Re: Q: org-publish-project-alist and :exclude
David Masterson writes: > Ihor Radchenko writes: > >> David Masterson writes: >> >>> Hmm. Couldn't get rx (or rx-to-string) to work for me. Kept getting an >>> error that a stringp was expected for the argument to :exclude. I tried >>> variations on: >>> >>> :exclude (rx-to-string (seq (or "init" "calendar-beorg") ".org")) >> >> When you have '(:foo bar :baz eet), nothing inside is evaluated because >> of the quote. To evaluate expressions selectively, use backquote: >> >> `(:foo bar:baz ,(concat "foo" "bar")) > > I always had trouble with '"` in hacking Elisp. I should've studied the > language more 40 years ago... :( > >>> Reverted to using a simple regex as above with proper escapes. Can I >>> suggest making the complex example in 14.3.2 of the Org Manual use a >>> better example regex (in rx form?) as a hint to what :exclude can do? >> >> Sure. >> https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=773bba92a > > Perfect. I spoke too soon -- I'm still getting the same error about expecting a string. You mentioned '`' above, but use ',' in your manual diff. I tried both (along with rx-to-string). -- David Masterson
Re: Q: org-publish-project-alist and :exclude
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Hmm. Couldn't get rx (or rx-to-string) to work for me. Kept getting an >> error that a stringp was expected for the argument to :exclude. I tried >> variations on: >> >> :exclude (rx-to-string (seq (or "init" "calendar-beorg") ".org")) > > When you have '(:foo bar :baz eet), nothing inside is evaluated because > of the quote. To evaluate expressions selectively, use backquote: > > `(:foo bar:baz ,(concat "foo" "bar")) I always had trouble with '"` in hacking Elisp. I should've studied the language more 40 years ago... :( >> Reverted to using a simple regex as above with proper escapes. Can I >> suggest making the complex example in 14.3.2 of the Org Manual use a >> better example regex (in rx form?) as a hint to what :exclude can do? > > Sure. > https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=773bba92a Perfect. -- David Masterson
Re: Q: org-publish-project-alist and :exclude
David Masterson writes: > Ihor Radchenko writes: > >> David Masterson writes: >> >>> So I have this form: >>> >>> :exclude "\(init\|calendar-beorg\).org" >>> >>> but that doesn't seem to work as I get an ignorable error in processing >>> calendar-beorg.org (a known Beorg issue). >>> >>> Is my regex wrong? >> >> Yes. You got to escape the \ inside string. >> I recommend using `rx' instead to avoid the backslash hell. > > Thanks, I didn't know about `rx'. Hmm. Couldn't get rx (or rx-to-string) to work for me. Kept getting an error that a stringp was expected for the argument to :exclude. I tried variations on: :exclude (rx-to-string (seq (or "init" "calendar-beorg") ".org")) Reverted to using a simple regex as above with proper escapes. Can I suggest making the complex example in 14.3.2 of the Org Manual use a better example regex (in rx form?) as a hint to what :exclude can do? -- David Masterson
Re: Q: org-publish-project-alist and :exclude
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> So I have this form: >> >> :exclude "\(init\|calendar-beorg\).org" >> >> but that doesn't seem to work as I get an ignorable error in processing >> calendar-beorg.org (a known Beorg issue). >> >> Is my regex wrong? > > Yes. You got to escape the \ inside string. > I recommend using `rx' instead to avoid the backslash hell. Thanks, I didn't know about `rx'. -- David Masterson
Q: org-publish-project-alist and :exclude
In the Org Mode manual section 14.1.3, it says that ":exclude" takes a regular expression of filenames to exclude from publishing but it doesn't really explain what the regular expression format is (I assume Elisp regex). I have two Org files that I want to exclude: * calendar-beorg.org * init.org So I have this form: :exclude "\(init\|calendar-beorg\).org" but that doesn't seem to work as I get an ignorable error in processing calendar-beorg.org (a known Beorg issue). Is my regex wrong? -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Ihor Radchenko writes: >> >>> Patches welcome. >> >> * What is my status as far as submitting patches to documentation >> (including docstrings)? > > I can see two commits of yours in Org repo. Beyond the 15LOC limit. > So, we cannot accept more TINYCHANGE patches and need FSF copyright > assignment - https://orgmode.org/worg/org-contribute.html#copyright The form for copyright assignment asks what files have you changed so far. I assumed the form would be universal for any past and future changes you make to the program (Emacs). Do people really need to fill that part out? Do I need the info from the 2 commits? >> * Is there a write-up on the process of "patching" I can follow? > > Yes, of course. See https://orgmode.org/worg/org-contribute.html#first-patch Thanks -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > Patches welcome. * What is my status as far as submitting patches to documentation (including docstrings)? * Is there a write-up on the process of "patching" I can follow? -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> The detailed reason why we use this particular markup is that >>> otherwise some internal code assumptions inside Org mode may break when >>> users run `fill-region' on the notes. This is an internal implementation >>> detail which should not be explained in the manual. >> >> Hmm. Fill-region will also compress the blanks in the generate note >> header -- does that run up against the code assumptions? > > No. See `org-skip-over-state-notes'. Hmm. The docstring on that should discuss what it's looking for to say "this is the end of the state notes". Does a plain note (org-add-note) count as a state note? >> I'm all for keeping internal implementation details out of the user's >> manual, unless... >> >>> What we might explain better is what is a line break, although I am not >>> very sure what to explain here - I may be too familiar with the concept >>> from my LaTeX-foo. >> >> The manual should set expectations on what an Org file should look like >> -- at least the key components. It already defines Header, Paragraph >> and Timestamp. What I think is missing here is the definition of a Note >> along with some structure info about it (header line + 2 space indented >> paragraphs[s]) to prepare the user. > > Unlike headings, paragraphs, and timestamps, notes are not a part of Org > syntax. Their format is customizeable via `org-log-note-headings'. Oh! That's an interesting point. That variable is not mentioned in the Manual (AFAICS), but perhaps it should be -- particularly around the talk of "rescheduling" (and "delschedule" which I don't see in the manual). Mentioned only in the sense of, if you want to change the note header, look here. > However, it is probably worth describing the notes in 5.3 Progress > Logging section of the manual. I'd agree. In particular, what depends on the format of the note (header) -- like Agenda. To warn people what they can or cannot touch. -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> We do document the line breaks in >>> https://orgmode.org/manual/Paragraphs.html >> >> The only thing I see with respect to '\\' is: >> >> Paragraphs are separated by at least one empty line. If you need to >> enforce a line break within a paragraph, use ‘\\’ at the end of a line. >> >> Which doesn't answer the question of why org-add-note (etc) added it the >> end of the first line of a Note which lead to my confusion. It's easy to >> assume, if Org is adding '\\' to the first line of the Note and the Note >> is a unit, then this is there to prevent folding/wrapping in the Note >> when Org does "something" (but what?). > > Line break is a "forced" break of a line in paragraph. When there is a > line break, paragraph does not re-flow to the page width. > > Re-flow may imply different things, including `fill-region' command in > Emacs or paragraph layout during export. > > The detailed reason why we use this particular markup is that > otherwise some internal code assumptions inside Org mode may break when > users run `fill-region' on the notes. This is an internal implementation > detail which should not be explained in the manual. Hmm. Fill-region will also compress the blanks in the generate note header -- does that run up against the code assumptions? I'm all for keeping internal implementation details out of the user's manual, unless... > What we might explain better is what is a line break, although I am not > very sure what to explain here - I may be too familiar with the concept > from my LaTeX-foo. The manual should set expectations on what an Org file should look like -- at least the key components. It already defines Header, Paragraph and Timestamp. What I think is missing here is the definition of a Note along with some structure info about it (header line + 2 space indented paragraphs[s]) to prepare the user. In this, I probably come from a more Reference Manual viewpoint (ie. "this is what all the pieces could look like -- now lets discuss why you want each piece"). You could say that the '\\' is needed to keep "other things" from combining the header and paragraph of the note. You could leave the details of "other things" to variable or function docstrings as well as internal code. p.s. would requiring a blank line after the Note header eliminate the need for '\\' ? -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Hmm. glancing through the manual, there is a bit of assumption implicit >> about the use of '\\'. We had the problem with Unix Shell scripts that >> we would need a backslash at the end of a line to prevent the EOL as >> being interpreted as end-of-input. Depending on the layers of scripting >> we were using, we added backslashes after the backslash because each >> layer would peel off a backslash. This is what I first thought of in >> reading the manual. > > We do document the line breaks in > https://orgmode.org/manual/Paragraphs.html The only thing I see with respect to '\\' is: Paragraphs are separated by at least one empty line. If you need to enforce a line break within a paragraph, use ‘\\’ at the end of a line. Which doesn't answer the question of why org-add-note (etc) added it the end of the first line of a Note which lead to my confusion. It's easy to assume, if Org is adding '\\' to the first line of the Note and the Note is a unit, then this is there to prevent folding/wrapping in the Note when Org does "something" (but what?). -- David Masterson
Re: org-publish and folding ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> I keep a number of Org files in buffers when I'm working on Org stuff. I >> try to keep them folded so that I get the overview when I switch to the >> buffer. I have found that, when I org-publish the project with these Org >> files, any Org file that is newly published will unfold the buffer as >> publish does it's thing, My problem is that it doesn't refold the >> buffer when publish is done. > > May you please provide more detailed steps to reproduce the problem? > See https://orgmode.org/manual/Feedback.html#Feedback Ok. I'll see if I can setup a minimal environment and test it. -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> To prevent fill-region from concatenating the auto-generated text in the >>> first line and the user input in the following lines. >> >> Ah. Is that mentioned somewhere in the Org manual? I don't mean the >> details of fill-region, but a little something to answer "why is that >> there?" by new users. > > No, AFAIK, the exact format of notes is not described in the manual. > We do not describe every single detail in the manual. > I believe that the exact wording of the notes is not something we have > to describe. Hmm. glancing through the manual, there is a bit of assumption implicit about the use of '\\'. We had the problem with Unix Shell scripts that we would need a backslash at the end of a line to prevent the EOL as being interpreted as end-of-input. Depending on the layers of scripting we were using, we added backslashes after the backslash because each layer would peel off a backslash. This is what I first thought of in reading the manual. Seeing '\\' at the end of the note line, I thought something would get messed up if the EOLs (except last) in the Note were treated as end-of-input, so I added them to all but the last line. This is what I think needs clarification. -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Samuel Wales writes: > On 12/4/23, David Masterson wrote: >> Ihor Radchenko writes: >> >>> David Masterson writes: >>> >>>> org-add-note puts a '\\' at the end of the first line. Is it expected >>>> the user will put '\\' at the end of each line of a multiline note >>>> (except the last line)? >>> >>> No. >>> >>>> .. Why is this done? >>> >>> To prevent fill-region from concatenating the auto-generated text in the >>> first line and the user input in the following lines. >> >> Ah. Is that mentioned somewhere in the Org manual? I don't mean the >> details of filll-region, but a little something to answer "why is that >> there?" by new users. > > (info "(org) Paragraphs") Hmm. Not quite as it doesn't say anything about Org notes. -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> org-add-note puts a '\\' at the end of the first line. Is it expected >> the user will put '\\' at the end of each line of a multiline note >> (except the last line)? > > No. > >> .. Why is this done? > > To prevent fill-region from concatenating the auto-generated text in the > first line and the user input in the following lines. Ah. Is that mentioned somewhere in the Org manual? I don't mean the details of filll-region, but a little something to answer "why is that there?" by new users. -- David Masterson
oeg-add-note and double backslash ?
org-add-note puts a '\\' at the end of the first line. Is it expected the user will put '\\' at the end of each line of a multiline note (except the last line)? Why is this done? -- David Masterson
org-publish and folding ?
I keep a number of Org files in buffers when I'm working on Org stuff. I try to keep them folded so that I get the overview when I switch to the buffer. I have found that, when I org-publish the project with these Org files, any Org file that is newly published will unfold the buffer as publish does it's thing, My problem is that it doesn't refold the buffer when publish is done. Is there a trick to get it to refold the buffer? -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> Would it help if we change it to >>> >>> It is made of numerous .org files from https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg. >>> >>> ? >> >> Perhaps: >> >> Follow the link https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg for information (including >> cloning) on the WORG Git repository at SourceHut (https://sourcehut.org). > > I am not sure if I like it. Ok. The more I look at it, the more I'm okay with it. I confused the link to ~bzg/worg with an argument you would give to 'git clone', but that's just me jumping to conclusions. -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> I see no mention of "~bzg/org" in worg-about. > > Would it help if we change it to > > It is made of numerous .org files from https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg. > > ? Perhaps: Follow the link https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/worg for information (including cloning) on the WORG Git repository at SourceHut (https://sourcehut.org). >>> Or we might consider https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/woof to automatically update >>> WORG pages for appropriately marked mailing list threads. >> >> Hmm. That sounds most interesting becuase it's command line driven. >> Perhaps a new mailing list should be created for this? > > I don't think so. We intentionally keep Org mailing list as a single > place for all the discussions, not just Org development. AFAIU, > Bastien is firmly into this policy (CCing him in case if I > misunderstood). Ok. There might be enough capability in WOOF to sort thru the mailing list properly. -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> In worg-about, it looks like the repo is ~bzg/worg on src.ht, but "worg" >> doesn't come up in the project search on src.ht (but "org" does). Is >> the repo hidden (I don't have an account on src.ht yet -- perhaps >> sourcehut should be explained a bit in worg-about). > > May you please provide more details? I'll try. > Do you refer to <https://orgmode.org/worg/worg-about.html>? Yes. > FYI, WORG is listed in "Repositories" right at https://sr.ht/~bzg/org/ I see no mention of "~bzg/org" in worg-about. I think my lack of experience for many years is showing -- I didn't think to click on the ~bzg/worg link which would've told me about ~bzg/org. I assumed the link was just telling me what to put on 'git clone'. Perhaps that should be explained a little more in worg-about. What I did was go to sr.ht to see what it looked like and maybe sign up for an account. I followed the "More Projects" link and searched for "~bzg/worg", but nothing came up. However, searching for "org" did bring up "~bzg/org". Being out of practice, I was confused. >>> Alternatively, perhaps the key element of "wiki" for some is "web >>> accessible editing", in which case I wonder if using EmacsWiki would >>> make sense. >> >> Duh! Why did I forget about EmacsWiki?!? Web accessible editing is a >> plus to allow organic growth to the wiki -- as long as some rules are >> followed. Wikis allow easy undoing of page edits (if necessary) and (I >> think) locking pages to be edited only by a few people (creator/admins). >> There could be a talk page for suggesting additions to a use-case to >> make it more flexible which the use-creator creator could test and >> incoporate into the use-case (or just tag it as interesting). > > Currently, we prefer all the discussions, including discussions of WORG > pages, to happen on this mailing list. And I'm beginning to warm to WORG's approach. I used FosWiki a long time ago which is different. > One interesting idea could be showing the comment threads right on the > WORG pages, similar to > https://isso-comments.de/ > https://staticman.net/ > https://meta.discourse.org/t/embed-discourse-comments-on-another-website-via-javascript/31963 > https://amnesiak.org/post/2021/01/30/hugo-blog-with-mastodon-comments-extended/ These each look interesting. > Or we might consider https://git.sr.ht/~bzg/woof to automatically update > WORG pages for appropriately marked mailing list threads. Hmm. That sounds most interesting becuase it command line driven. Perhaps a new mailing list should be created for this? -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Corwin Brust writes: > On Tue, Nov 14, 2023 at 8:16 PM David Masterson wrote: >> >> Max Nikulin writes: >> >> > On 14/11/2023 15:36, Russell Adams wrote: >> >> On Mon, Nov 13, 2023 at 09:09:54PM -0800, David Masterson wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Was thinking I'd like to see an archive of tagged use-cases for Org that >> >>> could be searched via tags or regexp. >> > [...] >> >> Have you looked at Worg? >> > >> > Specifically there is >> > https://orgmode.org/worg/org-hacks.html >> > "Org ad hoc code, quick hacks and workarounds" >> > page. No tags however. To my taste it is overwhelmingly large. >> >> Perhaps a Wiki would be better? >> > > WORG is the Wiki for Org, or perhaps I'm not sure what you mean: > better than what? Something that could be updated by the public (safely). > Patches to WORG don't require assignment, btw. Good point! > Please do suggest significant restructuring. I think your organizing > things more in terms of use-cases could be something that will make > WORG more of a "first choice" for people to find and leave suggestions > for getting the most from org. My first reading of WORG (since restructuring) missed a lot. I now see the idea of using git via sourcehut. Git may not be as simple as an open edit wiki, but it probably provides more tools for tracking. In worg-about, it looks like the repo is ~bzg/worg on src.ht, but "worg" doesn't come up in the project search on src.ht (but "org" does). Is the repo hidden (I don't have an account on src.ht yet -- perhaps sourcehut should be explained a bit in worg-about). > Alternatively, perhaps the key element of "wiki" for some is "web > accessible editing", in which case I wonder if using EmacsWiki would > make sense. Duh! Why did I forget about EmacsWiki?!? Web accessible editing is a plus to allow organic growth to the wiki -- as long as some rules are followed. Wikis allow easy undoing of page edits (if necessary) and (I think) locking pages to be edited only by a few people (creator/admins). There could be a talk page for suggesting additions to a use-case to make it more flexible which the use-creator creator could test and incoporate into the use-case (or just tag it as interesting). The key thing, though, will be making snippets of elisp code easily available for people to cut and paste into their own .emacs file. I haveto look at WORG and EmacsWiki some more. -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Russell Adams writes: > On Tue, Nov 14, 2023 at 06:14:43PM -0800, David Masterson wrote: >> Russell Adams writes: >> >> > On Mon, Nov 13, 2023 at 09:09:54PM -0800, David Masterson wrote: >> >> Just a suggestion (or maybe this is already handled?). >> >> >> >> Was thinking I'd like to see an archive of tagged use-cases for Org that >> >> could be searched via tags or regexp. The use-cases should include a >> >> description of the problem, a general description of the answer, blocks >> >> of elisp (general code) to setup the answer, and how to use the code to >> >> do the work of the use-case. In fact, it could be recommended that the >> >> use-cases be written in literate programming style (the first use-case >> >> would have to provide the recommended example). As such, if written >> >> properly in Org, it could (after a once over by maintainers) be exported >> >> to HTML for inclusion on orgmode.org. >> > >> > Have you looked at Worg? >> >> Yes. and that's a beginning. I'm just wondering if something could be >> made to encourage simple use-cases to be uploaded by anyone to provide a >> deeper cookbook. Perhaps I'm thinking of a wiki where people could add >> their own use cases and comment on other people's use cases, The wiki >> would provide structure and search tools for new Org users. > > That's Worg. It's written in Org via Emacs, and publishes to the > web. It does use git, but the codebase is very open. You only have to > ask for an account and start writing. This sounds good. -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Russell Adams writes: > On Mon, Nov 13, 2023 at 09:09:54PM -0800, David Masterson wrote: >> Just a suggestion (or maybe this is already handled?). >> >> Was thinking I'd like to see an archive of tagged use-cases for Org that >> could be searched via tags or regexp. The use-cases should include a >> description of the problem, a general description of the answer, blocks >> of elisp (general code) to setup the answer, and how to use the code to >> do the work of the use-case. In fact, it could be recommended that the >> use-cases be written in literate programming style (the first use-case >> would have to provide the recommended example). As such, if written >> properly in Org, it could (after a once over by maintainers) be exported >> to HTML for inclusion on orgmode.org. > > Have you looked at Worg? Yes. and that's a beginning. I'm just wondering if something could be made to encourage simple use-cases to be uploaded by anyone to provide a deeper cookbook. Perhaps I'm thinking of a wiki where people could add their own use cases and comment on other people's use cases, The wiki would provide structure and search tools for new Org users. -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Max Nikulin writes: > On 14/11/2023 15:36, Russell Adams wrote: >> On Mon, Nov 13, 2023 at 09:09:54PM -0800, David Masterson wrote: >>> >>> Was thinking I'd like to see an archive of tagged use-cases for Org that >>> could be searched via tags or regexp. > [...] >> Have you looked at Worg? > > Specifically there is > https://orgmode.org/worg/org-hacks.html > "Org ad hoc code, quick hacks and workarounds" > page. No tags however. To my taste it is overwhelmingly large. Perhaps a Wiki would be better? -- David Masterson
Suggestion: User-contributed use-cases on orgmode.org ?
Just a suggestion (or maybe this is already handled?). Was thinking I'd like to see an archive of tagged use-cases for Org that could be searched via tags or regexp. The use-cases should include a description of the problem, a general description of the answer, blocks of elisp (general code) to setup the answer, and how to use the code to do the work of the use-case. In fact, it could be recommended that the use-cases be written in literate programming style (the first use-case would have to provide the recommended example). As such, if written properly in Org, it could (after a once over by maintainers) be exported to HTML for inclusion on orgmode.org. My reason for this is to have a ready reference for how other people have setup functions/variables that I could then copy/modify for my particular need. Many times, hacking other people's code is easier than digging into the Elisp of the various parts of Org. Forty years of using Emacs (off fand on) and hacking pieces of Elisp, I never really learned programming in Elisp. -- David Masterson
Re: Exporting Hyperlinks ?
Max Nikulin writes:
> On 07/11/2023 19:36, Ihor Radchenko wrote:
>> If \href{file.pdf#anchor} can work, we should indeed use it when
>> publishing org->pdf.
>
> It would be nice to have a LaTeX package that redefines \label to
> generated \hypertarget from its argument.
This would make it easy to create a PDF "website" that doesn't depend on
a webserver like HTML. A PDF website could easily be put on a USB key
to take with you and access via a mobile phone. This would be secure
because no network interaction. This is the use case I've been working
toward for years.
> Ideally, xr-hyper workflow should be supported as well. A downside is
> anchors are not stable and unrelated to labels.
Stable in the sense that the CUSTOM_ID could be moved to new file?
Could IDs play a roll here?
--
David Masterson
Re: Exporting Hyperlinks ?
Ihor Radchenko writes:
> Max Nikulin writes:
>
>> Human-readable link targets are susceptible to collisions. So ox-latex
>> should support links to particular locations in the specified files,
>> either an Org one or inside external PDF files. Code from ox-html should
>> be adapted for ox-latex.
>>
>> [[file:test.pdf::#anchor][Another document]]
>>-> \href{test.pdf\#anchor}{Another document}
>
> AFAIK, this kind of URL cannot be opened except when opening pdf in
> browser.
What else is there? PDFviewer? What is the standard for Latex?
>> [[file:test.org::#anchor][Another document]]
>> Either for xr-hyper
>> -> Another document \ref{f1-orgabc123}
>> with \label{orgabc123} in test.tex
>> or with redefined \label to generate additional \hypertarget
>> -> \href{test.pdf\#anchor}{Another document}
>
> And this does not fit into single-document exports. We must export
> multiple files via ox-publish. ...and ox-publish does not support pdf
> export.
org-latex-publish-to-pdf ?? Oh, you mean that it has to go through
Latex to get to PDF.
--
David Masterson
Re: Exporting Hyperlinks ?
Max Nikulin writes:
> On 02/11/2023 09:11, David Masterson wrote:
>> If I understand what you mean by "anchor", does Org create an anchor in
>> exporting to Latex when it sees a CUSTOM_ID property in an item? Then,
>> would the search in the hyperlink reference the anchor? Your examples
>> weren't precise enough for me to follow.
>
> You are right. Despite `org-latex-prefer-user-labels' exists, it
> currently affects LaTeX label names only, so it is possible to
> reference them as #page.2, #section.3, but not as
> #custom_id. ox-beamer however adds \hypertarget{anchor}... for Org
> <>, so in PDF it can be referenced as #anchor.
>
> So ox-latex should be improved to add \hypertarget commands for CUSTOM_ID.
I agree. For a link of:
[[file:contacts.org::#custom_id][My text]]
the generated LaTeX href looks like
\href{contacts.tex}{My text}
which looks wrong.
> Originally I suspected only issues with links.
>
> To get links between HTML documents where CUSTOM_ID are not used, it
> is necessary to rely on org-publish to track autogenerated anchors. I
> am unsure if publish works for LaTeX.
I use publish for LaTex (org-latex-publish-to-pdf)
--
David Masterson
Re: Exporting Hyperlinks ?
Max Nikulin writes: > On 01/11/2023 11:24, David Masterson wrote: >> In the Org Mode documentation, I see how hyperlinks are handled in HTML >> export and how images are handled in Latex export, but is there a clear >> description of how hyperlinks are handled across export engines >> (particularly the standard ones)? > > Only the code may be more complete reference than backend-specific > sections in the manual. There are some issues (e.g. cross-file id > links), but in general links should work. Hmm. I'm using CUSTOM_ID links to make a rudimentary Contact DB. >> I see that the PDF viewer is seeing >> file links from exported PDFs from Latex as links, but it seems >> incomplete (ie. link to a file, but not to a particular CUSTOM_ID in the >> file). > > It seems ::search part is stripped. Perhaps ::#anchor should be > exported as #anchor, however it is more tricky with line numbers or > text search variants. If I understand what you mean by "anchor", does Org create an anchor in exporting to Latex when it sees a CUSTOM_ID property in an item? Then, would the search in the hyperlink reference the anchor? Your examples weren't precise enough for me to follow. Thanks -- David Masterson
Re: Preferred posting style
"Loris Bennett" writes: > writes: > >> On Wed, Nov 01, 2023 at 08:32:44AM +0100, Loris Bennett wrote: >> >>> Assuming the quoting of previous postings works (above there seems to be >>> a discrepancy between '>>' and '> >', although Gnus seems to handle >>> that), is there some sort of 'bottom-postify' command which would >>> reorder the quotes? I occasionally do this by hand if I find the text >>> makes no sense to me otherwise. >> >> ISTR there was something, not in the Emacs context, alas, and before >> the First Internet Supernova (aka roughly Y2K, when Google had the >> choice to either go bust or go evil). >> >> I guess it won't work, since proper "bottom posting" is a bit more >> than just putting the whole kaboodle above and your two lines below. > > That maybe true. However, it would probably cover well over 90% of my > uses-cases. Often someone sends me a message, I bottom-post an > interleaved reply, and then the other person top-posts their answer. In > this case would be enough just to move the other person's singly quoted, > non-interleaved text to the bottom. Interesting idea, but the formats of "top posting" done by the various mail readers is not uniform making rearragement difficult and often not satisfying. > However I should probably raise the topic on the Gnus list rather than > discussing it any further here. Probably true. They might have some tricks. -- David Masterson
Exporting Hyperlinks ?
In the Org Mode documentation, I see how hyperlinks are handled in HTML export and how images are handled in Latex export, but is there a clear description of how hyperlinks are handled across export engines (particularly the standard ones)? I see that the PDF viewer is seeing file links from exported PDFs from Latex as links, but it seems incomplete (ie. link to a file, but not to a particular CUSTOM_ID in the file). What about Beamer or ascii or Texinfo? -- David Masterson
Re: Preferred posting style
yaxp writes: > Hello, > > Which posting style is preferable in this list? > > Top or Bottom. A decades old argument. Top makes it easier for many mail readers to slice off all the previous thread history (which the reader has in previous messages). Bottom makes it easier to have thread context in the message, Most Emacs related mailing lists / newsgroups prefer bottom. -- David Masterson
Re: org-search-view across all org-agenda-files ?
Samuel Wales writes: > "This command searches the agenda files, and in addition the files > listed in ‘org-agenda-text-search-extra-files’ unless a restriction lock > is active." -- > > On 10/26/23, David Masterson wrote: >> Can org-search-view work across all org-agenda-files? Is there an >> alternative? Thanks -- should've seen that. :\ -- David Masterson
org-search-view across all org-agenda-files ?
Can org-search-view work across all org-agenda-files? Is there an alternative? -- David Masterson
Re: Completion mechanism for headlines when creating a link between 2 Org files?
alain.coch...@unistra.fr writes: > (In my naive view, as the completion mechanism already exists for > internal files, it should be easy to extend it for external files...) I believe the auto-complete package will do that. -- David Masterson
Re: [PATCH] org-manual: Add references to LaTeX docs
Minor change below.
Ihor Radchenko writes:
> David Masterson writes:
>
>> I think begin.html is a good starting point. Mentioning 'texdoc latex'
>> is also simple (and more LaTeX specific) and most likely to work. You
>> could include a parenthetical note that, if it doesn't work, try the
>> URL. After that, new users can dig through the documentation.
>
> See the attached tentative patch.
>
> From 659d79484fcd280b0ec8d57282588386aa626b21 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
> Message-ID:
> <659d79484fcd280b0ec8d57282588386aa626b21.1691049428.git.yanta...@posteo.net>
> From: Ihor Radchenko
> Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2023 10:56:07 +0300
> Subject: [PATCH] doc/org-manual.org: Refer to LaTeX docs for general
> terminology
>
> * doc/org-manual.org (LaTeX Export): Add links to online and offline
> LaTeX docs.
> (Quoting LaTeX code): Clarify that direct LaTeX can be used for
> fine-tuning.
>
> Link:
> https://orgmode.org/list/sj0pr03mb5455b2712fa85ba945dff441a2...@sj0pr03mb5455.namprd03.prod.outlook.com
> ---
> doc/org-manual.org | 14 +++---
> 1 file changed, 11 insertions(+), 3 deletions(-)
>
> diff --git a/doc/org-manual.org b/doc/org-manual.org
> index 16fbb268f..c3a4e47bc 100644
> --- a/doc/org-manual.org
> +++ b/doc/org-manual.org
> @@ -13703,6 +13703,13 @@ ** LaTeX Export
> blank lines in the Org document. That's because LaTeX itself depends
> on blank lines to tell apart syntactical elements, such as paragraphs.
>
> +The following sections expect users to be familiar with common LaTeX
> +terminology. You may refer to https://tug.org/begin.html to get
> +familiar with LaTeX basics. Users with LaTeX installed may also run
> +=texinfo latex= from terminal to open LaTeX introduction [fn:: The
I think you meant '=texdoc latex=' here.
> +command will open PDF file, which is also available for download from
Oh, also 'open a PDF file'.
> +http://mirrors.ctan.org/info/latex-doc-ptr/latex-doc-ptr.pdf]
> +
> *** LaTeX/PDF export commands
> :PROPERTIES:
> :DESCRIPTION: For producing @LaTeX{} and PDF documents.
> @@ -13979,9 +13986,10 @@ *** Quoting LaTeX code
> :DESCRIPTION: Incorporating literal @LaTeX{} code.
> :END:
>
> -The LaTeX export backend can insert any arbitrary LaTeX code, see
> -[[*Embedded LaTeX]]. There are three ways to embed such code in the Org
> -file and they all use different quoting syntax.
> +When the available LaTeX export customizations are not sufficient to
> +fine-tune the desired output, it is possible to insert any arbitrary
> +LaTeX code (see [[*Embedded LaTeX]]). There are three ways to embed such
> +code in the Org file and they all use different quoting syntax.
>
> #+cindex: inline, in @LaTeX{} export
> Inserting in-line quoted with @ symbols:
> --
> 2.41.0
Everything else looks good.
--
David Masterson
Re: New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> http://mirrors.ctan.org/info/latex-doc-ptr/latex-doc-ptr.pdf > > Other possibilities are: > https://www.tug.org/texlive/doc/texlive-en/texlive-en.html#x1-70001.5 or > https://tug.org/begin.html > > Some people may be slightly uncomfortable reading pdf-only. So, > providing an html page link might be slightly better. I think begin.html is a good starting point. Mentioning 'texdoc latex' is also simple (and more LaTeX specific) and most likely to work. You could include a parenthetical note that, if it doesn't work, try the URL. After that, new users can dig through the documentation. -- David Masterson
Re: New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
writes: > On Tue, Aug 01, 2023 at 11:28:32PM -0700, David Masterson wrote: > > [...] > >> Hmm. For me 'texdoc -l latex' in a shell showed me this: >> >> 1 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/luatex/luaotfload/luaotfload-latex.pdf >> 2 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/light-latex-make/llmk.pdf >> 3 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/latex-papersize/README >>= Readme >> 4 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/latex-git-log/README.md >> 5 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/light-latex-make/README.md.gz >> 6 >> /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/hook-pre-commit-pkg/pre-commit-latex.gz >> >> Searching around my system, I don't find the file, but all latex >> packages seem to be installed. Maybe it's not in Debian Bullseye? > > It seems to be a problem in texdoc. The file itself is there: > > tomas@trotzki:~$ apt-file search latex-doc-ptr.pdf > texlive-lang-english: > /usr/share/doc/texlive-doc/latex/latex-doc-ptr/latex-doc-ptr.pdf > > This is Bullseye, but I don't expect those things to change in Buster. Ah! That's the problem -- I didn't have texlive-lang-english installed! I also didn't know about 'apt-file search' -- useful command! 'texdoc latex' now works for me. Thanks -- David Masterson
Re: New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>>> What about >>>> >>>>http://mirrors.ctan.org/info/latex-doc-ptr/latex-doc-ptr.pdf >> >> Seems good, but maybe https://ctan.org is the true starting place. They >> can search for "latex" or look in the "Cover" dropdown for some ideas. >> I just found https://tug.org/begin.html there for getting started with >> TeX/LaTeX (which might also be good to mention). > > I am not sure. I cannot easily see beginner resources on CTAN and that > linked latex-doc-ptr.pdf does mention CTAN, alongside other useful > resources like stackexchange, learnlatex.org, and various beginner > tutorials. Okay, I agree. >>> Looks reasonable. >>> We may also link to "texdoc latex" command (the same file, but >>> locally). >> >> Didn't know about 'texdpc', but that brought up details about the >> Luaotfload package for me. Was that what you intended? > > Running texdoc latex in shell will open the same pdf file as in > http://mirrors.ctan.org/info/latex-doc-ptr/latex-doc-ptr.pdf Hmm. For me 'texdoc -l latex' in a shell showed me this: 1 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/luatex/luaotfload/luaotfload-latex.pdf 2 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/light-latex-make/llmk.pdf 3 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/latex-papersize/README = Readme 4 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/latex-git-log/README.md 5 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/light-latex-make/README.md.gz 6 /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/doc/support/hook-pre-commit-pkg/pre-commit-latex.gz Searching around my system, I don't find the file, but all latex packages seem to be installed. Maybe it's not in Debian Bullseye? If this is a general problem, then new users would have to figure out what wasn't installed (Chromebook starts with a pretty barebones Debian). Perhaps a URL is better to avoid installation issues? -- David Masterson
Re: New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > Stefan Nobis writes: > >> Ihor Radchenko writes: >> >>> I'd prefer to put some more generic reference. Some info manual or >>> good stable URL link that has explanations about kpsewhich and other >>> LaTeX basics. >> >> What about >> >>http://mirrors.ctan.org/info/latex-doc-ptr/latex-doc-ptr.pdf Seems good, but maybe https://ctan.org is the true starting place. They can search for "latex" or look in the "Cover" dropdown for some ideas. I just found https://tug.org/begin.html there for getting started with TeX/LaTeX (which might also be good to mention). > Looks reasonable. > We may also link to "texdoc latex" command (the same file, but > locally). Didn't know about 'texdpc', but that brought up details about the Luaotfload package for me. Was that what you intended? -- David Masterson
Re: New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Mentioning the (previously mentioned) 'kpsewhich' for finding what are >> the LaTex classes (etc.) to which Org can refer might be useful. From >> there, the newbie (like me) can go research what the classes can do in >> the LaTeX manuals. > > Do you have specific section of the manual in mind? I thought about it and, I think, a simple statement at the end of 13.10 (Latex Export) provides a start to help a newbie. Something like: If you have the LaTeX system installed, the 'kpsewhich' Linux command can be used to help you find where things are installed to learn if the LaTeX classes you want are already installed. In particular: kpsewhich -show-path tex This will show you the path of directories that are searched for classes and such. From there, you can use LaTeX documentation to learn more. Hmm. Perhaps only the first sentence to give people a start on where to look. What do you think? -- David Masterson
Re: New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> ... Someone should >> probably add something like this in the Org manual to help people begin >> the bridge of setup into more advanced LaTex while using Org (maybe it's >> there already?). > > It will not be productive to explain LaTeX in the Org manual. There are > whole books dedicated to various aspects of LaTeX out there. > > The best we can do it pointing users to some resources about TeX or to > the existence of such resources. Agreed. I was only suggesting a tidbit on how Org connects to LaTeX, but, looking further at the docs, I think it is already covered. Mentioning the (previously mentioned) 'kpsewhich' for finding what are the LaTex classes (etc.) to which Org can refer might be useful. From there, the newbie (like me) can go research what the classes can do in the LaTeX manuals. -- David Masterson
Re: New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
Stefan Nobis writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> I want to install a resume document class for LaTex > > There are the variables org-latex-classes and org-latex-default-class > on the Org side, but that's only about some structural metadata (how > to map Org headline levels to LaTeX structure macros). > > To find the new class file you have to put it into a folder where > LaTeX will find it. Org just puts the name of the class into the TeX > file and everything else is up to LaTeX. > > Usually, on Unix systems, there is the optional hierarchy $HOME/texmf > where you can store you private, local files. It is a good idea to > mimic the usual TeX directory structure, therefore class and style > files for LaTeX should go into $HOME/texmf/tex/latex (you may add > subdirectories there). > > Nowadays it should suffice to just drop your class file there and > everything should work on the LaTeX side. > > A quick check whether LaTeX will be able to find the file could be > done with the tool kpsewhich: > > kpsewhich myltxclass.cls > > This tool uses the same configuration and search algorithms for the > files as the TeX engines. So if kpsewhich finds the file, the engines > should find it too. > > One side note: On macOS the default path for the user texmf tree is > $HOME/Library/texmf. On all systems you may find the correct base > directory for the user texmf tree with the command > > kpsewhich -var-value TEXMFHOME > > Hope this helps. Thank you. This is very helpful for a newbie like me. Someone should probably add something like this in the Org manual to help people begin the bridge of setup into more advanced LaTex while using Org (maybe it's there already?). -- David Masterson
New Orgmode LaTex Document Class ?
I want to install a resume document class for LaTex so that I can (more easily) write good looking resumes from Org. I think I see how to identify the new document class to Org (org-latex-classes), but I'm not sure if that tells Org *where* the new document class is. Do I have to install the .cls file somewhere (where?) in my LaTex installation (TexLive) or can it be referenced elsewhere (like $HOME/tex) by proper configuration of an Org variable? I'm not a LaTex user -- this is my first attempt to add something to LaTex that I can then leverage in Org, -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> I used C-c C-a to attach my patch to the message for you. I was looking >> for the reverse to pull your patch out. When I read the message, the >> patch was inlined, so I wasn't seeing any buttons(?) to pull it out with >> and the Mime command didn't seem to do anything, so I thought I was >> looking in the wrong. The patch showed in diff-mode. > > It may depend on what you are using to view the patch. In notmuch, > there is `notmuch-show-save-part' and `notmuch-save-attachments'. In > Gnus, there is `notmuch-show-save-part'. Hmm. I think notmuch is non-standard. I was using gnus. -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes:
> In message-mode:
>
> C-c C-a runs the command mml-attach-file (found in message-mode-map),
> which is an autoloaded interactive native-compiled Lisp function in
> ‘mml.el’.
I used C-c C-a to attach my patch to the message for you. I was looking
for the reverse to pull your patch out. When I read the message, the
patch was inlined, so I wasn't seeing any buttons(?) to pull it out with
and the Mime command didn't seem to do anything, so I thought I was
looking in the wrong. The patch showed in diff-mode.
> I left the incorrectly spelled 'timerange' cindex entry on purpose.
> In Org, we have variables `org-agenda-timerange-leaders' and
> `org-agenda-remove-timeranges-from-blocks'. So, in Info-mode, some
> people may search index for 'timerange' instead of 'time range'. Again,
> the purpose is helping searchability.
>
> I now applied to patch onto main.
> https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=d50956e48
Thank you.
> Not exactly. There is git command to find total number of changed LOCs:
>
> <https://github.com/yantar92/emacs-config/blob/master/config.org#detect-fsf-contribution-status-of-sender-for-org-ml>
> (shell-command-to-string
>(format "cd ~/Git/org-mode/; git log --author=\"%s\"
> --pretty=tformat: --numstat main | gawk '{ add += $1; subs += $2; loc += $1 -
> $2 } END { printf \"+l: %%s -l: %%s total: %%s\", add, subs, loc }' -"
>(downcase (if (string-match-p email all-committers)
> email sender
Whoa.
> However, it will count all the LOCs, not just non-trivial.
> By raw number of LOCs, your patch is indeed over 15LOC. However, part of
> the patch is my text or syncing org-manual and org-guide texts. Those
> changes are trivial.
>
> So, I judged that the patch is still acceptable without FSF assignment.
> But it will be the limit.
Understood.
--
David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Ihor Radchenko writes: >> >>> May you please re-create the patch for the current main? >> >> Ok. See below. > > Thanks! > See the attached final draft. What's the command to save the attachment? It doesn't look like a mime attachment to me, > I amended removals of cindex entries in the manual - redundancy will not > hurt here (for better searchability). If they've got a purpose, that's fine. > I also slightly adjusted the wording and fixed list indentation in > one of description list items. One minor note -- I think of datestamp & timestamp as one word each while 'date range' & 'time range' are two words each. Unless you've got other reasons, I'd follow this convention. I think I see one 'cindex' that has 'timerange'. > Finally, I detailed all the changes in the commit message and added > TINYCHANGE cookie. Thanks. This is a good example for me. > Let me know if you are ok with this version. It looks good except for the minor note above. > Please note that with this patch your total contribution is approaching > non-trivial 15LOC. Further patches will require FSF copyright > assignment. You got the number via some 'git' command?? If I get to doing more, I will do the copyright assignment -- I just never thought I'd make much changes. -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
n:19]. A timestamp can appear anywhere in -the headline or body of an Org tree entry. Its presence causes -entries to be shown on specific dates in the agenda (see [[*Weekly/daily -agenda]]). We distinguish: +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or +a range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=[fn:19]. +A timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree +entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates in +the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: - Plain timestamp; Event; Appointment :: @@ -6011,13 +6014,16 @@ agenda]]). We distinguish: A simple timestamp just assigns a date/time to an item. This is just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper agenda. In the agenda display, the headline of an entry associated with - a plain timestamp is shown exactly on that date. + a plain timestamp is shown exactly on that date. There can be multiple timestamps in an item. #+begin_example ,* Meet Peter at the movies <2006-11-01 Wed 19:15> ,* Discussion on climate change -<2006-11-02 Thu> +<2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> + ,* My days off +<2006-11-03 Fri> +<2006-11-06 Mon> #+end_example - Timestamp with repeater interval :: @@ -6053,24 +6059,31 @@ agenda]]). We distinguish: <%%(diary-float t 4 2)> #+end_example +- Time range :: +#+cindex time range + +Time range is a timestamp having two time units connected by =-= + +#+begin_example +,* Discussion on climate change + <2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> +#+end_example + - Time/Date range :: - #+cindex: timerange + #+cindex: time range #+cindex: date range Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. In the agenda, the headline is shown on the first and last day of the range, and on any - dates that are displayed and fall in the range. Here is an example: + dates that are displayed and fall in the range. The first example + specifies just the dates of the range while the second example + specifies a time range for each date. #+begin_example ,** Meeting in Amsterdam <2004-08-23 Mon>--<2004-08-26 Thu> - #+end_example - - Timerange is a timestamp consisting of two time units connected by =-= - - #+begin_example - ,* Discussion on climate change - <2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> + ,** This weeks committee meetings + <2004-08-23 Mon 10:00-11:00>--<2004-08-26 Thu 10:00-11:00> #+end_example - Inactive timestamp :: -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with a date >> -and/or a time. The specially formatted string carrying the date and >> +and/or a time purposes like when an event happens, a deadline for a >> +task, or tracking time spent on a task as described in later sections >> +of this chapter. The specially formatted string carrying the date and >> time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. > > What about: > > To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with a date > and/or a time. The specially formatted string carrying the date and > time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. This may be > a little confusing because timestamp is often used as indicating when > something was created or last changed. However, in Org mode this term > is used in a much wider sense. > > Timestamps can be used to plan appointments, schedule tasks, set > deadlines, track time, and more. The following sections describe > the timestamp format and tooling that Org mode provides for common > use cases dealing with time and time intervals. I agree with your change. I'm often minimalist in my changes (especially when I'm trying not to rock the boat), but that's not always good. If that's it, make the change in both files and we can call it a day. :-) -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: >> To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with a date >> -and/or a time. The specially formatted string carrying the date and >> +and/or a time for purposes like a timestamp on an event, a deadline >> +for a task, or clocking time on a task as described in later sections >> +of this chapter. The specially formatted string carrying the date and >> time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. > > IMHO, this is just creating confusion. > Remember that this manual/guide is going to be read by people who are > not yet familiar with Org mode terminology. What is "timestamp on an > event"? What if you put a timestamp on a non-event? What is "clocking > time"? Ok. I did use "like". ;-) I don't want to get too in the weeds (because I don't know it all), so how about: ... purposes like when an event happens, a deadline for a task, or tracking time spent on a task ... >>A simple timestamp just assigns a date/time to an item. This is >>just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper agenda. >> + There can be multiple timestamps in an event. > > Why event? What about tasks? Can just use more general "heading" or "entry". Good point. The paragraph already used 'item' -- would that be better? New patch file attached: Change log: Doc change to explain timestamps better doc/org-guide.org (Dates and Times): purpose of timestamp + examples doc/org-manual.org (Dates and Times): purpose of timestamp + examples diff --git a/doc/org-guide.org b/doc/org-guide.org index 95828e4c0..e033ac0d9 100644 --- a/doc/org-guide.org +++ b/doc/org-guide.org @@ -1080,7 +1080,9 @@ Tags and Properties]]. :END: To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with a date -and/or a time. The specially formatted string carrying the date and +and/or a time purposes like when an event happens, a deadline for a +task, or tracking time spent on a task as described in later sections +of this chapter. The specially formatted string carrying the date and time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. ** Timestamps @@ -1099,20 +1101,24 @@ the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: A simple timestamp just assigns a date/time to an item. This is just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper agenda. + There can be multiple timestamps in an item. #+begin_example ,* Meet Peter at the movies <2006-11-01 Wed 19:15> ,* Discussion on climate change <2006-11-02 Thu 20:00-22:00> + ,* My days off +<2006-11-03 Fri> +<2006-11-06 Mon> #+end_example - Timestamp with repeater interval :: A timestamp may contain a /repeater interval/, indicating that it - applies not only on the given date, but again and again after - a certain interval of N days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or years - (y). The following shows up in the agenda every Wednesday: + applies not only on the given date, but again and again after a + certain interval of N hours (h), days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or + years (y). The following shows up in the agenda every Wednesday: #+begin_example ,* Pick up Sam at school @@ -1121,8 +1127,6 @@ the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: - Diary-style expression entries :: - #+cindex: diary style timestamps - #+cindex: sexp timestamps For more complex date specifications, Org mode supports using the special expression diary entries implemented in the Emacs Calendar package. For example, with optional time: @@ -1132,13 +1136,28 @@ the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: <%%(diary-float t 4 2)> #+end_example +- Time range + + Time range is a timestamp having two time units connected by =-= + + #+begin_example + ,* Discussion on climate change +<2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> + #+end_example + - Time/Date range :: - Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. + Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. In the agenda, the + headline is shown on the first and last day of the range, and on any + dates that are displayed and fall in the range. The first example + specifies just the dates of the range while the second example + specifies a time range for each date. #+begin_example ,** Meeting in Amsterdam <2004-08-23 Mon>--<2004-08-26 Thu> + ,** This weeks committee meetings + <2004-08-23 Mon 10:00-11:00>--<2004-08-26 Thu 10:00-11:00> #+end_example - Inactive timestamp :: diff --git a/doc/org-manual.org b/doc/org-manual.org index c11694849..71f52fac6 100644 --- a/doc/org-manual.org +++ b/doc/org-manual.org @@ -5978,14 +5978,15 @@ or a dynamic block. #+cindex: dates #+cindex: times #+cindex: timesta
Re: Is this proper time format?
nywhere in -the headline or body of an Org tree entry. Its presence causes -entries to be shown on specific dates in the agenda (see [[*Weekly/daily -agenda]]). We distinguish: +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or +a range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=[fn:19]. +A timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree +entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates in +the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: - Plain timestamp; Event; Appointment :: @@ -6011,13 +6011,16 @@ agenda]]). We distinguish: A simple timestamp just assigns a date/time to an item. This is just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper agenda. In the agenda display, the headline of an entry associated with - a plain timestamp is shown exactly on that date. + a plain timestamp is shown exactly on that date. There can be multiple timestamps in an event. #+begin_example ,* Meet Peter at the movies <2006-11-01 Wed 19:15> ,* Discussion on climate change -<2006-11-02 Thu> +<2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> + ,* My days off +<2006-11-03 Fri> +<2006-11-06 Mon> #+end_example - Timestamp with repeater interval :: @@ -6053,24 +6056,31 @@ agenda]]). We distinguish: <%%(diary-float t 4 2)> #+end_example +- Time range :: +#+cindex time range + +Time range is a timestamp having two time units connected by =-= + +#+begin_example +,* Discussion on climate change + <2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> +#+end_example + - Time/Date range :: - #+cindex: timerange + #+cindex: time range #+cindex: date range Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. In the agenda, the headline is shown on the first and last day of the range, and on any - dates that are displayed and fall in the range. Here is an example: + dates that are displayed and fall in the range. The first example + specifies just the dates of the range while the second example + specifies a time range for each date. #+begin_example ,** Meeting in Amsterdam <2004-08-23 Mon>--<2004-08-26 Thu> - #+end_example - - Timerange is a timestamp consisting of two time units connected by =-= - - #+begin_example - ,* Discussion on climate change - <2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> + ,** This weeks committee meetings + <2004-08-23 Mon 10:00-11:00>--<2004-08-26 Thu 10:00-11:00> #+end_example - Inactive timestamp :: -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>>> -To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with a date >>>> -and/or a time. The specially formatted string carrying the date and >>>> -time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. >>>> +To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with dates >>>> +and/or times for purposes described in this chapter. The specially >>>> +formatted string carrying the date and time information is called a >>>> +/timestamp/ in Org mode. >>> >>> What is the purpose of this change? The updated sentence is rather >>> confusing, IMHO. >> >> Mostly changing the statement from singular to plural to imply that more >> than one timestamp can be in a TODO item (SCHEDULED, DEADLINE, multiple >> plain timestamps) w/o directly mentioning how (leave that for later >> examples in the chapter). > > I am mostly questioning "for purposes described in this chapter". > All the TODO items can be labelled with multiple dates/times, not just in > "this chapter". I see. I'm trying to say that the rest of this chapter describes how, where and why you would use dates/times in an Org file. For example, the Timestamps subchapter describes what a timestamp looks like and that it can be used in any header or paragraph in an Org file and how the timestamp affects the agenda. >>>> +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or a >>>> +range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or >>>> +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. A >>>> +timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree >>>> +entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific >>>> +dates/times in the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We >>>> +distinguish: >>> >>> This is not accurate. Only date is considered by agenda. Not time. >>> Time can be displayed, but has no effect (by default) on whether an >>> entry appears in the agenda or not. >> >> In testing, I found the following: >> >> * TODO summer school >> <2023-06-05 Mon 10:30-12:15>--<2023-06-08 Thu 10:30-12:15> >> >> ... >> Is this being done by an add-on package? I have these, but most of them >> are not setup: > > No. I meant that presence of time has no effect on whether an entry > appear in agenda or not. Once agenda decides that an entry should > appear, the time is taken into account when formatting the display. > > You modified the manual to "Its presence causes entries to be shown on > specific dates/times in the agenda". There is no concept of "shown on > specific time" in agenda views. Just "shown on specific day". I think I see what you're saying. I'm fine with dropping "/times". >>>> - Timestamp with repeater interval :: >>>> >>>>A timestamp may contain a /repeater interval/, indicating that it >>>> - applies not only on the given date, but again and again after >>>> - a certain interval of N days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or years >>>> - (y). The following shows up in the agenda every Wednesday: >>>> + applies not only on the given date, but again and again after a >>>> + certain interval of N hours (h), days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or >>>> + years (y). The following shows up in the agenda every week at the >>>> + given day of the week and time: >>> >>> I miss the point here. You changed the last sentence to mention time, >>> but the "following" example does not specify the time (<%%(diary-float t 4 >>> 2)>). >> >> I think you're looking at the patch file, so you're not seeing the line >> before the 'diary' line which has a time of 22:00-23:00 on it. I don't >> use 'diary-float', so did I misinterpret the example? If so, drop the >> "and time". The main purpose was to add in "hours" after N. > > "22:00-23:00" has no relation to timestamps. > Agenda still accounts for it because of > `org-agenda-search-headline-for-time', but this part of the manual is > talking about timestamps, not agenda extras. The diary timestamp does > not set the time. Ah, then just drop the "and time" change. -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> -To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with a date >> -and/or a time. The specially formatted string carrying the date and >> -time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. >> +To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with dates >> +and/or times for purposes described in this chapter. The specially >> +formatted string carrying the date and time information is called a >> +/timestamp/ in Org mode. > > What is the purpose of this change? The updated sentence is rather > confusing, IMHO. Mostly changing the statement from singular to plural to imply that more than one timestamp can be in a TODO item (SCHEDULED, DEADLINE, multiple plain timestamps) w/o directly mentioning how (leave that for later examples in the chapter). >> ** Timestamps >> :PROPERTIES: >> :DESCRIPTION: Assigning a time to a tree entry. >> :END: >> +#+cindex: timestamps >> +#+cindex: ranges, time >> +#+cindex: deadlines >> +#+cindex: scheduling > > We do not need cindex and other index keywords in org-guide. There are a couple in the diary timestamp section already, but this can be dropped if wrong. >> -A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or >> -a range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or >> -=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. >> -A timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree >> -entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates in >> -the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: >> +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or a >> +range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or >> +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. A >> +timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree >> +entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific >> +dates/times in the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We >> +distinguish: > > This is not accurate. Only date is considered by agenda. Not time. > Time can be displayed, but has no effect (by default) on whether an > entry appears in the agenda or not. In testing, I found the following: * TODO summer school <2023-06-05 Mon 10:30-12:15>--<2023-06-08 Thu 10:30-12:15> This shows in my timegrid agenda for the week for Mon, Tue, Wed, & Thu on the specified time range. Interestingly, each agenda item had a "(n/4)" on it (n=1 to 4). Also, if you mark any of the 4 as DONE, then all change to DONE (which you kind of expect for this style). Is this being done by an add-on package? I have these, but most of them are not setup: org-ac-20170401.1307 org-books-20210408.1913 org-brain-20230217.1908 org-contacts-1.1 org-download-20220906.1929 org-edna-1.1.2 org-emms-20230515.1838 org-noter-20230605.323 org-noter-pdftools-20220320.300 org-pdftools-20220320.301 org-ql-20230525.1548 org-super-agenda-20220826.2315 org-vcard-2022.328 >> -<2006-11-02 Thu 20:00-22:00> >> +<2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> > > I do not mind, but wondering why you changed the time interval. It seemed strange to have a meeting so late at night. ;-) >> - Timestamp with repeater interval :: >> >>A timestamp may contain a /repeater interval/, indicating that it >> - applies not only on the given date, but again and again after >> - a certain interval of N days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or years >> - (y). The following shows up in the agenda every Wednesday: >> + applies not only on the given date, but again and again after a >> + certain interval of N hours (h), days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or >> + years (y). The following shows up in the agenda every week at the >> + given day of the week and time: > > I miss the point here. You changed the last sentence to mention time, > but the "following" example does not specify the time (<%%(diary-float t 4 > 2)>). I think you're looking at the patch file, so you're not seeing the line before the 'diary' line which has a time of 22:00-23:00 on it. I don't use 'diary-float', so did I misinterpret the example? If so, drop the "and time". The main purpose was to add in "hours" after N. -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Thank you. I haven't "patched" anything on Savannah and assumed I might >> have to do the GNU copyright assignment. For this, I thought it would >> be easy for you. > > Yes and no. One of the things you get to do when creating a proper patch > is commit message describing the changes in detail. This helps to review > your own changes and often helps with silly typos. Is there a form/example for a proper commit message? -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>>> Maybe I'm not explicit enough. In section 8.1 of the Org 9.6 manual is >>>> a subsection "Time/Date Range" that *implies* times are supported in >>>> ranges by the use of words "time" and "timestamp" when, above, you're >>>> saying they are undefined (unsupported?) for now. I'm merely saying >>>> adjust the manual to remove the implication. >>> >>> Please check the manual from main branch of Org. It has more text: >> >> I disagree. I cloned Org from Savannah and made the attached patch >> file from the main branch. First time for me attaching a file to a >> message. Does it work for you? > > Yes. Though it would be better to attach the diff with proper (.diff or > .patch) extension. I've updated my patch file taking into account what you mentioned and what I tested. Does this look all right? diff --git a/doc/org-guide.org b/doc/org-guide.org index 95828e4c0..12a1f0126 100644 --- a/doc/org-guide.org +++ b/doc/org-guide.org @@ -1079,40 +1079,51 @@ Tags and Properties]]. :DESCRIPTION: Making items useful for planning. :END: -To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with a date -and/or a time. The specially formatted string carrying the date and -time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. +To assist project planning, TODO items can be labeled with dates +and/or times for purposes described in this chapter. The specially +formatted string carrying the date and time information is called a +/timestamp/ in Org mode. ** Timestamps :PROPERTIES: :DESCRIPTION: Assigning a time to a tree entry. :END: +#+cindex: timestamps +#+cindex: ranges, time +#+cindex: deadlines +#+cindex: scheduling -A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or -a range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or -=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. -A timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree -entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates in -the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or a +range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. A +timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree +entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific +dates/times in the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We +distinguish: - Plain timestamp; Event; Appointment :: A simple timestamp just assigns a date/time to an item. This is - just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper agenda. + just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper + agenda. There can be multiple timestamps in an event. #+begin_example ,* Meet Peter at the movies <2006-11-01 Wed 19:15> ,* Discussion on climate change -<2006-11-02 Thu 20:00-22:00> +<2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> + ,* My days off +<2006-11-03 Fri> +<2006-11-06 Mon> #+end_example - Timestamp with repeater interval :: A timestamp may contain a /repeater interval/, indicating that it - applies not only on the given date, but again and again after - a certain interval of N days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or years - (y). The following shows up in the agenda every Wednesday: + applies not only on the given date, but again and again after a + certain interval of N hours (h), days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or + years (y). The following shows up in the agenda every week at the + given day of the week and time: #+begin_example ,* Pick up Sam at school @@ -1123,6 +1134,7 @@ the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: #+cindex: diary style timestamps #+cindex: sexp timestamps + For more complex date specifications, Org mode supports using the special expression diary entries implemented in the Emacs Calendar package. For example, with optional time: @@ -1132,13 +1144,24 @@ the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: <%%(diary-float t 4 2)> #+end_example +- Time range :: + + Time range is a timestamp consisting of two time units connected by =-= + + #+begin_example + ,* Discussion on climate change + <2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> + #+end_example + - Time/Date range :: - Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. + Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. The first example specifies just the dates of the range while the second specifies particular times during the dates. #+begin_example ,** Meeting in Amsterdam <2004-08-23 Mon>--<2004-08-26 Thu> + ,** This weeks committee meetings + &l
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>>> Maybe I'm not explicit enough. In section 8.1 of the Org 9.6 manual is >>>> a subsection "Time/Date Range" that *implies* times are supported in >>>> ranges by the use of words "time" and "timestamp" when, above, you're >>>> saying they are undefined (unsupported?) for now. I'm merely saying >>>> adjust the manual to remove the implication. >>> >>> Please check the manual from main branch of Org. It has more text: >> >> I disagree. I cloned Org from Savannah and made the attached patch >> file from the main branch. First time for me attaching a file to a >> message. Does it work for you? > > Yes. Though it would be better to attach the diff with proper (.diff or > .patch) extension. I hope you saw that I provided a "patch,txt" file in a following message (forgot about the naming convention -- been a long time...) > Even better would be providing commit message and formatting the patch > properly. See https://orgmode.org/worg/org-contribute.html#first-patch > Not mandatory though - I can format things properly on your behalf. Thank you. I haven't "patched" anything on Savannah and assumed I might have to do the GNU copyright assignment. For this, I thought it would be easy for you. >> - Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. >> + Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a date range. NOTE: time is >> + not specified in these timestamps -- just dates, > > I'd avoid this NOTE. Time is actually allowed, but agenda does nothing > with it. But only agenda. The rest of Org will handle date ranges like > <2023-06-10 Sat 14:00>--<2023-06-12 Mon 18:00> correctly. > >> -#+cindex: timestamps >> -#+cindex: ranges, time >> -#+cindex: date stamps >> -#+cindex: deadlines >> -#+cindex: scheduling > > Is there any particular reason why you removed index entries here and > further in the diff? No, there isn't. I think what happened here is that I noticed section 8.1 in org-guide and org-manual were almost (but not quite) the same. I assumed (incorrectly?) that they were supposed to be the same, but got out of sync. So I made my patch to org-guide and then replaced section 8.1 in org-manual with the one from org-guide. I think these "cindex" statements got dropped because of that. If they are important in org-manual, but not org-guide, then please put them back. >>A timestamp may contain a /repeater interval/, indicating that it >>applies not only on the given date, but again and again after >> - a certain interval of N hours (h), days (d), weeks (w), months (m), >> - or years (y). The following shows up in the agenda every Wednesday: >> + a certain interval of N days (d), weeks (w), months (m), or years >> + (y). The following shows up in the agenda every Wednesday: > > Why did you remove hours? Oh! Another difference between org-guide and org-manual that came over in trying to resync the two. >>For more complex date specifications, Org mode supports using the >> - special expression diary entries implemented in the >> - [[info:emacs#Special Diary Entries][Emacs Calendar package]][fn:20]. >> - For example, with optional time: >> + special expression diary entries implemented in the Emacs Calendar >> + package. For example, with optional time: > > Why did you remove the links and the footnote? Again, another diff between org-guide and org-manual, :-\ I'm relooking at this patch. Testing finds that these work in the timegrid agenda as expected: * <2023-02-03 Thu 10:00-11:00>--<2023-02-04 Fri 10:00-11:00> ** Can't mark one done -- you have to mark them all done *** Kind of expected for this form * <2023-02-03 Thu 10:00-11:00 +1d> ** Can you limit the number of repeats? If so, how? ** Marking it DONE removes current one from agenda *** reasonable I have to rethink section 8.1. With the above in mind, 8.1 is not quite right, but it's more subtle than I thought. Not sure how in the weeds it should get for a user's manual. -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> "Timestamp" is the general term we use. We make it explicit in the >>> parent section that timestamps may or may not have time specification: >>> >>> A timestamp is a specification of a date (possibly with a time) in a >>> special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or >>> =<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= >> >> Maybe I'm not explicit enough. In section 8.1 of the Org 9.6 manual is >> a subsection "Time/Date Range" that *implies* times are supported in >> ranges by the use of words "time" and "timestamp" when, above, you're >> saying they are undefined (unsupported?) for now. I'm merely saying >> adjust the manual to remove the implication. > > Please check the manual from main branch of Org. It has more text: Shouldn't have inlined the attachment -- here it is as an attachment. Again, this is a patch to the main branch of Org on Savannah. diff --git a/doc/org-guide.org b/doc/org-guide.org index 95828e4c0..167f62e49 100644 --- a/doc/org-guide.org +++ b/doc/org-guide.org @@ -1088,12 +1088,12 @@ time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. :DESCRIPTION: Assigning a time to a tree entry. :END: -A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or -a range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or -=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. -A timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree -entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates in -the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or a +range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. One or +more timestamps can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org +tree entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates +in the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: - Plain timestamp; Event; Appointment :: @@ -1132,15 +1132,25 @@ the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: <%%(diary-float t 4 2)> #+end_example -- Time/Date range :: +- Date range :: - Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. + Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a date range. NOTE: time is + not specified in these timestamps -- just dates, #+begin_example ,** Meeting in Amsterdam <2004-08-23 Mon>--<2004-08-26 Thu> #+end_example +- Time range :: + + Two times in a timestamp connected by =-= denote a time range. + + #+begin_example + ,** Planning meeting + <2004-08-23 Mon 9:00-10:00> + #+end_example + - Inactive timestamp :: Just like a plain timestamp, but with square brackets instead of diff --git a/doc/org-manual.org b/doc/org-manual.org index c11694849..824a46eaf 100644 --- a/doc/org-manual.org +++ b/doc/org-manual.org @@ -5991,42 +5991,32 @@ is used in a much wider sense. :PROPERTIES: :DESCRIPTION: Assigning a time to a tree entry. :END: -#+cindex: timestamps -#+cindex: ranges, time -#+cindex: date stamps -#+cindex: deadlines -#+cindex: scheduling - -A timestamp is a specification of a date (possibly with a time) in a -special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or -=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>=[fn:19]. A timestamp can appear anywhere in -the headline or body of an Org tree entry. Its presence causes -entries to be shown on specific dates in the agenda (see [[*Weekly/daily -agenda]]). We distinguish: + +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or a +range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. One or +more timestamps can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org +tree entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates +in the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: - Plain timestamp; Event; Appointment :: - #+cindex: timestamp - #+cindex: appointment A simple timestamp just assigns a date/time to an item. This is just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper agenda. - In the agenda display, the headline of an entry associated with - a plain timestamp is shown exactly on that date. #+begin_example ,* Meet Peter at the movies <2006-11-01 Wed 19:15> ,* Discussion on climate change -<2006-11-02 Thu> +<2006-11-02 Thu 20:00-22:00> #+end_example - Timestamp with repeater interval :: - #+cindex: timestamp, with repeater interval A timestamp may contain a /repeater interval/, indicating that it applies not only on the given date, but again and again after - a certai
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> "Timestamp" is the general term we use. We make it explicit in the >>> parent section that timestamps may or may not have time specification: >>> >>> A timestamp is a specification of a date (possibly with a time) in a >>> special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or >>> =<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= >> >> Maybe I'm not explicit enough. In section 8.1 of the Org 9.6 manual is >> a subsection "Time/Date Range" that *implies* times are supported in >> ranges by the use of words "time" and "timestamp" when, above, you're >> saying they are undefined (unsupported?) for now. I'm merely saying >> adjust the manual to remove the implication. > > Please check the manual from main branch of Org. It has more text: I disagree. I cloned Org from Savannah and made the attached patch file from the main branch. First time for me attaching a file to a message. Does it work for you? diff --git a/doc/org-guide.org b/doc/org-guide.org index 95828e4c0..167f62e49 100644 --- a/doc/org-guide.org +++ b/doc/org-guide.org @@ -1088,12 +1088,12 @@ time information is called a /timestamp/ in Org mode. :DESCRIPTION: Assigning a time to a tree entry. :END: -A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or -a range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or -=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. -A timestamp can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org tree -entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates in -the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or a +range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. One or +more timestamps can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org +tree entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates +in the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: - Plain timestamp; Event; Appointment :: @@ -1132,15 +1132,25 @@ the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: <%%(diary-float t 4 2)> #+end_example -- Time/Date range :: +- Date range :: - Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a range. + Two timestamps connected by =--= denote a date range. NOTE: time is + not specified in these timestamps -- just dates, #+begin_example ,** Meeting in Amsterdam <2004-08-23 Mon>--<2004-08-26 Thu> #+end_example +- Time range :: + + Two times in a timestamp connected by =-= denote a time range. + + #+begin_example + ,** Planning meeting + <2004-08-23 Mon 9:00-10:00> + #+end_example + - Inactive timestamp :: Just like a plain timestamp, but with square brackets instead of diff --git a/doc/org-manual.org b/doc/org-manual.org index c11694849..824a46eaf 100644 --- a/doc/org-manual.org +++ b/doc/org-manual.org @@ -5991,42 +5991,32 @@ is used in a much wider sense. :PROPERTIES: :DESCRIPTION: Assigning a time to a tree entry. :END: -#+cindex: timestamps -#+cindex: ranges, time -#+cindex: date stamps -#+cindex: deadlines -#+cindex: scheduling - -A timestamp is a specification of a date (possibly with a time) in a -special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or -=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>=[fn:19]. A timestamp can appear anywhere in -the headline or body of an Org tree entry. Its presence causes -entries to be shown on specific dates in the agenda (see [[*Weekly/daily -agenda]]). We distinguish: + +A timestamp is a specification of a date---possibly with a time or a +range of times---in a special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or +=<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= or =<2003-09-16 Tue 12:00-12:30>=. One or +more timestamps can appear anywhere in the headline or body of an Org +tree entry. Its presence causes entries to be shown on specific dates +in the agenda (see [[*The Weekly/Daily Agenda]]). We distinguish: - Plain timestamp; Event; Appointment :: - #+cindex: timestamp - #+cindex: appointment A simple timestamp just assigns a date/time to an item. This is just like writing down an appointment or event in a paper agenda. - In the agenda display, the headline of an entry associated with - a plain timestamp is shown exactly on that date. #+begin_example ,* Meet Peter at the movies <2006-11-01 Wed 19:15> ,* Discussion on climate change -<2006-11-02 Thu> +<2006-11-02 Thu 20:00-22:00> #+end_example - Timestamp with repeater interval :: - #+cindex: timestamp, with repeater interval A timestamp may contain a /repeater interval/, indicating that it applies not only on the given date, but aga
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> AFAIK, closed date intervals with time are currently not supported by >>> org-agenda. You can instead use diary sexp timestamps, a bunch of active >>> timestamps in the body, or M-x org-clone-subtree-with-time-shift >> >> "a bunch of active timestamps"?!? Ooh! I hadn't gotten the impression >> that that was allowed from the "Dates and Times" section of the manual. >> It always talked about "a timestamp" and it made sense to me that a task >> would only have one timestamp. Can a statement be added to the manual >> to make this explicit? > > How about the attached patch? I think that's good, but... >> By closed date interval, I assume you mean "--". That is >> mentioned in 8.1 of the manual. It's header is "Time/Date range", but it >> only talks about dates (no times) including in the example. > > Handling of date intervals when TIME1/2 have time specifications is > undefined behaviour for now. And I am not in favour of making it defined - > we may consider using this semantics to define repeater intervals with > end date in future. That would allow what you attempted to do in the > original email, but using <2023-06-05 Mon 10:30-12:15>--<2023-06-08 Thu> > semantics. See https://orgmode.org/list/877cxp1fbx.fsf@localhost > >> If times are allowed, then the paragraph could include a time example. >> If not, then the header should be changed and "timestamp" should be >> changed to "datestamp". > > No. The same section talks about time range: <2006-11-02 Thu 10:00-12:00> > > "Timestamp" is the general term we use. We make it explicit in the > parent section that timestamps may or may not have time specification: > > A timestamp is a specification of a date (possibly with a time) in a > special format, either =<2003-09-16 Tue>= or > =<2003-09-16 Tue 09:39>= Maybe I'm not explicit enough. In section 8.1 of the Org 9.6 manual is a subsection "Time/Date Range" that *implies* times are supported in ranges by the use of words "time" and "timestamp" when, above, you're saying they are undefined (unsupported?) for now. I'm merely saying adjust the manual to remove the implication. -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Samuel Wales writes: > On 6/6/23, David Masterson wrote: >>Ooh! I hadn't gotten the impression >> that that was allowed from the "Dates and Times" section of the manual. > > thre exists org-agenda-skip-additional-timestamps-same-entry thanks -- I hadn't seen that before. -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Hmm. What about this: >> >> <2023-06-05 Mon>--<2023-06-08 Thu 10:30-12:15> >> >> Is there a recommended specification for my meeting? Or do I have to >> break it into multiple tasks (one for each day)? > > AFAIK, closed date intervals with time are currently not supported by > org-agenda. You can instead use diary sexp timestamps, a bunch of active > timestamps in the body, or M-x org-clone-subtree-with-time-shift "a bunch of active timestamps"?!? Ooh! I hadn't gotten the impression that that was allowed from the "Dates and Times" section of the manual. It always talked about "a timestamp" and it made sense to me that a task would only have one timestamp. Can a statement be added to the manual to make this explicit? By closed date interval, I assume you mean "--". That is mentioned in 8.1 of the manual. It's header is "Time/Date range", but it only talks about dates (no times) including in the example. If times are allowed, then the paragraph could include a time example. If not, then the header should be changed and "timestamp" should be changed to "datestamp". -- David Masterson
Re: org-mode for package documentation
Björn Bidar writes: > Philip Kaludercic writes: > >> Christopher Dimech writes: >> >>> Dear Compeers, >>> >>> Some months ago there had been a discussion about using org-mode >>> to produce package documentation. Which would allow the use of >>> Latex3 (e.g. use of colour, floating images). >> >> Where/when did this happen? Could you provide a few pointers? > > I don't know exactly but when use-package was merged into Emacs there > were discussions if keeping the documentation in org-mode format is > fine. > > From what I understood it is possible. Org-mode can export to Texinfo/Info. All that's needed is proper conventions for writing the document such that it's compatible with Info). -- David Masterson
Re: Is this proper time format?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> I have a meeting for this week from 10:30-12:15 M-Th. Can I represent >> that this way? >> >> <2023-06-05 Mon 10:30-12:15>--<2023-06-08 Thu 10:30-12:15> > > No. > >> Is this a valid date/time? > > It is valid in current parser implementation, but it is not what you > expect. The first time range is ignored. Hmm. What about this: <2023-06-05 Mon>--<2023-06-08 Thu 10:30-12:15> Is there a recommended specification for my meeting? Or do I have to break it into multiple tasks (one for each day)? Anyone know how well BeOrg, Orgzly, and Organice handle this? -- David Masterson
Is this proper time format?
I have a meeting for this week from 10:30-12:15 M-Th. Can I represent that this way? <2023-06-05 Mon 10:30-12:15>--<2023-06-08 Thu 10:30-12:15> Is this a valid date/time? -- David Masterson
Re: Suggestion: Link to Diary docs (was Re: Limiting a repeating timestamp) ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Could I suggest adding a link to the Diary documentation in Emacs that >> discusses what a "diary sexp-style timestamp" looks like? Perhaps put it >> in 8.1 Timestamps? > > Sure. Done, on bugfix. > https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=56dd046d Thanks. -- David Masterson
Suggestion: Link to Diary docs (was Re: Limiting a repeating timestamp) ?
Ihor Radchenko writes: > Mark Barton writes: > Note that you can exclude holidays automatically using `org-class' in > diary sexp-style timestamps. Could I suggest adding a link to the Diary documentation in Emacs that discusses what a "diary sexp-style timestamp" looks like? Perhaps put it in 8.1 Timestamps? -- David Masterson
Limiting a repeating timestamp ?
Is there a way of creating a Task which is a once a week meeting that will take place in (say) June, July, and August and then stop repeating? -- David Masterson
Re: org-agenda-entry-text-mode
writes: > On Wed, Jan 25, 2023 at 01:24:56PM +, Ihor Radchenko wrote: >> David Masterson writes: >> >> > Ooh! Found org-agenda-entry-text-exclude-regexp! It's so close to what >> > I want. With it, I can delete everything on a line that I don't want to >> > be displayed with org-agenda-entry-text-mode. But I can't get rid of >> > the line, so I wind up with blank lines where the log would've been. >> >> You can. Just include newline into your regexp. > > If you are entering it interactively into the minibuffer, that's > CTRL-J (in a terminal you might have to do CTRL-Q CTRL-J). How do you represent that in Elisp? I can't quite get it from the Elisp Manual, but I think it's "\n" (CMIIAW) -- David Masterson
Re: oeg-agenda-entry-text-mode
David Masterson writes: > I've just discovered the E key in Agenda Commands and I'd like to use > it. The drawback is that it shows Log entries (I don't use a Drawer for > Logs -- yet). This means that the original description can be hidden if > the logs use up more than org-agenda-entry-text-maxlines. > > Is there someway to toggle logs in org-agenda-entry-text-mode? Also, if > I create a drawer for logs, is there someway to move current logs to the > drawer? Ooh! Found org-agenda-entry-text-exclude-regexp! It's so close to what I want. With it, I can delete everything on a line that I don't want to be displayed with org-agenda-entry-text-mode. But I can't get rid of the line, so I wind up with blank lines where the log would've been. Any other options? Or a secret to the regexp for getting rid of blank lines? Or embedding a newline in the regexp to exclude the line? -- David Masterson
oeg-agenda-entry-text-mode
I've just discovered the E key in Agenda Commands and I'd like to use it. The drawback is that it shows Log entries (I don't use a Drawer for Logs -- yet). This means that the original description can be hidden if the logs use up more than org-agenda-entry-text-maxlines. Is there someway to toggle logs in org-agenda-entry-text-mode? Also, if I create a drawer for logs, is there someway to move current logs to the drawer? -- David Masterson
Re: org-todo-keywords and task sequence
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> The problem is (I think), when you attach @ or ! to the state and, as you >> cycle thru (S-right), new unintended notes will be added as you cycle to >> the state you're looking for. True? > > If you attach @ or !, those notes are not unintended. > S-right is not for you to play around, it is for actual work on actual > tasks. If you tell Org to take a not on switching to next TODO state, > that's what you want. If you don't want it, don't put @ or !. I think I understand what you're saying, but the last statement seems wrong and should be "don't use cycling or sequences". Notes are much more important feature. What I've been saying is that, except for simple sequences, cycling will get you into trouble with notes as a lazy person (aren't we all?) may cycle thru something unintended. >> Can you repeat a keyword in org-todo-keywords? Perhaps there should be a >> sparse table defining, for a current state, what are the potential next >> states? ... > > No. S-right feature is there for simple workflows. > I am against introducing complex workflows for no reason. > It will do no good for the users. Complex workflows are rarely useful in > practice, except some specialized scenarios, which are not common enough > to include into the core. The problem is that todo keywords are being treated both as "state" (sequence) and "type" (type) which mixes things up. I guess I'm used to thinking of workflows as a digraph -- particularly in big projects where you want to be able to justify your work to the boss. But, I guess that's clock in/out. > And yes, you can use org-edna or custom org-trigger-hook if you need > something non-orthodox. I'll have to look at org-edna more. Thanks -- David Masterson
Re: org-todo-keywords and task sequence
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>> #+TODO: WAIT IN-PROCESS >>> #+TODO: TODO IN-PROCESS | DONE >> >>> Note, however, that moving S- will be ambiguous. >> >> Ambiguous or not possible? > > Ambiguous is: consider a task IN-PROCESS and you press S-left. Should > Org go to TODO or to WAIT? Org will choose one, but there are no defined > rules. Ah. Could Org offer a choice of TODO or WAIT (a la Ido style)? -- David Masterson
Re: org-todo-keywords and task sequence
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> The problem is (I think), when you attach @ or ! to the state and, as you >> cycle thru (S-right), new unintended notes will be added as you cycle to >> the state you're looking for. True? > > If you attach @ or !, those notes are not unintended. > S-right is not for you to play around, it is for actual work on actual > tasks. If you tell Org to take a note on switching to next TODO state, > that's what you want. If you don't want it, don't put @ or !. Or cycling -- note taking is much more important and cycling only works for simple workflows. My previous example shows how easy it is to make a (by Org definition) "complex" workflow. I could probably use tags for changing states, but notes are not automatic. And you're using two things for essentially the same purpose (state transition). >> Can you repeat a keyword in org-todo-keywords? Perhaps there should be a >> sparse table defining, for a current state, what are the potential next >> states? ... > > No. S-right feature is there for simple workflows. I am against > introducing complex workflows for no reason. It will do no good for > the users. Complex workflows are rarely useful in practice, except > some specialized scenarios, which are not common enough to include > into the core. If org-todo-keywords has no sequence, does S-right cycle? I suppose I could shift to just types and tags and avoid S-right. Workflows can easily get complex -- just add WAIT and HOLD for example. > And yes, you can use org-edna or custom org-trigger-hook if you need > something non-orthodox. I'll have to explore org-edna more. I do think that the use of "sequence" in org-todo-keywords complicates the variable because it talks about "simple workflow" and leaves people wondering (like me) how to change their view of a workflow to fit Org. I'll play with it some more. -- David Masterson
Re: org-todo-keywords and task sequence
Ihor Radchenko writes: F> David Masterson writes: > >> I'm not sure I understand 'sequence' and 'type' in org-todo-keywords. >> In particular, I can only think of the following simple sequence as >> being possible in org-todo-keywords: >> >> TODO -> IN-PROCESS -> DONE >> >> If I want to add in (say) WAITING, the graph (represented as a table) >> becomes: >> >> i\o | TODO | IN-P | WAIT | DONE >> TODO | N | Y | N | N >> IN-P | N | N | Y | Y >> WAIT | N | Y | N | N >> DONE | N | N | N | N > > The main purpose of the keyword sequences is working on tasks in steps. > When a keyword is a part of sequence, you can just use S- > S- to progress the task. For example: > > NEXT -> DOING -> REVIEW -> DONE > > Such sequence is only making sense when everything goes "as usual" with > a task and you do not want to think about which keyword to assign. > > The transition IN-PROGRESS -> WAIT is something you have to decide > consciously. Org cannot just read you mind and change IN-PROGRESS to > WAIT. You will have set such transition manually. > > For your table, you can try something like > > #+TODO: WAIT IN-PROCESS > #+TODO: TODO IN-PROCESS | DONE This is on a per-file basis, correct? This can't be done in org-todo-keywords? > Note, however, that moving S- will be ambiguous. Ambiguous or not possible? Perhaps there should be a sparse table var to represent the table above and drop sequence? More flexible? Org-Edna? -- David Masterson
Re: org-todo-keywords and task sequence
Daniel Fleischer writes: > Daniel Fleischer [2023-01-17 Tue 10:10] wrote: > >> Don't let the cyclical switching dictates the meaning, it's just an >> implementation detail, done for simplicity. Hope it helped. > > Put another way, if you define A B | C D E > > and the UI switching is A->B->C->D->E->A > > it doesn't mean the B going into C makes sense or D going into E makes > sense, it's just how the UI is built. You give meaning to the states and > what states transitions are valid (in your world). Like many things, org > gives some structure to work with and we need to give the meaning. The problem is (I think), when you attach @ or ! to the state and, as you cycle thru (S-right), new unintended notes will be added as you cycle to the state you're looking for. True? Can you repeat a keyword in org-todo-keywords? Perhaps there should be a sparse table defining, for a current state, what are the potential next states? Org-Edna...? -- David Masterson
org-todo-keywords and task sequence
I'm not sure I understand 'sequence' and 'type' in org-todo-keywords. In particular, I can only think of the following simple sequence as being possible in org-todo-keywords: TODO -> IN-PROCESS -> DONE If I want to add in (say) WAITING, the graph (represented as a table) becomes: i\o | TODO | IN-P | WAIT | DONE TODO | N | Y | N | N IN-P | N | N | Y | Y WAIT | N | Y | N | N DONE | N | N | N | N This table could be more complex with more Ys or more states in the task processing (like HOLD). I do not see what the proper sequence(s) to use for representing this table in Org. Hints? -- David Masterson
Re: Setting the default todo priority ?
Nick Dokos writes:
> David Masterson writes:
>
>> I see that Org treats TODOs without a priority cookie as having a
>> priority that is midway between highest and lowest.
>>
>> Use case: I may have a task type that fully expresses what it's priority
>> is. Example would be SOMEDAY which is going to have the lowest
>> priority. Adding a cookie to all SOMEDAY tasks seems superfluous.
>>
>> Is there a way of changing the default priority?
>
> C-h v org-priority-{highest,lowest,default}
Doh! That was obvious. I'm getting old. Thanks.
--
David Masterson
Setting the default todo priority ?
I see that Org treats TODOs without a priority cookie as having a priority that is midway between highest and lowest. Use case: I may have a task type that fully expresses what it's priority is. Example would be SOMEDAY which is going to have the lowest priority. Adding a cookie to all SOMEDAY tasks seems superfluous. Is there a way of changing the default priority? -- David Masterson
Re: TODO state for heading intersection?
Jean Louis writes: > Is there a way to change TODO state for intersection of headings, for > example, for some headings by tag to change the TODO state at once? Org-Elpa...? -- David Masterson
Re: TODO state for heading intersection?
Jean Louis writes: > Is there a way to change TODO state for intersection of headings, for > example, for some headings by tag to change the TODO state at once? Org-Edna...? -- David Masterson
Re: How to create a priority sorted list of tasks agenda ?
Samuel Wales writes: > ok i was completely wrong depending on which meaning of priority you > want. in the docstring in my old version of org, > org-agenda-sorting-strategy is ambiguous on which one it means, so you > might or might not need user-defined. Priority is the "[#A]" type cookie in the header of a task. A user-defined property that is a meaning of "priority" is not recognized by standard Org as a PRIORITY. You could write some Elisp to incorporate it into Org agendas with user-defined sorting functions. -- David Masterson
Re: How to create a priority sorted list of tasks agenda ?
Samuel Wales writes: > (info "(org) Presentation and Sorting") Yeah, my bad -- that should've been obvious. :-\ > emacs docs and info are both rather good. i used to dislike info for > years and catted it like a manpage but only a few commmand like u ret > l r are needed. Whoa. Interesting writing style. Info is pretty good, but lacks images to provide visual backing to the description. Also, some package writers write their docs for HTML (with images) and it doesn't quite come out write in Info. > note tht the word priority is used in 2 senses. t hre is a kind of > defult agend sorting that has its own calcualted priority and then > ther eare the priority cookies. i don't use the calculated priority > --- there is custom sorting avail via a var. maybe that is what you > are asking for ad if so you'd have to write a bit of lisp, which i > can't help you with but others might be able to. Hmm. I'll have to look at calculated priority. Thanks -- David Masterson
How to create a priority sorted list of tasks agenda ?
This seems like a typical request, but I don't readily see in the manual. I was thinking org-sort on an agenda, but it doesn't seem to do that. Any hints? -- David Masterson
Re: [BUG] Conflict between Org hyperlink and auto-complete (I think) [9.6 ( @ /home/dsmasterson/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.6/)]
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Not yet sure how to minimize my setup to build a reproducible case or >> further debug this, but I thought I'd get the bug out to others who >> might know better. > > I may consider using https://github.com/Malabarba/elisp-bug-hunter I think I'll add this package to my setup, but I don't think it can help in this case as it's an infinite loop bug. Once it's locked in the loop, I have to kill emacs, so elisp-bug-hunter would never have a chance to report anything. Question: does Org scan (some part of the) text *AS* you are typing? I'm beginning to think that the answer is 'no' and, so, it was auto-complete that tripped on a sequence of characters. I'll have to look at which part of auto-complete did it. -- David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
William Denton writes:
> On 5 January 2023, David Masterson wrote:
>
>> With the Org files that you create, how many levels of headers do you
>> use? I use Org for personal task management mostly, but I'd like to
>> produce good PDFs to give to my wife (Org is too complicated). My
>> problem is that I'll structure my documents with many (5+) header
>> levels with tasks at the bottom. The problem is that the 'article' and
>> 'report' document classes used by Org don't look right if you go beyond
>> 3 levels -- if you know what I mean. (NOTE: LaTeX newbie)
>
> By default the first three levels go to LaTeX headings, and then after that
> they
> become lists. You can change that with the H option in a header, as
> described
> here, to set org-export-headline-levels:
>
> https://orgmode.org/org.html#Export-Settings
>
> So you could say:
>
> #+options: H:5
>
> Level four headings become paragraphs, and level five become subparagraphs.
>
> With that in place, you might like how the titlesec package can give a great
> deal of control over section headings. I use this for some reports---it
> wraps
> text around level three headings, which about as far as I usually go for
> documents I export.
>
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \usepackage[]{titlesec}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \titleformat{\section} {\centering\Large}{\thesection}{}{}
> #+LATEX_HEADER:
> \titleformat{\subsubsection}[drop]{\itshape}{\thesection}{}{}{}
> #+LATEX_HEADER: \titlespacing{\subsubsection}{0.75in}{\baselineskip}{0.5in}
This looks interesting -- now to find some time to dig in. Thanks.
--
David Masterson
[BUG] Conflict between Org hyperlink and auto-complete (I think) [9.6 ( @ /home/dsmasterson/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.6/)]
:todo "TODAY"
:scheduled today
:deadline today :order 1)
(:name "Next to do" :todo "NEXT" :tag
"NEXT" :order 5)
(:name "Important" :tag "IMPORTANT"
:priority "A"
:order 6)
(:name "Consider" :tag "CONSIDER"
:priority< "A"
:order 7)
(:name "Overdue" :deadline past :order 8)
(:name "Due Soon" :deadline future :order
10)
(:name "Trivial" :discard (:anything t)
:order 90))
)
)
)
(alltodo "x"
((org-agenda-overriding-header "\nSpecial")
(org-super-agenda-groups
'((:name "Phone" :todo "PHONE" :order 13)
(:name "Meetings" :todo "MEETING" :order
15)
(:name "Hold" :todo "HOLD" :order 17)
(:name "Waiting" :todo "WAITING" :order 20)
(:name "Trivial" :discard (:anything t)
:order 90))
)
)
)
(alltodo "c"
((org-agenda-overriding-header "\nCategories")
(org-super-agenda-groups
'((:name "Others" :auto-category 1 :order
25)))
)
)
)
)
)
org-directory "/home/dsmasterson/DSM/MyOrg/"
org-agenda-sorting-strategy '((agenda habit-down time-up priority-down
category-keep)
(todo category-up priority-down deadline-up)
(tags priority-down category-keep) (search
category-keep))
org-publish-project-alist '(("orgfiles" :base-directory "~/DSM/MyOrg/"
:base-extension
"org" :publishing-directory "~/Publish/html/"
:publishing-function org-html-publish-to-html
:headline-levels 6 :section-numbers t :makeindex t
:auto-sitemap t :exclude "init.org" :with-toc nil)
("asciiDrop" :base-directory "~/DSM/MyOrg/"
:base-extension
"org" :publishing-directory "~/Publish/asciiDrop"
:publishing-function
org-asciidoc-publish-to-asciidoc
:exclude "init.org" :section-numbers t)
("beamers" :base-directory "~/DSM/MyOrg/"
:base-extension
"org" :exclude ".*" :include "TBD"
:publishing-directory
"~/Publish/pdfDrop" :publishing-function
org-beamer-export-to-pdf)
("orgDrop" :base-directory "~/DSM/MyOrg/"
:base-extension
"org" :htmlized-source t :exclude "init.org"
:publishing-directory "~/Publish/orgDrop/"
:publishing-function org-org-publish-to-org)
("pdfDrop" :base-directory "~/DSM/MyOrg/"
:base-extension
"org" :headline-levels 10 :section-numbers t
:makeindex t
:auto-sitemap t :exclude "init.org"
:publishing-directory
"~/Publish/pdfDrop/" :publishing-function
org-latex-publish-to-pdf)
("images" :base-directory "~/DSM/images/"
:base-extension
"jpg\\|gif\\|png" :publishing-directory
"~/Publish/images/"
:publishing-function org-publish-attachment)
("other" :base-directory "~/DSM/other/"
:base-extension
"css\\|el" :publishing-directory
"~/Publish/other/"
:publishing-function org-publish-attachment)
("website" :components
("orgfiles" "images" "asciiDrop" "orgDrop"
"pdfDrop" "other")
)
)
org-link-search-must-match-exact-headline nil
org-tags-exclude-from-inheritance '("RFL")
org-agenda-skip-deadline-if-done t
org-agenda-start-on-weekday 0
org-default-notes-file "/home/dsmasterson/DSM/MyOrg/notes.org"
)
--
David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
Pedro Andres Aranda Gutierrez writes: > David Masterson writes: >> "Fraga, Eric" writes: >>> On Sunday, 1 Jan 2023 at 13:43, Ihor Radchenko wrote: >>>> I think that it is not very clear how to use it. >>>> Abstract says that it is self-explaining, but it appears that not every >>>> pdf viewer supports showing the explanations. >>> >>> Yes, that's true. The PDF viewer has to support popups. I normally use >>> zathura to view PDF documents but that's one example of a viewer that >>> doesn't work with this document. In cases like this, I switch to evince >>> (others also work). >>> >>> But I find this document very useful. >> >>> Um, when I viewed it in my Emacs pdfviewer, it appeared to look fine >>> *EXCEPT* that it appeared to be in Latin (good Latin, I think, but I >>> don't read Latin). > > LoL... My kleines Latinum, though not completely fit right now, tells me that > indeed it is very, very good Latin :-) :-) > Now seriously, I'm using org for my academic activities (producing lecture > presentations and notes and laboratory scripts) and I'm extremely happy with > what I achieve. There's always a slight grief in that I can't forward search > to > or reverse search from a PDF... > > But anyhow, if you need a proofreader, happy to help.. With the Org files that you create, how many levels of headers do you use? I use Org for personal task management mostly, but I'd like to produce good PDFs to give to my wife (Org is too complicated). My problem is that I'll structure my documents with many (5+) header levels with tasks at the bottom. The problem is that the 'article' and 'report' document classes used by Org don't look right if you go beyond 3 levels -- if you know what I mean. (NOTE: LaTeX newbie) -- David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
"Fraga, Eric" writes: > On Monday, 2 Jan 2023 at 19:23, David Masterson wrote: >> Um, when I viewed it in my Emacs pdfviewer, it appeared to look fine >> *EXCEPT* that it appeared to be in Latin (good Latin, I think, but I >> don't read Latin). > > it's not the text of the document that matters; it's the popups that > describe how each visual aspect has been implemented! E.g. footers, > headers, justification, lists, etc. Ah! -- David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
David Masterson writes: > "Fraga, Eric" writes: > >> On Sunday, 1 Jan 2023 at 13:43, Ihor Radchenko wrote: >>> I think that it is not very clear how to use it. >>> Abstract says that it is self-explaining, but it appears that not every >>> pdf viewer supports showing the explanations. >> >> Yes, that's true. The PDF viewer has to support popups. I normally use >> zathura to view PDF documents but that's one example of a viewer that >> doesn't work with this document. In cases like this, I switch to evince >> (others also work). >> >> But I find this document very useful. > > Um, when I viewed it in my Emacs pdfviewer, it appeared to look fine > *EXCEPT* that it appeared to be in Latin (good Latin, I think, but I > don't read Latin). Or maybe I viewed it in Brave... -- David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
"Fraga, Eric" writes: > On Sunday, 1 Jan 2023 at 13:43, Ihor Radchenko wrote: >> I think that it is not very clear how to use it. >> Abstract says that it is self-explaining, but it appears that not every >> pdf viewer supports showing the explanations. > > Yes, that's true. The PDF viewer has to support popups. I normally use > zathura to view PDF documents but that's one example of a viewer that > doesn't work with this document. In cases like this, I switch to evince > (others also work). > > But I find this document very useful. Um, when I viewed it in my Emacs pdfviewer, it appeared to look fine *EXCEPT* that it appeared to be in Latin (good Latin, I think, but I don't read Latin). -- David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
William Denton writes: > On 30 December 2022, Thomas S. Dye wrote: > >> Org's latex exporter is exceptionally capable. AFAICT, it doesn't >> have practical limits on the LaTeX it produces, at least for my >> academic use case. I'm able to use all of the LaTeX packages I've >> ever wanted to use. > > Me too, and the more I use Org with LaTeX, the more I'm seeing how I > can use Org as a way to organize a large publishing project: use > literate programming and export the LaTeX piece by piece, documenting > what I'm doing; use source blocks to run necessary code to prepare > images or files before inclusion; and so on. > > Using Org (simple markup plus some +latex_header lines) and exporting > to LaTeX is straightforward enough ... managing a project, with the > LaTeX as code to be generated, can get a lot more complicated, but on > the other hand, Org makes that kind of thing simpler. (Of course, > anything involving LaTeX is bound to get complicated pretty soon.) > > I've learned a lot from several regulars on this mailing list, > including Juan Manuel Macías, who does remarkable work on dictionaries > and translations. Here's an example: > > https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-orgmode/2021-06/msg00348.html > > Along with all the other recommendations, it's worth looking at the > user guide for the memoir class, which is great for books: > > https://www.ctan.org/pkg/memoir > > It'll be somewhere on your system as memman.pdf. I learned a lot > about page design and LaTeX from it. I'll have to make time for this. Thanks. -- David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
"Thomas S. Dye" writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Anyone have a recommendation for a LaTeX tutorial that would >> (especially) help me understand the LaTeX exported by Org and how to >> enhance what is exported (new document classes, etc.). I don't want >> to >> bore you all with a lot of questions, so I'm looking for a good >> book. > > Org's latex exporter is exceptionally capable. AFAICT, it doesn't > have practical limits on the LaTeX it produces, at least for my > academic use case. I'm able to use all of the LaTeX packages I've > ever wanted to use. > > With the world of LaTeX at your feet, I recommend The LaTeX Companion > by Mittelbach and Goosens. My well-worn copy is almost 20 years old, > and I use it as often now as when I did all of my writing in LaTeX. > Of course, there are many new LaTeX packages in the last 20 years, but > LaTeX was very capable at the turn of the millennium and the few new > packages I use were easy to discover by browsing. Hmmm. I'll look into it. Thanks. -- David Masterson
Re: LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
"Fraga, Eric" writes: > A couple of documents I have used in the past might be useful: > > - https://archive.org/details/lshort This one sounds interesting and it's online. > - https://texdoc.org/serve/visualFAQ.pdf/0 I'm not sure what language this one is in. Thanks. -- David Masterson
LaTeX tutorial (focused on what Org exports) ??
Anyone have a recommendation for a LaTeX tutorial that would (especially) help me understand the LaTeX exported by Org and how to enhance what is exported (new document classes, etc.). I don't want to bore you all with a lot of questions, so I'm looking for a good book. -- David Masterson
Re: [BUG] Documentation fix needed in "4.4 External Links" [9.6 ( @ /home/dsmasterson/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.6/)]
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> Do you think (some part of) this (semi-)paragraph should be mentioned in >> the docstring for 'org-open-at-point' (and 'org-open-at-mouse')? I'm of >> the opinion that, if you walk-thru the docstring links, you would get >> all the info you'd get in the manual (and more), but not necessarily >> explained in a user-friendly form, > > https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git/commit/?id=edd000f3b Possibly good, but should the docstrings for org-open-at-point, org-open-at-mouse and org-open-file be unified in way so that they track each other for changes in one of them? -- David Masterson
Timestamps being changed in exporting to HTML ?
I just noticed that Org timestamps of the following form: <2006-11-02 Thu 20:00-22:00> are being changed to this form in HTML export: <2006-11-02 Thu 20:00>-<2006-11-02 Thu 22:00> # note single '-' Is this proper? -- David Masterson
Re: [BUG] Documentation fix needed in "4.4 External Links" [9.6 ( @ /home/dsmasterson/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.6/)]
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >>>> 2. If #1 depends on some org variable settings, can you mention what >>>> variables control the answer to #1? >>> >>> If you mean "can open", then see the next section. >> >> Ahh, maybe I am in the wrong section. I think, what I want is >> org-open-at-point (which could be mentioned in 4.4), but it's >> documentation string just says the linked file will be opened by "an >> appropriate application". I assume that that means some Elisp function >> is called that cross-references the file type with appropriate >> application. And that I could add to or adjust the cross-reference list >> for new/modified file types. It would be nice to mention that list >> variable so that I could trace the process further and determine what to >> do (like install the appropriate application). >> >> Does this help for what I'm looking for? > > 4.5 Handling Links > ... > ‘C-c C-o’ (‘org-open-at-point’) > ... > ... Furthermore, it visits text and > remote files in ‘file’ links with Emacs and select a suitable > application for local non-text files. Classification of files is > based on file extension only. See option ‘org-file-apps’. If you > want to override the default application and visit the file with > Emacs, use a ‘C-u’ prefix. If you want to avoid opening in Emacs, > use a ‘C-u C-u’ prefix. D***, I'm getting old! These things used to pop out at me in the old days. Apologies for the dumb question... :( Do you think (some part of) this (semi-)paragraph should be mentioned in the docstring for 'org-open-at-point' (and 'org-open-at-mouse')? I'm of the opinion that, if you walk-thru the docstring links, you would get all the info you'd get in the manual (and more), but not necessarily explained in a user-friendly form, -- David Masterson
Re: [BUG] Documentation fix needed in "4.4 External Links" [9.6 ( @ /home/dsmasterson/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.6/)]
Ihor Radchenko writes: > David Masterson writes: > >> The documentation page for "4.4 External Links" could provide the >> answers to following questions: >> >> 1. What "file types" are supported by link type "file"? > > All. Though I am not sure what you mean by "supported". As in, if you follow (open?) a file link, how is the file handled (particularly, for me, JPG, PNG, MP4, etc.)? What's the process by which an image gets inlined? Do I have to install some image processor to do that? If so, which? Or can I adjust a variable to use my chosen image processor? >> 2. If #1 depends on some org variable settings, can you mention what >> variables control the answer to #1? > > If you mean "can open", then see the next section. Ahh, maybe I am in the wrong section. I think, what I want is org-open-at-point (which could be mentioned in 4.4), but it's documentation string just says the linked file will be opened by "an appropriate application". I assume that that means some Elisp function is called that cross-references the file type with appropriate application. And that I could add to or adjust the cross-reference list for new/modified file types. It would be nice to mention that list variable so that I could trace the process further and determine what to do (like install the appropriate application). Does this help for what I'm looking for? -- David Masterson
[BUG] Documentation fix needed in "4.4 External Links" [9.6 ( @ /home/dsmasterson/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.6/)]
Remember to cover the basics, that is, what you expected to happen and what in fact did happen. You don't know how to make a good report? See https://orgmode.org/manual/Feedback.html#Feedback Your bug report will be posted to the Org mailing list. The documentation page for "4.4 External Links" could provide the answers to following questions: 1. What "file types" are supported by link type "file"? 2. If #1 depends on some org variable settings, can you mention what variables control the answer to #1? Emacs : GNU Emacs 27.1 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit, Xaw3d scroll bars) of 2021-03-27, modified by Debian Package: Org mode version 9.6 ( @ /home/dsmasterson/.emacs.d/elpa/org-9.6/) -- David Masterson
Re: bug#59882: Multiple versions of Org in load-path problem
"Cook, Malcolm" writes: >> Eli Zaretskii writes: >> >> >> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org, 59...@debbugs.gnu.org >> >> From: David Masterson >> >> Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2022 13:56:03 -0800 >> >> >> >> In my testing, I found a strange case where, in *scratch*, I get: >> >> >> >> (message "%s" org-version) >> >> ;; Error undefined >> >> ;; Do 'C-h v org-version' >> >> (message "%s" org-version) >> >> 9.3 >> >> >> >> So, 'describe-variable' on org-version causes Org to be loaded?!? >> > >> > Why is it so surprising? Is this the first time you see that a Help >> > command loads something to do its job? >> >> Yes, it is surprising. How did Emacs know to load Org to find org-version? > > This is provided for via emacs' autoload by prefix mechanism. > > See: > > https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/html_node/elisp/Autoload-by-Prefix.html > > What you observed will NOT happen if you first run: > > (clrhash definition-prefixes) Ah! Thank you. In many ways, I still think of Emacs from what I learned about it in the early 80s (yes, pre-Elisp). I didn't expect this and, so, didn't investigate the possibility that it's planned (the Info documentation has gotten huge). Apologies to Eli. -- David Masterson
Re: bug#59882: Multiple versions of Org in load-path problem
Eli Zaretskii writes: >> Cc: emacs-orgmode@gnu.org, 59...@debbugs.gnu.org >> From: David Masterson >> Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2022 13:56:03 -0800 >> >> In my testing, I found a strange case where, in *scratch*, I get: >> >> (message "%s" org-version) >> ;; Error undefined >> ;; Do 'C-h v org-version' >> (message "%s" org-version) >> 9.3 >> >> So, 'describe-variable' on org-version causes Org to be loaded?!? > > Why is it so surprising? Is this the first time you see that a Help > command loads something to do its job? Yes, it is surprising. How did Emacs know to load Org to find org-version? I didn't request it to by this action. Or did it do a package-activate-all (or similar) to ensure that everything was loaded? That would be overkill. Sometimes the best answer is 'nil'. -- David Masterson
