Re: [PSES] Machinery Directive 1.7.1

[John Woodgate]

In message 
<64D32EE8B9CBDD44963ACB076A5F6ABB0269B12B@Mailbox-Tech.lecotech.local>, 
dated Mon, 9 Jun 2014, "Kunde, Brian"  writes:


This has been a battle that has been going on for a long time. I wish 
we could come to some understanding.


France is a special case. The Academie Française exists to protect the 
French language and has pressed for the protection to be embodied in a 
very powerful French law. But it is often not enforced, so when it is, 
it comes as a big surprise. The law is particularly aimed at keeping 
foreign words, especially English words, out of use in France. It's a 
losing battle, but it hasn't lost yet.

--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] Machinery Directive 1.7.1

[Kunde, Brian]

Would you interpret the requirements of section 1.7.1 to only apply to 
"information" pertaining to a "warning"? For instance, does the FCC Statement 
have to be translated when it does not pertain in Europe?

How about English Text near a switch that says, "Main"? Is it good enough to 
show in the manual what the switch is for or do we also have to translate the 
word? If we changed the word "Main" to "CB1" then that would be ok? Or just 
remove any reverence and just explain the function in the manual?

How about I/O ports. I could make up some senseless squiggly lined symbol and 
explained its meaning in the manual and that is ok, but if I put the word 
"Input" near the port then I have to have it translated?  Why can't I just 
explain in the manual what "Input" means which we do anyway?

This has been a battle that has been going on for a long time. I wish we could 
come to some understanding.

Thanks for everyone's comments.

The Other Brian


-Original Message-
From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2014 4:04 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] Machinery Directive 1.7.1

In message
<64D32EE8B9CBDD44963ACB076A5F6ABB0269B066@Mailbox-Tech.lecotech.local>,
dated Mon, 9 Jun 2014, "Kunde, Brian"  writes:

>Here we go again. On and off over the last 30 years I have bumped heads
>over having English Text on warning labels on Worldwide marketed
>products shipped to non-English speaking countries. I was given the
>impression that Europe was ok with English Text as long as it was
>explained in the translated manual in an official language of the
>country sold.
>
>For this reason, we have been transitioning to use the new ANSI Style
>Warning labels which includes a pictogram, warning symbol, and English
>Text. But now I have been informed that a third party lab in France has
>found our product to be non-compliant. Here is their reason:
>
>"Warnings are not written in French on the machine and generate a
>confusion for operators."
>
>Is the third party lab correct and we need to remove all English text
>from warnings

No, but under French law you probably do need to add the French words.
This is one of those typical French laws that is enforced on the fourth 
Frewsday of every seventh month.

>which include pictograms and symbols or are they misinterpreting the
>requirements of 1.7.1, which says, "...warning must be expressed in an
>official Community language..". What does "expressed" mean?

'given', 'printed', moulded-in' ,'raised on a casting', 'etched', 'stamped' ... 
you name it.

>It technically doesn't say it has to be on the product,

I think it does: the heading of 1.7.1 says '.., on the machinery'.

>only expressed. Can expressed mean explained in the manual?
>
>This third party lab seemed to have misinterpreted several other
>requirements on the Machinery Directive so we are hoping this is
>another. I hate having to train third party labs in something they are
>getting paid to know.
>
>Any help, suggestions, or advice would be most appreciated.

Does you French agent know whether the test house is invoking the French 
language law or just being picky? If they are invoking the law, you must 
conform.
>
>The Other Brian
>
>PS: Here is the entire text of section 1.7.1 of the MD for your
>reference.
>
>1.7.1. Information and warnings on the machinery

>Information and warnings on the machinery should preferably be provided
>in the form of readily understandable symbols or pictograms. Any
>written or verbal information and warnings must be expressed in an
>official Community language or languages, which may be determined in
>accordance with the Treaty by the Member State in which the machinery
>is placed on the market and/or put into service and may be accompanied,
>on request, by versions in any other official Community language or
>languages understood by the operators.
>

--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Quid 
faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] Machinery Directive 1.7.1

[Nick Williams]

Brian,

In this instance, the lab is correct. You’ve only partially quoted EHSR 1.7.1; 
in full it reads:

"Information and warnings on the machinery

Information and warnings on the machinery should preferably be provided in the 
form of readily understandable symbols or pictograms. Any written or verbal 
information and warnings must be expressed in an official Community language or 
languages, which may be determined in accordance with the Treaty by the Member 
State in which the machinery is placed on the market and/or put into service 
and may be accompanied, on request, by versions in any other official Community 
language or languages understood by the operators.”

The key words are "which may be determined in accordance with the Treaty by the 
Member State in which the machinery is placed on the market”. France will say 
it all has to be in French. 

The Commission Guide to the Directive says:

"The second sentence of section 1.7.1 applies when information is provided in 
the form of written words or text on the machinery, on a monitor screen or in 
the form of oral text provided, for example, by means of voice synthesiser. In 
such cases the information and warnings must be provided in the official 
language or languages of the Member States in which the machinery is placed on 
the market and/or put into service.“

You could have pictograms only, with the meaning explained in French (and other 
languages) in the manual, but you cannot have an explanation in English if it 
is not also provided in the local language.

This may be a strict interpretation, and in practice, you may be able to ‘get 
away’ with a more relaxed approach, but the lab are correct in what they are 
saying. Bearing in mind that the French authorities may well take the same 
view, it would be wrong of them to take a more relaxed approach. 

Not the news you wanted, I’m afraid!

Nick. 



On 9 Jun 2014, at 19:35, Kunde, Brian  wrote:

> Here we go again. On and off over the last 30 years I have bumped heads over 
> having English Text on warning labels on Worldwide marketed products shipped 
> to non-English speaking countries. I was given the impression that Europe was 
> ok with English Text as long as it was explained in the translated manual in 
> an official language of the country sold.
> 
> For this reason, we have been transitioning to use the new ANSI Style Warning 
> labels which includes a pictogram, warning symbol, and English Text. But now 
> I have been informed that a third party lab in France has found our product 
> to be non-compliant. Here is their reason:
> 
> "Warnings are not written in French on the machine and generate a confusion 
> for operators."
> 
> Is the third party lab correct and we need to remove all English text from 
> warnings which include pictograms and symbols or are they misinterpreting the 
> requirements of 1.7.1, which says, "...warning must be expressed in an 
> official Community language..". What does "expressed" mean? It technically 
> doesn't say it has to be on the product, only expressed. Can expressed mean 
> explained in the manual?
> 
> This third party lab seemed to have misinterpreted several other requirements 
> on the Machinery Directive so we are hoping this is another. I hate having to 
> train third party labs in something they are getting paid to know.
> 
> Any help, suggestions, or advice would be most appreciated.
> 
> The Other Brian
> 
> PS: Here is the entire text of section 1.7.1 of the MD for your reference.
> 
> 1.7.1. Information and warnings on the machinery
> Information and warnings on the machinery should preferably be provided in 
> the form of readily understandable
> symbols or pictograms. Any written or verbal information and warnings must be 
> expressed in an official
> Community language or languages, which may be determined in accordance with 
> the Treaty by the Member
> State in which the machinery is placed on the market and/or put into service 
> and may be accompanied, on
> request, by versions in any other official Community language or languages 
> understood by the operators.
> 
> 
> LECO Corporation Notice: This communication may contain confidential 
> information intended for the named recipient(s) only. If you received this by 
> mistake, please destroy it and notify us of the error. Thank you.
> 
> -
> 
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 
> 
> 
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
> 
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
> formats), large files, etc.
> 
> Website:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/
> Instructions:  http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html

Re: [PSES] Machinery Directive 1.7.1

[John Woodgate]

In message 
<64D32EE8B9CBDD44963ACB076A5F6ABB0269B066@Mailbox-Tech.lecotech.local>, 
dated Mon, 9 Jun 2014, "Kunde, Brian"  writes:


Here we go again. On and off over the last 30 years I have bumped heads 
over having English Text on warning labels on Worldwide marketed 
products shipped to non-English speaking countries. I was given the 
impression that Europe was ok with English Text as long as it was 
explained in the translated manual in an official language of the 
country sold.


For this reason, we have been transitioning to use the new ANSI Style 
Warning labels which includes a pictogram, warning symbol, and English 
Text. But now I have been informed that a third party lab in France has 
found our product to be non-compliant. Here is their reason:


"Warnings are not written in French on the machine and generate a 
confusion for operators."


Is the third party lab correct and we need to remove all English text 
from warnings


No, but under French law you probably do need to add the French words. 
This is one of those typical French laws that is enforced on the fourth 
Frewsday of every seventh month.


which include pictograms and symbols or are they misinterpreting the 
requirements of 1.7.1, which says, "...warning must be expressed in an 
official Community language..". What does "expressed" mean?


'given', 'printed', moulded-in' ,'raised on a casting', 'etched', 
'stamped' ... you name it.



It technically doesn't say it has to be on the product,


I think it does: the heading of 1.7.1 says '.., on the machinery'.


only expressed. Can expressed mean explained in the manual?

This third party lab seemed to have misinterpreted several other 
requirements on the Machinery Directive so we are hoping this is 
another. I hate having to train third party labs in something they are 
getting paid to know.


Any help, suggestions, or advice would be most appreciated.


Does you French agent know whether the test house is invoking the French 
language law or just being picky? If they are invoking the law, you must 
conform.


The Other Brian

PS: Here is the entire text of section 1.7.1 of the MD for your 
reference.


1.7.1. Information and warnings on the machinery


Information and warnings on the machinery should preferably be provided 
in the form of readily understandable symbols or pictograms. Any 
written or verbal information and warnings must be expressed in an 
official Community language or languages, which may be determined in 
accordance with the Treaty by the Member State in which the machinery 
is placed on the market and/or put into service and may be accompanied, 
on request, by versions in any other official Community language or 
languages understood by the operators.




--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

-

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[PSES] Machinery Directive 1.7.1

[Kunde, Brian]

Here we go again. On and off over the last 30 years I have bumped heads over 
having English Text on warning labels on Worldwide marketed products shipped to 
non-English speaking countries. I was given the impression that Europe was ok 
with English Text as long as it was explained in the translated manual in an 
official language of the country sold.

For this reason, we have been transitioning to use the new ANSI Style Warning 
labels which includes a pictogram, warning symbol, and English Text. But now I 
have been informed that a third party lab in France has found our product to be 
non-compliant. Here is their reason:

"Warnings are not written in French on the machine and generate a confusion for 
operators."

Is the third party lab correct and we need to remove all English text from 
warnings which include pictograms and symbols or are they misinterpreting the 
requirements of 1.7.1, which says, "...warning must be expressed in an official 
Community language..". What does "expressed" mean? It technically doesn't say 
it has to be on the product, only expressed. Can expressed mean explained in 
the manual?

This third party lab seemed to have misinterpreted several other requirements 
on the Machinery Directive so we are hoping this is another. I hate having to 
train third party labs in something they are getting paid to know.

Any help, suggestions, or advice would be most appreciated.

The Other Brian

PS: Here is the entire text of section 1.7.1 of the MD for your reference.

1.7.1. Information and warnings on the machinery
Information and warnings on the machinery should preferably be provided in the 
form of readily understandable
symbols or pictograms. Any written or verbal information and warnings must be 
expressed in an official
Community language or languages, which may be determined in accordance with the 
Treaty by the Member
State in which the machinery is placed on the market and/or put into service 
and may be accompanied, on
request, by versions in any other official Community language or languages 
understood by the operators.


LECO Corporation Notice: This communication may contain confidential 
information intended for the named recipient(s) only. If you received this by 
mistake, please destroy it and notify us of the error. Thank you.

-

This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc 
discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
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Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
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formats), large files, etc.

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Re: [PSES] EN55032 and the Digital Television/Monitor Reference Test Pattern of ITU-R BT.1729

[monrad monsen]

Hi!
Unfortunately, Tom Sato's software does not fully comply with ITU-R 
BT.1729.  The big discrepancy is listed below:
 ** ZONE 12 MOVING BAR:  Page 6 of the standard states that "Zone 12 
contains a bar which moves horizontally from left to right and then 
starts again from the left. This is used for checking audio-video 
synchronization and to establish that the channel is active. The bar 
travels horizontally across its zone in 1 s. The audio sync signal is 
given when the bar passes the centreline."  (Page 6 or PDF page 8) There 
is more description to the zone 12 in the standard, but the above quote 
is sufficient to show that Tom's bar does not conform.  Zone 12 is the 
second row from the bottom in the circle portion of the screen.  (Page 3 
or PDF page 5)


The ITU-R BT.1729 standard is at the address below.
http://www.itu.int/dms_pubrec/itu-r/rec/bt/R-REC-BT.1729-0-200504-I!!PDF-E.pdf

I like Tom's application because it works on Java enabled web browsers, 
but Tom has no intention of fixing the Zone 12 moving bar.   As a 
result, I am not able to use his application.  I note that there is also 
nothing in the standard that allows use of a bouncing ball, but I like 
the feature and one could argue that this might catch some problems 
missed without it.


Does anyone have a software recommendation that fully implements the 
ITU-R BT.1729 as is required for CISPR32 / EN55032 emissions testing?


Monrad

On 6/6/2014 1:08 PM, Ted Eckert wrote:

Here is the link to Tom Sato's site.
http://homepage3.nifty.com/tsato/scrolling-h/colorbar.html


This email message and attachments may contain confidential and proprietary 
information.  Any unauthorized use is prohibited.  If you are not the intended 
recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of 
the original message and attachments.

-Original Message-
From: Brian Oconnell [mailto:oconne...@tamuracorp.com]
Sent: Friday, June 6, 2014 12:02 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] EN55032 and the Digital Television/Monitor Reference Test 
Pattern of ITU-R BT.1729

Mr. Tom Sato has some of the bouncing ball stuff source published on his web 
site.

And have seen other sites with 1729 stuff.

Brian


From: monrad monsen [mailto:monrad.mon...@oracle.com]
Sent: Friday, June 06, 2014 10:33 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] EN55032 and the Digital Television/Monitor Reference Test 
Pattern of ITU-R BT.1729

Hi!
For EN55032:2012, stand alone monitors must be emissions tested with a "standard 
television colour bar signal according to ITU-R BT 1729 with an additional small moving 
element."  This signal is defined in  ITU-R BT.1729 which gives a digital television 
reference test pattern.  Does anyone have a source for a software routine that puts out 
the reference test pattern?

Ideally, I would like the reference test pattern software with compiled 
executable files to support testing with each of the major operating systems 
like Windows, Solaris,  and Linux.

Thanks.

Monrad Monsen

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[PSES] Myanmar import restriction laws

[Brian Oconnell]

After U.S. Treasury Department issued General License No. 18, my employer has 
investigated the re-start of Myanmar factory.

Have received different stories from various NRTLs and other Notified and 
various assessment bodies. Some have interpreted U.S. policy to indicate ok to 
send people to 'Burma' to re-start the factory CIG/IPI process, others say that 
the mother country disallows them processing a request to add Myanmar site to 
the authorized factory list on the cert.

So what are the legal and political directives of your assessment body? Is 
there a tabulation available of the various national laws affecting import from 
this state?

Thanks,
Brian

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Re: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

[Pettit, Ghery]

You make an excellent point.  Please forward your suggestion to Martin Wright 
as he is the Chairman of SC I.

Ghery S. Pettit

-Original Message-
From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk] 
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2014 9:29 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

In message 
<63e38a5b081437478c77651f3d56c64f58052...@orsmsx102.amr.corp.intel.com>, 
dated Mon, 9 Jun 2014, "Pettit, Ghery"  writes:

>Some confusion with the way I worded my sentence.  By "I" I meant SC I, 
>not me personally.  Exactly how this is handled with be up to SC I in 
>its next meeting, scheduled for 20 October in Frankfurt.

I thought it was a bit odd, but I did not guess the reason. I still 
think a DC might be a good idea.
-- 
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

[John Woodgate]

In message 
<63e38a5b081437478c77651f3d56c64f58052...@orsmsx102.amr.corp.intel.com>, 
dated Mon, 9 Jun 2014, "Pettit, Ghery"  writes:


Some confusion with the way I worded my sentence.  By "I" I meant SC I, 
not me personally.  Exactly how this is handled with be up to SC I in 
its next meeting, scheduled for 20 October in Frankfurt.


I thought it was a bit odd, but I did not guess the reason. I still 
think a DC might be a good idea.

--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

[Pettit, Ghery]

Some confusion with the way I worded my sentence.  By "I" I meant SC I, not me 
personally.  Exactly how this is handled with be up to SC I in its next 
meeting, scheduled for 20 October in Frankfurt.

Ghery S. Pettit

-Original Message-
From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk] 
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2014 9:03 AM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

In message 
<63e38a5b081437478c77651f3d56c64f58052...@orsmsx102.amr.corp.intel.com>, 
dated Mon, 9 Jun 2014, "Pettit, Ghery"  writes:

>There's a chance that I will direct WG4 to resolve the national 
>committee comments on the FDIS and go with a CDV, skipping the CD 
>stage.

I think it's a bold move, but if the CDV is not accepted, the situation 
will be worse. I wonder if you would consider circulating the proposed 
CDV text as a DC with a short comment time? A DC gives a lot more scope 
for explaining why some decisions were made.

> But, you are correct in that there is not enough time left in the 
>project to go the CDV/FDIS route, so an NP will be required.  But, for 
>CENELEC to state that CISPR I has abandoned CISPR 35 is a gross 
>misstatement of the facts as I understand them.

I'm sure it's a simple misunderstanding that will be corrected.
-- 
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

[John Woodgate]

In message 
<63e38a5b081437478c77651f3d56c64f58052...@orsmsx102.amr.corp.intel.com>, 
dated Mon, 9 Jun 2014, "Pettit, Ghery"  writes:


There's a chance that I will direct WG4 to resolve the national 
committee comments on the FDIS and go with a CDV, skipping the CD 
stage.


I think it's a bold move, but if the CDV is not accepted, the situation 
will be worse. I wonder if you would consider circulating the proposed 
CDV text as a DC with a short comment time? A DC gives a lot more scope 
for explaining why some decisions were made.


But, you are correct in that there is not enough time left in the 
project to go the CDV/FDIS route, so an NP will be required.  But, for 
CENELEC to state that CISPR I has abandoned CISPR 35 is a gross 
misstatement of the facts as I understand them.


I'm sure it's a simple misunderstanding that will be corrected.
--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

[Pettit, Ghery]

John,

There's a chance that I will direct WG4 to resolve the national committee 
comments on the FDIS and go with a CDV, skipping the CD stage.  But, you are 
correct in that there is not enough time left in the project to go the CDV/FDIS 
route, so an NP will be required.  But, for CENELEC to state that CISPR I has 
abandoned CISPR 35 is a gross misstatement of the facts as I understand them.

Ghery S. Pettit

-Original Message-
From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk] 
Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 1:44 PM
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] CISPR 35/EN 55035

CENELEC has decided not to proceed with EN 55035, even under a new 
number.

Curiously, there is a CENELEC report that says that CISPR/I has 
abandoned CISPR 35, but the IEC web site doesn't confirm that. It says 
that the FDIS failed and a CD will be discussed at the next meeting. But 
the project will run out of time unless an exception is granted (which 
might be sensible), so the project would revert to Stage Zero and need a 
New Work proposal before a new CD could be issued.

It's extremely improbable that a New Work proposal would be voted down; 
everyone agrees that an immunity standard for multimedia is essential. 
So Stage Zero and NP voting would just add months to the process time, 
for no discernible reason.
-- 
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

[Scott Xe]

Hi Tony,

Thanks for useful info.  Highly recommended!

Noticeable changes are that all radio receivers including broadcast radio
and TV receivers now fall into RED.  TTE is now within the scope of the EMC
Directive and LVD.  The safety requirements set out in LVD with no voltage
limit applying...

Regards,

Scott

On 9/6/14 4:30 pm, "Anthony Thomson"  wrote:

>  
> Scott,
>  
> TUV have this free Webinar, it might be useful.
> http://www.tuv-sud.co.uk/uk-en/resource-centre/webinars/webinar-downloads
>  
> I can't comment because I haven't watched it yet, but I will do. Let me know
> if it's a 'must see'.
>  
> Regards,
> Tony
> Sent: Friday, June 06, 2014 at 4:20 PM From: "Scott Xe" 
> To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: Re: [PSES] New EU Directives
> Thanks! What is the major impact on own brand labelers? Regards, Scott On
> 6/6/14 5:53 am, "T.Sato"  wrote: > On Fri, 6 Jun 2014
> 00:49:58 +0800, > Scott Xe  wrote: > >> Is there any
> reason behind to have LVD, EMC and R&TTE directives updated in >> similar
> time? > > To align them with NLF, all the new approach directives which were >
> not aligned with NLF were/will be updated even if no other changes > were
> necessary. > > For some directives such as R&TTED (RED), other significant
> changes > were also made. > > NLF itself have big impact, and I guess own
> brand labelers who supplied > completed product from OEMs may have hard time.
> > > Regards, > Tom > > - >
>  > This
> message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc >
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to >
>  > > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on
> the web at: > http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html > > Attachments are not
> permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at >
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics -
>  This message
> is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list.
> To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to  All
> emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html Attachments are not permitted but the
> IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/
> can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. Website:
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> 
> 
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> formats), large files, etc.
> 
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Re: [PSES] List of Harmonised standards for RED

[John Woodgate]

In message <20f901cf83c7$bc77eba0$3567c2e0$@acbcert.com>, dated Mon, 9 
Jun 2014, Michael Derby  writes:



11:59pm on 11th June 2016 ?


23:59:59 UTC-12.
--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] List of Harmonised standards for RED

[Michael Derby]

OJ for RED?

 

11:59pm on 11th June 2016 ?

 

J

 

 

 

Michael Derby

Regulatory Engineer

ACB Europe

 

From: Charlie Blackham [mailto:char...@sulisconsultants.com] 
Sent: 08 June 2014 20:32
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] List of Harmonised standards for RED

 

David

 

It's unlikely to be any time soon.

 

The scope of the RED is different to the R&TTE, so there will be products
transitioning between R&TTE/RED and the EMC and LV Directives - this will
take a bit of time to coordinate.

 

The Commission is planning a workshop on the RED is late November - I don't
expect much to happen until sometime after that

 

Regards 

Charlie

 

From: itl-emc user group [mailto:itl...@itl.co.il] 
Sent: 08 June 2014 04:50
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: [PSES] List of Harmonised standards for RED

 

Hi

Does anyone know of a target date for a list of harmonised standards for the
RED.

I just checked the web site and the list for RTTE still appears but no RED.

 

Regards,

David Shidlowsky | Technical Writer

Address 1 Bat-Sheva St. POB 87, LOD 71100 Israel

Tel 972-8-9186113 Fax 972-8-9153101

Mail e...@itl.co.il/dav...@itl.co.il  Web  
www.itl.co.il

 

  Fill out Customer
Satisfaction Survey

Global Certifications You Can Trust 

 

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Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

[Michael Derby]

Hello,

Yes, the RED is just like the R&TTED in that sense.

Presently:   If a device has a radio in it (such as a laptop with WiFi, or
other digital device with Bluetooth, etc.), then the R&TTE Directive applies
to that device.   The R&TTE Directive includes EMC and Safety, so the EMC
and Safety (LV) Directives do not apply to that device.

Similarly with the RED, it includes EMC and Safety, so the EMC Directive and
the Safety Directive will continue not to apply to radio products.

However, the EMC and Safety requirements within the R&TTE and RE Directives
are equivalent to the requirements of the EMC and Safety Directives, with a
few noteworthy exceptions.   (For example, there is no minimum voltage limit
for radio equipment, so all battery powered equipment would need a safety
assessment)


Michael.


Michael Derby
Regulatory Engineer
ACB Europe


-Original Message-
From: John Woodgate [mailto:j...@jmwa.demon.co.uk] 
Sent: 09 June 2014 10:07
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

In message <20af01cf83c0$8988ff10$9c9afd30$@acbcert.com>, dated Mon, 9 Jun
2014, Michael Derby  writes:

>
>"When deemed appropriate with regard to the risks presented by radio 
>equipment, importers shall, to protect the health and safety of 
>end-users,

So the RED, unlike the EMCD, includes provisions for electrical safety?
--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Quid
faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

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Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

[John Woodgate]

In message <20af01cf83c0$8988ff10$9c9afd30$@acbcert.com>, dated Mon, 9 
Jun 2014, Michael Derby  writes:




"When deemed appropriate with regard to the risks presented by radio 
equipment, importers shall, to protect the health and safety of 
end-users,


So the RED, unlike the EMCD, includes provisions for electrical safety?
--
OOO - Own Opinions Only. With best wishes. See www.jmwa.demon.co.uk
Quid faciamus nisi sit?
John Woodgate, J M Woodgate and Associates, Rayleigh, Essex UK

-

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Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

[Michael Derby]

Hi Scott,

I think that two important points to consider for anyone re-branding a
product is this:

The new Radio Equipment Directive states:

"The manufacturer, having detailed knowledge of the design and production
process, is best placed to carry out the conformity assessment procedure.
Conformity assessment should therefore remain solely the obligation of the
manufacturer. "

It then states:

"Any economic operator that either places radio equipment on the market
under his own name or trade mark or modifies radio equipment in such a way
that compliance with this Directive may be affected should be considered to
be the manufacturer and should assume the obligations of the manufacturer. "


The Directive effectively also states that any importer who has concerns
about the compliance of the device they import, should get it tested.

"When deemed appropriate with regard to the risks presented by radio
equipment, importers shall, to protect the health and safety of end-users,
carry out sample testing of radio equipment made available on the market,
investigate, and, if necessary, keep a register of complaints, of
non-conforming radio equipment and radio equipment recalls, and shall keep
distributors informed of any such monitoring.

Importers who consider or have reason to believe that radio equipment which
they have placed on the market is not in conformity with this Directive
shall immediately take the corrective measures necessary to bring that radio
equipment into conformity, to withdraw it or recall it, if appropriate.
Furthermore, where the radio equipment presents a risk, importers shall
immediately inform the competent national authorities of the Member  states
in which they made the radio equipment available on the market to that
effect, giving details, in particular, of the non-compliance and of any
corrective measures taken. "


Thanks,   Michael.



Michael Derby
Regulatory Engineer
ACB Europe


-Original Message-
From: Scott Xe [mailto:scott...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 06 June 2014 16:20
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

Thanks!  What is the major impact on own brand labelers?

Regards,

Scott


On 6/6/14 5:53 am, "T.Sato"  wrote:

> On Fri, 6 Jun 2014 00:49:58 +0800,
>   Scott Xe  wrote:
> 
>> Is there any reason behind to have LVD, EMC and R&TTE directives 
>> updated in similar time?
> 
> To align them with NLF, all the new approach directives which were not 
> aligned with NLF were/will be updated even if no other changes were 
> necessary.
> 
> For some directives such as R&TTED (RED), other significant changes 
> were also made.
> 
> NLF itself have big impact, and I guess own brand labelers who 
> supplied completed product from OEMs may have hard time.
> 
> Regards,
> Tom
> 
> -
> 
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society 
> emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your 
> e-mail to 
> 
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
> 
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities 
> site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for 
> graphics

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Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

[Anthony Thomson]

 

Scott,

 

TUV have this free Webinar, it might be useful.

http://www.tuv-sud.co.uk/uk-en/resource-centre/webinars/webinar-downloads

 

I can't comment because I haven't watched it yet, but I will do. Let me know if it's a 'must see'.

 

Regards,

Tony


Sent: Friday, June 06, 2014 at 4:20 PM
From: "Scott Xe" 
To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG
Subject: Re: [PSES] New EU Directives

Thanks! What is the major impact on own brand labelers?

Regards,

Scott


On 6/6/14 5:53 am, "T.Sato"  wrote:

> On Fri, 6 Jun 2014 00:49:58 +0800,
> Scott Xe  wrote:
>
>> Is there any reason behind to have LVD, EMC and R&TTE directives updated in
>> similar time?
>
> To align them with NLF, all the new approach directives which were
> not aligned with NLF were/will be updated even if no other changes
> were necessary.
>
> For some directives such as R&TTED (RED), other significant changes
> were also made.
>
> NLF itself have big impact, and I guess own brand labelers who supplied
> completed product from OEMs may have hard time.
>
> Regards,
> Tom
>
> -
> 
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to
> 
>
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
>
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics

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This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to 

All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
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Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc.


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