Fwd: EMC immunity requirements in Canada?

2002-09-23 Thread Warren Birmingham 


Reposted due to server failure...


Begin forwarded message:


From: Warren Birmingham 
Date: Fri Sep 20, 2002  18:55:25 US/Pacific
To: Marko Radojicic 
Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Re: EMC immunity requirements in Canada?

I was not clear enough in my original message when I said that there 
ARE requirements but no per se standards.  The de-facto immunity 
requirements the FCC has (and the Canadians) is the responsibility the 
manufacturer accepts as posted on the label.  This is called out in 
15.19 (in part) as follows:


(3) All other devices shall bear the following statement in a
conspicuous location on the device:

This device complies with part 15 of the FCC Rules. Operation is
subject to the following two conditions: (1) This device may not cause
harmful interference, and (2) this device must accept any interference 
received, including interference that may cause undesired operation.


Thus the FCC does not dictate WHAT the testing levels are, only that 
the manufacturer must meet generally accepted design guidelines that 
protect the consumer and is on the hook for meeting them at their 
expense.  If this is splitting hairs to anyone, it is not that vague 
to me.


Warren Birmingham
Epsilon Mu consultants

On Thursday, Sep 19, 2002, at 16:33 US/Pacific, Marko Radojicic wrote:


Warren,

Could you reference the section of part 15 (or elsewhere) where the 
FCC
calls out immunity requirements? I have to speculate that you are 
mixing up

other requirements such as GR-1089 NEBS with the FCC.

Thanks,
Marko

-Original Message-
From: Warren Birmingham [mailto:war...@comfortjets.com]
Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 8:59 AM
To: am...@westin-emission.no
Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Re: EMC immunity requirements in Canada?




The Canadians accept FCC data, which DOES include immunity
requirements.  There are no testing standards for immunity, only that
the device must accept any interference for normal operation.  See the
labeling requirements for verification and certification in Part 15.

Warren Birmingham
Epsilon-Mu Consultants
(510) 793-4806
email: war...@epsilon-mu.com
website: http://www.epsilon-mu.com



On Thursday, Sep 19, 2002, at 05:22 US/Pacific,
am...@westin-emission.no wrote:



As far as I remember, US (FCC) do only have emission (radiated /
conducted)
requirements.
What about Canada (IC)  do they have immunity requirements in
addition ?

Best regards
Amund Westin, Oslo/ NORWAY






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RE: CE Marking for Passive speakers

2002-09-23 Thread Tyra, John 

Gee thanks John, wonder why I didn't think of
that?

-Original Message-
From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 12:31 PM
To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org
Subject: Re: CE Marking for Passive speakers



I read in !emc-pstc that Tyra, John  wrote (in
<418fbd441c22d5118d860003470d43160543e...@cupid.bose.com>) about 'CE
Marking for Passive speakers' on Mon, 23 Sep 2002:
>Still cost money! Every page you print has a cost associated with it even
if
>it is in the already existing instruction booklet..It may only be a
fraction
>of a cent but it adds up fast!

Include it as part of an existing printed page. If your printer charges
you extra for that, get another printer.
-- 
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk

Interested in professional sound reinforcement and distribution? Then go to 
http://www.isce.org.uk
PLEASE do NOT copy news posts to me by E-MAIL!

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Surge and EFT test equipment for AC, DC, and signal ports

2002-09-23 Thread Jim Eichner 

> We are starting to look into the costs and issues around gearing up for
> some immunity testing, with the intent of determining whether or not it is
> too hard or too expensive to gear up to do some of it "at home". We are
> not looking for final formal compliance results here, only for
> pre-compliance peace of mind. In particular, I need to consider the
> following:
> 
> 1. EFT (EN61000-4-4) - AC input, output, and ground lines, DC input and
> output lines, signal/control lines
> 2. Surges (EN 61000-4-5) - AC input, output, and ground lines, DC input
> and output lines, signal/control lines
> 3. Surges (SAE J1113/11) on DC power leads
> 4. Fast transients (SAE J1113/12) on other than power leads
> 
> The products which we hope to be able to test in-house are power
> conversion and control products, and have a wide range of input/output
> voltages and power:
> 
> - AC inputs up to 120V, 60A, or 230Vac, 30A single-phase, 120/240V, 50A,
> split-phase, and 120/208V, 30A, 3-phase
> - AC outputs up to 120Vac, 60A, 230Vac, 30A, 120/240V, 50A split-phase 
> - DC inputs up to 12V, 500A; 24V, 300A; 48V, 200A
> - DC outputs up to 12kW at 10 - 600Vdc (1200A - 20A)
> 
> Questions:
> 
> 1. Is there any single piece of equipment (with accessories/modules/etc.)
> available that can do both Surge and EFT tests on equipment, or are these
> tests just too different?
> 
> 2. Surge - Is there any single piece of equipment (with
> accessories/modules/etc.) available that can do surges on all these types
> of ports: AC and DC and signal/control?  Any info re mfr, cat. no., price,
> etc. would be appreciated.
> 
> 3. EFT - Is there any single piece of equipment (with
> accessories/modules/etc.) available that can do EFT on all these types of
> ports: AC and DC and signal/control?  Any info re mfr, cat. no., price,
> etc. would be appreciated.
> 
> 4. Do these tests have to be run at full output (which may limit my
> ability to find 3rd party labs with suitable equipment, let alone gear up
> in-house) or can they be run with a light load on the equipment and then
> test full output after each test to confirm return to normal operation?  
> 
> Thanks in advance for your help,
> Jim Eichner, P.Eng. 
> Regulatory Compliance Manager
> Xantrex Technology Inc. 
> e-mail: jim.eich...@xantrex.com 
> web: www.xantrex.com 
> Any opinions expressed are those of my invisible friend, who really
> exists.  Honest.  No, really.
> Confidentiality Notice: This email message, including any attachments, is
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Re: British fused plugs -

2002-09-23 Thread Lou Aiken 


Many, if not all, British socket outlets have shutters just behind the
access openings to the L&N contacts.  The purpose of the unused earthing pin
is to contact a  cam just inside the access opening to the earth contact,
that mechanically opens the shutters  allowing the L&N pins to enter the
socket.  The shutters stay closed whenever the socket has no plug present to
prevent contact with the L or N pins.  I suppose this additional protection
is considered necessary for children in the UK.

Rgds, Lou

Lou Aiken, LaMer LLC
27109 Palmetto Drive
Orange Beach, AL
36561 USA

tel ++ 1 251 981 6786
fax ++ 1 251 981 3054
- Original Message -
From: Gary McInturff 
To: EMC-PSTC (E-mail) 
Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 12:02 PM
Subject: British fused plugs -



Cohorts.
I may be missing the obvious here.
I have a small UPS heading to Dubai. The requirement is for a British style
fused plug. The UPS itself, is ungrounded and smack full of agency
approvals.
When I asked the vendor for a power cord he provided two, one with the
ground pin, and the hot and neutral pins. The ground pin isn't connected to
anything at the equipment end. The second configuration, and the one I
anticipated getting, didn't have the ground pin on the input, or wall outlet
side of the power cord.
Maybe I'm missing something obvious here, but I see no application for a
floating ground pin on the wall outlet side of this connector given that it
isn't carried through to the equipment which it is powering?
What am I missing?
Gary

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Re: British fused plugs -

2002-09-23 Thread John Woodgate 

I read in !emc-pstc that Gary McInturff  wrote (in <917063bab0ddb043af5faa73c7a835d40ac...@windlord.wwp.com
>) about 'British fused plugs -' on Mon, 23 Sep 2002:
>The second configuration, and the one I anticipated getting, didn't have the 
>ground pin on the input, or wall outlet side of the power cord.

You mean it has a 13 A rectangular-pin plug with no earth pin? That
won't work; you need the earth pin to work the shutter in the wall-
socket.

But the earth pin need not be metal. Is that what you have, a plastic
pin?
-- 
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk 
Interested in professional sound reinforcement and distribution? Then go to 
http://www.isce.org.uk
PLEASE do NOT copy news posts to me by E-MAIL!

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Looking for an AR Quadchek 6554SA Manual and Cables

2002-09-23 Thread Dave Lorusso 

I just bought an Associated Research Quadchek model 6554SA.  It didn't come
with a manual and is missing the cables - I got a real good deal though.
I'm looking for a source for the manual and cables other than AR (too
expensive).  Would appreciate any leads off line.

Thanks,

Dave
www.lorusso.com
512-695-5871


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Re: British fused plugs -

2002-09-23 Thread Cortland Richmond 

As a victim of the older plug, I welcome such protection. At age 8, having
been told that I could be hurt by sticking my finger in the receptacle, I
of course had to try it, and am lucky to be alive.

Cortland

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Presentation slides available for download

2002-09-23 Thread Grasso, Charles 
To all interested parties:

 

The presentation slides from our September meeting
the Mysteries of Grounding" are available for download.
Go to our website : http://www.ieee.org/rmcemc 
and click
on Last Meeting.

 

Best Regards
Charles Grasso
Senior Compliance Engineer
Echostar Communications Corp.
Tel:  303-706-5467
Fax: 303-799-6222
Cell: 303-204-2974
Email: charles.gra...@echostar.com;    
Email Alternate: chasgra...@ieee.org

Int'l Requirements for Lab Trials and Shipments - C.O. EQUIPMENT

2002-09-23 Thread Joe Finlayson 


repost due to list server outage.

>  -Original Message-
> From: Joe Finlayson  
> Sent: Friday, September 20, 2002 1:52 PM
> To:   'EMC PSTC'; 'NEBS Newsgroup'; 'TREG Newsgroup'
> Subject:  Int'l Requirements for Lab Trials and Shipments - C.O.
> EQUIPMENT
> 
>   
>   I've been trying to gather the information I need to generate a plan
> for international deployment of a CENTRAL OFFICE SWITCH powered by -48VDC
> with E1, OC-3 and OC-12 interfaces.  Many have responded and provided some
> very useful information although there have been some discrepancies in the
> information I have received thus far.  A majority of the confusion seems
> to be differentiating between commercial products that connect to the PSTN
> and C.O. Equipment which is installed in the PSTN.  My concerns are the
> latter.  I realize that some regions are difficult to assess until you've
> gone through the process.  So, it would be greatly appreciated if some of
> you out there that have endured this pain in these regions that I'm about
> to list would provide some input (and indicate whether this is from
> experience or not).  I am interested in in gathering the requirements for
> (1) What's required to get a product in for a lab trial and (2) what's
> required to ship for revenue.  I'll post what information (or
> misinformation) I have now and please feel free to comment.  Any and all
> input is welcome.
> 
> China
> MII (Network Access License) Required
> CCC (Safety, EMC and Lightning) Certs Required (I was under the impression
> this product was outside of the scope, though) 
> Must be a registered Chinese company to hold certs
> All tests must be performed in China - Lead time 6 months
> Test fees $25K - probably need local rep to assist
> All docs translated to Chinese
> Unknown what's required for Lab Trials
> 
> South Africa
> SABS (accepts IEC CB and CISPR 22 reports), ICASA (accepts reports from
> accredited labs?) certs required for revenue shipments
> No requirements for lab trials
Only Resident Company can hold certs

> Singapore
IDA approval not required for Network Equipment
> PSB approval Required?
> No requirements for Lab Trials?
> 
> Taiwan
> DGT and BSMI certs required
> No requirements for Lab Trials
> 
> Poland
> PCBC required
Any Telecom certs required?

> Europe
> CE Mark Required (ETSI 300 386-2, EN 60950)
> Mixed responses on lab trials (most responses are safety report with
> declaration/prominent notice of EMC non-compliance is OK)
> 
> Japan
> No mandatory safety or EMC certs (I have or will have IEC CB Scheme Report
> as well as CISPR 22)
> JATE not required as C.O. Equipment does not fall under the scope
> 
>   My apologies for the long-winded email, but I wanted to be clear
> this time around.
> 
> Thx,
> 
> 
> Joe
> 
> *
>  <<...OLE_Obj...>> 
> 
> Joe Finlayson
> Manager, Compliance Engineering
> Telica, Inc.
> 734 Forest Street, Bldg. G, Suite 100
> Marlboro, MA 01752
> Tel:  (508) 804-8212
> Fax:  (508) 480-0922
> Email:jfinlay...@telica.com
> Web:  www.telica.com
> 

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For Auction: Techron 7560 DC to 40kHz Amplifier 1000Watts

2002-09-23 Thread Kurt M. Marden 


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1769492510

Please contact me with any questions at the following email address:
kurt...@netscape.net

Thanks,
Kurt

--
Kurt M. Marden




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Re: British fused plugs -

2002-09-23 Thread Lou Aiken 

Many, if not all, British socket outlets have shutters just behind the
access openings to the L&N contacts.  The purpose of the unused earthing pin
is to contact a  cam just inside the access opening to the earth contact,
that mechanically opens the shutters  allowing the L&N pins to enter the
socket.  The shutters stay closed whenever the socket has no plug present to
prevent contact with the L or N pins.  I suppose this additional protection
is considered necessary for children in the UK.

Rgds, Lou

Lou Aiken, LaMer LLC
27109 Palmetto Drive
Orange Beach, AL
36561 USA

tel ++ 1 251 981 6786
fax ++ 1 251 981 3054
- Original Message -
From: Gary McInturff 
To: EMC-PSTC (E-mail) 
Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 12:02 PM
Subject: British fused plugs -



Cohorts.
I may be missing the obvious here.
I have a small UPS heading to Dubai. The requirement is for a British style
fused plug. The UPS itself, is ungrounded and smack full of agency
approvals.
When I asked the vendor for a power cord he provided two, one with the
ground pin, and the hot and neutral pins. The ground pin isn't connected to
anything at the equipment end. The second configuration, and the one I
anticipated getting, didn't have the ground pin on the input, or wall outlet
side of the power cord.
Maybe I'm missing something obvious here, but I see no application for a
floating ground pin on the wall outlet side of this connector given that it
isn't carried through to the equipment which it is powering?
What am I missing?
Gary

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Re: CE Marking for Passive speakers

2002-09-23 Thread John Woodgate 

I read in !emc-pstc that Tyra, John  wrote (in
<418fbd441c22d5118d860003470d43160543e...@cupid.bose.com>) about 'CE
Marking for Passive speakers' on Mon, 23 Sep 2002:
>Still cost money! Every page you print has a cost associated with it even if
>it is in the already existing instruction booklet..It may only be a fraction
>of a cent but it adds up fast!

Include it as part of an existing printed page. If your printer charges
you extra for that, get another printer.
-- 
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only. http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk 
Interested in professional sound reinforcement and distribution? Then go to 
http://www.isce.org.uk
PLEASE do NOT copy news posts to me by E-MAIL!

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coax grounding of E3/DS3 in the EU

2002-09-23 Thread pfitzgibbon 

Greetings all,

  I have a general question about E3/DS-3 in the EU.  I 
have heard that it is no longer necessary to isolate one 
of the two Tx/Rx coax ports but can't find a definite 
answer.  I'd like to know if I can directly tie both the 
TX and RX ports to chassis for intrabuilding only CO 
lines.  This would make EMI/EMC much easier to pass and 
would get rid of the special AC coupling that would 
otherwise be necessary.

The only reason that I could ever understand for the DC 
isolation requirements that used to be in place was to 
prevent ground connections in IBN CO's or to eliminate 
current on the shields due to differences in earth 
potential between buildings.  As neither of these really 
apply, I really don't see why it should still be 
necessary to provide the DC isolation (I have only 
intrabuilding lines and most CO's are now CBN 
installations).

Does anyone know what the current status on this is?  

Thanks,
Patrick

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EMC-PSTC now functional

2002-09-23 Thread Rich Nute 





The EMC-PSTC listserver was down from Friday
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British fused plugs -

2002-09-23 Thread Gary McInturff 

Cohorts.
I may be missing the obvious here.
I have a small UPS heading to Dubai. The requirement is for a British 
style fused plug. The UPS itself, is ungrounded and smack full of agency 
approvals.
When I asked the vendor for a power cord he provided two, one with the 
ground pin, and the hot and neutral pins. The ground pin isn't connected to 
anything at the equipment end. The second configuration, and the one I 
anticipated getting, didn't have the ground pin on the input, or wall outlet 
side of the power cord.
Maybe I'm missing something obvious here, but I see no application for 
a floating ground pin on the wall outlet side of this connector given that it 
isn't carried through to the equipment which it is powering?
What am I missing?
Gary

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