Re: [Emc-users] Phone security Re: Toolchanges
On Wed, Mar 26, 2014 at 5:21 PM, Gregg Eshelman g_ala...@yahoo.com wrote: On 3/26/2014 3:19 AM, Mark Wendt wrote: ROFL! Them phone mit keypads on 'em are getting harder and harder to find. We had a real problem here at work for a while, since they banned cameras from the installation. It was getting impossible to find phones that didn't have a camera. They finally loosened up that rule a bit and now we're allowed to bring our phones onto the base again. Easy to take care of that. Everyone bringing a phone in gets a bright green sticker to apply over the phone camera lens. Could have some made up with adhesive just around the edge and formulated so they'll only stick once or change color if they're peeled off and re-applied. When you leave, the stickers get checked. No sticker? You have to show you don't have any photos of the inside of the building. 'Course someone could steal some of the stickers... Another option would be company issued phones with a piece of opaque plastic super glued over the camera lens or carefully hit the lens with a glass bead blaster. Even easier was what they did. Lift the cell phone ban with cameras. ;-) I certainly wouldn't want anyone putting a sticker over any camera lens that I owned. Even if it was only around the edge of the sticker, eventually some adhesive would find a way onto the lens. This is a government installation, with both gummint employees and contractors. Along with a ton of visitors every day. They finally realized they didn't have a bin big enough to hold every single person's cell phone until they checked out at the end of the day. The gummint actually used a little common sense for once letting folks hold on to their cell phones. Mark -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] two speed backgear vs spindle speed control
Hi all; Sorry if this is the 2nd post, the first one hasn't come back in quite a few hours. What would be the usual way to toss a gear change constant into a servo speed control so that the PID.#.error band is relatively well centered in both gears? My mental what ifs are telling me I need to play with both Pgain and the first 2 FF's to arrive at a max feedback without instability. I have one input left that I could use to report a switch was closed by the lever being in high gear. If anyone else has done this, I could use some advice. Thanks. Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] Rotary axis system
Hi I am having trouble getting my router to run a fourth rotary axis nicely. It does the job. but rapid and cut speeds both seem very inconsistant. I notice that there is a configuration page for such a machine on the wiki site, but it looks pretty complicated. What benefits does it have over simply configuring with the stepper wizard, and if it does improve performance, I would be grateful if someone could talk a complete ejit through setting it up. Here she is speeded up x a zillion http://www.cnccraft.co.uk/3-dimensional-work/ Thanks Aaron Tel: 01209 890084 Mob: 07805686188 Email:aaronmo...@linuxmail.org Web: www.cnccraft.co.uk www.re-formfurniture.co.uk -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] two speed backgear vs spindle speed control
On 27 March 2014 09:50, Gene Heskett ghesk...@wdtv.com wrote: What would be the usual way to toss a gear change constant into a servo speed control so that the PID.#.error band is relatively well centered in both gears? You could try using http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/gearchange.9.html after the PID and before the DAC. Alternatively there is lincurve for altering PID parameters on the basis of something else. I have one input left that I could use to report a switch was closed by the lever being in high gear. On my mill I auto-detect the engaged gear (but I don't use any PID, I just trust the DAC to be linear enough for my purposes.) http://linuxcnc.org/hardy/dapper/index.php/english/forum/47-hal-examples/27071-automatic-spindle-gear-detection -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Rotary axis system
On 27 March 2014 11:08, aaron moore aaronmo...@linuxmail.org wrote: I am having trouble getting my router to run a fourth rotary axis nicely. It does the job. but rapid and cut speeds both seem very inconsistant. A combined X/Y/Z and A rapid move will run at a speed such that all axes arrive at the end-point at the same time. What you might be seeing is the linear axes being slowed down because the rotary axis can't keep up. So, an X-rapid with an A-move will happen at very different speeds depending on how far the A-axis is moving. I notice that there is a configuration page for such a machine on the wiki site, but it looks pretty complicated. What benefits does it have over simply configuring with the stepper wizard, Hard to say without the link :-) -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Rotary axis system
- Original Message - From: andy pugh Sent: 03/27/14 12:49 PM To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Rotary axis system On 27 March 2014 11:08, aaron moore aaronmo...@linuxmail.org wrote: I am having trouble getting my router to run a fourth rotary axis nicely. It does the job. but rapid and cut speeds both seem very inconsistant. A combined X/Y/Z and A rapid move will run at a speed such that all axes arrive at the end-point at the same time. What you might be seeing is the linear axes being slowed down because the rotary axis can't keep up. So, an X-rapid with an A-move will happen at very different speeds depending on how far the A-axis is moving. I notice that there is a configuration page for such a machine on the wiki site, but it looks pretty complicated. What benefits does it have over simply configuring with the stepper wizard, Hard to say without the link :-) Here is the link to the wiki page http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Rot4thaxiskins I have seen. On a number of jobs I have done recently all axix will go significantly faster and at certain points during the job they seemin gly double their feed speed then slow down again. A rapid x move is very slow. I do have very slow old computer.will this affect speed? None of this makes any sense to me. Cheers Aaron -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Tel: 01209 890084 Mob: 07805686188 Email:aaronmo...@linuxmail.org Web: www.cnccraft.co.uk www.re-formfurniture.co.uk -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Rotary axis system
On 27 March 2014 13:26, aaron moore aaronmo...@linuxmail.org wrote: I notice that there is a configuration page for such a machine on the wiki site, but it looks pretty complicated. Here is the link to the wiki page http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Rot4thaxiskins That is for a system with a tool-tip coordinate system. Unless you are producing XYZAUVW G-code then that kinematics won't be any help to you. I have seen. On a number of jobs I have done recently all axix will go significantly faster and at certain points during the job they seemingly double their feed speed then slow down again. Are you sure that the G-code isn't requesting that? A rapid x move is very slow. I do have very slow old computer.will this affect speed? The computer might affect speed, that rather depends on what step rate it can generate, and what step-rate you need. The F-word in the G-code only affects the linear axes, and the rotary axes either run at the speed required to arrive at the end-point at the same time, or if the rotary axis isn't fast enough to do that, then the linear axes will be slowed down so that they arrive at the end-point at the same time as the rotary. If you want to achieve constant cut-rate through the wood then you may need to generate G-code in inverse-time mode, (where you tell the system how long a move should take, not how fast to move). You will still have the slowest axis throttling the others, though. Normal feed-per-minute doesn't have much meaning in combined linear/rotary systems. The motion planner does not know where the axis of rotation is (it is equally valid for the Z=0 to be the surface of the work or the axis of the rotary) -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Rotary axis system
On Thursday 27 March 2014 09:23:24 aaron moore did opine: Hi I am having trouble getting my router to run a fourth rotary axis nicely. It does the job. but rapid and cut speeds both seem very inconsistant. I notice that there is a configuration page for such a machine on the wiki site, but it looks pretty complicated. What benefits does it have over simply configuring with the stepper wizard, and if it does improve performance, I would be grateful if someone could talk a complete ejit through setting it up. Here she is speeded up x a zillion http://www.cnccraft.co.uk/3-dimensional-work/ Thanks Aaron I have been doing this intermittently myself but usually in steel. But my rotary axis is a 4 90/1 table I motorized. What I see (poorly, video stutters on this machine) would represent about the top speed my table can do with air injection. That section of my .ini file: [AXIS_3] TYPE = ANGULAR HOME = 0.0 MAX_VELOCITY = 36.0 MAX_ACCELERATION = 100.0 STEPGEN_MAXACCEL = 200.0 SCALE = 320.0 FERROR = 1 MIN_FERROR = .25 MIN_LIMIT = -1 MAX_LIMIT = 1 HOME_OFFSET = 0.0 HOME_SEARCH_VEL=0.0 #HOME_SEQUENCE=3 BACKLASH = 0.056 velocity's are in degrees/second, meaning it would take 10 seconds to turn one full turn. But because I have the bearing pulled down tight to try and constrain the backlash when its at position, there has been a air port drilled into it, and a small groove cut into the castings mating face, to allow an air hose to pressurize it, lifting the table free enough to turn when it needs to turn. Otherwise I had better run it much slower, giving the 252 oz/in motor enough torque to move it. For most of what I use it for, like drilling the flash-holes in a #209 nipple, or carving the hex wrench flats on the nipple, the tool is not in contact with the work until it has reached position. You didn't say how your table is being driven, and the video doesn't show it, but for fancy engraving or carving (table?) legs such as I see there, I think that since the wood doesn't need the holding power of a 90/1 worm drive, I would use a timing belt setup with a high, say 10/1 tooth ratio. Maybe even in 2 stages to control the size of the pulley's. From a 425 oz/in motor, that should be more than enough holding power to carve that oak, white ash, or cherry at speeds high enough to control cherry's want to burn if the tool is kept clean and sharp. With enough voltage into the driver, I'd guess you could do a turn a second or more while maintaining a small fraction of a mm for accuracy. Tel: 01209 890084 Mob: 07805686188 Email:aaronmo...@linuxmail.org Web: www.cnccraft.co.uk www.re-formfurniture.co.uk -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] two speed backgear vs spindle speed control
On Thursday 27 March 2014 10:04:20 andy pugh did opine: On 27 March 2014 09:50, Gene Heskett ghesk...@wdtv.com wrote: What would be the usual way to toss a gear change constant into a servo speed control so that the PID.#.error band is relatively well centered in both gears? You could try using http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/gearchange.9.html after the PID and before the DAC. That makes sense, with the stepup out of the PID being effective in the low speed range. I'll give that a shot, maybe today since they are promising temps with a + sign later today. Alternatively there is lincurve for altering PID parameters on the basis of something else. I will be re-inserting that also because the gemini still has a positive speed vs voltage in at the higher speeds above about 1/2 scale. Placed after the gearchange before the DAC. I have one input left that I could use to report a switch was closed by the lever being in high gear. On my mill I auto-detect the engaged gear (but I don't use any PID, I just trust the DAC to be linear enough for my purposes.) http://linuxcnc.org/hardy/dapper/index.php/english/forum/47-hal-examples /27071-automatic-spindle-gear-detection That sounds neat too, but I don't think I need auto detection. Since I've only two speeds, a switch the lever twangs should be good enough. Thanks Andy. Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] BLDC Servo Torque Problem?
Hi, I have some problems in setting up BLDC servos, I just don't manage to get enough torque. Here's the set-up: Intel D525MW Mesa 5i23 Mesa 7i39-LV Nanotec DB57L01 + 4000 CPR endoder The servos are rated 24V DC, 4.6A (peak 17A). My power supply is 24V DC SNT rated at 500W. I suppose I just don't get the PID settings right, but before investigating this a question regarding power supply: Is the 24V supply correct? Or do I misread the BLDC data sheet and the 24V is a RMS rating? cu Flo -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] BLDC Servo Torque Problem?
On 27 March 2014 17:31, Florian Rist fr...@fs.tum.de wrote: Mesa 7i39-LV Nanotec DB57L01 + 4000 CPR endoder How are you commutating? -- atp If you can't fix it, you don't own it. http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] BLDC Servo Torque Problem?
On Thu, 27 Mar 2014, Florian Rist wrote: Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 18:31:12 +0100 From: Florian Rist fr...@fs.tum.de Reply-To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: [Emc-users] BLDC Servo Torque Problem? Hi, I have some problems in setting up BLDC servos, I just don't manage to get enough torque. Here's the set-up: Intel D525MW Mesa 5i23 Mesa 7i39-LV Nanotec DB57L01 + 4000 CPR endoder The servos are rated 24V DC, 4.6A (peak 17A). My power supply is 24V DC SNT rated at 500W. I suppose I just don't get the PID settings right, but before investigating this a question regarding power supply: Is the 24V supply correct? Or do I misread the BLDC data sheet and the 24V is a RMS rating? cu Flo The 7I39LV is limited to 30VDC max Its hard to tell with motor specifications, sometimes they are RMS and sometimes they are DC (for example lots of large BLDC motors are rated 320V which actually means they are 220V AC motors) If you dont have enough torque, a couple things to check are 1. initial rotor alignment (if wrong you will have different torque each direction) 2. Make sure the deadtime is set to 0 3. Make sure the PWM rate is set fairly high so you dont get current limiting from ripple current (40KHz is good for 7I39s) 4. Make sure you have the 7I39 current limit set to 15A and not 7.5A 5. If you have problems at high speeds, consider running LinuxCNC master and raising the servo thread rate as high as you can (good MBs can do 4 KHz or better) (linuxcnc master has a patch to BLDC than extrapolates the commutation angle base on velocity so approximately halves the commutation angle error at high speeds) -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users Peter Wallace Mesa Electronics (\__/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
[Emc-users] (no subject)
Hello Hive mind of LCNC; My question tonite is how much hard drive space is needed with a 10.04 install then getting all the other source files, compilers etc. so that I could do a make and install master as RIP. System has a 40 GB hdd, Installed 10.04 from CD then LCNC via script. No extras that I know of. (did this install last summer) and the box has just been sitting here collecting dust. Between battling doctors (spent the holidays and watched the ball drop from hospital bed), battle of the budget (did I mention Doctors?), battle with my machine iron etc. I have been feeling a bit beat up. I figure now was a good time to practice fighting code gremlins and getting my build/make/config skills into shape since I have nothing to loose but my pride and a few pennies worth of AC power. -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc stepper mill configuration
Hi everyone After three weeks I've got the latency down under 10,000 and received and installed my breakout board. Now I'm trying to get it going. With unipolar stepper motors and 2 wire uln2003 stepper drivers need to alter the loadrt stepgen step_type to 5,5,5 or 6,6,6 , the step and direction to A- and B+ , and remove the setp parport.0.pin-**-out- reset 1 command. ( thanks Andy for the linuxcnc forum of Sept 2012) I can't see how to do any of this with the stepconfig wizard, and if I just edit the BillsMill.hal file it will revert when I sun stepconf. So please let me know how I can edit this confuguration. Regards Bill ---Original Message--- From: Gene Heskett Date: 03/08/14 14:40:52 To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc stepper mill configuration On Friday 07 March 2014 23:06:00 Bill did opine: Hi Gene and Andy I guess I'm convinced that I need bigger motors but until I see some movement I don't want to do anything. If you want to see movement without letting the smoke out, and here I am assuming the + end of your 24 volt supply is being fed to the common centertap of all windings of the motor, you need a current limiter to protect the ULN2003 that will only allow about .5 amps to flow. IIRC from reading the spec sheet that the winding R was around 5 ohms for the unipolar version. Basically you will need to drop 21.5 more volts in order to arrive at the .5 amp current figure. At .5 amps, the 5 ohm winding will be dropping 2.5 volts. So 24-2.5=21.5, times 2 because its .5 amps, that would be a 43 ohm resistor and it will need to be sized for a wattage dissipation of a hair over 20 watts. A 50 ohm 25 watt adjustable power resistor, using most of it would be about right. Then you can apply power and see if the motor runs when jogged. It probably won't run long enough to see it jog without that current limiting resistor. What Torque do you both Suggest The comments re ball screws vs conventional is quite valid, the ball screw moves at 95+% energy efficiency, while the conventional screw, even in ACME thread, is about 35% at best because you'll need to count the drag of the threads in the nut and the drag of the end thrust containment. And the ball screws, properly fitted will have backlashes in the thousandth of an inch or less, whereas the conventional screw and nut can wear from 3 thou if just adjusted, to 7 thou in one half hour long job. To get drive power, fairly fine threads are used on the regular screw, but the ball screws have relatively coarse threads. a single start 16mm ball screw will move the table 5mm per turn for example. Typical gains would be 2 times faster, and twice as much push with the ball screw. In short, make it work with what you have, and if thats not good enough, you scratch the next itch. Its what I've been doing for the last 65 years since I quit school went to work fixing these new-fangled things called tv's for a living, about 1948 or 49. Switched to broadcasting by getting a 1st phone in '62, and the rest is history, working the last 18 years that I worked as the Chief and often only engineer at WDTV. I'll carry on with calculations in the meantime then I can shop around. Thanks again Bill Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene NOTICE: Will pay 100 USD for an HP-4815A defective but complete probe assembly. - Subversion Kills Productivity. Get off Subversion Make the Move to Perforce. With Perforce, you get hassle-free workflows. Merge that actually works. Faster operations. Version large binaries. Built-in WAN optimization and the freedom to use Git, Perforce or both. Make the move to Perforce. http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=122218951iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] (no subject)
The Borg Collective of LinuxCNC must be busy ... so only one mind is responding via this email...;-) 40 gigs is plenty. I think you will find that after you install everything you can think, and do a git clone to setup a RIP, you will still have way over 30 gigs of drive space left. Dave On 3/27/2014 9:33 PM, Greg Bentzinger wrote: Hello Hive mind of LCNC; My question tonite is how much hard drive space is needed with a 10.04 install then getting all the other source files, compilers etc. so that I could do a make and install master as RIP. System has a 40 GB hdd, Installed 10.04 from CD then LCNC via script. No extras that I know of. (did this install last summer) and the box has just been sitting here collecting dust. Between battling doctors (spent the holidays and watched the ball drop from hospital bed), battle of the budget (did I mention Doctors?), battle with my machine iron etc. I have been feeling a bit beat up. I figure now was a good time to practice fighting code gremlins and getting my build/make/config skills into shape since I have nothing to loose but my pride and a few pennies worth of AC power. -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
Re: [Emc-users] Linuxcnc stepper mill configuration
On Friday 28 March 2014 00:47:59 Bill did opine: Hi everyone After three weeks I've got the latency down under 10,000 and received and installed my breakout board. Now I'm trying to get it going. With unipolar stepper motors and 2 wire uln2003 stepper drivers need to alter the loadrt stepgen step_type to 5,5,5 or 6,6,6 , the step and direction to A- and B+ , and remove the setp parport.0.pin-**-out- reset 1 command. ( thanks Andy for the linuxcnc forum of Sept 2012) I can't see how to do any of this with the stepconfig wizard, and if I just edit the BillsMill.hal file it will revert when I sun stepconf. So please let me know how I can edit this confuguration. Regards Bill Long time between posts, Bill. Stepconfig was designed to get you going, so the machine could be moved. But once I had done that, I have never ran it again. The formats in the BillsMill.ini and BillsMill.hal can be edited with something like gedit to fine tune and improve how the machine works. Since you are driving the uln2003 unipolar drivers directly, you do not want the parport reset statement in your .hal file. So remove this line near the top of your .hal file setpparport.0.reset-timesomenumber Then scroll down thru the file, removing any statements like this setpparport.0.pin-02-out-reset 1 That follow any of xstepA,B,C, ystepA,B,C, or zstepA,B,C assignments to that same pin-##-out That should get you moving, albeit at limited power speed with that driver. And it might need current limiting resistors to prevent overheating the ULN2003, IIRC its current limit is half an amp for all combined outputs. Some ohms law checks will determine that at the drivers supply voltage. Using higher voltage, up to 90% of the the uln2003's ratings, with current limiting resistors (they will be big power types and will get hot) will gain you speed. How many wires on your motors? 5,5,5 might not be the correct stepgen mode in the loadrt line that calls it in to be used. Cheers, Gene -- There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order. -Ed Howdershelt (Author) Genes Web page http://geneslinuxbox.net:6309/gene -- ___ Emc-users mailing list Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
