Re: [PSES] Filter Issues [General Use]

[Price, Andrew (Leonardo, UK)]

Hi all

Thanks for the replies,

The filter is a ETS Lindgren Filter N6003 installed on the EMC Chamber wall.
The filter is defined as a 4 line 230/400V 32A  <450Hz filter.
When used for DEF STAN EMC measurements and loaded by the 4 of 10uF prior to 
the 5uH LISNs it appears to be OK,
however when only 1 phase is used it seems to cause an imbalance.

The ambient measurement shows the 400Hz and harmonics. Other than the region 
6kHz to 50kHz which exceeds the specified limit the rest of the frequency range 
is flat and meets the 6dB below the specified limit criteria.
The use of 10uF on each supply lead on the load side of the LISN's improves the 
response of the 6kHz to 50kHz region but this is still within 6dB of the 
specified limit.

Is there anything that can be done to improve the chamber filter performance?

The original 155V 400Hz generator never caused any issues, when it was replaced 
had an issue with the filter being noisy.
Chamber was replaced when EMC facility moved to a new building.
Originally 115V 400Hz to be taken from building supply but LISN's kept tripping 
supply.
Now supply obtained from a Failsafe SFC 6010 Static Convertor.
Regards
Andy



 Andrew Price
 Integrated Sensing & Protection (ISP)
 Prinicpal Environmental Engineer (EMC)

 Leonardo UK
 Sigma House,
 Christopher Martin Rd,
 Basildon
 SS14 3EL, UK
 Tel  EMC LAB : +44 (0)1268 883308
 Mobile: +44 (0)7507 854888
 
andrew.p.pr...@leonardocompany.com
 leonardocomapany.com
HELICOPTERS / AERONAUTICS / ELECTRONICS, DEFENCE AND SECURITY SYSTEMS / SPACE

P Please consider the environment before printing this email.



Leonardo UK Ltd

Registered Office: 1 Eagle Place, St James’s, London SW1Y 6AF

A company registered in England & Wales.  Company no. 02426132



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Re: [PSES] Filter Issues [General Use]

[Ken Javor]

Another possibility is adjusting power factor to account for the filter
effect. This is a common effect and a chamber outfitted with such filters
often has remotely-controlled power factor correction.  A long time ago,
when chamber EMI filters cut in at 150 kHz instead of 10 kHz, the impact
wasn¹t as pronounced, but there just isn¹t enough space between a ~1 kHz
pass band and 10 kHz 100 dB stop-band for the filters to have zero effect at
400 Hz.

Ken Javor
Phone: (256) 650-5261



From: John Woodgate 
Organization: J M Woodgate and Associates
Reply-To: John Woodgate 
Date: Wed, 27 Oct 2021 13:32:22 +0100
To: 
Subject: Re: [PSES] Filter Issues [General Use]

   

The filter is probably designed for 50Hz or 60 Hz mains. It probably isn't
saturating at a higher input frequency, but your voltage measurements
indicate that it may be resonating. I think you need a filter specifically
designed for 400 Hz mains.
 
 

==
 Best wishes John Woodgate OOO-Own Opinions Only
 www.woodjohn.uk <http://www.woodjohn.uk>
 Rayleigh, Essex UK
 Istae nunc praetereunt nisi non ubicumque
 
 
 
 
 
On 2021-10-27 10:56, Price, Andrew (Leonardo, UK) wrote:
 
 
> 
>  
> 
> Hi members
>  
>  
>  
> Can anyone offer some advice.
>  
> Have issues with EMC Chamber RF Filter 3 phase.
>  
> Using 115V 400Hz single phase supply from a static convertor, filter looks
> like it is saturating.
>  
> Ambient levels failing between 6kHz to 150kHz.
>  
> Voltage of phase at static convertor 115.8Vrms but at EUT on bench 132Vrms
>  
>  
>  
> Regards
>  
> Andy
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  Andrew Price
>       Integrated Sensing & Protection (ISP)
>  
>  Prinicpal Environmental Engineer (EMC)
>  
>  
>  
>  Leonardo UK
>   Sigma House,
>  
>  Christopher Martin Rd,
>  
>  Basildon
>  
>  SS14 3EL, UK
>   Tel  EMC LAB : +44 (0)1268 883308
>  
>  Mobile: +44 (0)7507 854888
>  
>  andrew.p.pr...@leonardocompany.com
> <mailto:andrew.p.pr...@leonardocompany.com>
>  
>      leonardocomapany.com
>  
> HELICOPTERS / AERONAUTICS / ELECTRONICS, DEFENCE AND SECURITY SYSTEMS / SPACE
>  
>  
>  
> P Please consider the environment before printing this email.
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> Leonardo UK Ltd
>  
> 
> Registered Office: 1 Eagle Place, St James¹s, London SW1Y 6AF
>  
> 
> A company registered in England & Wales.  Company no. 02426132
>  
> 
> 
>  
> 
> This email and any attachments are confidential to the intended
>  
> 
> recipient and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended
>  
> 
> recipient please delete it from your system and notify the sender.
>  
> 
> You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose or
>  
> 
> distribute its contents to any other person.
>  
> 
> 
>  -
>  
>  
> 
> This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc
> discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to
> 
>  
> 
> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at:
> http://www.ieee-pses.org/emc-pstc.html
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> 
> Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at
> http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used
> formats), large files, etc.
>  
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> Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/
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> unsubscribe) <http://www.ieee-pses.org/list.html>
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Re: [PSES] Filter Issues [General Use]

[John Woodgate]

The filter is probably designed for 50Hz or 60 Hz mains. It probably 
isn't saturating at a higher input frequency, but your voltage 
measurements indicate that it may be resonating. I think you need a 
filter specifically designed for 400 Hz mains.


==
Best wishes John Woodgate OOO-Own Opinions Only
www.woodjohn.uk
Rayleigh, Essex UK
Istae nunc praetereunt nisi non ubicumque



On 2021-10-27 10:56, Price, Andrew (Leonardo, UK) wrote:


Hi members

Can anyone offer some advice.

Have issues with EMC Chamber RF Filter 3 phase.

Using 115V 400Hz single phase supply from a static convertor, filter 
looks like it is saturating.


Ambient levels failing between 6kHz to 150kHz.

Voltage of phase at static convertor 115.8Vrms but at EUT on bench 132Vrms

Regards

Andy

*Andrew Price*
Integrated Sensing & Protection (ISP)

Prinicpal Environmental Engineer (EMC)

 Leonardo UK
 Sigma House,

 Christopher Martin Rd,

 Basildon

 SS14 3EL, UK
 Tel  EMC LAB : +44 (0)1268 883308

Mobile: +44 (0)7507 854888

_andrew.p.pr...@leonardocompany.com 
_


leonardocomapany.com

HELICOPTERS / AERONAUTICS / ELECTRONICS, DEFENCE AND SECURITY SYSTEMS 
/ SPACE


P /Please consider the environment before printing this email./

Leonardo UK Ltd

Registered Office: 1 Eagle Place, St James’s, London SW1Y 6AF

A company registered in England & Wales.  Company no. 02426132



This email and any attachments are confidential to the intended

recipient and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended

recipient please delete it from your system and notify the sender.

You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose or

distribute its contents to any other person.



-


This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society 
emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your 
e-mail to 


All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: 
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Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities 
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graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc.


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Mike Cantwell 

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David Heald 



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Attachments are not permitted but the IEEE PSES Online Communities site at 
http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ can be used for graphics (in well-used 
formats), large files, etc.

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List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html

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