Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Another one that came up during the prep time (and repost of the older Erasmus one as they strengthe each other): - Erasmus program for open source -- have 6 months of bursary / grant to work on open source near the tail end of your studies - at a facility large enough to be able to build a pool of talent / ongoing experience, habits and culture & convey culture / capture. - Open source developer 'in residence'; with a salary & relocation / temporary housing stipend - e.g. the concept where an open source developer can work for 6 to 24 month in an appropriate setting to work on open source in the public interret - potentially combined with above to also have a pool of 'mentors' physically available - Travel fund which lets any student in STEM visit, during thier study, twice an open source event (e.g. like FOSDEM) and -also- funds any person with an accepted talk or workshop. Just to add to the list of 'what is next'. With kind regards, Dw - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
All, As Michiel cannot be present - may make sense for those that participate to also have a look at their analysis on: https://blog.nlnetlabs.nl/open-source-software-vs-the-cyber-resilience-act/ as it appears that that topic may well get introduced by the various moderators. With kind regards, Dw
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi, As I didn't receive any update, I didn't book travel to Brussels. Thanks DW for preparing the document ! I was swamped in several meetings and not able to join the call, sorry about that. Regards JB On Tue, Nov 29, 2022 at 7:40 PM Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote: > > Folks, > > Several of us are now either on panels or going to this event (at least 4 in > 3 panels; or petty much every panel if I take the 'Friends of Apache' a bit > more liberal). > > I understood from Roman that, while he will be there, the ASF will not have > any formal position at this event - or a specific message they want to get > across. But I've not managed to prepare something with him in an apache > contrext. > > So would it make sense if those that go to have a short chat tomorrow > evening, 1900 CET time in a general 'friends of open source and apache' sort > of way ? Just to make sure that we more or less prioritise what we think is > important / not create noice that dillutes something we all agree on. > > I've created: > > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a > > to prepare a bit. I've gathered what I read on > > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JuPPcktiLpr9ei3r9n0JDhP2UTW7s5suLt_XAtmAeQU/edit?usp=sharing > > And would be nice to know who is there (happy to add you to a participants > signal with limited life-time/auto-delete chat if you DM me a number). > > With kind regards, > > Dw > > > > EU-Workshop -- Informal prep Chat for Friends of Open Source and Apache > Scheduled: 30 Nov 2022 at 18:45 to 19:45, CET > Location: > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Apologies, unable to make this, was planning to, but work meetings intervened. Gj On Wed, Nov 30, 2022 at 12:11 PM Gilles Sadowski wrote: > > Hello. > > Le mar. 29 nov. 2022 à 19:40, Dirk-Willem van Gulik > a écrit : > > > > Folks, > > > > Several of us are now either on panels or going to this event (at least 4 > > in 3 panels; or petty much every panel if I take the 'Friends of Apache' a > > bit more liberal). > > > > I understood from Roman that, while he will be there, the ASF will not have > > any formal position at this event - or a specific message they want to get > > across. But I've not managed to prepare something with him in an apache > > contrext. > > > > So would it make sense if those that go to have a short chat tomorrow > > evening, 1900 CET time in a general 'friends of open source and apache' > > sort of way ? Just to make sure that we more or less prioritise what we > > think is important / not create noice that dillutes something we all agree > > on. > > > > I've created: > > > > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a > > > > to prepare a bit. I've gathered what I read on > > > > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JuPPcktiLpr9ei3r9n0JDhP2UTW7s5suLt_XAtmAeQU/edit?usp=sharing > > Perhaps a word that should be mentioned there is "patent" (as a reminder > of what not to do if FLOSS is considered beneficial for society). > > > > > And would be nice to know who is there (happy to add you to a participants > > signal with limited life-time/auto-delete chat if you DM me a number). > > I'll attend the conference next Friday. > [It will be a rare (for me) occasion to meet ASF people in person.] > > > > > With kind regards, > > > > Dw > > > > > > > > EU-Workshop -- Informal prep Chat for Friends of Open Source and Apache > > Scheduled: 30 Nov 2022 at 18:45 to 19:45, CET > > Unfortunately, I won't be able to connect at that time. > > Best regards, > Gilles > > > Location: > > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hello. Le mar. 29 nov. 2022 à 19:40, Dirk-Willem van Gulik a écrit : > > Folks, > > Several of us are now either on panels or going to this event (at least 4 in > 3 panels; or petty much every panel if I take the 'Friends of Apache' a bit > more liberal). > > I understood from Roman that, while he will be there, the ASF will not have > any formal position at this event - or a specific message they want to get > across. But I've not managed to prepare something with him in an apache > contrext. > > So would it make sense if those that go to have a short chat tomorrow > evening, 1900 CET time in a general 'friends of open source and apache' sort > of way ? Just to make sure that we more or less prioritise what we think is > important / not create noice that dillutes something we all agree on. > > I've created: > > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a > > to prepare a bit. I've gathered what I read on > > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JuPPcktiLpr9ei3r9n0JDhP2UTW7s5suLt_XAtmAeQU/edit?usp=sharing Perhaps a word that should be mentioned there is "patent" (as a reminder of what not to do if FLOSS is considered beneficial for society). > > And would be nice to know who is there (happy to add you to a participants > signal with limited life-time/auto-delete chat if you DM me a number). I'll attend the conference next Friday. [It will be a rare (for me) occasion to meet ASF people in person.] > > With kind regards, > > Dw > > > > EU-Workshop -- Informal prep Chat for Friends of Open Source and Apache > Scheduled: 30 Nov 2022 at 18:45 to 19:45, CET Unfortunately, I won't be able to connect at that time. Best regards, Gilles > Location: > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Good for me. I **might** be late 15 minutes (but I will try to finish my earlier call a bit before to be on time. On Tue, Nov 29, 2022 at 7:40 PM Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote: > > Folks, > > Several of us are now either on panels or going to this event (at least 4 in > 3 panels; or petty much every panel if I take the 'Friends of Apache' a bit > more liberal). > > I understood from Roman that, while he will be there, the ASF will not have > any formal position at this event - or a specific message they want to get > across. But I've not managed to prepare something with him in an apache > contrext. > > So would it make sense if those that go to have a short chat tomorrow > evening, 1900 CET time in a general 'friends of open source and apache' sort > of way ? Just to make sure that we more or less prioritise what we think is > important / not create noice that dillutes something we all agree on. > > I've created: > > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a > > to prepare a bit. I've gathered what I read on > > https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JuPPcktiLpr9ei3r9n0JDhP2UTW7s5suLt_XAtmAeQU/edit?usp=sharing > > And would be nice to know who is there (happy to add you to a participants > signal with limited life-time/auto-delete chat if you DM me a number). > > With kind regards, > > Dw > > > > EU-Workshop -- Informal prep Chat for Friends of Open Source and Apache > Scheduled: 30 Nov 2022 at 18:45 to 19:45, CET > Location: > https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Folks,Several of us are now either on panels or going to this event (at least 4 in 3 panels; or petty much every panel if I take the 'Friends of Apache' a bit more liberal).I understood from Roman that, while he will be there, the ASF will not have any formal position at this event - or a specific message they want to get across. But I've not managed to prepare something with him in an apache contrext.So would it make sense if those that go to have a short chat tomorrow evening, 1900 CET time in a general 'friends of open source and apache' sort of way ? Just to make sure that we more or less prioritise what we think is important / not create noice that dillutes something we all agree on.I've created: https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410ato prepare a bit. I've gathered what I read on https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JuPPcktiLpr9ei3r9n0JDhP2UTW7s5suLt_XAtmAeQU/edit?usp=sharingAnd would be nice to know who is there (happy to add you to a participants signal with limited life-time/auto-delete chat if you DM me a number).With kind regards,DwEU-Workshop -- Informal prep Chat for Friends of Open Source and ApacheScheduled: 30 Nov 2022 at 18:45 to 19:45, CETLocation: https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410aBEGIN:VCALENDAR CALSCALE:GREGORIAN VERSION:2.0 X-WR-CALNAME:EU-Workshop -- Informal prep Chat for Friends of Open Sourc e and Apache METHOD:PUBLISH PRODID:-//Apple Inc.//macOS 12.6//EN BEGIN:VTIMEZONE TZID:Europe/Amsterdam BEGIN:DAYLIGHT TZOFFSETFROM:+0100 RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=3;BYDAY=-1SU DTSTART:19810329T02 TZNAME:CEST TZOFFSETTO:+0200 END:DAYLIGHT BEGIN:STANDARD TZOFFSETFROM:+0200 RRULE:FREQ=YEARLY;BYMONTH=10;BYDAY=-1SU DTSTART:19961027T03 TZNAME:CET TZOFFSETTO:+0100 END:STANDARD END:VTIMEZONE BEGIN:VEVENT UID:2250CF31-4F3F-4961-B5C6-1A273DB39CA6 TRANSP:OPAQUE CREATED:20221129T182829Z DTEND;TZID=Europe/Amsterdam:20221130T194500 X-APPLE-TRAVEL-ADVISORY-BEHAVIOR:AUTOMATIC SUMMARY:EU-Workshop -- Informal prep Chat for Friends of Open Source and Apache LAST-MODIFIED:20221129T182853Z DTSTAMP:20221129T182847Z DTSTART;TZID=Europe/Amsterdam:20221130T184500 LOCATION:https://meet.jit.si/moderated/6a0e28986b76ede1082453b5db022b71a 6e1de734c93d138e79b5ab3c08f410a\n SEQUENCE:1 END:VEVENT END:VCALENDAR
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
On Sat, Nov 5, 2022 at 6:27 PM Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > I am also scheduled for the "Workshop 3.4 Exploring practical solutions to > ensure long term sustainability of open source software". I'm now signed up to be on the: "1.4: Identifying, fixing and managing critical open source software used by European Public Services." > Geertjan - agree on both - beer a day before and a zoom call to prepare - > likely with Molly/Joe involved to get their help on messaging, and view. +1. Should we pick up a venue as well? > Related to what DW wrote - yep. We should always speak as individuals, but > I think we can be better prepared and not caught by "press" if we got some > kind of briefing from Molly/Joe. I have no experience speaking at EU > forums, but I remember when I was speaking at a big banking conference when > I was in a small Mobile Payment startup, I appreciated a lot all the > briefing, help and suggestions from the people with PR/Marketing experience > and I think that was one of the best prepared talks of mine. > (I actually quit the startup soon after because I realized at that very > conference that what our CEO was selling us internally was a complete > dreampipe, but that's a completely different story :D). > > Best time for me is Tuesday, Thursday or Friday next week - anything > before 3pm CET should work. Works for me as well! Thanks, Roman. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
I am also scheduled for the "Workshop 3.4 Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability of open source software". Geertjan - agree on both - beer a day before and a zoom call to prepare - likely with Molly/Joe involved to get their help on messaging, and view. Related to what DW wrote - yep. We should always speak as individuals, but I think we can be better prepared and not caught by "press" if we got some kind of briefing from Molly/Joe. I have no experience speaking at EU forums, but I remember when I was speaking at a big banking conference when I was in a small Mobile Payment startup, I appreciated a lot all the briefing, help and suggestions from the people with PR/Marketing experience and I think that was one of the best prepared talks of mine. (I actually quit the startup soon after because I realized at that very conference that what our CEO was selling us internally was a complete dreampipe, but that's a completely different story :D). Best time for me is Tuesday, Thursday or Friday next week - anything before 3pm CET should work. J. On Fri, Nov 4, 2022 at 7:50 PM Geertjan Wielenga wrote: > I’m scheduled for the panel on open source and the public sector. > > Maybe everyone from Apache who will be involved in one way or another > should do a Zoom call just to chat about it all, see where the overlaps and > cross-panel strategies are, and have drinks before/after the event itself > in Brussels, I’d be very keen for both. > > Gj > > On Fri, 4 Nov 2022 at 10:58, Joe Brockmeier wrote: > > > On Fri, Oct 28, 2022 at 11:42 AM Dirk-Willem van Gulik > > wrote: > > > > > > On 28 Oct 2022, at 17:27, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > > > > > Absolutely - that is great to have such support. > > > > > > > > I was a bit afraid that my points might be much more "private" than > > > > the "ASF" voice in general so having the opportunity to get comms > > > > involvement for such a potentially "wavy" event is cool. > > > > > > Well - regardless - unless we manage to create something like a > position > > paper & get board approval -- any interaction at this level will always > be > > on a personal basis. > > > > > > And even then - it is just that paper that represents the view of the > > ASF; not a person. > > > > > > I.e. one cannot speak on behalf of the ASF; only talk about what you > > personally think would work well according to your view on the apache > > community. > > > > Agreed that these interactions are not "official" and I'd hope anybody > > participating would be careful to mention their statements, etc. are > > as individuals who are members/contributors (whatever is appropriate) > > and not official statements on behalf of the foundation. (Unless there > > is one.) > > > > That said... the more we can speak with one voice and prep folks, the > > better. > > > > > > > > -- > > Joe Brockmeier > > Vice President Marketing & Publicity > > j...@apache.org > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > >
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
On Fri, Oct 28, 2022 at 11:42 AM Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote: > > On 28 Oct 2022, at 17:27, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > Absolutely - that is great to have such support. > > > > I was a bit afraid that my points might be much more "private" than > > the "ASF" voice in general so having the opportunity to get comms > > involvement for such a potentially "wavy" event is cool. > > Well - regardless - unless we manage to create something like a position > paper & get board approval -- any interaction at this level will always be on > a personal basis. > > And even then - it is just that paper that represents the view of the ASF; > not a person. > > I.e. one cannot speak on behalf of the ASF; only talk about what you > personally think would work well according to your view on the apache > community. Agreed that these interactions are not "official" and I'd hope anybody participating would be careful to mention their statements, etc. are as individuals who are members/contributors (whatever is appropriate) and not official statements on behalf of the foundation. (Unless there is one.) That said... the more we can speak with one voice and prep folks, the better. -- Joe Brockmeier Vice President Marketing & Publicity j...@apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
On 28 Oct 2022, at 17:27, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > Absolutely - that is great to have such support. > > I was a bit afraid that my points might be much more "private" than > the "ASF" voice in general so having the opportunity to get comms > involvement for such a potentially "wavy" event is cool. Well - regardless - unless we manage to create something like a position paper & get board approval -- any interaction at this level will always be on a personal basis. And even then - it is just that paper that represents the view of the ASF; not a person. I.e. one cannot speak on behalf of the ASF; only talk about what you personally think would work well according to your view on the apache community. Dw - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
t; > > > > Dw > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 27 Oct 2022, at 12:25, Jean-Baptiste Onofré > > wrote: > > > > > > > > By the way, I'm pretty interested to participate on these workshops: > > > > > > > > 1.1 - Open Source Processors for the Cloud Continuum > > > > 2.1 - Open Source Software and Cloud Services and Applications: On the > > > > way to more interoperable cloud services > > > > 3.4 - Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability > > > > of open source software > > > > > > > > I chatted today with some Eclipse Foundation guys: they plan to be > > > > there as well. > > > > > > > > Thoughts ? > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > JB > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Jarek Potiuk > > wrote: > > > >> > > > >> Yep. Thanks DW :) > > > >> > > > >> On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz > > > >> wrote: > > > >>> > > > >>> Hi all, > > > >>> > > > >>> Thanks for taking this coordination over. > > > >>> > > > >>> They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the > > industry. It seems this is not the case. > > > >>> > > > >>> But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting > > as panelist on these sessions. > > > >>> So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. > > > >>> > > > >>> And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an > > ApacheCon CFP and submit ideas a minute before the deadline. > > > >>> > > > >>> Chris > > > >>> > > > >>> From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik > > > >>> Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 > > > >>> To: dev@community.apache.org > > > >>> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source > > Sustainability > > > >>> I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to > > be that organised). > > > >>> > > > >>> Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. > > But suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. > > > >>> > > > >>> That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and > > participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to inform > > itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show up, > > contribute meaningfully, constructively and have knowledge/information to > > bring. > > > >>> > > > >>> Dw > > > >>> > > > >>>> On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > >>>> > > > >>>> Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or > > is > > > >>>> it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > > >>>> > > > >>>> On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > > > >>>> wrote: > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> Hi all, > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, > > that we want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing > > to participate. > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> Chris > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré > > > >>>>> Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 > > > >>>>> To: dev@community.apache.org > > > >>>>> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source > > Sustainability > > > >>>>> Hi Chris, > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> I can be there as well if needed. > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> Regards > > > >>>>> JB > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz > > > >>>>> wrote: > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Hi all, > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it > > seems the European Commission is continuing to try to understand > > open-source. > > > >>>>>> In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of > > workshops on a one-day session: > > > >>>>>> > > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the > > corporates to take over the narrative and explain to the European > > commission how Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > > > >>>>>> I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> What do you folks think? > > > >>>>>> > > > >>>>>> Chris > > > >>>>> > > > >>>>> > > - > > > >>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > > >>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > - > > > >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > > >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > >>>> > > > >>>> > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >>> - > > > >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > > >>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > >> > > > >> - > > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > > >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > >> > > > > > > > > - > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
rs (e.g. in apache). Nor in the interst of any corporate > funders (period) -- e.g. in cases where sponsors buy board-seats or > strategic control of open source houses. > > > > But secondly - that of ensuring that a sufficiently wide body of people > builds up the capability to participate with, and over time replace, this > relatively small group of core developers. Especially in the light of SaaS > and similar technologie which curtails how many people are close enough to > the coal face to pick up the needed knowledge. Or at companies; where the > existence of readily available large solutions makes picking up on that > skill less needed. > > > > So in a way to break through a `fatal' aspect of well build technology - > that you do not need to know about it anymore. > > > > => so. would like to argue for physical places, of sufficient > size to build the right human culture, to work, learn and build these > critical skills. > > > > and that this is _NOT_ the problem of open source - but the > responsibility of society. > > > > This is not something uncommon - we have plenty of industrial areas > where countries build & keep strategic and tactical capcity. And in Europe > - this is increasingly done pan-european. > > > > 3) "Software matters too much" > > > > Software matters too much for communities and societies -- so I would > personally not want to allow large corporate interest buy themselves > control of this. > > > > I am worried about a self amplifying and 'fiscally welcome' pattern; > where we blame some industry for a problem in society. And were we then > expect 'them' to resolve this; or pay for something as some sort of > penance. But in return then effectively allows the existing and richest > players get even more control over the playing field. > > > > As opposed to letting society set & enforce their vision of what is > right. And either pick up the tab for that - or tax/fine those that do not > comply -and- then allow society to choose where to invest that money in. > Rather than let the inmates run the asylum & direct the funding. > > > > Apache is in a vey good position here - we are one of the defacto > industry bodies - but unlike most - we are a community of (people) > volunteer(ed by their employers dujour) - not a set of companies. In many > ways we are more like the IEEE, the IETF, the institute of chartered > engineers or a medical society - -than say, the GSMA or the W3C. > > > > And we have a stellar track record when it comes to resisting & > neutering such corporate funding / direction attemts. > > > > But the corollary/downside of that is that we're also ill equipped to do > the `boring grunt work' that is often needed once things become so key to > society. Such as secretariat services, testing, certification, measuring > quality & reporting, etc. > > > > => so would like to argue that this is a role for society; and > that we need places where our community can meet which those that want this > - and where those that want this participate in our community. But without > funding `through us' troubling the waters. > > > > Just like we see in many other industries - where some institute simply > acts as the coordinator for such information in the public context. And > this also addresses interoperability and standards. > > > > With kind regards, > > > > Dw > > > > > > > > > > > On 27 Oct 2022, at 12:25, Jean-Baptiste Onofré > wrote: > > > > > > By the way, I'm pretty interested to participate on these workshops: > > > > > > 1.1 - Open Source Processors for the Cloud Continuum > > > 2.1 - Open Source Software and Cloud Services and Applications: On the > > > way to more interoperable cloud services > > > 3.4 - Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability > > > of open source software > > > > > > I chatted today with some Eclipse Foundation guys: they plan to be > > > there as well. > > > > > > Thoughts ? > > > > > > Regards > > > JB > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Jarek Potiuk > wrote: > > >> > > >> Yep. Thanks DW :) > > >> > > >> On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz > > >> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> Hi all, > > >>> > > >>> Thanks for taking this coordination over. > > >>> > > >>> They did disarm my worries, that the
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
=> so. would like to argue for physical places, of sufficient size > to build the right human culture, to work, learn and build these critical > skills. > > and that this is _NOT_ the problem of open source - but the > responsibility of society. > > This is not something uncommon - we have plenty of industrial areas where > countries build & keep strategic and tactical capcity. And in Europe - this > is increasingly done pan-european. > > 3) "Software matters too much" > > Software matters too much for communities and societies -- so I would > personally not want to allow large corporate interest buy themselves control > of this. > > I am worried about a self amplifying and 'fiscally welcome' pattern; where we > blame some industry for a problem in society. And were we then expect 'them' > to resolve this; or pay for something as some sort of penance. But in return > then effectively allows the existing and richest players get even more > control over the playing field. > > As opposed to letting society set & enforce their vision of what is right. > And either pick up the tab for that - or tax/fine those that do not comply > -and- then allow society to choose where to invest that money in. Rather > than let the inmates run the asylum & direct the funding. > > Apache is in a vey good position here - we are one of the defacto industry > bodies - but unlike most - we are a community of (people) volunteer(ed by > their employers dujour) - not a set of companies. In many ways we are more > like the IEEE, the IETF, the institute of chartered engineers or a medical > society - -than say, the GSMA or the W3C. > > And we have a stellar track record when it comes to resisting & neutering > such corporate funding / direction attemts. > > But the corollary/downside of that is that we're also ill equipped to do the > `boring grunt work' that is often needed once things become so key to > society. Such as secretariat services, testing, certification, measuring > quality & reporting, etc. > > => so would like to argue that this is a role for society; and that > we need places where our community can meet which those that want this - and > where those that want this participate in our community. But without funding > `through us' troubling the waters. > > Just like we see in many other industries - where some institute simply acts > as the coordinator for such information in the public context. And this also > addresses interoperability and standards. > > With kind regards, > > Dw > > > > > > On 27 Oct 2022, at 12:25, Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote: > > > > By the way, I'm pretty interested to participate on these workshops: > > > > 1.1 - Open Source Processors for the Cloud Continuum > > 2.1 - Open Source Software and Cloud Services and Applications: On the > > way to more interoperable cloud services > > 3.4 - Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability > > of open source software > > > > I chatted today with some Eclipse Foundation guys: they plan to be > > there as well. > > > > Thoughts ? > > > > Regards > > JB > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Jarek Potiuk wrote: > >> > >> Yep. Thanks DW :) > >> > >> On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> Hi all, > >>> > >>> Thanks for taking this coordination over. > >>> > >>> They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the > >>> industry. It seems this is not the case. > >>> > >>> But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting as > >>> panelist on these sessions. > >>> So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. > >>> > >>> And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an ApacheCon CFP > >>> and submit ideas a minute before the deadline. > >>> > >>> Chris > >>> > >>> From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik > >>> Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 > >>> To: dev@community.apache.org > >>> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source > >>> Sustainability > >>> I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be > >>> that organised). > >>> > >>> Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But > >>> suspect we need to do this in the next hours an
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
ded once things become so key to society. Such as secretariat services, testing, certification, measuring quality & reporting, etc. => so would like to argue that this is a role for society; and that we need places where our community can meet which those that want this - and where those that want this participate in our community. But without funding `through us' troubling the waters. Just like we see in many other industries - where some institute simply acts as the coordinator for such information in the public context. And this also addresses interoperability and standards. With kind regards, Dw > On 27 Oct 2022, at 12:25, Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote: > > By the way, I'm pretty interested to participate on these workshops: > > 1.1 - Open Source Processors for the Cloud Continuum > 2.1 - Open Source Software and Cloud Services and Applications: On the > way to more interoperable cloud services > 3.4 - Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability > of open source software > > I chatted today with some Eclipse Foundation guys: they plan to be > there as well. > > Thoughts ? > > Regards > JB > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Jarek Potiuk wrote: >> >> Yep. Thanks DW :) >> >> On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> Thanks for taking this coordination over. >>> >>> They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the industry. >>> It seems this is not the case. >>> >>> But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting as >>> panelist on these sessions. >>> So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. >>> >>> And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an ApacheCon CFP >>> and submit ideas a minute before the deadline. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik >>> Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 >>> To: dev@community.apache.org >>> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability >>> I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be that >>> organised). >>> >>> Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But >>> suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. >>> >>> That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and >>> participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to inform >>> itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show up, >>> contribute meaningfully, constructively and have knowledge/information to >>> bring. >>> >>> Dw >>> >>>> On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: >>>> >>>> Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is >>>> it a generic address we should find ourselves? >>>> >>>> On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi all, >>>>> >>>>> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that >>>>> we want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to >>>>> participate. >>>>> >>>>> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. >>>>> >>>>> Chris >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré >>>>> Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 >>>>> To: dev@community.apache.org >>>>> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source >>>>> Sustainability >>>>> Hi Chris, >>>>> >>>>> I can be there as well if needed. >>>>> >>>>> Regards >>>>> JB >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi all, >>>>>> >>>>>> as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems >>>>>> the European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. >>>>>> In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on >>>>>> a one-day session: >>>>>> https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability >>>>>> >>>>>>
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi Jarek, 1.1 - Agree, my proposal is more attending 2.1 - it's interesting. As Karaf is also cloud runtime, I think we have some fuel here. I can talk to Funs from Cloudstack. I think it would be great to have both the stack standpoint, and the runtime/application standpoint as well. 3.4 - OK I leave it to you then Regards JB On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 12:46 PM Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > 3.4. I will be writing a (short) proposal on what I would like to > cover and share it here before sending it to them (I got contact from > DW). > > 1.1 - is a bit vague to me (and I would rather be a more passive > listener as I am not sure if I have anything to come up with) > 2.1 - is interesting, but I think it would be great if someone from > cloudstack takes an active part in it. There were some really > interesting talks from Cloudstack at ApacheCon's last day and I had > nice conversations there - they have a really interesting stakeholder > setup and in Cloudstack and possibly that would be a great input. > Maybe someone from cloudstack is listening ? Or if not I can reach out > to the speakers I spoke to I think :) > > J, > > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 12:26 PM Jean-Baptiste Onofré > wrote: > > > > By the way, I'm pretty interested to participate on these workshops: > > > > 1.1 - Open Source Processors for the Cloud Continuum > > 2.1 - Open Source Software and Cloud Services and Applications: On the > > way to more interoperable cloud services > > 3.4 - Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability > > of open source software > > > > I chatted today with some Eclipse Foundation guys: they plan to be > > there as well. > > > > Thoughts ? > > > > Regards > > JB > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > > > > Yep. Thanks DW :) > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > > > > Thanks for taking this coordination over. > > > > > > > > They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the > > > > industry. It seems this is not the case. > > > > > > > > But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting as > > > > panelist on these sessions. > > > > So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. > > > > > > > > And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an ApacheCon > > > > CFP and submit ideas a minute before the deadline. > > > > > > > > Chris > > > > > > > > From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik > > > > Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 > > > > To: dev@community.apache.org > > > > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source > > > > Sustainability > > > > I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be > > > > that organised). > > > > > > > > Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But > > > > suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. > > > > > > > > That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and > > > > participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to > > > > inform itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show > > > > up, contribute meaningfully, constructively and have > > > > knowledge/information to bring. > > > > > > > > Dw > > > > > > > > > On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is > > > > > it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > > > > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> Hi all, > > > > >> > > > > >> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, > > > > >> that we want to attend and which seessions, which people would be > > > > >> willing to participate. > > > > >> > > > > >> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > > > > >> > > > > >> Chris > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré >
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
3.4. I will be writing a (short) proposal on what I would like to cover and share it here before sending it to them (I got contact from DW). 1.1 - is a bit vague to me (and I would rather be a more passive listener as I am not sure if I have anything to come up with) 2.1 - is interesting, but I think it would be great if someone from cloudstack takes an active part in it. There were some really interesting talks from Cloudstack at ApacheCon's last day and I had nice conversations there - they have a really interesting stakeholder setup and in Cloudstack and possibly that would be a great input. Maybe someone from cloudstack is listening ? Or if not I can reach out to the speakers I spoke to I think :) J, On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 12:26 PM Jean-Baptiste Onofré wrote: > > By the way, I'm pretty interested to participate on these workshops: > > 1.1 - Open Source Processors for the Cloud Continuum > 2.1 - Open Source Software and Cloud Services and Applications: On the > way to more interoperable cloud services > 3.4 - Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability > of open source software > > I chatted today with some Eclipse Foundation guys: they plan to be > there as well. > > Thoughts ? > > Regards > JB > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > > Yep. Thanks DW :) > > > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz > > wrote: > > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > > Thanks for taking this coordination over. > > > > > > They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the > > > industry. It seems this is not the case. > > > > > > But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting as > > > panelist on these sessions. > > > So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. > > > > > > And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an ApacheCon CFP > > > and submit ideas a minute before the deadline. > > > > > > Chris > > > > > > From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik > > > Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 > > > To: dev@community.apache.org > > > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source > > > Sustainability > > > I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be > > > that organised). > > > > > > Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But > > > suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. > > > > > > That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and > > > participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to > > > inform itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show > > > up, contribute meaningfully, constructively and have > > > knowledge/information to bring. > > > > > > Dw > > > > > > > On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > > > > > > Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is > > > > it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > > > > > > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > > > > wrote: > > > >> > > > >> Hi all, > > > >> > > > >> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, > > > >> that we want to attend and which seessions, which people would be > > > >> willing to participate. > > > >> > > > >> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > > > >> > > > >> Chris > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré > > > >> Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 > > > >> To: dev@community.apache.org > > > >> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source > > > >> Sustainability > > > >> Hi Chris, > > > >> > > > >> I can be there as well if needed. > > > >> > > > >> Regards > > > >> JB > > > >> > > > >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz > > > >> wrote: > > > >>> > > > >>> Hi all, > > > >>> > > > >>> as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it > > > >>> seems the European Commission is continuing to try to understand > > > >>> open-source. &
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
By the way, I'm pretty interested to participate on these workshops: 1.1 - Open Source Processors for the Cloud Continuum 2.1 - Open Source Software and Cloud Services and Applications: On the way to more interoperable cloud services 3.4 - Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability of open source software I chatted today with some Eclipse Foundation guys: they plan to be there as well. Thoughts ? Regards JB On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 11:38 AM Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > Yep. Thanks DW :) > > On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz > wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > Thanks for taking this coordination over. > > > > They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the industry. > > It seems this is not the case. > > > > But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting as > > panelist on these sessions. > > So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. > > > > And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an ApacheCon CFP > > and submit ideas a minute before the deadline. > > > > Chris > > > > From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik > > Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 > > To: dev@community.apache.org > > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability > > I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be that > > organised). > > > > Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But > > suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. > > > > That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and > > participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to inform > > itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show up, > > contribute meaningfully, constructively and have knowledge/information to > > bring. > > > > Dw > > > > > On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > > > > Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is > > > it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > > > > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > > > wrote: > > >> > > >> Hi all, > > >> > > >> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that > > >> we want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to > > >> participate. > > >> > > >> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > > >> > > >> Chris > > >> > > >> > > >> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré > > >> Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 > > >> To: dev@community.apache.org > > >> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source > > >> Sustainability > > >> Hi Chris, > > >> > > >> I can be there as well if needed. > > >> > > >> Regards > > >> JB > > >> > > >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz > > >> wrote: > > >>> > > >>> Hi all, > > >>> > > >>> as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems > > >>> the European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > > >>> In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on > > >>> a one-day session: > > >>> https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > >>> > > >>> As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the > > >>> corporates to take over the narrative and explain to the European > > >>> commission how Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > > >>> I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > >>> > > >>> What do you folks think? > > >>> > > >>> Chris > > >> > > >> - > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > > > - > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Yep. Thanks DW :) On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 10:43 AM Christofer Dutz wrote: > > Hi all, > > Thanks for taking this coordination over. > > They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the industry. It > seems this is not the case. > > But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting as > panelist on these sessions. > So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. > > And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an ApacheCon CFP and > submit ideas a minute before the deadline. > > Chris > > From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik > Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 > To: dev@community.apache.org > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability > I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be that > organised). > > Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But > suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. > > That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and > participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to inform > itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show up, > contribute meaningfully, constructively and have knowledge/information to > bring. > > Dw > > > On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > > > Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is > > it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > > wrote: > >> > >> Hi all, > >> > >> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that we > >> want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to > >> participate. > >> > >> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > >> > >> Chris > >> > >> > >> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré > >> Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 > >> To: dev@community.apache.org > >> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability > >> Hi Chris, > >> > >> I can be there as well if needed. > >> > >> Regards > >> JB > >> > >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> Hi all, > >>> > >>> as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems > >>> the European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > >>> In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > >>> one-day session: > >>> https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > >>> > >>> As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates > >>> to take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > >>> Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > >>> I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > >>> > >>> What do you folks think? > >>> > >>> Chris > >> > >> - > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > > > > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi all, Thanks for taking this coordination over. They did disarm my worries, that the panelists would be from the industry. It seems this is not the case. But they do explicitly welcome suggestions for people to be acting as panelist on these sessions. So, we can be more actively involved. If we want to. And I agree .. this is not something we can sit out like an ApacheCon CFP and submit ideas a minute before the deadline. Chris From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik Date: Thursday, 27. October 2022 at 10:24 To: dev@community.apache.org Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be that organised). Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to inform itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show up, contribute meaningfully, constructively and have knowledge/information to bring. Dw > On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is > it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > wrote: >> >> Hi all, >> >> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that we >> want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to >> participate. >> >> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. >> >> Chris >> >> >> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré >> Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 >> To: dev@community.apache.org >> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability >> Hi Chris, >> >> I can be there as well if needed. >> >> Regards >> JB >> >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the >>> European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. >>> In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a >>> one-day session: >>> https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability >>> >>> As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates >>> to take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how >>> Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. >>> I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. >>> >>> What do you folks think? >>> >>> Chris >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
I've been in touch with the various organizers (who do not seem to be that organised). Happy to bundle things once we reach some sort of conclusion here. But suspect we need to do this in the next hours and days; not week. That said - these meetings are open - so anyone can 'show up' and participate. In many ways this type of meeting where the EC tries to inform itself are very much in a spirit akin to open source; just show up, contribute meaningfully, constructively and have knowledge/information to bring. Dw > On 26 Oct 2022, at 23:14, Jarek Potiuk wrote: > > Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is > it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > wrote: >> >> Hi all, >> >> I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that we >> want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to >> participate. >> >> As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. >> >> Chris >> >> >> From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré >> Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 >> To: dev@community.apache.org >> Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability >> Hi Chris, >> >> I can be there as well if needed. >> >> Regards >> JB >> >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the >>> European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. >>> In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a >>> one-day session: >>> https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability >>> >>> As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates >>> to take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how >>> Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. >>> I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. >>> >>> What do you folks think? >>> >>> Chris >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi Chris, Yes, I agree. I think it makes sense to prepare here and have one person as "main" contact. Regards JB On Thu, Oct 27, 2022 at 8:09 AM Christofer Dutz wrote: > > Well I thought we would coordinate things a bit more here and then I could > forward it as bulk to them. Didn't think everyone contacting them on his own > was what they would expect. > > Chris > > Holen Sie sich Outlook für Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg> > > From: Jarek Potiuk > Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2022 11:14:13 PM > To: dev@community.apache.org > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability > > Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is > it a generic address we should find ourselves? > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz > wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that we > > want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to > > participate. > > > > As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > > > > Chris > > > > > > From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré > > Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 > > To: dev@community.apache.org > > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability > > Hi Chris, > > > > I can be there as well if needed. > > > > Regards > > JB > > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz > > wrote: > > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > > as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems > > > the European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > > > In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > > > one-day session: > > > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > > > > > As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates > > > to take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > > > Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > > > I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > > > > > What do you folks think? > > > > > > Chris > > > > - > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Well I thought we would coordinate things a bit more here and then I could forward it as bulk to them. Didn't think everyone contacting them on his own was what they would expect. Chris Holen Sie sich Outlook für Android<https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg> From: Jarek Potiuk Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2022 11:14:13 PM To: dev@community.apache.org Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is it a generic address we should find ourselves? On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz wrote: > > Hi all, > > I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that we > want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to > participate. > > As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > > Chris > > > From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré > Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 > To: dev@community.apache.org > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability > Hi Chris, > > I can be there as well if needed. > > Regards > JB > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz > wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the > > European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > > In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > > one-day session: > > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > > > As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates > > to take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > > Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > > I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > > > What do you folks think? > > > > Chris > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Do you have a specific contact or conversation you can forward? Or is it a generic address we should find ourselves? On Wed, Oct 26, 2022 at 10:55 PM Christofer Dutz wrote: > > Hi all, > > I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that we > want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to > participate. > > As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. > > Chris > > > From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré > Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 > To: dev@community.apache.org > Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability > Hi Chris, > > I can be there as well if needed. > > Regards > JB > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz > wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the > > European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > > In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > > one-day session: > > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > > > As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates > > to take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > > Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > > I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > > > What do you folks think? > > > > Chris > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi all, I think we probably should at least tell them as soon as possible, that we want to attend and which seessions, which people would be willing to participate. As I mentioned, unfortunately I won’t be able to attend. Chris From: Jean-Baptiste Onofré Date: Wednesday, 26. October 2022 at 19:42 To: dev@community.apache.org Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability Hi Chris, I can be there as well if needed. Regards JB On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz wrote: > > Hi all, > > as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the > European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > one-day session: > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates to > take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > What do you folks think? > > Chris - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi Chris, I can be there as well if needed. Regards JB On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 10:44 AM Christofer Dutz wrote: > > Hi all, > > as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the > European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > one-day session: > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates to > take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > What do you folks think? > > Chris - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
The subject is very interesting to me personally, I am not sure if I would be of much help - not much interaction with politicians and not much experience with it but if I can be of any help I am happy to travel too. I think I could take part in the panel: Workshop 3.4 Exploring practical solutions to ensure long term sustainability of open source software This is the subject I've been exploring for quite a while, and by December I might even have some very tangible examples, use cases and concrete proposals I could discuss about. If that sounds plausible, I'd love to get in contact with the panel organizer. J. On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 12:17 PM Dirk-Willem van Gulik wrote: > On 25 Oct 2022, at 11:52, Christofer Dutz > wrote: > > > So there still seems to be the possibility to participate in some of the > panel discussions as panelists. > > But I think we should probably be as quickly as possible with sending > them proposals. > > My understanding as well - happy to help here. But think days - not a week > in terms of registering informal interest. > > Dw. > >
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
On 25 Oct 2022, at 11:52, Christofer Dutz wrote: > So there still seems to be the possibility to participate in some of the > panel discussions as panelists. > But I think we should probably be as quickly as possible with sending them > proposals. My understanding as well - happy to help here. But think days - not a week in terms of registering informal interest. Dw.
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 11:44 AM Christofer Dutz wrote: > > Hi all, > > as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the > European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > one-day session: > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability > > As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates to > take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. > > What do you folks think? I very much support this idea. Also, given that I live in EU now -- that trip would be very easy for me (if needed). Thanks, Roman. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@community.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@community.apache.org
Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi all, Unfortunately, I won’t be able to go, but I wanted to make sure we are aware and possibly able to participate. However, I contacted them for more information, as some of the topics seem somewhat finished and some don’t. Here’s what I got in response: “The workshops will consist in a panel but there will be time for having a vivid discussion between all participants. Note that the workshops are targeted to specific policy areas. Not all lists of panelists are finalised and that is the reason why they are not yet published. In case you are interested in participating in a particular panel, feel free to communicate your interest and reasons and we will put through the information to the panel organizer.” So there still seems to be the possibility to participate in some of the panel discussions as panelists. But I think we should probably be as quickly as possible with sending them proposals. Chris From: Dirk-Willem van Gulik Date: Tuesday, 25. October 2022 at 11:29 To: dev@community.apache.org , Christofer Dutz Subject: Re: European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability On 25 Oct 2022, at 10:44, Christofer Dutz wrote: > as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the > European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. > In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a > one-day session: > https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability I should be going there. > As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates to > take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how > Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. > I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. Not just that - but open source is becoming key to society; the the infrastructure of our economie, our society, and so on. Would be useful to prepare prior with those that intent to go. As these meetings are slowly moving from 'understanding' to 'how is, (and will) this industry regulate itself' to, if it is not, `what regulation would potentially work (to help shape society the way the EU generally sees society)'. Happy to help coordinate, With kind regards, Dw
European Commission Workshop day on Open-Source Sustainability
Hi all, as I attended the last set of workshops in pre-pandemic times, it seems the European Commission is continuing to try to understand open-source. In this quest it seems they are planning on doing a set of workshops on a one-day session: https://swforum.eu/events/open-source-workshops-computing-sustainability As last time Willem and I traveled there as we didn’t want the corporates to take over the narrative and explain to the European commission how Open-Source works, perhaps we should participate. I mean … we’re a pretty important factor in open-source, I guess. What do you folks think? Chris
