Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
usable, but at the expense of simplicity. Every device added to the combination of things to put a signal on the air adds to the complexity of the entire setup. And that added complexity adds to the number of devices that can fail, and adds exponentially to the number of setup combinations that are possible - some combinations will work, others will almost work, and a lot of other combinations result in requests for help here on the Elecraft reflector. None of those combinations are a K3 problem, but are a result of the complexity of the various components in the users station setup. Since the K3 does support digital modes direct from a computer soundcard, it would be prudent IMHO for users to try that combination first before committing to the extra features afforded by an external interface box. In two cases in the last two days, we have encountered problems on this reflector where the user of an external interface box had problems because the audio levels presented to the K3 were at microphone level instead of line level - simply because the interface box manufacturer did not consider that any transceiver would be using line level inputs. Your Microham interface boxes may give consideration to line level input (I don't know one way or the other), but many do not even consider anything other than mic level input. I am not targeting the Microham products, but am simply indicating that many digital interface boxes do not consider line level audio input to the transceiver. Again with the KISS principle, the more functions that are placed in the interface box, the more complex the entire station operation becomes. Once properly set up, it can be a benefit, but for those who are initially venturing into digital modes, the variety of setup tools and menus for a particular interface box can be overwhelming. This is not a K3 problem. Set things up using the simplest connections possible, and determine that the K3 works. Then add the interface box - if it does not work, then it should be obvious that some setup parameter for the interface box is the problem and the user should direct his questions to the interface box reflector and not bring implications that the K3 is faulty. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/9/2011 8:06 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: In other words (for those using a K3), an additional soundcard may be a better solution than one of the Digital Interface boxes. That depends entirely on the feature set the user needs. 1) The K3 can not switch between soundcard input and microphone input based on PTT source to support DVK from logging software 2) The K3 can not automatically control band switching in an Icom PW-1 or other CI-V compatible accessories. 3) The K3 does not have a keyer compatible with the three major contest loggers and several major day to day loggers. I'm sure I can come up with two or three more features if pressed. In any case, dismissing the digital interfaces rather than helping K3 users make their equipment coexist properly is rather short sighted. 73, ... Joe Subich, W4TV microHAM America, LLC. http://www.microHAM-USA.com http://groups.yahoo.com/group/microHAM On 1/9/2011 7:29 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: Bob, Your assertion that one does not have to use the normal computer soundcard is well received. BUT there is no need to use one of the Digital Interfaces just to get the soundcard function. There are plenty of external soundcards available at less cost than the digital interfaces, and for those with desktop computers, adding an internal soundcard (in addition to the normal Windows soundcard) is an easy thing to do. Most applications will let you select which soundcard should be used. In other words (for those using a K3), an additional soundcard may be a better solution than one of the Digital Interface boxes. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/9/2011 6:59 PM, Bob Naumann wrote: The TI-5 has a USB sound card in it. The idea is so you don't have to interfere with your normal computer's sound card. I have a TI-5 and it works nicely - although I do FSK RTTY so the transmit levels are not something I have to mess with. 73, Bob W5OV -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Tony Estep Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2011 2:50 PM To: Elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5 On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelmw3...@embarqmail.com wrote: ...With the K3, no digital interface is required...everything needed built-in, no need for a separate interface box. What Don said. Start out by hooking the K3 straight to the computer (3 cables: serial, audio in, audio out) and get it working that way. It will do all digital modes, SSB, CW, and everything else without an interface. Then you will know everything works and can adjust levels, etc. After that you can insert an interface if for some reason you need one. Tony KT0NY
[Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
Good afternoon everyone I just received a RigExpert TI-5 with the factory-made cable for my K3. I've installed it as directed and I get the K3 to transmit using MXWin software, I can get the frequency/mode to change on the K3 but not much else. I have the Line-In on the K3 turned on,etc and just can't figure out why this won't work. Anyone else have the RigExpert and the K3 that could point me to a configuration I might be missing on the K3? Thanks. Larry, KN8N __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
I use a RigExpert Plus, which appears to be very similar to the TI-5. You'll need to set the OUT pot to max and use a high setting on the windows slider control related to that output. I don't know how that maps to usage with MixW; I'm using DM780. The K3 requires more drive than some radios for sufficient transmit audio on Line In. Be *sure* to set the drive to 4-5 bars of ALC. I know the conventional wisdom on PSK31 tells you to have no ALC indication on your transmitter or your Tx IMD will suffer, but the purveyors of that wisdom aren't using a K3 :-) The ALC indication on the K3 is an audio input level indication until you get to 5 bars. It is *not* a Tx power has been reduced due to overdive indicator. 73, Lyle KK7P I just received a RigExpert TI-5 with the factory-made cable for my K3. I've installed it as directed... I have the Line-In on the K3 turned on,etc and just can't figure out why this won't work. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
Larry, We had a similar problem yesterday too. Put the K3 into TX TEST and check the audio input level. Are you getting at least 4 bars indicated on the ALC meter with the 5th bar flashing occasionally? If not, the audio level is not high enough. The RigExpert manual only addresses using microphone input to the transceiver, but there is a jumper to insert or remove a 10 dB attenuator - try it in the non-attenuated position and see if the level becomes high enough. See Appendix A of the Rigexpert manual, the proper jumper is labeled OUT, but unfortunately the manual does not state how the jumper should be configured to remove the attenuator. The level required by the K3 is the normal Line level available from a computer soundcard. Several ham type digital interfaces apparently do not produce a line level because the manufacturer provides only microphone levels - mic level is down in the millivolt range while line level in in the low volts range. You *could* use the microphone input to the K3 if worse comes to worse, but the TX EQ is in line with the microphone input and you would want to set all bands of the TX EQ to zero for digital use. With the K3, no digital interface is required - just a computer soundcard. Connect the soundcard Line Out to the K3 Line In, and the K3 Line Out to the soundcard Line In using a pair of stereo cables with 3.5mm stereo jacks and you can run DATA A or AFSK A (for RTTY) using VOX. If your application can key the K3 using RS-232 commands, so much the better, and the K3 provides for DTR or RTS keying as well. The K3 has everything needed built-in, no need for a separate interface box. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/9/2011 2:48 PM, Larry Boekeloo wrote: Good afternoon everyone I just received a RigExpert TI-5 with the factory-made cable for my K3. I've installed it as directed and I get the K3 to transmit using MXWin software, I can get the frequency/mode to change on the K3 but not much else. I have the Line-In on the K3 turned on,etc and just can't figure out why this won't work. Anyone else have the RigExpert and the K3 that could point me to a configuration I might be missing on the K3? Thanks. Larry, KN8N __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote: ...With the K3, no digital interface is required...everything needed built-in, no need for a separate interface box. What Don said. Start out by hooking the K3 straight to the computer (3 cables: serial, audio in, audio out) and get it working that way. It will do all digital modes, SSB, CW, and everything else without an interface. Then you will know everything works and can adjust levels, etc. After that you can insert an interface if for some reason you need one. Tony KT0NY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
The TI-5 has a USB sound card in it. The idea is so you don't have to interfere with your normal computer's sound card. I have a TI-5 and it works nicely - although I do FSK RTTY so the transmit levels are not something I have to mess with. 73, Bob W5OV -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Tony Estep Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2011 2:50 PM To: Elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5 On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote: ...With the K3, no digital interface is required...everything needed built-in, no need for a separate interface box. What Don said. Start out by hooking the K3 straight to the computer (3 cables: serial, audio in, audio out) and get it working that way. It will do all digital modes, SSB, CW, and everything else without an interface. Then you will know everything works and can adjust levels, etc. After that you can insert an interface if for some reason you need one. Tony KT0NY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
Bob, Your assertion that one does not have to use the normal computer soundcard is well received. BUT there is no need to use one of the Digital Interfaces just to get the soundcard function. There are plenty of external soundcards available at less cost than the digital interfaces, and for those with desktop computers, adding an internal soundcard (in addition to the normal Windows soundcard) is an easy thing to do. Most applications will let you select which soundcard should be used. In other words (for those using a K3), an additional soundcard may be a better solution than one of the Digital Interface boxes. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/9/2011 6:59 PM, Bob Naumann wrote: The TI-5 has a USB sound card in it. The idea is so you don't have to interfere with your normal computer's sound card. I have a TI-5 and it works nicely - although I do FSK RTTY so the transmit levels are not something I have to mess with. 73, Bob W5OV -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Tony Estep Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2011 2:50 PM To: Elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5 On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelmw3...@embarqmail.com wrote: ...With the K3, no digital interface is required...everything needed built-in, no need for a separate interface box. What Don said. Start out by hooking the K3 straight to the computer (3 cables: serial, audio in, audio out) and get it working that way. It will do all digital modes, SSB, CW, and everything else without an interface. Then you will know everything works and can adjust levels, etc. After that you can insert an interface if for some reason you need one. Tony KT0NY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
Joe, My apologies to your products, but I have been a long and strong believer in the KISS principle. Keep It Simple Stupid. Yes, there are accessories that make things more usable, but at the expense of simplicity. Every device added to the combination of things to put a signal on the air adds to the complexity of the entire setup. And that added complexity adds to the number of devices that can fail, and adds exponentially to the number of setup combinations that are possible - some combinations will work, others will almost work, and a lot of other combinations result in requests for help here on the Elecraft reflector. None of those combinations are a K3 problem, but are a result of the complexity of the various components in the users station setup. Since the K3 does support digital modes direct from a computer soundcard, it would be prudent IMHO for users to try that combination first before committing to the extra features afforded by an external interface box. In two cases in the last two days, we have encountered problems on this reflector where the user of an external interface box had problems because the audio levels presented to the K3 were at microphone level instead of line level - simply because the interface box manufacturer did not consider that any transceiver would be using line level inputs. Your Microham interface boxes may give consideration to line level input (I don't know one way or the other), but many do not even consider anything other than mic level input. I am not targeting the Microham products, but am simply indicating that many digital interface boxes do not consider line level audio input to the transceiver. Again with the KISS principle, the more functions that are placed in the interface box, the more complex the entire station operation becomes. Once properly set up, it can be a benefit, but for those who are initially venturing into digital modes, the variety of setup tools and menus for a particular interface box can be overwhelming. This is not a K3 problem. Set things up using the simplest connections possible, and determine that the K3 works. Then add the interface box - if it does not work, then it should be obvious that some setup parameter for the interface box is the problem and the user should direct his questions to the interface box reflector and not bring implications that the K3 is faulty. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/9/2011 8:06 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: In other words (for those using a K3), an additional soundcard may be a better solution than one of the Digital Interface boxes. That depends entirely on the feature set the user needs. 1) The K3 can not switch between soundcard input and microphone input based on PTT source to support DVK from logging software 2) The K3 can not automatically control band switching in an Icom PW-1 or other CI-V compatible accessories. 3) The K3 does not have a keyer compatible with the three major contest loggers and several major day to day loggers. I'm sure I can come up with two or three more features if pressed. In any case, dismissing the digital interfaces rather than helping K3 users make their equipment coexist properly is rather short sighted. 73, ... Joe Subich, W4TV microHAM America, LLC. http://www.microHAM-USA.com http://groups.yahoo.com/group/microHAM On 1/9/2011 7:29 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote: Bob, Your assertion that one does not have to use the normal computer soundcard is well received. BUT there is no need to use one of the Digital Interfaces just to get the soundcard function. There are plenty of external soundcards available at less cost than the digital interfaces, and for those with desktop computers, adding an internal soundcard (in addition to the normal Windows soundcard) is an easy thing to do. Most applications will let you select which soundcard should be used. In other words (for those using a K3), an additional soundcard may be a better solution than one of the Digital Interface boxes. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/9/2011 6:59 PM, Bob Naumann wrote: The TI-5 has a USB sound card in it. The idea is so you don't have to interfere with your normal computer's sound card. I have a TI-5 and it works nicely - although I do FSK RTTY so the transmit levels are not something I have to mess with. 73, Bob W5OV -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Tony Estep Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2011 2:50 PM To: Elecraft Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5 On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelmw3...@embarqmail.com wrote: ...With the K3, no digital interface is required...everything needed built-in, no need for a separate interface box. What Don said. Start out by hooking the K3 straight to the computer (3 cables: serial, audio in, audio out) and get it working that way
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
: Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5 On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 2:26 PM, Don Wilhelmw3...@embarqmail.com wrote: ...With the K3, no digital interface is required...everything needed built-in, no need for a separate interface box. What Don said. Start out by hooking the K3 straight to the computer (3 cables: serial, audio in, audio out) and get it working that way. It will do all digital modes, SSB, CW, and everything else without an interface. Then you will know everything works and can adjust levels, etc. After that you can insert an interface if for some reason you need one. Tony KT0NY __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html -- Gary VK4FD - Motorhome Mobile http://www.qsl.net/vk4fd/ K3 #679, P3 #546 For everything else there's Mastercard!!! __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5
Don, I think it's fair to say that interfacing a K3 with a USB port is easily the most commonly occurring issue on this reflector. The infinite messages and inquiries about what driver will work with a KUSB and the apparent change of the KUSB hardware from Prolific to FTDI chipsets while retaining the same part number is obviously confusing to many users. In the case of the interface that is the subject of this thread, it greatly simplifies all of the interfacing for all modes with the K3 to a single USB port. The TI-5, and other Rig Expert interfaces allow the user to have one physical USB port drive the K3 with RS232, a WinKey, PTT/CW/Soft FSK for all modes, hard FSK for RTTY and not have to mess around with figuring all of those different things. It's all built-in. One of the benefits of the Rig Expert units is that you do not need to take them out of the line to use the K3 utility or the P3 utility to manage your K3. Again, I have not used mine to do any of the digital modes that require the use of audio coming from the interface so there could be an issue there, but I suspect that there is likely a simple resolution to that problem. And yes, I agree that support for the use of the interface should be directed to the interface manufacturer's reflector - not here. 73, Bob W5OV -Original Message- From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Don Wilhelm Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2011 7:57 PM To: Joe Subich, W4TV Cc: 'Elecraft'; d...@w3fpr.com Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3/RigExpert TI-5 Joe, My apologies to your products, but I have been a long and strong believer in the KISS principle. Keep It Simple Stupid. Yes, there are accessories that make things more usable, but at the expense of simplicity. Every device added to the combination of things to put a signal on the air adds to the complexity of the entire setup. And that added complexity adds to the number of devices that can fail, and adds exponentially to the number of setup combinations that are possible - some combinations will work, others will almost work, and a lot of other combinations result in requests for help here on the Elecraft reflector. None of those combinations are a K3 problem, but are a result of the complexity of the various components in the users station setup. Since the K3 does support digital modes direct from a computer soundcard, it would be prudent IMHO for users to try that combination first before committing to the extra features afforded by an external interface box. In two cases in the last two days, we have encountered problems on this reflector where the user of an external interface box had problems because the audio levels presented to the K3 were at microphone level instead of line level - simply because the interface box manufacturer did not consider that any transceiver would be using line level inputs. Your Microham interface boxes may give consideration to line level input (I don't know one way or the other), but many do not even consider anything other than mic level input. I am not targeting the Microham products, but am simply indicating that many digital interface boxes do not consider line level audio input to the transceiver. Again with the KISS principle, the more functions that are placed in the interface box, the more complex the entire station operation becomes. Once properly set up, it can be a benefit, but for those who are initially venturing into digital modes, the variety of setup tools and menus for a particular interface box can be overwhelming. This is not a K3 problem. Set things up using the simplest connections possible, and determine that the K3 works. Then add the interface box - if it does not work, then it should be obvious that some setup parameter for the interface box is the problem and the user should direct his questions to the interface box reflector and not bring implications that the K3 is faulty. 73, Don W3FPR On 1/9/2011 8:06 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote: In other words (for those using a K3), an additional soundcard may be a better solution than one of the Digital Interface boxes. That depends entirely on the feature set the user needs. 1) The K3 can not switch between soundcard input and microphone input based on PTT source to support DVK from logging software 2) The K3 can not automatically control band switching in an Icom PW-1 or other CI-V compatible accessories. 3) The K3 does not have a keyer compatible with the three major contest loggers and several major day to day loggers. I'm sure I can come up with two or three more features if pressed. In any case, dismissing the digital interfaces rather than helping K3 users make their equipment coexist properly is rather short sighted. 73, ... Joe Subich, W4TV microHAM America, LLC. http://www.microHAM-USA.com http://groups.yahoo.com/group/microHAM On 1/9
