Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
On Jul 18, 2005, at 12:47 PM, wayne burdick wrote: A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. It would need about twice as many parts, and to fit in the available space would require nearly all SMDs, including 0603 size passives and TSSOP ICs. Now, I certainly don't want to challenge the designers of the K2, who have already proved their genius. However, I was looking closely at my K2 last night and as considering ways in which the KNB2 and KSB2 boards might be expanded. The KSB2 is a real challenge, since it starts to run into things. But there appears to be room for at least three to four more square inches if you are willing to deal with a really oddly shaped board - one square inch moving toward the control board from the right edge - between the XFIL1 side and the XFIL2 crystals. Another stuck between the XFIL2 and BFO crystals. Perhaps another on the left side of the XFIL2 crystals moving forward. And a lot more space moving toward the rear if you wrap around the edge of the KNB2. For the KNB2, it seems a lot simpler. It looks really easy to double the size of the board just by moving the rear edge toward the back of the K2, up over the LPF toroids and relays. (You would have to leave a hole for R60) Or, if that isn't acceptable, the left edge could expand toward the left side, up next to the KSB2. I don't have the K60XV, so maybe it's in the way, but there seem to be some possibilities for expansion other than going SMT. Just some ideas. Bill Coleman, AA4LR, PP-ASELMail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Quote: "Not within a thousand years will man ever fly!" -- Wilbur Wright, 1901 ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
On Tue, 19 Jul 2005, John D'Ausilio wrote: Why does that imply pre-assembly? Lots of us out here are perfectly comfortable with SMT, and there's enuf builders-for-hire to support those who aren't ... An interesting, and market driven to boot, approach would be if some enterprizing person/persons produced a kit and an assembled noise blanker for the K2 using more current technology. For those K2 owners that either can not or would rather not build one, the assembled version would be a plus, and the kit version would allow the "builders" to benefit. 73,Thom-k3hrn www.zerobeat.net Home of QRP Web Ring, Drakelist home page, Free Classified Ads for amateur radio, QRP IRC channel Elecraft Owners Database www.tlchost.net/hosting/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
Why does that imply pre-assembly? Lots of us out here are perfectly comfortable with SMT, and there's enuf builders-for-hire to support those who aren't ... de w1rt On 7/18/05, wayne burdick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Thanks, everyone, for all the input on noise blankers. > > A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. It would need > about twice as many parts, and to fit in the available space would > require nearly all SMDs, including 0603 size passives and TSSOP ICs. > This implies a completely pre-assembled module, which is one of the > things we tried to avoid in the K2 :) > > Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, we'll > be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to throw at > it. > > 73, > Wayne > N6KR > > > > --- > > http://www.elecraft.com > > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
I understand where you are coming from, Darrell. That is bad.. I have been a ham since 1961 and really never found a NB that worked really good in the house. Usually it also distorts the audio. Now, in a vehicle I have found that the NB does work good usually. Paul Gates K1 #0231 KX1 #1186 XG1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: "Darrell Bellerive" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 10:55 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2 > Eliminating the source of the noise is by far the best solution, however > in > many cases it is just not practical. I live in a farming area and there > are > many, many, electric fences. While an electric fence in proper order > causes > little if any RFI, most fences are simply not installed and maintained > with > respect to RFI. Keeping them in good working order would be a full time > job, > and I would rather be on the air than fixing them. > > The same would hold true of a ham near an industrial complex. Just too > many > noise sources to be eliminated to be practical. > > Sometimes a good noise blanker is the most practical solution. > Unfortunately > most noise blankers seem to be designed to tackle only one noise source at > a > time within limited constraints of pulse width, pulse rate and pulse > level, > rather than many simultaneous noise sources with very diverse pulse > characteristics. > > Another alternative to noise blanking is to move off the grid, way into > the > backcountry where manmade noise is behind a few mountain ranges, but this > too > has some practical limitations. > > On July 18, 2005 11:37 am, Paul Gates wrote: > > I would think that be-moaning the fact of a better noise blanker would > > be > > to find the source of the noise which is pretty easy to do usually and > > with > > the help of the FCC things change. > > Paul Gates > > K1 #0231 > > KX1 #1186 > > XG1 > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -- > Darrell Bellerive > Amateur Radio Stations VA7TO and VE7CLA > Grand Forks, British Columbia, Canada > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
Eliminating the source of the noise is by far the best solution, however in many cases it is just not practical. I live in a farming area and there are many, many, electric fences. While an electric fence in proper order causes little if any RFI, most fences are simply not installed and maintained with respect to RFI. Keeping them in good working order would be a full time job, and I would rather be on the air than fixing them. The same would hold true of a ham near an industrial complex. Just too many noise sources to be eliminated to be practical. Sometimes a good noise blanker is the most practical solution. Unfortunately most noise blankers seem to be designed to tackle only one noise source at a time within limited constraints of pulse width, pulse rate and pulse level, rather than many simultaneous noise sources with very diverse pulse characteristics. Another alternative to noise blanking is to move off the grid, way into the backcountry where manmade noise is behind a few mountain ranges, but this too has some practical limitations. On July 18, 2005 11:37 am, Paul Gates wrote: > I would think that be-moaning the fact of a better noise blanker would be > to find the source of the noise which is pretty easy to do usually and with > the help of the FCC things change. > Paul Gates > K1 #0231 > KX1 #1186 > XG1 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Darrell Bellerive Amateur Radio Stations VA7TO and VE7CLA Grand Forks, British Columbia, Canada ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
Eric, I have a S8 noise all the time... 24 hours a day. I have discovered with the Utility company the neighbor that is responsible. The neighbors were asked to called the Utility Co. months ago but they have not done anything. At the time... March... I was going in for a full knee replacement and so I let it ride. I am back to walking normal and going up and down stairs quite well and trying walk a mile a day. So, I will make contact with the neighbor again if I get no satisfaction I will contact the ARRL and they in turn will contact the FCC. The Fcc will probably fine them and send a rep. to get them to solve the problem. I figure they are giving havoc to the rest of the neighborhood but the neighbors probably have no idea where it is coming from. Now with the Icom 706MKIIG I have to engage DSP, Noise Reduction, NB, and AmCom's digital speaker to calm down the noise. With the KX1 it seems to be tighter and the S- meter is reading only 2 bars! That is with the filter wide open on the KX1. So in my mind that says something for Elecraft!! Paul Gates K1 #0231 KX1 #1186 XG1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: "EricJ" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "'Vic Rosenthal'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'Elecraft Reflector'" Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 5:14 PM Subject: RE: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2 > I agree Vic. My location is pretty noise during the day, esp. in the > summer. > Frequently it is S5-S7 during the afternoon. The KNB2 does the best job of > any noise blanker I have ever had, but it is not up to everything I > experience. An effective noise blanker would be high on my list. > > Eric > KE6US > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Vic Rosenthal > Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 10:10 AM > To: Elecraft Reflector > Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2 > > wayne burdick wrote: > > > A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. > > > > > Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, > > we'll be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to > > throw > at it. > > My experience over the past 49 years as a ham tells me YES! I want this. > Noise of various types is the biggest problem I face in my day-to-day > hamming, and it is getting worse and worse. A solution to longer > rise-time > manmade electrical noise would be welcome. Who knows, the new device > might > be flexible enough to deal with some types of BPL. > > -- > 73, > Vic, K2VCO > Fresno CA > http://www.qsl.net/k2vco > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
RE: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
I agree Vic. My location is pretty noise during the day, esp. in the summer. Frequently it is S5-S7 during the afternoon. The KNB2 does the best job of any noise blanker I have ever had, but it is not up to everything I experience. An effective noise blanker would be high on my list. Eric KE6US -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Vic Rosenthal Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 10:10 AM To: Elecraft Reflector Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2 wayne burdick wrote: > A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. > Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, > we'll be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to throw at it. My experience over the past 49 years as a ham tells me YES! I want this. Noise of various types is the biggest problem I face in my day-to-day hamming, and it is getting worse and worse. A solution to longer rise-time manmade electrical noise would be welcome. Who knows, the new device might be flexible enough to deal with some types of BPL. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
Wayne, sign me up; I got lots of bad noise from a variety of sources; I would only love my K2 all the more... 73, Dave W5SV wayne burdick wrote: Thanks, everyone, for all the input on noise blankers. A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. It would need about twice as many parts, and to fit in the available space would require nearly all SMDs, including 0603 size passives and TSSOP ICs. This implies a completely pre-assembled module, which is one of the things we tried to avoid in the K2 :) Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, we'll be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to throw at it. 73, Wayne N6KR ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
Hi Vic, Have you met an Evasive Noise Blanker? It won't send 'QRZ test' at you either! 73, Geoff GM4ESD Vic Rosenthal wrote: My experience over the past 49 years as a ham tells me YES! I want this. Noise of various types is the biggest problem I face in my day-to-day hamming, and it is getting worse and worse. A solution to longer rise-time manmade electrical noise would be welcome. Who knows, the new device might be flexible enough to deal with some types of BPL. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
On Mon, 18 Jul 2005, Paul Gates wrote: I would think that be-moaning the fact of a better noise blanker would be to find the source of the noise which is pretty easy to do usually and with the help of the FCC things change. Let's see, using that logic, I can get rid of all the locks on my doors as soon as I know I've found all the crooks and the state has them all in jail. Somehow, like having an effective noise blanker, I'll count on the locks. 73,Thom-k3hrn www.zerobeat.net Home of QRP Web Ring, Drakelist home page, Free Classified Ads for amateur radio, QRP IRC channel Elecraft Owners Database www.tlchost.net/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
I would think that be-moaning the fact of a better noise blanker would be to find the source of the noise which is pretty easy to do usually and with the help of the FCC things change. Paul Gates K1 #0231 KX1 #1186 XG1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: "Bill NY9H" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Elecraft Reflector" Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 1:21 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2 > I ALSO WOULD GO FOR A BETTER BLANKER,,, > > keeping things in perspective > MY K2,, with MY powerline noise,,, > is superior to my Icom 756P2, and my TT omni6+... > > the tentec has a very good one and the icom does NOT > to me that is the weakest part of the Icom series > > > > bill > > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
There is an easier way to take care of the noise/NB... Go to your next door neighbor with a rep. from the utility company. Ask them to turn off their power and then one by one turn the circuits back on to see where the noise is coming from! And then with the power company solve it. This we did here. I can take a S8 noise level and with the 250 cw filter on the KX1, filter the noise out completely. Paul Gates K1 #0231 KX1 #1186 XG1 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: "Vic Rosenthal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Elecraft Reflector" Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 1:09 PM Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2 > wayne burdick wrote: > > > A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. > > > > > Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, we'll > > be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to throw at > > it. > > My experience over the past 49 years as a ham tells me YES! I want > this. Noise of various types is the biggest problem I face in my > day-to-day hamming, and it is getting worse and worse. A solution to > longer rise-time manmade electrical noise would be welcome. Who knows, > the new device might be flexible enough to deal with some types of BPL. > > -- > 73, > Vic, K2VCO > Fresno CA > http://www.qsl.net/k2vco > ___ > Elecraft mailing list > Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net > You must be a subscriber to post to the list. > Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm > Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com > ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
While an internal blanker would be consistant with the design goals of the K2, an external blanker would also be acceptable. Most severe noise problems are at a home QTH, and not at locations where portable operations are conducted. Less noise at the campsite than at home. A fully assembled internal SMD noise blanker module is still preferable to not being able to fully use the K2. Even if we couldn't assemble it, at least we could still plug it in to the headers. :-) Darrell VA7TO On July 18, 2005 09:47 am, wayne burdick wrote: > Thanks, everyone, for all the input on noise blankers. > > A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. It would need > about twice as many parts, and to fit in the available space would > require nearly all SMDs, including 0603 size passives and TSSOP ICs. > This implies a completely pre-assembled module, which is one of the > things we tried to avoid in the K2 :) > > Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, we'll > be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to throw at > it. > > 73, > Wayne > N6KR -- Darrell Bellerive Amateur Radio Stations VA7TO and VE7CLA Grand Forks, British Columbia, Canada ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
On Mon, 18 Jul 2005, wayne burdick wrote: A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, we'll be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to throw at it. Hand raised, Baltimore's worst electrical noises await. Thanks.. 73,Thom-k3hrn www.zerobeat.net Home of QRP Web Ring, Drakelist home page, Free Classified Ads for amateur radio, QRP IRC channel Elecraft Owners Database www.tlchost.net/ Web Hosting as low as 3.49/month ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
I ALSO WOULD GO FOR A BETTER BLANKER,,, keeping things in perspective MY K2,, with MY powerline noise,,, is superior to my Icom 756P2, and my TT omni6+... the tentec has a very good one and the icom does NOT to me that is the weakest part of the Icom series bill ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: KNB2
wayne burdick wrote: A more sophisticated noise blanker is certainly possible. Still, this is definitely on the wish-list. When we do get to it, we'll be looking for testers who have all sorts of horrible noise to throw at it. My experience over the past 49 years as a ham tells me YES! I want this. Noise of various types is the biggest problem I face in my day-to-day hamming, and it is getting worse and worse. A solution to longer rise-time manmade electrical noise would be welcome. Who knows, the new device might be flexible enough to deal with some types of BPL. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
