Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp - etc.

[Edward R Cole]

Thanks, Josh:

Exactly where I am.  Have no idea how many bucks spent to do eme.

BTW this is one activity where more RF output is useful; I run a 8877 
on 2m for 1400w, but only run the KXPA100 on HF-SSB.  If doing 
digital modes (on HF) the 10w from my Elecraft radios is 
sufficient.  I have four towers and a 16-foot dish (which maybe helps).


I am converting a Harris TV linear to 6m hoping to get 1kW, but this 
is for meteor scatter and eme.  80w from my KXPA-100 worked a 6m 
mobile in the Yukon Territory 700 miles away this weekend.  Of course 
the 30-foot long 6-element yagi helped (and I was using my KX3). Also 
worked into BC/WA/OR/UT/ID.  Figure it was Auroral-E prop as there 
was some audio distortion on signals.


If I wanted 1500w on HF I would buy the LDMOS kit from W6PQL.

BTW I built my 8877, and 300w 1296 amps and converting two 50w amps 
for 3400-MHz eme.  Instead of using CW as a qualifier for ham license 
maybe the ability to understand electronics and build your radio 
would be better.  Oh, sorry that would result in a 90% drop in 
licensees, wouldn't it?  If no-code had passed in 1959 when my Novice 
expired, I would have been a General class ham as I passed that 
written exam for my Technician license.  I finally passed 13wpm in 
1982 and now trying to get speed back in order to work some of the CW 
eme stations.


Most of you wanting Elecraft to build you an amp have never been in 
business.  Try launching a new ham product and you will gain new understanding.


You (Elecraft users) asked for a 2m amplifier for the KX3-2M and I 
provided one for twelve of you (with my thanks for buying it).  But 
no subsequent orders since then.  Elecraft is probably glad they 
didn't sink a few thousand $ into that.  I made enough to buy myself 
a KXPA-100 and a couple K3 Synth boards.  Fortunately, I don't have a 
factory full of workers to support.


Plenty of mfr's in both the QRO amp and VHF amp field for Elecraft to 
compete with, so they came out with the KX2 instead which is unique 
(smart business to my mind).  K3s is probably nice, too!


73, Ed - KL7UW

From: Josh Fiden <j...@voodoolab.com>
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp
Message-ID: <cbe8b13c-5c75-3f5b-6c74-14f64537b...@voodoolab.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed

If cost per QSO were a concern, no one would ever work EME. Just sayin'.

Back to waiting for this thread to die!

73,
Josh W6XU


73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
"Kits made by KL7UW"
Dubus Mag business:
dubus...@gmail.com

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp: THREAD CLOSED

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

Folks, The 1500W threads were closed many hours ago due to their high volume. 
Please take the discussion off list for now.

73,

Eric
Moderator
elecraft.com
_..._



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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[David Gilbert]

The gain/loss for antennas/feedline is immaterial ... it is there no 
matter whether you have an amp or not.  The difference between 500 watts 
and 1500 watts is 4.77 db, which is huge if you're trying to work weak 
DX.  Check out:


http://www.ab7e.com/weak_signal/mdd.html

Getting an additional 4.77 db out of different feedline is a ridiculous 
expectation unless you're currently using wet clothsline for feedline, 
and a used amp is almost always cheaper (and less obtrusive to the 
neighborhood assuming you don't overdrive it) than putting up a taller 
tower and bigger antennas.


None of this has anything to do with whether or not Elecraft should 
produce a 1500 watt amplifier, but the idea that big amps aren't cost 
effective is a particularly silly argument for them to not build one.


Dave   AB7E


On 8/1/2016 1:13 PM, Jerry More wrote:

We just differ in opinion and I’m happy for everyone to enjoy the hobby as they 
are able. The issues I see is where the Amateur code is broken. Just listen on 
DX pileups sometime and you’ll hear guys that really make us look bad as a 
community.

About the only time I can imagine someone needing power is perhaps a DX station 
but that’s IF they can actually hear.
Doing the math I am probably missing something because I don’t see much of a 
gain from 500w to 1.5kw into the same antenna system.
 From memory 500w to 1k is 3db and 1k to 1.5kw is 1.5 db, so 500w to 1.5kw is 
4.5db
6db is 1 S unit (from memory) so running a 1.5kw amp gives just less than 1 S 
unit.

Now start factoring up the DB gain/loss for antennas/feedline.

Which gives the best bang for the buck??

Maybe I’m just slow. Seems to me a nice, instant on 500w solid state with 
quality low loss feed line into a matched antenna should rock and roll.

This thread should probably die.

Enjoy the hobby as you wish. Just know any station who worked em with less 
power just owned you regardless of your budget 

  


Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Mike Markowski
Sent: Monday, August 1, 2016 2:03 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

Jer & Fred,

You're right from a certain point of view.  But also consider more
generally that it's about link budget; maximize gains, minimize losses.
How much of each a ham can do comes down to money & motivation within
lifestyle (& FCC!) constraints.

73,
Mike ab3ap

On 08/01/2016 01:47 PM, Fred Moore wrote:

I'm with you Jer..

I always wonder that some of you guys "cost/QSO" is..  it only a hobby,
[...]

Fred


On 8/1/16 9:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:

I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
[...]

Just my view.
Jer

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Phil Wheeler]

Re "And spare me the argument that QRM would 
increase (if everyone had amps) ...it wouldn't, 
because the water level would simply rise for 
everyone.": A Global Warming analogy, Dave? :-)


73, Phil W7OX

On 8/1/16 8:27 PM, David Gilbert wrote:


An amp helps tremendously on receive if the guy 
with the amp is on the other end of the QSO from 
you.  And if you can't hear him you aren't going 
to make the contact.


It has been said before many times, and I'm 
living proof of it ... an amplifier is the most 
cost effective way to improve the QSO rate for 
everyone that there is.  If everyone used 
amplifiers it would be the equivalent of 
dropping the background QRN level by ten or more 
db ... a huge amount.  And spare me the argument 
that QRM would increase (if everyone had amps) 
...it wouldn't, because the water level would 
simply rise for everyone.


Dave  AB7E






On 8/1/16 9:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
I don't see the point of having a large power 
amp. It doesn't help receive.

[...]

Just my view.
Jer


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[David Gilbert]

An amp helps tremendously on receive if the guy with the amp is on the 
other end of the QSO from you.  And if you can't hear him you aren't 
going to make the contact.


It has been said before many times, and I'm living proof of it ... an 
amplifier is the most cost effective way to improve the QSO rate for 
everyone that there is.  If everyone used amplifiers it would be the 
equivalent of dropping the background QRN level by ten or more db ... a 
huge amount.  And spare me the argument that QRM would increase (if 
everyone had amps) ...it wouldn't, because the water level would simply 
rise for everyone.


Dave  AB7E






On 8/1/16 9:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help 
receive.

[...]

Just my view.
Jer




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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Clay Autery]

What an excellent idea...  Wonder what that would cost me to get my
power provider to do?

I'd do pretty much anything to get new/larger feeder lines into my house...

__
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 8/1/2016 7:52 PM, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:
> I have 400 Amp service, mainly to force the local power company to use
> larger feeders to my distribution panel.

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Charlie T, K3ICH]

Every house I know of in the US has a split phase 120/240 line in, usually
at a minimum of 60 Amps and typically 200 Amps.

You are correct in that the 240 V only goes to specific items, such as the
water pump, stove, HW heater, clothes dryer etc.
One has to purposely wire the "radio-room" for 240V.

I have 400 Amp service, mainly to force the local power company to use
larger feeders to my distribution panel.

I am all electric (if you don't count the 5 chords of wood we cut and burn
each year) and even on an electric co-op out here in the "sticks", we're
paying under 14¢ per kW-hr.
It'll stay there if we can keep the coal industry afloat.

73, Charlie k3ICH



-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Graham
Kimbell
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2016 4:09 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

Watching this from afar, I notice the irony - US has 1500W limit but not
enough (120v) mains power to use it, whilst the UK has loads of mains power
(240v at 13A) but only a 400W limit.

Graham


> The KPA500 can be run from any decent 120VAC mains outlet as long as there
aren't too many other loads on it. But going above that power level forces
the Ham to have 240 VAC in the shack, something many of us do not normally
plan for. That can be a very expensive addition to the cost of the amp,
especially if the mains panel is not expandable as needed.
>
>


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Clay Autery]

Running 240 to the shack, while not a trivial task, is not "undoable". 
I am doing so right now...  I am putting in a sub-panel to deliver the
power from the service, and am running separate circuits for 8 x 20Amp
120 V receptacles, 2 x 15 Amp 240 V receptacles, and 2 x 20 Amp 240 V re
ceptacles.  All using twisted pair wirin g of at least 2 wire gauges
above code for power level and steel conduit for shielding from service
to sub, and sub to 6 gang metal back box...

Have a master electrician who will inspect and sign off on the work to
satisfy the insurance guys...

__
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 8/1/2016 3:08 PM, Graham Kimbell wrote:
> Watching this from afar, I notice the irony - US has 1500W limit but
> not enough (120v) mains power to use it, whilst the UK has loads of
> mains power (240v at 13A) but only a 400W limit.
>
> Graham
>
>
>> The KPA500 can be run from any decent 120VAC mains outlet as long as
>> there aren't too many other loads on it. But going above that power
>> level forces the Ham to have 240 VAC in the shack, something many of
>> us do not normally plan for. That can be a very expensive addition to
>> the cost of the amp, especially if the mains panel is not expandable
>> as needed.
>>
>>
>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

We are well past the single topic posting limit on this thread. 

Let's close the thread for now in the interest of relieving email overload for 
our other readers.

73,
Eric
Moderator (from wherever I may be..)
elecraft.com
_..._



> On Aug 1, 2016, at 1:08 PM, Ken Arck  wrote:
> 
> As those of us active in EME would say..
> 
> No s*** 
> 
> Ken
> 
> 
> At 04:04 PM 8/1/2016, Josh Fiden wrote:
>> If cost per QSO were a concern, no one would ever work EME. Just sayin'.
>> 
>> Back to waiting for this thread to die!
>> 
>> 73,
>> Josh W6XU
>> 
>>> On 8/1/2016 10:47 AM, Fred Moore wrote:
>>> I always wonder that some of you guys "cost/QSO" is..
>> 
>> __
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> 
> --
> President and CTO - Arcom Communications
> Makers of repeater controllers and accessories.
> http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/
> Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and
> we offer complete repeater packages!
> AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
> http://www.irlp.net
> "We don't just make 'em. We use 'em!"
> 
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> 

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Ken Arck]

As those of us active in EME would say..

No s*** 

Ken


At 04:04 PM 8/1/2016, Josh Fiden wrote:

If cost per QSO were a concern, no one would ever work EME. Just sayin'.

Back to waiting for this thread to die!

73,
Josh W6XU

On 8/1/2016 10:47 AM, Fred Moore wrote:

I always wonder that some of you guys "cost/QSO" is..


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--
President and CTO - Arcom Communications
Makers of repeater controllers and accessories.
http://www.arcomcontrollers.com/
Authorized Dealers for Kenwood and Telewave and
we offer complete repeater packages!
AH6LE/R - IRLP Node 3000
http://www.irlp.net
"We don't just make 'em. We use 'em!"

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Wayne Burdick]

On Aug 1, 2016, at 2:03 PM, "N2TK, Tony"  wrote:

> Wayne,
> It is nice you were able to write a couple poems based on your own
> experience with QRP :-)
> Do I detect another hobby or stress reliever?


You do. My alter ego is a wannabe author. Unfortunately time is a zero-sum game 
(think Jake and his Avatar). Cloning would be a better solution, but it's not 
in my budget.

Wayne

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Josh Fiden]

If cost per QSO were a concern, no one would ever work EME. Just sayin'.

Back to waiting for this thread to die!

73,
Josh W6XU

On 8/1/2016 10:47 AM, Fred Moore wrote:

I always wonder that some of you guys "cost/QSO" is..


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Fred Jensen]

Nice variation on "It was a dark and stormy night ..."  Bulwer-Lytton 
award candidate if I've ever seen one.  Snoopy would be proud. :-)


73,

Fred K6DGW
Sparks NV
Washoe County DM09dn

On 8/1/2016 2:03 PM, N2TK, Tony wrote:

Wayne,
It is nice you were able to write a couple poems based on your own
experience with QRP :-)
Do I detect another hobby or stress reliever?

73,
N2TK, Tony

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wayne
Burdick
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2016 12:55 PM
To: EricJ <eric_c...@hotmail.com>
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

I wrote an epic poem on this subject :)  See:

http://www.qsotoday.com/n6kr-poetry.html

Wayne
N6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Wes Stewart]

It sure does at the other end :-)

On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:

I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[W1GO (Joe)]

Thread hasn't closed because it's free market research from a very targeted 
audience.  Companies pay big bucks in order to hear "the voice of the customer."

> On Aug 1, 2016, at 16:12, F5vjc  wrote:
> 
> Why hasn't this thread been terminated?  It's getting boring now. Much more
> interesting threads are quickly closed.
> 
> There is no 1500W Amp guys.
> 
> 73 F5VJC
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[Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jon Moody]

Wayne,

Just to be clear my previous e-mail was referring to your poem writing
ability.

-- 
73
Jon
KG6VDW
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[N2TK, Tony]

Wayne,
It is nice you were able to write a couple poems based on your own
experience with QRP :-)
Do I detect another hobby or stress reliever?

73,
N2TK, Tony

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Wayne
Burdick
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2016 12:55 PM
To: EricJ <eric_c...@hotmail.com>
Cc: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

I wrote an epic poem on this subject :)  See:

http://www.qsotoday.com/n6kr-poetry.html

Wayne
N6KR


On Aug 1, 2016, at 9:04 AM, EricJ <eric_c...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> The point is dominance. If you are the strongest signal, the DX hears you
better. If you are the strongest, you hear the DX better because everyone
else stands by until you make the contact and go away. I lived among the
legendary California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. Letting them in and
letting them chat about their vacation at that location with the DX because
they could was the only way you could work the DX eventually yourself. Same
as in life.
> 
> Eric KE6US
> 
> 
> On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
>> I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help
receive.
>> My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, 
>> better feedlines, and a better receiver.
>> If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band 
>> conditions permit.
>> Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past 
>> 500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
>> If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then 
>> maybe you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit
better.
>> Just my view.
>> I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later 
>> came to resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup.
>> I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get 
>> another amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have 
>> so much opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes 
>> sense to run power at this time.
>> 
>> Just my view.
>> Jer
>> 
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Gary]

Don't forget us in VK. We also have a 400w limit. Not that many comply:-)
Gary 

-Original Message-
From: "Jerry More" <je...@carolinaheli.com>
Sent: ‎2/‎08/‎2016 6:21 AM
To: "Graham Kimbell" <g3...@g3tct.co.uk>; "elecraft@mailman.qth.net" 
<elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

Do you dare imply that UK ops may have more skill ?? LOL

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Graham Kimbell
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jerry More]

Do you dare imply that UK ops may have more skill ?? LOL

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Graham Kimbell
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jerry More]

We just differ in opinion and I’m happy for everyone to enjoy the hobby as they 
are able. The issues I see is where the Amateur code is broken. Just listen on 
DX pileups sometime and you’ll hear guys that really make us look bad as a 
community. 

About the only time I can imagine someone needing power is perhaps a DX station 
but that’s IF they can actually hear. 
Doing the math I am probably missing something because I don’t see much of a 
gain from 500w to 1.5kw into the same antenna system.
From memory 500w to 1k is 3db and 1k to 1.5kw is 1.5 db, so 500w to 1.5kw is 
4.5db
6db is 1 S unit (from memory) so running a 1.5kw amp gives just less than 1 S 
unit. 

Now start factoring up the DB gain/loss for antennas/feedline.

Which gives the best bang for the buck?? 

Maybe I’m just slow. Seems to me a nice, instant on 500w solid state with 
quality low loss feed line into a matched antenna should rock and roll. 

This thread should probably die. 

Enjoy the hobby as you wish. Just know any station who worked em with less 
power just owned you regardless of your budget 

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Mike Markowski
Sent: Monday, August 1, 2016 2:03 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

Jer & Fred,

You're right from a certain point of view.  But also consider more 
generally that it's about link budget; maximize gains, minimize losses. 
How much of each a ham can do comes down to money & motivation within 
lifestyle (& FCC!) constraints.

73,
Mike ab3ap

On 08/01/2016 01:47 PM, Fred Moore wrote:
> I'm with you Jer..
>
> I always wonder that some of you guys "cost/QSO" is..  it only a hobby,
> [...]
>
> Fred
>
>
> On 8/1/16 9:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
>> I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
>> [...]
>>
>> Just my view.
>> Jer
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[F5vjc]

Why hasn't this thread been terminated?  It's getting boring now. Much more
interesting threads are quickly closed.

There is no 1500W Amp guys.

73 F5VJC

On 1 August 2016 at 21:56, EricJ  wrote:

> Ha ha. Yeah. Like I said, same as in life.
>
> Eric KE6US
>
>
>
> On 8/1/2016 9:54 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>
>> I wrote an epic poem on this subject :)  See:
>>
>>  http://www.qsotoday.com/n6kr-poetry.html
>>
>> Wayne
>> N6KR
>>
>>
>> On Aug 1, 2016, at 9:04 AM, EricJ  wrote:
>>
>> The point is dominance. If you are the strongest signal, the DX hears you
>>> better. If you are the strongest, you hear the DX better because everyone
>>> else stands by until you make the contact and go away. I lived among the
>>> legendary California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. Letting them in and
>>> letting them chat about their vacation at that location with the DX because
>>> they could was the only way you could work the DX eventually yourself. Same
>>> as in life.
>>>
>>> Eric KE6US
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
>>>
 I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help
 receive.
 My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
 feedlines, and a better receiver.
 If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
 conditions permit.
 Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
 500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
 If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then
 maybe
 you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better.
 Just my view.
 I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later
 came to
 resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup.
 I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get
 another
 amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
 opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to
 run
 power at this time.

 Just my view.
 Jer

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>>
>>
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Graham Kimbell]

Watching this from afar, I notice the irony - US has 1500W limit but not 
enough (120v) mains power to use it, whilst the UK has loads of mains 
power (240v at 13A) but only a 400W limit.


Graham



The KPA500 can be run from any decent 120VAC mains outlet as long as there 
aren't too many other loads on it. But going above that power level forces the 
Ham to have 240 VAC in the shack, something many of us do not normally plan 
for. That can be a very expensive addition to the cost of the amp, especially 
if the mains panel is not expandable as needed.

   



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[Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jon Moody]

Wow Wayne... who knew you had so much in you.  The world is a better place
with you in it.  You should run for President.  No, nice people don't
deserve that much punishment.
-- 
73
Jon
KG6VDW
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[EricJ]

Ha ha. Yeah. Like I said, same as in life.

Eric KE6US


On 8/1/2016 9:54 AM, Wayne Burdick wrote:

I wrote an epic poem on this subject :)  See:

 http://www.qsotoday.com/n6kr-poetry.html

Wayne
N6KR


On Aug 1, 2016, at 9:04 AM, EricJ  wrote:


The point is dominance. If you are the strongest signal, the DX hears you 
better. If you are the strongest, you hear the DX better because everyone else 
stands by until you make the contact and go away. I lived among the legendary 
California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. Letting them in and letting them chat 
about their vacation at that location with the DX because they could was the 
only way you could work the DX eventually yourself. Same as in life.

Eric KE6US


On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:

I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
feedlines, and a better receiver.
If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
conditions permit.
Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then maybe
you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better.
Just my view.
I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later came to
resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup.
I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get another
amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to run
power at this time.

Just my view.
Jer

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Mike Markowski]

Jer & Fred,

You're right from a certain point of view.  But also consider more 
generally that it's about link budget; maximize gains, minimize losses. 
How much of each a ham can do comes down to money & motivation within 
lifestyle (& FCC!) constraints.


73,
Mike ab3ap

On 08/01/2016 01:47 PM, Fred Moore wrote:

I'm with you Jer..

I always wonder that some of you guys "cost/QSO" is..  it only a hobby,
[...]

Fred


On 8/1/16 9:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:

I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
[...]

Just my view.
Jer

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Fred Moore]

I'm with you Jer..

I always wonder that some of you guys "cost/QSO" is..  it only a hobby,
not a masculinity contest..  Many times I see a 10K station and ask how
often they operate.. many times the answer is I turn on at least once
per month to make sure it work..

Fred


On 8/1/16 9:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
> I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
> My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
> feedlines, and a better receiver.
> If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
> conditions permit. 
> Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
> 500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160? 
> If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then maybe
> you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better. 
> Just my view. 
> I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later came to
> resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup. 
> I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get another
> amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
> opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to run
> power at this time.
>
> Just my view. 
> Jer
>
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-- 
Fred Moore
email: f...@fmeco.com
   f...@safes.com
phone:  321-217-8699

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jerry Moore]

+1
Too many alligators imho.
On the weak path contacts. Sure, how often does that happen? 

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Phil
Wheeler
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2016 1:20 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

Hmm .. another solution would be to reduce max power to 500 W and enforce it
;-)

Phil W7OX

On 8/1/16 9:04 AM, EricJ wrote:
> The point is dominance. If you are the strongest signal, the DX hears 
> you better. If you are the strongest, you hear the DX better because 
> everyone else stands by until you make the contact and go away. I 
> lived among the legendary California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. 
> Letting them in and letting them chat about their vacation at that 
> location with the DX because they could was the only way you could 
> work the DX eventually yourself. Same as in life.
>
> Eric KE6US
>
>
> On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
>> I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help 
>> receive.
>> My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, 
>> better feedlines, and a better receiver.
>> If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band 
>> conditions permit.
>> Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past 
>> 500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
>> If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then 
>> maybe you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit 
>> better.
>> Just my view.
>> I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later 
>> came to resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup.
>> I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get 
>> another amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have 
>> so much opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes 
>> sense to run power at this time.
>>
>> Just my view.
>> Jer

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Phil Wheeler]

Hmm .. another solution would be to reduce max 
power to 500 W and enforce it ;-)


Phil W7OX

On 8/1/16 9:04 AM, EricJ wrote:
The point is dominance. If you are the strongest 
signal, the DX hears you better. If you are the 
strongest, you hear the DX better because 
everyone else stands by until you make the 
contact and go away. I lived among the legendary 
California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. Letting 
them in and letting them chat about their 
vacation at that location with the DX because 
they could was the only way you could work the 
DX eventually yourself. Same as in life.


Eric KE6US


On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
I don't see the point of having a large power 
amp. It doesn't help receive.
My whole Ham life I've been told to put the 
money into antennas, better

feedlines, and a better receiver.
If you are a skilled operator then you'll make 
the contact if band

conditions permit.
Doing the math I really don't see why anyone 
"needs" an amp past

500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
If a QRP /Low power station can make the 
contact but you can't then maybe
you need to ask for help getting your station 
optimized a bit better.

Just my view.
I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made 
the contact. I later came to
resent Ops I heard running power just to get 
over the pileup.
I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a 
minute. If I were to get another
amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, 
however, I have so much
opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it 
doesn't makes sense to run

power at this time.

Just my view.
Jer


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT]

I've been in way too many situations where my customers said "you need 
to offer this."


I spent time and money making "this" available, and turned to the 
customers and said "here it is, it costs this much."


Silence.

Just sayin'

-- Lynn

P.S. I'm happy at 12 watts.

On 8/1/2016 5:30 AM, Guy Olinger K2AV wrote:

There WAS just as much very positive
chatter from the peanut gallery way back after that first prototype
surfaced at Dayton. Even with all that encouragement the answer still
turned out no.



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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[James Cassidy]

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jim Brown]

On Mon,8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:

If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then maybe
you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better.


I don't buy this logic. I've optimized my station and have an antenna 
farm most hams would die for. I've got 320 countries confirmed with 
unlimited power, running 1.5kW to work the ones over difficult paths. 
Since I'm not competitive in DX contests from W6, I often work them QRP. 
I have about 160 countries confirmed running 5W.


Others have said it quite well -- the primary reason for running high 
power is receive noise at the station you're trying to work. If the 
other guy's noise is S9, you're unlikely to work him QRP, no matter how 
much you have optimized your station. Likewise, if your antenna is a low 
dipole or a wire strung into a tree, you're starting with at least one 
hand tied behind you. No use tying the second hand with low power.


73, Jim K9YC

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Bill Brooks]

Very nice, Wayne.

On Monday, August 1, 2016, Wayne Burdick  wrote:

> I wrote an epic poem on this subject :)  See:
>
> http://www.qsotoday.com/n6kr-poetry.html
>
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
> On Aug 1, 2016, at 9:04 AM, EricJ >
> wrote:
>
> > The point is dominance. If you are the strongest signal, the DX hears
> you better. If you are the strongest, you hear the DX better because
> everyone else stands by until you make the contact and go away. I lived
> among the legendary California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. Letting them in
> and letting them chat about their vacation at that location with the DX
> because they could was the only way you could work the DX eventually
> yourself. Same as in life.
> >
> > Eric KE6US
> >
> >
> > On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
> >> I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help
> receive.
> >> My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
> >> feedlines, and a better receiver.
> >> If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
> >> conditions permit.
> >> Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
> >> 500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
> >> If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then
> maybe
> >> you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better.
> >> Just my view.
> >> I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later
> came to
> >> resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup.
> >> I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get
> another
> >> amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
> >> opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to
> run
> >> power at this time.
> >>
> >> Just my view.
> >> Jer
> >>
> >> __
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> >>
> >>
> >
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-- 
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432-244-8863
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Wayne Burdick]

I wrote an epic poem on this subject :)  See:

http://www.qsotoday.com/n6kr-poetry.html

Wayne
N6KR


On Aug 1, 2016, at 9:04 AM, EricJ  wrote:

> The point is dominance. If you are the strongest signal, the DX hears you 
> better. If you are the strongest, you hear the DX better because everyone 
> else stands by until you make the contact and go away. I lived among the 
> legendary California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. Letting them in and letting 
> them chat about their vacation at that location with the DX because they 
> could was the only way you could work the DX eventually yourself. Same as in 
> life.
> 
> Eric KE6US
> 
> 
> On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:
>> I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
>> My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
>> feedlines, and a better receiver.
>> If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
>> conditions permit.
>> Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
>> 500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
>> If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then maybe
>> you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better.
>> Just my view.
>> I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later came to
>> resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup.
>> I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get another
>> amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
>> opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to run
>> power at this time.
>> 
>> Just my view.
>> Jer
>> 
>> __
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>> Message delivered to eric_c...@hotmail.com
>> 
>> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[EricJ]

The point is dominance. If you are the strongest signal, the DX hears 
you better. If you are the strongest, you hear the DX better because 
everyone else stands by until you make the contact and go away. I lived 
among the legendary California Kilowatts when I was a DXer. Letting them 
in and letting them chat about their vacation at that location with the 
DX because they could was the only way you could work the DX eventually 
yourself. Same as in life.


Eric KE6US


On 8/1/2016 6:50 AM, Jerry Moore wrote:

I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
feedlines, and a better receiver.
If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
conditions permit.
Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160?
If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then maybe
you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better.
Just my view.
I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later came to
resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup.
I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get another
amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to run
power at this time.

Just my view.
Jer

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[N2TK, Tony]

I remember seeing the KPA1500 at Dayton heating up the building. I reached
for my credit card but was told not taking orders. Bummer.

Today I have a KPA500 and an Acom-2000A (very early one) sitting on a shelf
7' off the floor in the basement. Literally right below my feet here in the
office/shack. Keeps the heat and noise downstairs. Both track the K3. So
when I key the amp it is on freq and ready. I have two switches between the
pair of K3's - one to select which K3 and one to select which amp.
Most of the time both amps are off. I find 100 W is usually enough. But in a
decent pileup I will turn on the KPA500. For DXpeditions like VK0 and FT4,
especially on the low bands, I can get in and out more quickly with the
Acom. For contesting the Acom stays on the entire weekend.

This setup also gives me backup in case one of the amps fail. Also give me
more watts on 6M.

Someone mentioned about you got to hear them to work them. And I agree money
should be first spent on receiving - equipment, antennas, coax, receive
antennas, etc. But once you have optimized as much as you can because of
land, money and other restrictions, an amp is a nice way of helping you in a
pileup to work a station you can hear. And especially on the low bands going
from 500 to 1500 W may make the difference from working and not working a
station.
I still remember the one morning I heard Zone 19 on Topband for my first and
only time at my sunrise. Unfortunately I did not have the KPA500 then. Only
had the Acom. But the Acom was off. While I waited for the Acom to heat up I
tried calling the UA0 with 100W. He knew I was calling him but he could not
pull out my full call. By the time the Acom cycled ON, the UA0 was down in
the noise. Bummer.  

73,
N2TK, Tony

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jerry
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2016 7:36 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

I'm with Greg. Though I am only a casual DX chaser and even more casual
contester I found the KPA500 just wasn't enough to suit me, but I knew that
going in. I only ordered the 500 as a temporary measure to hold me until my
2K-FA came in. I certainly would have gone with a 1500w Elecraft product, if
it existed.
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Nr4c]

Buy some of the "2D " blocks from Elecraft and have Front Panel Express   to 
make the panels for you from your design. 

Sent from my iPhone
...nr4c. bill


> On Aug 1, 2016, at 9:56 AM, Dr. William J. Schmidt, II  
> wrote:
> 
> The question of Elecraft building1500 watt amps has been settled, but there 
> are those of us that can build pretty much whatever we want... and that 
> includes me.  I currently have a twin BLF188XR amp nearing completion on my 
> lab bench, and my issue has always been making it look like the existing 
> equipment... whatever that is.  I would be very happy with Elecraft offering 
> "project boxes" like they did with past lines, or connecting with the sub 
> that does their sheet metal do get some boxes that go with the K3.  That way 
> those advanced amps could become reality and Elecraft really has no skin in 
> the game.
> 
> 
> Dr. William J. Schmidt - K9HZ J68HZ 8P6HK ZF2HZ PJ4/K9HZ VP5/K9HZ PJ2/K9HZ 
> 
> Owner - Operator
> Big Signal Ranch – K9ZC
> Staunton, Illinois
> 
> Owner – Operator
> Villa Grand Piton – J68HZ
> Soufriere, St. Lucia W.I.
> Rent it: www.VillaGrandPiton.com
> 
> email:  b...@wjschmidt.com
> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Charlie T, K3ICH]

We should probably carry that logic over to many facets of life:

No automobile needs to go over 45 MPH or need more than 25 HP.
AC and iced drinks should be outlawed.
Also, the sugar content needs to be about 1/10th of what it is currently in
ALL foods.
Houses should be limited to 1000 Sq. Ft.
87 Octane gasoline is plenty.
Jack Daniels should be limited to 70 proof.
One six-pack of Bud per month.

Oh wait, strike those last two.

I wasn't thinking.


73, Charlie k3ICH







-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jerry
Moore
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2016 9:51 AM
To: 'Guy Olinger K2AV' <k2av@gmail.com>; 'Elecraft Reflector'
<elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
feedlines, and a better receiver.
If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
conditions permit. 
Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160? 
If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then maybe
you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better. 
Just my view. 
I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later came to
resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup. 
I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get another
amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to run
power at this time.

Just my view. 
Jer

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Dr. William J. Schmidt, II]

The question of Elecraft building1500 watt amps has been settled, but there are 
those of us that can build pretty much whatever we want... and that includes 
me.  I currently have a twin BLF188XR amp nearing completion on my lab bench, 
and my issue has always been making it look like the existing equipment... 
whatever that is.  I would be very happy with Elecraft offering "project boxes" 
like they did with past lines, or connecting with the sub that does their sheet 
metal do get some boxes that go with the K3.  That way those advanced amps 
could become reality and Elecraft really has no skin in the game.


Dr. William J. Schmidt - K9HZ J68HZ 8P6HK ZF2HZ PJ4/K9HZ VP5/K9HZ PJ2/K9HZ 

Owner - Operator
Big Signal Ranch – K9ZC
Staunton, Illinois

Owner – Operator
Villa Grand Piton – J68HZ
Soufriere, St. Lucia W.I.
Rent it: www.VillaGrandPiton.com

email:  b...@wjschmidt.com


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jerry Moore]

I don't see the point of having a large power amp. It doesn't help receive.
My whole Ham life I've been told to put the money into antennas, better
feedlines, and a better receiver.
If you are a skilled operator then you'll make the contact if band
conditions permit. 
Doing the math I really don't see why anyone "needs" an amp past
500-600watts. Maybe on 60/160? 
If a QRP /Low power station can make the contact but you can't then maybe
you need to ask for help getting your station optimized a bit better. 
Just my view. 
I used to run an SB220 and loved it when I made the contact. I later came to
resent Ops I heard running power just to get over the pileup. 
I sold the Amp and don't regret it for a minute. If I were to get another
amp the math shows 500w to be the sweet spot, however, I have so much
opportunity to improve feedlines and antenna it doesn't makes sense to run
power at this time.

Just my view. 
Jer

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Ignacy]

Perhaps with slight modifications KPA500 can become KPA1000 or even KPA1300
at a lower weight. Replace MRF151 with the Microsemi device and replace a
toroidal PS with a switching power supply. Perhaps adjust firmware so that
the amp works near saturation on CW for increased efficiency and perhaps the
same heat dissipation as KPA500. 

Current standard bearer for amps is SPE 1.3k. 20lb , antenna tuner, 4
antenna switch plus automatic 110/220V switching. At a campsite with AC
available, this is an extension for KX3 that suddenly makes KX3 competitive
even with moderate antennas. From 5 lb to 25 lb and 100 times stronger. 

1.3 k is not perfect. It is loud, may have some hash (2k-fa does), its CAT
is limited, and relays click.  

Ignacy, NO9E



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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Guy Olinger K2AV]

One of the things going here is that people would have sprung for an
*ELECRAFT* KPA1500 with the same reliability, compactness etc. That is to
say they would have sprung for a KPA1500 made to the Wayne/Eric Elecraft
standards, reliability and price points we have all come to love.

The man keeps saying he isn't gonna.

How many hundred times the guy gonna have to post the same answer before
the huddled masses notice he said no. There WAS just as much very positive
chatter from the peanut gallery way back after that first prototype
surfaced at Dayton. Even with all that encouragement the answer still
turned out no.

Wayne grew Elecraft right through the Great Recession. Gotta think he can
call these product to market or not things on the button. If he says no
there's reasons why no.

If he finally says yes it will still be for his reasons and up to his
standards.

73, Guy K2AV

On Monday, August 1, 2016, Jerry  wrote:

> I'm with Greg. Though I am only a casual DX chaser and even more casual
> contester I found the KPA500 just wasn't enough to suit me, but I knew that
> going in. I only ordered the 500 as a temporary measure to hold me until my
> 2K-FA came in. I certainly would have gone with a 1500w Elecraft product,
> if it existed.
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> Message delivered to k2av@gmail.com 
>


-- 
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Jerry]

I'm with Greg. Though I am only a casual DX chaser and even more casual 
contester I found the KPA500 just wasn't enough to suit me, but I knew that 
going in. I only ordered the 500 as a temporary measure to hold me until my 
2K-FA came in. I certainly would have gone with a 1500w Elecraft product, if it 
existed.
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Josh Fiden]

I wouldn't make any assumption about what Elecraft customers will do!

I understand people deciding to upgrade their K3 to the K3S. What has 
completely mystified me is how many people upgrade the synthesizer(s) 
and THEN dump the rig to replace it with a nearly identical radio! I'm 
sure my view is biased since when faced with the same choice, it seemed 
only logical to upgrade my existing radios which work great and are 
configured how I like them.


I guess this horse is dead, no?! hi

73,
Josh W6XU

On 7/31/2016 5:06 PM, Kevin wrote:


You assume because they have spent that kind of money on a radio they 
will turn right around and spend that on an amp. I'm saying they 
won't, not even an Elecraft amp.


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Phil Wheeler]

Re "Lyle did design the KSDP2 independently, and 
then when he presented it to Elecraft, it became a 
product - *and* Lyle was subsequently hired by 
Elecraft as their DSP designer.": An impressive 
job interview, that :-)


And the KDSP2 remains a favorite of mine; I 
replaced the KAF2 with it as soon as it was 
available,it really makes a difference in my K2! 
Given the design constraints of adding it to the 
K2 after the design was more-or-less complete, 
it's menu system is not the most user friendly. 
But using the K2 with KDSP2 alongside my K3, KX3 
and KX2 the K2 still holds its own.


73, Phil W7OX

On 7/31/16 5:29 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

Wes,

You will have to find an example beyond the 
KDSP2 to support that assertion.
Yes, Lyle did design the KSDP2 independently, 
and then when he presented it to Elecraft, it 
became a product - *and* Lyle was subsequently 
hired by Elecraft as their DSP designer.


All other products were designed by engineers 
working either full time or part time for 
Elecraft.  The fact that they are not all 
working at a desk in Watsonville is not 
important.  The Elecraft staff is distributed 
throughout the country, and I represent the 
Elecraft legacy line for repairs, and I am 
located in Wake Forest, NC.  Email and other 
forms of communication keep us working together 
- for me the only handicap is the time 
difference, Watsonville does not "wake up" until 
11AM my time.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 7/31/2016 2:37 PM, Wes Stewart wrote:
Apparently you don't know Elecraft's 
engineering process.  Many "Elecraft" products 
were "designed by someone else", starting with 
the DSP in the K2.  Here's what Wayne had to 
say about that:


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Don Wilhelm]

Wes,

You will have to find an example beyond the KDSP2 to support that assertion.
Yes, Lyle did design the KSDP2 independently, and then when he presented 
it to Elecraft, it became a product - *and* Lyle was subsequently hired 
by Elecraft as their DSP designer.


All other products were designed by engineers working either full time 
or part time for Elecraft.  The fact that they are not all working at a 
desk in Watsonville is not important.  The Elecraft staff is distributed 
throughout the country, and I represent the Elecraft legacy line for 
repairs, and I am located in Wake Forest, NC.  Email and other forms of 
communication keep us working together - for me the only handicap is the 
time difference, Watsonville does not "wake up" until 11AM my time.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 7/31/2016 2:37 PM, Wes Stewart wrote:
Apparently you don't know Elecraft's engineering process.  Many 
"Elecraft" products were "designed by someone else", starting with the 
DSP in the K2.  Here's what Wayne had to say about that:


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Kevin]

On 7/31/2016 3:20 PM, Greg wrote:

"I own a KPA500 and it is very nice; the integration with the K3 makes 
it a pleasure to use...but I want the capability to run full legal 
limit. I own several full legal limit amps but would gladly get rid of 
one or more for an Elecraft amp. At my age and being retired, I care 
more about value,engineering design, and service than I do about price. 
There are lots of people who spend $6 - $14K on a radio...why not an 
amplifier?"


You assume because they have spent that kind of money on a radio they 
will turn right around and spend that on an amp. I'm saying they won't, 
not even an Elecraft amp.


"The majority of serious contesters and DX'ers own a K3."

No argument there, The exception I know of is K3LR who runs Icom 7851's

And a majority of those multi-multi and dedicated DX chasing stations 
are running tube amps of one flavor or another, most likely an AL-1500 
on each band. They aren't looking for fancy shmancy doodads. They want 
simple brute force power. There is a reason why more Ameritron amps are 
sold than Alpha's and it's not price. It's simplicity. The RF section of 
an Alpha amp is pretty much bomb proof as is the AL1500. It's all the 
microprocessor controlled "stuff" that breaks. If an Ameritron breaks 
during the contest there's a better than even chance of fixing it before 
the contest is over. Not so with an Alpha.


"Contesters especially would appreciate convenience with the instant 
band switching with no need to touch drive controls or worry about 
antenna selection."


Nope, SO2R's and multi-multi class stations are running dedicated amps 
per band or radio with integrated automatic antenna switching running 
off band data from the radio. The only time the Op raises a finger is to 
hit another function key in N1MM+. If you're running stations in a 
contest you won't touch the amp no need to. If your chasing P5 on twenty 
meters you won't move far enough in the pile to have to re tune the amp.


"I'll offer my opinion that a lot of people who already own a 1500 watt 
amplifier would go ahead and purchase an Elecraft amplifier for all the 
reasons mentioned".


For those folks it's obviously a pissing contest...boys and their toys. 
To make it profitable for Elecraft they'd probably have to sell as many 
1500W amps as Ameritron does. A tall order at twice the price. Then 
there's SPE who make a legal limit SSPA right now that does almost 
everything the KPA500 does with a K3. It'll even do kinda sorta SO2R in 
one box. It's $8K+ and I wouldn't contest with one. The "I can't fix it" 
rule kicks in.


The tube is still king of the brute force crowd.
--

R. Kevin Stover
AC0H
ARRL
FISTS #11993
SKCC #215
NAQCC #3441


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

['DGB']

ditto ditto ! ;-)

73 de NS9I


On 7/31/2016 4:36 PM, Art Peters wrote:

I would say, here is to itchy conditions ….

73,

Art Peters, K0ACP
k0...@k0acp.com




On Jul 31, 2016, at 4:39 PM, Wayne Burdick  wrote:

The K2 DSP is the only such case, and as noted, Lyle has been with us 
exclusively ever since. All other Elecraft products were designed by our 
full-time or part-time engineering staff.

We would not source someone else's QRO amp design. We would reserve the fun for 
ourselves :)

Those exploratory models from 2006 were designed by our senior RF engineer in his 
"spare time." If he gets the itch again someday, we'll let you know.

73,
Wayne
N6KR

-
http://www.elecraft.com 


On Jul 31, 2016, at 11:37 AM, Wes Stewart > wrote:

Apparently you don't know Elecraft's engineering process.  Many "Elecraft" products were 
"designed by someone else", starting with the DSP in the K2.  Here's what Wayne had to 
say about that:

"A major milestone in our history was the KDSP2 option for the K2. Lyle Johnson, 
KK7P, became known to us *after* he had mostly completed this highly versatile DSP unit. 
He reverse-engineered the auxBus protocol and made the KDSP2 behave as if it were a KAF2, 
which plugged into the same spot. He showed it to us, and we immediately adopted both the 
product and Lyle himself."

Lyle now works for Elecraft from the comfort of his home here in Tucson..(What I call, 
"distributed engineering.")

Many other "Elecraft" designs were done similarly, by someone else, PAs 
included.

BTW QRO is about being heard.  I'm often amused by the digital mode crowd, who profess that one 
doesn't need "power" to get through, i.e., "I work the world with 5 W on ESP (your 
favorite mode here)."  Some of them even make imaginary QSOs on EME. 
http://www.sm2cew.com/jt65.html

Wes N7WS
www.qrz.com/db/n7ws



On 7/30/2016 5:40 PM, Rick Braun wrote:
I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems inceivable 
that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed by someone 
else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When receivers were 
less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters, digital noise 
reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of DX receivers.  We 
don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e. blow out the ops with 
less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft ethic.  They aren’t QRP 
snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence, and cunning, rather than 
brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as odd.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Josh Fiden]

Before I switched to the K3, I ran Icom gear with their PW-1 amp. While 
the PW-1 had a few shortcomings, having a 160-6 KW amp with built-in 
tuner, 4 antenna outs which auto-select per band, and integration with 
the transceiver was pretty great. It had an internal switching power 
supply which would run from either 120 or 240v. At 120v max output power 
was reduced.


These days my operating is primarily HF contesting and 6m EME, so a 500W 
amp is not interesting. Something like the PW-1, done right with 
Elecraft's attention to detail, absolutely would be interesting.


73,
Josh W6XU
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Art Peters]

I would say, here is to itchy conditions ….

73,

Art Peters, K0ACP
k0...@k0acp.com



> On Jul 31, 2016, at 4:39 PM, Wayne Burdick  wrote:
> 
> The K2 DSP is the only such case, and as noted, Lyle has been with us 
> exclusively ever since. All other Elecraft products were designed by our 
> full-time or part-time engineering staff. 
> 
> We would not source someone else's QRO amp design. We would reserve the fun 
> for ourselves :) 
> 
> Those exploratory models from 2006 were designed by our senior RF engineer in 
> his "spare time." If he gets the itch again someday, we'll let you know. 
> 
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
> 
> -
> http://www.elecraft.com 
> 
>> On Jul 31, 2016, at 11:37 AM, Wes Stewart > > wrote:
>> 
>> Apparently you don't know Elecraft's engineering process.  Many "Elecraft" 
>> products were "designed by someone else", starting with the DSP in the K2.  
>> Here's what Wayne had to say about that:
>> 
>> "A major milestone in our history was the KDSP2 option for the K2. Lyle 
>> Johnson, KK7P, became known to us *after* he had mostly completed this 
>> highly versatile DSP unit. He reverse-engineered the auxBus protocol and 
>> made the KDSP2 behave as if it were a KAF2, which plugged into the same 
>> spot. He showed it to us, and we immediately adopted both the product and 
>> Lyle himself."
>> 
>> Lyle now works for Elecraft from the comfort of his home here in 
>> Tucson..(What I call, "distributed engineering.")
>> 
>> Many other "Elecraft" designs were done similarly, by someone else, PAs 
>> included.
>> 
>> BTW QRO is about being heard.  I'm often amused by the digital mode crowd, 
>> who profess that one doesn't need "power" to get through, i.e., "I work the 
>> world with 5 W on ESP (your favorite mode here)."  Some of them even make 
>> imaginary QSOs on EME. http://www.sm2cew.com/jt65.html
>> 
>> Wes N7WS
>> www.qrz.com/db/n7ws
>> 
>> 
>>> On 7/30/2016 5:40 PM, Rick Braun wrote:
>>> I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems inceivable 
>>> that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed by someone 
>>> else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When receivers 
>>> were less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters, digital noise 
>>> reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of DX receivers. 
>>>  We don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e. blow out the ops 
>>> with less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft ethic.  They 
>>> aren’t QRP snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence, and cunning, 
>>> rather than brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as odd.
>>> 
>>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>>> 
>>> __
>>> Elecraft mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
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>>> Message delivered to wes_n...@triconet.org
>> 
>> 
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Gary]

The kpa500 runs happily on generator power.
For those of us who wander around as well as expeditions etc, the kpa500 works 
great.
Many of us are possibly in the silent majority NOT into buying a 1500w 
amplifier.
Having said that, I am aware of big amps working into dipoles here in VK, loud, 
and mostly deaf...:-)
I have been beating on my field test kpa500 unit from day one, not a single 
heart stopping event has occurred to date.
Not all amp are created equal
Gary 

-Original Message-
From: "Ron D'Eau Claire" <r...@cobi.biz>
Sent: ‎1/‎08/‎2016 6:57 AM
To: "elecraft@mailman.qth.net" <elecraft@mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

It's an economic decision for the Ham too. 

The KPA500 can be run from any decent 120VAC mains outlet as long as there 
aren't too many other loads on it. But going above that power level forces the 
Ham to have 240 VAC in the shack, something many of us do not normally plan 
for. That can be a very expensive addition to the cost of the amp, especially 
if the mains panel is not expandable as needed.

Of course, it's a "no brainer" for those looking to run the legal limit, but 
for the average Ham it can be a real consideration. 

73, Ron AC7AC 

-Original Message-

Agreed, and I'd guess it was purely an economic decision.
Bob AA6VB


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Ron D'Eau Claire]

It's an economic decision for the Ham too. 

The KPA500 can be run from any decent 120VAC mains outlet as long as there 
aren't too many other loads on it. But going above that power level forces the 
Ham to have 240 VAC in the shack, something many of us do not normally plan 
for. That can be a very expensive addition to the cost of the amp, especially 
if the mains panel is not expandable as needed.

Of course, it's a "no brainer" for those looking to run the legal limit, but 
for the average Ham it can be a real consideration. 

73, Ron AC7AC 

-Original Message-

Agreed, and I'd guess it was purely an economic decision.
Bob AA6VB


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Wayne Burdick]

The K2 DSP is the only such case, and as noted, Lyle has been with us 
exclusively ever since. All other Elecraft products were designed by our 
full-time or part-time engineering staff. 

We would not source someone else's QRO amp design. We would reserve the fun for 
ourselves :) 

Those exploratory models from 2006 were designed by our senior RF engineer in 
his "spare time." If he gets the itch again someday, we'll let you know. 

73,
Wayne
N6KR

-
http://www.elecraft.com

> On Jul 31, 2016, at 11:37 AM, Wes Stewart  wrote:
> 
> Apparently you don't know Elecraft's engineering process.  Many "Elecraft" 
> products were "designed by someone else", starting with the DSP in the K2.  
> Here's what Wayne had to say about that:
> 
> "A major milestone in our history was the KDSP2 option for the K2. Lyle 
> Johnson, KK7P, became known to us *after* he had mostly completed this highly 
> versatile DSP unit. He reverse-engineered the auxBus protocol and made the 
> KDSP2 behave as if it were a KAF2, which plugged into the same spot. He 
> showed it to us, and we immediately adopted both the product and Lyle 
> himself."
> 
> Lyle now works for Elecraft from the comfort of his home here in 
> Tucson..(What I call, "distributed engineering.")
> 
> Many other "Elecraft" designs were done similarly, by someone else, PAs 
> included.
> 
> BTW QRO is about being heard.  I'm often amused by the digital mode crowd, 
> who profess that one doesn't need "power" to get through, i.e., "I work the 
> world with 5 W on ESP (your favorite mode here)."  Some of them even make 
> imaginary QSOs on EME. http://www.sm2cew.com/jt65.html
> 
> Wes N7WS
> www.qrz.com/db/n7ws
> 
> 
>> On 7/30/2016 5:40 PM, Rick Braun wrote:
>> I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems inceivable 
>> that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed by someone 
>> else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When receivers 
>> were less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters, digital noise 
>> reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of DX receivers.  
>> We don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e. blow out the ops 
>> with less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft ethic.  They 
>> aren’t QRP snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence, and cunning, 
>> rather than brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as odd.
>> 
>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>> 
>> __
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>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Wes Stewart]

I would even reinstall the 240V service:-)

On 7/31/2016 1:20 PM, Greg wrote:

It's amazing how many people offer an opinion on what the market would be
for an Elecraft 1500 watt amplifier.  People just know it wouldn't be
successful without a clue who might or might not really be interested.
They're right...the QRP'ers would not be interested, for one, would be very
interested.  People who have amplifiers sitting on shelves collecting dust
would not be interested.  So who would be interested -- contesters and
DX'ers.

  I own a KPA500 and it is very nice; the integration with the K3 makes it a
pleasure to use...but I want the capability to run full legal limit.  I own
several full legal limit amps but would gladly get rid of one or more for an
Elecraft amp.  At my age and being retired, I care more about value,
engineering design, and service than I do about price.  There are lots of
people who spend $6 - $14K on a radio...why  not an amplifier?

The majority of serious contesters and DX'ers own a K3.  If a KPA1500 had
the same features as  the KPA500 then it would be compatible with the K3,
remember the drive required on each band, put the K3 back at 100 watts when
in standby, be upgradeable through Elecraft's utilities, have Elecraft's
service commitment, would match the K-line, would be fully self-protected,
and it would be made and serviced in the USA.  Elecraft has already dealt
with the requirements for an amp to be compatible with other rigs than the
K3 so that would not be an issue with the 1500.  Contesters especially would
appreciate convenience with the instant band switching with no need to touch
drive controls or worry about antenna selection.  I'll offer my opinion that
a lot of people who already own a 1500 watt amplifier would go ahead and
purchase an Elecraft amplifier for all the reasons mentioned.  Alphas used
to be the cat's meow but the products and service they have now don't
measure up to what Dick Ehrhorn used to offer.  I wouldn't discourage
Eric/Wayne from considering a KPA1500.  I hope they do it.  Put me on the
list to get one if/when they do.  73, Greg-N4CC
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Clay Autery]

Building a pile of cash for an amp...  Would definitely prefer to hand
that pile of cash to Elecraft than to any other company...

__
Clay Autery, KY5G
MONTAC Enterprises
(318) 518-1389

On 7/31/2016 3:20 PM, Greg wrote:
> Put me on the
> list to get one if/when they do.  73, Greg-N4CC
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Greg]

It's amazing how many people offer an opinion on what the market would be
for an Elecraft 1500 watt amplifier.  People just know it wouldn't be
successful without a clue who might or might not really be interested.
They're right...the QRP'ers would not be interested, for one, would be very
interested.  People who have amplifiers sitting on shelves collecting dust
would not be interested.  So who would be interested -- contesters and
DX'ers.  

 I own a KPA500 and it is very nice; the integration with the K3 makes it a
pleasure to use...but I want the capability to run full legal limit.  I own
several full legal limit amps but would gladly get rid of one or more for an
Elecraft amp.  At my age and being retired, I care more about value,
engineering design, and service than I do about price.  There are lots of
people who spend $6 - $14K on a radio...why  not an amplifier?

The majority of serious contesters and DX'ers own a K3.  If a KPA1500 had
the same features as  the KPA500 then it would be compatible with the K3,
remember the drive required on each band, put the K3 back at 100 watts when
in standby, be upgradeable through Elecraft's utilities, have Elecraft's
service commitment, would match the K-line, would be fully self-protected,
and it would be made and serviced in the USA.  Elecraft has already dealt
with the requirements for an amp to be compatible with other rigs than the
K3 so that would not be an issue with the 1500.  Contesters especially would
appreciate convenience with the instant band switching with no need to touch
drive controls or worry about antenna selection.  I'll offer my opinion that
a lot of people who already own a 1500 watt amplifier would go ahead and
purchase an Elecraft amplifier for all the reasons mentioned.  Alphas used
to be the cat's meow but the products and service they have now don't
measure up to what Dick Ehrhorn used to offer.  I wouldn't discourage
Eric/Wayne from considering a KPA1500.  I hope they do it.  Put me on the
list to get one if/when they do.  73, Greg-N4CC
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Wes Stewart]

Apparently you don't know Elecraft's engineering process.  Many "Elecraft" 
products were "designed by someone else", starting with the DSP in the K2.  
Here's what Wayne had to say about that:


"A major milestone in our history was the KDSP2 option for the K2. Lyle Johnson, 
KK7P, became known to us *after* he had mostly completed this highly versatile 
DSP unit. He reverse-engineered the auxBus protocol and made the KDSP2 behave as 
if it were a KAF2, which plugged into the same spot. He showed it to us, and we 
immediately adopted both the product and Lyle himself."


Lyle now works for Elecraft from the comfort of his home here in Tucson..(What I 
call, "distributed engineering.")


Many other "Elecraft" designs were done similarly, by someone else, PAs 
included.

BTW QRO is about being heard.  I'm often amused by the digital mode crowd, who 
profess that one doesn't need "power" to get through, i.e., "I work the world 
with 5 W on ESP (your favorite mode here)."  Some of them even make imaginary 
QSOs on EME. http://www.sm2cew.com/jt65.html


Wes N7WS
www.qrz.com/db/n7ws


On 7/30/2016 5:40 PM, Rick Braun wrote:

I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems inceivable 
that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed by someone 
else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When receivers were 
less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters, digital noise 
reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of DX receivers.  We 
don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e. blow out the ops with 
less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft ethic.  They aren’t QRP 
snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence, and cunning, rather than 
brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as odd.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Edward R Cole]

I was going to say something like what Kevin has.

I have a HB 300w linear sspa built from Comm Concepts kit which 
sitting on the dusty shelf and a 140w amp from them.  BTW both are for sale.


I bought the KXPA-100* which work nicely with either my KX3 or K3/10 
driving at about 4w.  If I did more HF I guess I would want more RF 
power but cannot justify several $K for that.  For what I would spend 
on a KPA-500 I could build a 1200w LDMOS amp using the kit board from 
Jim Klitzing - W6PQL.  Of course I like building.  That would not 
have all the nice features or integrating ATU.


If I had the disposable cash the KPA-500 would be just fine.  Stack 
more aluminum for more ERP!!


I am more likely to spend ham dollars on my VHF+ "stuff".  Current 
project is converting a Harris KW ch2 TV linear to 6m.  It will drive 
with 8-10w.


Yesterday, we held a celebration of life at Rich Strand's KL7RA (sk) 
Nikiski QTH and admiring the multi-multi contest station he built - 
Lots of the amps that have been mentioned in that room.


I feel that Wayne and Eric are very smart businessman and they 
consider the market very carefully when looking at a new product 
line.  Probably why they are staying out of the QRO market or VHF amp 
market (which I dipped my toe into).


73, Ed - KL7UW
*Nice opening from Alaska to PacNW on 6m last two days (my 80w worked well)

From: Kevin <ksto...@ac0h.net>
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp
Message-ID: <c95dcfc3-73f1-6434-4306-bab2b1c25...@ac0h.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed

"Some People" does not a market make.

The 1KW and up amplifier market is awash with suppliers. Yaesu, Icom,
SPE, Ameritron, Alpha, OM Power, Emtron or whoever owns them now,
Dishtronics. To be competitive they'd have to design an amp that works
with anybody's transceiver just like the KPA500 does with the K3(s) and
be as rugged as an AL1500, the contest crowds favorite amp. Add solid
state to that and your market shrinks because fewer people will drop
$8K+ on an amp. I'd bet they'd sell less than 1,000...ever.

Smart move is to let the legal limit amplifier folks do what they do
best and Elecraft do what it does best, make radios.


73, Ed - KL7UW
http://www.kl7uw.com
"Kits made by KL7UW"
Dubus Mag business:
dubus...@gmail.com

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Kevin]

"Some People" does not a market make.

The 1KW and up amplifier market is awash with suppliers. Yaesu, Icom, 
SPE, Ameritron, Alpha, OM Power, Emtron or whoever owns them now, 
Dishtronics. To be competitive they'd have to design an amp that works 
with anybody's transceiver just like the KPA500 does with the K3(s) and 
be as rugged as an AL1500, the contest crowds favorite amp. Add solid 
state to that and your market shrinks because fewer people will drop 
$8K+ on an amp. I'd bet they'd sell less than 1,000...ever.


Smart move is to let the legal limit amplifier folks do what they do 
best and Elecraft do what it does best, make radios.



On 7/30/2016 9:51 PM, Kevin - K4VD wrote:

I'm not so sure. Just the rumor of a big Elecraft amp had some people
(including me) quite interested. In fact, based on some of the pictures,
Elecraft had some interest in the past.

Amps are not evil and I also don't think they are incompatible -
technically or philosophically - with Elecraft. I value skill,
intelligence, cunning and brute force when necessary.

If ever Elecraft comes out with a legal limit amp I'd be asking the boss
for OT.

On Sat, Jul 30, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Rick Braun  wrote:


I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems
inceivable that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed
by someone else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When
receivers were less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters,
digital noise reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of
DX receivers.  We don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e.
blow out the ops with less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft
ethic.  They aren’t QRP snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence,
and cunning, rather than brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as
odd.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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--
R. Kevin Stover
AC0H
ARRL
FISTS #11993
SKCC #215
NAQCC #3441


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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[David Gilbert]

Compared to a 500 watt amplifier, 1500 watts represents almost 5 db.  If 
you don't know what 5 db can do when trying to make weak signal contacts 
you haven't done much of it.  I'm not saying that Elecraft should come 
out with a 1500 watt amp, but amps are NOT just about being loud and 
busting pileups.  They have nothing to do with the front end of 
receivers and everything to do with fighting noise of one sort or another.


Dave   Ab7E


On 7/30/2016 5:40 PM, Rick Braun wrote:

I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems inceivable 
that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed by someone 
else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When receivers were 
less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters, digital noise 
reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of DX receivers.  We 
don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e. blow out the ops with 
less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft ethic.  They aren’t QRP 
snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence, and cunning, rather than 
brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as odd.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Chortek Bob via Elecraft]

 blockquote, div.yahoo_quoted { margin-left: 0 !important; border-left:1px 
#715FFA solid !important; padding-left:1ex !important; background-color:white 
!important; }  Agreed, and I'd guess it was purely an economic decision.
Bob AA6VB


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Saturday, July 30, 2016, 7:51 PM, Kevin - K4VD  wrote:

I'm not so sure. Just the rumor of a big Elecraft amp had some people
(including me) quite interested. In fact, based on some of the pictures,
Elecraft had some interest in the past.

Amps are not evil and I also don't think they are incompatible -
technically or philosophically - with Elecraft. I value skill,
intelligence, cunning and brute force when necessary.

If ever Elecraft comes out with a legal limit amp I'd be asking the boss
for OT.

On Sat, Jul 30, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Rick Braun  wrote:

> I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems
> inceivable that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed
> by someone else.  Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When
> receivers were less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters,
> digital noise reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of
> DX receivers.  We don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e.
> blow out the ops with less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft
> ethic.  They aren’t QRP snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence,
> and cunning, rather than brute power.  Whole big amp thing struck me as
> odd.
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> __
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> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
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Re: [Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Kevin - K4VD]

I'm not so sure. Just the rumor of a big Elecraft amp had some people
(including me) quite interested. In fact, based on some of the pictures,
Elecraft had some interest in the past.

Amps are not evil and I also don't think they are incompatible -
technically or philosophically - with Elecraft. I value skill,
intelligence, cunning and brute force when necessary.

If ever Elecraft comes out with a legal limit amp I'd be asking the boss
for OT.

On Sat, Jul 30, 2016 at 8:40 PM, Rick Braun  wrote:

> I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems
> inceivable that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed
> by someone else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When
> receivers were less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters,
> digital noise reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of
> DX receivers.  We don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e.
> blow out the ops with less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft
> ethic.  They aren’t QRP snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence,
> and cunning, rather than brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as
> odd.
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to ke...@k4vd.net
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[Elecraft] The 1500 watt amp

[Rick Braun]

I was heartened to see Wayne’s response to this rumor.  It seems inceivable 
that Elecraft would offer such a product, much less one designed by someone 
else.   Big amps are about being loud, busting pileups,  .  When receivers were 
less sensitive and sophisticated, e.g. digital filters, digital noise 
reduction, etc., you needed power to get in the front ends of DX receivers.  We 
don’t need that power anymore except to contest, i.e. blow out the ops with 
less power.  To me this don’t seem like the Elecraft ethic.  They aren’t QRP 
snobs, and they seem to value skill, intelligence, and cunning, rather than 
brute power.   Whole big amp thing struck me as odd.  

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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