Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
Is your Squeezebox Working today? Or did Logitech suspended all the network broadcasting and remotely setup? Thanks Ant Antanico's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=58443 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
d6jg wrote: For you the Onkyo dock would be a good move as its also an Airplay adapter. A rare beast. You could use the ipad as a player either docked (is ipad3 30 pin?) or via airplay - I assume you have some kind of hifi from your comments. Yea I use a Marantz PM6003 Amp with a pair of Wharfedale Diamond 9.1 speakers. Great combo! More options: Marantz CD6004 as it has an iPod digi USB input on the front and can even charge the iPad. £250 Arcam drDock - has its own DAC plus digital outputs to an external DAC, if needed. £180 I really want to give that Onkyo a try, but for some reason I'm not holding out a deal of hope on its sound. I don't want to get it then have to buy a DAC as well; I just don't have the budget. ReValveiT's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=55767 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
Another good audiophile alternative: iDevice (if you don't already own one - MANY already do - a 3rd gen iPod Tough can be had for little £££) iPeng! + the playback add on. One of the many digital dock / iPod USB enabled devices, or Airplay receiver. That'll give you all the lurvely Squeezebox functionality / brilliance + bit-perfect playback (just like the touch). So ye, not as dead as you might think! ;) ReValveiT's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=55767 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
There aren't that many decent digital iPod docks on the market. Best I have come across is an Onkyo DS A5 but its well pricey! d6jg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=44051 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
That depends on what you consider well pricey. The Squeezebox Touch retailed around the £200 (UK) mark. The Onkyo can be got for £140. If you already own an iDevice you can add around a tenner for iPeng and the playback, and you're there for £150 - £50 less than a Touch (was). Plus you have the benefits of Airplay, and the vastly superior (to the Squeezebox version) Spotify IOS app that can be streamed over Airplay. Wouldn't mind giving the Onkyo a try myself. ReValveiT's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=55767 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
Have an iPod Touch and iPhone 4S with iPeng + Playback on both. The Touch is second gen so a bit limited. I regularly use the iPhone as a remote player and stream from my home system when in hotels etc but to if I had a 3rd gen Touch then I would experiment with that as a player using initially a Cambridge Audio analog dock and use the iPhone as the controller which is what it is generally used for. At present I don't need another player but if I did I would consider the following (no particular order):- A Raspberry Pi An iDevice with Onkyo dock (because it has both digital and analog output) A netbook running Squeezeplay and USB DAC An eBay SB3 or Touch There are plenty of options that will allow me loads of years worth of listening. d6jg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=44051 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
d6jg wrote: Have an iPod Touch and iPhone 4S with iPeng + Playback on both. The Touch is second gen so a bit limited. I regularly use the iPhone as a remote player and stream from my home system when in hotels etc but to if I had a 3rd gen Touch then I would experiment with that as a player using initially a Cambridge Audio analog dock and use the iPhone as the controller which is what it is generally used for. At present I don't need another player but if I did I would consider the following (no particular order):- A Raspberry Pi An iDevice with Onkyo dock (because it has both digital and analog output) A netbook running Squeezeplay and USB DAC An eBay SB3 or Touch There are plenty of options that will allow me loads of years worth of listening. Yep, all sounds good to me! Having sold my Touches (financial reasons) I'm now looking into new ways to stream. I have an iPhone 4 and iPad 3, but neither device comes anywhere near the SBT on sound quality (all devices analog out). My real choices are : PC running Squeezeplay into a good USB DAC, or, iDevice running iPeng into a good digital DOCK. Either way I want to stay in the Squeezebox ecosystem mainly because iPeng is so good. Currently playing CDs from my Sony BD player, which actually sounds surprisingly good! If only it had a Squeezeplay type app, I'd probably stick with it! ReValveiT's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=55767 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
For you the Onkyo dock would be a good move as its also an Airplay adapter. A rare beast. You could use the ipad as a player either docked (is ipad3 30 pin?) or via airplay - I assume you have some kind of hifi from your comments. d6jg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=44051 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
I've heard good things about using an iDevice with iPeng and the Pure i-20 dock ( $100) which serves as both a DAC with analog outs or using its digital output to your own DAC -- both options better than just using the iDevice headphone output. It would seem that Logitech abandoning the manufacture of Squeezeboxen is of far less concern than that of ongoing dev and support of LMS. The question I have is whether LMS can ultimately be supported and improved upon by an open source community... Is there anything that would prohibit that? mdconnelly's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10312 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
mdconnelly wrote: I've heard good things about using an iDevice with iPeng and the Pure i-20 dock ( $100) which serves as both a DAC with analog outs or using its digital output to your own DAC -- both options better than just using the iDevice headphone output. It would seem that Logitech abandoning the manufacture of Squeezeboxen is of far less concern than that of ongoing dev and support of LMS. The question I have is whether LMS can ultimately be supported and improved upon by an open source community... Is there anything that would prohibit that? I don't think so. LMS *is* open-source. Most of the concern I've heard is from people who rely on mysqueezebox.com for functionality they care deeply about. The EOL announcement means the writing's on the wall (eventually) for mysqueezebox.com. azinck3's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3967 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
mdconnelly wrote: It would seem that Logitech abandoning the manufacture of Squeezeboxen is of far less concern than that of ongoing dev and support of LMS. The question I have is whether LMS can ultimately be supported and improved upon by an open source community... Is there anything that would prohibit that? It is completely dead, they have the UE line. If they produce a UE Touch to go along with the UE Radio some folks would be happy? I guess most will miss all the 3rd party apps? It would be nice if Logitech would let us know if they plan on a UE Touch? -Bob Bob bobm's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=19401 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
ReValveiT wrote: Another good audiophile alternative: iDevice (if you don't already own one - MANY already do - a 3rd gen iPod Touch can be had for little £££) iPeng! + the playback add on. One of the many digital dock / iPod USB enabled devices, or Airplay receiver. That'll give you all the lurvely Squeezebox functionality / brilliance + bit-perfect playback (just like the Touch). So ye, not as dead as you might think! ;) Did you mean? That'll give you all the lurvely Squeezebox functionality - (brilliance + bit-perfect playback (just like the Touch)). I though bit-perfect was not confirmed on an iDevice? Thanks Bob bobm's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=19401 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
Bit perfect works with iPeng but depending on the dock hardware you use, you might have to set the volume to 100% It's also limited to a maximum of 48kHz/24bit except on iPad when using the camera connection kit in which case you can go up to 96/24. A few people have done the full round trip bit comparison, it does indeed work. pippin's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13777 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
pippin wrote: Bit perfect works with iPeng but depending on the dock hardware you use, you might have to set the volume to 100% It's also limited to a maximum of 48kHz/24bit except on iPad when using the camera connection kit in which case you can go up to 96/24. A few people have done the full round trip bit comparison, it does indeed work. Thank you, good information. -Bob bobm's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=19401 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
azinck3 wrote: LMS *is* open-source. This is good news in the storm. djfake's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8111 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
SlimPvC wrote: Owww man this is sad sad sad... I remember the passion of the original SlimDevices owners, the way they put their heart in this product. And I remember the horror in the community when it was sold to Logitech. I do not want any of those stupid radio thingies. I want a streaming device like the Squeezebox I know. Just hope my Touch and SB2 will not die soon... :-( If your Touch or SB2 does die, there is a simple way to build your own inexpensive headless Squeezebox using a low cost / low power box (eg. Raspberry Pi) running Squeezelite. See this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?97046-Announce-Squeezelite-a-small-headless-squeezeplay-emulator-for-linux-%28alsa-only%29 The Pi's onboard audio is not very good quality, so you'll probably want to hook up a USB DAC. cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
Sad news indeed. Fortunately Squeezebox server will live on, and I imagine, someone could buy the rights... but I am also reminded of all the pro-Logitech zealots at this time... I TOLD YOU SO! djfake's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8111 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
cliveb wrote: If your Touch or SB2 does die, there is a simple way to build your own inexpensive headless Squeezebox using a low cost / low power box (eg. Raspberry Pi) running Squeezelite. See this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?97046-Announce-Squeezelite-a-small-headless-squeezeplay-emulator-for-linux-%28alsa-only%29 The Pi's onboard audio is not very good quality, so you'll probably want to hook up a USB DAC. I hope that someone can assemble a simple how-to guide on building one of these from the hardware and software standpoint, or even better, start putting together the hardware and sell it to the technically-ignorant masses. jimzak's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=17592 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
djfake wrote: Sad news indeed, but Logitech has put the death squeeze on the entire Squeezebox line. Good news is that the software will live on, but bad news is they own the patents? for the devices. Will someone come along and buy the line? Will the old SlimDevices team buy it back? Will someone integrate SqueezeBox functionality into, say a universal player like Oppo, or setup box like Roku? We can only hope... In the meantime, off to eBay to find an old v3! Editorial: I am reminded of all the pro-Logitech zealots at this time, and all I can say is I told you so. The big corporate purchase may have been good for SlimDevices, but what analyst wouldn't have figured that this was a niche device? It's easy to play Monday morning quarterback. Though what has happened wasn't totally unexpected, it certainly did not have to be this way. Part of the issue has nothing to do with the squeezebox but the fact that the company made a HUGE blunder with the Revue, putting the entire company at risk and scrambling to recover. maggior's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9080 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
jimzak wrote: I hope that someone can assemble a simple how-to guide on building one of these from the hardware and software standpoint, or even better, start putting together the hardware and sell it to the technically-ignorant masses. It has been done http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=38t=22580 I haven't ordered a Pi yet but it looks like its easy to me d6jg's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=44051 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
djfake wrote: Good news is that the software will live on, but bad news is they own the patents? for the devices. Are you sure there are any patents ? There are trademarks and code/binaries which isn't available for redistribution but I'm not sure there are any patents. djfake wrote: Will someone come along and buy the line? No djfake wrote: Will the old SlimDevices team buy it back? No djfake wrote: Will someone integrate SqueezeBox functionality into, say a universal player like Oppo, or setup box like Roku? We can only hope... If you mean the actual Squeezebox code, it's unlikely. If you mean functionality similar to Squeezebox, it will very likely happen if there is a market with enough people willing to buy such devices, it's just a matter of time. erland's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3124 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
Most people seem content to use general purpose uPnP or DLNA devices. A friend at work told me today I need to give up on the squeezebox thing. He recently bought a Grace Radio because he wanted something generally compatable with his various uPnP devices. Why do you need a special server? he asked. I explained that general purpose doesn't really work for somebody that has a large collection and wants good sound quality, ease of library navigation, and gapless playback. He just waved his hand dismissing all of that - clearly it's not something he cares about. I suspect his feelings are pretty representative of the typical user. I think that squeezebox-like devices will continue to be a niche product. I don't think you will see this integrated into any other products. Sonos is already filling this niche and is apparently successful at it. No sure that there is really room for any more...is it really that large of a niche? maggior's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9080 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
maggior wrote: Most people seem content to use general purpose uPnP or DLNA devices. These devices already will play mp3 files, so such a product already exists. A friend at work told me today I need to give up on the squeezebox thing. He recently bought a Grace Radio because he wanted something generally compatable with his various uPnP devices. Why do you need a special server? he asked. I explained that general purpose doesn't really work for somebody that has a large collection and wants good sound quality, ease of library navigation, and gapless playback. He just waved his hand dismissing all of that - clearly it's not something he cares about. I suspect his feelings are pretty representative of the typical user. I think that squeezebox-like devices will continue to be a niche product. I don't think you will see this integrated into any other products. Sonos is already filling this niche and is apparently successful at it. No sure that there is really room for any more...is it really that large of a niche? +1. Sad but true, I suspect. azinck3's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3967 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
d6jg wrote: It has been done http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=38t=22580 That page is about running Squeezeslave on a Pi. Squeezeslave is a very different beast to Squeezelite, and is pretty much EOL. It doesn't look like there is going to be any further work on Squeezeslave. Squeezelite is clearly the future for roll-your-own players in the Squeezebox world. d6jg wrote: or easier still http://www.squeezeplug.de/ I got a page not found. However, I am vaguely aware of the Squeezeplug project and I've seen posting from its creator in the Squeezelite thread, so he is clearly looking at incorporating it. As far as I am aware, Squeezeplug is a project aimed more at the server side of things. I all you want is a player, you're better off putting just Squeezelite on a machine. d6jg wrote: I haven't ordered a Pi yet but it looks like its easy to me It is very easy. Run the armv6hf distribution of Raspbian Wheezy (downloadable from the Pi foundation), add Triode's armv6hf build of Squeezelite, and you're done. Plug in a USB DAC and with luck you should find that it is recognised by the Pi and made available to Squeezelite - at least that's what happened when I added a DAC based on the PCM2704 chip. Triode has reported that some people have had issues with some USB DACs, so it may not be completely plain sailing in some cases. cliveb's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=348 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
[slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
From someone who has usually has checked his facts I heard this awful rumour that Logitech is abandoning Squeezebox. The SB Touches are slowly selling out, and may be impossible to find (in Holland) within a few months. I really hope this is not true. I'm a devoted Squeezebox addict since 2004 and I still think there's no real alternative Don't make me have to buy a Sonos next, please!! Rumour seems to be confirmed here http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-57519226-221/logitech-leaves-squeezebox-fans-wondering-whats-next/ I guess I've missed something important here?? What's the latest news? SlimPvC's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=51 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
SlimPvC wrote: From someone who has usually has checked his facts I heard this awful rumour that Logitech is abandoning Squeezebox. The SB Touches are slowly selling out, and may be impossible to find (in Holland) within a few months. I really hope this is not true. I'm a devoted Squeezebox addict since 2004 and I still think there's no real alternative Don't make me have to buy a Sonos next, please!! Rumour seems to be confirmed here http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-57519226-221/logitech-leaves-squeezebox-fans-wondering-whats-next/ I guess I've missed something important here?? What's the latest news? Yup, it's true. There are many threads. Here's one: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?96188-New-Squeezebox-Radio azinck3's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3967 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
SAD but TRUE :( Jaca's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=58187 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
Owww man this is sad sad sad... I remember the passion of the original SlimDevices owners, the way they put their heart in this product. And I remember the horror in the community when it was sold to Logitech. I do not want any of those stupid radio thingies. I want a streaming device like the Squeezebox I know. Just hope my Touch and SB2 will not die soon... :-( SlimPvC's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=51 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
SlimPvC wrote: Owww man this is sad sad sad... I remember the passion of the original SlimDevices owners, the way they put their heart in this product. And I remember the horror in the community when it was sold to Logitech. I do not want any of those stupid radio thingies. I want a streaming device like the Squeezebox I know. Just hope my Touch and SB2 will not die soon... :-( I hear you and feel the same way (I've never been without a Slim Device of some kind since 2002). Thankfully there still seems to be a decent supply on the used market and the advent of iPeng means you can turn any iPod touch into a Squeezebox. If you need one for more audiophile purposes then it's a bit trickier (probably running a software player on a PC with digital out is your best bet here). Sure, I'd rather see an ongoing supply of quality dedicated hardware like Slim Devices was churning out, but things aren't so bad. azinck3's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3967 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] Logitech abandoning Squeezebox?
SlimPvC wrote: From someone who has usually has checked his facts I heard this awful rumour that Logitech is abandoning Squeezebox. The SB Touches are slowly selling out, and may be impossible to find (in Holland) within a few months. I really hope this is not true. I'm a devoted Squeezebox addict since 2004 and I still think there's no real alternative Don't make me have to buy a Sonos next, please!! Rumour seems to be confirmed here http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-33199_7-57519226-221/logitech-leaves-squeezebox-fans-wondering-whats-next/ I guess I've missed something important here?? What's the latest news? My sentiments exactly...plus! We all are feeling the same pain and letdown. We all LOVE this Squeeze ecosystem. I am still in disbelief that LOGITECH would ever betray its loyal long supportive customers. I don't believe they want to lose the trust of consumers or their stock holders. I'm sure they want to remain credible and respected. Ikabob's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=32088 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=97532 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/mailman/listinfo/discuss
