[Elecraft] K3 power problem with LPA FETs

2021-03-18 Thread chetsubaccount
Others have asked so I took a little time today to consolidate my disorganized 
notes and will add it below.
73,
Chet, N8RA

Assembled below are the notes from my experience in finding and fixing a power 
out problem on my K3. Where possible, I tried to give credit to the authors, to 
all of which I am grateful.

TESTS FOR THE MOSFETS.

The 3-screw finger test from WA6VAB and others: 
There are 3 MOSFETs of the  LPA that are heat-sinked to the bottom of the radio 
by being connected to the bottom plate using phillips head screws. Check your 
manual for their location

Place the radio so it is raised up using the front bail and place your fingers 
on the 3 screw that are holding the 3 MOSFETs. 

Key the PTT so the XTR is on.   All 3 should get warm, Not HOT or Cold.   
Hot = shorted, Cold = open,  Warm  = normal.


WE6R factory tech comments:
The 3-finger bottom cover on and going into full TX test is valid, just takes 
longer and a bit harder to tell what is happening. 
You can do the 3-finger check with the bottom cover OFF, but  DO NOT Transmit, 
just TAP xmit to turn the Bias ON. (and have the mode set to USB or LSB-ed). 
Stop the test after 10-15 seconds. Good devices will get hot fast.
(N8RA- Note that the MOSFETs have sticky pad attached to them and if the bottom 
cover has not been off for a while, it may take some gentle wiggling to get the 
bottom cover off.)

N8RA test using the front panel power supply current display:
If there is a KPA3 installed, configure it to NOT INST and cycle power so you 
do not have its current added. Tap DISP and turn the VFO-B knob to get to the 
current display. Turn transmitter power below 10w and put the transmitter in 
“test” mode with the mode button. Note the difference in current from receive 
to that when tapping the xmit button. The difference should be about 600 ma. If 
significantly less or more, then one of the MOSFETs in the low power amp (LPA) 
may be bad or not biased properly. Reset your KPA3 configuration back to NOR 
(normal).


ORDER THE RIGHT MOSFET

Only one of my MOSFETs was bad, but I replaced both output MOSFETs. With one 
failed,  the other had been carrying the whole load to produce output so may 
have been over-worked, over-stressed and hurting.

To be sure of getting the right vintage of RD15HVF1 MOSFETs, last year I 
ordered them (and thermal insulators) from Elecraft. My order was shipped that 
same day and arrived via priority mail 2 days later. Great service.

RF Parts is also a source. It has been reported that the earlier MOSFET with 
-101 is the one to get for the K3.

DOING THE REPAIR

Obviously, the bottom cover must come off. The MOSFETs have sticky pads between 
them and the bottom cover, so it may take some gentle wiggling to free it. 

MOSFET means USE CARE to prevent ESD damage. Use a soldering iron with a 
grounded tip. Wear an ESD strap, if you do not have one, keep your other wrist 
on a metal part of the K3 case.

Note the bending direction and bent lead distance of the MOSFETs to prep the 
new parts. 
Take extra ESD care when handling these transistors by themselves. 

Cut the leads of a bad part near the body and then unsolder each lead from its 
pcb hole.

Use a solder sucker or wick to open the pcb holes.

Mount the new MOSFET and reflow its 3 pcb holes. 

Add the heat sink pads to the MOSFET tabs and put the bottom cover back on. 


MOSFET BIAS ADJUST

From Elecraft Customer Support:

You'll need to follow this sequence for setting bias after the fix:

1. Remove the 100 watt amplifier (if installed) by disconnecting the fan panel 
and their 2 connector wires, and the 2 wires to the circuit breaker.  Use care 
to not pull on the KPA3 too hard and thus let it fly off the connectors and 
cause damage to it or to the chassis. Use gentle but firm finger pressure, or 
pry carefully with a plastic tool (such as the K2 green plastic alignment 
tool), near the two PCB connectors. This will usually help the KPA3 start to 
move.

(N8RA: The Elecraft document “KPA3CONMDKT MOD Kit Manual” has a wonderful 
description of how to remove and reinstall the 100W amplifier to allow access 
to the LPA’s adjustment potentiometers.)

2. Locate small SMD pots R18, R19 and R24 near the center of the LPA board.  
Turn the pots to minimum. (White pots fully CW, Black pots fully CCW)

3. Turn the power knob down to ZERO. 

4. Tap DISP, (display button), use VFO B to display the current drawn by the 
radio. For more accurate results, insert a DMM in the positive power supply 
lead that is set to a current range that can handle up to 2-3 amps.

5. Hold TEST (the right hand side of the MODE button). This puts the K3 in TEST 
mode with no RF drive.(but it will not light the red xmt led)

6.  Tap XMIT. You will see a current of approx  1 to 2A (depending on options 
in radio) but the red TX LED will not come on.  Adjust R18 to increase the 
reading by 0.2A  IE 200ma

7. Adjust R19 to increase the current another 0.2A

8. Adjust R24 to increase the cu

[Elecraft] K3 Power problem: won't shut down and blank screen on power on

2013-04-11 Thread Hunsdon Cary III
Elecrafters:  Tech support at Elecraft is closed at the moment.  I had a nice 
QSO with W0YY a few minutes ago and when I went to shut down the K3, the 
"Power" button did not work.  Tried pushing it from a variety of angles, no 
dice. I powered down by turning my Astron RS-35M off - that did the trick!  
After supper, I sat down for some 40 meter fun and, lo and behold, the power 
button worked BUT the display is BLANK…no K4TM welcoming message….TOTALLY BLANK!
Any ideas before Elecraft tech support comes on line for me about noon tomorrow?
Tnx & 73,
Cary, K4TM
Lynchburg VA
Elecraft K3-100 #3448, KAT500 #144, KPA500 #698
h3c...@gmail.com



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-05 Thread Jim HaRRIS

Dave,

Thank you for taking he time to take the measurements nd pass them along.  I
said in my previous post that I had calibrated the wattmeter and it seemed
to help.  Well, it did help some but not enough to completely eliminate high
current warnings and subsequent power reductions.

In trouble shooting I have found that some interesting things.  

1.  Going through the tuner part of my antenna tuner adds about three (3)
more amps than going direct through the tuner.
2.  I have set CONFIG:WMTR to the setting (180) that requires least current
regardless of actual external meter indication.  If the setting (160) is
used that indicates 50 watts on the external meter when 50 is set on the
radio, the current is nearly one amp higher.
3.  When the radio is room temperature on 20 meters with 100 watts set, the
current is 20.25 amps when going directly into two different dummy loads. 
After about four minutes of 15 seconds on and off the current is 21.6 amps
and climbing.
4.  When using an antenna with an SWR of higher than 1.2:1, the current
warning is always displayed with subsequent power reduction.
5.  I have found the current warning threshold is at about 24.5 amps.

It seems the high current warning only is displayed during RTTY at 100 watts
into less than a perfect antenna while tuning with an external antenna
tuner.  I've never seen the warning in any other mode.  If this is in fact
normal then I'm very disappointed with my K3.  It sure spoiled my contest
effort today.  I've previously learned that the S-meter does not respond in
the way I would expect.  These and 2-3 other issues have left a less than
sterling impression of the K3.  I'm trying hard to like this radio but my
offshore rig doesn't have these kind of issues.

Does anyone else on the list have high current warnings when running RTTY at
100 watts?  If support is listening I sure would like to hear from you.

Jim, W0EM


100W measured on the following bands gives:

160m, 18.1 A
80m, 17.3A
40m, 22.5A
30m, 21.5A
20m, 20.5A
15m, 19.4A
10m, 17.5A
6m, 21.5A

These figures were with 13.5 ~ 13.4 Volts from my power supply as
measured on the K3's display (both for Amps and Voltage).

Power measurement into a 50 Ohm load with a calibrated LP-100 power meter.

73 Dave, G4AON
K3/100 #80
--
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-05 Thread Dave G4AON
100W measured on the following bands gives:

160m, 18.1 A
80m, 17.3A
40m, 22.5A
30m, 21.5A
20m, 20.5A
15m, 19.4A
10m, 17.5A
6m, 21.5A

These figures were with 13.5 ~ 13.4 Volts from my power supply as
measured on the K3's display (both for Amps and Voltage).

Power measurement into a 50 Ohm load with a calibrated LP-100 power meter.

73 Dave, G4AON
K3/100 #80
--

Dave,

What current does your radio draw with 100w output?

W5OV
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-05 Thread Jim HaRRIS

Dave,

Looks like you have pointed me in the right direction. I had not done the
wattmeter calibration as the manual implies that it is optional.  That plus
the usual inaccuracies in the average wattmeter I decided to accept the
factory settings.  This morning I did the procedure and thus far have not
had a high current warning.  Current is 1-2 amps less than before; still a
little on the high side but at least no warnings about it.  Knock on
wood..

For the Elecraft tech writers and anyone attempting to do the procedure
there is an error in the procedure.  On page 49 of the Owner's Manual the
last step on the bottom left should read tap XMIT rather than hold TUNE.  If
TUNE is used rather than XMIT the radio will output 20 watts regardless of
the power set while calibrating.

Thanks for the help.  73,

Jim, W0EM



Dave G4AON wrote:
> 
> Jim, if you calibrated the K3 Wattmeter with a low reading Wattmeter it
> would give the symptoms you describe. The calibration is optional and
> calls for an accurate Wattmeter, the K3 already comes calibrated from
> the factory. You might have a fault, K3 Support will be able to assist.
> 
> I use the supplied cable and obtain good correlation to the expected
> power at 5 and 50 Watts, but slightly less at 100 Watts. There is a
> table of the results at: http://www.astromag.co.uk/k3/
> 
> I've never had an over current warning.
> 
> 73 Dave, G4AON
> K3/100 #80
> -
> Exactly 100 watts set on K3. Measured about 90 watts out on two external
> watt meters. One on an MFJ antenna tuner and the other is a high end MFJ
> power meter. They agree within a couple of watts near 100 watts measured.
> 
> Have a good day and 73.
> 
> Jim, W0EM
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-05 Thread Bob Naumann
Dave,

What current does your radio draw with 100w output?

W5OV



-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Dave G4AON
Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 2:46 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

Jim, if you calibrated the K3 Wattmeter with a low reading Wattmeter it
would give the symptoms you describe. The calibration is optional and
calls for an accurate Wattmeter, the K3 already comes calibrated from
the factory. You might have a fault, K3 Support will be able to assist.

I use the supplied cable and obtain good correlation to the expected
power at 5 and 50 Watts, but slightly less at 100 Watts. There is a
table of the results at: http://www.astromag.co.uk/k3/

I've never had an over current warning.

73 Dave, G4AON
K3/100 #80
-
Exactly 100 watts set on K3. Measured about 90 watts out on two external
watt meters. One on an MFJ antenna tuner and the other is a high end MFJ
power meter. They agree within a couple of watts near 100 watts measured.

Have a good day and 73.

Jim, W0EM
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-05 Thread Dave G4AON
Jim, if you calibrated the K3 Wattmeter with a low reading Wattmeter it
would give the symptoms you describe. The calibration is optional and
calls for an accurate Wattmeter, the K3 already comes calibrated from
the factory. You might have a fault, K3 Support will be able to assist.

I use the supplied cable and obtain good correlation to the expected
power at 5 and 50 Watts, but slightly less at 100 Watts. There is a
table of the results at: http://www.astromag.co.uk/k3/

I've never had an over current warning.

73 Dave, G4AON
K3/100 #80
-
Exactly 100 watts set on K3. Measured about 90 watts out on two external
watt meters. One on an MFJ antenna tuner and the other is a high end MFJ
power meter. They agree within a couple of watts near 100 watts measured.

Have a good day and 73.

Jim, W0EM
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-04 Thread Bob Naumann
Jim,

23 to 24 amps is excessive current to be drawing at 14v and probably means
that you are drawing too much.

Have you verified that those watt meters are accurate?

As some comparison data, running 100 watts out of my K3 into a 1:1.1 SWR it
only draws 17.1 amps.

73,

Bob W5OV



-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim Harris
Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 10:41 PM
To: w...@w5ov.com; Elecraft Email; Gary Elecraft
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??


Hi,

Exactly 100 watts set on K3.  Measured about 90 watts out on two external
watt meters.  One on an MFJ antenna tuner and the other is a high end MFJ
power meter.  They agree within a couple of watts near 100 watts measured.

Have a good day and 73.

Jim, W0EM




> From: w...@w5ov.com
> To: w...@q.com; elecraft@mailman.qth.net; g...@elecraft.com
> Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??
> Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 21:51:35 -0600
> 
> Jim,
> 
> 23 to 24 amps on transmit? The manual says you should have 17 to 22. At
14v
> it sure sounds like you're running a lot more than 100w out. 
> 
> How are you measuring the output?
> 
> W5OV
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim Harris
> Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:46 PM
> To: Elecraft Email; Gary Elecraft
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??
> 
> 
> Hi Folks,
> 
> When doing RTTY at 100 watts a high current warning flashes in the VFO B
> display area and RF power is automatically cut back to about 60 watts.
SWR
> is about 1.1:1 or there abouts; nothing approaching 1.5:1.  I have found
> there is 0.6 volts drop in the Elecraft supplied power cable (Power Poles
> are soldered) and about 0.2 volt drop between my power supply and the
output
> of the Rigrunner.  It's between the power supply and the K3.  Voltage at
the
> radio drops to 13.2 vdc and current is 23-24 amps on transmit.  Under that
> load the voltage at the power supply drops 0.01 volts.  I run the power
> supply (it's variable) at 14.0 volts at the supply.  It's a 40 amp power
> supply.  I have a popular off shore rig that has no problem with the
> existing power setup.
> 
> In reading the Supply/Voltage Current specifications on page eight (8) of
> the Owners Manual I find it recommends  "When using reduced supply voltage
> (<12volts), power output should be reduced (e.g. 70 W at 11 V).  Further,
> "For best results, use the supplied 5 foot (1.3 m) power cable."  Those
two
> statements appear to be in error when applied to my radio.
> 
> My K3 appears to be overly sensitive to voltage and current.  The only
> adjustment I can locate that might relate to this is the menu CONFIG:ADC
REF
> entry. However, I seriously doubt it will have any impact on this as this
> appears to be a serious error and adjust appears to be for fine tuning at
> best.
> 
> I certainly would appreciate any ones constructive input on this
situation.
> I could appreciate knowing the gauge of the supplied cableI'm hoping
> that doubling or tripling the size might help.  But, that seems to be a
> bandaide rather that eliminating the root cause.
> 
> Thank, have a good day and 73.
> 
> Jim, W0EM
> 
> 
> 
> __
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-04 Thread Jim Harris

Hi,

Exactly 100 watts set on K3.  Measured about 90 watts out on two external watt 
meters.  One on an MFJ antenna tuner and the other is a high end MFJ power 
meter.  They agree within a couple of watts near 100 watts measured.

Have a good day and 73.

Jim, W0EM




> From: w...@w5ov.com
> To: w...@q.com; elecraft@mailman.qth.net; g...@elecraft.com
> Subject: RE: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??
> Date: Fri, 4 Dec 2009 21:51:35 -0600
> 
> Jim,
> 
> 23 to 24 amps on transmit? The manual says you should have 17 to 22. At 14v
> it sure sounds like you're running a lot more than 100w out. 
> 
> How are you measuring the output?
> 
> W5OV
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim Harris
> Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:46 PM
> To: Elecraft Email; Gary Elecraft
> Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??
> 
> 
> Hi Folks,
> 
> When doing RTTY at 100 watts a high current warning flashes in the VFO B
> display area and RF power is automatically cut back to about 60 watts.  SWR
> is about 1.1:1 or there abouts; nothing approaching 1.5:1.  I have found
> there is 0.6 volts drop in the Elecraft supplied power cable (Power Poles
> are soldered) and about 0.2 volt drop between my power supply and the output
> of the Rigrunner.  It's between the power supply and the K3.  Voltage at the
> radio drops to 13.2 vdc and current is 23-24 amps on transmit.  Under that
> load the voltage at the power supply drops 0.01 volts.  I run the power
> supply (it's variable) at 14.0 volts at the supply.  It's a 40 amp power
> supply.  I have a popular off shore rig that has no problem with the
> existing power setup.
> 
> In reading the Supply/Voltage Current specifications on page eight (8) of
> the Owners Manual I find it recommends  "When using reduced supply voltage
> (<12volts), power output should be reduced (e.g. 70 W at 11 V).  Further,
> "For best results, use the supplied 5 foot (1.3 m) power cable."  Those two
> statements appear to be in error when applied to my radio.
> 
> My K3 appears to be overly sensitive to voltage and current.  The only
> adjustment I can locate that might relate to this is the menu CONFIG:ADC REF
> entry. However, I seriously doubt it will have any impact on this as this
> appears to be a serious error and adjust appears to be for fine tuning at
> best.
> 
> I certainly would appreciate any ones constructive input on this situation.
> I could appreciate knowing the gauge of the supplied cableI'm hoping
> that doubling or tripling the size might help.  But, that seems to be a
> bandaide rather that eliminating the root cause.
> 
> Thank, have a good day and 73.
> 
> Jim, W0EM
> 
> 
> 
> __
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-04 Thread Bob Naumann
Jim,

23 to 24 amps on transmit? The manual says you should have 17 to 22. At 14v
it sure sounds like you're running a lot more than 100w out. 

How are you measuring the output?

W5OV

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim Harris
Sent: Friday, December 04, 2009 7:46 PM
To: Elecraft Email; Gary Elecraft
Subject: [Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??


Hi Folks,

When doing RTTY at 100 watts a high current warning flashes in the VFO B
display area and RF power is automatically cut back to about 60 watts.  SWR
is about 1.1:1 or there abouts; nothing approaching 1.5:1.  I have found
there is 0.6 volts drop in the Elecraft supplied power cable (Power Poles
are soldered) and about 0.2 volt drop between my power supply and the output
of the Rigrunner.  It's between the power supply and the K3.  Voltage at the
radio drops to 13.2 vdc and current is 23-24 amps on transmit.  Under that
load the voltage at the power supply drops 0.01 volts.  I run the power
supply (it's variable) at 14.0 volts at the supply.  It's a 40 amp power
supply.  I have a popular off shore rig that has no problem with the
existing power setup.

In reading the Supply/Voltage Current specifications on page eight (8) of
the Owners Manual I find it recommends  "When using reduced supply voltage
(<12volts), power output should be reduced (e.g. 70 W at 11 V).  Further,
"For best results, use the supplied 5 foot (1.3 m) power cable."  Those two
statements appear to be in error when applied to my radio.

My K3 appears to be overly sensitive to voltage and current.  The only
adjustment I can locate that might relate to this is the menu CONFIG:ADC REF
entry. However, I seriously doubt it will have any impact on this as this
appears to be a serious error and adjust appears to be for fine tuning at
best.

I certainly would appreciate any ones constructive input on this situation.
I could appreciate knowing the gauge of the supplied cableI'm hoping
that doubling or tripling the size might help.  But, that seems to be a
bandaide rather that eliminating the root cause.

Thank, have a good day and 73.

Jim, W0EM


  
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[Elecraft] K3 Power Problem ??

2009-12-04 Thread Jim Harris

Hi Folks,

When doing RTTY at 100 watts a high current warning flashes in the VFO B 
display area and RF power is automatically cut back to about 60 watts.  SWR is 
about 1.1:1 or there abouts; nothing approaching 1.5:1.  I have found there is 
0.6 volts drop in the Elecraft supplied power cable (Power Poles are soldered) 
and about 0.2 volt drop between my power supply and the output of the 
Rigrunner.  It's between the power supply and the K3.  Voltage at the radio 
drops to 13.2 vdc and current is 23-24 amps on transmit.  Under that load the 
voltage at the power supply drops 0.01 volts.  I run the power supply (it's 
variable) at 14.0 volts at the supply.  It's a 40 amp power supply.  I have a 
popular off shore rig that has no problem with the existing power setup.

In reading the Supply/Voltage Current specifications on page eight (8) of the 
Owners Manual I find it recommends  "When using reduced supply voltage 
(<12volts), power output should be reduced (e.g. 70 W at 11 V).  Further, "For 
best results, use the supplied 5 foot (1.3 m) power cable."  Those two 
statements appear to be in error when applied to my radio.

My K3 appears to be overly sensitive to voltage and current.  The only 
adjustment I can locate that might relate to this is the menu CONFIG:ADC REF 
entry. However, I seriously doubt it will have any impact on this as this 
appears to be a serious error and adjust appears to be for fine tuning at best.

I certainly would appreciate any ones constructive input on this situation.  I 
could appreciate knowing the gauge of the supplied cableI'm hoping that 
doubling or tripling the size might help.  But, that seems to be a bandaide 
rather that eliminating the root cause.

Thank, have a good day and 73.

Jim, W0EM


  
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