Re: [OSM-dev] Feedback for Vespucci-dev
On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 7:56 AM, Jan Schejbal jan.mailinglis...@googlemail.com wrote: Hi, I have now made and committed the following changes. - Add Advanced Preferences (and move some stuff there) Less clutter. :) - Add pref to disable context menu in unnecessary cases (default: enabled = show always) - Add heuristics for context menu (to always show it when really necessary). If the above-mentioned pref is unset, it basically works like this: Get the list of touched objects. If there are OSMBugs, always show. If there are no nodes but multiple ways, always show. If there is at least one node, then the nearest node is considered to be clicked, UNLESS this node has another node *really* close to it (not to the click area). This ensures that exactly overlapping nodes and ways always bring up the context menu, while other cases can be handled quickly. (Way tolerance is low enough so it doesn't cause false hits.) - Sort context menu entries by distance to click (nodes by distance first, then ways by distance) Great idea! - Undo menu: Add background colors (black/white) and icons properly I now always set background and foreground color. The problem before was that I only set one of them and/or only in one case, I think. I also added custom-made greyscale icons. Feel free to remove the icons if they suck/eat too much space or remove the coloring if it causes problems (I think it shouldn't this time). Color has the big plus over icons that it a) doesn't need space and b) is easier to notice than small icons. - Tag editor: Changed X icon size to match editor rows, force minimum text field size The text fields were REALLY small on my device, and the X was too large. Indeed, the spacing between the fields was the X being larger than the text fields. I gave the text fields a minimum height and a bottom border to fix this, and shrunk the X so it is now aligned. - Tag editor: Set autosuggest dropdown spacing to minimum text field size - I chose to use 36dp as the height of one dropdown item (not counting the spacers). This is already more than the text field size on my device, which is 36dp *including* the spacers (and was even smaller before I introduced the minHeight). If the fields and X are big enough to hit, the autocomplete is too. If the autocomplete is too small, we need to also enlarge the fields (in my tests, I didn't have trouble hitting them correctly, though). Will have to try it out to be sure. Hitting a text field not precisely has less consequences then hitting the wrong autosuggest. ...just a thought. I suspect the field height could be device/style specific. It should be in device indipendent pixels based on the size of a finger. Not device specific. I did NOT make any changes to the content of the autosuggest (i.e. re-add the duplicates or move the corresponding entries to top), so we currently have a plain alphabetic list. I would like to hear some more opinions on this if possible. I guess an LRU schema would be way to complicated to implement and users would be surprised to find their tags at different positions in the list every time. Should we maybe remove the distinction between recommended and mandatory tags and add them all when applying a preset? Currently, recommended tags are more or less invisible to the user, so we should do *something*. The best way would probably to check for mandatory tags every time a tag was added or changed and just add them. I'm not sure how users would react to selecting the wrong tag and getting all these additional ones to delete before they can select the one they actually wanted. Oh, and I just noticed that I forgot to update the appname.xml, but I am not the first one. Should we maybe put a $Rev: $ SVN tag in there for now? The dollar signs look nasty but it makes sure it's always up to date. Good idea. It will always be forgotten once in a while. I returned last night and will sign the release this afternoon after work and after checking that there are no open translation tickets with texts we haven't applied yet. Weekend was too busy with a thousand other projects that can only be done on weekends. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Feedback for Vespucci-dev
On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 9:04 AM, andrewg_oz andrew.greg...@gmail.com wrote: On Monday, October 1, 2012 2:28:40 PM UTC+8, Marcus Wolschon wrote: I think the icons for source=survey and for presets need to be replaced with something more intuitive at some point. Problem is, I don't know any symbol more intuitive for these myself. Agreed, but I couldn't think of anything better, either. I was thinking an eye icon for surveyed, like: http://www.darshancomputing.com/android/1.5-drawables/ic_menu_view.png i.e. you had seen whatever it is. Still thinking about presets. I chose the heart because the presets remind of favourites, which are often represented with a heart. I was thinking favorites too when I first saw it. Then I wondered why you would mark an object as a favorite. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Feedback for Vespucci-dev
On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 9:25 AM, andrewg_oz andrew.greg...@gmail.com wrote: Just as an FYI in relation to Galaxy Ace testing, I've checked Vespucci on a 320x480 emulator, and it looks OK. The real Galaxy Ace runs Froyo. Has anyone been able to run Vespucci on Froyo? When I try a Froyo emulator, Vespucci gets stuck starting up (black screen, ANR). Andrew I have a very old china-tablet at home but that't 600Km away at the moment. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Feedback for Vespucci-dev
On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 9:28 AM, andrewg_oz andrew.greg...@gmail.com wrote: Does anyone else think the OSM API URL should be moved to the new Advanced preferences? Andrew Indeed. It certainly is an advanced feature. Just like custom presets. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
I don't see much use for an action bar in the tag editor. We should just leave it as it is. We've made some great progress thanks to Jan to be talking about trivial things like this. :) On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 4:35 AM, andrewg_oz andrew.greg...@gmail.comwrote: Everything is looking pretty good now. I'm going to take Vespucci out for a survey later today to see how things go. I've also noticed a small annoyance with the tag editor. The main map activity is using the new action bar, but the tag editor activity is still using the classic Android title bar. With the background transparent it looks a little messy seeing half the action bar of the main activity behind the title bar of the tag editor. Is that something easy to fix? (eg make the tag editor use an action bar too?) Regards, Andrew ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 12:18 PM, andrewg_oz andrew.greg...@gmail.comwrote: On Sunday, August 19, 2012 2:16:18 PM UTC+8, Marcus Wolschon wrote: I don't see much use for an action bar in the tag editor. On the contrary, we're starting to have quite a little collection of buttons in the main form that would be much better if moved to an action bar. We should just leave it as it is. See above. We've made some great progress thanks to Jan to be talking about trivial things like this. :) Jan has indeed made excellent progress, and Vespucci is very much better for it. Nevertheless, he seems to be familiar with action bars and if it was something that could be done quickly with little effort, then now would seem the time to do it. Too often things aren't done because they're trivial. And more things. And more things. Eventually the software ends up feeling shoddy because there are so many trivial things that need fixing. Don't worry, I'll raise an issue and I'll do it, but I think I'll wait until Jan's branch is merged into the trunk. In that case, let's talk about it in detail in 2 weeks, okay? GSoC deadline in tomorrow (So now is the time for last documentation and comments) and I'll be on a short vacation. Marcu ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 12:32 PM, andrewg_oz andrew.greg...@gmail.comwrote: On Sunday, August 19, 2012 10:35:50 AM UTC+8, andrewg_oz wrote: Everything is looking pretty good now. I'm going to take Vespucci out for a survey later today to see how things go. Now that I'm back from my survey, here are the things I noticed. First the good stuff: 1. GPS works fine. Turned it off and on again no problem. 2. Undo works too! I even used it once! :-) *Very* handy. 3. The new presets are working nicely. Unfortunately, it's not all good: 1. After a while the action bar items started disappearing. First the undo and GPS buttons disappeared. The main action drop-down (Move, EasyEdit, New, etc) was still visible and worked properly. Pressing Menu just revealed Preferences and Help. Transfer was not visible anywhere. Going into the Preferences and backing out without changing anything resulted in the main action drop-down going blank (the little triangle was still visible), and pressing it would do nothing. The action bar was blank except for the little triangle related to the main action drop-down. At this point I couldn't transfer to save my data. I had to exit Vespucci and restart it. 2. In the tag editor, the tag key/value auto complete doesn't seem to be working properly. The key auto-complete seems to be working, but the value auto-complete seems to be missing entirely. On the whole, it's all working very well. Value auto-complete worked fine here. What keys did you try? What Android Version are you using? 4.x with native Action bar, 3.x with the first Action Bar or an earlier one with the Compat-Library/ActionBarSherlock ? ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
I'd like to hear everyones opinion on this. What do you think? On Thu, Aug 16, 2012 at 7:24 AM, Jan Schejbal jan.mailinglis...@googlemail.com wrote: A new and maybe last development APK was provided at the usual location: http://www.janschejbal.de/temp/vespucci.apk Due to licensing reasons explained on the osmeditor4anroid list, the preset icons have been removed from the package. A separate icon package is available at: http://www.janschejbal.de/temp/vespucci-icons.apk Gruß Jan ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
I think the undo item is still showing in the ActionBar even when nothing is to be undone. This prevents the more important GPS item from showing prominently. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
On Mon, Aug 13, 2012 at 5:58 PM, andrewg_oz andrew.greg...@gmail.comwrote: Hi Jan, First of all, well done for all the work you've put into Vespucci. It's been a long time since I've done anything with Vespucci (or OSM in general, really) and you've certainly added quite a few nice things (and squished some bugs along the way). Now that the OSM license change redaction has passed, there's quite a bit of field work to do - retrace roads and capture names for starters. I've just installed a very recent Vespucci build of yours (downloaded today) and tried it out. It looks very nice and I like the action bar support, but I did note some issues: 1. The GPS location isn't showing up. That's the issue I raised. It's in the overflow menu because the undo arrow is showing, even though there's nothing to undo. 2. The tag editor preset system does not check for pre-existing key/value pairs, so you can end up with duplicates. This is allowed in the schema even as some editors are too limited to support it. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
Just tried it. Seems to work really fine. :) I can have a look and add missing German translations. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
That was FAST! I would have thought that would take much longer. Cool! On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Jan Schejbal jan.mailinglis...@googlemail.com wrote: I have now implemented undo support. A proper button supporting a multi-undo/redo selection via long-press will be provided later, until then, you can find the basic undo function in the menu. The code is in the SVN, and an APK has been uploaded to the usual location: http://www.janschejbal.de/temp/vespucci.apk Kind regards, Jan ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci
You would use a URL on the OSM server that contains a redirect to the Vespucci-page in Android market. The app registers for that URL and opens it instead of the browser. If the app is not installed the user gets the Google Play market app on Android and the Google Play market website for our app on any other device (where you can remotely install it on any of your Android devices). Von: Ken Guest [mailto:ken.gu...@gmail.com] Gesendet: Montag, 30. Juli 2012 11:12 An: Marcus Wolschon Cc: dev@openstreetmap.org; osmeditor4andr...@googlegroups.com Betreff: Re: [OSM-dev] [GSoC] Improvements to Vespucci Here's an idea I'd like to see implemented in Vespucci at some stage: Could Vespucci be added to the Complete action in dialog when a link to some point on the www.openstreetmap.org map is 'clicked' on? I have noticed the github and Google+ apps do this for related URLs, so it is possible. Thanks, Ken -- Sent from my Android phone. Please excuse any typos which might have occurred. On Jul 30, 2012 7:38 a.m., Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz wrote: That was FAST! I would have thought that would take much longer. Cool! On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 8:32 AM, Jan Schejbal jan.mailinglis...@googlemail.com wrote: I have now implemented undo support. A proper button supporting a multi-undo/redo selection via long-press will be provided later, until then, you can find the basic undo function in the menu. The code is in the SVN, and an APK has been uploaded to the usual location: http://www.janschejbal.de/temp/vespucci.apk Kind regards, Jan ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] GSoC delegates
Who will our two delegate GSoC mentors be? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Super-relations or not
I'm using routes in way-simplification to generate simplified maps for realtime rendering of larger areas when zooming out. It's quite a lot of work with LOTS of cases to try to sort route-relations that are randomly sorted with parts being other relations instead of ways, parts being contained twice, parts missing in the relation but having a ref= -tag or a ref_nat= -tag or ... , parts having a ref= -tag with the wrong road-number that should NOT be made a part of this simplified way,... ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] projection for calculating distances in PostGIS
Hello, what projections do you use to calculate distances (in meters) in postgis? I have some code here that tried to use 27700 but that is not defined on all inhabited continents of this planet. An error of at most 25% would be acceptable as tis is just about search -areas and not street-length. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] projection for calculating distances in PostGIS
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 2:13 PM, Emilie Laffray emilie.laff...@gmail.com wrote: On 19 May 2010 13:06, Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz wrote: Hello, what projections do you use to calculate distances (in meters) in postgis? I have some code here that tried to use 27700 but that is not defined on all inhabited continents of this planet. An error of at most 25% would be acceptable as tis is just about search -areas and not street-length. It all depends what kind of distance you are trying to get. One easy way is to use the FindUTM of the area you are looking for http://trac.osgeo.org/postgis/wiki/UsersWikiplpgsqlfunctionsDistance The next possible trick is to switch your column type to geography if you have postgis 1.5. It would mean that all postgis function relating to length and areas would start reporting data in meters. It is postgis 1.4 and the data-columns are geometries in WGS84 with the bounding-boxes stored pre-computed and projected in their own column, for faster access. The page you mentioned has a ST_DWithin_Sphere but that only works between 60 and -60° and it does not help with the distance-calculation required for sorting the results by distance (I forgot to mention that. This is about finding the closest element to a search-point where the elements may be points, lines and areas.). This code needs to work on all of the continental planet except north and south polar regions. (60,60 is still somewhere in russia). So the question is just to find a better projection to use. Due to locality it would even be possible to use different projections based on WGS84- coordinate-regions. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] projection for calculating distances in PostGIS
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 2:53 PM, Emilie Laffray emilie.laff...@gmail.com wrote: The page is interesting due to the utmzone function. This will allow to know what projection to use if you want a good approximation. It return a SRID that you can use to do a ST_Transform. Ah, with only the line Find UTM (WGS84) SRID for a point (in any SRID) I was not quite sure what it was supposed to do. Thanks for the clarification. But what you want to do is going to be very painfully slow especially if you are going to work with geometries other than points, since it means that you have to reproject the data for each geometries you are going to work with potentially. Why should that be slow? I´m calculating a projected bounding-box for each element once ahead of time and storing these. When doing the queries I only need to project my query-location to find the few elements where my query-loction is within the bounding-box. Then I transform the few geometries found to compare the distance and sort. The following page will work in any units that you want. http://www.bostongis.com/PrinterFriendly.aspx?content_name=postgis_nearest_neighbor_generic Only if the reference-point and the bounding-boxes have the same projection and the distance()-function will use that projection to calculate the distance. So this will be highly distorted for WGS84 as 1 meter is not the same distance in lat as it is in lon. So basically back to square one. Finding a good projection. One other possibility instead of using a nearest neighbour functionality is to do a search with ST_DWithin applying a ratio depending on the latitude. That could work. Calculate a WGS4-bounding box with a width and height depending on the loction of the reference-point and select all geometries who intersect it. Could I use utmzone() to calculate a good projection, then project my reference-point to it, create a bounding-box with that SRID of +- N meters, project that back to WGS84 and do the range-query? Then use that SRID in the distance-calculation of the resulting elements that where found to intersect the bounding-box? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] projection for calculating distances in PostGIS
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 5:29 PM, Stephen Cavilia aili...@gmail.com wrote: Why should that be slow? I´m calculating a projected bounding-box for each element once ahead of time and storing these. When doing the queries I only need to project my query-location to find the few elements where my query-loction is within the bounding-box. Then I transform the few geometries found to compare the distance and sort. But the bounding boxes you have are stored in degrees, right? That means you can't do distance calculations without projecting every feature to an appropriate UTM. And reprojecting your entire database will take a long time. The full geometries in the current code are in WGS84 but the bounding-boxes are projected (currently all to 27700). One other possibility instead of using a nearest neighbour functionality is to do a search with ST_DWithin applying a ratio depending on the latitude. That could work. Calculate a WGS4-bounding box with a width and height depending on the loction of the reference-point and select all geometries who intersect it. Could I use utmzone() to calculate a good projection, then project my reference-point to it, create a bounding-box with that SRID of +- N meters, project that back to WGS84 and do the range-query? Then use that SRID in the distance-calculation of the resulting elements that where found to intersect the bounding-box? This is what I would do. Calculate a rough lat-lon bounding box that approximates the area you want, filter any features that intersect that box, then reproject just those into UTM for calculating the actual distances. Or a more accurate geodesic/great circle distance, but UTM will be close enough over relatively small areas. no need for great circle. We are talking about bounding-boxes of 500m-5Km . Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] projection for calculating distances in PostGIS
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 10:35 PM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 19 May 2010 22:06, Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz wrote: Hello, what projections do you use to calculate distances (in meters) in postgis? I have some code here that tried to use 27700 but that is not defined on all inhabited continents of this planet. An error of at most 25% would be acceptable as this is just about search -areas and not street-length. If you generate an area that you want to cover, then all you need to do is use ST_Within() function I think it is. No, I do need the = st_intersects() and after the intersects() the result is checked for distance. Because the geometries I am checking against my bounding-box may be ways and areas and thus not be completely inside the bounding-box but just intersecting it. Both the creation of the bounding-box and the distance -calculation require a projection. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] New OSM binary fileformat implementation.
Sounds cool! What indice exist? Can I access elements by ID? what about access by bounding-box? Are there navigatable back-references from Members to relations and from Nodes to Ways? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [osmosis-dev] osmbin plugin
Hello Daniel, Osmbin has some known bugs that I was just never able to pinpoint and has been replaces by the H2Database here. (at some point in time there would always be inconsistencies in the indice despite me having sanity-checks all over the place :( ) It works but is not perfect. You´ll have a hard time getting it to run in J2SE as it uses memory mapped files all over the place for performance reasons but conventional IO-code is in there too as a fallback due to limitations on the size of memory mapped files on the Atom-platform. So it is possible. On my Machine is running Win 7 enterprise and I cannot write in the Applocation Data Folder. So I copied the libosm-2.5.2-RC1-plugin_for_osmosis-0.32.zip into the bin directory of osmosis-0.32. But if I use this command: osmosis --read-xml file=map.osm --writeOsmBin-0.6 dir=osmbin-map I get a OsmosisRuntimeException: Task Type writeOsmBin-0.6 does not exist. Can anyone please help? In the osmosis-sources there is a class PluginManager. You can look up the pathes that is searches for plugins there. Marcus ___ osmosis-dev mailing list osmosis-dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/osmosis-dev
Re: [OSM-dev] GSoC Project : Routing app with Group connect
Find the best suitable path for a journey from source to destination point What is best and what pathes are suitabe? Suitable for that kind of vehicle? Also the approximate time for travel will be computed What method? Additional Group Connect feature (meeting planner) ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] GSoC - Travel Time Analysis
On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 11:09 AM, Eric Marsden eric.mars...@free.fr wrote: lk == Lukas Kabrt lu...@kabrt.cz writes: lk I wrote a draft of my GSoC application. It is available on wiki [1]. I lk tried to define goals more precisely. Any comments are appreciated. * tool for matching GPS traces to the roads from the OSM * tool for analyzing GPS traces and estimating travel times Are you sure that dividing it this way is reasonable? Can you explain this design decision? What is the output of the first tool? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] GSoC - Travel Time Analysis (classification aproach of Speedcollector)
On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 12:21 PM, Aditya Vikram Thoomati adivik2...@hotmail.com wrote: Hi, Good to see the talk on Travel Time Analysis i would like you to have a look at http://www.wsdot.wa.gov/projects/completed.htm and also check out hypercube queuing model to have an elevated idea. Your links seems to point to a site listing 403 Projects where roads in the US have been improved or repaired. I'm not saying it's easy. A lot of trail and error adjustments will be needed. The main point is that the router already does a lot of the work. I still think your aproach is flawed. There should be little trial and error required as you are dealing with exact meassurements to make a a prediction giving certain of these meassurements more weight then others based on how closely they resemble the situation you want to predict. You start with gpx-traces containing many location- and speed- information. You also start with a vector map. But then why divide your traces by timestamp instead of referencing your map? 2 minutes is nothing on a motorway but lets you cross a good part of a city driving a green wave on a major road. such as road maintenance or a car crash that cause motorists traveling in both directions to slow down to take a peek. These events should be filtered out from the start if they do not occur every day in the same place. Expected, general travel times and delays due to random events are 2 different problems. That there was a car accident last week does not affect the estimate of how long you are likely to travel by the time you react the start of a segment now. The most likely source of information about short time traffic obstructions is TMC and it usually tells you the expected delay. So this needs different issue not be addressed now and certainly not here. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] GSoC - Travel Time Analysis (classification aproach of Speedcollector)
On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Nic Roets nro...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Mar 26, 2010 at 6:00 PM, Marcus Wolschon marcus.wolsc...@googlemail.com wrote: Expected, general travel times and delays due to random events are 2 different problems. The two problems are so closely interlinked it makes sense to treat them as one. No. One requires statistical data of all of the road-network indexed by the specific road to make predictions about the infuence of this specific piece of road compared to the average road of that kind. The second requires statistical data of popular incidents that can happen everywhere and have such a large impact that the specific road does not matter. A 5Km trafic jam on a motorway of 2 lanes getting narrowed down to 1 lane will have the same impact no matter what the name of the specific motorway is. That there was a car accident last week does not affect the estimate of how long you are likely to travel by the time you react the start of a segment now. Of course it does ! How so? There IS no car-accident now and it is unrealistic to assume that there will be by the time you get there. Don´t mistake the average travel time with the statistical expected value for a single, random drive. You have to account for the probability that the road is poorly designed at that spot. I don´t think that the road has anything to do with it. To account for the probability you have to 1) detect an instance of a specific type of event 2) know the probability I don´t think 1 is possible with this kind of data. And I don´t think we´ll have the number of tracks for 2 in any meaningful number of places to merit development time. (Remember, we are short of developers everywhere in this project.) The most likely source of information about short time traffic obstructions is TMC and it usually tells you the expected delay. So this needs different issue not be addressed now and certainly not here. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] GSoC - Travel Time Analysis (classification aproach of Speedcollector)
On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 2:28 PM, Nic Roets nro...@gmail.com wrote: Rerouting traffic based on collected track logs is essentially an extension to this: Take the tracklog, divide it into 2 minute intervals (or T seconds). I suggest to use the ways and segments between pairs of nodes on ways instead of and time base. But of cause any such design deccisions are not up to us but the students who´s project this wil become. It´s their project. We merely offer a problem and advising suggestions. Try to filter out the cases where the vehicle was parked or the user was walking around. Ask the router how long it should take to travel from the starting point to the end point. If it's substantially less than T, mark the point (segment) as a penalty point (avoid point) What point? You where talking about start to end a second ago. with an appropriate weighting. There is no apropriate weighting as that algorithm does not know IF the delay even happened in that one, random point. You are calculating the delay for a complete route and then suddenly assuming it´s all in single point/segment. Serve these penalty points to clients and routing servers. Then adjust the penalty points according to time of day patterns etc. And in what way do your random penalty-points relate to the completely different route of the client? a) If there is a delay n one direction, there need not be such a delay in both directions. b) That one car had a delay does not mean that one second later others have a similar delay. You don´t even attempt to describe merging the delays meassured by multiple vehicles on the same segment. c) Your aproach is highly dependent on the metric on one particular routing engine with one set of speed parameters. You are penalising a sportscar in the midle of the night becasue a heavy truck at rush hour was slow 3 month earlier. d) Tracks are about past events. You cannot blindly compare travel times of different vehicle-classes (heavy truck, light sports car, motorbike, bicycle, slow city-hopper), drivers with completely different intensions (driving fast, efficient, mapping sideroads) and at different classes of days (weekend? start/end of local holidays?) and times (rush hour, night, evening, morning). My aproach: I proposed to collect the tracks in navigation-software in my attempts (http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/travelingsales/index.php?title=Speedcollector) to solve this issue one or two years back becasue there we know the car and chosen metric as well as the time and day. Then classify times and days into some broad classes and subclasses and a heuristic for combining different meassurements taken with different meta-info with a weighting dependent on how much they aligh with the meta info that is being asked for. If a service to collect such tracks with all these meta-information was provided, I´d be happy to add the functionality of posting tracks there to Traveling Salesman (provided the user allows it). http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/travelingsales/index.php?title=Plugin/FeedbackFastestRouteMetric Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] GSoC - Travel Time Analysis (classification aproach of Speedcollector)
Here are the other links to my own aproach back then: submit: http://speedcollector.comyr.com/submit.php (this is for testing. It was supposed to be called by navigation software, not humans) query: http://speedcollector.comyr.com/query.php classification chosen: https://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/travelingsales/index.php?title=Speedcollector#database_schema Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] OSM als Map-Service auf Blackberry
On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 9:30 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: 2010/1/4 Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz: Hello, on Blackberry the documentation of the net.rim.device.api.lbs.MapField -class mentions a current map service. I guess Blackberry Maps using Google is the default. Does anyone know if there is an SPI to replace it with another map or change the location tiles are loaded from and if anyone is working on such code? There is a few java components to embed in BB apps to show OSM maps. http://dev.cloudmade.com/ Links to one such component... I guess you mean http://www.nutiteq.com/rim-blackberry-mapping-api-sdk http://developers.cloudmade.com/projects/show/j2me-lib-rim it would work if we payed the license-fee for every client but I was thinking along the lines of a free implementation or a sourcecode-example on how to implement this. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] OSM als Map-Service auf Blackberry
On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 1:59 PM, Erik Johansson e...@kth.se wrote: I guess you mean http://www.nutiteq.com/rim-blackberry-mapping-api-sdk http://developers.cloudmade.com/projects/show/j2me-lib-rim it would work if we payed the license-fee for every client but I was thinking along the lines of a free implementation or a sourcecode-example on how to implement this. Nutiteq allows you to download the lib and use it as long as you publish your code as GPL. I can't remember if they have published their source code yet though. I can only say that nutiteq works for my simplistic maps. On the downoad-page it states: Note that to use the library inside your own application you need to generate evaluation license key for specific application and vendor's name. This requires free simple registration. The generate-link gives a you are not authorized-message but http://www.nutiteq.com/map-lib-license-prices is more then clear. The downloadable archive is GPL but it consists only of 5 example-classes calling a binary-only library that among other things contains 2 classes License.class and LicenseKeyChecker.class. The application that I´m looking to use OSM instead of Google in is not open source. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Polygon buffer tool (for Osmosis)
It's a python-script. How would you like to do that inside osmosis? ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] XAPI queries for tags that include a pipe, vbar or vertical bar
It´s the same as me asking about including a space in a tag-value a few weeks ago. No escaping. Who has time to grab the source and add it? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] potlatch breaking B38a
OK, I have the source. I have inserted my call to setAdvice() to notify the user that he just merged 2 ways instead of selecting multiple ways. But where do I add the translated texts for a new constant advice_merged given to iText() ? I cannot find the text-ressources. Marcus On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 10:40 AM, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote: Marcus Wolschon wrote: Where is the sourcecode for potlatch and what is needed to compile it? I may try to add a singe ways merges, press z to undo like the message it displayes after deleting something. http://trac.openstreetmap.org/browser/applications/editors/potlatch/ and you need the open-source Ming compiler to compile it (www.libming.net). cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://old.nabble.com/potlatch-breaking-B38a-tp26403528p26421250.html Sent from the OpenStreetMap - Dev mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] 401 after PUT /api/0.6/[node|way|relation]/#id?
On Wed, Nov 18, 2009 at 7:17 PM, Karl Guggisberg karl.guggisb...@guggis.ch wrote: Hi A JOSM user reported a 401 status message after a PUT /api/0.6/[node|way|relation]/#id, see https://josm.openstreetmap.de/ticket/3887#comment:7 Why is it doing a PUT http://api.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/way/29495765? It should be doing a GET here as it´s downloading, not uploading. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] potlatch breaking B38a
On Thu, Nov 19, 2009 at 4:01 AM, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote: Marcus Wolschon wrote: ...no chance that users might actually read some documentation? No, of course not. Silly me. We`ve all been spoiled by WindowsCo just expecting ctrl+c to copy, enter to push a button that has focus, alt to get to the menu, ... Seriously, noone reads documentation that comes with graphical software unless there is a feature the user knows exists but can´t get to work. Where is the sourcecode for potlatch and what is needed to compile it? I may try to add a singe ways merges, press z to undo like the message it displayes after deleting something. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] response-code 400 to changeset
I found the bug in the new osmosis upload-changeset -task and was able to get it working and to give it a proper error-handling. It was merely using the wrong character-encoding while uploading. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] response-code 400 to changeset
Can anyone explain to me why I get a response-code 400 for the following changeset? (and a 405 for the http://api.openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/changeset/3124886/close after it) ?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8'? osmChange version=0.6 generator=Osmosis 0.31.2 modify relation id=103981 version=27 timestamp=2009-10-29T13:26:38Z uid=87062 user=KaChing_Cacher changeset=3124886 member type=way ref=4522450 role=/ member type=way ref=10778442 role=/ member type=way ref=10850451 role=/ member type=way ref=10850452 role=/ member type=way ref=12704586 role=/ member type=way ref=37793348 role=/ member type=way ref=37793349 role=/ member type=way ref=17506758 role=/ member type=way ref=17506759 role=/ member type=way ref=25210019 role=/ member type=way ref=25210020 role=/ member type=way ref=10850450 role=/ member type=way ref=10850449 role=/ member type=way ref=24919482 role=/ member type=way ref=24919483 role=/ member type=way ref=26440459 role=/ member type=way ref=38629036 role=/ member type=way ref=38629037 role=/ member type=way ref=5054531 role=/ member type=way ref=4605074 role=/ member type=way ref=8036185 role=/ member type=way ref=10850936 role=/ member type=way ref=28980677 role=/ member type=way ref=5056016 role=/ member type=way ref=30564756 role=/ member type=way ref=29263524 role=/ member type=way ref=35658596 role=/ member type=way ref=35588580 role=/ member type=way ref=35588579 role=/ member type=way ref=36876558 role=/ member type=way ref=36876571 role=/ member type=way ref=36876581 role=/ member type=way ref=36876664 role=/ member type=way ref=38708051 role=/ member type=way ref=38708055 role=/ member type=way ref=34935475 role=/ member type=way ref=5056014 role=/ member type=way ref=38708050 role=/ member type=way ref=38793242 role=/ member type=way ref=35945583 role=/ member type=way ref=38939953 role=/ member type=way ref=35945581 role=/ member type=way ref=33831354 role=/ member type=way ref=31269714 role=/ member type=way ref=38939950 role=/ member type=way ref=41916831 role=/ member type=way ref=41916832 role=/ member type=way ref=31269713 role=/ member type=way ref=39146155 role=/ member type=way ref=29263293 role=/ member type=way ref=4986941 role=/ member type=way ref=5130948 role=/ member type=way ref=36943091 role=/ member type=way ref=38939952 role=/ member type=way ref=38939951 role=/ member type=way ref=43323350 role=/ member type=way ref=36943092 role=/ member type=way ref=24067971 role=/ member type=way ref=24067974 role=/ member type=way ref=4847238 role=/ member type=way ref=4847237 role=/ member type=way ref=38757096 role=/ member type=way ref=38757097 role=/ member type=way ref=38757098 role=/ member type=way ref=31288973 role=/ member type=way ref=39916955 role=/ tag k=operator v=Baden-Württemberg/ tag k=ref v=L 1100/ tag k=route v=road/ tag k=type v=route/ tag k=TMC:cid_58:tabcd_1:LCLversion v=8.00/ tag k=TMC:cid_58:tabcd_1:LocationCode v=30959/ /relation /modify /osmChange ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] response-code 400 to changeset
Shaun McDonald schrieb: Do you get some other message with the 400 or 405? The server will normally return a error message to give you a reason to help diagnose the problem. As per http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/API_v0.6#Close:_PUT_.2Fapi.2F0.6.2Fchangeset.2F.23id.2Fclose you need to be using a PUT request to close the changeset and that is the reason for the 405. I was using a put-request and the upload-code worked well quite a few times before. I´ll try to do it again and this time output the complete answer the server gave. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] xapi handing out relation-members without role-attribute
http://osmxapi.hypercube.telascience.org/api/0.6/relation[name|ref|name:de|short_name:de=Knittlingen] ?xml version='1.0' standalone='no'? osm version='0.6' generator='xapi: OSM Extended API 2.0' xmlns:xapi='http://www.informationfreeway.org/xapi/0.6' xapi:uri='/api/0.6/relation[name|ref|name:de|short_name:de=Knittlingen]' xapi:planetDate='200911090606' xapi:copyright='2009 OpenStreetMap contributors' xapi:instance='zappyHyper' relation id='156069' user='werner2101' xapi:users='aps,werner2101' uid='110263' timestamp='2009-08-02T07:13:46Z' version='2' changeset='2010045' member type='way' ref='33629139'/ member type='way' ref='28975606'/ member type='way' ref='33626690'/ member type='way' ref='33626686'/ member type='way' ref='33627519'/ tag k='admin_level' v='7'/ tag k='boundary' v='administrative'/ tag k='name' v='Knittlingen'/ tag k='type' v='boundary'/ /relation /osm Here the role-attribute is completely missing. This causes problems at least with osmosis. I just patched my local osmosis to handle this as a role. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] XAPI - issue with spaces in tag-value
So, who a maintains the XAPI? On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 5:55 PM, 80n 80n...@gmail.com wrote: I think it's a bug. On Thu, Nov 5, 2009 at 9:31 AM, marcus.wolsc...@googlemail.com wrote: Hello, I am using XAPI to search for relations like [ref=L 1100] but I get lots of results with ref=L instead of what I'm searching for. Is there some kind of escaping for spaces that just has not been documented on http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Xapi#wildcards_in_the_value.3F or is this a bug? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Quick OSM read-only API optimised for rendering
On Mon, Oct 26, 2009 at 1:24 PM, Peter Körner osm-li...@mazdermind.de wrote: Looks interesting but only for high zoom-levels. What queries can be supported to e.g. render a map of the world? That would at least require all coastlines but not in full resolution. This is only true for the coastlines, as mapnik is doing the same (coastlines from shapefile, everything else from postgis). That´s interesting. I wasn´t aware that mapnik did not actually render the coastlines we have in the database. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] MySQL GIS extensions - some tipps
On Thu, Jul 23, 2009 at 8:35 PM, Andreas Kalschandreaskal...@gmx.de wrote: How much would that be without filtering? Since I have no clue what are relevant tags and relations for you. Relevant features are features which represent a GeoObject. Nodes which are just part of ways and ways which are just part of multipolygons are not relevant in this context. Ah, I see. As I need the ways that share a given node and tags on nodes in ways are very important I would only store a POINT on the nodes but not use any GIS-Extension on the ways. (such as POLYLINE) Do I loose precision if I store the lat+lon of a node as a POINT and convert it back? I`m asking because I have an edit-button that exports the currently visible area and starts the latest JOSM with it so co-drivers can fix mistakes in the map right as the driver encounters them. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Rendering of long street names for short streets
On Fri, Jul 17, 2009 at 5:33 AM, Eugene Alvin Villarsea...@gmail.com wrote: I've actually been thinking of suggesting an :abbr suffix key to all name-accepting tags (name, name:en, name:fr, alt_name, int_name, etc.) and the values are a semicolon-separated list of abbreviations. This is backwards compatible since existing tools can still use the base name tags and ignore the :abbr tags. But for renderers and namefinder tools that need abbreviated names, then can then look into the :abbr tags and select the one which fits the space or matches a query. That would be a lot of redundant data considering the standard-abbreviations. Also think about the fact the abbreviations are language-dependent. So there are different abbreviations based on what language-variant of the name you are using. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Traveling Salesman - v1.0.0
Traveling Salesman - v1.0.0 == Traveling Salesman is a navigation application for use on nettops and laptops for the OpenStreetMap. It's focus is on clean, well documented code and modularity via plugins. Download it: https://sourceforge.net/project/platformdownload.php?group_id=203597 Start it via Java Webstart: http://travelingsales.sourceforge.net/ts-stable.jnlp Changelog: http://travelingsales.sourceforge.net/bugs/changelog_page.php V1.0.0 is the first stable version that is feature-complete and bug-free enough to be called 1.0. It is not finished as such a project never is. There are enhancements already present in the trunk-version that will become1.1 that are not yet part of 1.0 (TMC-support, more translations, new database-backends, ...). There are also still issues to be looked at. Importing maps is very slow but fully working. But you have to do the cut and call it 1.0 at some point and for us this cut was at 1.0.0-RC1. To try it out, you can use the 2 webstart-versions: http://travelingsales.sourceforge.net/ts-stable.jnlp and http://travelingsales.sourceforge.net/ts.jnlp a wizzard will guide you through the impor of your first map and configuration of the GPS-device. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] implemented API for J2SE and J2ME (NameFinder Client API)
On Tue, Apr 21, 2009 at 3:06 PM, Michael Willigens mich...@willigens.de wrote: should not be a problem to support this. abbrevate the objects before indexing: highways: filter: ave, street, way, strasse, straße etc. same goes for cities and towns. LDAP supports wildcard queries for the rest and one could also do a simple for human beings: p=Earth,Street=Haslachstrasse Haslachstrasse would therefor give Haslach* before doing the query. Thats what I'm doing in address-search and it works fine. I'm also normalizing everything to non-capital letters and a given number of special characters of the search-string get replaced by %. (The first time I made the mistake of transliterating ^[a-zA-Z0-9] to % and this broke the search for russian names.) Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Bittorrent
2009/4/18 Max petersonm...@googlemail.com: so you speak of a magnet link and not a torrent. that works as well, right, but it is not anonymous, offsystem link is. It does not need to be. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] JOSM and API 0.6
On Sat, Apr 4, 2009 at 6:28 PM, Shaun McDonald sh...@shaunmcdonald.me.uk wrote: Just don't forgat that users have lots of v0.5 -maps still lying on their hard-disk at and after that date. So the default should also set alternatice accepted versions. If you are on the JOSM-dev list, you will have noticed that Fredrik is working on improving the cross API version support, especially now that there is a versionless capabilities call in the current live API, like in API 0.6. Hopefully more editors will make use of the capabilities call in the future. Thanks for the info. I am not on that list as I do not do JOSM-development. (my own keeps me busy enough). Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] state of preparing the TMC-import
I have made quite some progress in preparing the import of the German TMC Location-Codes that was allowed to us by the BASt. Now I would like to present what we may get into the map in a few month. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/TMC/TMC_Import_Germany We are talking about: 28.520 points 1.699 segments 2.889 roads 16.966 intersections 6.135 administrative areas 932 other areas spanning all of the german road-network. Some of these roads, areas and points may not yet exist in OSM. There are no tools to do this import yet. There will need to be due to the excessive topology-checing required and that this import of Germany may just be the first of some dozen other complete countries that use TMC and thus the same exchange-format for their LocationCodeLists. (No today germany, tomorrow he world-jokes please. Actually Italy was the first to publish their LCL publicly without highly restrictive licensing.) There is one tool linked in the wiki that can convert the segments and points (not yet ways, areas and intersections) into an osm-map for visualisation and manual checking of yet to write import-tools. == understanding TMC== I managed to write a small TMC-parser and look at quite a selection of messages. A proof of concept to use the tagging- schema below in an actual working navigator with TMC-support if slowly taking shape. (As the result of the import is to be computer readable, I believe it should be proven that it can be read and used in the intended way before starting to add elements the map that may prove inadequate.) I managed to get a good understanding of how locations are referenced in the TMC-system and the given tagging-schema with its location-codes, forward- and backward-references looks adequate to the task. The challange may still be that the topology of the very simplistic tmc-road-network has to be mapped to our much more detailed osm-network and thus to a more refined topology. (e.g. dual-carriageways and motorway-juctions are just a simple line or point in tmc but a tmc-message mentioning an affected direction may only affect one half of our dual-cardiageway.) == tagging schema === I prepared a tagging-schema that I would very much like feedback on as it does not yet look very pretty. (Please use the Talk-Page) Due to the fact that there are multiple countries with their own Location-List and that some countries have more then one operator and that a Tag can only have one value there was a decision to make. For TMC:Roads the best way to tag them was relations as they are only ordered lists of TMC:Segments. But for TMC:Points=OSM:Nodes and TMC:Segments=OSM:Ways there where 2 options: 1: use a relation with only one member and simple tags like tmc:country tmc:table tmc:locationcode or 2:tag the element itself but use more complex keys to allow the same element to be referenced from multiple locationcodes. I opted for the second as it is easier to understand, work with and faster to obtain the referenced objects. (Points and Segments are usually referenced by TMC-messages. Roads and Areas more seldomly.) I tried to avoid characters like ( or [ and stayed with : and _ instread, to avoid special-characters that need encoding. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] JOSM: Several tags with same key
2009/4/3 Pierre-André Jacquod pjacq...@alumni.ethz.ch: this sort of thing already exists for banks, but is tagged as amenity=bank, atm=yes. you could easily adopt this for other types as well: shop=supermarket, atm=yes. Ok, I see, something like: amenity = post_box atm = yes while stefan is right (there is no technical reason why we can't support duplicate tag keys whilst ensuring the tags themselves are unique), the pragmatic approach is to recognise that most clients and other bits of OSM software already use some sort of unique keyed map to store tags. Ok I can understand this approach. I am currently gathering statistics (currently limited to austria and switzerland) in order to show how key / value are used and I have the following observation: As drawback, I see the following point: I have a characteristic (in this case post_box) once as a value, the second time as a key (atm=yes). This means I am not more able to find easily all atm, e.g, since sometime the value will appear in the value side (if this is alone) but could / would also appear on the key side... And I have to check that I do not have a atm = no (you never know...) Yes, I also see this as an error in the tagging-schema. We have way too many values for amenity so these collisions happen all the time. It`s not just bank+atm, it is also hotel+restaurant and many others. This way of tagging amenities simply grew without any regard for what was technically possible (most editors never properly supported multiple values for a key, thus noone was to use them as their work could be destroyed at any moment). Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Traveling Salesman v0.9.8 released
Today I am proud to announce Traveling Salesman v0.9.8 . In a few weeks, when API 0.6 goes online we want to push v1.0.0 and to do that, we need your help! We need people who try it out, make bug-reports, suggest improvements, complain... we need YOU. Just click on the webstart-link below, try to use it and then go back to the forum linked below and tell us what you think. We want to make this as stable and reliable as possible to make a usefull navigator for you to use. Traveling Salesman - 0.9.8 == Download it: https://sourceforge.net/project/platformdownload.php?group_id=203597 Start it via Java Webstart: http://travelingsales.sourceforge.net/ts.jnlp Changelog: http://travelingsales.sourceforge.net/bugs/changelog_page.php Announcement: http://apps.sourceforge.net/phpbb/travelingsales/viewtopic.php?f=3t=49 After introducing house-numbers with v0.9.7, a great deal of new improvements are now getting published with v0.9.8. The most important are probably: * support for turn-restrictions and metrics for making turns with a completely new routing-engine -plugin TurnRestrictedMultiTargetDijkstraRouter. * support for determining what country a road is in and if it is inside a city * that is used to provide support for country-spefic traffic regulations like different maximum speeds and driving on the left side * we show the ETA and remaining kilometers in the routeInstructionPanel * Plugins now support having settings of their own and the Settings-dialog was cleaned up big time * We support many more speech-synthesesis -plugins with SpeechD and invoking external programs. * The low zoom-maps are now much faster and show more roads then before by applying improved road-combining-algorithms = Changes - 052: [Renderers] ODRPaintVisitor: simplified view missing significant parts of roads (Marcuswolschon) - erledigt. - 055: [Renderers] ODRPaintVisitor: map is really sluggish with a database full of detail (Marcuswolschon) - erledigt. - 076: [Route-Finding] Route is recalculated too often (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 075: [Driving Directions] NullPointerException in SimpleRouteDescriber if there is no myNextStep (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 072: [Databases] tags-keys changing (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 060: [User-Interface] Selectable predefined zoom for destinations or route (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 071: [User-Interface] Icon for roundabouts missing (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 074: [Route-Finding] TurnRestrictedMultiTargetDijkstraRouter (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 073: [Address-Search] AdressDB strips cyrillic characters (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 070: [User-Interface] show ETA and remaining distance to destination in UI (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 043: [User-Interface] add context menu to map with two items (combbs) - geschlossen. - 069: [Driving Directions] allow an external program to be used for voice-output (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 068: [Settings and Plugin-Management] support Config-Settings with a list to choose from (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 067: [Driving Directions] support voice-output using Speechd (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 066: [Settings and Plugin-Management] Settings cannot handle null values (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 065: [Settings and Plugin-Management] Improve plugin-system to let plugins have settings of their own (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 054: [Renderers] ODRPaintVisitor: highway=path without additional tags falsely rendered like a normal road (combbs) - geschlossen. - 059: [Driving Directions] 0.9.8-beta: still wrong instructions (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 061: [User-Interface] improved finnish translatrion (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 058: [User-Interface] search field has steetname (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 056: [Driving Directions] A turn right is needed but screen shows follow road (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. - 057: [User-Interface] add instructions to log-panel (Marcuswolschon) - geschlossen. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] country boundary polygons
On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 1:46 AM, Roland Olbricht roland.olbri...@gmx.de wrote: I am looking for a simple answer to the question 'what country is lat+long in?', Has there been any progress made with this? Yes, I'm working on a server side scripting host for OSM data. This includes a reverse gazetteer as a sample application. The gazetteer works fine, but the more down-to-earth-things like updating the database without a complete data reload aren't yet working stable. So I think, the system will be available about mid-May. Traveling Salesman is using the .poly -files that Osmosis is useng to find out the country-polgon. They are consistent and later someone can write a small tool to convert the OSM-multipolygons that make up the admin_level=2 -relations into .poly -files so all data comes from OSM. forum-thread on the topic: http://apps.sourceforge.net/phpbb/travelingsales/viewtopic.php?f=4t=48sid=2e0d4b1deee51d556f71e4d7c75e3cff Sly: I do not see how your query can answer the question as the borders are broken up into multiple ways and you do not find out what ways need to be connected, what are enclaves and exclaves and build a multipolygon from it. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] extracting house-number from string
On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 5:52 PM, Stefan Breunig ste...@mathphys.fsk.uni-heidelberg.de wrote: So it misses 5bis and 135sous ? Yes, it would. But maybe it's the wrong approach to identify the housenumber and then look it up. Instead, building a list of all available housenumber/street combinations from the dataset and doing a similar search might yield the best results, independently from the exact address definition (similar means like Google does its did you mean…? feature). That would mean to load all streets of all matching cities from disk. Loading an area of nodes for all of them to get the house-numbers, evaluating all house-number -interpolations of all streets of all matching (potentially major) cities... That is not feasable. Try to search for a street+house-number in Frankfurt that way. You get 2 major cities to load from disk and the user expects a result fast as he sits in his car and is about to start driving. With Dataset we are talking about the planet earth or at least one of its major continents. Otherwise I really don't see a way to get it right everytime. If the address style differs from city to city, one would have to have a huge database on different address formats which still doesn't catch user typos or if someone gives out addresses in the wrong format. But that goes far beyond 'simple' and may require extensive resources (but it's possible, Such databases of country- address-format exist. I know that at least OsCommerce contains one. Google did it for their Maps and it even only requires one field). On the other hand an algorithm that finds the correct address most of the time is probably good enough. For navigating it's possible to drop the entire lettering stuff (i.e. 13a, 13b…) because the houses are so close in these cases that it really doesn't matter. My guess is the same goes for 5bis or 135sous. Maybe we want to just drop any lettering and just take the most likely number? There is no guarantee that 13b is near 13 and anyway...if you can identify the 13b in the search-field you have already correctly identifies it. Just because it`s a hard problem does not mean we can not try to find a good solution that works in as many cases as possible. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] extracting house-number from string
On 3/14/09, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Hi, Stefan Breunig wrote: True about \d. But this regex doesn't match any housenumber in 3rd street. It matches [number][maybe a single letter][word boundary]. Could someone from the US shed some light on this type of address: 5325 E. Pacific Coast Hwy Long Beach, CA 90804 This gets more complicated every day. ;) For the time being I changed my UI do the user has to enter street-name and house-number in 2 different text-fields for the search. I would however still like this to be one text-field in the future to make it easier for the user. STATUS I just implemented experimental support for house-number -search in Traveling Salesman using the proof of concept I wrote back on the Karlsruhe-Schema-Meeting. It is in SVN and will announce it, when a public and tested version exists that offers routing to house-numbers. FUTURE There is support for house-nodes, house-polygons and numerical interpolation. Numerical interpolation is still very primitive and advanced features like multiple houses with the same number, alphabetical interpolation,... are not yet implemented. Maybe they will not even be a part of Version 1.0 but something for 1.1 or 1.2 or even 2.0. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] extracting house-number from string
Hello, does anyone know a good algorithm to extract the house-number from a string containing street-name and house-number? Cases coollected so far: // xyz 12 // xyz 12b // 11b xyz // 11 xyz // xyz // 5th avenue // 3rd avenue // 2nd avenue // 1st avenue I need it for adding routing to house-numbers to the Traveling Salesman -navigator. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Can't get osmosis to work
On 2/28/09, A. Stice ast...@ou.edu wrote: C:\Users\Alan\Documents\Downloads\osmosis-latest.tar.gz\osmosis-latest\osmosis-0 .30\binosmosis -v --read-xml file=planet.osm --write-mysql validateSchemaVers ion=false host=localhost database=gis user=root password=** ... SEVERE: Thread for task 1-read-xml failed com.bretth.osmosis.core.OsmosisRuntimeException: Unable to read XML file planet. osm. at com.bretth.osmosis.core.xml.v0_5.XmlReader.run(XmlReader.java:124) at java.lang.Thread.run(Unknown Source) Caused by: java.io.FileNotFoundException: planet.osm (The system cannot find the file specified) at java.io.FileInputStream.open(Native Method) at java.io.FileInputStream.init(Unknown Source) at com.bretth.osmosis.core.xml.v0_5.XmlReader.run(XmlReader.java:99) ... 1 more Feb 27, 2009 8:08:54 AM com.bretth.osmosis.core.pipeline.common.PassiveTaskManag er waitForCompletion Could it be that you have no planet.osm but a planet.osm.bz2 there? It would be quite uncommon to have an uncompressed planet-file around. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Massive building import - thoughts
On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 11:29 PM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Hi, sly (sylvain letuffe) wrote: In france, next to the cadastre's agreement of using their data for OSM, we might soon be able to import something like 60% of France's builings. Assuming that most houses will have 4 nodes, you're talking about importing roughly 10 million ways and 40 million nodes. I am not sure if this assumption is correct, thinking that most houses are in cities where 2 houses join a wall and thus we get a ratio of 2:1 instead of 4:1 . Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Massive building import - thoughts
On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 7:32 PM, sly (sylvain letuffe) li...@letuffe.org wrote: Hi there, ( that will probably bring some more fear to the different API/server admins ;-) ) In france, next to the cadastre's agreement of using their data for OSM, we might soon be able to import something like 60% of France's builings. Hello Sly, do we get some metadata like the house-number for these buildings too? I could help with the associated-street and such. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] 'My first OSM experiences' - PDA Mapping software and the OSM mobile binary protocol
2009/1/6, Oliver Ford o...@oliford.co.uk: PS: Just as I'm signing this off I've stumbled over the 'OSMbin(file_format)' wiki page. Is that format related to the OSM Mobile binary somehow? Is one more developed/used than the other, has one been abandoned? It is not related to OSM-MB at all. It is another binary-format I am currently specifying version 1.0 of that can be used with the next API-version (0.6). It is optimized for different scenarios then osmmb. I am currently debugging it's reference-implementation. As stated on the wiki-page of it, it is not ready yet but making good progress. (95% done). Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] requesting filtered europe-extract - question about osmosis
2008/12/26, Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz: 2008/12/25, Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz: Are you aware that, because of the huge amount of coastline, such an extract is about 7% the size of the unfiltered Europe extract? Here's your file, it has 70 MB: http://www.remote.org/frederik/tmp/cemw.osm.bz2 Hello again, could it be that this files does not contain any nodes but only ways? Okay, I give up. 5 Atempts to download it. The last time my connection broke down after 4 hours and firefox does not let me resume. At the congress I should be able to get a local worldfile onto a larger laptop. Whar command-line do I have to run with osmosis to extract europe and to get only ways (and their nodes) that contain a given tag=value -combination? Is this osmosis --read-xml planet.osm.bz2 --way-key-value keyValueList=highway.motorway --bounding-polygon file=europe_outline.txt completeWays=yes --used-node --write-xml european_motorways.osm ? The page http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Osmosis#--bounding-polygon_.28--bp.29 links to http://www.maproom.psu.edu for polygon-files. However I cannot find a europe- polygon there. Where can I get that shape? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] requesting filtered europe-extract
Hello, I am debugging storing the map in different LevelsOfDetail and simplifying rendering while zooming out for the Traveling Salesman -navigator. During the holidays I am working on a small netbook using a cellphone for internet-access. Can someone provide me with a europe-extract that contains only highway=motorway, coastlines and the center-nodes of major cities? That would be great. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] requesting filtered europe-extract
2008/12/25, Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz: Are you aware that, because of the huge amount of coastline, such an extract is about 7% the size of the unfiltered Europe extract? Here's your file, it has 70 MB: http://www.remote.org/frederik/tmp/cemw.osm.bz2 Hello again, could it be that this files does not contain any nodes but only ways? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Traveling Salesman 0.8 with the OsmBin file-format version 0.9 and libOSM+OsmNavigation 2.3.9 released.
Hello everyone. After a year of silence I found the SVN-Head to be stable enough to relase * version 0.8 of the Traveling Salesman -navigator and * Verson 2.3.9 of the LibOSM and OsmNavigation -libraries https://apps.sourceforge.net/mediawiki/travelingsales/index.php?title=Main_Page (Note: The Java-Webstart -link will be updated to the new version in a few days. I need to access my key-storage on another computer first to create a signed jar.) They are now using 0.9, the first non-draft -version of my OsmBin file-format http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSMbin(file_format) as their new default-format. I intend to finalize this file-format as a version 1.0 when API0.6 is public with a added version-numbers and small improvements. Please give comments, so we can make this a better format for indexed, mutable on-disk -storage with random access. I also changed the default-renderer from the SimplePaintVisitor to the much nicer OdrPainsVisitor after adding support for different text-styles depending on zoom-level and way-type. Please feel invited to comment on my file-format and to file any bugs you encounter to https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?group_id=203597atid=986231 Thank you. Marcus Wolschon ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Traveling Salesman 0.8 with the OsmBin file-format version 0.9 and libOSM+OsmNavigation 2.3.9 released.
2008/12/23, Marcus Wolschon mar...@wolschon.biz: Hello everyone. After a year of silence I found the SVN-Head to be stable enough to relase * version 0.8 of the Traveling Salesman -navigator and * Verson 2.3.9 of the LibOSM and OsmNavigation -libraries https://apps.sourceforge.net/mediawiki/travelingsales/index.php?title=Main_Page (Note: The Java-Webstart -link will be updated to the new version in a few days. I need to access my key-storage on another computer first to create a signed jar.) Sorry, I posted the wrong link. It's http://apps.sourceforge.net/mediawiki/travelingsales/index.php?title=Main_Page The https-link asks for a sourceforge-account to edit wiki-pages. Marcus They are now using 0.9, the first non-draft -version of my OsmBin file-format http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSMbin(file_format) as their new default-format. I intend to finalize this file-format as a version 1.0 when API0.6 is public with a added version-numbers and small improvements. Please give comments, so we can make this a better format for indexed, mutable on-disk -storage with random access. I also changed the default-renderer from the SimplePaintVisitor to the much nicer OdrPainsVisitor after adding support for different text-styles depending on zoom-level and way-type. Please feel invited to comment on my file-format and to file any bugs you encounter to https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?group_id=203597atid=986231 Thank you. Marcus Wolschon ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] ConcurrentModificationException in Josm every few minutes - and possible fix
When I use JOSM with liveGPS+Surveyor I get the following StackTrace every
few minutes.
This would not be too bad IF an Exception would not mean
a) a popup making surveyor lose the keybord-focus and
b) LiveGPS losing the connection to the GPS-unit
...every 5 minutes. It gets worse the more gpx-points are
already collected.
I guess it was not anticipated that gpx-layers may be modified while
they are drawn.
Could someone with CVS-write-access please add the following line into
line 113 in
GpxLayer.java:
ArrayList tempWayPoints = new ArrayList(trk.trackSegs) // copy List to
avoid concurrent modification
for (WayPoint tpt : tempWayPoints) {
here is the Stack-trace.
java.util.ConcurrentModificationException
at java.util.AbstractList$Itr.checkForComodification(Unknown Source)
at java.util.AbstractList$Itr.next(Unknown Source)
at org.openstreetmap.josm.data.gpx.GpxData.length(GpxData.java:113)
at
org.openstreetmap.josm.gui.layer.GpxLayer.getToolTipText(GpxLayer.java:317)
at
org.openstreetmap.josm.gui.dialogs.LayerListDialog$1.getListCellRendererComponent(LayerListDialog.java:176)
at javax.swing.plaf.basic.BasicListUI.paintCell(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.plaf.basic.BasicListUI.paintImpl(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.plaf.basic.BasicListUI.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.plaf.ComponentUI.update(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintComponent(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintChildren(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JViewport.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintChildren(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintChildren(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintChildren(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintChildren(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintToOffscreen(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.RepaintManager$PaintManager.paintDoubleBuffered(Unknown
Source)
at javax.swing.RepaintManager$PaintManager.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.BufferStrategyPaintManager.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.RepaintManager.paint(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent._paintImmediately(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.JComponent.paintImmediately(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.RepaintManager.paintDirtyRegions(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.RepaintManager.paintDirtyRegions(Unknown Source)
at javax.swing.RepaintManager.seqPaintDirtyRegions(Unknown Source)
at
javax.swing.SystemEventQueueUtilities$ComponentWorkRequest.run(Unknown
Source)
at java.awt.event.InvocationEvent.dispatch(Unknown Source)
at java.awt.EventQueue.dispatchEvent(Unknown Source)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpOneEventForFilters(Unknown Source)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForFilter(Unknown Source)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForHierarchy(Unknown Source)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(Unknown Source)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(Unknown Source)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.run(Unknown Source)
___
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Re: [OSM-dev] mmap() (was: Re: Some statistics for file-format -development)
Hello everyone. My reference-implementation for the osmbin-format is nearly completely debugged and optimized and I was able to generate statistics about the number of ways referenced per nodes, distribution of tag-value-length, ... for a much larger sample. This time not using the city of Hamburg but the state of Baden Wuerttemberg (Germany). http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:MarcusWolschon/osmbin_draft I'll try to do all of Germany next. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] mmap()
2008/12/4 Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Marcus Wolschon wrote: My reference-implementation for the osmbin-format is nearly completely debugged and optimized and I was able to generate statistics about the number of ways referenced per nodes, distribution of tag-value-length, ... for a much larger sample. This time not using the city of Hamburg but the state of Baden Wuerttemberg (Germany). http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:MarcusWolschon/osmbin_draft I'll try to do all of Germany next. Sounds cool :) Do you have the final filesize reduction also calculated? Is the structure extendable? (I mean does it allow efficient network updates) The file-sizes are stated in the statistics. The Index by ID is optimal if a worldfile or large extract is used and can grow to be larger then the nodes/ways-file for smaller extracts where this does not matter. The nodes.id2 has about the same size as nodes.obm since I was able to reduce the average size of a nodes-record dramatically using the first statistics. The structure is mutable, meaning you can add, modify and remove nodes, ways and attributes at will. The reference-code does that. Thus you can use this as a native on-disk-format for a wide range of applications and directly apply the nightly/ hourly/minutely diffs to it without re-generating the file or downloading more then just the diff. (All code required to do that is already part of LibOSM.) The index can be removed and re-generated or substituted with another kind of index at will. (For example: I have an additional hsqldb-file with an index of all streets, villages, house-numbers and zip-codes indexed by their normalized name for address-searches.) Rules exist to repair a broken file and return it into a consistent state while loosing as little information as possible. I want to publish an automatic repair-tool later (much later). Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] mmap()
2008/12/4 Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Marcus Wolschon wrote: The structure is mutable, meaning you can add, modify and remove nodes, ways and attributes at will. How did you solve fragmentation? Fragmentation occurs only in variable-length -records. I chose a fixed-length-record to avoid this issue. It allows for trivial reuse of empty spaces and speeds up seeking in the file. (All code required to do that is already part of LibOSM.) Could we make a C version of it too? Because I think embedded is J2ME... but C is probably faster for other platforms. YOU can. The spec is easy to understand. You can also compile my code into native code and link it using gcj/gcc. Stefan ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] mmap()
2008/12/4 Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Marcus Wolschon wrote: 2008/12/4 Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Marcus Wolschon wrote: The structure is mutable, meaning you can add, modify and remove nodes, ways and attributes at will. How did you solve fragmentation? Fragmentation occurs only in variable-length -records. I chose a fixed-length-record to avoid this issue. It allows for trivial reuse of empty spaces and speeds up seeking in the file. So you do not maintain order, only use indices? That is correct. It would be too expensive to keep any kind of order when modifying a file containing the world or the size the world-file will have in..say..5 years. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] mmap()
2008/12/4 Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Marcus Wolschon wrote: It would be too expensive to keep any kind of order when modifying a file containing the world or the size the world-file will have in..say..5 years. ;) I think we fully understand eachother. But I wonder wonder what you do at a delete. Just move the last record to the gap? No. On delete I mark the record as free for reuse. I can move records to shrink a file that has grown too large but in general I anticipate that a file will much more likely grow then shrink. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Implementing a 2D-index - need feedback
2008/11/25 Marcus Wolschon [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
I am starting to implement the 2D-indexing (lat+lon-{List of NodeIDs})
for my binary file-format soon.
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:MarcusWolschon%5Cosmbin_draft#nodes.id2
I want to use a 2-dimensional AVL-tree for it with 4 byte integers for the
coordinates (compatible with the osm-database-schemas) in a fixed-record-size
-format.
Anyone have comments on my structure or ideas for a better datastructure to
use
for such an index?
Hello,
I'd probably go for a bucket quad tree with a not-too-small bucket size.
However, as a general hint, you may want to take a look at some previous art
regarding spatial data structures.
I don't particularly like the idea of a quadTree inserting
intermediate tree-nodes
at fixed intervalls in the key-space.
When I think of large rural areas next to large cities I don't think this kind
of tree will stay very balanced. This was fine for the index by ID, where our
keyspace is continous and 90% of it used.
an AVL tree may or may not do the trick, depending on its implementation.
Frankly,
I don't currently see how it would work in 2D, but I haven't pondered it too
deeply.
As for how a 2D-AVL-tree works, that's simple.
Every inner node has 2 values to compare against instead of one.
Thus you don't have LEFT and RIGHT but NORTHEAST, SOUTHEAST, NOTTHWEST
and SOUTHWEST
child-nodes. Of cause you also have 2 balance-factors of
{north,balanced,south}x{east,balanced,west} instead of {-1, 0, 1}.
You'll find some great demos here:
http://donar.umiacs.umd.edu/quadtree/index.html Joerg Henne
The link you gave me was good but there was no explanation of the
data-structures presented. Either I don't understand the rectangles-section
or they don't do anything at all.
Marcus
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Re: [OSM-dev] mmap()
2008/11/25 Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Sascha Silbe wrote: On Tue, Nov 25, 2008 at 08:47:16AM +0100, Marcus Wolschon wrote: Okay, on a big AMD-multicore-laptop the limit in Java seems to be 1GB of memory-mapped files. That's pretty small given that kernel/user split is usually 2G/2G or even 3G/1G... I think if you enable PAE all your problems will be gone :) I'll try that. Is it enabled in the kernel-maneuconfig via Processor type and features --- High Memory Support --- 64GB ? I'll try to compile a new kernel remotely and download the software required to build a new X-server matching the kernel,... Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Some statistics for file-format -development
2008/11/21 Marcus Wolschon [EMAIL PROTECTED]: 2008/11/21 Sascha Silbe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Fri, Nov 21, 2008 at 10:59:27AM +0100, Marcus Wolschon wrote: I ran into an outOfMemory-Exception memory-mapping the file when importing Baden-Württemberg. [...] (I did not think this would become an issue for file-sizes of about 100MB) Did you try it on Windows or a POSIX compatible OS? 32bit or 64bit architecture/OS/userspace? On 64bit Linux, I can easily mmap() even the whole planet database (~50GB total, with largest file being ~30GB) - on 32bit it's less, but still way more than a few hundred MBs. I will try on a Linux/x86-32 later. ATM I only have an XP on an Eeepc at my hands. I could raise the limit to a few hundred MB by using an undocumented argument to the java-runtime but still , reserving 3GB only allows me to memory-map 2 files with a sum of 450MB. Okay, I found it. I ran my program on an eeepc while programming on the train. Now I wrote a small test-program that would memory-map a 1 GB-file and write to it. It works fine on a 2GB desktop-PC but fails to aquire the mapping on the eeepc with 2GB. Both run Windows XP. I added a fallback to use normal IO for the index-file if the memory cannot be mapped. It is much, much slower (about 1/10 the speed since in the index I change single integers at random locations in a large file) but it works. I'll do the large files on my big Linux-laptop now. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Some statistics for file-format -development
2008/11/24 Sascha Silbe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 10:23:31AM +0100, Marcus Wolschon wrote: It works fine on a 2GB desktop-PC but fails to aquire the mapping on the eeepc with 2GB. Both run Windows XP. So on Windows the maximum mmap() size depends on the RAM size? Ugly. Is it physical RAM size or virtual (i.e. increasing swap file allows larger mmap() sizes)? No. Both have 2GB of Ram and both run Windows XP. But one is an Atom N270 -processor and one a desktop Core2. They even run the same Java-version. I even checked the registry for differences on the maximum mappable ram. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Some statistics for file-format -development
2008/11/24 Sascha Silbe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Mon, Nov 24, 2008 at 12:59:18PM +0100, Marcus Wolschon wrote: Both have 2GB of Ram and both run Windows XP. But one is an Atom N270 -processor and one a desktop Core2. Ah, all right. Unfortunately, none of datasheets [1,2] at Intel mentions the size of the virtual address space. I'd have expected it to be the same for all IA32 systems then... :-/ Okay, on a big AMD-multicore-laptop the limit in Java seems to be 1GB of memory-mapped files. Ulimit was unlimited and --XX:MaxDirectMemorySize was set to 32GB -Xmx was a few GB. I am using the current Java6 -patchlevel 10 from Sun. Strange thing is: Setting MaxDirectMemorySize to 3GB you can't start because some Swing-Code in font-loading can't memory-map the few kilobytes it needs. If I set no limit, it works but failes once the file-size goes over 1GB. I'd like to try this on a 64bit-Linux on that box but don't know how to do that yet. Any help on turning a debian 32bit into a 64-bit or running a 64bit-VM in a 32bit-Linux? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Some statistics for file-format -development
Hello everyone, during the development of my osmbin file-format I ahev gathered some statistics using an extract of the city of hamburg (a larger extract of all of the state of baden-wuertemberg is computing right now). http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:MarcusWolschon/osmbin_draft#statistics http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=p5alGmffVt6gMsh_x2iXzew They may be usefull for others doing similar tasks. It shows the history of: * how many nodes/ways have now many tags * how many tag-values have each length (for ways and nodes) * how many ways have how many nodes referenced * how many nodes have how many ways referencing them * ... I made the linked spreadshet to find the optimum number of slots for each of these in my fixed-record-length format. PS: I could use some help with specifying and implementing the 2D-index for nodes(location) and ways(bounding-box). ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Some statistics for file-format -development
2008/11/21 Matthias Brandt [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Marcus Wolschon wrote: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:MarcusWolschon/osmbin_draft#statistics http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=p5alGmffVt6gMsh_x2iXzew They may be usefull for others doing similar tasks. Thanks a lot! This is really healpful for me! I ran into an outOfMemory-Exception memory-mapping the file when importing Baden-Württemberg. The current statistics are about a city, this new run should provide more representative data. However it will take a while to change the architecture of my code to not require memory-mapping all of the binary-file while writing. (I did not think this would become an issue for file-sizes of about 100MB) Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Some statistics for file-format -development
2008/11/21 Sascha Silbe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Fri, Nov 21, 2008 at 10:59:27AM +0100, Marcus Wolschon wrote: I ran into an outOfMemory-Exception memory-mapping the file when importing Baden-Württemberg. [...] (I did not think this would become an issue for file-sizes of about 100MB) Did you try it on Windows or a POSIX compatible OS? 32bit or 64bit architecture/OS/userspace? On 64bit Linux, I can easily mmap() even the whole planet database (~50GB total, with largest file being ~30GB) - on 32bit it's less, but still way more than a few hundred MBs. I will try on a Linux/x86-32 later. ATM I only have an XP on an Eeepc at my hands. I could raise the limit to a few hundred MB by using an undocumented argument to the java-runtime but still , reserving 3GB only allows me to memory-map 2 files with a sum of 450MB. I made sure there are no references to the old mapping when growing the file and mapping again and even called the garbage-collector manually. The code is pretty small and easy to understand. http://travelingsales.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/travelingsales/libosm/src/org/openstreetmap/osm/data/osmbin/ https://sourceforge.net/svn/?group_id=203597 (look at nodesfile.java and it's super-class FixedRecordFile.java) I don't understand how this can be yet but I intend to find out. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] wiki problems
Could this have something to do with SchlundTech being completely down? Their DNS-servers are gone since a few hours. Marcus 2008/11/21 sylvain letuffe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi there, The wiki is down again... Are there any help someone with few programming skills but high admin sys skills could provide to help the wiki operate better ? Is the wiki installed on a dedicated machine, does someone can provide me a link to the wiki's visitors stats, load stats ? Is there somewhere an explanation of how the wiki is architecturaly installed ? ( mysql DB ? mysql server ? php ? config files ) Can I get in touch with actual sys admins ? Is my help anyhow wanted ? -- Sylvain Letuffe [EMAIL PROTECTED] qui suis-je : http://slyserv.dyndns.org ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Bluetooth-GPS and RXTX trouble
I have one problem: Under Windows I have a bluetooth-GPS connected to the virtual serial-port 5, When I open that port in a Java-program I can open it just fine but in 90% of the cases shortly after that the bluetooth-connection is gone. I can still ready 0 byte from the port, it is still open and all I did was read from it. Then again, sometimes it works and I can actually read nmea-sentences. Any clues? ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Binary OSM; the first pass encoder
Hello Robert, as far as I understand it the OSM-databases store the location in long integers anyway. Thus there is no precision to be gained from using floats. You only loose storage-space, computation-time and native functionality on platforms that do not have native floating- points (like many cellphones, reflashed navigation-devices or all mobile J2ME java-platforms). Marcus 2008/11/12, Robert (Jamie) Munro [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Floats only allow more precision as the location being considered tends towards 0,0 latitude and longitude. For the general case, using an integer with the same number of bits of storage will always be more precise, particularly at the extremes. As others have said, 32 bits gives errors of less than 10mm on the equator, with even greater accuracy as you move away from it. This is around 1000 times more accurate than the data in OSM can be reasonably recorded at with standard GPS equipment. Robert (Jamie) Munro ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Binary OSM; the first pass encoder
Hello Stefan, cool to see some progress here. If you decide on an index-format I can implement a DataSource for Traveling Salesman for it (however any updates can only be appended). Did you have a look at http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/User:MarcusWolschon%5Cosmbin_draft ? I am trying something similar but with fixed length records and back-links from node to way to allow updates to be applied to the file. 1.4GB-135MB is nice but you still don't want to download 135MB every day to have an up-to-date netherlands-file (let alone to do this for the planet). I was quite occupied with another open-source-project of mine and switching jobs but now I should have the time to finish implementing my own proposal in code and test it's performance. Marcus 2008/11/9 Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi All, Because I am getting more and more disappointed with the current state of affairs with respect to the downloading of OSM content some people on the Dutch OSM IRC channel thought of an alternative way of distribution that could potentionally get binary diffs after any possible download in the past. Can you give some more specifics on the binary-diffs? Is there some code or a spec for a service to get them? In principle it is nothing more than: N [long id] [float lat] [float lon] [time_t timestamp] [uint length of userfield] [non terminated userfield] How do you encode the nodes of a way and the ways, nodes and relations of a relation? If interested taking a peak is possible at; http://repo.or.cz/w/handlerosm.git?a=tree;f=osmbinary;h=1701a9194285a56e7a91536def314fb8b2e95350;hb=96c7b81af692df89bc6c5eba999e9bb61c92323c I see you used float for lat and lon. Did you think about using long integers? We don't loose any precision since the osm-db already saves them this way and they are much smaller and faster to compute with. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Hibernate Spatial
Hello, did anyone work with Hibernate Spatial and MySQL or PostGIS yet? If so, is it possible to map any schema existing tools use or do I need to create my own database that is incompatible with anything else? I'd like to evaluate it as another DataStore-plugin for Traveling Salesman. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] What country is something in?
Great work! I haven't tried it yet but had a brief look. Is it possible to have the name of the country in the filename of the .border-file? (I don't care what translation of the name, the first one found will do.) I have little time at the moment (end of month again) to write it myself but I guess it would be trivial to add an option to output the border as a way in OSM-XML -format instead? I guess osmosis-polygons are the most important for cutting maps but with an osm-polygon I could add it to my routing-software in no time and make use of it for maxspeed and driving on the left or the right side of the road (think turnabout ahead, second exit). Marcus 2008/10/29 Roland Olbricht [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hello everybody, you can now download a first version of the discover-boundaries tool. In its current state, the tool delivers the multipolygons constituting a country's border, in a format suitable to osmosis' --bounding-polygon option. Feel free to ask for a different format it that would fit better. For the download, please visit http://wmaz.math.uni-wuppertal.de/olbricht/osm/ - the national boundaries contains the results and can be accessed via its index.html - the Discover Boundaries source code contains the source code. It is described in README and can be used out-of-the-box by the script RUNME and an OSM XML file. I would be grateful for any comments. ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Binary OSM db (was: Re: on-disk indexing of geodata)
2008/10/22 Sascha Silbe [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Ok. Do you plan to make your current format into a kind of standard for binary, indexed OSM data or do you want to go with, say, Marcus' plans (for which I don't clearly see if he wants it to be lossy or lossless)? Well, I try to make a lossless one. Users who want a lossy one can still filter out the data they don't want in there but the format should be capable of describing all of OSM since there's no telling what a person may want filtered out. You may however prioritize some attributes (e.g. the ones needed for fast, real-time rendering and smooth zooming) over others (invisible ones used for routing). Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] on-disk indexing of geodata
Hello. I am trying to create a binary-format for storing OSM-data. ( http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/User:MarcusWolschon%5Cosmbin_draft#nodes.obm ) I am looking for advise on how to create an on-disk index in one dimension (element-id-offset where it is stored) and 2 dimensions (bounding-box-nodeIDs and boundingBox-intersecting bouding-boxes of ways). Thanks, Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] What country is something in?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Stefan de Konink schrieb: Roland Olbricht schreef: is anybody working currently on the What country is something in? issue from the Things-to-do-page? I would like to work on it, but I want to avoid doing work twice. Isn't that a trivial thing using PostGIS? It would be if we had polygons or complete relations containing all parts of a complete border. ...we don't have either. What we have are merely fragments of borders. I wold LOVE to have a function that can tell me what country a point is in. It would make looking up local laws for routing finally possible. Marcus -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFI74mdf1hPnk3Z0cQRAl49AKCBf+c/L4q1G0UTdZhnK2WptSBaqACeKd1Y T9Ou1l66BNAD3xEJfL3BMCA= =bB+5 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] What country is something in?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Stefan de Konink schrieb: Marcus Wolschon schreef: Stefan de Konink schrieb: Roland Olbricht schreef: is anybody working currently on the What country is something in? issue from the Things-to-do-page? I would like to work on it, but I want to avoid doing work twice. Isn't that a trivial thing using PostGIS? It would be if we had polygons or complete relations containing all parts of a complete border. What are you saying? We don't have borders? That sounds unlikely ;) If the border on the other hand is broken, then fix it :) I tried and fixed a great deal of the german border but it was too much work and there are regions where I do not know in details where the border actually should be. As for fixing the other 100 countries sorry, I have a live, a work and other open-source projects to keep me busy. Not the least of wich is writing my navigation-software that shall use the borders. Marcus -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFI74ttf1hPnk3Z0cQRAvMaAJ9NJ80uxAp49BMl46mebB+YimnQMACeMr3/ 2E1eUnvw2O0Umyc0HpsTn1Q= =1Eb2 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Advanced Routing Algorithms
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Vojtech Brtnik schrieb: Hello, do you know any open library in C# (or other .NET lang., worse C++), that would implement some of the advanced routing algorithms?, for example: - reach-based routing (Gutman) - highway hierarchies (Sanders and Schultes) - transit-node routing - precomputed cluster distances . Maybe you should ask this on the routing-list. Marcus -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFI3QG4f1hPnk3Z0cQRAoOXAJ4rv9b9pq69AsURGBBluXsOAau9/wCfR1qL vkwuoHgWJYRxiuWnQ9be/+g= =xjX1 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Roadnav moving to OSM data only: some questions...
On Fri, 22 Aug 2008 08:31:38 +0100, Tom Hughes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The API is based on http and very simple, so there is not much to implement for loading data. ... but mobile navigation systems should probably be using planet anyway and not pulling from the API as we don't have the resources to support lots of read-only clients pulling from the API like that. I don't see mobile clients with their own networking abilities to use the world-file. The world-file simply requires ressources that are nowhere near present. As for the API. This is read-only -access and need not be the most current data. So if we ever run into load-issues anyone can set up mirrors within hours/days using only a database, an apache and some php or python -code as well as the daily diffs and maybe a monthly full reload of the world-file. There was much fruitless discussion over the best format to store these but after a while we started simply mapping this insted of arguing with the Karlsruhe Schema. It is done as an experiment to gather experience how best to map all the exceptional cases of house-numbers but has been widely adopted. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Proposed_features/House_numbers/Karlsruhe_Schema I'm not sure widely is the right word... Right. Let's say it's the only thing we have. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] another josm plugin error
Can't someone set up a nightly build for JOSM and all it's plugins that simply annoys everyone on thw josm-dev with a daily mail that includes all the broken dependencies? I don't even propose regression-tests or style-reports, just compile-errors. It's not exactly the first time that a plugin no longer compiles after some changes to the josm-base. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] real-time traffic map
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 17:08:34 +0200, Rogier Wolff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: b) maybe I don't want you knowing where I am and how fast I'm going This is an issue. The phone company already knows this, and they would get into a big scandal if they suddenly started selling that data. For OSM, this type of data should also lose the identifying information as soon as possible. But the people having root access to the server will always be able to put one and one together. (this is no different from those having root at the phone company. But those guys are bound by an NDA). I disagree here. The server sees an anonymous ip-adress and some summary-information that does not include the exact start+end and not the actual time of travel but only something like weekday-morning or friday-afternoon. Even the root of the server that gathers this info cannot know who uploads. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] real-time traffic map
On Wed, 20 Aug 2008 13:00:05 +0300, Bogdan Bivolaru [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear all, Do you know any way to maintain an instantaneous map of a road? By that I mean: can all the drivers using OpenStreetMap + GPS upload their current location and direction they are going to, instant average speed to some server and then can the server process the uploads to show the average speed and traffic? And maybe people can upload other location related info like a picture of an interesting view, or info about a car accident? Any free software plugin for OpenStreetMap that does that? OpenStreetMap is no software but a database, so it does not have plugins. Only applications that use our database. I don't think such a software exists but it sure sounds interesting. Are you capable of writing such a thing or specify it in more detail? This sounds like something that could be done using Google Apps Engine. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Chopped of ways. Change Default or remove ID
On Thu, 14 Aug 2008 07:56:26 +0200, Jochen Topf [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 03:44:57PM +1000, Brett Henderson wrote: Karl Newman wrote: Even still, it's a valid concern and there are other operations (i.e., cutting into tiles or tag transforms) that can manipulate the data into a form that probably shouldn't be uploaded. Karl Yep, agree. If it wasn't the default behaviour it would just be far less likely to occur :-) ... But people *want* to use the data they get from some kind of extraction process to base decisions upon. And they should be able to. Not all the data is invalidated by an extraction, only some of it. It makes sense to mark those parts invalid that are, so that an automated process can decide what it uses and what not. I propose to not modify ways by default and to remove the way-id of ways that are modified during extraction. What should a tool care if the way references node-ids that it has no nodes for because they are outside the bounding-box? It has to ignore them. The removal of the ID is because this is no longer the way with that ID but a new and artificially created way that contains a part of the original one. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Chopped of ways. Change Default or remove ID
On Thu, 14 Aug 2008 14:06:13 +0100, Nick Austin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then just flip the sign of the ID to make it a negative number, (unless negative IDs already have some meaning of which I'm not aware). Negative IDs mean new entities that, if uploaded, will be created. This is not perfect but far better then destroying the original way and it is something maplint will find and mark. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Chopped of ways. Change Default or remove ID
On Thu, 14 Aug 2008 15:19:00 +0200, Jochen Topf [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Then just flip the sign of the ID to make it a negative number, (unless negative IDs already have some meaning of which I'm not aware). They have. Negative IDs are used by JOSM and other tools to denote new, not yet uploaded objects. So this would make the problem even worse, as it could lead to re-uploading of broken ways. I think it's worse to destroy perfectly good ways then to mistakenly upload parts of them and get this mistake marked by maplint. The first breaks the map, the second has no impact on rendered maps nor routing on the map. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Call to mobile developers: OSM binary file format
On Fri, 08 Aug 2008 10:17:58 +0200, Jan Peter Stotz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Chris Browet wrote: We all have the same problem: the XML OSM format is not efficient for mobile devices. For the time being, we all develop our own solution to transform the XML in whatever binary format suitable for a mobile application, often forcing the user to use a specific desktop application for the transformation. May be WAP WAP Binary XML (WBXML) encoding [1] would be a possible solution? It significantly reduces the size of data to be transfered while keeping the compatibility to the current data format. The transportation could be still HTTP or a different binary protocol with a higher efficiency. So, are we talking about storage or transport? I was talking about a storage-format (where of cause offering already compressed maps in that format over a network is possible). Do we have a problem with gzip-compressed xml for transport as it is? I guess a good, indexed binary storage-format is much more pressing. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Call to mobile developers: OSM binary file format
On Fri, 8 Aug 2008 10:34:54 +0200 (CEST), Stefan de Konink [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A binary XML format would be better to parse for an XML processor. But OSM data is pretty structured. The point is that for line transfers a pretty efficient format can be choosen that is totally unparsible by embedded devices. Well, if it's binary it's no longer XML. wbXML is a binary encoding of XML but it is no longer XML and it's parser is no longer an XML-parser. Since the subject suggest mobile developers; they might only be interested in a derrivative format that even *not* includes some information, and has a high focus on routing. Now I was always teached that if something focusses on one thing it will need to make compromises. So, do we agree that the focus is routing and navigation -software? If so, we could move on to finding out what data we actually need to store and what we can leave out. Once we know what we are storing, we can start on the how to store, retrieve search, merge and update it. Binary XML is cute if there is an efficient parser. But I presume it would work as great as any other database format specification. I wonder if even OSM in SQLite will give better line speeds. You got me confused. What do database-formats have to do with transfer-formats? You would never use wbxml for storage on a mobile device (you have to load it into ram and decode instead of indexing into the file) and databases not for transfer. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
[OSM-dev] Wiki-Page for defining OSM binary file format created
Hello everyone, as this discussion on osm-dev seems to get very unfocused I created a wiki-page http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/OSM_Mobile_Binary_Format for such a data-format. So we can organize our thoughts on the topic and together make this happen. If anyone does not agree with the basic scope of the format (e.g. define an alternative transport), please feel free to create a page for it or start working on updating the current mobile-binary-protocoll. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Call to mobile developers: OSM binary file format
Hello Chris, not only for mobile devices but for Laptops too I'd really apreciate a binary-format. Do you intend to save all the data OSM has or only support a subset required for routing and map-rendering? Do you think about floating-point or fixed-point coordinates? We could start by collecting the requirements of everyone. Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
Re: [OSM-dev] Call to mobile developers: OSM binary file format
On Thu, 7 Aug 2008 11:03:05 +0200, Chris Browet [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Do you intend to save all the data OSM has or only support a subset required for routing and map-rendering? The idea is to have a binary format specification. The actual organization of the files will be up to the application. Actually I ment what kind of features this format shall support? Do you want to only include streets? Do you want comments? Id-numbers of nodes and ways for updates? Include all tags or only a small selection? include geographic featues required for map-rendering on the device or only routable streets? Include the timestamps present in OSM-XML? Save ways their nodes as 2 entity-types or include the node-locations in the way? Marcus ___ dev mailing list dev@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/dev
