Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Lukas Javorsky]

Thank you all for the feedback,

Indeed the summary was a bit misleading, I forgot to change it after I
listed the packages. I fixed it now.

I also added that maintainers should decide which spellchecker they prefer
and migrate to that one (hunspell is not mandatory).

On Mon, May 29, 2023 at 9:48 AM Barry  wrote:

>
>
> On 28 May 2023, at 15:44, Sam Varshavchik  wrote:
>
> Hunspell does not have a functionally-equivalent C++ API. It has a C++ API
> of its own, but it's targeted at applications that come with their own
> language dictionaries. Its C++ API is, basically, a lookup function against
> a dictionary file that the application also supplies, it does not have a
> C++ API that offers a convenient way for applications to run a spell check
> against the system's default dictionary. The way for an application to do
> it is to have it run hunspell itself separately, and talk to it via pipes.
> Hopefully, it's easy for the application to do that without leaking other
> file descriptors.
>
>
> I found the hunspell C++ API usable. See
> https://github.com/barry-scott/BarrysEmacs/blob/master/Editor/Source/Common/spell_checker.cpp
>  for
> an example.
>
> Barry
>
>
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-- 
S pozdravom/ Best regards

Lukáš Javorský

Software Engineer, Core service - Databases

Red Hat 

Purkyňova 115 (TPB-C)

612 00 Brno - Královo Pole

ljavo...@redhat.com

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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Barry]

> On 28 May 2023, at 15:44, Sam Varshavchik  wrote:
> 
> Hunspell does not have a functionally-equivalent C++ API. It has a C++ API of 
> its own, but it's targeted at applications that come with their own language 
> dictionaries. Its C++ API is, basically, a lookup function against a 
> dictionary file that the application also supplies, it does not have a C++ 
> API that offers a convenient way for applications to run a spell check 
> against the system's default dictionary. The way for an application to do it 
> is to have it run hunspell itself separately, and talk to it via pipes. 
> Hopefully, it's easy for the application to do that without leaking other 
> file descriptors.

I found the hunspell C++ API usable. See 
https://github.com/barry-scott/BarrysEmacs/blob/master/Editor/Source/Common/spell_checker.cpp
 for an example.

Barry


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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Kevin Kofler via devel]

Sam Varshavchik wrote:
> I have one package in Fedora. It uses aspell's C++ API.
> 
> Hunspell does not have a functionally-equivalent C++ API.

Then use Enchant2, as already suggested. It has a C (enchant.h) and a C++ 
(enchant++.h) API.

Or if it is a Qt/KDE application, just use Sonnet.

> it does not have a C++ API that offers a convenient way for applications
> to run a spell check against the system's default dictionary.

Enchant and Sonnet both handle that for you (they use the Hunspell C++ API 
and do their own file lookup in system paths), see:
https://github.com/AbiWord/enchant/blob/e224b4cbc9856d86335afb43dd1a6651f99fc58e/providers/enchant_hunspell.cpp#L196
https://invent.kde.org/frameworks/sonnet/-/blob/88ba0b8c53d4bc6fbb45ab5350bdf5aa4fde23d7/src/plugins/hunspell/hunspellclient.cpp#L23

Kevin Kofler
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Kevin Kofler via devel]

Peter Oliver wrote:
> If we’re going to recommend migration to anything, shouldn’t it be
> enchant2?  Users would be able to configure their preferred spellchecking
> engine per language (which I imagine is more important for some languages
> than others), and we wouldn’t have to go through this again in the future
> if we hypothetically decided that, say, Nuspell should replace Hunspell as
> our default spellchecker.

It shall be noted that KDE upstream actually dropped Enchant support in 
Sonnet in KF5 and switched to using Hunspell directly. (They also support 
aspell, hspell, and voikko. All 4 are optional at compile-time, and plugins 
at runtime.) Though to be fair, Sonnet is already an abstraction similar to 
Enchant, and having an abstraction built on top of an abstraction apparently 
did not work out that well.

Kevin Kofler
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Kevin Kofler via devel]

ijaaskelai...@outlook.com wrote:
> What are Finnish users supposed to do once aspell-fi retires?

As I understand it, the only spellchecker the Finnish spellchecking 
community supports is Voikko. Unfortunately, upstreams have been reluctant 
to add support for a single-language spellchecking library when the rest of 
the world has been moving to Hunspell.

You can find some ancient unmaintained Hunspell dictionaries for Finnish, 
which are based on the same ispell-fi 0.7 from 2000 as the aspell-fi 
dictionaries you are apparently using:
https://github.com/fluks/fi-FI-mozilla-spellchecker
The copyright file says the dictionaries come from the Debian myspell-fi 
package, which is built from the ispell-fi source package:
https://sources.debian.org/src/ispell-fi/
https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ispell-fi/0.7-18
(That source code should probably be included, given the GPL license of the 
dictionaries.)
This changelog:
https://sources.debian.org/src/ispell-fi/0.7-18/CHANGELOG/
gives the date of the last upstream change as "3rd of September 2000". These 
could be packaged as hunspell-fi, but upstream is completely dead. (Even the 
GitHub repository that just republishes the files has not been touched since 
2017. No changes have been made in that repository at all. The Debian 
package was last touched in 2011, the original upstream in 2000.)

There is also a hyphenation dictionary for Hunspell's "hyphen":
http://hlt.sztaki.hu/resources/hunspell/Finnish/fi_FI.zip
converted 2003-11-03 from a LaTeX rule file apparently last touched in 1995. 
This could be packaged as hyphen-fi, but there too, upstream is dead.

If you want these rules to be maintained, somebody who speaks the Finnish 
language will have to do it. (There was a suggestion to look for inspiration 
at the rules for Estonian, which, as you probably know, is closely related.)

Kevin Kofler
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Sam Varshavchik]

Mattia Verga via devel writes:


I'd also like to raise attention to what I think is a misleading Change
Summary:

> Deprecating aspell package because it is no longer
> Required/Buildrequired by any package in Fedora.
This is clearly not true, as the change is about migrating package to
another spellchecker.


I have one package in Fedora. It uses aspell's C++ API.

Hunspell does not have a functionally-equivalent C++ API. It has a C++ API  
of its own, but it's targeted at applications that come with their own  
language dictionaries. Its C++ API is, basically, a lookup function against  
a dictionary file that the application also supplies, it does not have a C++  
API that offers a convenient way for applications to run a spell check  
against the system's default dictionary. The way for an application to do it  
is to have it run hunspell itself separately, and talk to it via pipes.  
Hopefully, it's easy for the application to do that without leaking other  
file descriptors.


I'll have to code that, which I'll do, but I don't know how many other  
applications currently rely on aspell's C++ API, and whether their upstreams  
are also willing to update.




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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Mattia Verga via devel]

Il 27/05/23 11:56, Peter Oliver ha scritto:
>
> If we’re going to recommend migration to anything, shouldn’t it be enchant2?  
> Users would be able to configure their preferred spellchecking engine per 
> language (which I imagine is more important for some languages than others), 
> and we wouldn’t have to go through this again in the future if we 
> hypothetically decided that, say, Nuspell should replace Hunspell as our 
> default spellchecker.
>
+1 here. If we have to convince upstream to migrate to a different 
default spellchecker, I think it's better to push enchant2. If it is 
about having the package maintainer build their package against another 
spellchecker, hunspell is fine, but drop a note about enchant2 is preferred.

I'd also like to raise attention to what I think is a misleading Change 
Summary:

> Deprecating aspell package because it is no longer 
> Required/Buildrequired by any package in Fedora.
This is clearly not true, as the change is about migrating package to 
another spellchecker.

Mattia

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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Sam Varshavchik]

Lukas Javorsky writes:


Hi,


I would like to announce the Fedora change for the deprecation of the aspell  
package [1].



This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most occurrences)  
by the hunspell package [2].


http://aspell.net/ does not seem to be dead to me.

This is a spell checker, after all. This is not something I'd expect to see  
monthly updates for. Languages evolve over the course of centuries. It's  
true that there's a small number of self-appointed authorities that put on  
an annual pomp-and-circumstances affair announcing this year's addition to  
King's English. But I'll be impressed if anyone can recall what last year's  
additions were.





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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Peter Oliver]

On Fri, 26 May 2023, Lukas Javorsky wrote:


I would like to announce the Fedora change for the deprecation of the aspell
package [1].


I would be sad to lose Aspell, since it outperforms Hunspell, at least for 
English (http://aspell.net/test/cur/).


This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most
occurrences) by the hunspell package [2].


Although it’s true that it’s nearly four years since the last Aspell release, I 
notice that the same was true of Hunspell until last year.


https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/AspellDeprecation says:


The dependent packages will migrate to hunspell.


If we’re going to recommend migration to anything, shouldn’t it be enchant2?  
Users would be able to configure their preferred spellchecking engine per 
language (which I imagine is more important for some languages than others), 
and we wouldn’t have to go through this again in the future if we 
hypothetically decided that, say, Nuspell should replace Hunspell as our 
default spellchecker.

--
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[ijaaskelainen]

What are Finnish users supposed to do once aspell-fi retires?
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Matthew Miller]

On Fri, May 26, 2023 at 02:30:09PM +0200, Lukas Javorsky wrote:
> This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most
> occurrences) by the hunspell package [2].

Oh no! I will have to update my joerc! And remember how to update my joerc!

Thanks for the notice!


-- 
Matthew Miller

Fedora Project Leader
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Lukas Javorsky]

Thanks, Miro for the correction.

I totally forgot the BuildRequires, I've already updated the list.

On Fri, May 26, 2023 at 2:45 PM Miro Hrončok  wrote:

> On 26. 05. 23 14:40, Lukas Javorsky wrote:
> > Sorry for the wrong URL of the change. This is the right one [1].
> >
> > [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/AspellDeprecation
> > <https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/AspellDeprecation>
> >
> > On Fri, May 26, 2023 at 2:30 PM Lukas Javorsky  > <mailto:ljavo...@redhat.com>> wrote:
> >
> >     Hi,
> >
> >     I would like to announce the Fedora change for the deprecation of the
> > aspell package [1].
> >
> > This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most
> > occurrences) by the hunspell package [2].
> >
> > The Fedora Change [3] is describing this in more detail, feel free
> to view
> > and read it.
> >
> > [1] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/aspell
> > <https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/aspell>
> > [2] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/hunspell
> > <https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/hunspell>
> > [3] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/AspellDeprecation
> > <https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/AspellDeprecation>
>
> Hello Lukas, it seems that the list in the Dependencies section is
> incomplete:
>
> This is probably what you have, packages requiring aspell* on runtime:
>
> $ repoquery -q --repo=rawhide{,-source} --whatrequires 'aspell*' | grep -v
> '^aspell' | grep -v 'src$' | pkgname
> eiskaltdcpp-qt
> enchant-aspell
> enchant2-aspell
> kf5-sonnet-core
> kf5-sonnet-core
> moodle
> perl-Code-TidyAll
> perl-Text-Aspell
> php-pspell
> recoll
> recoll
> xedit
> xmlcopyeditor
> yagf
>
>
> But there are also packages BuildRequiring it:
>
> $ repoquery -q --repo=rawhide{,-source} --whatrequires 'aspell*' | grep -v
> '^aspell' | grep 'src$' | pkgname
> eiskaltdcpp
> enchant
> enchant2
> hunspell-az
> hunspell-csb
> hunspell-de
> hunspell-en
> hunspell-fa
> hunspell-gv
> hunspell-ky
> ibus-typing-booster
> inkscape
> kf5-sonnet
> logjam
> perl-MouseX-ConfigFromFile
> perl-MouseX-Types-Path-Class
> perl-Text-Aspell
> perl-Text-SpellChecker
> php
> recoll
> tin
> xmlcopyeditor
> yagf
>
>
> --
> Miro Hrončok
> --
> Phone: +420777974800
> IRC: mhroncok
>
>

-- 
S pozdravom/ Best regards

Lukáš Javorský

Software Engineer, Core service - Databases

Red Hat <https://www.redhat.com>

Purkyňova 115 (TPB-C)

612 00 Brno - Královo Pole

ljavo...@redhat.com
<https://www.redhat.com>
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Miro Hrončok]

On 26. 05. 23 14:40, Lukas Javorsky wrote:

Sorry for the wrong URL of the change. This is the right one [1].

[1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/AspellDeprecation 
<https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/AspellDeprecation>


On Fri, May 26, 2023 at 2:30 PM Lukas Javorsky <mailto:ljavo...@redhat.com>> wrote:


Hi,

I would like to announce the Fedora change for the deprecation of the
    aspell package [1].

This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most
occurrences) by the hunspell package [2].

The Fedora Change [3] is describing this in more detail, feel free to view
and read it.

[1] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/aspell
<https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/aspell>
[2] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/hunspell
<https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/hunspell>
[3] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/AspellDeprecation
<https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/AspellDeprecation>


Hello Lukas, it seems that the list in the Dependencies section is incomplete:

This is probably what you have, packages requiring aspell* on runtime:

$ repoquery -q --repo=rawhide{,-source} --whatrequires 'aspell*' | grep -v 
'^aspell' | grep -v 'src$' | pkgname

eiskaltdcpp-qt
enchant-aspell
enchant2-aspell
kf5-sonnet-core
kf5-sonnet-core
moodle
perl-Code-TidyAll
perl-Text-Aspell
php-pspell
recoll
recoll
xedit
xmlcopyeditor
yagf


But there are also packages BuildRequiring it:

$ repoquery -q --repo=rawhide{,-source} --whatrequires 'aspell*' | grep -v 
'^aspell' | grep 'src$' | pkgname

eiskaltdcpp
enchant
enchant2
hunspell-az
hunspell-csb
hunspell-de
hunspell-en
hunspell-fa
hunspell-gv
hunspell-ky
ibus-typing-booster
inkscape
kf5-sonnet
logjam
perl-MouseX-ConfigFromFile
perl-MouseX-Types-Path-Class
perl-Text-Aspell
perl-Text-SpellChecker
php
recoll
tin
xmlcopyeditor
yagf


--
Miro Hrončok
--
Phone: +420777974800
IRC: mhroncok
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Re: Deprecation of the aspell package

[Lukas Javorsky]

Sorry for the wrong URL of the change. This is the right one [1].

[1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/AspellDeprecation

On Fri, May 26, 2023 at 2:30 PM Lukas Javorsky  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I would like to announce the Fedora change for the deprecation of the
> aspell package [1].
>
> This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most
> occurrences) by the hunspell package [2].
>
> The Fedora Change [3] is describing this in more detail, feel free to view
> and read it.
>
> [1] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/aspell
> [2] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/hunspell
> [3] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/AspellDeprecation
>
> --
> S pozdravom/ Best regards
>
> Lukáš Javorský
>
> Software Engineer, Core service - Databases
>
> Red Hat <https://www.redhat.com>
>
> Purkyňova 115 (TPB-C)
>
> 612 00 Brno - Královo Pole
>
> ljavo...@redhat.com
> <https://www.redhat.com>
>


-- 
S pozdravom/ Best regards

Lukáš Javorský

Software Engineer, Core service - Databases

Red Hat <https://www.redhat.com>

Purkyňova 115 (TPB-C)

612 00 Brno - Královo Pole

ljavo...@redhat.com
<https://www.redhat.com>
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Deprecation of the aspell package

[Lukas Javorsky]

Hi,

I would like to announce the Fedora change for the deprecation of the
aspell package [1].

This package has a dead upstream and has been obsoleted (in most
occurrences) by the hunspell package [2].

The Fedora Change [3] is describing this in more detail, feel free to view
and read it.

[1] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/aspell
[2] https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/hunspell
[3] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/AspellDeprecation

-- 
S pozdravom/ Best regards

Lukáš Javorský

Software Engineer, Core service - Databases

Red Hat <https://www.redhat.com>

Purkyňova 115 (TPB-C)

612 00 Brno - Královo Pole

ljavo...@redhat.com
<https://www.redhat.com>
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