Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-15 Thread Joe Subich, W4TV



The manufacturer said the slider must be at max and then use the
front panel pot and radio line in control to manage the desired audio
level.


The problem is that when the Windows slider is at max the USB CODEC is
running rail to rail on its output.  With the improper filtering and
lack of regulation for the V/2 reference the output tones *are clipped*
and that causes distortion no matter where one runs the front panel
controls on the device or the mic gain on the K3.

This is another design fault of the device, the gain of its internal
VOX/PTT should have been increased to operate at lower levels from
the CODEC.  With the K3, one is better served to use a lower output
from the CODEC and higher mic gain/VOX gain in the K3 and not rely
on the internal VOX/PTT of the device - transmit audio quality will
be up to 3 dB better.

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 2014-10-15 10:46 AM, Greg wrote:

Understood...thanks.

I had a similar problem when I first got a SL USB.  The manufacturer said
the slider must be at max and then use the front panel pot and radio line
in control to manage the desired audio level.  When I did that I was able
to get the desired output.  I did not mean to crank all the controls to
maxthat indeed would be a mess.
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 7:34 AM, Joe Subich, W4TV  wrote:



Be very careful ... Signalink USB lacks sufficient bypassing on
the internal 5V distribution, lacks regulation on the CODEC and
op-amp V/2 reference, and lacks sufficient filtering on the USB
power line.

Most sound card show increased distortion with Playback gain above
80%.  Cranking the audio gain to 100% in the playback mixer can
cause it to become *VERY DIRTY* if power supply and regulation is
not properly addressed.

73,

... Joe, W4TV



On 2014-10-15 10:03 AM, Greg wrote:


  Another thing to check:


In your sound devices find the signalink USB codecs and open the playback
mixer.  The slider needs to be at 100all the way to the top.

Also, there are jumpers in the SL.  One is for low output or high output.
Make sure the jumpers are set to the high positions.

73
Greg
AB7R








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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-15 Thread Greg
Understood...thanks.

I had a similar problem when I first got a SL USB.  The manufacturer said
the slider must be at max and then use the front panel pot and radio line
in control to manage the desired audio level.  When I did that I was able
to get the desired output.  I did not mean to crank all the controls to
maxthat indeed would be a mess.
On Wed, Oct 15, 2014 at 7:34 AM, Joe Subich, W4TV  wrote:

>
> Be very careful ... Signalink USB lacks sufficient bypassing on
> the internal 5V distribution, lacks regulation on the CODEC and
> op-amp V/2 reference, and lacks sufficient filtering on the USB
> power line.
>
> Most sound card show increased distortion with Playback gain above
> 80%.  Cranking the audio gain to 100% in the playback mixer can
> cause it to become *VERY DIRTY* if power supply and regulation is
> not properly addressed.
>
> 73,
>
>... Joe, W4TV
>
>
>
> On 2014-10-15 10:03 AM, Greg wrote:
>
>>  Another thing to check:
>>>
>>> In your sound devices find the signalink USB codecs and open the playback
>>> mixer.  The slider needs to be at 100all the way to the top.
>>>
>>> Also, there are jumpers in the SL.  One is for low output or high output.
>>> Make sure the jumpers are set to the high positions.
>>>
>>> 73
>>> Greg
>>> AB7R
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> __
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-15 Thread Joe Subich, W4TV


Be very careful ... Signalink USB lacks sufficient bypassing on
the internal 5V distribution, lacks regulation on the CODEC and
op-amp V/2 reference, and lacks sufficient filtering on the USB
power line.

Most sound card show increased distortion with Playback gain above
80%.  Cranking the audio gain to 100% in the playback mixer can
cause it to become *VERY DIRTY* if power supply and regulation is
not properly addressed.

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 2014-10-15 10:03 AM, Greg wrote:

Another thing to check:

In your sound devices find the signalink USB codecs and open the playback
mixer.  The slider needs to be at 100all the way to the top.

Also, there are jumpers in the SL.  One is for low output or high output.
Make sure the jumpers are set to the high positions.

73
Greg
AB7R









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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-15 Thread Greg
> Another thing to check:
>
> In your sound devices find the signalink USB codecs and open the playback
> mixer.  The slider needs to be at 100all the way to the top.
>
> Also, there are jumpers in the SL.  One is for low output or high output.
> Make sure the jumpers are set to the high positions.
>
> 73
> Greg
> AB7R
>



>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Jim Brown

On Tue,10/14/2014 10:16 PM, Wes (N7WS) wrote:
It is an ".ini" file... userpara.ini :-) 


That sounds familiar. Thanks, Wes.

73, Jim
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Wes (N7WS)

It is an ".ini" file... userpara.ini :-)

On 10/14/2014 9:26 AM, Jim Brown wrote:

On Tue,10/14/2014 5:17 AM, Wes (N7WS) wrote:
I like to use lower tones (915) because I listen to the incoming signal and 
the high tone drives me nuts. MMTTY defaults to 2125. If you use profiles 
then it's best to edit the .ini file directly and set these. 


I do the same, and for the same reason. But it's not only the .ini file that 
must be edited -- there's another file that defines the various decoder 
settings that can be selected from a pull-down menu or cycled through. I don't 
recall the name of that file, but like the .ini file, it's plain text and in 
the same directory. There are about ten instances of the setting that must be 
changed.


73, Jim K9YC



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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Jim Brown

On Tue,10/14/2014 2:56 PM, paul ecker via Elecraft wrote:

But the question remains, if I set K3 mode to AFSK I get no power out or no 
Diddles. With Data A I do get power out and Diddles. Why is that ??


One possibility is that MMTTY and the radio are set to different tones. 
Another is that the radio may not be getting keyed. I use VOX, which is 
turned on and off by mode. So if you're using it, check to see that the 
rig is set for VOX in AFSK-A mode. Also check VOX levels.


Another possibility is that your computer sound card has been set to the 
wrong L/R channel. Check the playback mixer for the SignalLink. Also 
check that the RTTY program is using the SignalLink.


The fundamental differences between AFSK-A and DATA-A are that AFSK-A 
uses MMTTY as a single frequency decoder, works LSB, and the dial 
frequency is the Mark frequency. DATA-A uses USB, and uses software with 
multiple decode capability, and the digital modulation can be moved 
anywhere in the passband to the frequency of the signal you've chosen to 
work.  AFSK-A is RTTY ONLY, DATA-A can be used with ANY digital modes.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Don Wilhelm

Paul,

I fear there is something in your setup between the K3 and MMTTY that is 
causing your problems.
In addition to the K3 manual, review the MMTTY help file to see if you 
can discover what that may be.
We can only guess about what your problem may be - what I can say is 
that if the tones are correct, the K3 will transmit in AFSK A.
Once you figure out what is wrong with the setup, you will likely do a 
good 'forehead slap'.
You had once mentioned "backwards" RTTY - you should not have ALT set on 
the K3 nor reverse set in MMTTY when using AFSK A because AFSK is LSB 
which is normal for RTTY.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/14/2014 5:56 PM, paul ecker wrote:
I have the Pitch in AFSK set the same as the mark in MMTTY. I am using 
Signalink USB external sound card and the K3 and MMTTY.


But the question remains, if I set K3 mode to AFSK I get no power out 
or no Diddles. With Data A I do get power out and Diddles. Why is that 
??  Even though using Data A I get some power out , why the lower 
power then what I have the K3 set out ??





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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread paul ecker via Elecraft
I have the Pitch in AFSK set the same as the mark in MMTTY. I am using 
Signalink USB external sound card and the K3 and MMTTY.

But the question remains, if I set K3 mode to AFSK I get no power out or no 
Diddles. With Data A I do get power out and Diddles. Why is that ??  Even 
though using Data A I get some power out , why the lower power then what I have 
the K3 set out ??
73 Paulkc2nyu
  From: Don Wilhelm 
 To: paul ecker ; "elecraft@mailman.qth.net" 
 
 Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2014 5:39 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem
   
 Paul,
 
 There are subtle differences between DATA A and AFSK A.  You may want to 
review the K3 manual section on data modes for additional information.
 
 First, DATA A sets the K3 to USB mode by default where AFSK A uses LSB by 
default.
 DATA A can transmit and receive anywhere within the audio frequency range 
(unless the filters are narrowed).  AFSK A uses narrow filters by default. 
 Secondly, in DATA A, the K3 frequency shown is the suppressed carrier 
frequency.
 In AFSK A the frequency displayed is the RTTY mark frequency.  Convention when 
referring to the frequency of an RTTY signal, the MARK frequency is specified - 
that is helpful for scheduled contacts - no mental math from a waterfall 
display, it is right there on the K3 display.
 
 
 Because of the latter two conditions, you must have the 'PITCH' set in AFSK A 
to the same as the mark frequency that you have set in MMTTY.  The K3 uses 
narrow filters for AFSK A in both transmit and receive, so if you do not have 
both MMTTY and the K3 set to agree with those tones, the signal may not get 
through the K3 filters.  Once you have things set properly, it should proceed 
smoothly.
 
 When using AFSK A, you would tune in the signal using the K3 VFO rather than 
clicking on a waterfall.  That works great with MMTTY.  If you prefer working 
with a waterfall display and clicking on a signal, you may find more comfort 
using FLDIGI or some data mode application other than MMTTY.
 
 73,
 Don W3FPR
 
 

On 10/14/2014 4:56 PM, paul ecker wrote:
  
  Thanks for all the inputs on my question. I have made some progress. I 
changed the K3 mode from AFSK to Data A, and in MMTTY have"Rev" selected. I am 
now upon TX getting power out, movement on the ALC meter (4 bars with 5th 
flickering, mic line set at 31) and hearing Diddles. So MMTTY is working for TX 
and RX better than before, and I had a QSO a  bit ago with W1AW/4. - However 
with K3 power set at 85w, I am only  showing 30w power out on both K3 RF meter 
and on the KPA digital readout. - Also as I understand it Signalink does AFSK, 
so why does it appear to be working in DATA A. Does the Data A mode selection 
have something to do with the reduced power out?
  
  
 
 

  
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Don Wilhelm

Paul,

There are subtle differences between DATA A and AFSK A.  You may want to 
review the K3 manual section on data modes for additional information.


First, DATA A sets the K3 to USB mode by default where AFSK A uses LSB 
by default.
DATA A can transmit and receive anywhere within the audio frequency 
range (unless the filters are narrowed).  AFSK A uses narrow filters by 
default.
Secondly, in DATA A, the K3 frequency shown is the suppressed carrier 
frequency.
In AFSK A the frequency displayed is the RTTY mark frequency. Convention 
when referring to the frequency of an RTTY signal, the MARK frequency is 
specified - that is helpful for scheduled contacts - no mental math from 
a waterfall display, it is right there on the K3 display.



Because of the latter two conditions, you must have the 'PITCH' set in 
AFSK A to the same as the mark frequency that you have set in MMTTY.  
The K3 uses narrow filters for AFSK A in both transmit and receive, so 
if you do not have both MMTTY and the K3 set to agree with those tones, 
the signal may not get through the K3 filters. Once you have things set 
properly, it should proceed smoothly.


When using AFSK A, you would tune in the signal using the K3 VFO rather 
than clicking on a waterfall.  That works great with MMTTY. If you 
prefer working with a waterfall display and clicking on a signal, you 
may find more comfort using FLDIGI or some data mode application other 
than MMTTY.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/14/2014 4:56 PM, paul ecker wrote:

Thanks for all the inputs on my question.
I have made some progress. I changed the K3 mode from AFSK to Data A, 
and in MMTTY have"Rev" selected. I am now upon TX getting power out, 
movement on the ALC meter (4 bars with 5th flickering, mic line set at 
31) and hearing Diddles. So MMTTY is working for TX and RX better than 
before, and I had a QSO a bit ago with W1AW/4.
- However with K3 power set at 85w, I am only  showing 30w power out 
on both K3 RF meter and on the KPA digital readout.
- Also as I understand it Signalink does AFSK, so why does it appear 
to be working in DATA A. Does the Data A mode selection have something 
to do with the reduced power out?




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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Joe Subich, W4TV



I do the same, and for the same reason. But it's not only the .ini
file that must be edited -- there's another file that defines the
various decoder settings that can be selected from a pull-down menu
or cycled through.


userpara.ini - it only comes into play if one uses the "Profiles (S)"
menu.

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 2014-10-14 12:26 PM, Jim Brown wrote:

On Tue,10/14/2014 5:17 AM, Wes (N7WS) wrote:

I like to use lower tones (915) because I listen to the incoming
signal and the high tone drives me nuts.  MMTTY defaults to 2125. If
you use profiles then it's best to edit the .ini file directly and set
these.


I do the same, and for the same reason. But it's not only the .ini file
that must be edited -- there's another file that defines the various
decoder settings that can be selected from a pull-down menu or cycled
through. I don't recall the name of that file, but like the .ini file,
it's plain text and in the same directory. There are about ten instances
of the setting that must be changed.

73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Joe Subich, W4TV


> Also as I understand it Signalink does AFSK, so why
> does it appear to be working in DATA A. Does the Data A mode
> selection have something to do with the reduced power out?

AFSK A has a very narrow *transmit* filter on the Mark/Space tones to
prevent distortion and hum.  If the MARK in MMTTY is not the same as
the MARK in the K3 (Pitch), you will get no output.

As for DATA A, depending on the transmit filter, you can have as much
as 1 to 1.5 dB of passband ripple.  -1 dB is roughly 80W output for a
nominal 100W.

I strongly suggest making sure the MMTTY Mark and K3 PTICH are set
to the same frequency, that you turn NET ON in MMTTY, turn AFC OFF,
*TUNE WITH THE K3 VFO* while using AFSK A and carefully read both
the K3 Owners Manual and MMTTY help files.

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 2014-10-14 4:56 PM, paul ecker via Elecraft wrote:

Thanks for all the inputs on my question.I have made some progress. I
changed the K3 mode from AFSK to Data A, and in MMTTY have"Rev"
selected. I am now upon TX getting power out, movement on the ALC
meter (4 bars with 5th flickering, mic line set at 31) and hearing
Diddles. So MMTTY is working for TX and RX better than before, and I
had a QSO a bit ago with W1AW/4.- However with K3 power set at 85w, I
am only  showing 30w power out on both K3 RF meter and on the KPA
digital readout.- Also as I understand it Signalink does AFSK, so why
does it appear to be working in DATA A. Does the Data A mode
selection have something to do with the reduced power out?

73 Paulkc2nyu
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[Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread paul ecker via Elecraft
Thanks for all the inputs on my question.I have made some progress. I changed 
the K3 mode from AFSK to Data A, and in MMTTY have"Rev" selected. I am now upon 
TX getting power out, movement on the ALC meter (4 bars with 5th flickering, 
mic line set at 31) and hearing Diddles. So MMTTY is working for TX and RX 
better than before, and I had a QSO a bit ago with W1AW/4.- However with K3 
power set at 85w, I am only  showing 30w power out on both K3 RF meter and on 
the KPA digital readout.- Also as I understand it Signalink does AFSK, so why 
does it appear to be working in DATA A. Does the Data A mode selection have 
something to do with the reduced power out?

73 Paulkc2nyu
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Jim Brown

On Tue,10/14/2014 5:17 AM, Wes (N7WS) wrote:
I like to use lower tones (915) because I listen to the incoming 
signal and the high tone drives me nuts.  MMTTY defaults to 2125. If 
you use profiles then it's best to edit the .ini file directly and set 
these. 


I do the same, and for the same reason. But it's not only the .ini file 
that must be edited -- there's another file that defines the various 
decoder settings that can be selected from a pull-down menu or cycled 
through. I don't recall the name of that file, but like the .ini file, 
it's plain text and in the same directory. There are about ten instances 
of the setting that must be changed.


73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-14 Thread Wes (N7WS)

I didn't read the op so I'll add on here.

Make sure that the transmit mark frequency is the same as the receive 
frequency.  I've been bitten by this several times.  I like to use lower tones 
(915) because I listen to the incoming signal and the high tone drives me nuts.  
MMTTY defaults to 2125. If you use profiles then it's best to edit the .ini file 
directly and set these.


Wes  N7WS

On 10/13/2014 4:08 PM, Tom Blahovici wrote:

Hi Paul,
Although I do not use MMTTY ,  the fact that you have the lights and TX on the 
k3 working suggests that the ptt function (or VOX) is correct.
The fact that all of the other software is working suggests that something 
related to the sound card settings in MMTTY is incorrect. Perhaps it has its 
own level controls or you have the wrong i/o settings.
Can you receive correctly? Have you set the input on the k3 to the line in?
Hope this helps.
73's Tom
va2fsq.com

On Oct 13, 2014 2:50 PM, paul ecker via Elecraft  
wrote:

I am having problems getting MMTTY to transmitproperly using K3 with a 
Signalink USB interface.

Currently, when I go to TX in MMTTY, I get red TXlight on Signalink, a red TX 
light on K3, I hear diddles coming out of theSignalink rear monitor jack, and  
I seemovement on Vu meter in Windows sound playback tab. BUT I get no RF out on 
K3 RFmeter, no movement on K3 ALC meter and I am not hearing any diddles.

- PC is Win 7 64 bit, i5 3.5ghz processor, 16gbof ram

- My K3, Signalink, PC setup is working finewith DM780 PSK31, JT65HF, WSPR and 
WSJT-X.

Would appreciate talking to someone who hasMMTTY running successfully  using K3 
witha Signalink USB  to share setup information.

  
Tnx & 73


Paul



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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-13 Thread Don Wilhelm

Paul,

How many bars are being illuminated on the K3 ALC meter?  If you do not 
have 4 bars illuminated with the 5th bar flickering, you do not have 
enough audio drive.
If you are using the K3 Line In, you will have to set the SignaLink for 
high audio output (see the SL instructions).


The K3 must be operated as indicated in the K3 manual.  If you try to 
use the conventional advice given for other rigs, you will have trouble 
- the K3 is different in how it controls the power output level.
Set the audio level to produce the proper level in the ALC meter (you 
can do that in TX TEST mode so you do not bother other operators).  Then 
set your desired power level with the K3 power control.
Attempting to use the audio level to control the power output will 
result in failure.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 10/13/2014 2:50 PM, paul ecker via Elecraft wrote:

I am having problems getting MMTTY to transmitproperly using K3 with a 
Signalink USB interface.

Currently, when I go to TX in MMTTY, I get red TXlight on Signalink, a red TX 
light on K3, I hear diddles coming out of theSignalink rear monitor jack, and  
I seemovement on Vu meter in Windows sound playback tab. BUT I get no RF out on 
K3 RFmeter, no movement on K3 ALC meter and I am not hearing any diddles.

- PC is Win 7 64 bit, i5 3.5ghz processor, 16gbof ram

- My K3, Signalink, PC setup is working finewith DM780 PSK31, JT65HF, WSPR and 
WSJT-X.

Would appreciate talking to someone who hasMMTTY running successfully  using K3 
witha Signalink USB  to share setup information.



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Re: [Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-13 Thread Tom Blahovici
Hi Paul, 
Although I do not use MMTTY ,  the fact that you have the lights and TX on the 
k3 working suggests that the ptt function (or VOX) is correct. 
The fact that all of the other software is working suggests that something 
related to the sound card settings in MMTTY is incorrect. Perhaps it has its 
own level controls or you have the wrong i/o settings. 
Can you receive correctly? Have you set the input on the k3 to the line in? 
Hope this helps. 
73's Tom 
va2fsq.com

On Oct 13, 2014 2:50 PM, paul ecker via Elecraft  
wrote:
>
> I am having problems getting MMTTY to transmitproperly using K3 with a 
> Signalink USB interface.
>
> Currently, when I go to TX in MMTTY, I get red TXlight on Signalink, a red TX 
> light on K3, I hear diddles coming out of theSignalink rear monitor jack, and 
>  I seemovement on Vu meter in Windows sound playback tab. BUT I get no RF out 
> on K3 RFmeter, no movement on K3 ALC meter and I am not hearing any diddles.
>
> - PC is Win 7 64 bit, i5 3.5ghz processor, 16gbof ram
>
> - My K3, Signalink, PC setup is working finewith DM780 PSK31, JT65HF, WSPR 
> and WSJT-X.
>
> Would appreciate talking to someone who hasMMTTY running successfully  using 
> K3 witha Signalink USB  to share setup information.
>
>  
> Tnx & 73
>
> Paul
>
>  
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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> Message delivered to tom...@videotron.ca
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[Elecraft] K3/MMTTY/Signalink Problem

2014-10-13 Thread paul ecker via Elecraft
I am having problems getting MMTTY to transmitproperly using K3 with a 
Signalink USB interface.

Currently, when I go to TX in MMTTY, I get red TXlight on Signalink, a red TX 
light on K3, I hear diddles coming out of theSignalink rear monitor jack, and  
I seemovement on Vu meter in Windows sound playback tab. BUT I get no RF out on 
K3 RFmeter, no movement on K3 ALC meter and I am not hearing any diddles.

- PC is Win 7 64 bit, i5 3.5ghz processor, 16gbof ram

- My K3, Signalink, PC setup is working finewith DM780 PSK31, JT65HF, WSPR and 
WSJT-X.

Would appreciate talking to someone who hasMMTTY running successfully  using K3 
witha Signalink USB  to share setup information.


 
Tnx & 73 

Paul


 
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