firefox-dev posting [was Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner]

[Karl Tomlinson]

Justin and I did some investigation and weren't able to reproduce
the problems people were encountering last year.

We confirmed that it is not necessary to subscribe before posting.

If the sender is not whitelisted, then messages receive an
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If a message does not get posted on the list and there is no
moderation auto-reply, then it has gone missing, perhaps
filtered with the spam.  firefox-dev-owner is the official contact
if there is a problem.

On Thu, 23 Mar 2017 00:55:19 -0700, Justin Dolske wrote:

> Can you follow up with me in separate email about what posts you're
> concerned about?
>
> I've done most of the rejection moderation on the list, and usually reply
> to people explaining why and where a better venue would be. Most stuff that
> has been moderated is exactly what's listed there as being off-topic, and
> that's fairly uncommon. Obvious spam gets silently plonked, but that's
> presumably not what you're talking about.
>
> This thread, had it been posted to firefox-dev, would very clearly be
> on-topic and not rejected.
>
> Justin
>
> On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 7:35 PM, Karl Tomlinson  wrote:
>
>> Benjamin Smedberg writes:
>>
>> > This is not the list for this question. Please respect this question to the
>> > firefox-dev list.
>>
>> https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/firefox-dev says "Anyone can post. By
>> default, posts will be reviewed by a moderator before being sent to the
>> list."
>> bit in fact some unclear set of posts are redirected to /dev/null, even
>> when
>> contributing to the goal and abiding by the rules.
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Emma Humphries]

FYI, this was resolved yesterday. Peter DeHann's volunteered to triage the
component. Replies to FFx list please.

-- Emma

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 6:22 AM,  wrote:

> I have not been able to find an owner for the Firefox::New Tab Page
> bugzilla component (bug 1346908).  There are 35 tests in the tree and
> without anyone to assume responsibility for them when they are intermittent
> (bug 1338848), I plan to delete them all if I cannot get an owner by the
> end of the month including someone who will sign up to be the triage owner
> for the bugzilla component.
>
> Thanks for helping me find owners for tests!
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Justin Dolske]

Can you follow up with me in separate email about what posts you're
concerned about?

I've done most of the rejection moderation on the list, and usually reply
to people explaining why and where a better venue would be. Most stuff that
has been moderated is exactly what's listed there as being off-topic, and
that's fairly uncommon. Obvious spam gets silently plonked, but that's
presumably not what you're talking about.

This thread, had it been posted to firefox-dev, would very clearly be
on-topic and not rejected.

Justin

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 7:35 PM, Karl Tomlinson  wrote:

> Benjamin Smedberg writes:
>
> > This is not the list for this question. Please respect this question to
> the
> > firefox-dev list.
>
> https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/firefox-dev says "Anyone can post. By
> default, posts will be reviewed by a moderator before being sent to the
> list."
> bit in fact some unclear set of posts are redirected to /dev/null, even
> when
> contributing to the goal and abiding by the rules.
> ___
> dev-platform mailing list
> dev-platform@lists.mozilla.org
> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform
>
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Karl Tomlinson]

Benjamin Smedberg writes:

> This is not the list for this question. Please respect this question to the
> firefox-dev list.

https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/firefox-dev says "Anyone can post. By
default, posts will be reviewed by a moderator before being sent to the list."
bit in fact some unclear set of posts are redirected to /dev/null, even when
contributing to the goal and abiding by the rules.
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Gijs Kruitbosch]

On 22/03/2017 13:22, jma...@mozilla.com wrote:

I have not been able to find an owner for the Firefox::New Tab Page bugzilla 
component (bug 1346908).  There are 35 tests in the tree and without anyone to 
assume responsibility for them when they are intermittent (bug 1338848), I plan 
to delete them all if I cannot get an owner by the end of the month including 
someone who will sign up to be the triage owner for the bugzilla component.

Thanks for helping me find owners for tests!


I've responded on the bug, so let's continue there. bsmedberg is right 
that fx-dev is probably a better place for this type of question (if 
relating to Firefox frontend stuff) in future.


~ Gijs
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Ben Kelly]

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 10:00 AM, David Burns  wrote:

> On 22 March 2017 at 13:49, Ben Kelly  wrote:
>
>> Finding someone to own the feature and investigate intermittents is
>> important too, but that doesn't mean the tests have zero value.
>>
>
> This just strikes me that we are going to disable until they are all gone
> then we have dead code in the tree and still no one to own it. Its a longer
> process that could end up at the same end point.
>

Are *all* the tests intermittent?  My quick read of the bug was that its a
single test.  I just don't understand the logic of *removing green tests*
from the tree.  The idea they might one day become intermittent is not
compelling to me.
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Lawrence Mandel]

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 10:33 AM, Ben Kelly  wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 10:00 AM, David Burns  wrote:
>
> > On 22 March 2017 at 13:49, Ben Kelly  wrote:
> >
> >> Finding someone to own the feature and investigate intermittents is
> >> important too, but that doesn't mean the tests have zero value.
> >>
> >
> > This just strikes me that we are going to disable until they are all gone
> > then we have dead code in the tree and still no one to own it. Its a
> longer
> > process that could end up at the same end point.
> >
>
> Are *all* the tests intermittent?  My quick read of the bug was that its a
> single test.  I just don't understand the logic of *removing green tests*
> from the tree.  The idea they might one day become intermittent is not
> compelling to me.
>

Leaving aside this part, I think Joel's request is help to find an owner
for these tests who can be responsible for maintaining them. I think this
is the right approach and will help get the test suite into a better state
over time. Finding an owner makes the rest of this thread moot at this
point (although we can certainly talk about policy separately). Is there an
obvious owner for the new tab page tests and Bugzilla component? To which
engineering team does this work now fall?

Lawrence
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Benjamin Smedberg]

This is not the list for this question. Please respect this question to the
firefox-dev list.

Also I recommend that another way to get traction in this sort of question
is to contact the moisture owner, in the case Dave Townsend.

--BDS

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 9:25 AM  wrote:

> I have not been able to find an owner for the Firefox::New Tab Page
> bugzilla component (bug 1346908).  There are 35 tests in the tree and
> without anyone to assume responsibility for them when they are intermittent
> (bug 1338848), I plan to delete them all if I cannot get an owner by the
> end of the month including someone who will sign up to be the triage owner
> for the bugzilla component.
>
> Thanks for helping me find owners for tests!
> ___
> dev-platform mailing list
> dev-platform@lists.mozilla.org
> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform
>
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[David Burns]

On 22 March 2017 at 13:49, Ben Kelly  wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 9:39 AM,  wrote:
>
>
> Finding someone to own the feature and investigate intermittents is
> important too, but that doesn't mean the tests have zero value.
>

This just strikes me that we are going to disable until they are all gone
then we have dead code in the tree and still no one to own it. Its a longer
process that could end up at the same end point.

David
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Ben Kelly]

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 9:39 AM,  wrote:

> On Wednesday, March 22, 2017 at 9:35:35 AM UTC-4, Ben Kelly wrote:
> > You plan to delete all the tests?  This seems somewhat extreme for a
> > shipped feature.  Why not disable just the tests that are intermittent?
>
> I agree that does sound extreme, but if nobody cares about the tests or
> will accept responsibility if we have failures, then they have no real
> value.  I assume they have value and this is why I am asking for help to
> find someone who cares about the code and will take responsibility for the
> feature and related tests.
>

I don't agree they have no value "if nobody cares about the tests or will
accept responsibility if we have failures".  If someone changes something
in platform and these tests turn perma-red, that person has to fix their
code.  This is how we prevent regressions.

Finding someone to own the feature and investigate intermittents is
important too, but that doesn't mean the tests have zero value.
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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[jmaher]

On Wednesday, March 22, 2017 at 9:35:35 AM UTC-4, Ben Kelly wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 9:22 AM,  wrote:
> 
> > I have not been able to find an owner for the Firefox::New Tab Page
> > bugzilla component (bug 1346908).  There are 35 tests in the tree and
> > without anyone to assume responsibility for them when they are intermittent
> > (bug 1338848), I plan to delete them all if I cannot get an owner by the
> > end of the month including someone who will sign up to be the triage owner
> > for the bugzilla component.
> >
> 
> You plan to delete all the tests?  This seems somewhat extreme for a
> shipped feature.  Why not disable just the tests that are intermittent?

I agree that does sound extreme, but if nobody cares about the tests or will 
accept responsibility if we have failures, then they have no real value.  I 
assume they have value and this is why I am asking for help to find someone who 
cares about the code and will take responsibility for the feature and related 
tests.

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Re: unowned module: Firefox::New Tab Page, help me find an owner

[Ben Kelly]

On Wed, Mar 22, 2017 at 9:22 AM,  wrote:

> I have not been able to find an owner for the Firefox::New Tab Page
> bugzilla component (bug 1346908).  There are 35 tests in the tree and
> without anyone to assume responsibility for them when they are intermittent
> (bug 1338848), I plan to delete them all if I cannot get an owner by the
> end of the month including someone who will sign up to be the triage owner
> for the bugzilla component.
>

You plan to delete all the tests?  This seems somewhat extreme for a
shipped feature.  Why not disable just the tests that are intermittent?
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