Re: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to the USA

2021-09-15 Thread Mark Abramowitz via EV 
I really don’t know.

I don’t follow those efforts.

I think the place to find more is on the California Energy Commission website, 
or just Google “Lithium Commission.” 

- Mark

Sent from my Fuel Cell powered iPhone

> On Sep 14, 2021, at 9:41 PM, Peri Hartman via EV  wrote:
> 
> Sounds good. How does that work ? Do they pump the water through some sort 
> of catalyst that can extract lithium ?
> 
> Peri
> 
> << Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >>
> 
> -- Original Message --
> From: "Mark Abramowitz via EV" 
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
> Cc: "Mark Abramowitz" 
> Sent: 14-Sep-21 20:45:29
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from 
> Asia to the USA
> 
>> California is looking to “produce” its own lithium supplies, from the Salton 
>> Sea. They’ve formed a Commission (a good friend of mine is on it) to oversee 
>> it, and I’m hopeful that appropriate environmental safeguards will be in 
>> place.
>> 
>> - Mark
>> 
>> Sent from my Fuel Cell powered iPhone
>> 
 On Sep 14, 2021, at 5:46 PM, Peri Hartman via EV  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Very ambitious. Can Straubel et al do it ? I presume he can front a lot of 
>>> money, so that helps. And I presume he's not really inventing anything. 
>>> Perhaps the biggest challenge will be sourcing raw materials. The finished 
>>> product (batteries) is environmentally clean but strip mining is another 
>>> matter.
>>> 
>>> Exciting. Best of luck !
>>> 
>>> Peri
>>> 
>>> << Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >>
>>> 
>>> -- Original Message --
>>> From: "cleanair--- via EV" 
>>> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
>>> Cc: "clean...@sbcglobal.net" 
>>> Sent: 14-Sep-21 15:35:52
>>> Subject: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia 
>>> to the USA
>>> 
 Lets support a tsunami of battery cathodes made in the USA.This should be 
 of strategic interest.
 Danny A.
 
 https://www.mining.com/web/a-tesla-co-founder-aims-to-build-an-entire-us-battery-industry/
 
 
 Redwood Materials Inc., the battery recycling company created by Tesla 
 Inc. co-founder J.B. Straubel, has been keeping a big secret: It isn’t 
 really a recycling company.
 
 Sure, Redwood has risen quickly to become the biggest lithium-ion battery 
 recycler in the U.S.. But Straubel didn’t leave Tesla in 2019 just to 
 clean out America’s junk drawers. His broader goal, described to Bloomberg 
 for the first time, is to move a huge chunk of the battery-component 
 industry from Asia to the U.S.
 
 
 “It’s both inspiring and terrifying to see so many nations and car 
 companies announcing their shift to electric vehicles,” Straubel said. 
 “But there’s a massive gap in what needs to happen.”
 
 To fill that gap, Straubel has set out to build one of the largest battery 
 materials factories in the world. Redwood, which currently operates three 
 facilities in Nevada, is searching for a location farther east to build a 
 new million-square-foot factory. At a cost of well over $1 billion, 
 according to Straubel, the addition will enable Redwood to become a major 
 U.S. producer of cathodes. (Every battery has two electrodes — an anode 
 and a cathode — between which trillions of charged lithium atoms travel. 
 It’s the cathode that largely determines a battery’s cost, performance and 
 environmental footprint.)
 
 Straubel says the U.S. factory will produce material for 100 gigawatt 
 hours of batteries a year by the end of 2025. That’s enough for about 1.3 
 million long-range vehicles a year, on par with the biggest producers in 
 Asia. By 2030, the same facility will ramp up to 500 gigawatt hours a 
 year, he says. At today’s prices, that’s $25 billion of cathodes a year. 
 Redwood plans to build a similar operation in Europe by 2023.
 
 “These numbers sound insane, but when you look at what the market needs, 
 I’m like holy cow — is this even aggressive enough?” Straubel says. 
 “Somebody’s got to do this. In fact, we need at least four companies doing 
 similarly aggressive, crazy things all in the same timeline.”
 
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Re: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to the USA

2021-09-15 Thread EVDL Administrator via EV 
On 15 Sep 2021 at 4:40, Peri Hartman via EV wrote:

> How does that work ? Do they pump the water through some 
> sort of catalyst that can extract lithium ?

If I understand correctly, it's David Snydacker's "direct lithium 
extraction" process (Lilac).  It uses ion exchange, fundamentally the same 
process used in water softeners for decades.  

The big deal about siting it at the Salton Sea is that there they can use 
geothermal energy for the process.  My main concern would be the handling 
and disposal of the chemicals that the process requires, but I'm far from an 
expert on these matters.

finfeed.com/features/explainer-overview-direct-lithium-extraction-dle-
geothermal-brines/

or v.gd/SlJrjF

Excerpt:

Both heat and electricity are used in lithium extraction and refining.

The lithium chemical production process begins with contacting the 
geothermal brine with a selective medium which adsorbs lithium chloride 
(LiCl) from the brine and leaves all the other salts in solution. The 
lithium chloride is then eluted into pure water or acid at a higher 
concentration compared to the geothermal brine and with very low quantities 
of impurities.

There are a number of technology companies which market the ability to 
perform DLE with high lithium recovery including Lilac Solutions, Tenova 
Advanced Technologies, Adionics, EnergySource Minerals, and others, some of 
which will work well for geothermal-lithium projects.

The pure lithium chloride stream produced by the DLE process needs to be 
purified and concentrated to produce lithium chemical products like lithium 
hydroxide.

For the purification process, a number of inputs are needed including 
chemical reagents like soda ash (Na2CO3), caustic soda (NaOH), and sulfuric 
acid (H2SO4). Electricity is also required to run pumps and filtration 
systems. For the concentration process, a significant quantity of 
electricity and heat is required to remove water from the lithium chloride 
stream for recycling and to crystallise battery quality lithium hydroxide.

The geothermal plant can handily produce all of the power required, and heat 
is harnessed from the geothermal brine to drive the process. All the 
electricity and heat used in the process is produced on site and has no 
carbon footprint. No natural gas pipeline is needed, and no diesel or coal 
needs to be burned to run the process, giving geothermal-lithium projects a 
low carbon and potentially a cost advantage over both salar-type brine and 
hard rock resources which require burning of fossil fuels in lithium 
chemical production.

David Roden, EVDL moderator & general lackey

To reach me, don't reply to this message; I won't get it.  Use my 
offlist address here : http://evdl.org/help/index.html#supt

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Re: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to the USA

2021-09-14 Thread Peri Hartman via EV 
Sounds good. How does that work ? Do they pump the water through some 
sort of catalyst that can extract lithium ?


Peri

<< Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >>

-- Original Message --
From: "Mark Abramowitz via EV" 
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
Cc: "Mark Abramowitz" 
Sent: 14-Sep-21 20:45:29
Subject: Re: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes 
from Asia to the USA



California is looking to “produce” its own lithium supplies, from the Salton 
Sea. They’ve formed a Commission (a good friend of mine is on it) to oversee 
it, and I’m hopeful that appropriate environmental safeguards will be in place.

- Mark

Sent from my Fuel Cell powered iPhone


 On Sep 14, 2021, at 5:46 PM, Peri Hartman via EV  wrote:

 Very ambitious. Can Straubel et al do it ? I presume he can front a lot of 
money, so that helps. And I presume he's not really inventing anything. Perhaps 
the biggest challenge will be sourcing raw materials. The finished product 
(batteries) is environmentally clean but strip mining is another matter.

 Exciting. Best of luck !

 Peri

 << Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >>

 -- Original Message --
 From: "cleanair--- via EV" 
 To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
 Cc: "clean...@sbcglobal.net" 
 Sent: 14-Sep-21 15:35:52
 Subject: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to 
the USA


 Lets support a tsunami of battery cathodes made in the USA.This should be of 
strategic interest.
 Danny A.

https://www.mining.com/web/a-tesla-co-founder-aims-to-build-an-entire-us-battery-industry/


 Redwood Materials Inc., the battery recycling company created by Tesla Inc. 
co-founder J.B. Straubel, has been keeping a big secret: It isn’t really a 
recycling company.

 Sure, Redwood has risen quickly to become the biggest lithium-ion battery 
recycler in the U.S.. But Straubel didn’t leave Tesla in 2019 just to clean out 
America’s junk drawers. His broader goal, described to Bloomberg for the first 
time, is to move a huge chunk of the battery-component industry from Asia to 
the U.S.


 “It’s both inspiring and terrifying to see so many nations and car companies 
announcing their shift to electric vehicles,” Straubel said. “But there’s a 
massive gap in what needs to happen.”

 To fill that gap, Straubel has set out to build one of the largest battery 
materials factories in the world. Redwood, which currently operates three 
facilities in Nevada, is searching for a location farther east to build a new 
million-square-foot factory. At a cost of well over $1 billion, according to 
Straubel, the addition will enable Redwood to become a major U.S. producer of 
cathodes. (Every battery has two electrodes — an anode and a cathode — between 
which trillions of charged lithium atoms travel. It’s the cathode that largely 
determines a battery’s cost, performance and environmental footprint.)

 Straubel says the U.S. factory will produce material for 100 gigawatt hours of 
batteries a year by the end of 2025. That’s enough for about 1.3 million 
long-range vehicles a year, on par with the biggest producers in Asia. By 2030, 
the same facility will ramp up to 500 gigawatt hours a year, he says. At 
today’s prices, that’s $25 billion of cathodes a year. Redwood plans to build a 
similar operation in Europe by 2023.

 “These numbers sound insane, but when you look at what the market needs, I’m 
like holy cow — is this even aggressive enough?” Straubel says. “Somebody’s got 
to do this. In fact, we need at least four companies doing similarly 
aggressive, crazy things all in the same timeline.”

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Re: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to the USA

2021-09-14 Thread Mark Abramowitz via EV 
California is looking to “produce” its own lithium supplies, from the Salton 
Sea. They’ve formed a Commission (a good friend of mine is on it) to oversee 
it, and I’m hopeful that appropriate environmental safeguards will be in place.

- Mark

Sent from my Fuel Cell powered iPhone

> On Sep 14, 2021, at 5:46 PM, Peri Hartman via EV  wrote:
> 
> Very ambitious. Can Straubel et al do it ? I presume he can front a lot of 
> money, so that helps. And I presume he's not really inventing anything. 
> Perhaps the biggest challenge will be sourcing raw materials. The finished 
> product (batteries) is environmentally clean but strip mining is another 
> matter.
> 
> Exciting. Best of luck !
> 
> Peri
> 
> << Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >>
> 
> -- Original Message --
> From: "cleanair--- via EV" 
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
> Cc: "clean...@sbcglobal.net" 
> Sent: 14-Sep-21 15:35:52
> Subject: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to 
> the USA
> 
>> Lets support a tsunami of battery cathodes made in the USA.This should be of 
>> strategic interest.
>> Danny A.
>> 
>> https://www.mining.com/web/a-tesla-co-founder-aims-to-build-an-entire-us-battery-industry/
>> 
>> 
>> Redwood Materials Inc., the battery recycling company created by Tesla Inc. 
>> co-founder J.B. Straubel, has been keeping a big secret: It isn’t really a 
>> recycling company.
>> 
>> Sure, Redwood has risen quickly to become the biggest lithium-ion battery 
>> recycler in the U.S.. But Straubel didn’t leave Tesla in 2019 just to clean 
>> out America’s junk drawers. His broader goal, described to Bloomberg for the 
>> first time, is to move a huge chunk of the battery-component industry from 
>> Asia to the U.S.
>> 
>> 
>> “It’s both inspiring and terrifying to see so many nations and car companies 
>> announcing their shift to electric vehicles,” Straubel said. “But there’s a 
>> massive gap in what needs to happen.”
>> 
>> To fill that gap, Straubel has set out to build one of the largest battery 
>> materials factories in the world. Redwood, which currently operates three 
>> facilities in Nevada, is searching for a location farther east to build a 
>> new million-square-foot factory. At a cost of well over $1 billion, 
>> according to Straubel, the addition will enable Redwood to become a major 
>> U.S. producer of cathodes. (Every battery has two electrodes — an anode and 
>> a cathode — between which trillions of charged lithium atoms travel. It’s 
>> the cathode that largely determines a battery’s cost, performance and 
>> environmental footprint.)
>> 
>> Straubel says the U.S. factory will produce material for 100 gigawatt hours 
>> of batteries a year by the end of 2025. That’s enough for about 1.3 million 
>> long-range vehicles a year, on par with the biggest producers in Asia. By 
>> 2030, the same facility will ramp up to 500 gigawatt hours a year, he says. 
>> At today’s prices, that’s $25 billion of cathodes a year. Redwood plans to 
>> build a similar operation in Europe by 2023.
>> 
>> “These numbers sound insane, but when you look at what the market needs, I’m 
>> like holy cow — is this even aggressive enough?” Straubel says. “Somebody’s 
>> got to do this. In fact, we need at least four companies doing similarly 
>> aggressive, crazy things all in the same timeline.”
>> 
>> -- next part --
>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
>> URL: 
>> 
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Re: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to the USA

2021-09-14 Thread Peri Hartman via EV 
Very ambitious. Can Straubel et al do it ? I presume he can front a lot 
of money, so that helps. And I presume he's not really inventing 
anything. Perhaps the biggest challenge will be sourcing raw materials. 
The finished product (batteries) is environmentally clean but strip 
mining is another matter.


Exciting. Best of luck !

Peri

<< Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >>

-- Original Message --
From: "cleanair--- via EV" 
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" 
Cc: "clean...@sbcglobal.net" 
Sent: 14-Sep-21 15:35:52
Subject: [EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from 
Asia to the USA



Lets support a tsunami of battery cathodes made in the USA.This should be of 
strategic interest.
Danny A.

https://www.mining.com/web/a-tesla-co-founder-aims-to-build-an-entire-us-battery-industry/


Redwood Materials Inc., the battery recycling company created by Tesla Inc. 
co-founder J.B. Straubel, has been keeping a big secret: It isn’t really a 
recycling company.

Sure, Redwood has risen quickly to become the biggest lithium-ion battery 
recycler in the U.S.. But Straubel didn’t leave Tesla in 2019 just to clean out 
America’s junk drawers. His broader goal, described to Bloomberg for the first 
time, is to move a huge chunk of the battery-component industry from Asia to 
the U.S.


“It’s both inspiring and terrifying to see so many nations and car companies 
announcing their shift to electric vehicles,” Straubel said. “But there’s a 
massive gap in what needs to happen.”

To fill that gap, Straubel has set out to build one of the largest battery 
materials factories in the world. Redwood, which currently operates three 
facilities in Nevada, is searching for a location farther east to build a new 
million-square-foot factory. At a cost of well over $1 billion, according to 
Straubel, the addition will enable Redwood to become a major U.S. producer of 
cathodes. (Every battery has two electrodes — an anode and a cathode — between 
which trillions of charged lithium atoms travel. It’s the cathode that largely 
determines a battery’s cost, performance and environmental footprint.)

Straubel says the U.S. factory will produce material for 100 gigawatt hours of 
batteries a year by the end of 2025. That’s enough for about 1.3 million 
long-range vehicles a year, on par with the biggest producers in Asia. By 2030, 
the same facility will ramp up to 500 gigawatt hours a year, he says. At 
today’s prices, that’s $25 billion of cathodes a year. Redwood plans to build a 
similar operation in Europe by 2023.

“These numbers sound insane, but when you look at what the market needs, I’m 
like holy cow — is this even aggressive enough?” Straubel says. “Somebody’s got 
to do this. In fact, we need at least four companies doing similarly 
aggressive, crazy things all in the same timeline.”

-- next part --
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[EVDL] J.B. Straubel in the news - Move making cathodes from Asia to the USA

2021-09-14 Thread cleanair--- via EV 
Lets support a tsunami of battery cathodes made in the USA.This should be of 
strategic interest.
Danny A.

https://www.mining.com/web/a-tesla-co-founder-aims-to-build-an-entire-us-battery-industry/


Redwood Materials Inc., the battery recycling company created by Tesla Inc. 
co-founder J.B. Straubel, has been keeping a big secret: It isn’t really a 
recycling company.

Sure, Redwood has risen quickly to become the biggest lithium-ion battery 
recycler in the U.S.. But Straubel didn’t leave Tesla in 2019 just to clean out 
America’s junk drawers. His broader goal, described to Bloomberg for the first 
time, is to move a huge chunk of the battery-component industry from Asia to 
the U.S. 


“It’s both inspiring and terrifying to see so many nations and car companies 
announcing their shift to electric vehicles,” Straubel said. “But there’s a 
massive gap in what needs to happen.”

To fill that gap, Straubel has set out to build one of the largest battery 
materials factories in the world. Redwood, which currently operates three 
facilities in Nevada, is searching for a location farther east to build a new 
million-square-foot factory. At a cost of well over $1 billion, according to 
Straubel, the addition will enable Redwood to become a major U.S. producer of 
cathodes. (Every battery has two electrodes — an anode and a cathode — between 
which trillions of charged lithium atoms travel. It’s the cathode that largely 
determines a battery’s cost, performance and environmental footprint.)

Straubel says the U.S. factory will produce material for 100 gigawatt hours of 
batteries a year by the end of 2025. That’s enough for about 1.3 million 
long-range vehicles a year, on par with the biggest producers in Asia. By 2030, 
the same facility will ramp up to 500 gigawatt hours a year, he says. At 
today’s prices, that’s $25 billion of cathodes a year. Redwood plans to build a 
similar operation in Europe by 2023. 

“These numbers sound insane, but when you look at what the market needs, I’m 
like holy cow — is this even aggressive enough?” Straubel says. “Somebody’s got 
to do this. In fact, we need at least four companies doing similarly 
aggressive, crazy things all in the same timeline.”

-- next part --
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