Re: [O] Table aligning and editing in 9.2

[Kaushal Modi]

On Fri, Sep 8, 2017 at 3:42 PM Nicolas Goaziou 
wrote:

> William Denton  writes:
> > But now the cell contents are locked until either a) C-C ` opens up an
> > edit buffer (which was useful before for editing a long piece of text
> > that got shrunk, but is a lot of work when you have something short
> > like "Foo" in a <10> column and want to make it "Bar") or, as you
> > point out, b) something is typed in the shrunk column.
>
> Or c), simply expand the columns with C-c TAB, and edit the field to
> your heart's content.
>

I was initially bummed by the same observation that William made too.. that
you now needed to first do C-c ` for editting shrunk cells. So thanks for
that C-c TAB tip. That workflow works for me.
-- 

Kaushal Modi

Re: [O] Table aligning and editing in 9.2

[Nicolas Goaziou]

William Denton  writes:

> Previously one could edit the contents of a cell in a shrunken column
> without doing anything special: move the point in, move to a position,
> then hit any key (space, delete, a letter), and the change is made.
> If a character is deleted then the => at the end comes closer; if
> added it moves away.  C-c C-c or TAB realigns everything.  Everything
> is directly editable: the text can be operated on without any
> barriers.

No barrier? Try editing directly the text under "=>".

> But now the cell contents are locked until either a) C-C ` opens up an
> edit buffer (which was useful before for editing a long piece of text
> that got shrunk, but is a lot of work when you have something short
> like "Foo" in a <10> column and want to make it "Bar") or, as you
> point out, b) something is typed in the shrunk column.

Or c), simply expand the columns with C-c TAB, and edit the field to
your heart's content.

> But when something is typed in a shrunk column, the column expands and
> the point is now at the start of the cell.  To edit anything in the
> cell, you need to hit "a" or SPC or something just to get in there,
> then you need to delete it, then move to where you want to make
> a change, then edit.

See above.

> And then C-c C-c or TAB doesn't realign things, you need to hit C-c
> TAB.

Either you spotted a bug, or I don't understand. C-c C-c (or TAB) still
re-align things. But it doesn't narrow them again anymore. These are two
different commands.

> So the workflow is different, and in each piece it's more awkward.

You have to admit that the above is, by itself, quite a feat.

So, is there anything wrong with the following workflow:

   expand the column (C-c TAB), edit field, shrink it again (C-c TAB)

?

Regards,

Re: [O] Table aligning and editing in 9.2

[William Denton]

On 7 September 2017, Nicolas Goaziou wrote:


What workflow are you missing? Note that typing in a shrunk column
expands it.


Previously one could edit the contents of a cell in a shrunken column without 
doing anything special: move the point in, move to a position, then hit any key 
(space, delete, a letter), and the change is made.  If a character is deleted 
then the => at the end comes closer; if added it moves away.  C-c C-c or TAB 
realigns everything.  Everything is directly editable: the text can be operated 
on without any barriers.


But now the cell contents are locked until either a) C-C ` opens up an edit 
buffer (which was useful before for editing a long piece of text that got 
shrunk, but is a lot of work when you have something short like "Foo" in a <10> 
column and want to make it "Bar") or, as you point out, b) something is typed in 
the shrunk column.


But when something is typed in a shrunk column, the column expands and the point 
is now at the start of the cell.  To edit anything in the cell, you need to hit 
"a" or SPC or something just to get in there, then you need to delete it, then 
move to where you want to make a change, then edit.


And then C-c C-c or TAB doesn't realign things, you need to hit C-c TAB.

So the workflow is different, and in each piece it's more awkward.  Everything 
works---and I appreciate that the code and implementation is much cleaner 
now---but it seems like some of the magic that makes Org tables so wonderful is 
now gone. :(


Bill
--
William Denton :: Toronto, Canada   ---   Listening to Art: 
https://listeningtoart.org/
https://www.miskatonic.org/ ---   GHG.EARTH: http://ghg.earth/
Caveat lector.  ---   STAPLR: http://staplr.org/

Re: [O] Table aligning and editing in 9.2

[Nicolas Goaziou]

Hello,

William Denton  writes:

> On 7 September 2017, William Denton wrote:
>
>> I can't find the "Dynamically narrow table columns" documentation,
>> though. Where is it?
>
> Aha, checking the Git commit I see it (in doc/org.texi).  (The title
> doesn't match, which threw me off.)

"Dynamically narrow table columns" is another entry in ORG-NEWS. But
there is, indeed, documentation in "org.texi".

> "To see the full text, hold the mouse over the field---a tool-tip window
> will show the full content.  To edit such a field, use the command
> @kbd{C-c `} (that is @kbd{C-c} followed by the grave accent).  This will
> open a new window with the full field."
>
> I wish I'd tested this before and noticed this, so I could comment.
> It makes using tables much less pleasurable, I think.

The above was also available in previous implementation of narrowed
columns.

What workflow are you missing? Note that typing in a shrunk column
expands it.

Regards,

-- 
Nicolas Goaziou

Re: [O] Table aligning and editing in 9.2

[William Denton]

On 7 September 2017, William Denton wrote:

I can't find the "Dynamically narrow table columns" documentation, though. 
Where is it?


Aha, checking the Git commit I see it (in doc/org.texi).  (The title doesn't 
match, which threw me off.)


"To see the full text, hold the mouse over the field---a tool-tip window
will show the full content.  To edit such a field, use the command
@kbd{C-c `} (that is @kbd{C-c} followed by the grave accent).  This will
open a new window with the full field."

I wish I'd tested this before and noticed this, so I could comment.  It makes 
using tables much less pleasurable, I think.


Bill
--
William Denton :: Toronto, Canada   ---   Listening to Art: 
https://listeningtoart.org/
https://www.miskatonic.org/ ---   GHG.EARTH: http://ghg.earth/
Caveat lector.  ---   STAPLR: http://staplr.org/

[O] Table aligning and editing in 9.2

[William Denton]

The new approach to table alignment, that will be in 9.2, is there now if you 
compile from source, which I did.  etc/ORG-NEWS says



** Incompatible changes
*** =align= STARTUP value no longer narrow table columns

Columns narrowing (or shrinking) is now dynamic. See [[*Dynamically
narrow table columns]] for details. In particular, it is decoupled from
aligning.


I can't find the "Dynamically narrow table columns" documentation, though. 
Where is it?


My main question is: Is it now necessary to use C-c ` to edit a cell in a table? 
Moving the point around skips from cell to cell without letting me edit it.  I 
hope this isn't permanent. :(


Bill
--
William Denton :: Toronto, Canada   ---   Listening to Art: 
https://listeningtoart.org/
https://www.miskatonic.org/ ---   GHG.EARTH: http://ghg.earth/
Caveat lector.  ---   STAPLR: http://staplr.org/