[Declude.JunkMail] Is it possible?
Title: Message Going back to the discussion on Junkmail? Is it possible to simply have a list for "Check First" and then deliver domains that users with that domain will have their userID checked for validity first. If we can check the domains of Hotmail, and Yahoo first and see if they exist before delivering their message our traffic will fall dramatically. I see such lines in our log files quite a lot: - 05:22 06:53 SMTP-(014A) RCPT To:[EMAIL PROTECTED]05:22 06:53 SMTP-(014A) 553 VS10-RT Possible forgery or deactivated due to abuse - see http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/spam/spam-18.html (#5.1.1)05:22 06:53 SMTP-(014A) QUIT - But these are coming after Declude Junkmail rejects their email and this is the bounce message for the notice. Why can't this be done before hand? The idea would not be to check every e-Mail but the e-Mails from a selected list, similar to Blacklist or Whitelist. Regards, Kami
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] Is it possible?
Is it possible to simply have a list for Check First and then deliver domains that users with that domain will have their userID checked for validity first. If we can check the domains of Hotmail, and Yahoo first and see if they exist before delivering their message our traffic will fall dramatically. I see such lines in our log files quite a lot: - 05:22 06:53 SMTP-(014A) RCPT To:mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] 05:22 06:53 SMTP-(014A) 553 VS10-RT Possible forgery or deactivated due to abuse - see http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/spam/spam-18.htmlhttp://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/spam/spam-18.html (#5.1.1) 05:22 06:53 SMTP-(014A) QUIT - But these are coming after Declude Junkmail rejects their email and this is the bounce message for the notice. Are you using the BOUNCE action? If so, you may want to stop using it. Most spammers don't have valid return addresses. Why can't this be done before hand? The problem is that there is no reliable way to find out if an addresses exists or not (and, if you try, it is very resource intensive). The MAILFROM test checks to see whether or not mail can be sent to a given domain. That requires 2 short UDP packets (one out and one in), which are typically handled in less than a second. To try to figure out of the address is valid would require connecting to the mailserver using TCP and initiating a pretend SMTP connection, which would take at least a dozen TCP packets, and would take quite a bit longer. It's not foolproof -- many domains will accept E-mail for users that don't exist, and either bounce it later or not even bounce it (the nobody alias). -Scott --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] DSN:spamattach.eml clarification
The question is regarding messages received with multiple recipients, where one recipient's mail should not be scanned (JunkMail off) and the other should be scanned - and the resulting weight is assigned spamattach? It seems like both recipients receive the You Have Spam email. Is this the expected behavior? And is this the case only when both recipients mail is hosted on our mail server? Regardless of where the mail originates? Just trying to be sure I understand this correctly. This is the expected behavior. The problem is that when CC's are sent, the E-mails are supposed to be identical. So, IMail treats both E-mails the same, and expects both copies to be the same. -Scott --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] DSN:spamattach.eml clarification
Scott, thanks for the quick response. I apologize for being dense, but this only happens when the recipients' mail is hosted on our mail server, yes? Regardless of whether it originated on our mail server or not? Thanks again, David http://www.orcsweb.com/ Powerful Web Hosting Solutions #1 in Service and Support - Original Message - From: R. Scott Perry [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 7:28 PM Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] DSN:spamattach.eml clarification The question is regarding messages received with multiple recipients, where one recipient's mail should not be scanned (JunkMail off) and the other should be scanned - and the resulting weight is assigned spamattach? It seems like both recipients receive the You Have Spam email. Is this the expected behavior? And is this the case only when both recipients mail is hosted on our mail server? Regardless of where the mail originates? Just trying to be sure I understand this correctly. This is the expected behavior. The problem is that when CC's are sent, the E-mails are supposed to be identical. So, IMail treats both E-mails the same, and expects both copies to be the same. -Scott --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com . --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] DSN:spamattach.eml clarification
Scott, thanks for the quick response. I apologize for being dense, but this only happens when the recipients' mail is hosted on our mail server, yes? That is correct. For example, if I sent an E-mail to you that is CC'd to this list, your IMail server will only see the one copy addressed to you, so there will only be one recipient on your server. -Scott --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] DSN:spamattach.eml clarification
Scott, thanks for the quick response. I apologize for being dense, but this only happens when the recipients' mail is hosted on our mail server, yes? That is correct. For example, if I sent an E-mail to you that is CC'd to this list, your IMail server will only see the one copy addressed to you, so there will only be one recipient on your server. -Scott Got it - thanks again. David --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
[Declude.JunkMail] False positives for Spamheaders
Hello... Installed JunkMail last week and I'm getting some interesting spamheader false positives. Some of the more interesting ones are newsletters from: ORACLE, SOPHOS, and SYMANTEC! I must trigger for Spamheaders since there are far too many real spam messages failing only the Spamheader test, so i'll be doing some whitelisting... ...but, all this makes makes me wonder why companies such as these, who of all people should know better, are sending out deficient headers. Any suggestions? Thx, D (just curious) McD. --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] False positives for Spamheaders
Installed JunkMail last week and I'm getting some interesting spamheader false positives. Some of the more interesting ones are newsletters from: ORACLE, SOPHOS, and SYMANTEC! Unfortunately, a lot of web mailers are thrown together (the boss thinks that their web programmer is a programmer, and therefore can write programs, even a mail client). The web programmer doesn't understand RFCs, and voila. Problems. In the case of SPAMHEADERS, that test will fail on E-mail that has legal headers (but ones which are common in spam and rarely ever seen with legitimate mail clients). The most common problem is that the web programmers don't add a Message-ID: header -- the RFCs require that they have one, unless they have a good reason not to and understand the consequences (that their E-mail may get treated as junk). -Scott --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] False positives for Spamheaders
If anyone would understand that then well world be so much easier. Get it when someone like microsoft don't support postmaster and abuse.. Their mailservers don't have any rev dns configured and to boot has invalid headers (this was what I saw on a MSN passport lost password requests that got held in our mails a while back). Whatever you do do not block or delete on JUST spamheaders or badheaders use the weighted system and if a message fail spamheaders only let it pass through. my .02 Thursday, May 23, 2002, 20:00:34, you wrote: DM Hello... DM Installed JunkMail last week and I'm getting some interesting spamheader DM false positives. Some of the more interesting ones are newsletters from: DM ORACLE, SOPHOS, and SYMANTEC! DM I must trigger for Spamheaders since there are far too many real spam DM messages failing only the Spamheader test, so i'll be doing some DM whitelisting... DM ...but, all this makes makes me wonder why companies such as these, who of DM all people should know better, are sending out deficient headers. DM Any suggestions? DM Thx, DM D (just curious) McD. DM --- DM [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] DM --- DM This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To DM unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and DM type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail DM [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web DM site at http://www.declude.com . DM --- DM [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Best regards, Eje mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] --- The Family Entertainment Network http://www.fament.com Phone : 620-231- Fax : 620-231-4066 - Your Full Time Professionals - --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
Re: [Declude.JunkMail] False positives for Spamheaders
Yup. I doubt I'll ever do any deleting. Except for one president who insists I HOLD for him (damn the torpedoes, boy!), everyone else gets SUBJECT for everything except Badheaders and Routing, which I wait to see if they Weight10 from any other failure before they get SUBJECT. That MS info is news to me, but I wouldn't put it passed 'em (damn the torpedoes, boy!). D. At 08:37 PM 5/23/2002 -0500, you wrote: If anyone would understand that then well world be so much easier. Get it when someone like microsoft don't support postmaster and abuse.. Their mailservers don't have any rev dns configured and to boot has invalid headers (this was what I saw on a MSN passport lost password requests that got held in our mails a while back). Whatever you do do not block or delete on JUST spamheaders or badheaders use the weighted system and if a message fail spamheaders only let it pass through. my .02 Thursday, May 23, 2002, 20:00:34, you wrote: DM Hello... DM Installed JunkMail last week and I'm getting some interesting spamheader DM false positives. Some of the more interesting ones are newsletters from: DM ORACLE, SOPHOS, and SYMANTEC! DM I must trigger for Spamheaders since there are far too many real spam DM messages failing only the Spamheader test, so i'll be doing some DM whitelisting... DM ...but, all this makes makes me wonder why companies such as these, who of DM all people should know better, are sending out deficient headers. DM Any suggestions? DM Thx, DM D (just curious) McD. DM --- DM [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] DM --- DM This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To DM unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and DM type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail DM [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web DM site at http://www.declude.com . DM --- DM [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Best regards, Eje mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] --- The Family Entertainment Network http://www.fament.com Phone : 620-231- Fax : 620-231-4066 - Your Full Time Professionals - --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com . --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
RE: [Declude.JunkMail] False positives for Spamheaders
We have the exact same problem.. We've been running in SUBJECT mode and I've got everything tuned perfectly except list servers! All of our users are forwarding email to me saying that this is real email and not SPAM: Since I'm dealing with a single business in front of an Exchange server, we're going to have to decide if we want to block spam or want to allow users to subscribe to lists. Unfortunately, I think most people get on Spam lists because the join lists. FWIW, Microsoft (at least the UK sites) don't support REVDNS, Postmaster, or Abuse. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Dale McDiarmid Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 10:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Declude.JunkMail] False positives for Spamheaders Yup. I doubt I'll ever do any deleting. Except for one president who insists I HOLD for him (damn the torpedoes, boy!), everyone else gets SUBJECT for everything except Badheaders and Routing, which I wait to see if they Weight10 from any other failure before they get SUBJECT. That MS info is news to me, but I wouldn't put it passed 'em (damn the torpedoes, boy!). D. At 08:37 PM 5/23/2002 -0500, you wrote: If anyone would understand that then well world be so much easier. Get it when someone like microsoft don't support postmaster and abuse.. Their mailservers don't have any rev dns configured and to boot has invalid headers (this was what I saw on a MSN passport lost password requests that got held in our mails a while back). Whatever you do do not block or delete on JUST spamheaders or badheaders use the weighted system and if a message fail spamheaders only let it pass through. my .02 Thursday, May 23, 2002, 20:00:34, you wrote: DM Hello... DM Installed JunkMail last week and I'm getting some interesting DM spamheader false positives. Some of the more interesting ones are DM newsletters from: ORACLE, SOPHOS, and SYMANTEC! DM I must trigger for Spamheaders since there are far too many real DM spam messages failing only the Spamheader test, so i'll be doing DM some whitelisting... DM ...but, all this makes makes me wonder why companies such as these, who of DM all people should know better, are sending out deficient headers. DM Any suggestions? DM Thx, DM D (just curious) McD. DM --- DM [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] DM --- DM This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To DM unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type DM unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail DM [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at DM http://www.declude.com . DM --- DM [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Best regards, Eje mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] --- The Family Entertainment Network http://www.fament.com Phone : 620-231- Fax : 620-231-4066 - Your Full Time Professionals - --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com . --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com . --- [This E-mail was scanned for viruses by Declude Virus (http://www.declude.com)] --- This E-mail came from the Declude.JunkMail mailing list. To unsubscribe, just send an E-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and type unsubscribe Declude.JunkMail. You can E-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] for assistance. You can visit our web site at http://www.declude.com .
