes will upgrade when you upgrade
WordPress anyway.
Also, it still identifies itself as Wordpress 3.6.1.
Clearly there's something I'm overlooking. ???
Semi-stripped Wheezy with WordPress installed per wiki
fresh installation using wordpress_3.6.1+dfsg-1~deb7u1_all.deb
wordpress3.6.1+dfsg-1~de
grep -v # /etc/apt/sources.list
deb http://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/debian/ wheezy main non-free contrib
deb http://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/debian/ wheezy-updates main non-free
contrib
deb http://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/debian-security/ wheezy/updates main
non-free contrib
package list:-
http://paste.debian.net/69647/
Try this (you'll need ftp configured), let me know how it goes for you:-
1. http://postimg.org/image/z82eo5ggb/
2. http://postimg.org/image/knlbtblhn/
3. http://postimg.org/image/5qcusb897/
Otherwise follow manual upgrade instructions:-
http://codex.wordpress.org/Updating_WordPress#Manual_Update
Login to WordPress admin
go to the Plugins page
select all your plugins
deactivate them all
# cd ~
# wget http://wordpress.org/latest.tar.gz
# mv /usr/share/wordpress/wp-includes{,-3.6.1}
# mv /usr/share/wordpress/wp-admin{,-3.6.1}
# tar -zxvf latest.tar.gz -C /usr/share wordpress/wp-admin
# tar -zxvf latest.tar.gz -C /usr/share wordpress/wp-includes
# tar -zxvf latest.tar.gz -C /usr/share wordpress/wp-content
# tar --wildcards -zxvf latest.tar.gz -C /usr/share/ 'wordpress/*.php'
Back in WordPress agree to reload/upgrade the database
then reactivate plugins
Upgraded to freshly baked stable:-
http://postimg.org/image/t8enkhvnv/ (notice the changes to the upgrade
options?).
NOTE: nothing to stop you using the same process to upgrade to the beta
version of WordPress if you want.
snipped
Kind regards
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Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
Thanks to all who replied. I got lots of useful suggestions. The one that finally got me off the ground is this one… Somehow I missed it in all my googling. https://wiki.debian.org/WordPress By *carefully* following *all* the instructions there, I was able to get a functioning WordPress v3.6.1 (latest available in the Debian Wheezy archives). I believe this will do the job for the time being. There was some recent discussion on the mentors list about recruiting new folks to help with maintaining the Debian WordPress packages. I presume we won't see any updates past 3.6.1 until that issue is resolved? If there's anything I can do as a non-developer -- such as, perhaps, testing new releases on a quick-turnaround basis with non-x86 architectures (I have PowerPC and ARM boxes that I can use for testing) Enjoy! Rick -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/983d2290-1012-4baf-babe-6e220051a...@pobox.com
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
On 06/12/13 13:30, Rick Thomas wrote: Thanks to all who replied. I got lots of useful suggestions. The one that finally got me off the ground is this one… Somehow I missed it in all my googling. :) It didn't exist when you did your Googling. I wrote it *after* reading your post. https://wiki.debian.org/WordPress By *carefully* following *all* the instructions there, I was able to get a functioning WordPress v3.6.1 (latest available in the Debian Wheezy archives). I believe this will do the job for the time being. When I get some time I'll try and update the wiki to include instructions for installing WordPress for individual users (apache2-suexec-custom), and using Nginx instead of Apache (you'll note that the WordPress package doesn't automagically install Apache2, that's why). There was some recent discussion on the mentors list about recruiting new folks to help with maintaining the Debian WordPress packages. I presume we won't see any updates past 3.6.1 until that issue is resolved? Yes, but it won't mean much, the existing package (see further down) will still work fine, it'll just require you to update WordPress once it's installed to be up-to-date with the latest stable upstream version. 3.6.1 is the version of WordPress *packaged* in the Debian WordPress package you installed. It can/should be updated to the latest version of WordPress (3.7.1) once installed (login to WordPress and look on the WordPress Dashboard). The most recently baked Debian WordPress package has just been released, it includes v3.7.1[*1]. NOTE: *you* don't need it to upgrade to the latest version of WordPress. [*1]http://raphaelhertzog.com/2013/12/01/my-free-software-activities-in-november-2013/ If there's anything I can do as a non-developer -- such as, perhaps, testing new releases on a quick-turnaround basis with non-x86 architectures (I have PowerPC and ARM boxes that I can use for testing) Contact Raphael, I'm sure he'd appreciate the offer, and, you don't need to be a developer to package. Enjoy! Rick Kind regards -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/52a15e9f.4020...@gmail.com
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
On Sunday 24 November 2013 07:09 AM, Rick Thomas wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? All help will be appreciated! Rick Hi Rick, These instructions should work for Debian as well: http://movingtofreedom.org/2007/05/09/how-to-wordpress-on-ubuntu-gnu-linux/ The main thing is to get Apache PHP configured properly. Once that's done, Wordpress config goes easily. I'll be happy to help you troubleshoot this if needed. Sincerely, Kailash -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5295ab94.10...@gmail.com
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
On 27/11/13 19:21, Kailash wrote: On Sunday 24 November 2013 07:09 AM, Rick Thomas wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? All help will be appreciated! Rick Hi Rick, These instructions should work for Debian as well: http://movingtofreedom.org/2007/05/09/how-to-wordpress-on-ubuntu-gnu-linux/ The main thing is to get Apache PHP configured properly. Once that's done, Wordpress config goes easily. I'll be happy to help you troubleshoot this if needed. Sincerely, Kailash The OP was emphatic about wanting to use the Debian package, and the answer has already been provided. (https://wiki.debian.org/WordPress) NOTE: also that the page you refer to is many years out of date. Kind regards -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5295af8f.5080...@gmail.com
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
On Nov 27, 2013, at 12:38 AM, Scott Ferguson scott.ferguson.debian.u...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Rick, These instructions should work for Debian as well: http://movingtofreedom.org/2007/05/09/how-to-wordpress-on-ubuntu-gnu-linux/ The main thing is to get Apache PHP configured properly. Once that's done, Wordpress config goes easily. I'll be happy to help you troubleshoot this if needed. Sincerely, Kailash The OP was emphatic about wanting to use the Debian package, and the answer has already been provided. (https://wiki.debian.org/WordPress) NOTE: also that the page you refer to is many years out of date. Kind regards Wow! Thanks folks. The Debian users list to the rescue again! (-: (-: Yes, I do need to do it in Debian -- primarily because the machine I want to use for it is a G5 PowerPC Macintosh and Debian is the only distro I know of that supports that hardware -- but I'm guessing that Ubuntu, even out of date Ubuntu, will be sufficiently like Debian as to be useful. Due to the US Thanksgiving holidays, I won't be able to attack this until after the weekend. But at least now I've got a couple of places to read up on doing it, and a couple of people who have offered to help me over the rough spots. The folks on this list are so great! Rick -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/6f03f5a0-d4d8-42e4-b9e8-f6c97518c...@pobox.com
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
On 25/11/13 12:10, Scott Ferguson wrote: On 25/11/13 10:13, Hugo Vanwoerkom wrote: Rick Thomas wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. More explanations of the Debianization as shown in the /usr/share/doc/examples. snipped Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? OK. :) See https://wiki.debian.org/WordPress Takes about 5 minutes to set up. (I've only shown the simple single install, run as www-data method using apache2 and mysql). snipped I just installed the Debian package then went to the wp admin page in my browser and began using it as you would normally. The debian package just does the installation for you. Kind regards Just spent 10 minutes with the Wheezy WordPress package either it's not as simple as it used to be or I'd mis-remembered the process in Squeeze (most likely the latter). Kind regards -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5294786f.30...@gmail.com
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
On Sat, 23 Nov 2013 17:39:20 -0800 Rick Thomas rbtho...@pobox.com wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? All help will be appreciated! Rick. A few months ago I was considering doing this, hosting my wordpress blog on this computer, but after considering all the disadvantages of self-hosting I chose someone to do it for me in a local web-hosting company for 4UKP a month, which is a very good price. Since then we've worked together to reduce the sites footprint in size and speed it up. Now I take full backups of it twice a day, and they just take a few minutes over a distance of about 25 miles. I can only suggest you do the same as it saves a lot of heartache and worry too. Sharon. -- A taste of linux = http://www.sharons.org.uk efever = http://www.efever.blogspot.com/ efever = http://sharon04.livejournal.com/ my git repo = https://bitbucket.org/boudiccas/dots Debian testing, Fluxbox 1.3.5, LibreOffice 4.1.3.2 Registered Linux user 561944 signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
Thanks, Sharon! That's good advice if all I want is wordpress. But I'm a sysadmin, and like to understand the details. So, for the time being, I'd prefer to do it from scratch if I can. If I succeed (with help from the list) I promise to write up the step-by-step procedure for the wiki, so the next person can benefit from our experience. Thanks in advance! Rick On Nov 24, 2013, at 11:46 AM, Sharon Kimble boudic...@talktalk.net wrote: On Sat, 23 Nov 2013 17:39:20 -0800 Rick Thomas rbtho...@pobox.com wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? All help will be appreciated! Rick. A few months ago I was considering doing this, hosting my wordpress blog on this computer, but after considering all the disadvantages of self-hosting I chose someone to do it for me in a local web-hosting company for 4UKP a month, which is a very good price. Since then we've worked together to reduce the sites footprint in size and speed it up. Now I take full backups of it twice a day, and they just take a few minutes over a distance of about 25 miles. I can only suggest you do the same as it saves a lot of heartache and worry too. Sharon. -- A taste of linux = http://www.sharons.org.uk efever = http://www.efever.blogspot.com/ efever = http://sharon04.livejournal.com/ my git repo = https://bitbucket.org/boudiccas/dots Debian testing, Fluxbox 1.3.5, LibreOffice 4.1.3.2 Registered Linux user 561944 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/6dc011f2-5150-4590-9428-d80ac4ddd...@pobox.com
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
I'd avoid the packages. Wordpress is basically a bunch of php scripts that get dumped inside a directory on your Apache server, plus some setup for your database. You're a lot safer just downloading the zip file and following the instructions. At least, that's how I've always had the best luck. Miles Fidelman Rick Thomas wrote: Thanks, Sharon! That's good advice if all I want is wordpress. But I'm a sysadmin, and like to understand the details. So, for the time being, I'd prefer to do it from scratch if I can. If I succeed (with help from the list) I promise to write up the step-by-step procedure for the wiki, so the next person can benefit from our experience. Thanks in advance! Rick On Nov 24, 2013, at 11:46 AM, Sharon Kimble boudic...@talktalk.net wrote: On Sat, 23 Nov 2013 17:39:20 -0800 Rick Thomas rbtho...@pobox.com wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? All help will be appreciated! Rick. A few months ago I was considering doing this, hosting my wordpress blog on this computer, but after considering all the disadvantages of self-hosting I chose someone to do it for me in a local web-hosting company for 4UKP a month, which is a very good price. Since then we've worked together to reduce the sites footprint in size and speed it up. Now I take full backups of it twice a day, and they just take a few minutes over a distance of about 25 miles. I can only suggest you do the same as it saves a lot of heartache and worry too. Sharon. -- A taste of linux = http://www.sharons.org.uk efever = http://www.efever.blogspot.com/ efever = http://sharon04.livejournal.com/ my git repo = https://bitbucket.org/boudiccas/dots Debian testing, Fluxbox 1.3.5, LibreOffice 4.1.3.2 Registered Linux user 561944 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/52928748.6030...@meetinghouse.net
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
Rick Thomas wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? In 2004 I set up WP on this system using the upstream tarball, exactly because at that time I could not find step-by-step instructions using Debian. Hugo -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/l6u15t$4lt$1...@ger.gmane.org
Fwd: Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
---BeginMessage--- Rick Thomas wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? There's a reason everyone says do it from the wordpress site - and follow the directions THERE (which are for dummies). apt packaging is great for binaries, not so good for PHP and database configuration. There are times to do stuff the Debian way and times when it makes no sense. Miles Fidelman ---End Message---
Re: Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
On 25/11/13 10:13, Hugo Vanwoerkom wrote: Rick Thomas wrote: Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? In 2004 I set up WP on this system using the upstream tarball, exactly because at that time I could not find step-by-step instructions using Debian. Hugo I just installed the Debian package then went to the wp admin page in my browser and began using it as you would normally. The debian package just does the installation for you. Kind regards -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5292a375.10...@gmail.com
Setting up wordpress on wheezy using the debian packages?
Can someone point me at step-by-step instructions for going from sudo aptitude install wordpress on a freshly scrubbed, newly installed Wheezy system to a working wordpress website on the same machine? I've read the README.Debian in /usr/share/doc/wordpress/ and the stuff in examples/ but they are just hints, I think. I've googled till I'm blue in the face, but all I find is people who insist on installing wordpress from the downloadable tarball at the wordpress development site and ignore the debian package entirely. I'd much rather do things the Debian way. Somebody must have done it, I would think -- or what's the point of having a Debian package in the first place? If you have, can you share your recipe? All help will be appreciated! Rick -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/ec8aa022-d5a6-4ce7-a59d-7c261508e...@pobox.com
