RE: Harmonics/Flicker Compliance

2000-11-28 Thread O'Shaughnessy, Paul

We just went through the same thing a few months back.  The confusion comes
from a clause near the end of 61326 which appears to  exempt you from any
responsibility on harmonics and flicker if your product is non-domestic.  I
know a number of EMC professionals who take that as the last word on the
subject.  However, I am advised by most others that the harmonic and flicker
standards stand on their own, regardless of what 61326 says.  And yes, they
become mandatory (according to their DOW) on January 1, 2001.  The recent
wrinkle on all this is that A14 to EN61000-3-2 will allow most
instrumentation (other than personal computers and TVs) to comply, as of
January 1, 2001, with harmonic standards under Class A rather than the more
stringent Class D.

Hope this helps (and hope that I said all of that right).

Paul O'Shaughnessy
Affymetrix, Inc.

-Original Message-
From: bous...@perkin-elmer.com [mailto:bous...@perkin-elmer.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 2:19 PM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Harmonics/Flicker Compliance




We have been informed by our local EMC lab that, effective 1 January 2001,
harmonics  (EN 61000-3-2)  and voltage fluctuations/flicker  (EN 61000-3-3)
compliance is mandatory for products consuming currents less than or equal
to 16 Amps, and connected to the public low-voltage  (220V to 250V, 50 Hz)
distribution systems in the European Union.

Is compliance on 1 January 2001 mandatory for products that will meet the
EMC requirements defined in EN 61326 (electrical equipment for measurement,
control and laboratory use)  which has an effectivity date of 1 July 2001?

Do participants in the group agree that testing is mandatory before
1 January 2001,  and have they started/completed testing their products?

Regards,
John Bouse
PerkinElmer Instruments (USA)
Safety/EMC Compliance



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RE: Harmonics/Flicker Compliance

2000-11-28 Thread Maxwell, Chris

John,  

We have bounced this subject around ad nauseam (to the point of sickness
for those not into latin).

As I understand it, the long and short of it is:

The writers of EN 61326-1 separated equipment into two classes.  Class A and
Class B.  They intended to exclude Class A equipment from the Harmonics and
Flicker requirements.

Problem is:  according to how standards are ranked.  EN 61326-1 doesn't
have the authority to exclude equipment from EN 61000-3-2 and EN
61000-3-3.  There are arguments that could last a lifetime regarding which
of the two standards should take precedence.

Actually, the path that I have taken is to assume that the Harmonic and
Flicker standards apply and then look at the application of EN 61000-3-2 and
EN 61000-3-3 themselves.  Under EN 61000-3-2 and EN 61000-3-3 equipment must
be put into different classes depending upon how much power it draws and
whether or not the equipment is professional equipment.  By looking at
these classifications, you can make an educated decision regarding whether
the standards apply or not.

If you want to draw your own conclusions,  check out the online standards
update Conformity-Update put out by Curtis-Straus.  There were some
articles in the August and September 2000 updates that cover a great deal of
this ground.

The link to Conformity-Update is:

http://www.std.com/Newbury/c-u/

One specific article from Conformity-Update may be found at:

http://www.conformity-update.com/iec-61000-000908.htm

Happy hunting.

Chris Maxwell, Design Engineer
GN Nettest Optical Division
6 Rhoads Drive, Building 4  
Utica, NY 13502
PH:  315-797-4449
FAX:  315-797-8024
EMAIL:  chr...@gnlp.com



 -Original Message-
 From: bous...@perkin-elmer.com [SMTP:bous...@perkin-elmer.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 2:19 PM
 To:   emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
 Subject:  Harmonics/Flicker Compliance
 
 
 
 We have been informed by our local EMC lab that, effective 1 January 2001,
 harmonics  (EN 61000-3-2)  and voltage fluctuations/flicker  (EN
 61000-3-3)
 compliance is mandatory for products consuming currents less than or equal
 to 16 Amps, and connected to the public low-voltage  (220V to 250V, 50 Hz)
 distribution systems in the European Union.
 
 Is compliance on 1 January 2001 mandatory for products that will meet the
 EMC requirements defined in EN 61326 (electrical equipment for
 measurement,
 control and laboratory use)  which has an effectivity date of 1 July 2001?
 
 Do participants in the group agree that testing is mandatory before
 1 January 2001,  and have they started/completed testing their products?
 
 Regards,
 John Bouse
 PerkinElmer Instruments (USA)
 Safety/EMC Compliance
 
 
 
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IEC 61000-3-2 -3-3

2000-11-28 Thread Dick Grobner



At the web address below you will find an article written by J.M. Woodgate
dealing with 61000-3-2  -3. This may be of interest to some on this forum
as I know the issue seems to surface about every other week.
Happy Reading! 


http://www.conformity-update.com/iec-61000-000908.htm

Dick Grobner
Compliance Engineering
Medical Graphics Corporation
350 Oak Grove Parkway
St Paul, MN 55127
651-766-3395
651-766-3389 (fax)
dick.grob...@medgraph.com



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Harmonics/Flicker Compliance

2000-11-28 Thread BouseJC


We have been informed by our local EMC lab that, effective 1 January 2001,
harmonics  (EN 61000-3-2)  and voltage fluctuations/flicker  (EN 61000-3-3)
compliance is mandatory for products consuming currents less than or equal
to 16 Amps, and connected to the public low-voltage  (220V to 250V, 50 Hz)
distribution systems in the European Union.

Is compliance on 1 January 2001 mandatory for products that will meet the
EMC requirements defined in EN 61326 (electrical equipment for measurement,
control and laboratory use)  which has an effectivity date of 1 July 2001?

Do participants in the group agree that testing is mandatory before
1 January 2001,  and have they started/completed testing their products?

Regards,
John Bouse
PerkinElmer Instruments (USA)
Safety/EMC Compliance



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RE: we need some information

2000-11-28 Thread Michael Mertinooke


Heh!  Used a CRT focussing coil with a Lionel train transformer, actually.
By quickly making and breaking the connections I could time the
current so it would accelerate the ball bearing smartly.

And where did we get our CRT focusing coil? Hmm?
You must have been SOME kid to raise!





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RE: FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread Grant, Tania (Tania)

While it is true that all personal computers destined for the home user must
be Class B and therefore, Certified, it is not true that any device that
meets Class B limits must, as a consequence, also be Certified.   

Thus, if the device falls into the product category under FCC Verification
(professional and other equipment not destined for the home user and not
available for general distribution in retail stores) such devices (as FCC is
wont to call them!) can be verified  as meeting Class B limits.   We have
seen in the past Intel and IBM high-end industrial PCs that have been
verified as meeting Class B limits, at a time when you still had to mention
the Class in the mandatory verification markings on the product.  However,
you never saw these PCs available in your local computer/electronic store.

Those of us in the industry that use such PCs are very pleased that they
meet Class B limits even if legally (per FCC) they don't have to.  Thus,
such PCs could still be marked as verified to Class A limits; however, if
they meet Class B, why not state so.   If you've got it, flaunt it!  

Tania Grant,  tgr...@lucent.com
Lucent Technologies, Switching Solutions Group
Intelligent Network and Messaging Solutions


-Original Message-
From: Dan Kinney (A) [mailto:dan.kin...@heapg.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 9:56 AM
To: Courtland Thomas; emcpost
Subject: RE: FCC Part 15 Class B



47CFR Part 15 Subpart B, paragraph 15.101(a) would lead you believe so.
Within the table, under Type of device, it says Other Class B digital
devices and peripherals. - Verification.
Dan Kinney 

 -Original Message-
 From: Courtland Thomas [SMTP:ctho...@patton.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 1:20 PM
 To:   emcpost
 Subject:  FCC Part 15 Class B
 
 
 Hello Group,
 
 I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for
 ITE.
 I know it can be done for Class A, but I am not sure about Class B. The
 interesting thing is that I posed the question to a contact at the FCC and
 the answer I got was No idea.
 
 Courtland Thomas
 Patton Electronics
 
 
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RE: FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread JMurphy
It depends on the product. Attached is a copy of a chart found in Subpart B
that details the action needed for different products.  There are different
labelling requirements for Class B products that can use the DoC route.  You
can download FCC Pt15 at
http://www.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Engineering_Technology/Documents/cfr/1998/47cfr15
.pdf.

Jack

-Original Message-
From: Courtland Thomas [mailto:ctho...@patton.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 1:20 PM
To: emcpost
Subject: FCC Part 15 Class B



Hello Group,

I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for ITE.
I know it can be done for Class A, but I am not sure about Class B. The
interesting thing is that I posed the question to a contact at the FCC and
the answer I got was No idea.

Courtland Thomas
Patton Electronics


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attachment: FCC15.jpg

FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread Courtland Thomas

Hello Group,

I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for ITE.
I know it can be done for Class A, but I am not sure about Class B. The
interesting thing is that I posed the question to a contact at the FCC and
the answer I got was No idea.

Courtland Thomas
Patton Electronics


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Re: FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread Jon D. Curtis

See 15.101.  Class B personal computers and peripherals may use either the
Certification or Declaration of Conformity equipment authorization procedure.
Other class B digital devices and peripherals are subject to the Verification
equipment authorization procedure.

Be careful as Verification is not the same as Declaration of Conformity with
different labeling requirements, test site accreditation requirements, etc.  See

47 CFR Part 2 for detailed descriptions of the equipment authorization
procedures.

Jon Curtis.

Courtland Thomas wrote:

 Hello Group,

 I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for ITE.
 I know it can be done for Class A, but I am not sure about Class B. The
 interesting thing is that I posed the question to a contact at the FCC and
 the answer I got was No idea.

 Courtland Thomas
 Patton Electronics

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--
Jon D. Curtis, P.E.

Director of Engineering
Curtis-Straus LLC

One Stop Laboratory for NEBS, EMC,
Product Safety, and Telecom Testing.
527 Great Road
Littleton, MA 01460 USA
Voice 978-486-8880  Fax 978-486-8828
email: jcur...@curtis-straus.com
WWW.CURTIS-STRAUS.COM



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Re: FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread Jim Hulbert



Yes, class B ITE can be self-verified.  However, if the ITE is a personal
computer or personal computer peripheral, then the Declaration of Conformity
procedure must be followed.  The DofC procedure is essentially
self-certification, but requires that the testing be performed at an accredited
test laboratory (NVLAP, AALA).

Jim Hulbert
Senior Engineer-EMC
Pitney Bowes





Courtland Thomas ctho...@patton.com on 11/28/2000 01:20:01 PM

Please respond to Courtland Thomas ctho...@patton.com

To:   emcpost emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
cc:(bcc: Jim Hulbert/MSD/US/PBI)

Subject:  FCC Part 15 Class B




Hello Group,

I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for ITE.
I know it can be done for Class A, but I am not sure about Class B. The
interesting thing is that I posed the question to a contact at the FCC and
the answer I got was No idea.

Courtland Thomas
Patton Electronics


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RE: FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread Dan Kinney (A)

47CFR Part 15 Subpart B, paragraph 15.101(a) would lead you believe so.
Within the table, under Type of device, it says Other Class B digital
devices and peripherals. - Verification.
Dan Kinney 

 -Original Message-
 From: Courtland Thomas [SMTP:ctho...@patton.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2000 1:20 PM
 To:   emcpost
 Subject:  FCC Part 15 Class B
 
 
 Hello Group,
 
 I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for
 ITE.
 I know it can be done for Class A, but I am not sure about Class B. The
 interesting thing is that I posed the question to a contact at the FCC and
 the answer I got was No idea.
 
 Courtland Thomas
 Patton Electronics
 
 
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Re: FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread Flinders, Randall

You can Self-Certify.  This is all described in FCC's CFR 47, Part
15.101.  To read the rules for yourself, go to:

http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_99/47cfr15_99.html

regards,



Randy Flinders
EMC Engineer
Emulex Corp.
r.flind...@ieee.org


Courtland Thomas wrote:
 
 Hello Group,
 
 I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for ITE.
 I know it can be done for Class A, but I am not sure about Class B. The
 interesting thing is that I posed the question to a contact at the FCC and
 the answer I got was No idea.
 
 Courtland Thomas
 Patton Electronics
 
 ---
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Re: FCC Part 15 Class B

2000-11-28 Thread Cortland Richmond

Hi, Courtland!

You asked
I would like to know if it is permissible to self verify to Class B for
ITE.

Isn't that what a DOC is?

Cortland

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RE: EMC in Norway and Switzerland

2000-11-28 Thread Dinh, Huu Dung

Dear All,
http://www.dnv.com/eltestlab/ http://www.dnv.com/eltestlab/  should be an
equally good website.
Best regards,
Huu Dung Dinh
DET NORSKE VERITAS, RN 413
Testing and Certification of Electrical Equipment
Division Nordic Countries

*   +47 67 57 95 91
FAX +47 67 57 89 60
*   Veritasveien 1, N-1322 Høvik, Norway
*   huu.dung.d...@dnv.com mailto:huu.dung.d...@dnv.com 
Web http://www.dnv.com/eltestlab/ http://www.dnv.com/eltestlab/ 


-Original Message-
From:   Colgan, Chris [SMTP:chris.col...@tagmclarenaudio.com]
Sent:   28. november 2000 11:15
To: 'Emc-Pstc' (E-mail)
Subject:RE: EMC in Norway and Switzerland


Paul

I know for sure that Norway accepts products bearing the CE mark.
The
NEMKO website should give you all you need to know about Norway.

http://www.nemko.no/

I am 99% sure that Switzerland accepts the CE mark too, try SEV's
website
for info.

http://www.sev.ch/e/nav/sevhome.htm

Regards

Chris Colgan
Compliance Engineer
TAG McLaren Audio Ltd
The Summit, Latham Road
Huntingdon, Cambs, PE29 6ZU
*Tel: +44 (0)1480 415 627
*Fax: +44 (0)1480 52159
* Mailto:chris.col...@tagmclarenaudio.com
* http://www.tagmclarenaudio.com


 -Original Message-
 From: Paul Hare [SMTP:jphar...@earthlink.net]
 Sent: 27 November 2000 21:34
 To:   emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
 Subject:  EMC in Norway and Switzerland
 
 
 Group,
 
 I am looking for comments regarding EMC requirements for Norway
and
 Switzerland.
 
 I realize they are member countries of the European Free Trade
Association
 (EFTA), and not the EU.  I also realize that Norway (along with
Iceland
 and Liechtenstein) participates in the European Economic Area
(EEA).  And
 the EEA combined with the EU member states constitutes the
European
 Community (EC).  
 
 Q1.  Have the EFTA countries adopted the same compliance framework
that
 the EU uses?  (e.g. harmonized standards, DoC model, labeling,
etc.)
 
 Q2.  If only the EC countries use the EU framework, what about
 Switzerland?
 
 Q3.  Can anyone point me to the applicable Swiss or Norwegian
agency
 website?
 
 Thanks in advance,
 
 Paul Hare
 
  
 
 
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Re: Testing as a system for harmonics?

2000-11-28 Thread Cortland Richmond

I'll guess it's this way:  If your equipment requires a computer system to
work, and you sell that system, then you're responsible for compliance of
what you sell, even if you didn't make it. But I haven't  seen power supply
emissions tested with everything plugged into one outlet.  Seems to me,
separately powered devices must be separately tested for harmonics and
conducted emissions. Might as well test a whole office of networked
computers -- plugged into one outlet -- for harmonics. 


Cortland

== Original Message Follows 


From: marti...@appliedbiosystems.com
Subject: Testing as a system for harmonics?
List-Post: emc-pstc@listserv.ieee.org
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2000 10:18:49 -0800
Reply-To: marti...@appliedbiosystems.com
 

One of our products is sold as a system with several other non-connected
products as well as a computer system and printer. We brought this product
to a well known EMC Testing facility to perform Harmonics testing.  They
required that we plugged our product, as well as all of the peripheral
devices, into a power strip and they then tested the complete system
together for Harmonics.  Obviously, it failed.

Has anyone else had an EMC Lab make this request of testing the complete
system?  Is anyone aware of any document that requires system testing for
Harmonics?

All responses are appreciated.

Regards

Joe Martin
EMC/Product Safety Engineer
marti...@appliedbiosystems.com

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RE: Passive fiber optic components

2000-11-28 Thread Gorodetsky, Vitaly

The IEC has circulated for comments 86B/1385/FDIS, Fiber Optic
Interconnecting Devices and Passive Components - Basic Test and Measurement
Procedures for Attenuation and 86B/1386/FDIS, Fiber Optic Interconnecting
Devices and Passive Components - Basic Test and Measurement Procedures for
Attenuation and Return Loss.  I believe these documents cover performance
evaluation procedures rather than components compliance.
 
Vitaly  Gorodetsky

The suitability of this information for making decision is solely with the
reader


-Original Message-
From:   Maxwell, Chris [SMTP:chr...@gnlp.com]
Sent:   Monday, November 27, 2000 1:11 PM
To: 'EMC-PSTC Internet Forum'
Subject:Passive fiber optic components


All,

I was asked by one of my colleagues here if there are any compliance
requirements for passive fiber optic components such as:
patchcords,
connector adapters ... 

My quick answer was no;  however, the cautious side of me says
that there
may be some EN standard governing these types of components.

Has anyone seen or heard of standards that regulate passive fiber
optic
components?

Chris Maxwell, Design Engineer
GN Nettest Optical Division
6 Rhoads Drive, Building 4  
Utica, NY 13502
PH:  315-797-4449
FAX:  315-797-8024
EMAIL:  chr...@gnlp.com



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