Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
[At the risk of being flamed for having a non-Debian discussion here...] Shaya Potter writes: What I remember reading was that WABI actually was able to run more windows apps if you installed windows and ran the apps through it, then if you would run the apps directly from WABI. No, that's not true. However, what doesn't make sense to me about this approach is how can it run windows. Windows, from my understanding, interacts on a very low level with dos, and WABI isn't a pc emulator, it justs emulates window system calls. Wabi doesn't run the KERNEL, GDI and USER DLLs. You are correct, these work at a very low level. Wabi provides emulation for these APIs. It still requires MS Windows install disks unconditionally at install time. Wabi uses various other components from MS Windows such as the OLE DLLs, applets, fonts, help files and various utilities such as the program manager and file manager. Of course the most important thing it requires is Solitaire. If you would like to discuss this furthur, please join us on the Caldera Wabi email list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]). Ron -- Ron Holt [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera, Inc. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
Rick Macdonald writes: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. In short, yes, it does run. I've run Wabi 2.2 on Debian 1.1. The only serious problem I've found is that the default permissions on /dev/fd0 don't allow access by regular users. Wabi requires the installation of MS Windows 3.1 and this is often done via floppy while running as a regular user. Just change permissions on /dev/fd0 to work around this problem. There is a document entitled Installing Wabi for Linux on Non-Caldera Platforms on the Wabi CDROM. An updated version with some Debian-specific information can be found at: http://www.caldera.com/wabi/ We included Wabi in .tgz format to facilitate it's installation on non-Caldera platforms. Officially, Wabi is only supported on Caldera platforms, but so far most people have reported success with installing Wabi on other Linux distributions. This subject has been discussed on the Caldera Wabi User's email list. You can join this list by running: echo subscribe caldera-wabi | mail -s [EMAIL PROTECTED] The two major incompatibilities that have been reported so far are with Metrolink's MetroX X server (version 3.1.2). Wabi causes their server to hang. They know about the problem and are working on it. The other problem reported is that Wabi will not run with the Motif window manager (mwm). I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. The certified version of Quicken that runs on Wabi is version 4.0. I don't think 5.0 will run. Quicken 4.0 works fine. I haven't checked for awhile, but I assume that WINE is still a long ways away. I couldn't tolerate having my Quicken files corrupted! Wine has come a long ways in the last three years that I've been following it. But it has still has a long way to go to match the millions of dollars Sun has had to invest to get Wabi where it is now... Ron -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
Bruce Perens writes: From: Richard G. Roberto [EMAIL PROTECTED] By the by, for reasons that are mostly, but not entirely, technical, Caldera will no longer be basin their OS on RedHat linux. They purchased Linux FT ans will base their next release (Caldera Open Linux or COL) on that. The sales rep I spoke with was unsure as to what package format they would be using. Maybe Bruce and Ian should give them a call? Actually, our next release, Caldera OpenLinux (COL) 1.0 is based primarily on LST's distribution. Some Linux FT technology such as POSIX certification is being integrated into COL. COL currently uses RPM. Nevertheless, we have several Debian fans here at Caldera. If Debian 1.0 was out when we we're making distribution decisions, we might have used it. There's a lot of history and backwards compatibility issues now that keep us on our current Linux distribution course. I am in regular correspondence with LaserMoon. They are interested enough in Debian that they run a few Debian systems. That says nothing about their commercial plans, which they have not disclosed to me, and which of course I wouldn't publish without their permission. Who have you been talking to? Ian Nandhra? He works for Caldera. I think WINE is a technically superior approach to WABI, and I hope the availability of WABI doesn't impede WINE's progress. Why? Wine's approach is quite similar to Wabi's. Anyway, we too would like to see Wine move forward. When it can support the apps that Wabi supports, we won't have to pay Sun a royalty anymore... Until then, Linux users now have the option of purchasing Wabi for Linux. Back when Caldera was a project inside Novell, we were quite hopeful that we could use Wine instead of Wabi. I wrote the (now outdated) Docs/Resources.Z file included in the Wine source. In addition, our group at Novell paid an outside consulting firm lotsa bucks to accelerate the development of Wine. This firm didn't make a lot of progress and in any case, Novell dumped the work they did into the bit bucket. I believe we also bought Bob Amstadt a disk drive for his Wine development machine. Later, we convinced Ray Noorda to buy Willows Software. They've also made progress but still can't run all the apps Wabi can. Anyway, after three years I can look back and see the progress that the Wine group has made. I hope they keep up the good work. But Sun has spent millions of dollars over the last 6 years to get Wabi to its current level of functionality. I feel many people still don't realize the difficulty in cloning MS Windows. But I digress... Ron -- Ron Holt [EMAIL PROTECTED] Caldera, Inc. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
From: Ron Holt [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bruce Perens writes: Who have you been talking to? Ian Nandhra? He works for Caldera. Ian Phillips, if I remember correctly. I think WINE is a technically superior approach to WABI, and I hope the availability of WABI doesn't impede WINE's progress. Why? Wine's approach is quite similar to Wabi's. I'd heard that WABI was usually run with some MS components - in fact you installed Windows into it, although perhaps only to get some desktop stuff like the file browser. Am I mistaken? WINE comes with its own versions of the desktop tools. Bruce -- Bruce Perens K6BP [EMAIL PROTECTED] Finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP public key. PGP fingerprint = 88 6A 15 D0 65 D4 A3 A6 1F 89 6A 76 95 24 87 B3 -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
Bruce Perens writes: From: Ron Holt [EMAIL PROTECTED] Bruce Perens writes: I think WINE is a technically superior approach to WABI, and I hope the availability of WABI doesn't impede WINE's progress. Why? Wine's approach is quite similar to Wabi's. I'd heard that WABI was usually run with some MS components - in fact you installed Windows into it, although perhaps only to get some desktop stuff like the file browser. Am I mistaken? WINE comes with its own versions of the desktop tools. Wabi 1.x was MS free if I remember. Quite a bit of work went into writing replacements for the program manager, file manager, etc. But here's the way Sun explains their current approach: Q: Why must Microsoft Windows be installed with Wabi 2.x? A: SunSoft requires users to install Microsoft Windows with Wabi 2.x to ensure that all of the certified applications will execute properly in the Wabi environment. Some of the applications certified to run under Wabi require the presence of certain Dynamically Linked Libraries (DLLs) that no longer ship with the applications themselves. Instead, such applications rely on DLLs provided by Microsoft Windows. To meet our customer requirements, SunSoft has chosen to invest its engineering resources in improving performance and creating new functionality for Wabi rather than replicating all of the DLLs in MS Windows. This decision has enabled the Wabi development team to concentrate on delivering a high quality product and will permit ongoing development to focus on new features and enhancements. Please note that although the applets (accessory programs) that ship with Microsoft Windows will run under Wabi, the presence of MS Windows does not otherwise affect the number of applications that are able to run under Wabi. The difficulty in cloning OLE 2.0 was one of the main reasons for now requiring MS Windows. Ron -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
On Fri, 22 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: Mike Schmitz wrote: On Thu, 21 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. Consider CBB. It will import quicken data and alerady runs under Linux natively. It lives at http://www2.me.umn.edu/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html The URL doesn't seem to exist. Please check and let me know what it is! -- ...RickM... It comes up when I point my browser it's way. If you mean your nameserver doesn't have it, try http://134.84.197.48/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html/ Good Luck, Mike -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
On Sat, 23 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: On Sat, 23 Nov 1996, Mike Schmitz wrote: Consider CBB. It will import quicken data and alerady runs under Linux natively. It lives at http://www2.me.umn.edu/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html The URL doesn't seem to exist. Please check and let me know what it is! It comes up when I point my browser it's way. If you mean your nameserver doesn't have it, try http://134.84.197.48/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html/ No, the name is resolved OK. It doesn't find the file. I get this error: File Not found The requested URL /~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html was not found on this server. I cut/paste with the mouse, so I didn't make a typing error. ...RickM... Sorry typo :-) http://www2.me.umn.edu/~clolson/cbb/cbb.html I looked at that several times before I caught it. I used cut paste this time to make sure. Mike -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
On Sat, 23 Nov 1996, Mike Schmitz wrote: On Fri, 22 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: Mike Schmitz wrote: On Thu, 21 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. Consider CBB. It will import quicken data and alerady runs under Linux natively. It lives at http://www2.me.umn.edu/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html The URL doesn't seem to exist. Please check and let me know what it is! -- ...RickM... It comes up when I point my browser it's way. If you mean your nameserver doesn't have it, try http://134.84.197.48/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html/ They BOTH work IF you spell the name right! clolson Cheers Carlo *** *Carlo U. Segre * * Department of Biological, Chemical and Physical Sciences * *Illinois Institute of Technology, Chicago, IL 60616 * * Voice: (312) 567-3498 FAX: (312) 567-3494* * [EMAIL PROTECTED] * *** -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
Rick Macdonald ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system?
: Caldera's web page kind of says maybe.
:
: I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without
: booting up DOS/Windows.
:
: I haven't checked for awhile, but I assume that WINE is still
: a long ways away. I couldn't tolerate having my Quicken files
: corrupted!
If Caldera uses RPM then install the Debian RPM Package and the debmake package.
Debmake contains software to install RPM Packages which might enable you to run
WABI under debian.
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Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
On Thu, 21 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. I had a short correspndance with [EMAIL PROTECTED] and their position make sense. They can't guarentee in won't run on anything but CND. This is like somebody asking if the debian lyx package will work on slackware. How should we know? Debian has a package system that can guarentee results that are _proveably_ correct (strange hardware problems, etc. not withstanding). Likewise, Caldera's method of guarenteeing any of their products work is to tell you to install the whole CND distribution. They know what packages are their. Their current packagin system is based on RedHat 2.1, so they don't have dependencies. Caldera told me that it they feel it is a very stable product and I should use my own judgement. They will only provide support for CND customers however. They give you 5 free support calls if you own CND. I priced WABI here in Tokyo at Y40,000 (about $400), but I'm getting the whole CND package+WABI direct from Caldera for $277 shipped, so I'll get support. I'll ask them about producing an installer .deb file after I get it. By the by, for reasons that are mostly, but not entirely, technical, Caldera will no longer be basin their OS on RedHat linux. They purchased Linux FT ans will base their next release (Caldera Open Linux or COL) on that. The sales rep I spoke with was unsure as to what package format they would be using. Maybe Bruce and Ian should give them a call? It would be very cool to have Caldera switch to using .deb format packages, eh? I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. I haven't checked for awhile, but I assume that WINE is still a long ways away. I couldn't tolerate having my Quicken files corrupted! Well, if its anything like Sun's wabi, you need to install windows with it, and install any apps you need to use. Unlike wine, you cant just execute a program a la wine prog.exe. You should be able to set up a virtual drive letter for any mounted filesystem (or directory structure) if memory serves. I haven't used WABI for a while (1.0 or so). I'll let you know when I get it. I'm hoping to mount my ccdata directory via smbmount and use WABI to do CCMail. I don't kow about sending, but I should be able to read. We'll see. Richard G. Roberto [EMAIL PROTECTED] 011-81-3-3437-7967 - Tokyo, Japan -- *** Bear Stearns is not responsible for any recommendation, solicitation, offer or agreement or any information about any transaction, customer account or account activity contained in this communication. *** -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
On Thu, 21 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. I haven't checked for awhile, but I assume that WINE is still a long ways away. I couldn't tolerate having my Quicken files corrupted! -- ...RickM... -- Consider CBB. It will import quicken data and alerady runs under Linux natively. It lives at http://www2.me.umn.edu/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html Mike- -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
Mike Schmitz wrote: On Thu, 21 Nov 1996, Rick Macdonald wrote: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. Consider CBB. It will import quicken data and alerady runs under Linux natively. It lives at http://www2.me.umn.edu/~clolsen/cbb/cbb.html The URL doesn't seem to exist. Please check and let me know what it is! -- ...RickM... -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
From: Richard G. Roberto [EMAIL PROTECTED] By the by, for reasons that are mostly, but not entirely, technical, Caldera will no longer be basin their OS on RedHat linux. They purchased Linux FT ans will base their next release (Caldera Open Linux or COL) on that. The sales rep I spoke with was unsure as to what package format they would be using. Maybe Bruce and Ian should give them a call? I am in regular correspondence with LaserMoon. They are interested enough in Debian that they run a few Debian systems. That says nothing about their commercial plans, which they have not disclosed to me, and which of course I wouldn't publish without their permission. I think WINE is a technically superior approach to WABI, and I hope the availability of WABI doesn't impede WINE's progress. Thanks Bruce -- Bruce Perens K6BP [EMAIL PROTECTED] Finger [EMAIL PROTECTED] for PGP public key. PGP fingerprint = 88 6A 15 D0 65 D4 A3 A6 1F 89 6A 76 95 24 87 B3 -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. I haven't checked for awhile, but I assume that WINE is still a long ways away. I couldn't tolerate having my Quicken files corrupted! -- ...RickM... -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Will Caldera's WABI run on a Debian system?
Rick Macdonald [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Does anybody know if Caldera's WABI will run on a Debian system? Caldera's web page kind of says maybe. I'm tempted to pay the $200 just so I can run Quicken without booting up DOS/Windows. Actually I use Executor for that. It runs Macintosh Quicken 6 in an X window with no problem. I actually own both the Mac and Windows versions of Quicken (don't ask), and I prefer the Mac version. For those that don't know, Executor's a (commercial) Mac emulator that runs many Mac apps at roughly the speed of a 68040 running at half the clock speed of your pentium (YMMV). Details at www.ardi.com. -- Rob -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
