[Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Sanyo, Tenergy, Powerex, Imedion, Panasonic, etc. matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Hi Ken, While higher capacity may seem better, it is sort of a false promise. The highest capacity cells tend to have high self-discharge, which causes them to deplete just sitting on the shelf quickly. Look for low self-discharge batteries. Sanyo's Enerloop (~2000mah) or Sanyo's XX (~2500mah) are two good examples. Hard to beat amazon pricing. Enerloop are about $20 for a set of 8. XX are about $34. 73, Bob, WB4SON __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
The Sanyo's are also known as Eneloops. Be sure to get 2000mah or higher capacity cells. Mark KE6BB Sent from my iThingie. On Jun 27, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net wrote: Sanyo, Tenergy, Powerex, Imedion, Panasonic, etc. matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Just to be clear, there are Sanyo's Eneloops out there at retail, but also a line of Sanyo commercial cells generally sold only as OEM product. I had a 14.8V pack built from the latter: 39 WH - so good for several days of KX3 CW ops. 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 12:43:07 -0700, you wrote: The Sanyo's are also known as Eneloops. Be sure to get 2000mah or higher capacity cells. Mark KE6BB Sent from my iThingie. On Jun 27, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net wrote: Sanyo, Tenergy, Powerex, Imedion, Panasonic, etc. matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Ken, if you only want batteries to keep the clock running and you otherwise run off of an external power supply, why not a set of simple alkaline cells? One set should last years, if not longer! 73 Ron AC7AC -Original Message- On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Correct, Matt. I am actually running Panasonic HHR210AAB cells right now, which appear to be Enelooops with a different jacket, based on my research. We used them in my work, but only recharged them a few times, so I was able to get them cheap, and they work well. I have a lot of experience with Eneloop 2000 maH cells at home...probably a more severe environment than my work! They seem to be very forgiving so long as you don't discharge them below 0.9 volts per cell. I think early this year, we were seeing a lot of out of the box infant mortality with the Rayovac rechargeable NiMH cells. Not sure if that is still a problem. Mark KE6BB From: Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net To: Mark Petiford rv6am...@yahoo.com Cc: Rose elecraftcov...@gmail.com; Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 12:51 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells? Just to be clear, there are Sanyo's Eneloops out there at retail, but also a line of Sanyo commercial cells generally sold only as OEM product. I had a 14.8V pack built from the latter: 39 WH - so good for several days of KX3 CW ops. 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 12:43:07 -0700, you wrote: The Sanyo's are also known as Eneloops. Be sure to get 2000mah or higher capacity cells. Mark KE6BB Sent from my iThingie. On Jun 27, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net wrote: Sanyo, Tenergy, Powerex, Imedion, Panasonic, etc. matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Hi Mark, You caught me in the middle a battery research project (day job) and I found some dirt on Rayovac -literally-:ALK and NiMH both. Pretty severe manufacturing issues, though the details about the contamination weren't spelled out. No CPSC issues though, so they're still in business. It got so bad that Rayovac has to put a banner on all retail blister packs: Lasts As Long As Duracell or some such. Everyone seems pretty pleased with the Eneloops, so that's good. I used them on the KX3 for a while, then ran a few tests and ended up with Tenergy Premium. To each his own! 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 14:13:40 -0700 (PDT), you wrote: Correct, Matt. I am actually running Panasonic HHR210AAB cells right now, which appear to be Enelooops with a different jacket, based on my research. We used them in my work, but only recharged them a few times, so I was able to get them cheap, and they work well. I have a lot of experience with Eneloop 2000 maH cells at home...probably a more severe environment than my work! They seem to be very forgiving so long as you don't discharge them below 0.9 volts per cell. I think early this year, we were seeing a lot of out of the box infant mortality with the Rayovac rechargeable NiMH cells. Not sure if that is still a problem. Mark KE6BB From: Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net To: Mark Petiford rv6am...@yahoo.com Cc: Rose elecraftcov...@gmail.com; Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 12:51 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells? Just to be clear, there are Sanyo's Eneloops out there at retail, but also a line of Sanyo commercial cells generally sold only as OEM product. I had a 14.8V pack built from the latter: 39 WH - so good for several days of KX3 CW ops. 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 12:43:07 -0700, you wrote: The Sanyo's are also known as Eneloops. Be sure to get 2000mah or higher capacity cells. Mark KE6BB Sent from my iThingie. On Jun 27, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net wrote: Sanyo, Tenergy, Powerex, Imedion, Panasonic, etc. matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Ken, If you primarily want to keep the clock alive, I think the 2000 mAH Sanyo Eneloop are hard to beat, based on cost, availability, and self discharge rate. I'd avoid Alkaline cells for long term use because of the potential damage from leaking. 73, Rich AC7MA On 06/27/2013 11:58 AM, Bob wrote: Hi Ken, While higher capacity may seem better, it is sort of a false promise. The highest capacity cells tend to have high self-discharge, which causes them to deplete just sitting on the shelf quickly. Look for low self-discharge batteries. Sanyo's Enerloop (~2000mah) or Sanyo's XX (~2500mah) are two good examples. Hard to beat amazon pricing. Enerloop are about $20 for a set of 8. XX are about $34. 73, Bob, WB4SON __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Matt, That would explain why, on the Yahoo Group, we were seeing complaints of a cell or two out of eight, failing right out of the box!!! I was amazed at that. FYI, All Electronics sells a Tenergy cell that is a D size cell with a capacity of 10,000 maH: http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/NMH-D/NIMH-RECHARGEABLE-D-CELL-10-000MAH/1.html I don't have one, but they do not appear to be AA cells in a D size sleeve...not with that capacity! They won't fit in a KX3, but I had thought I might build a tube of these as an external battery pack. Unfortunately, I don't think it would be much less expensive than a similar size pack of LiFePo cells. I wouldn't have to buy the balanced charger, but would have to make up a constant current charger myself...or else charge with a variable voltage power supply while manually adjusting the voltage to keep the current relatively constant. Makes the newer lithium technology look better and better. Now, if I could just get myself to trust Lithium technology enough to charge them in my living room... Mark KE6BB (Hoping someone can convince me). From: Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net To: Mark Petiford rv6am...@yahoo.com Cc: Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 2:29 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells? Hi Mark, You caught me in the middle a battery research project (day job) and I found some dirt on Rayovac -literally-:ALK and NiMH both. Pretty severe manufacturing issues, though the details about the contamination weren't spelled out. No CPSC issues though, so they're still in business. It got so bad that Rayovac has to put a banner on all retail blister packs: Lasts As Long As Duracell or some such. Everyone seems pretty pleased with the Eneloops, so that's good. I used them on the KX3 for a while, then ran a few tests and ended up with Tenergy Premium. To each his own! 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 14:13:40 -0700 (PDT), you wrote: Correct, Matt. I am actually running Panasonic HHR210AAB cells right now, which appear to be Enelooops with a different jacket, based on my research. We used them in my work, but only recharged them a few times, so I was able to get them cheap, and they work well. I have a lot of experience with Eneloop 2000 maH cells at home...probably a more severe environment than my work! They seem to be very forgiving so long as you don't discharge them below 0.9 volts per cell. I think early this year, we were seeing a lot of out of the box infant mortality with the Rayovac rechargeable NiMH cells. Not sure if that is still a problem. Mark KE6BB From: Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net To: Mark Petiford rv6am...@yahoo.com Cc: Rose elecraftcov...@gmail.com; Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 12:51 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells? Just to be clear, there are Sanyo's Eneloops out there at retail, but also a line of Sanyo commercial cells generally sold only as OEM product. I had a 14.8V pack built from the latter: 39 WH - so good for several days of KX3 CW ops. 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 12:43:07 -0700, you wrote: The Sanyo's are also known as Eneloops. Be sure to get 2000mah or higher capacity cells. Mark KE6BB Sent from my iThingie. On Jun 27, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net wrote: Sanyo, Tenergy, Powerex, Imedion, Panasonic, etc. matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
Yes, it isn't very pleasant to think about that failure rate. I think Rayovac took their manufacturing to a Chinese ODM a few years ago. Having worked in the ODM space a few years, I can appreciate the trouble they would face with quality control. They'll probably take the ODM down with them though. Battery makers are large scale operations. I had a pack built with those Sanyo industrial NMH AAs (qty 11). At 39WH, it's quite a pack. I kept the AA form factor to minimize weight for backpacking. D cells weigh about 170g, but AAs are around 26g. 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 14:55:35 -0700 (PDT), you wrote: Matt, That would explain why, on the Yahoo Group, we were seeing complaints of a cell or two out of eight, failing right out of the box!!! I was amazed at that. FYI, All Electronics sells a Tenergy cell that is a D size cell with a capacity of 10,000 maH: http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/NMH-D/NIMH-RECHARGEABLE-D-CELL-10-000MAH/1.html I don't have one, but they do not appear to be AA cells in a D size sleeve...not with that capacity! They won't fit in a KX3, but I had thought I might build a tube of these as an external battery pack. Unfortunately, I don't think it would be much less expensive than a similar size pack of LiFePo cells. I wouldn't have to buy the balanced charger, but would have to make up a constant current charger myself...or else charge with a variable voltage power supply while manually adjusting the voltage to keep the current relatively constant. Makes the newer lithium technology look better and better. Now, if I could just get myself to trust Lithium technology enough to charge them in my living room... Mark KE6BB (Hoping someone can convince me). From: Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net To: Mark Petiford rv6am...@yahoo.com Cc: Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 2:29 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells? Hi Mark, You caught me in the middle a battery research project (day job) and I found some dirt on Rayovac -literally-:ALK and NiMH both. Pretty severe manufacturing issues, though the details about the contamination weren't spelled out. No CPSC issues though, so they're still in business. It got so bad that Rayovac has to put a banner on all retail blister packs: Lasts As Long As Duracell or some such. Everyone seems pretty pleased with the Eneloops, so that's good. I used them on the KX3 for a while, then ran a few tests and ended up with Tenergy Premium. To each his own! 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 14:13:40 -0700 (PDT), you wrote: Correct, Matt. I am actually running Panasonic HHR210AAB cells right now, which appear to be Enelooops with a different jacket, based on my research. We used them in my work, but only recharged them a few times, so I was able to get them cheap, and they work well. I have a lot of experience with Eneloop 2000 maH cells at home...probably a more severe environment than my work! They seem to be very forgiving so long as you don't discharge them below 0.9 volts per cell. I think early this year, we were seeing a lot of out of the box infant mortality with the Rayovac rechargeable NiMH cells. Not sure if that is still a problem. Mark KE6BB From: Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net To: Mark Petiford rv6am...@yahoo.com Cc: Rose elecraftcov...@gmail.com; Elecraft Reflector elecraft@mailman.qth.net Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 12:51 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells? Just to be clear, there are Sanyo's Eneloops out there at retail, but also a line of Sanyo commercial cells generally sold only as OEM product. I had a 14.8V pack built from the latter: 39 WH - so good for several days of KX3 CW ops. 73, matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 12:43:07 -0700, you wrote: The Sanyo's are also known as Eneloops. Be sure to get 2000mah or higher capacity cells. Mark KE6BB Sent from my iThingie. On Jun 27, 2013, at 11:56 AM, Matt Zilmer mzil...@verizon.net wrote: Sanyo, Tenergy, Powerex, Imedion, Panasonic, etc. matt W6NIA On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:51:22 +, you wrote: I'm guilty of not paying much attention to reflector chatter concerning batteries, as I didn't expect to need any. (:-) Now I have a new KX3 (S/N 4437) and find I need a set to keep the clock running when it's off 12V. Who's a good source? 73! Ken - K0PP kengk...@gmail.com __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Re: [Elecraft] Source of NiMH cells?
I think early this year, we were seeing a lot of out of the box infant mortality with the Rayovac rechargeable NiMH cells.? Not sure if that is still a problem. FTR, I bought two 4-packs of the Rayovac Platinum (2Ah, slow discharge, like Eneloop) in May and all eight were fine, with equal voltage after one charge. To the OP, if with source you meant the source and not the brand, try BatteriesAmerica.com or Battieries +, just to name two. __ Elecraft mailing list Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
