Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 21:04:07 -0500 (EST), kc9...@aol.com wrote: >Why invent the wheel...but as they say...go for it if it trips your >trigger. By the time you buy all the parts...you won't save much. Maybe you missed the part about FUN! And the sense of accomplishment. Parts are cheap. Especially if you went to the Radar O'Rielly school of procurement. 73 -Jim -- Ham Radio NU0C Lincoln, Nebraska, U.S.S.A. TR7/RV7/R7A/L7, TR6/RV6, T4XC/R4C/L4B, NCL2000, SB104A, R390A, GT550A/RV550A, HyGain 3750, IBM PS/2 - all vintage, all the time! "Give a man a URL, and he will learn for an hour; teach him to Google, and he will learn for a lifetime." HyGain 3750 User's Group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HyGain_3750/ http://incolor.inetnebr.com/jshorney http://www.nebraskaghosts.org ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Sartori Associates also made the kits available. The earliest ads I have for the Sherwood / Sartori kits is 1982. Most of the articles for R-4C improvement show up in 1979 issues of Ham Radio and 73. Fox Tango also made switchable 1st IF filters kits available they called GUF-1 and GUF-2. For a while in the late 90’s a fellow by the name of David McCauley I believe and sold upgrade kits as well through his online Drake Shop store. The boards were good quality and priced very reasonable. I don’t think he is in business any longer though. So you are quite correct Steve, the current improvements for the R-4C were dreamed up 30 years ago and by various individuals. 73, Gary___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Steve, Have you ever had/used extensively a properly done Sherwood R-4C? I have a TT Orion II right beside it.that's a pretty good comparison machine, as would the K3... I had the Sherwood before the O II...now I really don't need the Sherwood, but I love it and it's staying. Sometimes I want to run Drake and I want the performace of the Sherwood R-4C. My 2 cents is if you are into running Drake AND want the top performace it's worth the Mods. If you do the Drake for ragchew & like the easy/great audio,, forget it and get a R-4A or B...better audio and very smooth. One nice thing about the Sherwood modded RX, leave the Front end filter switch at center and the regular front end isstill used...or go to 2,4 or 600 front end roofing filters as needed with heavy QRM. You don't really need anything but a Icom 718...but all this is fun. 73, Lee -Original Message- From: Steve Wedge To: Gary Poland ; drakelist Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2011 9:03 pm Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods One needs to look at these changes for what they are, in the context of their original use when they were introduced over 30 years ago. Back then, these mods did make a fairly-new radio perform much better. I can also remember ads in QST for solid-state tube replacements. I never saw any tests done on those. Back around 1980, these mods were ways to get more performance out of contemporary or recently contemporary rigs. There are folks who love them with these mods and others who hate 'em. A chacque son gout. For me and lots of others, we like the Drakes for what they represent from their now-historical period and will minimize the mods. Myself, I have an Elecraft K3 for doing contesting and heavy-duty DX'ing. It's a fantastic rig. I used to have a Model A Ford, as well as my modern car that I commuted to work with. While it was fun to take the "A" out on weekends and occasionally to work to show it off, it really was a lousy commuter car compared to the Saab that I was driving at the time. But the "A" was still enjoyable. That's the way I look at my Drake gear. BTW, stock Drake gear is usually much more useable on the current bands than 90% of the other rigs that were contemporary to any of the Drake line. My $0.02 Enjoy Those Drakes, but leave the DSP in your K3... Steve Wedge, W1ES/4 "I can't complain, but sometimes I still do." - Joe Walsh If the above message appears, it came from Steve's Son of Laptop! - Original Message - From: Gary Poland To: drakelist@zerobeat.net Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2011 9:43 AM Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods Against my better judgment to comment on the Sherwood mods, I guess this time I can’t help myself HI HI. This subject is just about as opinionated as the fan sucks in, blows out debate. First I am not a serious contester, just a tinkerer, casual SSB /AM operator and not so serious DX chaser. Short of first IF filter replacements, I am personally not in favor of modifying the the R-4C. Even overlooking the fact that it is no longer as Drake designed it, good or bad, I prefer to keep them stock, just my opinion. I love them for what they are. The modifications were first published in Ham Radio and 73 magazines years ago. I have tried most of them, but later returned the R-4C back to stock. Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, everyone has an opinion. Those that spent big bucks to “ upgrade “ their R-4C’s have a need to feel warm and fuzzy about the expense I suppose, and maybe they see a real improvement. I will just keep my non Blue LED lighted, spotted chassis, non $100 Hartzel paint job, non modded C-lines as they are ... 73, Gary ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Jim, Of course anything can be done...it takes MANY, MANY hours just to install all of Sherwoods mods even if you get the kits from him. Then there is a modified alignment procedure too. (according to Rob, I have not had to do one since he did mine) Why invent the wheel...but as they say...go for it if it trips your trigger. By the time you buy all the parts...you won't save much. 73, Lee -Original Message- From: Jim Shorney To: drakelist Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2011 8:55 pm Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 20:32:14 -0500 (EST), kc9...@aol.com wrote: I don't see any of the MODS I have on my Sherwood R-4C as roll your own...I guess if you can design and build printed circuit boards and get all the parts including those neat front end filters you could. Sure, why not? That's what building stuff is all about! You could even make your own crystal filters if you wanted to get that deep. Most of the Sherwood stuff is pretty well documented. 73 -Jim -- Ham Radio NU0C Lincoln, Nebraska, U.S.S.A. TR7/RV7/R7A/L7, TR6/RV6, T4XC/R4C/L4B, NCL2000, SB104A, R390A, GT550A/RV550A, HyGain 3750, IBM PS/2 - all vintage, all the time! "Give a man a URL, and he will learn for an hour; teach him to Google, and he will learn for a lifetime." HyGain 3750 User's Group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HyGain_3750/ http://incolor.inetnebr.com/jshorney http://www.nebraskaghosts.org ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
One needs to look at these changes for what they are, in the context of their original use when they were introduced over 30 years ago. Back then, these mods did make a fairly-new radio perform much better. I can also remember ads in QST for solid-state tube replacements. I never saw any tests done on those. Back around 1980, these mods were ways to get more performance out of contemporary or recently contemporary rigs. There are folks who love them with these mods and others who hate 'em. A chacque son gout. For me and lots of others, we like the Drakes for what they represent from their now-historical period and will minimize the mods. Myself, I have an Elecraft K3 for doing contesting and heavy-duty DX'ing. It's a fantastic rig. I used to have a Model A Ford, as well as my modern car that I commuted to work with. While it was fun to take the "A" out on weekends and occasionally to work to show it off, it really was a lousy commuter car compared to the Saab that I was driving at the time. But the "A" was still enjoyable. That's the way I look at my Drake gear. BTW, stock Drake gear is usually much more useable on the current bands than 90% of the other rigs that were contemporary to any of the Drake line. My $0.02 Enjoy Those Drakes, but leave the DSP in your K3... Steve Wedge, W1ES/4 "I can't complain, but sometimes I still do." - Joe Walsh If the above message appears, it came from Steve's Son of Laptop! - Original Message - From: Gary Poland To: drakelist@zerobeat.net Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2011 9:43 AM Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods Against my better judgment to comment on the Sherwood mods, I guess this time I can’t help myself HI HI. This subject is just about as opinionated as the fan sucks in, blows out debate. First I am not a serious contester, just a tinkerer, casual SSB /AM operator and not so serious DX chaser. Short of first IF filter replacements, I am personally not in favor of modifying the the R-4C. Even overlooking the fact that it is no longer as Drake designed it, good or bad, I prefer to keep them stock, just my opinion. I love them for what they are. The modifications were first published in Ham Radio and 73 magazines years ago. I have tried most of them, but later returned the R-4C back to stock. Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, everyone has an opinion. Those that spent big bucks to “ upgrade “ their R-4C’s have a need to feel warm and fuzzy about the expense I suppose, and maybe they see a real improvement. I will just keep my non Blue LED lighted, spotted chassis, non $100 Hartzel paint job, non modded C-lines as they are ... 73, Gary -- ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 20:32:14 -0500 (EST), kc9...@aol.com wrote: >I don't see any of the MODS I have on my Sherwood R-4C as roll your >own...I guess if you can design and build printed circuit boards and >get all the parts including those neat front end filters you could. Sure, why not? That's what building stuff is all about! You could even make your own crystal filters if you wanted to get that deep. Most of the Sherwood stuff is pretty well documented. 73 -Jim -- Ham Radio NU0C Lincoln, Nebraska, U.S.S.A. TR7/RV7/R7A/L7, TR6/RV6, T4XC/R4C/L4B, NCL2000, SB104A, R390A, GT550A/RV550A, HyGain 3750, IBM PS/2 - all vintage, all the time! "Give a man a URL, and he will learn for an hour; teach him to Google, and he will learn for a lifetime." HyGain 3750 User's Group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HyGain_3750/ http://incolor.inetnebr.com/jshorney http://www.nebraskaghosts.org ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Jim, Huh? I don't see any of the MODS I have on my Sherwood R-4C as roll your own...I guess if you can design and build printed circuit boards and get all the parts including those neat front end filters you could. Another way to get a Sherwood r-4C is get one from someone selling thiers. They do sell the kits so you can install them yourself..(Maybe a couple at a time) I did a couple...I am a pretty good technitian and it was not all that easy to do...it's pretty tight in most of the RX. Anyways...Glad I already have it...just today I used the C line including the L-4B, and had a great timejust nice & quiet and signals just pop out when you get to them. I have the 2.4 KC frony end roofing filters and it's cool to have weal signals nearby that do not de-sense the weak ones. 73, Lee -Original Message- From: Jim Shorney To: drakelist Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2011 12:26 pm Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 09:43:18 -0500, Gary Poland wrote: Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, everyone has an opinion I can see your point, and I generally stay away from "feature-ism" mods, but I'm not opposed to technically sound mods that address design deficiencies. Arguably that audio output stage and low voltage power supply were not state-of-the-art when the radio was manufactured, nor was the product detector and that mixer stage that picks up noise on AM, but we can assume that Drake was designing to a price point. Sherwood mods are only expensive when purchased from Sherwood, it's easy enough to roll your own for most of them if you have the skills. I don't care for most of the modern radios out there at all, and can't justify the expense - especially when I can spend a sawbuck or two now and then on some parts and make what I have the equal of anything that's out there in performance or listenablility. Just my opinons. 73 -Jim -- Ham Radio NU0C Lincoln, Nebraska, U.S.S.A. TR7/RV7/R7A/L7, TR6/RV6, T4XC/R4C/L4B, NCL2000, SB104A, R390A, GT550A/RV550A, HyGain 3750, IBM PS/2 - all vintage, all the time! "Give a man a URL, and he will learn for an hour; teach him to Google, and he will learn for a lifetime." HyGain 3750 User's Group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HyGain_3750/ http://incolor.inetnebr.com/jshorney http://www.nebraskaghosts.org ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 13:55:06 -0500 (EST), L L bahr wrote: > I look at modifying a Drake rig like taking a Stanley Steamer, removing it's > boiler and installing a Corvette engine in it. Maybe you wouldn't put a 'vette engine in it, but I'd bet a dollar that you would set a stadium cushion on the seat to soften your ride a bit ;) > > I just look at modifying a Drake rig as showing no appreciation of years gone > bye technology. If someone wants to improve something, go out and buy a new > 2012 rig and modify/destroy it. And I can still remember when is wasn't uncommon for hams to spend hours tuning, tweaking, and yes, making modifications to their gear (whether homebrew or store-bought) so they could put the best possible signal on the air. This is just an extension of that, and arguably part of the basis and purpose of Amateur Radio. And besides that, it's FUN! Aside from that, which one of us hasn't replaced a 2-wire power cord with 3-wire, or (to stray off-topic a bit) opearated an AC/DC set through an isolation transformer? Those are mods, too. If Bob Drake modded his C-Line, would it still be a Drake...? 73 -Jim -- Ham Radio NU0C Lincoln, Nebraska, U.S.S.A. TR7/RV7/R7A/L7, TR6/RV6, T4XC/R4C/L4B, NCL2000, SB104A, R390A, GT550A/RV550A, HyGain 3750, IBM PS/2 - all vintage, all the time! "Give a man a URL, and he will learn for an hour; teach him to Google, and he will learn for a lifetime." HyGain 3750 User's Group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HyGain_3750/ http://incolor.inetnebr.com/jshorney http://www.nebraskaghosts.org ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Adrian… I can’t resist this comment to your Jaguar/Bentley question and being fond of both vehicle lines. It seems to me you would call that car a Jentley rather than say, a Baguar. OK, that’s my last bad joke for 2011. I promise. Happy New Year to all! Tom Holmes, N8ZM Tipp City, OH EM79 From: drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net [mailto:drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net] On Behalf Of Adrian Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2011 6:35 AM To: John Brown Cc: drakelist@zerobeat.net Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods A vacuum tube-born radio with loads of solid state mods ? Sorry but then isn't a vacuum made receiver,transmitter, twin line ( etc ) anymore. The FUN about those "boathanchors" is "use it as it is". If i wanna something improved...ill buy a new product. At my side, the challenging while using old stuff is fun, fun and fun. The battle against big, closed, splatters while you have to fight with the passband tuning AND rf gain...etc etc. It's like to drive a Jaguar, but with a (eg) Bentley engine inside. Do we can call that car a Jaguar ? I don't think so. So, at my side, a Drake product, with plenty of solid state things inside...isn't a Drake anymore. Obv it's only my opinion. '73 de Adrian iz3svi On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 12:06:30 +1100, "John Brown" wrote: Max, if you are inclined towards doing all of the R-4C Sherwood mods on your receiver then I would say it would be well worthwhile. The complete mods really puts the R4-C ahead of the pack. I have done 2 R4C’s this way and wouldn’t hesitate to do them again. In terms of individual mods, then the power supply is a must and perhaps the filter capacitors at the same time. The audio module gets rid of the class A audio amp which is a heat generator and source of PTO drift. I believe you would need to do the audio mod if the power supply is upgraded. So once you start you might as well keep going. Best of luck JB From: drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net [mailto:drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net] On Behalf Of AirRadio Sent: Saturday, 31 December 2011 8:28 AM To: drakelist@zerobeat.net Subject: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods I am thinking about doing the full works Sherwood mods on my R4-C. Which are the best to do? I don't mind how far I go with this, I just want the best receiver for my money, I would like it for Top band use but I know it will be good for all frequencies however 160M is where I want to go. 73 Max M0GHQ/W8BX ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] Sherwood mods
What an interesting selection of replies, I am not into drilling holes in equipment at all, so all the mods will be reversable, some are just common sense like changing out caps and the power board, however I do keep all the 'bits' just in case I wish to sell the radio, but this one is a keeper. I have had a great deal of focusing on my collection recently and am only keeping a select few items that I enjoy using, some are Collins some are Drakes, my BC-610E, the rest are various collectables which are used for short time only, however this R4C is a nice radio to use but it does have some issues all of which have been addressed here in some view or another, I actually fall into both camps of keep original and make sensible mods, I did the AGC mod to my early KWM-2 and it transformed the radio into a very useable and fun radio to use, the R4C is a great radio and there are quite a few of them still in service, testiment to the great engineering of the day so I do not feel so guilty for doing some small changes, but I wanted to get a flavour of what can be expected and everyone here has given their opinion on what is good and bad, actually not so much bad as good I feel. Anyway great group and many excellent replies, Thank you, 73 & HNY, Max M0GHQ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Personally I would never consider modifying my Drakes. They work great as is. When I want 2011 technology, I use one of my modern rigs. When I turn on my Drakes, I want to experience a Drake rig, and not some cobbled up one. I no longer would consider buying any Drake rig with modifications. I've done that a few times and regretted it each and every time. (Too much working taking them out). I look at modifying a Drake rig like taking a Stanley Steamer, removing it's boiler and installing a Corvette engine in it. Doing this makes absolutely no sense to me at all. To me, if you don't like the radio as is, why not build your own design. One of my other interests are Tropical Fish. I am almost out of that hobby as today sellers are injecting dye to color living fish and breeding sports which never existed in nature. I guess there are different strokes for different people. I just look at modifying a Drake rig as showing no appreciation of years gone bye technology. If someone wants to improve something, go out and buy a new 2012 rig and modify/destroy it. Lee, w0vt ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4c sherwood moods
Every now & then...I will ONLY use my C line and L-4B for a whole week end... Lee, That's a great idea since it gives you the opportunity to re-visit the older technology and compare notes against recent designs. I have no issues with well-designed and implemented mods that serve an overarching purpose. The Sherwood mods accomplish that. Moreover, I keep respect alive by ensuring that cosmetically, they are as perfect as possible. I have to thank the many folks who have provided those resources. At one time or another, they've been the recipient of my business. Both my R-4C and R-4B are heavily modified. The R-4B may not even be recognizable under the chassis to most folks here. But I started with a purpose and designed for it. The changes meet my operating goals and were not meant to appeal to all Drake users. Folks who have used a Sherwood-modified Drake have every right to express their opinion -- but seemingly, several users have not tried the mods and have based their opinion on perception and not reality. Another a group of users seem to resent that some owners have attained the aptitude to either install and/or design their own mods. This attitude seems even stronger among Collins owners. Now, that's *my* perception and may not be reality! Paul, W9AC ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 09:43:18 -0500, Gary Poland wrote: >Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to >burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes >stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, >everyone has an opinion I can see your point, and I generally stay away from "feature-ism" mods, but I'm not opposed to technically sound mods that address design deficiencies. Arguably that audio output stage and low voltage power supply were not state-of-the-art when the radio was manufactured, nor was the product detector and that mixer stage that picks up noise on AM, but we can assume that Drake was designing to a price point. Sherwood mods are only expensive when purchased from Sherwood, it's easy enough to roll your own for most of them if you have the skills. I don't care for most of the modern radios out there at all, and can't justify the expense - especially when I can spend a sawbuck or two now and then on some parts and make what I have the equal of anything that's out there in performance or listenablility. Just my opinons. 73 -Jim -- Ham Radio NU0C Lincoln, Nebraska, U.S.S.A. TR7/RV7/R7A/L7, TR6/RV6, T4XC/R4C/L4B, NCL2000, SB104A, R390A, GT550A/RV550A, HyGain 3750, IBM PS/2 - all vintage, all the time! "Give a man a URL, and he will learn for an hour; teach him to Google, and he will learn for a lifetime." HyGain 3750 User's Group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HyGain_3750/ http://incolor.inetnebr.com/jshorney http://www.nebraskaghosts.org ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4c sherwood moods
Curt, Well, certainly a vaild staement in general..BUT. The r-4c Sherwood is still quieter than my 746 PRO was and my TT Orion II is. Still kind of like the analog dial too...very fast to move or very slow...all without any buttin pushing. Every now & then...I will ONLY use my C line and L-4B for a whole week end...Not even turn on the TT OII and Alpha amp... well..it's fun and it is VERY effective stilll today. All great radios today. 73, Lee -Original Message- From: Curt Nixon To: drakelist Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2011 12:03 pm Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4c sherwood moods Hi Darryl: I like that approach. No question that the mods make the C a better radio. As long as a person understands what the final product is going to be, then go for it. The performance margin that the Sherwood mods offered over comparably priced SS rigs of the day is no longer valid. Whatever the bench work indicates, there is NO performance comparison, all around, to a modern $1200 radio. (Of course, anything I can "hear" on the 746pro or TS2000, or whatever, I surely can hear also on the R4a---but that is NOT what the mods were all about) I am one that will indeed make minor mods to help in small ways..especially heat related, for durability or availability of parts. ( The AC-4 mods as example) Mine are not museum pieces, but user rigs like Gary mentions and are mostly stock. A line, B line, TR-3,4,7. They are what they are and a pleasure to use as is. Curt KU8L On 12/31/2011 11:32 AM, dle9480...@aol.com wrote: Well I will say it just like my two 56 chevys one bone stock plane 235 inline six with three on the tree to my Loving hot rod with a 383 stroker and nitros injection. the best of both worlds. as to Drake I have a plane Jane B line , a plane Jane C line and a hot rod fully moded R4C (over$1800 in mods and filters) and love to play with em both. You can have your cake and eat it too. Just my 2 cents 73s Darryl WA5TOO ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4c sherwood moods
Hi Darryl: I like that approach. No question that the mods make the C a better radio. As long as a person understands what the final product is going to be, then go for it. The performance margin that the Sherwood mods offered over comparably priced SS rigs of the day is no longer valid. Whatever the bench work indicates, there is NO performance comparison, all around, to a modern $1200 radio. (Of course, anything I can "hear" on the 746pro or TS2000, or whatever, I surely can hear also on the R4a---but that is NOT what the mods were all about) I am one that will indeed make minor mods to help in small ways..especially heat related, for durability or availability of parts. ( The AC-4 mods as example) Mine are not museum pieces, but user rigs like Gary mentions and are mostly stock. A line, B line, TR-3,4,7. They are what they are and a pleasure to use as is. Curt KU8L On 12/31/2011 11:32 AM, dle9480...@aol.com wrote: Well I will say it just like my two 56 chevys one bone stock plane 235 inline six with three on the tree to my Loving hot rod with a 383 stroker and nitros injection. the best of both worlds. as to Drake I have a plane Jane B line , a plane Jane C line and a hot rod fully moded R4C (over$1800 in mods and filters) and love to play with em both. You can have your cake and eat it too. Just my 2 cents 73s Darryl WA5TOO ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
[Drakelist] R4c sherwood moods
Well I will say it just like my two 56 chevys one bone stock plane 235 inline six with three on the tree to my Loving hot rod with a 383 stroker and nitros injection. the best of both worlds. as to Drake I have a plane Jane B line , a plane Jane C line and a hot rod fully moded R4C (over$1800 in mods and filters) and love to play with em both. You can have your cake and eat it too. Just my 2 cents 73s Darryl WA5TOO___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 12:35:11 +0100, Adrian wrote: >So, at my side, a Drake product, with plenty of solid state >things inside...isn't a Drake anymore. I hate to tell you this, Adrian, but your Drake already has solid state things inside. 73 -Jim -- Ham Radio NU0C Lincoln, Nebraska, U.S.S.A. TR7/RV7/R7A/L7, TR6/RV6, T4XC/R4C/L4B, NCL2000, SB104A, R390A, GT550A/RV550A, HyGain 3750, IBM PS/2 - all vintage, all the time! "Give a man a URL, and he will learn for an hour; teach him to Google, and he will learn for a lifetime." HyGain 3750 User's Group - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HyGain_3750/ http://incolor.inetnebr.com/jshorney http://www.nebraskaghosts.org ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Well, thats another way to look at it...and very valid. Today you can do that (buy a better radio) BUT in the time when he was doing a lot of them...that was NOT an option since during that time the Jap radios were very poor RX ( they didn't tell us that??) we were sold on all the neat features & no tuneup. Just recently are the MFG (US & Jap) radios finally coming around to using roofing filters like Rob used decades ago! If you love the whole Drake thing AND you want a real DX/contest quality radio...go for the MODS. Yep, get your wallet out and dig deep. As to using the Drakes the way they were originally. Give me a R-4A or R-4B instead. 73, Lee -Original Message- From: Gary Poland To: drakelist Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2011 9:45 am Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods Against my better judgment to comment on the Sherwood mods, I guess this time I can’t help myself HI HI. This subject is just about as opinionated as the fan sucks in, blows out debate. First I am not a serious contester, just a tinkerer, casual SSB /AM operator and not so serious DX chaser. Short of first IF filter replacements, I am personally not in favor of modifying the the R-4C. Even overlooking the fact that it is no longer as Drake designed it, good or bad, I prefer to keep them stock, just my opinion. I love them for what they are. The modifications were first published in Ham Radio and 73 magazines years ago. I have tried most of them, but later returned the R-4C back to stock. Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, everyone has an opinion. Those that spent big bucks to “ upgrade “ their R-4C’s have a need to feel warm and fuzzy about the expense I suppose, and maybe they see a real improvement. I will just keep my non Blue LED lighted, spotted chassis, non $100 Hartzel paint job, non modded C-lines as they are ... 73, Gary ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
The audio amp in the stock R-4C is already solid state. The Sherwood mod for the audio amp does make it sound better and removes the big heat source right below the PTO. That is the only Sherwood mod I made, but I'm considering the power supply mod. I also installed the Hayseed Hamfest cap cans. 73, Bob WW3QB The R-4C (stock) is hardly a true vacuum tube radio...very much a hybrid. Even the R-4B has quite a few transisters. Early R-4a...= tube RX...and I'm looking to get one of those some day (Dayton??) 73, Lee -Original Message- From: Adrian To: John Brown Cc: drakelist Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2011 6:50 am Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods A vacuum tube-born radio with loads of solid state mods ? Sorry but then isn't a vacuum made receiver,transmitter, twin line ( etc ) anymore. The FUN about those "boathanchors" is "use it as it is". If i wanna something improved...ill buy a new product. At my side, the challenging while using old stuff is fun, fun and fun. The battle against big, closed, splatters while you have to fight with the passband tuning AND rf gain...etc etc. It's like to drive a Jaguar, but with a (eg) Bentley engine inside. Do we can call that car a Jaguar ? I don't think so. So, at my side, a Drake product, with plenty of solid state things inside...isn't a Drake anymore. Obv it's only my opinion. '73 de Adrian iz3svi On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 12:06:30 +1100, "John Brown" wrote: Max, if you are inclined towards doing all of the R-4C Sherwood mods on your receiver then I would say it would be well worthwhile. The complete mods really puts the R4-C ahead of the pack. I have done 2 R4C’s this way and wouldn’t hesitate to do them again. In terms of individual mods, then the power supply is a must and perhaps the filter capacitors at the same time. The audio module gets rid of the class A audio amp which is a heat generator and source of PTO drift. I believe you would need to do the audio mod if the power supply is upgraded. So once you start you might as well keep going. Best of luck JB From: drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net [mailto:drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net] On Behalf Of AirRadio Sent: Saturday, 31 December 2011 8:28 AM To: drakelist@zerobeat.net Subject: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods I am thinking about doing the full works Sherwood mods on my R4-C. Which are the best to do? I don't mind how far I go with this, I just want the best receiver for my money, I would like it for Top band use but I know it will be good for all frequencies however 160M is where I want to go. 73 Max M0GHQ/W8BX ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
"To Mod or not to Mod" has been an interesting theme to close out the old year, that is for sure. Happy Old Year to all, and may the new year bring excellent propagation, low noise, and resonance on all antennas and remember, "to tune is to exist." Kris KM2KM___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
The R-4C (stock) is hardly a true vacuum tube radio...very much a hybrid. Even the R-4B has quite a few transisters. Early R-4a...= tube RX...and I'm looking to get one of those some day (Dayton??) 73, Lee -Original Message- From: Adrian To: John Brown Cc: drakelist Sent: Sat, Dec 31, 2011 6:50 am Subject: Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods A vacuum tube-born radio with loads of solid state mods ? Sorry but then isn't a vacuum made receiver,transmitter, twin line ( etc ) anymore. The FUN about those "boathanchors" is "use it as it is". If i wanna something improved...ill buy a new product. At my side, the challenging while using old stuff is fun, fun and fun. The battle against big, closed, splatters while you have to fight with the passband tuning AND rf gain...etc etc. It's like to drive a Jaguar, but with a (eg) Bentley engine inside. Do we can call that car a Jaguar ? I don't think so. So, at my side, a Drake product, with plenty of solid state things inside...isn't a Drake anymore. Obv it's only my opinion. '73 de Adrian iz3svi On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 12:06:30 +1100, "John Brown" wrote: Max, if you are inclined towards doing all of the R-4C Sherwood mods on your receiver then I would say it would be well worthwhile. The complete mods really puts the R4-C ahead of the pack. I have done 2 R4C’s this way and wouldn’t hesitate to do them again. In terms of individual mods, then the power supply is a must and perhaps the filter capacitors at the same time. The audio module gets rid of the class A audio amp which is a heat generator and source of PTO drift. I believe you would need to do the audio mod if the power supply is upgraded. So once you start you might as well keep going. Best of luck JB From: drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net [mailto:drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net] On Behalf Of AirRadio Sent: Saturday, 31 December 2011 8:28 AM To: drakelist@zerobeat.net Subject: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods I am thinking about doing the full works Sherwood mods on my R4-C. Which are the best to do? I don't mind how far I go with this, I just want the best receiver for my money, I would like it for Top band use but I know it will be good for all frequencies however 160M is where I want to go. 73 Max M0GHQ/W8BX ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
I'll third it. If I want something to act like a new whizbang radio, why not get a new whizbang radio? The joy of an old piece of gear is it being an old piece of gear that still works well. I suppose the "ultimate" update would be to remove everything in the cabinet of a R4C and install inside an Elecraft K3.. Would it still be a Drake? I don't think so, but others might. We own the radios, so we're free to do as we wish, but remember, it's only original once. John K5MO At 09:43 AM 12/31/2011, Gary Poland wrote: Against my better judgment to comment on the Sherwood mods, I guess this time I canât help myself HI HI. This subject is just about as opinionated as the fan sucks in, blows out debate. First I am not a serious contester, just a tinkerer, casual SSB /AM operator and not so serious DX chaser. Short of first IF filter replacements, I am personally not in favor of modifying the the R-4C. Even overlooking the fact that it is no longer as Drake designed it, good or bad, I prefer to keep them stock, just my opinion. I love them for what they are. The modifications were first published in Ham Radio and 73 magazines years ago. I have tried most of them, but later returned the R-4C back to stock. Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, everyone has an opinion. Those that spent big bucks to â upgrade â their R-4Câs have a need to feel warm and fuzzy about the expense I suppose, and maybe they see a real improvement. I will just keep my non Blue LED lighted, spotted chassis, non $100 Hartzel paint job, non modded C-lines as they are ... 73, Gary ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Gary - Amen! Happy New Year!! 73, Garey - K4OAH Glen Allen, VA Drake 2-B, 2-C/2-NT, 4-A, 4-B, C-Line and TR-4/C Service Supplement CDs Gary Poland wrote: Against my better judgment to comment on the Sherwood mods, I guess this time I can’t help myself HI HI. This subject is just about as opinionated as the fan sucks in, blows out debate. First I am not a serious contester, just a tinkerer, casual SSB /AM operator and not so serious DX chaser. Short of first IF filter replacements, I am personally not in favor of modifying the the R-4C. Even overlooking the fact that it is no longer as Drake designed it, good or bad, I prefer to keep them stock, just my opinion. I love them for what they are. The modifications were first published in Ham Radio and 73 magazines years ago. I have tried most of them, but later returned the R-4C back to stock. Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, everyone has an opinion. Those that spent big bucks to “ upgrade “ their R-4C’s have a need to feel warm and fuzzy about the expense I suppose, and maybe they see a real improvement. I will just keep my non Blue LED lighted, spotted chassis, non $100 Hartzel paint job, non modded C-lines as they are ... 73, Gary ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] AM with T-4XC AND L-4B
I once used my C-Line with a single 500Z Ameritron AL-80. It produced about 100 watts of carrier and peaks of 600 to 700 watts. You really need to have a scope inline to check the waveform as to not over do it. 73, Gary___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Against my better judgment to comment on the Sherwood mods, I guess this time I can’t help myself HI HI. This subject is just about as opinionated as the fan sucks in, blows out debate. First I am not a serious contester, just a tinkerer, casual SSB /AM operator and not so serious DX chaser. Short of first IF filter replacements, I am personally not in favor of modifying the the R-4C. Even overlooking the fact that it is no longer as Drake designed it, good or bad, I prefer to keep them stock, just my opinion. I love them for what they are. The modifications were first published in Ham Radio and 73 magazines years ago. I have tried most of them, but later returned the R-4C back to stock. Probably the best reason I see against the mods, unless you have money to burn, they are very expensive. I personally would prefer the keep the Drakes stock and purchase a newer radio. Again I realize everyone is different, everyone has an opinion. Those that spent big bucks to “ upgrade “ their R-4C’s have a need to feel warm and fuzzy about the expense I suppose, and maybe they see a real improvement. I will just keep my non Blue LED lighted, spotted chassis, non $100 Hartzel paint job, non modded C-lines as they are ... 73, Gary ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
Adrian - You're not alone!! :-) 73, Garey - K4OAH Glen Allen, VA Drake 2-B, 2-C/2-NT, 4-A, 4-B, C-Line and TR-4/C Service Supplement CDs Adrian wrote: A vacuum tube-born radio with loads of solid state mods ? Sorry but then isn't a vacuum made receiver,transmitter, twin line ( etc ) anymore. The FUN about those "boathanchors" is "use it as it is". If i wanna something improved...ill buy a new product. At my side, the challenging while using old stuff is fun, fun and fun. The battle against big, closed, splatters while you have to fight with the passband tuning AND rf gain...etc etc. It's like to drive a Jaguar, but with a (eg) Bentley engine inside. Do we can call that car a Jaguar ? I don't think so. So, at my side, a Drake product, with plenty of solid state things inside...isn't a Drake anymore. Obv it's only my opinion. '73 de Adrian iz3svi On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 12:06:30 +1100, "John Brown" wrote: Max, if you are inclined towards doing all of the R-4C Sherwood mods on your receiver then I would say it would be well worthwhile. The complete mods really puts the R4-C ahead of the pack. I have done 2 R4C’s this way and wouldn’t hesitate to do them again. In terms of individual mods, then the power supply is a must and perhaps the filter capacitors at the same time. The audio module gets rid of the class A audio amp which is a heat generator and source of PTO drift. I believe you would need to do the audio mod if the power supply is upgraded. So once you start you might as well keep going. Best of luck JB *From:*drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net [mailto:drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net] *On Behalf Of *AirRadio *Sent:* Saturday, 31 December 2011 8:28 AM *To:* drakelist@zerobeat.net *Subject:* [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods I am thinking about doing the full works Sherwood mods on my R4-C. Which are the best to do? I don't mind how far I go with this, I just want the best receiver for my money, I would like it for Top band use but I know it will be good for all frequencies however 160M is where I want to go. 73 Max ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
I have investigated the Sherwood Mods somewhat, but I found, like Steve mentioned, a lot of it is directed toward building a better contest radio. The mods really go after the close in IMD spec in CW. Other than a little better audio, it seems that UNLESS you truly want a contest rig, it may not do what you expect. I find it mildly amusing that so many Drake fans, who are pretty openly against just about any non-Drake modification, will embrace the Sherwood treatment. Remember, it is no longer an R4c when you are doneit is a Sherwood/Drake R4c. FWIW, Curt KU8L On 12/30/2011 8:06 PM, John Brown wrote: Max, if you are inclined towards doing all of the R-4C Sherwood mods on your receiver then I would say it would be well worthwhile. The complete mods really puts the R4-C ahead of the pack. I have done 2 R4C's this way and wouldn't hesitate to do them again. In terms of individual mods, then the power supply is a must and perhaps the filter capacitors at the same time. The audio module gets rid of the class A audio amp which is a heat generator and source of PTO drift. I believe you would need to do the audio mod if the power supply is upgraded. So once you start you might as well keep going. Best of luck JB *From:*drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net [mailto:drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net] *On Behalf Of *AirRadio *Sent:* Saturday, 31 December 2011 8:28 AM *To:* drakelist@zerobeat.net *Subject:* [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods I am thinking about doing the full works Sherwood mods on my R4-C. Which are the best to do? I don't mind how far I go with this, I just want the best receiver for my money, I would like it for Top band use but I know it will be good for all frequencies however 160M is where I want to go. 73 Max M0GHQ/W8BX ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] AM with T-4XC AND L-4B
On 2011-12-30, at 10:33 PM, kc9...@aol.com wrote: > Thinking of running some AM on the Drake. > Have a T-4XC and L-4b... > Suggestions please from those that have done it Hi Lee, One immediate comment you'll get from the folks you work is that your AM signal will sound like you're using VOX... That's because the T-4X uses controlled carrier modulation---no audio, VERY little carrier. I git that all the time whenever I used my T-4X on 40-meters AM. The audio does sound good, however, as was attested to by the guys that I worked... ~73~ de Eddy VE3CUI - VE3XZ ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
Re: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods
A vacuum tube-born radio with loads of solid state mods ? Sorry but then isn't a vacuum made receiver,transmitter, twin line ( etc ) anymore. The FUN about those "boathanchors" is "use it as it is". If i wanna something improved...ill buy a new product. At my side, the challenging while using old stuff is fun, fun and fun. The battle against big, closed, splatters while you have to fight with the passband tuning AND rf gain...etc etc. It's like to drive a Jaguar, but with a (eg) Bentley engine inside. Do we can call that car a Jaguar ? I don't think so. So, at my side, a Drake product, with plenty of solid state things inside...isn't a Drake anymore. Obv it's only my opinion. '73 de Adrian iz3svi On Sat, 31 Dec 2011 12:06:30 +1100, "John Brown" wrote: Max, if you are inclined towards doing all of the R-4C Sherwood mods on your receiver then I would say it would be well worthwhile. The complete mods really puts the R4-C ahead of the pack. I have done 2 R4C's this way and wouldn't hesitate to do them again. In terms of individual mods, then the power supply is a must and perhaps the filter capacitors at the same time. The audio module gets rid of the class A audio amp which is a heat generator and source of PTO drift. I believe you would need to do the audio mod if the power supply is upgraded. So once you start you might as well keep going. Best of luck JB FROM: drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net [mailto:drakelist-boun...@zerobeat.net] ON BEHALF OF AirRadio SENT: Saturday, 31 December 2011 8:28 AM TO: drakelist@zerobeat.net SUBJECT: [Drakelist] R4C Sherwood mods I am thinking about doing the full works Sherwood mods on my R4-C. Which are the best to do? I don't mind how far I go with this, I just want the best receiver for my money, I would like it for Top band use but I know it will be good for all frequencies however 160M is where I want to go. 73 Max M0GHQ/W8BX ___ Drakelist mailing list Drakelist@zerobeat.net http://mailman.zerobeat.net/mailman/listinfo/drakelist
