Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Mark Johnsen]

There are 2 HAL examples (a small and not as small) in the integrator's
manual that  cover the basics of HAL.  I think you even write a very small
component because I had taken a very simple example and modified it
slightly.  The examples will help you connect the pins, setup parameters,
and load the components and functions.  The tutorials will help your HAL
understanding.  When you run through a pncconf or the other setup feature,
it writes a hal file, but with a lot more connections, etc. than the
tutorials.

Just a thought and hats off to whomever put those tutorials together and
John K for editing that manual at the LinuxCNC fest in Houston last year.

Mark



>
>
> --
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 15 May 2015 09:57:11 +0100
> From: andy pugh 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> 
> Message-ID:
>  hpw...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> On 15 May 2015 at 07:26, alex chiosso  wrote:
>
> > And when an where the logic elaboration should be ?
>
> There isn't any HAL logic elaboration as you seem to be describing it.
>
> All the HAL logic is handled by individual components. Those
> components read their inputs and update their outputs one by one in
> the order they are placed in the thread.
>
> (Some components have more than one "function" and strictly-speaking
> it is the functions that execute in the order they are added to the
> thread)
>
> What I am saying is that there is that the sequence that things appear
> in the HAL files has little bearing on the sequence in which they
> happen.
> When LinuxCNC starts it reads through all the HAL files in sequence
> and sets up all the HAL connections. This is a one-time process at
> startup, and from that point on the HAL file is not looked at again.
> It is a mistake to imagine that the HAL file is somehow "interpreted"
> every cycle as some people seem to. This is why it isn't a programming
> language.
>
> If there are two HAL files, and the first contains:
>
> addf parport.0.read thread1
> addf and2.0  thread1
> addf parport.0.write
>
> and a the second contains
>
> addf or2.0
>
> Then the sequence is that the parport is scanned and the
> parport.0.pin-in-NN pin values are updated
> Then the and2.0 funsction runs, reading its inputs and updating the outputs
> Then the parport.0.write function runs, updating the voltages on the
> parport output pins.
> Then the or2.0 function runs, reading its inputs and writing its outputs.
>
> I rather worry that my original intention of trying to make HAL
> simpler to understand has just become subverted by discussion of
> technical details that were not part of the original question at all.
>
>
> --
> atp
> If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
> http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto
>
>
>
>
--
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Scott Salrin]

My printer will do 13" x 19" and the machine is a simple gantry router with
a 4th axis rotary, ought to be big enough, even for these tired old eyes.
Sounds a perfect solution, at least to better understand what's there now,
before I go re-routing spindle control... LOL

On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:06 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Friday 15 May 2015 08:40:07 Scott Salrin wrote:
> > You just did Gene... Now my head hurts,
>
> Oh dear, I was afraid of that. :)
>
> > and all I know so far is it is
> > a species of penguin :) , and a linuxcnc websocket. The penguins are
> > adorable...
>
> The web browser doesn't normally have enough magnify gain to show you
> what it can do.  I have a printout, 2 landscape sheets high & 3 long of
> what is now an obsolete survey of my lathe, whose hal file is a bit
> north of 400 lines.  Taped to the inside of one of the double doors of
> my shop.
>
> When trouble shooting, it can be a very valuable tool.  The image it
> generates and that you can save is an svg image, so you can blow it up
> without it falling apart.  And it sure makes following a signal path
> thru the hal jungle a piece of cake.
>
> > On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 7:49 PM, Gene Heskett 
> wrote:
> > > On Thursday 14 May 2015 14:11:22 Scott Salrin wrote:
> > > > Andy, it certainly flows like programming... Maybe I'll try
> > > > charting like John suggests. I never was any good at logic...
> > >
> > > Duh.  Guys, do we dare mention rockhopper to this new bee?
> > >
> > > > On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Andy Pugh 
> wrote:
> > > > > > On 14 May 2015, at 17:36, John Alexander Stewart
> > > > > > 
> > > > >
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > > Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But
> > > > > > then one day it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem
> > > > >
> > > > > It possibly helps to realise that it isn't a programming
> > > > > language, even if it looks like one.
> > > > > A HAL file is a definition of how signals pass between various
> > > > > drivers and linuxcnc, optionally through other blocks that do
> > > > > things to or with the numbers.
> > > > >
> > > > > 
> > > > > -- One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > > > > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support
> > > > > with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports
> > > > > that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with
> > > > > transaction tracing using APM Insight.
> > > > > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > > > > ___
> > > > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > >  One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > > > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support
> > > > with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that
> > > > give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction
> > > > tracing using APM Insight.
> > > > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > > > ___
> > > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> > > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> > > --
> > > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> > >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > > -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> > > Genes Web page 
> > >
> > >
> > > 
> > >-- One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> > > 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give
> > > you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction
> > > tracing using APM Insight.
> > > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > --
> > One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> > 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you
> > Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing
> > using APM Insight.
> > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --

Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Gene Heskett]

On Friday 15 May 2015 08:40:07 Scott Salrin wrote:
> You just did Gene... Now my head hurts,

Oh dear, I was afraid of that. :)

> and all I know so far is it is 
> a species of penguin :) , and a linuxcnc websocket. The penguins are
> adorable...

The web browser doesn't normally have enough magnify gain to show you 
what it can do.  I have a printout, 2 landscape sheets high & 3 long of 
what is now an obsolete survey of my lathe, whose hal file is a bit 
north of 400 lines.  Taped to the inside of one of the double doors of 
my shop.

When trouble shooting, it can be a very valuable tool.  The image it 
generates and that you can save is an svg image, so you can blow it up 
without it falling apart.  And it sure makes following a signal path 
thru the hal jungle a piece of cake.

> On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 7:49 PM, Gene Heskett  
wrote:
> > On Thursday 14 May 2015 14:11:22 Scott Salrin wrote:
> > > Andy, it certainly flows like programming... Maybe I'll try
> > > charting like John suggests. I never was any good at logic...
> >
> > Duh.  Guys, do we dare mention rockhopper to this new bee?
> >
> > > On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Andy Pugh  
wrote:
> > > > > On 14 May 2015, at 17:36, John Alexander Stewart
> > > > > 
> > > >
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But
> > > > > then one day it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem
> > > >
> > > > It possibly helps to realise that it isn't a programming
> > > > language, even if it looks like one.
> > > > A HAL file is a definition of how signals pass between various
> > > > drivers and linuxcnc, optionally through other blocks that do
> > > > things to or with the numbers.
> > > >
> > > > 
> > > > -- One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > > > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support
> > > > with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports
> > > > that give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with
> > > > transaction tracing using APM Insight.
> > > > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > > > ___
> > > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> > > --
> > >  One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support
> > > with 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that
> > > give you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction
> > > tracing using APM Insight.
> > > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> > Genes Web page 
> >
> >
> > 
> >-- One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> > 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give
> > you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction
> > tracing using APM Insight.
> > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> --
> One dashboard for servers and applications across
> Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you
> Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing
> using APM Insight.
> http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

--
One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud 
Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
Deep dive visibility with trans

Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Scott Salrin]

You just did Gene... Now my head hurts, and all I know so far is it is a
species of penguin :) , and a linuxcnc websocket. The penguins are
adorable...

On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 7:49 PM, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Thursday 14 May 2015 14:11:22 Scott Salrin wrote:
> > Andy, it certainly flows like programming... Maybe I'll try charting
> > like John suggests. I never was any good at logic...
>
> Duh.  Guys, do we dare mention rockhopper to this new bee?
> >
> > On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Andy Pugh  wrote:
> > > > On 14 May 2015, at 17:36, John Alexander Stewart
> > > > 
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > > > Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But then
> > > > one day it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem
> > >
> > > It possibly helps to realise that it isn't a programming language,
> > > even if it looks like one.
> > > A HAL file is a definition of how signals pass between various
> > > drivers and linuxcnc, optionally through other blocks that do things
> > > to or with the numbers.
> > >
> > > 
> > >-- One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> > > 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give
> > > you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction
> > > tracing using APM Insight.
> > > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > --
> > One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> > 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you
> > Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing
> > using APM Insight.
> > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
> --
> One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud
> Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
> Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
> Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
> http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
--
One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud 
Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[alex chiosso]

Hi Andy , thank you for the reply.
It's not the matter of change the discussion object .
But when somebody as expert as you are is writing an important concept I
would like to understand it properly.
Sorry ...


On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 10:57 AM, andy pugh  wrote:

> On 15 May 2015 at 07:26, alex chiosso  wrote:
>
> > And when an where the logic elaboration should be ?
>
> There isn't any HAL logic elaboration as you seem to be describing it.
>
> All the HAL logic is handled by individual components. Those
> components read their inputs and update their outputs one by one in
> the order they are placed in the thread.
>
> (Some components have more than one "function" and strictly-speaking
> it is the functions that execute in the order they are added to the
> thread)
>
> What I am saying is that there is that the sequence that things appear
> in the HAL files has little bearing on the sequence in which they
> happen.
> When LinuxCNC starts it reads through all the HAL files in sequence
> and sets up all the HAL connections. This is a one-time process at
> startup, and from that point on the HAL file is not looked at again.
> It is a mistake to imagine that the HAL file is somehow "interpreted"
> every cycle as some people seem to. This is why it isn't a programming
> language.
>
> If there are two HAL files, and the first contains:
>
> addf parport.0.read thread1
> addf and2.0  thread1
> addf parport.0.write
>
> and a the second contains
>
> addf or2.0
>
> Then the sequence is that the parport is scanned and the
> parport.0.pin-in-NN pin values are updated
> Then the and2.0 funsction runs, reading its inputs and updating the outputs
> Then the parport.0.write function runs, updating the voltages on the
> parport output pins.
> Then the or2.0 function runs, reading its inputs and writing its outputs.
>
> I rather worry that my original intention of trying to make HAL
> simpler to understand has just become subverted by discussion of
> technical details that were not part of the original question at all.
>
>
> --
> atp
> If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
> http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto
>
>
> --
> One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud
> Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
> Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
> Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
> http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
--
One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud 
Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[andy pugh]

On 15 May 2015 at 07:26, alex chiosso  wrote:

> And when an where the logic elaboration should be ?

There isn't any HAL logic elaboration as you seem to be describing it.

All the HAL logic is handled by individual components. Those
components read their inputs and update their outputs one by one in
the order they are placed in the thread.

(Some components have more than one "function" and strictly-speaking
it is the functions that execute in the order they are added to the
thread)

What I am saying is that there is that the sequence that things appear
in the HAL files has little bearing on the sequence in which they
happen.
When LinuxCNC starts it reads through all the HAL files in sequence
and sets up all the HAL connections. This is a one-time process at
startup, and from that point on the HAL file is not looked at again.
It is a mistake to imagine that the HAL file is somehow "interpreted"
every cycle as some people seem to. This is why it isn't a programming
language.

If there are two HAL files, and the first contains:

addf parport.0.read thread1
addf and2.0  thread1
addf parport.0.write

and a the second contains

addf or2.0

Then the sequence is that the parport is scanned and the
parport.0.pin-in-NN pin values are updated
Then the and2.0 funsction runs, reading its inputs and updating the outputs
Then the parport.0.write function runs, updating the voltages on the
parport output pins.
Then the or2.0 function runs, reading its inputs and writing its outputs.

I rather worry that my original intention of trying to make HAL
simpler to understand has just become subverted by discussion of
technical details that were not part of the original question at all.


-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

--
One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud 
Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[alex chiosso]

Hi to all.
Andy , please , can you be more precise on this definition :

> It reads that way, but that isn't how it runs. Every component reads
> its inputs and updates its outputs exactly in the order they are
> "addf"-ed to a thread, and they do that every time the thread runs.


And when an where the logic elaboration should be ?
I mean is it something like this (as I understand from the above
enunciation) ?

- read component input
- update/write of the component output of the previous scan (thread
elaboration)
- elaboration of the HAL logic

or it is

- read component input
- elaboration of the HAL logic
- update/write of the component output

or it is something different 

Regards

Alex


On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 2:49 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> On Thursday 14 May 2015 14:11:22 Scott Salrin wrote:
> > Andy, it certainly flows like programming... Maybe I'll try charting
> > like John suggests. I never was any good at logic...
>
> Duh.  Guys, do we dare mention rockhopper to this new bee?
> >
> > On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Andy Pugh  wrote:
> > > > On 14 May 2015, at 17:36, John Alexander Stewart
> > > > 
> > >
> > > wrote:
> > > > Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But then
> > > > one day it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem
> > >
> > > It possibly helps to realise that it isn't a programming language,
> > > even if it looks like one.
> > > A HAL file is a definition of how signals pass between various
> > > drivers and linuxcnc, optionally through other blocks that do things
> > > to or with the numbers.
> > >
> > > 
> > >-- One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> > > 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give
> > > you Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction
> > > tracing using APM Insight.
> > > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > --
> > One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
> > 50+ applications Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you
> > Actionable Insights Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing
> > using APM Insight.
> > http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> Genes Web page 
>
>
> --
> One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud
> Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
> Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
> Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
> http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
--
One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud 
Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
___
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 14 May 2015 14:11:22 Scott Salrin wrote:
> Andy, it certainly flows like programming... Maybe I'll try charting
> like John suggests. I never was any good at logic...

Duh.  Guys, do we dare mention rockhopper to this new bee?
>
> On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Andy Pugh  wrote:
> > > On 14 May 2015, at 17:36, John Alexander Stewart
> > > 
> >
> > wrote:
> > > Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But then
> > > one day it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem
> >
> > It possibly helps to realise that it isn't a programming language,
> > even if it looks like one.
> > A HAL file is a definition of how signals pass between various
> > drivers and linuxcnc, optionally through other blocks that do things
> > to or with the numbers.
> >
> > 
> >-- One dashboard for servers and applications across
> > Physical-Virtual-Cloud Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with
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>
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 14 May 2015 08:19:38 John Alexander Stewart wrote:
> Tomaz;
>
> I had the same problem:
>
> http://cnc-for-model-engineers.blogspot.ca/2014/01/spindle-ramping-up-
>to-speed.html
>
> The solution (as found in my blog page above):
>
> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/examples/spindle.html#_spindle_soft_star
>t
>
>
> FYI - when I put a Mesa 5i25 in there, I accurately figured out how to
> set the spindle speed:
>
> http://cnc-for-model-engineers.blogspot.ca/2013/02/kx1-5i25-and-spindl
>e-speeds.html
>
>
> John.

Interesting link John.  Too bad it cannot be printed.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[andy pugh]

On 14 May 2015 at 19:11, Scott Salrin  wrote:
> Andy, it certainly flows like programming.

It reads that way, but that isn't how it runs. Every component reads
its inputs and updates its outputs exactly in the order they are
"addf"-ed to a thread, and they do that every time the thread runs.
(typically every mS for the servo-thread and independently and faster
for the base thread when there is one)


-- 
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http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Scott Salrin]

Andy, it certainly flows like programming... Maybe I'll try charting like
John suggests. I never was any good at logic...

On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Andy Pugh  wrote:

>
>
> > On 14 May 2015, at 17:36, John Alexander Stewart 
> wrote:
> >
> > Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But then one day
> > it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem
>
> It possibly helps to realise that it isn't a programming language, even if
> it looks like one.
> A HAL file is a definition of how signals pass between various drivers and
> linuxcnc, optionally through other blocks that do things to or with the
> numbers.
>
> --
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>
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Todd Zuercher]

Does your VFD have an at speed signal to use?  Most of the VFDs I have used 
have a digital output that indicate when they've finished their ramp up the 
speed.  I have had pretty good luck connecting that to the 
motion.spindle-at-speed input.  It isn't perfect, but works good enough for me.

- Original Message -
From: "Tomaz T." 
To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2015 5:54:42 AM
Subject: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

I don't have encoder feedback from spindle and in 99% times I'm using same rpm 
speed, so I know how long it takes spindle to reach programmed rpms...

Is there a way to delay motion.spindle-at-speed for few seconds, before it 
proceeds with g-code?
--
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Andy Pugh]

> On 14 May 2015, at 17:36, John Alexander Stewart  wrote:
> 
> Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But then one day
> it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem

It possibly helps to realise that it isn't a programming language, even if it 
looks like one. 
A HAL file is a definition of how signals pass between various drivers and 
linuxcnc, optionally through other blocks that do things to or with the 
numbers. 
--
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Scott Salrin]

LOL yeah, John, I had a click when I got the MPG working, without
overriding the spindle speed meter. LOL again. The other noises I thought
to be clicks ended up just being my bad knees... I appreciate the words of
encouragement. This community never fails to amaze me, I love being a small
part.

On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 11:36 AM, John Alexander Stewart  wrote:

> Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But then one day
> it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem. Syntax still is a bit of a
> mystery at times, so I'm not near the Hal expert that many on the list is.
>
> Keep at it, and you'll have more and more fist pumping "Yeah!" moments. ;-)
>
> Work through that spindle speed example; I take scrap paper and put blocks
> down with lines between them, and label everything. It makes understanding
> (for me) Hal a lot easier.
>
> Oh, and ask questions here, I have asked many questions in the past and
> have had clear, concise, explanations.
>
> John.
>
> --
> One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud
> Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
> Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
> Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
> http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> ___
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>
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[John Alexander Stewart]

Scott - Hal was a bit of a problem to learn for me, too. But then one day
it "clicked" and now it's not really a problem. Syntax still is a bit of a
mystery at times, so I'm not near the Hal expert that many on the list is.

Keep at it, and you'll have more and more fist pumping "Yeah!" moments. ;-)

Work through that spindle speed example; I take scrap paper and put blocks
down with lines between them, and label everything. It makes understanding
(for me) Hal a lot easier.

Oh, and ask questions here, I have asked many questions in the past and
have had clear, concise, explanations.

John.
--
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Scott Salrin]

It's only been 2 weeks with linuxcnc for me, and I'm using G4. I wish I had
a shallower learning curve. Speed based delay is exactly the solution I
need Hal still eludes me...

On Thu, May 14, 2015 at 7:19 AM, John Alexander Stewart 
wrote:

> Tomaz;
>
> I had the same problem:
>
>
> http://cnc-for-model-engineers.blogspot.ca/2014/01/spindle-ramping-up-to-speed.html
>
> The solution (as found in my blog page above):
>
> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/examples/spindle.html#_spindle_soft_start
>
>
> FYI - when I put a Mesa 5i25 in there, I accurately figured out how to set
> the spindle speed:
>
>
> http://cnc-for-model-engineers.blogspot.ca/2013/02/kx1-5i25-and-spindle-speeds.html
>
>
> John.
> ​
>
> --
> One dashboard for servers and applications across Physical-Virtual-Cloud
> Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
> Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
> Deep dive visibility with transaction tracing using APM Insight.
> http://ad.doubleclick.net/ddm/clk/290420510;117567292;y
> ___
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> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[John Alexander Stewart]

Tomaz;

I had the same problem:

http://cnc-for-model-engineers.blogspot.ca/2014/01/spindle-ramping-up-to-speed.html

The solution (as found in my blog page above):

http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/examples/spindle.html#_spindle_soft_start


FYI - when I put a Mesa 5i25 in there, I accurately figured out how to set
the spindle speed:

http://cnc-for-model-engineers.blogspot.ca/2013/02/kx1-5i25-and-spindle-speeds.html


John.
​
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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 14 May 2015 05:54:42 Tomaz T. wrote:
> I don't have encoder feedback from spindle and in 99% times I'm using
> same rpm speed, so I know how long it takes spindle to reach
> programmed rpms...
>
> Is there a way to delay motion.spindle-at-speed for few seconds,
> before it proceeds with g-code?

Sure, in your gcode, after the M3/4 that starts it in the chosen 
direction, put a 
G4P(time in seconds)
immediately after. Mine starts quickly so I rarely use more that .75 
seconds.

Multi-HP motors that blink the lights need more time of course.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

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Re: [Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[andy pugh]

On 14 May 2015 at 10:54, Tomaz T.  wrote:

> Is there a way to delay motion.spindle-at-speed for few seconds, before it 
> proceeds with g-code?

Yes, you can use timedelay:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/timedelay.9.html

loadrt...
addf...

net spindle-on motion.spindle-on => timedelay.0.in
net net spindle-on-delayed  timedelay.0.out => motion.spindle-at-speed
setp timedelay.0.on-delay 4

If you wanted to you could also connect spindle-speed to a lincurve
component and have a delay that changed with set speed.

-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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[Emc-users] How to delay spindle-at-speed

[Tomaz T .]

I don't have encoder feedback from spindle and in 99% times I'm using same rpm 
speed, so I know how long it takes spindle to reach programmed rpms...

Is there a way to delay motion.spindle-at-speed for few seconds, before it 
proceeds with g-code?
--
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