[FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics
The notion that ancient Hindu mysticism is just quantum physics wrapped in metaphysical garb seems to have originated with Fritjof Capra in his book The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels Between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism (1975). The book's first two parts are excellent expositions on ancient religions and modern physics. The third part, which tries to connect the two is an abysmal failure and about the purest poppycock this side of Bombay. Nevertheless, it has been this third part which has influenced numerous New Age energy medicine advocates to claim that quantum physics proves the reality of everything from chi and prana to ESP. The idea that there is such a connection is denied by most physicists but books like Capra's and Gary Zukav's The Dancing Wu Li Masters : An Overview of the New Physics (1976) overshadow and are much more popular than more sensible books written by physicists. Chopra and other defenders of Ayurveda, following Capra and Zukav, are fond of claiming that modern physics has substantially validated ancient Hindu metaphysics. However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. The claim that the fields of modern physics have anything to do with the field of consciousness is false. The notion that what physicists call the vacuum state has anything to do with consciousness is nonsense. The claim that large numbers of people meditating helps reduce crime and war by creating a unified field of consciousness is foolishness of a high order. The presentation of the ideas of modern physics side by side, and apparently supportive of, the ideas of the Maharishi about pure consciousness can only be intended to deceive those who might not know any better. Reading these materials authorized by the Maharishi causes me distress because I am a man who values the truth. To see the beautiful and profound ideas of modern physics, the labor of generations of scientists, so willfully perverted provokes a feeling of compassion for those who might be taken in by these distortions. I would like to be generous to the Maharishi and his movement because it supports world peace and other high ideals. But none of these ideals could possibly be realized within the framework of a philosophy that so willfully distorts scientific truth (Pagels). From: http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html Deepak Chopra - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com From Abracadabra to Zombies | View All a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r View on www.skepdic.com Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics
Do you have a physics degree, Michael? A bit of what is in physics goes back centuries to Greece and other countries like China and yup probably India as well. It's just observation and certainly could be coded in Indian science. Pagels must not know biochemistry or just thought that ayurveda uses exotic herbs he didn't have access too. Examining the chemical properties of cinnamon, ginger, fennel, cloves he might have had a different opinion. On 11/05/2014 11:02 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: The notion that ancient Hindu mysticism is just quantum physics wrapped in metaphysical garb seems to have originated with Fritjof Capra in his book /The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels Between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism/ (1975). The book's first two parts are excellent expositions on ancient religions and modern physics. The third part, which tries to connect the two is an abysmal failure and about the purest poppycock this side of Bombay. Nevertheless, it has been this third part which has influenced numerous New Age energy medicine advocates to claim that quantum physics proves the reality of everything from chi and prana to ESP http://www.skepdic.com/esp.html. The idea that there is such a connection is denied by most physicists but books like Capra's and Gary Zukav's /The Dancing Wu Li Masters : An Overview of the New Physics /(1976) overshadow and are much more popular than more sensible books written by physicists. Chopra and other defenders of Ayurveda, following Capra and Zukav, are fond of claiming that modern physics has substantially validated ancient Hindu metaphysics. However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of /The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0553246259/roberttoddcarrolA// vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. The claim that the fields of modern physics have anything to do with the field of consciousness is false. The notion that what physicists call the vacuum state has anything to do with consciousness is nonsense. The claim that large numbers of people meditating helps reduce crime and war by creating a unified field of consciousness is foolishness of a high order. The presentation of the ideas of modern physics side by side, and apparently supportive of, the ideas of the Maharishi about pure consciousness can only be intended to deceive those who might not know any better. Reading these materials authorized by the Maharishi causes me distress because I am a man who values the truth. To see the beautiful and profound ideas of modern physics, the labor of generations of scientists, so willfully perverted provokes a feeling of compassion for those who might be taken in by these distortions. I would like to be generous to the Maharishi and his movement because it supports world peace and other high ideals. But none of these ideals could possibly be realized within the framework of a philosophy that so willfully distorts scientific truth (Pagels http://web.archive.org/web/19990420021943/http:/www.trancenet.org/research/pagels.shtml). From: http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html image http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html Deepak Chopra - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html From Abracadabra to Zombies | View All a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r View on www.skepdic.com http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics
Why don't you ask Pagels if he has a degree in physics? Just because you want there to be a correlation between quantum physics and meditation ain't gone make it so. certainly could be coded in Indian science - this is a horseshit observation. Prove it and then Pagels will have to eat his words. You are also misreading the post. Pagels says nothing about ayurveda - the author merely referred to Chopra as a defender of ayurveda. Pagels is specifically addressing the idea that modern physics is found in ancient Hindu claptrap and that the claptrap is validated by modern physics. From: Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 5, 2014 2:26 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics Do you have a physics degree, Michael? A bit of what is in physics goes back centuries to Greece and other countries like China and yup probably India as well. It's just observation and certainly could be coded in Indian science. Pagels must not know biochemistry or just thought that ayurveda uses exotic herbs he didn't have access too. Examining the chemical properties of cinnamon, ginger, fennel, cloves he might have had a different opinion. On 11/05/2014 11:02 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: The notion that ancient Hindu mysticism is just quantum physics wrapped in metaphysical garb seems to have originated with Fritjof Capra in his book The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels Between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism (1975). The book's first two parts are excellent expositions on ancient religions and modern physics. The third part, which tries to connect the two is an abysmal failure and about the purest poppycock this side of Bombay. Nevertheless, it has been this third part which has influenced numerous New Age energy medicine advocates to claim that quantum physics proves the reality of everything from chi and prana to ESP. The idea that there is such a connection is denied by most physicists but books like Capra's and Gary Zukav's The Dancing Wu Li Masters : An Overview of the New Physics (1976) overshadow and are much more popular than more sensible books written by physicists. Chopra and other defenders of Ayurveda, following Capra and Zukav, are fond of claiming that modern physics has substantially validated ancient Hindu metaphysics. However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. The claim that the fields of modern physics have anything to do with the field of consciousness is false. The notion that what physicists call the vacuum state has anything to do with consciousness is nonsense. The claim that large numbers of people meditating helps reduce crime and war by creating a unified field of consciousness is foolishness of a high order. The presentation of the ideas of modern physics side by side, and apparently supportive of, the ideas of the Maharishi about pure consciousness can only be intended to deceive those who might not know any better. Reading these materials authorized by the Maharishi causes me distress because I am a man who values the truth. To see the beautiful and profound ideas of modern physics, the labor of generations of scientists, so willfully perverted provokes a feeling of compassion for those who might be taken in by these distortions. I would like to be generous to the Maharishi and his movement because it supports world peace and other high ideals. But none of these ideals could possibly be realized within the framework of a philosophy that so willfully distorts scientific truth (Pagels). From: http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html Deepak Chopra - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com From Abracadabra to Zombies | View All a b c d e f g h i j k l m n o p q r View on www.skepdic.com Preview by Yahoo
Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics
On 11/05/2014 11:42 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Why don't you ask Pagels if he has a degree in physics? Just because you want there to be a correlation between quantum physics and meditation ain't gone make it so. certainly could be coded in Indian science - this is a horseshit observation. Prove it and then Pagels will have to eat his words. This is the narcissism of believing that our current civilization is the most advanced that EVER existed on this planet. That can't be correlated because real scientists have figured that after 5000 year much evidence of a civilization would have deteriorated. All you get is stone masonry and broken pottery. You are also misreading the post. Pagels says nothing about ayurveda - the author merely referred to Chopra as a defender of ayurveda. Pagels is specifically addressing the idea that modern physics is found in ancient Hindu claptrap and that the claptrap is validated by modern physics. You don't even read the stuff you post? /However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0553246259/roberttoddcarrolA/ vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. / // *From:* Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Wednesday, November 5, 2014 2:26 PM *Subject:* Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics Do you have a physics degree, Michael? A bit of what is in physics goes back centuries to Greece and other countries like China and yup probably India as well. It's just observation and certainly could be coded in Indian science. Pagels must not know biochemistry or just thought that ayurveda uses exotic herbs he didn't have access too. Examining the chemical properties of cinnamon, ginger, fennel, cloves he might have had a different opinion. On 11/05/2014 11:02 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com mailto:mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: The notion that ancient Hindu mysticism is just quantum physics wrapped in metaphysical garb seems to have originated with Fritjof Capra in his book /The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels Between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism/ (1975). The book's first two parts are excellent expositions on ancient religions and modern physics. The third part, which tries to connect the two is an abysmal failure and about the purest poppycock this side of Bombay. Nevertheless, it has been this third part which has influenced numerous New Age energy medicine advocates to claim that quantum physics proves the reality of everything from chi and prana to ESP http://www.skepdic.com/esp.html. The idea that there is such a connection is denied by most physicists but books like Capra's and Gary Zukav's /The Dancing Wu Li Masters : An Overview of the New Physics /(1976) overshadow and are much more popular than more sensible books written by physicists. Chopra and other defenders of Ayurveda, following Capra and Zukav, are fond of claiming that modern physics has substantially validated ancient Hindu metaphysics. However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of /The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0553246259/roberttoddcarrolA// vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. The claim that the fields of modern physics have anything to do with the field of consciousness is false. The notion that what physicists call the vacuum state has anything to do with consciousness is nonsense. The claim that large numbers of people meditating helps reduce crime and war by creating a unified field of consciousness is foolishness of a high order. The presentation of the ideas of modern physics side by side, and apparently supportive of, the ideas of the Maharishi about pure consciousness can only be intended to deceive those who might not know any better. Reading these materials authorized by the Maharishi causes me distress because I am a man who values the truth. To see the beautiful and profound ideas of modern physics, the labor of generations of scientists, so willfully perverted provokes a feeling of compassion for those who might be taken in by these distortions. I would like to be generous
Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics
You are correct - I was referring to the letter that Pagels wrote which I also posted but I see in hind sight that you were referring to the first post and not the full letter - I stand corrected. From: Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 5, 2014 3:04 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics On 11/05/2014 11:42 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: Why don't you ask Pagels if he has a degree in physics? Just because you want there to be a correlation between quantum physics and meditation ain't gone make it so. certainly could be coded in Indian science - this is a horseshit observation. Prove it and then Pagels will have to eat his words. This is the narcissism of believing that our current civilization is the most advanced that EVER existed on this planet. That can't be correlated because real scientists have figured that after 5000 year much evidence of a civilization would have deteriorated. All you get is stone masonry and broken pottery. You are also misreading the post. Pagels says nothing about ayurveda - the author merely referred to Chopra as a defender of ayurveda. Pagels is specifically addressing the idea that modern physics is found in ancient Hindu claptrap and that the claptrap is validated by modern physics. You don't even read the stuff you post? However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. From: Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 5, 2014 2:26 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics Do you have a physics degree, Michael? A bit of what is in physics goes back centuries to Greece and other countries like China and yup probably India as well. It's just observation and certainly could be coded in Indian science. Pagels must not know biochemistry or just thought that ayurveda uses exotic herbs he didn't have access too. Examining the chemical properties of cinnamon, ginger, fennel, cloves he might have had a different opinion. On 11/05/2014 11:02 AM, Michael Jackson mjackso...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote: The notion that ancient Hindu mysticism is just quantum physics wrapped in metaphysical garb seems to have originated with Fritjof Capra in his book The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels Between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism (1975). The book's first two parts are excellent expositions on ancient religions and modern physics. The third part, which tries to connect the two is an abysmal failure and about the purest poppycock this side of Bombay. Nevertheless, it has been this third part which has influenced numerous New Age energy medicine advocates to claim that quantum physics proves the reality of everything from chi and prana to ESP. The idea that there is such a connection is denied by most physicists but books like Capra's and Gary Zukav's The Dancing Wu Li Masters : An Overview of the New Physics (1976) overshadow and are much more popular than more sensible books written by physicists. Chopra and other defenders of Ayurveda, following Capra and Zukav, are fond of claiming that modern physics has substantially validated ancient Hindu metaphysics. However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. The claim that the fields of modern physics have anything to do with the field of consciousness is false. The notion that what physicists call the vacuum state has anything to do with consciousness is nonsense. The claim that large numbers of people meditating helps reduce crime and war by creating a unified field of consciousness is foolishness of a high order. The presentation of the ideas of modern physics side by side, and apparently supportive of, the ideas of the Maharishi about pure consciousness can only be intended to deceive those who might not know any better. Reading these materials authorized by the Maharishi causes me distress because I am a man who values the truth. To see the beautiful and profound ideas of modern physics, the labor
Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics
perhaps it will dawn on you some day, Michael, that physics, like every other branch is an evolving science. this piece by Hagel may one day be shown to be prescient, or may one day sound like a backward thinking scientist. Perhaps we will find out. Of course, there are statements by much greater pioneers in physics who have speculated, just the opposite of Hagels. But acknowledging that would be the equivalent of throwing sand into the gearworks of your mind. ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mjackson74@... wrote : Why don't you ask Pagels if he has a degree in physics? Just because you want there to be a correlation between quantum physics and meditation ain't gone make it so. certainly could be coded in Indian science - this is a horseshit observation. Prove it and then Pagels will have to eat his words. You are also misreading the post. Pagels says nothing about ayurveda - the author merely referred to Chopra as a defender of ayurveda. Pagels is specifically addressing the idea that modern physics is found in ancient Hindu claptrap and that the claptrap is validated by modern physics. From: Bhairitu noozguru@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, November 5, 2014 2:26 PM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Hindu Physics Do you have a physics degree, Michael? A bit of what is in physics goes back centuries to Greece and other countries like China and yup probably India as well. It's just observation and certainly could be coded in Indian science. Pagels must not know biochemistry or just thought that ayurveda uses exotic herbs he didn't have access too. Examining the chemical properties of cinnamon, ginger, fennel, cloves he might have had a different opinion. On 11/05/2014 11:02 AM, Michael Jackson mjackson74@... mailto:mjackson74@... [FairfieldLife] wrote: The notion that ancient Hindu mysticism is just quantum physics wrapped in metaphysical garb seems to have originated with Fritjof Capra in his book The Tao of Physics: An Exploration of the Parallels Between Modern Physics and Eastern Mysticism (1975). The book's first two parts are excellent expositions on ancient religions and modern physics. The third part, which tries to connect the two is an abysmal failure and about the purest poppycock this side of Bombay. Nevertheless, it has been this third part which has influenced numerous New Age energy medicine advocates to claim that quantum physics proves the reality of everything from chi and prana to ESP http://www.skepdic.com/esp.html. The idea that there is such a connection is denied by most physicists but books like Capra's and Gary Zukav's The Dancing Wu Li Masters : An Overview of the New Physics (1976)overshadow and are much more popular than more sensible books written by physicists. Chopra and other defenders of Ayurveda, following Capra and Zukav, are fond of claiming that modern physics has substantially validated ancient Hindu metaphysics. However, physicist Heinz R. Pagels, author of The Cosmic Code: Quantum Physics as the Language of Nature vehemently rejects the notion that there is any significant connection between the discoveries of modern physicists and the metaphysical claims of Ayurveda. No qualified physicist that I know would claim to find such a connection without knowingly committing fraud, says Dr. Pagels. The claim that the fields of modern physics have anything to do with the field of consciousness is false. The notion that what physicists call the vacuum state has anything to do with consciousness is nonsense. The claim that large numbers of people meditating helps reduce crime and war by creating a unified field of consciousness is foolishness of a high order. The presentation of the ideas of modern physics side by side, and apparently supportive of, the ideas of the Maharishi about pure consciousness can only be intended to deceive those who might not know any better. Reading these materials authorized by the Maharishi causes me distress because I am a man who values the truth. To see the beautiful and profound ideas of modern physics, the labor of generations of scientists, so willfully perverted provokes a feeling of compassion for those who might be taken in by these distortions. I would like to be generous to the Maharishi and his movement because it supports world peace and other high ideals. But none of these ideals could possibly be realized within the framework of a philosophy that so willfully distorts scientific truth (Pagels http://web.archive.org/web/19990420021943/http:/www.trancenet.org/research/pagels.shtml). From: http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html http://www.skepdic.com/chopra.html Deepak Chopra - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com From Abracadabra to Zombies | View
