Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
On 15/12/10 21:35, Wyo wrote: Tom Hughes wrote: I tried it when I first got your email and I've just tried again and on both occasions data was loading just fine - typical time to download a chunk of data is 10-30s at worst. Why then do I get it all the time? Since I've read your answer about 10 min ago, I tried it without any success. I just now started from scratch at http://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?lat=49.55544&lon=5.09523&zoom=17, one shift of the map and I hit the "Couldn't load map". It looks (based on the IP your mail was sent from) like you have been rate limited. I'm not sure what sort of mapping you're doing but it does look like you were fetching a lot of data - there seems to be a new request every few seconds. Unfortunately due to some issues with Flash P2 isn't able to report errors very well at the moment, which is something we are working on fixing. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
On 15/12/10 21:58, Ian Dees wrote: Well the link you sent wasn't for P2 editing... It is if you have P2 set as your default editor ;-) Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Fwd: API/XAPI caching proxy server
-- Forwarded message -- From: steve brown Date: 15 December 2010 22:05 Subject: Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server To: Ian Dees On 15 December 2010 21:58, Ian Dees wrote: > > > On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 3:56 PM, Otto Wyss wrote: > >> I just tried that link now (~10 minutes after you) and it took roughly >>> 15 seconds to get map data back. There are no Yahoo imagery tiles, so >>> the screen is filled with "We're sorry, the data you have requested is >>> unavailable.", but the OSM data vectors are sitting happily on top of >>> those. Perhaps you are mistaking the lack of imagery for the lack of OSM >>> data? >>> >> >> Believe me I know when I see a popup box. Besides I've the Bing map as a >> background. Do you really use Potlatch2? >> >> > Well the link you sent wasn't for P2 editing... > > When I use P2 ( > http://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?editor=potlatch2&lat=49.55544&lon=5.09523&zoom=17), > the response was even faster. Bing imagery finished loading after the OSM > data was shown. > > Perhaps your ISP is having problems getting your packets to the OSM > servers? Do you have problems with the wiki or tile servers ever? > > No problems here either. Wyo, it appears to be just you. Sorry :( Steve ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 3:56 PM, Otto Wyss wrote: > I just tried that link now (~10 minutes after you) and it took roughly >> 15 seconds to get map data back. There are no Yahoo imagery tiles, so >> the screen is filled with "We're sorry, the data you have requested is >> unavailable.", but the OSM data vectors are sitting happily on top of >> those. Perhaps you are mistaking the lack of imagery for the lack of OSM >> data? >> > > Believe me I know when I see a popup box. Besides I've the Bing map as a > background. Do you really use Potlatch2? > > Well the link you sent wasn't for P2 editing... When I use P2 ( http://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?editor=potlatch2&lat=49.55544&lon=5.09523&zoom=17), the response was even faster. Bing imagery finished loading after the OSM data was shown. Perhaps your ISP is having problems getting your packets to the OSM servers? Do you have problems with the wiki or tile servers ever? ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 3:35 PM, Wyo wrote: > Tom Hughes wrote: > >> I tried it when I first got your email and I've just tried again and on >> both occasions data was loading just fine - typical time to download a >> chunk of data is 10-30s at worst. >> >> Why then do I get it all the time? Since I've read your answer about 10 > min ago, I tried it without any success. I just now started from scratch at > http://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?lat=49.55544&lon=5.09523&zoom=17, one > shift of the map and I hit the "Couldn't load map". > > I just tried that link now (~10 minutes after you) and it took roughly 15 seconds to get map data back. There are no Yahoo imagery tiles, so the screen is filled with "We're sorry, the data you have requested is unavailable.", but the OSM data vectors are sitting happily on top of those. Perhaps you are mistaking the lack of imagery for the lack of OSM data? ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
Tom Hughes wrote: I tried it when I first got your email and I've just tried again and on both occasions data was loading just fine - typical time to download a chunk of data is 10-30s at worst. Why then do I get it all the time? Since I've read your answer about 10 min ago, I tried it without any success. I just now started from scratch at http://www.openstreetmap.org/edit?lat=49.55544&lon=5.09523&zoom=17, one shift of the map and I hit the "Couldn't load map". Wyo ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
On 15/12/10 18:41, Wyo wrote: Well just about now it's impossible to work, in Potlatch2 I always get "Could'n load map". I've save my changes (that worked), left to viewing and again entered editing. The second shift of the map again brought the "Could'n load map". From now on till about 22:00h it's not possible to map or only with rather large pauses in between. I tried it when I first got your email and I've just tried again and on both occasions data was loading just fine - typical time to download a chunk of data is 10-30s at worst. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
Hi, Although I ranted before about the high barriers to entry in using the OSM data, I agree with Frederik on this one. With limited resources providing a good quality data query service isn't really a priority. I've implemented support for XAPI in both Kosmos and Maperitive and it's a flaky service, but since it's free, I and all of the users of my software have to put up with it. On the other hand, if I were to provide a commercial service and start making money out of it, I would sure set up my own XAPI-like thing. Which I think many do, but for their own private/commercial purposes, so you don't get to hear about it. Maybe writing a nice letter to Steve C. at MS asking for some server infrastructure would help? ;) Regards, Igor On Wed, Dec 15, 2010 at 8:10 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote: > Hi, > > > On 12/15/10 19:54, Wyo wrote: > >> Just tell me, how many people, who don't get paid for the work, have set >> up their own XAPI server? A handful or a dozens, wordwide? Sorry forgive >> me my harsh words, yet the current procedure to set up an XAPI server is >> useless. For most interested people this is simply out of reach. >> > > There are many things I am interested in but which are out of reach for me. > I guess I'll either have to work on bringing them within reach, or I'll have > to live with them being out of reach. > > Sure it's a nice thing to be able to download a data set of all pizza > joints in Spain with one simple command, but time and money has to be > invested to make it possible - money to buy servers, time to install and > maintain servers, time to write and maintain the software. > > If I were an OSM admin, and I'm not, I'd divert resources away from > non-essential services like that and into more power for people actually > editing our data any time. > > If there are so many people who would like to have a well-working XAPI > server or similar, let them get together, find a sponsor (that may also be > some university that allows the group to use a server there), write the > required software and just do it. They don't need support from OSM, OSMF, > OSM Admins or anyone to get it done. > > If this hasn't happened until now, then that's a clear sign that there is > not enough interest or not enough willingness to invest time and money in > this. > > Sitting there any saying "I think OSM should make my life easier" isn't > going to get anything accomplished. > > Bye > Frederik > > > ___ > dev mailing list > dev@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev > ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
Hi, On 12/15/10 19:54, Wyo wrote: Just tell me, how many people, who don't get paid for the work, have set up their own XAPI server? A handful or a dozens, wordwide? Sorry forgive me my harsh words, yet the current procedure to set up an XAPI server is useless. For most interested people this is simply out of reach. There are many things I am interested in but which are out of reach for me. I guess I'll either have to work on bringing them within reach, or I'll have to live with them being out of reach. Sure it's a nice thing to be able to download a data set of all pizza joints in Spain with one simple command, but time and money has to be invested to make it possible - money to buy servers, time to install and maintain servers, time to write and maintain the software. If I were an OSM admin, and I'm not, I'd divert resources away from non-essential services like that and into more power for people actually editing our data any time. If there are so many people who would like to have a well-working XAPI server or similar, let them get together, find a sponsor (that may also be some university that allows the group to use a server there), write the required software and just do it. They don't need support from OSM, OSMF, OSM Admins or anyone to get it done. If this hasn't happened until now, then that's a clear sign that there is not enough interest or not enough willingness to invest time and money in this. Sitting there any saying "I think OSM should make my life easier" isn't going to get anything accomplished. Bye Frederik ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
Frederik Ramm wrote: You're right that XAPI is in this thread's subject, but Wyo explicitly talked about mapping, for which XAPI is not required. I've talked about API/XAPI as you can see in the subject. And at least during high volume hours the API server is already on the brink, e.g. just now. But if you thing API isn't a problem I can easily drop that. ... Anyone who is unhappy with the performance of XAPI *can* set up their own mirror server by using the minutely diffs we publish While you have technically right, that's completely nuts on the practical side. Not everyone has his own server. Most hosting services don't provide a postgres DB (this rules out PostGIS). And downloading OSM files in the gigs size is something not everybody likes very much. Just tell me, how many people, who don't get paid for the work, have set up their own XAPI server? A handful or a dozens, wordwide? Sorry forgive me my harsh words, yet the current procedure to set up an XAPI server is useless. For most interested people this is simply out of reach. Wyo ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
Tom Hughes wrote: Oh please, do stop talking bollocks. I've actually been doing quite a bit of mapping the last few weeks at all sorts of different times and it's been absolutely fine. Well just about now it's impossible to work, in Potlatch2 I always get "Could'n load map". I've save my changes (that worked), left to viewing and again entered editing. The second shift of the map again brought the "Could'n load map". From now on till about 22:00h it's not possible to map or only with rather large pauses in between. Wyo ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
On Wed, 15 Dec 2010, Frederik Ramm wrote: On 12/15/10 08:53, Stefan de Konink wrote: It has been done in C already :) By different people, so what are we waiting for :) If there's a working instance that supports the XAPI protocol it should be added to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/XAPI#Servers and also added to the automatic load balancing. Sadly we cannot defined partitions there yet. Stefan ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] API/XAPI caching proxy server
Hi, On 12/15/10 08:53, Stefan de Konink wrote: It has been done in C already :) By different people, so what are we waiting for :) If there's a working instance that supports the XAPI protocol it should be added to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/XAPI#Servers and also added to the automatic load balancing. Bye Frederik ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
