Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
On 6/4/2014 6:15 PM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] wrote: On 06/04/2014 03:32 PM, s3raph...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: How do you know it is the mantra you're remembering? (This isn't a deep philosophical query.) Say your mantra is potato and you *hear* yourself repeating potahto then you'd be relaxed about that as we are encouraged to allow the syllable to mutate without trying to think it clearly. So the mantra can settle down to being a vague pulse and we're cool. What I was curious about was those advanced techniques. When you learn a new mantra - and with additional syllables - doesn't it require effort to keep reminding yourself that you are repeating the new mantra correctly? So wouldn't it be less effective than the simple bija mantra beginners are given which are chosen precisely because they can be easily forgotten? Funny you should mention that. On my TTC when MMY came to make us teachers he also gave out advanced techniques. On the flight back home folks were running around asking do you remember the mantra that MMY gave you for an advanced technique? A number of people could not or were confused as to it's pronunciation (including myself). In TM and advanced techniques, you get only one single mantra. The fertilizer you get are not mantras but Sanskrit words. It's not complicated. (On a related note: does repeating the sidhi mantras not require a more conscious effort than regular TM? - they seem to be repeated with eyes open judging by film footage of hoppers - so I'm guessing TM takes you deeper than samyama.)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
On 6/4/2014 6:21 PM, s3raph...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: ReFunny you should mention that. On my TTC when MMY came to make us teachers he also gave out advanced techniques. On the flight back home folks were running around asking do you remember the mantra that MMY gave you for an advanced technique? A number of people could not or were confused as to it's pronunciation (including myself). Ha-ha! There are also stories of people (here on FFL) who reverted back to their original bija mantras because they found the advanced technique mantra didn't agree with them. (I bet there was no money-back-if-not-completely-satisfied clause.) Maybe, but I've been reading these messages since Rick posted the first one and I can't recall anyone saying that, since you get only one mantra in TM and advanced techniques. Go figure.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Why Maharishi REALLY Hated Students 'Seeing Other Teachers'
On 6/4/2014 6:27 PM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Don't you guys who oppose this thing think it might be a mighty good idea to find out where the TM council members including the mayor stand? And especially MUM? Even tho its a university the fact that they are there, drawing in faulty, staff, and especially students plus the money they spend in the community makes them a force to be reckoned with locally. /Addressing the important issues!/ Apparently some people in FF and Vedic City are worried that some GMO dust might get blown their way from the proposed food co-op grain silo. This sounds really serious, /compared to eliminating food deserts in towns./ Down here, people are concerned about where and how they will be able to afford ordinary groceries. These days you go into a grocery store and get a few measly bags of food and it costs you almost $50. The rent is too damn high!
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi explains how UC becomes Brahman
On 6/4/2014 6:47 PM, merudanda wrote: **FWIW in danada`s holding meruop-onion chasing fleeting wood`s maximize attunement with the universe of me-ness sounds flashy nice** You are not even making any sense - it sounds complicated.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
On 6/4/2014 7:28 PM, authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Gee, in my understanding, you get only one bija mantra when you're initiated. The advanced techniques aren't new bija mantras, they're actual Sanskrit words that you use with your original bija mantra. Am I wrong? I have only one advanced technique, and that was the case for me. You are correct - and in the advanced/Night Technique/, there's no mantra involved at all. Go figure.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
Maybe if you are a kindergarden student as far as mantra shastra goes. Sadly, it's a subject that never was taught by Maharishi. But other paths do. It's also another reason why I walked away from TM: because it was very limited. FYI, this stuff has been available in books for decades. Swami Shivananda wrote quite a bit about it. To think that any of this is special or not to be discussed displays extreme ignorance. On 06/04/2014 06:42 PM, lengli...@cox.net [FairfieldLife] wrote: For what it is worth, discussion of advanced techniques could result in instant fail on TTC, or so I have read. Maharishi was far more strict about advanced technique discussion than about regular TM. L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, noozguru@... wrote : When did you get your advanced technique? When I got mine in 1976 it was based on a different beej mantra from the first technique I got. I've heard in later years it might have been taught by using the original beej and adding to it. There are all kinds of way to create advanced mantras and they can have different effects too. On 06/04/2014 05:28 PM, authfriend@... mailto:authfriend@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: Gee, in my understanding, you get only one bija mantra when you're initiated. The advanced techniques aren't new bija mantras, they're actual Sanskrit words that you use with your original bija mantra. Am I wrong? I have only one advanced technique, and that was the case for me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, s3raphita@... mailto:s3raphita@... wrote : ReFunny you should mention that. On my TTC when MMY came to make us teachers he also gave out advanced techniques. On the flight back home folks were running around asking do you remember the mantra that MMY gave you for an advanced technique? A number of people could not or were confused as to it's pronunciation (including myself). Ha-ha! There are also stories of people (here on FFL) who reverted back to their original bija mantras because they found the advanced technique mantra didn't agree with them. (I bet there was no money-back-if-not-completely-satisfied clause.)
Re: [FairfieldLife] detailed advanced technique discussion = bye bye for me.
What a loser! On 06/04/2014 06:44 PM, lengli...@cox.net [FairfieldLife] wrote: as the title suggests. I'm outa. Cheers all. L
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi explains how UC becomes Brahman
Whoa - ALL CAPS, eh? Self is right! :-) The spiritual explanation for that is, the continuing ripening and enrichment, the strength of the Self, from TC/CC to UC - ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : Fleetwood, for me it's not a CONCEPT of near and dear Self. It's an isness that's closer than the closest, almost impossible to put into words. On Wednesday, June 4, 2014 4:34 PM, fleetwood_macncheese@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com wrote: Thank you for this, Share - It is interesting that Maharishi refers to the ripening of UC (Brahman), as still in terms of the Self. I suppose in terms of continuing to function as a human being, that thread is necessary, the laisha vidya, but when the Self can, in reality, be anywhere, non local to the body, can it legitimately still be referred to as our Self? Not an argument, but experience (in Brahman) begins to render the concept of the Self, that has been near and dear, from CC on, almost meaningless. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@... wrote : 5/19-Maharishi: How Unity Consciousness becomes Brahman Consciousness becomes a part of Brahman Now, in the beginning days of Unity the object of the main focus of attention is appreciated in terms of the Self. This object is seen -- the eyes fall on it -- this object is appreciated in terms of the subject. But the eyes not only fall on this; there is the whole paraphernalia in the background. But that is in the background. The main focus is on this carnation, the secondary focus is on the table, the third-grade focus is on the floor, the fourth-grade is on this side. So, there are degrees of focus. In the beginning days of Unity only the first focus -- the object of first attention -- is in terms of the Self, and when this state is lived for a while the object of the second focus also participates in the same value. A little more practice, a little more living of Unity, and even the objects of the third-grade focus and then the fourth-grade focus [are in terms of the Self]. Like that, as we start to live the near environment in terms of the Self, so the ability to appreciate the farther values of the environment in terms of the Self keeps increasing. And the time comes when all the galactic universe, which we can't even see -- the whole thing becomes concretely cognized, and appreciated in terms of the Self. And that is the last [furthest] range of Unity Consciousness which, due to its different characteristic, has been given a name: Brahman Consciousness. It's Unity Consciousness; only, it's the expansion of Unity. ~Maharishi~ ~Seelisberg, Switzerland -- October 4, 1973~ ~Conversations with Maharishi, Volume 1 (p. 50-51)-- Edited by Dr. Vernon Katz -- 2011~ * * * * * * * From Unity is born that wholeness which is Brahman, in comparison to which, Unity becomes a part, has the value of a part. ~Maharishi~ ~Vittel, France -- September 19, 1973 ~Conversations with Maharishi, Volume 1 (p. 51) -- Edited by Dr. Vernon Katz -- 2011~
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
Again it depends when you got your advanced technique. This ain't a religion. You are to keep your mantra secret supposedly to keep it's power for you. But discussion of mantra shastra and how mantras work is certainly not off limits unless a crazy cult leader demands it which would only be for him to keep his cult in line. On 06/04/2014 07:07 PM, emptyb...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: /Authfriend: / /Gee, in my understanding, you get only one bija mantra when you're initiated. The advanced techniques aren't new bija mantras, they're actual Sanskrit words that you use with your original bija mantra. Am I wrong? I have only one advanced technique, and that was the case for me./ Yes, that is true. Supposedly, we only get one bija mantra. It is later used with Sanskrit words that interject certain meanings and actions – for TM they are shama akshara-s (i.e. peaceful, laudatory and surrendering seed-sounds). However, this is not true for TM teachers since, by definition, they received a well-known sequence of bija mantras used to initiate students. Most teachers appear to use this group of mantras */only/* to initiate. However, the whole group of mantras is fully charged and available for meditation whenever used in that manner. Most TM teachers don’t like to talk about this possibility - proly because they are apprehensive about it being “off the program”. I have done so (of course) and find this collection rather too intense to use for the sake of mere curiosity. In the live-a-day world, such potency, distinctive qualities and effacing intensity is more suited to those renunciate sadhus keen to finish off their stock of prarabdha karma.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi explains how UC becomes Brahman
I think I'll start my own country next.:-) I am looking at a 42 acre, level, wooded property in the Sierra foothills, about fifteen miles north of Paradise, with a house and large horse barn included (art and music studio, and maybe a couple of cats, too). If I end up there, first priority: design a national flag.-lol- ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote : ?? During practice of the Transcendental Meditation technique, individuals report an experience of the Self aware of itself-free from the incessant thoughts, feelings and perceptions that usually fill their minds. Maharishi explains that this is Transcendental Consciousness, a fourth state of consciousness called Turiya Chetana in the Vedic tradition. Repeated alternation of the fourth state with customary waking activity gives rise to a new integrated state in which Transcendental Consciousness co-exists across the 24 hours of waking, dreaming and sleeping consciousness. Maharishi explains that this is Cosmic Consciousness, a fifth state of consciousness called Turiyatit Chetana. In Cosmic Consciousness, Transcendental Consciousness is experienced as a foundational state that is full in its Nature and is untouched by ongoing experience during waking, sleeping and dreaming. It is analogous to the vastness of the ocean not being lost with each rising wave of daily life.!?! FWIW in danada`s holding meru op-onion chasing fleeting wood`s maximize attunement with the universe of me-ness sounds flashy nice Anybody remembers MMY (appr. the same time -1973-o.m. paper butterfly-Share shared with us) intimate beautiful description how The Guru is needed and appears naturally by cosmic demand to recognize silently with a tape amicale from within of within without outer noise and certainly no public assurancethe UC in the focused seeker--- in order to stop-settle down lovely- intimate with a laughing twinkle of an eye the chasing fleeting wood of UC? just asking without cosmic demand and then.. .. if I should ever go away Well, then close your eyes and try To feel the way we do today And then if you can remember Keep smiling, keep shining That's What Friends Are For - Dionne Warwick and Friends http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdHFElOHQzs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdHFElOHQzs That's What Friends Are For - Dionne Warwick and Fri... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdHFElOHQzs That's What Friends Are For is a 1982 song written by Burt Bacharach and Carole Bayer Sager and introduced by Rod Stewart for the soundtrack of the... View on www.youtube.com http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdHFElOHQzs Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
On 6/4/2014 8:07 PM, Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] wrote: When did you get your advanced technique? When I got mine in 1976 it was based on a different beej mantra from the first technique I got. I've heard in later years it might have been taught by using the original beej and adding to it. There are all kinds of way to create advanced mantras and they can have different effects too. That's interesting because when I got my initial TM initiation, Jerry Jarvis gave me the bija mantra /and the fertilizer/ the first time. My advanced technique was the Night Technique I got from Satyanand that had no mantras at all. What I'm interested in is where MMY got the list of bija mantras. Usually you get a bija mantra from your guru, not a whole list of bijas to pass out to others. There are lists of bijas in so many books, but a real guru would probably not get them from a book, or would he? And, how would MMY know what bija mantras SBS was giving out, since they are supposedly whispered into the ear and kept secret by the student in an initiation? Apparently all the bija mantras used in TM are bhakti mantras used in /qualified non-dualism/ by Vaishnavas. Are there any bija mantras in TM that would be used in relation to the impersonal Brahman? When you think about it, repeating a sound over and over in your mind is kind of a strange thing to be doing, when you can't even read a Sanskrit scripture or even speak Hindi to find out what it means. How do we know if somebody didn't just make up sounds to confuse the people and charge a fee? What is it, exactly, that would lead a rational person to repeat a nonsense gibberish phrase given to them by a total stranger? Also, how many mantras does a person need to know in order to become enlightened? There are a lot of unanswered questions about the bija mantras. I've been asking these questions for 40 years - and since 1999 on the internet - and nobody has been able to provide an answer. You're probably the most qualified person to date. Go figure. On 06/04/2014 05:28 PM, authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Gee, in my understanding, you get only one bija mantra when you're initiated. The advanced techniques aren't new bija mantras, they're actual Sanskrit words that you use with your original bija mantra. Am I wrong? I have only one advanced technique, and that was the case for me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, s3raphita@... wrote : ReFunny you should mention that. On my TTC when MMY came to make us teachers he also gave out advanced techniques. On the flight back home folks were running around asking do you remember the mantra that MMY gave you for an advanced technique? A number of people could not or were confused as to it's pronunciation (including myself). Ha-ha! There are also stories of people (here on FFL) who reverted back to their original bija mantras because they found the advanced technique mantra didn't agree with them. (I bet there was no money-back-if-not-completely-satisfied clause.)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
On 6/4/2014 8:12 PM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: aing to aing namah to shri aing namah is the way it went for me. The only bija in this list is aing. Were you thinking that sri and namah were also bijas? Go figure. *From:* Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Wednesday, June 4, 2014 9:07 PM *Subject:* Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring When did you get your advanced technique? When I got mine in 1976 it was based on a different beej mantra from the first technique I got. I've heard in later years it might have been taught by using the original beej and adding to it. There are all kinds of way to create advanced mantras and they can have different effects too. On 06/04/2014 05:28 PM, authfri...@yahoo.com mailto:authfri...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Gee, in my understanding, you get only one bija mantra when you're initiated. The advanced techniques aren't new bija mantras, they're actual Sanskrit words that you use with your original bija mantra. Am I wrong? I have only one advanced technique, and that was the case for me. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, s3raphita@... mailto:s3raphita@... wrote : ReFunny you should mention that. On my TTC when MMY came to make us teachers he also gave out advanced techniques. On the flight back home folks were running around asking do you remember the mantra that MMY gave you for an advanced technique? A number of people could not or were confused as to it's pronunciation (including myself). Ha-ha! There are also stories of people (here on FFL) who reverted back to their original bija mantras because they found the advanced technique mantra didn't agree with them. (I bet there was no money-back-if-not-completely-satisfied clause.)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Vedanta, TM and Vipassana
Yeah, I basically agree. As many benefits as I have gained from TM, etc., and all the *crap* I enjoy about enlightenment - lol -, it wouldn't be worth a plugged nickel, if I didn't have a life, too. No Fun.:-( I pretty much run flat out, all the time, like an Irish Setter, and doing all the attunement exercises, ensures I don't smack into a tree at 80 miles an hour. 75, maybe, but not 80... ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote : ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : How do you reconcile the fact that TM is supposed to make all things get better in a fabulous way (according to the pr) and you have been doing TM for all these years yet are OCD? If TM works as advertised, why do you think it has not melted the OCD energy away? I don't think that is how it works, all too literal and absolute. TM may be a positive thing to do, it may reduce stress, it may even get you to enlightenment but it won't remove warts, fix the ingrown toenail or ensure you don't have bad breath in the morning. Maybe if Sparaig didn't do TM he would be dead for all you know. From: LEnglish5@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, June 4, 2014 8:52 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Vedanta, TM and Vipassana As far as I can tell, I think a mantra without effort with the best of 'em and I'm currently being evaluated for disability due to OCD/ADHD. L ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, s3raphita@... wrote : Re There's no monitoring required to do TM. In fact, you can get lost for hours in thought if you have mental health problems as I do, and still be doing TM correctly.: I have wondered if people with OCD or similar obsessive habits can think a mantra effortlessly !
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
On 6/4/2014 8:12 PM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: aing to aing namah to shri aing namah is the way it went for me. The so-called/Saraswati bija//mantra/ is an early Buddhist bija mantra - apparently you practiced Buddhism for twelve years. Did you also mediate inside a Buddhsit stupa at MIU? Go figure.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: No Effort means no need for self-reflexive monitoring
On 6/4/2014 9:07 PM, emptyb...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Yes, that is true. Supposedly, we only get one bija mantra. It is later used with Sanskrit words that interject certain meanings and actions – for TM they are shama akshara-s (i.e. peaceful, laudatory and surrendering seed-sounds). However, this is not true for TM teachers since, by definition, they received a well-known sequence of bija mantras used to initiate students. Most teachers appear to use this group of mantras */only/* to initiate. However, the whole group of mantras is fully charged and available for meditation whenever used in that manner. Most TM teachers don’t like to talk about this possibility - proly because they are apprehensive about it being “off the program”. I have done so (of course) and find this collection rather too intense to use for the sake of mere curiosity. In the live-a-day world, such potency, distinctive qualities and effacing intensity is more suited to those renunciate sadhus keen to finish off their stock of prarabdha karma. So, where do the TM bija mantras come from? It's not a complicated question, or is it? We know that some of them are mentioned in Sri Vidya scriptures, but how did they get in there? According to Williams, the first historical mantra is mentioned in the /Prajña//p//ramita Hrdaya//Sutra/, which apparently originated in the Swat Valley around 100 BCE. Go figure. Work cited: 'Mahayana Buddhism: The Doctrinal Foundations' by Paul Williams 2nd edition. Routledge, 2009 pp. 52-3.
