Re: The real Debian.org
Jaldhar H. Vyas [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Orn E. Hansen wrote: Let's march to Victory! SIEG HEIL! And thus Orn E. Hansen officially ends this thread. :-) Unfortunately not, even if he didn't invoke Godwin's Law on purpose. He just guaranteed a signal to noise of 0. -- Carey Evans * http://home.clear.net.nz/pages/c.evans/ gc Neniu anticipas la hispanan Inkvizicion. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org - please read
Would you guys kindly leave debian-user out of your squabble? It belongs in debian-dissent or debian-devel or private email in my opinion. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dave Cinege) writes: If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. I use Linux since two and a half years and especially Debian since some more than a year. I'm reading along debian-user and debian-devel since a few months now (so i know of what breed you are) and since just a few days have applied as new package maintainer of the official Debian distribution. Actually i'm really very happy not to have to work with you. I doubt you'll find any package maintainers for the distribution you intend to create given the fact that your ridiculous behaviour until now so ironically corresponds to the domain names you have been using in past, current and recent time. Just go away and stop your FQBS here. Thank you, P. *8^( -- Paul Seelig [EMAIL PROTECTED] African Music Archive - Institute for Ethnology and Africa Studies Johannes Gutenberg-University - Forum 6 - 55099 Mainz/Germany My Homepage in the WWW at the URL http://www.uni-mainz.de/~pseelig -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
RE: The real Debian.org
Þann 26-Oct-97 skrifar Dave Cinege: Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. It happens everywhere, if you challenge the leader of a group. Personal attacks, compliants to your service provider, banishment from the project. They will gang-up on you and drive you away. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. There are many things, people should be ashamed of themselves for... but people will continue to be people, non the less. If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. Now you've learned... But you shouldn't feel angry, pushed or vengeful. People sell themselves, for a little attention... from those who they term as the leadership... that's nothing to hate people for, because it's human. And although people throw harsh words at you, it's not because they are ganging on you. But because they are protecting themselves... they feel, that by attacking the leader, you are attacking the distribution and thus ultimately... them. We've all been tought that argumentation is what makes intelligent people... and the only way you can ever argue somone on your side, is when it will benefit that somone. We are all animals, and our ultimate goal is to feed... thus, next time you present your arguments on an issue, put your feelings aside and present them in a way where your arguments will clearly serve and benefit the interest of those, whom you present it to... and, present it to the right crowd. Orn Einar Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] voice+fax; +46 035 217194 -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 05:48:10PM -0500, Dave Cinege wrote: Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. Personal attacks, compliants to your service provider, banishment from the project. They will gang-up on you and drive you away. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. Thanks Dave, I needed a laugh to brighten up an otherwise uneventful day. And I thought all you had to do was mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with some technical details, I think I forgot to include the grovelling my email.. oops. Sorry Bruce, Klee, Guy and other committee members. Hamish -- Hamish Moffatt, StudIEAust [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Student, computer science computer systems engineering.3rd year, RMIT. http://hamish.home.ml.org/ (PGP key here) CPOM: [* ] 58% Your train has been cancelled due to defective government at Spring Street.. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 07:12:57PM -0500, Dave Cinege wrote: 2. To the users, it's so pitiful that users of a distribution is so quick to kick out a DEVELOPER just because he disagrees with the leader. You're going to get a lot of flack over this. See I'm not a developer. Why? I'm not allowed to be. But don't worry this catch 22 does nothing to prevent other developers that are *allowed* by Bruce from pointing the finger at me for not being a developer. The reason that you are not allowed to be a developer is under your control. Think about it. hamish -- Hamish Moffatt, StudIEAust [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Student, computer science computer systems engineering.3rd year, RMIT. http://hamish.home.ml.org/ (PGP key here) CPOM: [* ] 58% Your train has been cancelled due to defective government at Spring Street.. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: IMPORTANT Correction: The real Debian.org
On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 07:18:27PM -0500, Dave Cinege wrote: On Sun, 26 Oct 1997 23:54:15 +0100, Marcus Brinkmann wrote: On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 12:25:56PM -1000, Jimen Ching wrote: 2. To the users, it's so pitiful that users of a distribution is so quick to kick out a DEVELOPER just because he disagrees with the leader. Please notice that Dave Cinege is NOT a debian developer. See what I mean Convenently left out is I would be maintaining packages, as well writing a new system package, if I was allowed to. I was also going to open a crypto mirror, but Bruce made it clear it to would not be recognized. Because it is not legal, not because of you. Hamish -- Hamish Moffatt, StudIEAust [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Student, computer science computer systems engineering.3rd year, RMIT. http://hamish.home.ml.org/ (PGP key here) CPOM: [* ] 58% The opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth. --Bohr -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 12:25:56PM -1000, Jimen Ching wrote: I should mention that this is not the first time there was disagreement in the Debian project. I remember in the beginning that Bruce and RMS also had a disagreement. Fortunately, that was resolved. I hope this one gets resolved as well. Unlike others, I do see some problems with the distribution and improvements can be made. Dave, I don't know what kind of contributions you make to debian. But if it is in the dpkg program, then I hope you can continue to improve it. If you do branch off into another distribution (great, yet another distribution), then dpkg is the first program you should improve. Cinege does not want a resolution; he wants Bruce removed. As I posted yesterday, when it became clear that the revised revision-naming scheme did not suit Cinege's business, he started on a personal vendetta against Bruce. At no stage has he ever tried to negotiate. Hamish -- Hamish Moffatt, StudIEAust [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Student, computer science computer systems engineering.3rd year, RMIT. http://hamish.home.ml.org/ (PGP key here) CPOM: [* ] 58% The opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth. --Bohr -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
with all due respect grow up and leave debian alone if you done like the way debian is run and managed. Use another distribution. At 11:43 AM 10/27/97 +1100, Hamish Moffatt wrote: On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 05:48:10PM -0500, Dave Cinege wrote: Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. Personal attacks, compliants to your service provider, banishment from the project. They will gang-up on you and drive you away. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. Thanks Dave, I needed a laugh to brighten up an otherwise uneventful day. And I thought all you had to do was mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with some technical details, I think I forgot to include the grovelling my email.. oops. Sorry Bruce, Klee, Guy and other committee members. Hamish -- Hamish Moffatt, StudIEAust [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Student, computer science computer systems engineering.3rd year, RMIT. http://hamish.home.ml.org/ (PGP key here) CPOM: [* ] 58% Your train has been cancelled due to defective government at Spring Street.. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . --- Corey A. [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
Dave Cinege wrote: [much drek removed] That's the point, let it be known. I am done with it and debian. Bye. Leadership is a thankless task, but the great thing about free software is that if you don't like the leadership, strike off and go at it on your own. The people will follow if the cause is righteous. I however, will stick with the Debian project, as it DOES have a committed leader and leadership body. Have a nice life, Dave. Paul Kuykendall -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
On Mon, 27 Oct 1997 11:43:56 +1100, Hamish Moffatt wrote: Thanks Dave, I needed a laugh to brighten up an otherwise uneventful day. And I thought all you had to do was mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] with some technical details, I think I forgot to include the grovelling my email.. oops. Sorry Bruce, Klee, Guy and other committee members. Bruce what do you have to say about me submiting any work to the project? On Thu, 23 Oct 97 23:33 PDT, Bruce Perens wrote: There's a little trust issue standing in the way of that, I fear. Various other posts making it clear my work will not be accepted (most not in such a cheery tone) available upon request. Or maybe you could just ask Bruce yourself? -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
Dave (dc) wrote: -- Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. [crap deleted] Can we please filter mails from [EMAIL PROTECTED] from the debian-user-list (and the digest). It was funny in the beginning but this freak just wastes bandwidth. Thanx, Gernot -- Gernot Bauer University of Linz Austria [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
Sorry for the cross-post but I had to do it... On 26 Oct, Dave Cinege wrote: Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. This is what happens if you chanllenge without valid motivations. If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. The fact here, Dave, is that you never contributed to Debian! You just keep sending malicious mail. If you (not you, dave, the others) are new to Debian go read the home page of Dave (http://www.psychosis.com/) and don't make the mistake he made (about life maybe?). * Federico Di Gregorio | / *-=$ ;-) TeX Wizard?* * Debian developer! | / -1pgp: finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] * * friend of penguins |/try http://www.debian.org* **DE 9E B2 75 B4 F6 CC 5B C3 D5 71 51 04 AB F3 B2** -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
Þann 27-Oct-97 skrifar Gernot Bauer: Dave (dc) wrote: -- Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. [crap deleted] Can we please filter mails from [EMAIL PROTECTED] from the debian-user-list (and the digest). It was funny in the beginning but this freak just wastes bandwidth. Yeah, and bandwidth costs money... and who wants to pay for opinions nobody wants to hear, right? So, why don't we lock'im in a lunatic assylum... I mean, he doesn't share our view of the world... so he must be crazy! No, better yet, let's take the JEW and put'im in the Gas chamber... that way, he won't return ever! Let's march to Victory! SIEG HEIL! -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Orn E. Hansen wrote: Yeah, and bandwidth costs money... and who wants to pay for opinions nobody wants to hear, right? I will gladly pay for opinions I do not want to hear but is it asking too much for them to have some substance? At one time Dave had a slight point. It was discussed by the developers then rejected. So instead of dropping the subject or finding better arguments he turned it into a personal vendetta against Bruce. I don't see why anyone should have to waste their time with that. Even then the 'evil tyrant' of Debian announced his dissent mailing list and placed him in digest mode rather than ejecting him. So maybe Dave should feel offended but persecuted? Nope. So, why don't we lock'im in a lunatic assylum... I mean, he doesn't share our view of the world... so he must be crazy! No, better yet, let's take the JEW and put'im in the Gas chamber... that way, he won't return ever! Let's march to Victory! SIEG HEIL! And thus Orn E. Hansen officially ends this thread. :-) -- Jaldhar -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
Orn E. Hansen wrote: ^ann 27-Oct-97 skrifar Gernot Bauer: Dave (dc) wrote: -- Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. [crap deleted] Can we please filter mails from [EMAIL PROTECTED] from the debian-user-list (and the digest). It was funny in the beginning but this freak just wastes bandwidth. Yeah, and bandwidth costs money... and who wants to pay for opinions nobody wants to hear, right? It seems that he is the ONLY one who is not allowed to become a debian-maintainer (funny, hmm?). This would be a reason for whining (sp?) but the whole thing became a crusade against Bruce Whateverheiscalled. So, why don't we lock'im in a lunatic assylum... I mean, he doesn't share our view of the world... so he must be crazy! No, better yet, let's take the JEW and put'im in the Gas chamber... that way, he won't return ever! Let's march to Victory! SIEG HEIL! This is no good topic to make fun of! We - specially in Austria - are happy that this dark chapter of history is over. Dont let it happen again!!! Gernot -- -- Gernot Bauer University of Linz [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: IMPORTANT Correction: The real Debian.org
On Mon, 27 Oct 1997, Hamish Moffatt wrote: On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 07:18:27PM -0500, Dave Cinege wrote: On Sun, 26 Oct 1997 23:54:15 +0100, Marcus Brinkmann wrote: On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 12:25:56PM -1000, Jimen Ching wrote: 2. To the users, it's so pitiful that users of a distribution is so quick to kick out a DEVELOPER just because he disagrees with the leader. Please notice that Dave Cinege is NOT a debian developer. See what I mean Convenently left out is I would be maintaining packages, as well writing a new system package, if I was allowed to. I was also going to open a crypto mirror, but Bruce made it clear it to would not be recognized. Because it is not legal, not because of you. Actually, the first test case has already been won, and I doubt there will be a second, especially since the technology can alredy be had from many international sites :) Hamish -- Hamish Moffatt, StudIEAust [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Student, computer science computer systems engineering.3rd year, RMIT. http://hamish.home.ml.org/ (PGP key here) CPOM: [* ] 58% The opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth. --Bohr -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . __ I like six eggs when starting on a journey. Fried - not poached. And mind you don't break 'em. I won't eat a broken egg. -- Thorin Oakenshield -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: IMPORTANT Correction: The real Debian.org
From: Britton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Actually, the first test case has already been won, and I doubt there will be a second The first test case was not sufficiently general. There must be more of them to overturn the law. Thanks Bruce -- Can you get your operating system fixed when you need it? Linux - the supportable operating system. http://www.debian.org/support.html Bruce Perens K6BP [EMAIL PROTECTED] NEW PHONE NUMBER: 510-620-3502 -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
The real Debian.org
Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. Personal attacks, compliants to your service provider, banishment from the project. They will gang-up on you and drive you away. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
First off, I am not a developer of Debian packages and thus do not know how Bruce Perens manages the distribution. But basically I have two comments. 1. To DC, your first mistake was to post your request to all of the debian lists. The problem with this is that this is a developers' issue, not a users' issue. Thus all those responses sound like they were from users of debian, not the developers. In this case, user's opinions are irrelavent. Who cares if a user likes Bruce Perens as the project leader? They are not the one who must work with him. Developers like you and others are the ones who matter. What do other developers think? Are they having the same problem as you? 2. To the users, it's so pitiful that users of a distribution is so quick to kick out a DEVELOPER just because he disagrees with the leader. As a user, I must laugh at some of the criticisms. Spelling mistakes? Use of initials instead of the full name? These are reasons for ignoring a complaint? It is scary to find out that this type of group can decide who becomes a developer for debian and who doesn't. I should mention that this is not the first time there was disagreement in the Debian project. I remember in the beginning that Bruce and RMS also had a disagreement. Fortunately, that was resolved. I hope this one gets resolved as well. Unlike others, I do see some problems with the distribution and improvements can be made. Dave, I don't know what kind of contributions you make to debian. But if it is in the dpkg program, then I hope you can continue to improve it. If you do branch off into another distribution (great, yet another distribution), then dpkg is the first program you should improve. --jc -- Jimen Ching (WH6BRR) [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
Hello Dave! Actually, you sent this message to me personally, so I think you want to address me. This is why I answer. On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 05:48:10PM -0500, Dave Cinege wrote: Take heed people. This is what happens if you dare challenge the leadership of the Debian project. Personal attacks, compliants to your service provider, banishment from the project. They will gang-up on you and drive you away. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. I never attacked you or tried to do you any harm. So I think that you want to warn me: If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. Sorry, Dave. My experience is different from yours. Although I never contributed anything real to debian, all people here have been friendly and open to suggestions even from people that are not a developer or maintainer, but just an ordinary user. Think about it, Marcus -- Rhubarb is no Egyptian god. Marcus Brinkmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://homepage.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/Marcus.Brinkmann/ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: IMPORTANT Correction: The real Debian.org
On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 12:25:56PM -1000, Jimen Ching wrote: 2. To the users, it's so pitiful that users of a distribution is so quick to kick out a DEVELOPER just because he disagrees with the leader. Please notice that Dave Cinege is NOT a debian developer. He does not maintain a package and never did. He does work on a router project that uses debian as a basis, and he did contribute to debian-user, asking questions of other users. But he is not official involved in Debian, if there isn't something I don't know. As a user, I must laugh at some of the criticisms. Spelling mistakes? Use of initials instead of the full name? These are reasons for ignoring a complaint? It is scary to find out that this type of group can decide who becomes a developer for debian and who doesn't. It seems to me that you missed the long thread on debian-devel a while ago, where dave has used uglier things than common four letter words to express his opinion :( I can post you this thread, it is only slightly larger than one megabyte... I should mention that this is not the first time there was disagreement in the Debian project. I remember in the beginning that Bruce and RMS also had a disagreement. Fortunately, that was resolved. I hope this one gets resolved as well. Unlike others, I do see some problems with the distribution and improvements can be made. Dave, I don't know what kind I use Debian since a year only, but I think the disagreement between the FSF and Debian is in no way comparable to the rantings of dc. of contributions you make to debian. But if it is in the dpkg program, then I hope you can continue to improve it. If you do branch off into another distribution (great, yet another distribution), then dpkg is the first program you should improve. As I stated above, dc is not a debian developer, and I doubt that he can improve dpkg. As Ian(?) stated a while ago, everyone who has a small idea of the way dpkg works, disappears from this world :) For dpkg: Bruce is pretty sure that all distributions will use ANSI packages soon. Thank you, Marcus -- Rhubarb is no Egyptian god. Marcus Brinkmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://homepage.ruhr-uni-bochum.de/Marcus.Brinkmann/ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
if you are friendly, we threat you friendly. if you are unfriendly, we might threat you unfriendly (but we try at least to be friendly). if you are unfriendly, are threated unfriendly, and complain about being threated unfrienly in an unfriendly tone, you are annoying. we have better to do than reading annoying emails, so we will get angry sooner or later. in this case, we got angry. please leave, david. when you have learned this lessen, you are invited to come back. andreas -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org
On Sun, 26 Oct 1997 12:25:56 -1000 (HST), Jimen Ching wrote: First off, I am not a developer of Debian packages and thus do not know how Bruce Perens manages the distribution. But basically I have two comments. 1. To DC, your first mistake was to post your request to all of the debian lists. The problem with this is that this is a developers' issue, not a users' issue. My orginal post was to all list because it concerned everyone involved in the project. (Removal of project leader) 2. To the users, it's so pitiful that users of a distribution is so quick to kick out a DEVELOPER just because he disagrees with the leader. You're going to get a lot of flack over this. See I'm not a developer. Why? I'm not allowed to be. But don't worry this catch 22 does nothing to prevent other developers that are *allowed* by Bruce from pointing the finger at me for not being a developer. As a user, I must laugh at some of the criticisms. Spelling mistakes? Use of initials instead of the full name? These are reasons for ignoring a complaint? It is scary to find out that this type of group can decide who becomes a developer for debian and who doesn't. That's the point, let it be known. I am done with it and debian. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: IMPORTANT Correction: The real Debian.org
On Sun, 26 Oct 1997 23:54:15 +0100, Marcus Brinkmann wrote: On Sun, Oct 26, 1997 at 12:25:56PM -1000, Jimen Ching wrote: 2. To the users, it's so pitiful that users of a distribution is so quick to kick out a DEVELOPER just because he disagrees with the leader. Please notice that Dave Cinege is NOT a debian developer. See what I mean Convenently left out is I would be maintaining packages, as well writing a new system package, if I was allowed to. I was also going to open a crypto mirror, but Bruce made it clear it to would not be recognized. It seems to me that you missed the long thread on debian-devel a while ago, where dave has used uglier things than common four letter words to express his opinion :( I can post you this thread, it is only slightly larger than one megabyte... Where the same lynching immedatly began, and I made the mistake of responding too. Many of the same people, including Marcus, started the fireworks back then as well. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The real Debian.org - please read
On Sun, 26 Oct 1997, Dave Cinege wrote: If you are new to Debian, please don't make the mistake I made. This is a closed software project, where you are allowed to contribute only if you surcome to the personal agenda of the current leadership. This is the structure and model of the project, make no bones about it. I am a developer, albeit a fringe developer in that I do not maintain many packages or any mainstream packages. I became a developer to give something back to Debian as I and my department (economics, not the institute below) uses the Debian distribution more and more every day. I have not always agreed on the management technique, but Debian is a volunteer organization. It is large. It is not perfect. Inherent in any organization of this nature is disagreement and the need for some subset of volunteers to have a final say. Otherwise nothing would be accomplished. Overall I am immensely pleased with Debian. I was openly and freely admitted as a developer and will leave when and if I decide I do not agree with the direction Debian is headed. There are many linux distributions including Debian that all have their advantages and disadvantages. Debian is no exception. We are all free to choose among them. New users, old users, new developers, etc. - please make the above judgments for yourself. I cannot find any logic in Mr. Cinege's attacks on the Debian project and am at a loss to why he expends so much effort abusing something he seems to dislike. I assume that I am missing parts of his arguments as some discussions were in private and therefore I am not fully informed. However, that is irrelevant. These skirmishes have never affected me in any way nor in the way that I approach the organization and use the distribution. I am thrilled with Debian and, with a lot of help from Dirk Eddelbuettel, have easily convinced my department Debian is stable enough to switch from AIX to Debian/GNU Linux for all applications. Colin Telmer. -- Colin Telmer, Institute of Intergovernmental Relations School of Policy Studies Building, Room 309, Queen's University Kingston, Ontario, Canada, K7L-3N6 (613)545-6000x4219 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://terrapin.econ.queensu.ca -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
