Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
On Sep 27, 2009, at 5:30 PM, Steve Baty wrote: So you're thinking of magic in the Arthur C. Clarke sense of any sufficiently advanced technology (or service)...? But don't forget the corollary: Any sufficiently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science! From the massively fantastic (and 2009 Hugo Award-winning) webcomic, Girl Genius: http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php?date=20081205 -- Jim Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
%u201CMagic%u201D seems that it could be applied in many ways. It seems to me that interface designers working in the %u201Cmagical%u201D shows that this industry is the front-line of technological progress and evolution. As a Neanderthal might find a flashlight magical, it is as Steve Baty and Jeff Drew reminded us, Any sufficiently analyzed magic is indistinguishable from science! Jef Raskin once wrote, %u201CThe primacy of the interface was a revolution largely unforeseen by even the boldest of science fiction writers.%u201D Over the years as users have grown, some of the magic has ebbed away. Once the magic is explained, understood, or becomes commonplace it disappears (like Highlander 2). Might examination of the %u201Cde-magification%u201D of interface elements, of their evolution and cultural impacts bring us to see more plainly the doorways to the next %u201Cnew magic%u201D? I like to think it%u2019s the pursuit of this %u201Cnew magic%u201D that drives us to do what we do. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=46102 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
Hi Jared, As an amateur magician, I can say the process of designing a product has many similarities to the act of performing magic. Among other things, both of them take in account the audience, the context, and the goal to create different types of experience. I've already faced similar reactions from people after kinetically scrolling a list on Iphone and after seeing a torn card begin restored in front of theirs eyes: wow. -- Miguel Peres On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 7:08 PM, Jared Spool jsp...@uie.com wrote: Hi David, I'm intrigued with your comment: But what Designers do IS magic! That act of synthesis towards craft towards implementation is a wondrous magical thing once turned into a Palm Pre or HP NetBook Mini that brings new areas of delight that were never there before. What's wrong with magic? What's wrong with the unexplained? Or the secretly explained (LIKE MAGIC!). Magic is an awesome metaphor. You're right about it's wondrous qualities. What's interesting to me about the choice of magic is the point of view that sees it as magical. There are three approaches to the point-of-view thing: 1) We look at magic from the Harry Potter or Terry Pratchett view where there are things happening on a level that mortals aren't meant to understand. 2) We look at magic from a more phantasmal viewpoint, where there are forces in the universe that just defy explanation (ala Shroud of Turin or the creation of the solar system, but on a more productive level) 3) We look at magic from the viewpoint of a professional magician (ala David Copperfield or Penn Teller), where the magicians view the process as explainable, but design an experience for their audience that is mystical. I think, if we're going to assert that there are magical qualities to design, we should pick which one we want to go with. Personally, I'd go with the professional magician viewpoint, because that means that we have control over it (and don't require special powers). It also, in my mind, is the closest thing to experience design as we think of it today. One of the things I like about the comparison to professional magic is that magicians, when they get together to talk/teach/share their craft, don't ever talk about the magical elements, except from the perspective of the audience. For example, there's a saying amongst magicians: That's when the magic happens It describes the magical moment, a point in the audience's experience when they are to think that the core element of the trick (such as the chosen card moving from the deck into the magician's coat pocket) is happening. Of course, the mechanics of the trick happened at another point in time. The magical moment is part of the experience design, focusing the magician on the audience p.o.v. Is that what you were thinking? Or were you thinking it might be a different perspective on magic? Jared Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
I'm enjoying this thread, mostly because of the similarity it has to the title of my next book: http://www.methodsofsynthesis.com/ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=46102 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
[IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
Hi David, I'm intrigued with your comment: But what Designers do IS magic! That act of synthesis towards craft towards implementation is a wondrous magical thing once turned into a Palm Pre or HP NetBook Mini that brings new areas of delight that were never there before. What's wrong with magic? What's wrong with the unexplained? Or the secretly explained (LIKE MAGIC!). Magic is an awesome metaphor. You're right about it's wondrous qualities. What's interesting to me about the choice of magic is the point of view that sees it as magical. There are three approaches to the point-of-view thing: 1) We look at magic from the Harry Potter or Terry Pratchett view where there are things happening on a level that mortals aren't meant to understand. 2) We look at magic from a more phantasmal viewpoint, where there are forces in the universe that just defy explanation (ala Shroud of Turin or the creation of the solar system, but on a more productive level) 3) We look at magic from the viewpoint of a professional magician (ala David Copperfield or Penn Teller), where the magicians view the process as explainable, but design an experience for their audience that is mystical. I think, if we're going to assert that there are magical qualities to design, we should pick which one we want to go with. Personally, I'd go with the professional magician viewpoint, because that means that we have control over it (and don't require special powers). It also, in my mind, is the closest thing to experience design as we think of it today. One of the things I like about the comparison to professional magic is that magicians, when they get together to talk/teach/share their craft, don't ever talk about the magical elements, except from the perspective of the audience. For example, there's a saying amongst magicians: That's when the magic happens It describes the magical moment, a point in the audience's experience when they are to think that the core element of the trick (such as the chosen card moving from the deck into the magician's coat pocket) is happening. Of course, the mechanics of the trick happened at another point in time. The magical moment is part of the experience design, focusing the magician on the audience p.o.v. Is that what you were thinking? Or were you thinking it might be a different perspective on magic? Jared Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
actually, I was totally thinking of #3 the professional and how they orchestrate and choreograph a performance experience. WE (the pros) all know what we are doing, but that sense of awe and delight we can't in thinking it is Mystical, is the goal for many classes of products and services. How did that waiter know I needed more bread? If you go to a Michelin rated restaurant they are just trained to serve. stuff like that. AND! here's the clincher, it is all b/c of you that I even have insight into that world. All those conversations about your son and the card tricks. But also through my understanding of the Mage from Babylon 5. -- dave On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 7:08 PM, Jared Spool jsp...@uie.com wrote: Hi David, I'm intrigued with your comment: But what Designers do IS magic! That act of synthesis towards craft towards implementation is a wondrous magical thing once turned into a Palm Pre or HP NetBook Mini that brings new areas of delight that were never there before. What's wrong with magic? What's wrong with the unexplained? Or the secretly explained (LIKE MAGIC!). Magic is an awesome metaphor. You're right about it's wondrous qualities. What's interesting to me about the choice of magic is the point of view that sees it as magical. There are three approaches to the point-of-view thing: 1) We look at magic from the Harry Potter or Terry Pratchett view where there are things happening on a level that mortals aren't meant to understand. 2) We look at magic from a more phantasmal viewpoint, where there are forces in the universe that just defy explanation (ala Shroud of Turin or the creation of the solar system, but on a more productive level) 3) We look at magic from the viewpoint of a professional magician (ala David Copperfield or Penn Teller), where the magicians view the process as explainable, but design an experience for their audience that is mystical. I think, if we're going to assert that there are magical qualities to design, we should pick which one we want to go with. Personally, I'd go with the professional magician viewpoint, because that means that we have control over it (and don't require special powers). It also, in my mind, is the closest thing to experience design as we think of it today. One of the things I like about the comparison to professional magic is that magicians, when they get together to talk/teach/share their craft, don't ever talk about the magical elements, except from the perspective of the audience. For example, there's a saying amongst magicians: That's when the magic happens It describes the magical moment, a point in the audience's experience when they are to think that the core element of the trick (such as the chosen card moving from the deck into the magician's coat pocket) is happening. Of course, the mechanics of the trick happened at another point in time. The magical moment is part of the experience design, focusing the magician on the audience p.o.v. Is that what you were thinking? Or were you thinking it might be a different perspective on magic? Jared -- Dave Malouf http://davemalouf.com/ http://twitter.com/daveixd http://scad.edu/industrialdesign http://ixda.org/ Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
So you're thinking of magic in the Arthur C. Clarke sense of any sufficiently advanced technology (or service)...? 2009/9/28 Dave Malouf dave@gmail.com actually, I was totally thinking of #3 the professional and how they orchestrate and choreograph a performance experience. WE (the pros) all know what we are doing, but that sense of awe and delight we can't in thinking it is Mystical, is the goal for many classes of products and services. How did that waiter know I needed more bread? If you go to a Michelin rated restaurant they are just trained to serve. stuff like that. AND! here's the clincher, it is all b/c of you that I even have insight into that world. All those conversations about your son and the card tricks. But also through my understanding of the Mage from Babylon 5. -- dave On Sun, Sep 27, 2009 at 7:08 PM, Jared Spool jsp...@uie.com wrote: Hi David, I'm intrigued with your comment: But what Designers do IS magic! That act of synthesis towards craft towards implementation is a wondrous magical thing once turned into a Palm Pre or HP NetBook Mini that brings new areas of delight that were never there before. What's wrong with magic? What's wrong with the unexplained? Or the secretly explained (LIKE MAGIC!). Magic is an awesome metaphor. You're right about it's wondrous qualities. What's interesting to me about the choice of magic is the point of view that sees it as magical. There are three approaches to the point-of-view thing: 1) We look at magic from the Harry Potter or Terry Pratchett view where there are things happening on a level that mortals aren't meant to understand. 2) We look at magic from a more phantasmal viewpoint, where there are forces in the universe that just defy explanation (ala Shroud of Turin or the creation of the solar system, but on a more productive level) 3) We look at magic from the viewpoint of a professional magician (ala David Copperfield or Penn Teller), where the magicians view the process as explainable, but design an experience for their audience that is mystical. I think, if we're going to assert that there are magical qualities to design, we should pick which one we want to go with. Personally, I'd go with the professional magician viewpoint, because that means that we have control over it (and don't require special powers). It also, in my mind, is the closest thing to experience design as we think of it today. One of the things I like about the comparison to professional magic is that magicians, when they get together to talk/teach/share their craft, don't ever talk about the magical elements, except from the perspective of the audience. For example, there's a saying amongst magicians: That's when the magic happens It describes the magical moment, a point in the audience's experience when they are to think that the core element of the trick (such as the chosen card moving from the deck into the magician's coat pocket) is happening. Of course, the mechanics of the trick happened at another point in time. The magical moment is part of the experience design, focusing the magician on the audience p.o.v. Is that what you were thinking? Or were you thinking it might be a different perspective on magic? Jared -- Dave Malouf http://davemalouf.com/ http://twitter.com/daveixd http://scad.edu/industrialdesign http://ixda.org/ Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help -- Steve 'Doc' Baty | Principal | Meld Consulting | P: +61 417 061 292 | E: steveb...@meld.com.au | Twitter: docbaty | Skype: steve_baty | LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/stevebaty Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
I would add the anthropological meaning of magic: the manipulation of
signs in a ritual. It´s a way of thinking, talking and using something
we don´t know.
Who could exactly say what is needed for doing good design? Even
though we have a name for craft skills (tacit knowledge), we cannot
generalize it for everyone.
I remember Jack Schulze saying that design is not somethings that
happens in your mouth, it´s something that happens in the world, in
your hands...
http://www.kickerstudio.com/blog/2009/05/six-questions-from-kicker-jack-schulze/
If it´s some kind of cultural intervention, as Schulze said, the magic
analogy could be interesting. Magic is an intervention of the sacred
over the profanne, transfering some of it´s qualities in the ritual.
Could we think design a the new magic of transforming crude objects
into meaningful ones?
How sacred are the signs we manipulate?
What could we know more about Design, thinking it as some kind of magic?
2009/9/27 Jared Spool jsp...@uie.com:
Hi David,
I'm intrigued with your comment:
But what Designers do IS magic! That act of synthesis towards craft
towards implementation is a wondrous magical thing once turned into a
Palm Pre or HP NetBook Mini that brings new areas of delight that were
never there before.
What's wrong with magic? What's wrong with the unexplained? Or the
secretly explained (LIKE MAGIC!).
Magic is an awesome metaphor. You're right about it's wondrous qualities.
What's interesting to me about the choice of magic is the point of view that
sees it as magical.
There are three approaches to the point-of-view thing:
1) We look at magic from the Harry Potter or Terry Pratchett view where
there are things happening on a level that mortals aren't meant to
understand.
2) We look at magic from a more phantasmal viewpoint, where there are forces
in the universe that just defy explanation (ala Shroud of Turin or the
creation of the solar system, but on a more productive level)
3) We look at magic from the viewpoint of a professional magician (ala David
Copperfield or Penn Teller), where the magicians view the process as
explainable, but design an experience for their audience that is mystical.
I think, if we're going to assert that there are magical qualities to
design, we should pick which one we want to go with.
Personally, I'd go with the professional magician viewpoint, because that
means that we have control over it (and don't require special powers). It
also, in my mind, is the closest thing to experience design as we think of
it today.
One of the things I like about the comparison to professional magic is that
magicians, when they get together to talk/teach/share their craft, don't
ever talk about the magical elements, except from the perspective of the
audience.
For example, there's a saying amongst magicians: That's when the magic
happens It describes the magical moment, a point in the audience's
experience when they are to think that the core element of the trick (such
as the chosen card moving from the deck into the magician's coat pocket) is
happening. Of course, the mechanics of the trick happened at another point
in time. The magical moment is part of the experience design, focusing the
magician on the audience p.o.v.
Is that what you were thinking? Or were you thinking it might be a different
perspective on magic?
Jared
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Re: [IxDA Discuss] Exploring the Magic of Design
On a different track -- I studied some mathematics (specifically pure mathematics, lots of proofs, few numbers) in college. My favorite kind of magic, and the kind that I can most relate to when talking about design, is this kind: http://bit.ly/S5Xgc. I think it falls outside Jared's 3 because I do it, but it can be just as mystical an experience to me as anyone else, that little miracle bit at least. Anyone who's ever written many hard proofs can relate to that. It's what I believe great designers and great mathematicians have in common. For lack of a better word (besides miracle) we call it 'intuition'. Had some good conversations with Hugh Dubberly over this one... . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Posted from the new ixda.org http://www.ixda.org/discuss?post=46102 Welcome to the Interaction Design Association (IxDA)! To post to this list ... disc...@ixda.org Unsubscribe http://www.ixda.org/unsubscribe List Guidelines http://www.ixda.org/guidelines List Help .. http://www.ixda.org/help
