Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- On Sun, 8/15/10, wgm4u wg...@yahoo.com wrote: From: wgm4u wg...@yahoo.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, August 15, 2010, 8:23 PM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: In Yogananada's kriya line this is the cosmic mandala. When you penetrate the different bindu-s, your consciousness transits into that loka. However you have to have good dharana. You can't just project your imagination, gossip with the masters and call it a day. The golden-yellow is the background color of prana and of the suksma loka-s (gross and subtle worlds). The blue (nila mandala) is the background color of the casual realm or karana loka-s. In the center is a white bindu. This central white bindu is seen as guru, deva, ishvara. Which, in order to actually transcend (in actuality) one has to penetrate (the white 5 pointed star in the center of the third eye or Ajna Chakra the portal to the infinite). I get a headache just reading that! You can't penetrate anything. Subtle, subtle, subtle intent and letting go. It pulls attention in by itself. As ol' Charlie used to say, You can't storm the gates of heaven! To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: --- On Sun, 8/15/10, wgm4u wg...@... wrote: From: wgm4u wg...@... Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, August 15, 2010, 8:23 PM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptybill@ wrote: In Yogananada's kriya line this is the cosmic mandala. When you penetrate the different bindu-s, your consciousness transits into that loka. However you have to have good dharana. You can't just project your imagination, gossip with the masters and call it a day. The golden-yellow is the background color of prana and of the suksma loka-s (gross and subtle worlds). The blue (nila mandala) is the background color of the casual realm or karana loka-s. In the center is a white bindu. This central white bindu is seen as guru, deva, ishvara. Which, in order to actually transcend (in actuality) one has to penetrate (the white 5 pointed star in the center of the third eye or Ajna Chakra the portal to the infinite). I get a headache just reading that! You can't penetrate anything. Subtle, subtle, subtle intent and letting go. It pulls attention in by itself. As ol' Charlie used to say, You can't storm the gates of heaven! In Kriya Yoga they practice Dharana or concentration as recommended by Maharishi Patanjali. Swami Yogananda recommends all 8 limbs of Yoga to achieve Nirvikalpa Samadhi (as does MMY as well in the BG). TM is a different method of meditation, empty bill was talking about Kriya. I personally don't think Patanjali taught TM type meditation, he clearly taught the concentration method as recommended by SRF. AS you concentrate deeper and deeper you *consciously* withdraw the prana up the sushumna finally to the third eye (Ajna). You have described TM well as Charlie put it, but Kriya also leads to enlightenment and comports to what Patanjali actually taught, unlike MMY, IMO.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: cardemaister: A.C's reading is otherwise odd Swami Bhaktivedanta, a Vedantin, enumerates the five classical states of consciousness which are similar to M's: 1. Wakefulness (jagrat) 2. Dream state (svapna) 3. Deep sleep (sushupti) 4. Superconscious state (turiya) 5. Transcendent state (turiyatita) 'OM Mantra and 7 Levels of Consciousness' by Swami Jnaneshvara Bharati http://www.swamij.com/om.htm#sevenstates Same as Yogananda: Waking, Dreaming, Deep Sleep, Super Conscious/Causal, Self Realization (what MMY calls Cosmic Consciousness), God Realization, Cosmic Consciousness (what MMY calls Unity). Same states of consciousness, slightly different names..(MMY wanted to be different I guess because in most schools of Yoga and classical Yoga CC is considered the ultimate or what MMY calls Unity).
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: I get a ideo-dynamic conditioned headache just reading that! You can't penetrate anything--you naughty boy you ..ups. Chakra girl? .. As ol' Charlie used to say, You can't storm the gates of heaven!and Don't teach your Ajna Chakra to suck eggs or snake's heads REMBER REMBER REMBER REMBER REMBER Ajna Chakra SUCKS NOT penetrates Ajna Chakra is a sucker REMEMBER sucks you into the infinity surely a sucker bet greeting from your bathetically sucker PS in the next message Card will show his ma(i)stery in explaining the semantic meaning of the verb suck in Sanskrit and it's root relation to the Germanic languages as well as the misunderstanding /misuse of the Latin word penetrare, derived from penitus= deeply = infinite followed by SrSri DrDr about the ideo-dynamic response to your motoric mental health of the word suck suck gentle and it's many variational operatives in meditation toppled by our omphaloskeptic navel loss1008 http://profiles.yahoo.com/nablusoss1008 with a detail description of the hidden esoteric meaning and many you-tube reference of the revealing suck relationship to the lost MASTERS (string theory)
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- On Mon, 8/16/10, wgm4u wg...@yahoo.com wrote: From: wgm4u wg...@yahoo.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, August 16, 2010, 7:36 AM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: --- On Sun, 8/15/10, wgm4u wg...@... wrote: From: wgm4u wg...@... Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, August 15, 2010, 8:23 PM --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptybill@ wrote: In Yogananada's kriya line this is the cosmic mandala. When you penetrate the different bindu-s, your consciousness transits into that loka. However you have to have good dharana. You can't just project your imagination, gossip with the masters and call it a day. The golden-yellow is the background color of prana and of the suksma loka-s (gross and subtle worlds). The blue (nila mandala) is the background color of the casual realm or karana loka-s. In the center is a white bindu. This central white bindu is seen as guru, deva, ishvara. Which, in order to actually transcend (in actuality) one has to penetrate (the white 5 pointed star in the center of the third eye or Ajna Chakra the portal to the infinite). I get a headache just reading that! You can't penetrate anything. Subtle, subtle, subtle intent and letting go. It pulls attention in by itself. As ol' Charlie used to say, You can't storm the gates of heaven! In Kriya Yoga they practice Dharana or concentration as recommended by Maharishi Patanjali. Swami Yogananda recommends all 8 limbs of Yoga to achieve Nirvikalpa Samadhi (as does MMY as well in the BG). TM is a different method of meditation, empty bill was talking about Kriya. I personally don't think Patanjali taught TM type meditation, he clearly taught the concentration method as recommended by SRF. AS you concentrate deeper and deeper you *consciously* withdraw the prana up the sushumna finally to the third eye (Ajna). You have described TM well as Charlie put it, but Kriya also leads to enlightenment and comports to what Patanjali actually taught, unlike MMY, IMO. Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
wgm4u: Same as Yogananda: According Vaj, MMY 'made up' the 'seven states of consciousness'. Now we see that MMY's seven states schema is almost the same as Wilber, Swami Bhaktivedanta, Swami Rama, and Swami Yogananda, and the Vijnanavada, Sri Vidya, and Trika systems. Apparently Vaj, in his religious zeal to discredit MMY, got mixed up again. Waking, Dreaming, Deep Sleep, Super Conscious/Causal, Self Realization (what MMY calls Cosmic Consciousness), God Realization, Cosmic Consciousness (what MMY calls Unity). Same states of consciousness, slightly different names ..(MMY wanted to be different I guess because in most schools of Yoga and classical Yoga CC is considered the ultimate or what MMY calls Unity). Swami Bhaktivedanta, a Vedantin, enumerates the five classical states of consciousness which are similar to M's: 1. Wakefulness (jagrat) 2. Dream state (svapna) 3. Deep sleep (sushupti) 4. Superconscious state (turiya) 5. Transcendent state (turiyatita) 'OM Mantra and 7 Levels of Consciousness' by Swami Jnaneshvara Bharati http://www.swamij.com/om.htm#sevenstates
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutp...@... wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there ... back in the day! --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? Actually I was there. He told me: Sorry but you have a bunch more be-backs. He also told me: In one of them you will hear the speech of a demon. He his name will be ritam (right/wright) but he will claim that there is no ritam,only anritam (wrong). Further, whenever he sees or hears the word, 'penetrate', he will attempt to insert himself, thinking I am the great I, the universal Lingam. They call to me and so I shall appear in that place claiming sovereignty. He then finished with: When that happens, use the demon dispelling mantra Ahem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
rightI'm still waiting for Vaj to present some evidence showing how his Guru (Norbu Rinpoche)'s metaphysics is somehow beyond what MMY has elucidated in his scheme of the 7 states of Consciousness. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: wgm4u: Same as Yogananda: According Vaj, MMY 'made up' the 'seven states of consciousness'. Now we see that MMY's seven states schema is almost the same as Wilber, Swami Bhaktivedanta, Swami Rama, and Swami Yogananda, and the Vijnanavada, Sri Vidya, and Trika systems. Apparently Vaj, in his religious zeal to discredit MMY, got mixed up again. Waking, Dreaming, Deep Sleep, Super Conscious/Causal, Self Realization (what MMY calls Cosmic Consciousness), God Realization, Cosmic Consciousness (what MMY calls Unity). Same states of consciousness, slightly different names ..(MMY wanted to be different I guess because in most schools of Yoga and classical Yoga CC is considered the ultimate or what MMY calls Unity). Swami Bhaktivedanta, a Vedantin, enumerates the five classical states of consciousness which are similar to M's: 1. Wakefulness (jagrat) 2. Dream state (svapna) 3. Deep sleep (sushupti) 4. Superconscious state (turiya) 5. Transcendent state (turiyatita) 'OM Mantra and 7 Levels of Consciousness' by Swami Jnaneshvara Bharati http://www.swamij.com/om.htm#sevenstates
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Thanks. this is the Phuket mantra: uAhem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! ... as it has turned out, just yesterday a US Marine was in a bar in Phuket, Thailand and challenged to a fight by a Brit kick-boxer who killed the Marine for no apparent reason with multiple stabbings. So go figure!. i --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there ... back in the day! --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? Actually I was there. He told me: Sorry but you have a bunch more be-backs. He also told me: In one of them you will hear the speech of a demon. He his name will be ritam (right/wright) but he will claim that there is no ritam,only anritam (wrong). Further, whenever he sees or hears the word, 'penetrate', he will attempt to insert himself, thinking I am the great I, the universal Lingam. They call to me and so I shall appear in that place claiming sovereignty. He then finished with: When that happens, use the demon dispelling mantra Ahem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifux...@... wrote: Thanks. this is the Phuket mantra: uAhem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! ... as it has turned out, just yesterday a US Marine was in a bar in Phuket, Thailand and challenged to a fight by a Brit kick- boxer who killed the Marine for no apparent reason with multiple stabbings. So go figure!. He just wasn't using the mantra properly. He should read the book by this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVdKQ0I35qo --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptybill@ wrote: --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there ... back in the day! --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? Actually I was there. He told me: Sorry but you have a bunch more be-backs. He also told me: In one of them you will hear the speech of a demon. He his name will be ritam (right/wright) but he will claim that there is no ritam,only anritam (wrong). Further, whenever he sees or hears the word, 'penetrate', he will attempt to insert himself, thinking I am the great I, the universal Lingam. They call to me and so I shall appear in that place claiming sovereignty. He then finished with: When that happens, use the demon dispelling mantra Ahem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Yep, you're wright. I jus' din' memeber it the same. I went back an saw that he really gave it as: Ahem phukit phukit anritam wah tuh phuk haha! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: Thanks. this is the Phuket mantra: uAhem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! ... as it has turned out, just yesterday a US Marine was in a bar in Phuket, Thailand and challenged to a fight by a Brit kick- boxer who killed the Marine for no apparent reason with multiple stabbings. So go figure!. He just wasn't using the mantra properly. He should read the book by this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVdKQ0I35qo --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptybill@ wrote: --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there ... back in the day! --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? Actually I was there. He told me: Sorry but you have a bunch more be-backs. He also told me: In one of them you will hear the speech of a demon. He his name will be ritam (right/wright) but he will claim that there is no ritam,only anritam (wrong). Further, whenever he sees or hears the word, 'penetrate', he will attempt to insert himself, thinking I am the great I, the universal Lingam. They call to me and so I shall appear in that place claiming sovereignty. He then finished with: When that happens, use the demon dispelling mantra Ahem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Naah, you amateurs are mixing up amritam with amukam the first being the heart and the latter a word you replace with the name of the target. So it would be: Om phukit phukit amukam me hoong phat swaha. ;-) emptybill wrote: Yep, you're wright. I jus' din' memeber it the same. I went back an saw that he really gave it as: Ahem phukit phukit anritam wah tuh phuk haha! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: Thanks. this is the Phuket mantra: uAhem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! ... as it has turned out, just yesterday a US Marine was in a bar in Phuket, Thailand and challenged to a fight by a Brit kick- boxer who killed the Marine for no apparent reason with multiple stabbings. So go figure!. He just wasn't using the mantra properly. He should read the book by this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVdKQ0I35qo --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptybill@ wrote: --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there ... back in the day! --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? Actually I was there. He told me: Sorry but you have a bunch more be-backs. He also told me: In one of them you will hear the speech of a demon. He his name will be ritam (right/wright) but he will claim that there is no ritam,only anritam (wrong). Further, whenever he sees or hears the word, 'penetrate', he will attempt to insert himself, thinking I am the great I, the universal Lingam. They call to me and so I shall appear in that place claiming sovereignty. He then finished with: When that happens, use the demon dispelling mantra – Ahem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? To subscribe, send a message to: fairfieldlife-subscr...@yahoogroups.com Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: fairfieldlife-dig...@yahoogroups.com fairfieldlife-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: fairfieldlife-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Well done! This reveals possible dangers in using mispronounced or wrong words in mantras; so a lesson to the wise. This Australian psychic was looking for a little girl (having had some visions of the whereabouts of a body); but instead found the headless corpse of a woman in her 30's. Such results can occur when the mantras used are tweaked just slightly. http://www.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474978448094 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozg...@... wrote: Naah, you amateurs are mixing up amritam with amukam the first being the heart and the latter a word you replace with the name of the target. So it would be: Om phukit phukit amukam me hoong phat swaha. ;-) emptybill wrote: Yep, you're wright. I jus' din' memeber it the same. I went back an saw that he really gave it as: Ahem phukit phukit anritam wah tuh phuk haha! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: Thanks. this is the Phuket mantra: uAhem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! ... as it has turned out, just yesterday a US Marine was in a bar in Phuket, Thailand and challenged to a fight by a Brit kick- boxer who killed the Marine for no apparent reason with multiple stabbings. So go figure!. He just wasn't using the mantra properly. He should read the book by this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVdKQ0I35qo --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptybill@ wrote: --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there ... back in the day! --- infairfieldl...@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? Actually I was there. He told me: Sorry but you have a bunch more be-backs. He also told me: In one of them you will hear the speech of a demon. He his name will be ritam (right/wright) but he will claim that there is no ritam,only anritam (wrong). Further, whenever he sees or hears the word, 'penetrate', he will attempt to insert himself, thinking I am the great I, the universal Lingam. They call to me and so I shall appear in that place claiming sovereignty. He then finished with: When that happens, use the demon dispelling mantra Ahem phukoff phukoff anritam phat phat! --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there...back in the day! What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Actually hard to know what those old school guys actually taught unless you were there... back in the day! TurquoiseB: What makes you think it would have been any easier if you had been? Because you wouldn't have to read about them in books or on the internet long after they are dead and gone?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
MMY BG CH4 V14 Commentary ...knowledge of the essential nature of the divine Being, personified by Lord Krishna, who is beyond the relative and the Absolute, beyond the Unity of Being and the diversity of creation, but holds within Himself the fullness of both. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifux...@... wrote: right, of course. It's true that AC Bhaktivedanta put Krishna first, ahead of the impersonal Absolute. That's why I discard his teachings as being false, along with that other dualist from Barsana Dham. But one can choose to retain a copy of false teachings, since there's plenty of that in the Bible (imo). For the record, I'm a Buddhist foremost; and fully respect - in advance - any questions/criticisms and objections the Skeptics may have regarding any pov whatsoever. For those demanding proof of what's true vs false,; I'll get back to you later on that. My first Buddhist teacher Hsuan Hua probably has never read the Gita. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willytex@ wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: June 17, 2004 http://tinyurl.com/26k5vl5 Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga, alt.meditation Date: August 26, 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2dlbyoz
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
jeff: MMY BG CH4 V14 Commentary... Lord Krishna is the 'Transcendental Person', mentioned in Bhagavad Gita. That means that He is beyond, or transcendental to, phenomenon - the relative world of change. So, since Krishna is the Absolute, he is in fact 'indescribablly different', (Acyenta Bheda Bheda). Many of the Vedantists who composed the Vedic literature were dualists or qualified-dualists, or non-dualists, and others were mixed dualists and qualified-nondualists. While all the Upanishadic thinkers were transcendentalists, not all of them ascribed to the Advaita philosophy of non-dualism. In fact, there is good reason to doubt the Advaita of the Adi Shankaracharya. Because all of these good fellows (sadhus) do no ascribe to the illusion theory, 'Maya' proposed by the Adi. This Transcendental Person is not false - He is real, not an illusion. Isha Upanishad: The face of Truth is covered with a brilliant golden lid; that do thou remove O'Fosterer, for the law of the Truth, for sight. According to Sri Aurobindo, the term 'Isha' refers to Ishvara, the cosmic person, the Paramatman or Brahman. Ishvara is the supreme controller. According to Isha, those who are engaged in the worship of the demi-Gods enter into the darkest region of ignorance, and still more so do the worshipers of the impersonal Absolute alone. The Ultimate Reality is two fulls - 200% of each. One who knows nescience side-by-side with the Transcendent, can pass beyond repeated birth and death, and can enjoy the full blessings of immortality. Work cited: 'Isha Upanishad' v. 2 Translation by Sri Aurobindo Sri Aurobindo Ashram Trust Pondicherry, India 1914 ...knowledge of the essential nature of the divine Being, personified by Lord Krishna, who is beyond the relative and the Absolute, beyond the Unity of Being and the diversity of creation, but holds within Himself the fullness of both.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jeff.evans60 jeff.evan...@... wrote: MMY BG CH4 V14 Commentary ...knowledge of the essential nature of the divine Being, personified by Lord Krishna, who is beyond the relative and the Absolute, beyond the Unity of Being and the diversity of creation, but holds within Himself the fullness of both. Thanks, Jeff. In Love and God Maharishi expresses the nature of divine Being beautifully and poetically: My Lord Thou art in Thy Fullness of Eternal Being Even when Thyself is playing the role Of temporary, phenomenal existence. The ever-changing world And the never-changing Self, The relative and the Absolute, The manifest and the Unmanifest, Both are the expressions Of Thy Eternal Glory, Both reveal only Thy Eternal Grace, Both are the modes Of Thy True Nature. Thy True Nature My Lord Is neither Absolute nor relative, For it is Absolute and relative Both together. It is mysteriously both together. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: right, of course. It's true that AC Bhaktivedanta put Krishna first, ahead of the impersonal Absolute. That's why I discard his teachings as being false, along with that other dualist from Barsana Dham. But one can choose to retain a copy of false teachings, since there's plenty of that in the Bible (imo). For the record, I'm a Buddhist foremost; and fully respect - in advance - any questions/criticisms and objections the Skeptics may have regarding any pov whatsoever. For those demanding proof of what's true vs false,; I'll get back to you later on that. My first Buddhist teacher Hsuan Hua probably has never read the Gita. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willytex@ wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: June 17, 2004 http://tinyurl.com/26k5vl5 Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga, alt.meditation Date: August 26, 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2dlbyoz
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV7zBvfc2mQfeature=related Ariel is the youngest of King Triton's seven daughters. She is shown as being adventurous and curious about the world of humans, a fascination which angers her father as merfolk are forbidden from making contact with the human world. She is the Princess of Wishes. Her best friend is a fish named Flounder, and she develops a close relationship with a crab named Sebastian, Triton's court composer. Ariel salvages human items and keeps them in a secret grotto as part of her collection. No, really.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
The essential triune nature of Being is easily understood by the analogy of the crystal ball. A blue crystal ball exposed to the Sun reflects the light of the sun, which is now blue light being modified by the color of the crystal, the blue reflected light within this crystal ball is Krishna, Christ, Brahma or the many other names given to it (MMY's personal God). The crystal ball itself is symbolic of Prakriti or Mother nature, the Sun represents Brahman, the eternal absolute 'unmanifest' Brahman, to know Brahman is to become Brahman. Purman adah, Purnam idam is the compliment MMY gave to Guru Dev in the book Love and God to illustrate that Guru Dev had achieved the fullness of both, the manifested nature of Being (the blue light) and the unmanifest Brahman (the Sun). Essentially Prakriti is Maya or what MMY has called Mithya (seeming). http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/definitions/mithyA.htm --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jeff.evans60 jeff.evan...@... wrote: MMY BG CH4 V14 Commentary ...knowledge of the essential nature of the divine Being, personified by Lord Krishna, who is beyond the relative and the Absolute, beyond the Unity of Being and the diversity of creation, but holds within Himself the fullness of both. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: right, of course. It's true that AC Bhaktivedanta put Krishna first, ahead of the impersonal Absolute. That's why I discard his teachings as being false, along with that other dualist from Barsana Dham. But one can choose to retain a copy of false teachings, since there's plenty of that in the Bible (imo). For the record, I'm a Buddhist foremost; and fully respect - in advance - any questions/criticisms and objections the Skeptics may have regarding any pov whatsoever. For those demanding proof of what's true vs false,; I'll get back to you later on that. My first Buddhist teacher Hsuan Hua probably has never read the Gita. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willytex@ wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: June 17, 2004 http://tinyurl.com/26k5vl5 Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga, alt.meditation Date: August 26, 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2dlbyoz
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
wgm4u: Purman adah, Purnam idam Om ! That (world) is a complete whole. This (world) too is a complete whole. From the complete whole only, the (other) complete whole rose. Even after removing the complete whole from the (other) complete whole, still the complete whole remains unaltered and undisturbed. 'Isha Upanishad' http://www.vedarahasya.net/isha.htm
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
very good, consistent with what Muktananda (and his disciple Master Charlnes Cannon); and Adi Da say. ...with one minor exception: Adi Da mentions the Blue field of the Cosmic Mandala and doesn't go into Personalities such as Krishna, Jesus, etc. Muktananda specifically mentions seeing the Blue Man but doesn't mention His Name. ... Lama Zopa appeared to me in a Blue Radiant form in the dream state. My conclusion: various Personalities may be merged into and radiate the Blue Light and then there's the Blue Pearl mentioned by Muktananda and others. But this statment gives no direction indication of exactly which Personalities are or should be Blue. Krishna may be Blue as reported by others, as well as any number of other Radiant Personalities. ... imo the Blue Light is a subtle field of Prakriti, and any number of Personalities may reflect that Light. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u wg...@... wrote: The essential triune nature of Being is easily understood by the analogy of the crystal ball. A blue crystal ball exposed to the Sun reflects the light of the sun, which is now blue light being modified by the color of the crystal, the blue reflected light within this crystal ball is Krishna, Christ, Brahma or the many other names given to it (MMY's personal God). The crystal ball itself is symbolic of Prakriti or Mother nature, the Sun represents Brahman, the eternal absolute 'unmanifest' Brahman, to know Brahman is to become Brahman. Purman adah, Purnam idam is the compliment MMY gave to Guru Dev in the book Love and God to illustrate that Guru Dev had achieved the fullness of both, the manifested nature of Being (the blue light) and the unmanifest Brahman (the Sun). Essentially Prakriti is Maya or what MMY has called Mithya (seeming). http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/definitions/mithyA.htm --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jeff.evans60 jeff.evans60@ wrote: MMY BG CH4 V14 Commentary ...knowledge of the essential nature of the divine Being, personified by Lord Krishna, who is beyond the relative and the Absolute, beyond the Unity of Being and the diversity of creation, but holds within Himself the fullness of both. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: right, of course. It's true that AC Bhaktivedanta put Krishna first, ahead of the impersonal Absolute. That's why I discard his teachings as being false, along with that other dualist from Barsana Dham. But one can choose to retain a copy of false teachings, since there's plenty of that in the Bible (imo). For the record, I'm a Buddhist foremost; and fully respect - in advance - any questions/criticisms and objections the Skeptics may have regarding any pov whatsoever. For those demanding proof of what's true vs false,; I'll get back to you later on that. My first Buddhist teacher Hsuan Hua probably has never read the Gita. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willytex@ wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: June 17, 2004 http://tinyurl.com/26k5vl5 Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga, alt.meditation Date: August 26, 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2dlbyoz
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
In Yogananada's kriya line this is the cosmic mandala. When you penetrate the different bindu-s, your consciousness transits into that loka. However you have to have good dharana. You can't just project your imagination, gossip with the masters and call it a day. The golden-yellow is the background color of prana and of the suksma loka-s (gross and subtle worlds). The blue (nila mandala) is the background color of the casual realm or karana loka-s. In the center is a white bindu. This central white bindu is seen as guru, deva, ishvara. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifux...@... wrote: very good, consistent with what Muktananda (and his disciple Master Charlnes Cannon); and Adi Da say. ...with one minor exception: Adi Da mentions the Blue field of the Cosmic Mandala and doesn't go into Personalities such as Krishna, Jesus, etc. Muktananda specifically mentions seeing the Blue Man but doesn't mention His Name. ... Lama Zopa appeared to me in a Blue Radiant form in the dream state. My conclusion: various Personalities may be merged into and radiate the Blue Light and then there's the Blue Pearl mentioned by Muktananda and others. But this statment gives no direction indication of exactly which Personalities are or should be Blue. Krishna may be Blue as reported by others, as well as any number of other Radiant Personalities. ... imo the Blue Light is a subtle field of Prakriti, and any number of Personalities may reflect that Light. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wgm4u wgm4u@ wrote: The essential triune nature of Being is easily understood by the analogy of the crystal ball. A blue crystal ball exposed to the Sun reflects the light of the sun, which is now blue light being modified by the color of the crystal, the blue reflected light within this crystal ball is Krishna, Christ, Brahma or the many other names given to it (MMY's personal God). The crystal ball itself is symbolic of Prakriti or Mother nature, the Sun represents Brahman, the eternal absolute 'unmanifest' Brahman, to know Brahman is to become Brahman. Purman adah, Purnam idam is the compliment MMY gave to Guru Dev in the book Love and God to illustrate that Guru Dev had achieved the fullness of both, the manifested nature of Being (the blue light) and the unmanifest Brahman (the Sun). Essentially Prakriti is Maya or what MMY has called Mithya (seeming). http://www.advaita.org.uk/discourses/definitions/mithyA.htm --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jeff.evans60 jeff.evans60@ wrote: MMY BG CH4 V14 Commentary ...knowledge of the essential nature of the divine Being, personified by Lord Krishna, who is beyond the relative and the Absolute, beyond the Unity of Being and the diversity of creation, but holds within Himself the fullness of both. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: right, of course. It's true that AC Bhaktivedanta put Krishna first, ahead of the impersonal Absolute. That's why I discard his teachings as being false, along with that other dualist from Barsana Dham. But one can choose to retain a copy of false teachings, since there's plenty of that in the Bible (imo). For the record, I'm a Buddhist foremost; and fully respect - in advance - any questions/criticisms and objections the Skeptics may have regarding any pov whatsoever. For those demanding proof of what's true vs false,; I'll get back to you later on that. My first Buddhist teacher Hsuan Hua probably has never read the Gita. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willytex@ wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups:
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifux...@... wrote: very good, consistent with what Muktananda (and his disciple Master Charlnes Cannon); and Adi Da say. ...with one minor exception: Adi Da mentions the Blue field of the Cosmic Mandala and doesn't go into Personalities such as Krishna, Jesus, etc. Muktananda specifically mentions seeing the Blue Man but doesn't mention His Name. ... Lama Zopa appeared to me in a Blue Radiant form in the dream state. My conclusion: various Personalities may be merged into and radiate the Blue Light and then there's the Blue Pearl mentioned by Muktananda and others. But this statment gives no direction indication of exactly which Personalities are or should be Blue. Krishna may be Blue as reported by others, as well as any number of other Radiant Personalities. ... imo the Blue Light is a subtle field of Prakriti, and any number of Personalities may reflect that Light. Agreed, being formless (yet immanent) it can assume any form (it's the field of the 'glow' or Akasha Tattwa MMY so beautifully elucidated on the Guru Dev/MMY website). Jesus became the 'Christ' or anointed one and so will we some day. Eventually he went on to the Father (Brahman or Parme vyoman), though he stated even while alive, me and my Father are one. Brahman is the formless absolute, the Christ/Krishna 'glow' is the son or the reflection of the Father off the Divine Mother, Prakriti. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit (SAT,TAT,OM). This 'glow' can take ANY form.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: In Yogananada's kriya line this is the cosmic mandala. When you penetrate the different bindu-s, your consciousness transits into that loka. However you have to have good dharana. You can't just project your imagination, gossip with the masters and call it a day. The golden-yellow is the background color of prana and of the suksma loka-s (gross and subtle worlds). The blue (nila mandala) is the background color of the casual realm or karana loka-s. In the center is a white bindu. This central white bindu is seen as guru, deva, ishvara. Which, in order to actually transcend (in actuality) one has to penetrate (the white 5 pointed star in the center of the third eye or Ajna Chakra the portal to the infinite).
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: Don't you just hate those fukin' Latinos! Hater. Usted señor no son caballero. ¿Ve cuán estúpido es?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Texican pfrases such as y'all, chicken fried, and messcan. Don't you just hate those fukin' Latinos! azgrey: Usted señor no son caballero... Are you mescan? You're not making any sense.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote: FWIW: anaadimatparaM brahma Shankara: *anaadimat* paraM brahma A.C: anaadi *matparaM* brahma IOW, the author of the Giitaa seems to have been a bit, well, mischievous: Shankara's reading is grammatically a bit clumsy(the redundant suffix 'mat'); A.C's reading is otherwise odd, because why would Krishna be such an ego-maniac, that He'd want to emphasize his supremeness, or whatever?! :D
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: FWIW: anaadimatparaM brahma Shankara: *anaadimat* paraM brahma A.C: anaadi *matparaM* brahma IOW, the author of the Giitaa seems to have been a bit, well, mischievous: Shankara's reading is grammatically a bit clumsy(the redundant suffix 'mat'); A.C's reading is otherwise odd, because why would Krishna be such an ego-maniac, that He'd want to emphasize his supremeness, or whatever?! :D From AS-IT-IS: TEXT 13 jneyam yat tat pravaksyami yaj jnatvamrtam asnute anadi mat-param brahma na sat tan nasad ucyate SYNONYMS jneyam--knowable; yat--that; tat--which; pravaksyami--I shall now explain; yat--which; jnatva--knowing; amrtam--nectar; asnute--taste; anadi--beginningless; ***mat-param--subordinate to Me***; brahma--spirit; na--neither; sat--cause; tat--that; na--nor; asat--effect; ucyate--is called. TRANSLATION I shall now explain the knowable, knowing which you will taste the eternal. This is beginningless, and it is subordinate to Me. It is called Brahman, the spirit, and it lies beyond the cause and effect of this material world. PURPORT
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: FWIW: anaadimatparaM brahma Shankara: *anaadimat* paraM brahma A.C: anaadi *matparaM* brahma IOW, the author of the Giitaa seems to have been a bit, well, mischievous: Shankara's reading is grammatically a bit clumsy(the redundant suffix 'mat'); A.C's reading is otherwise odd, because why would Krishna be such an ego-maniac, that He'd want to emphasize his supremeness, or whatever?! :D From AS-IT-IS: TEXT 13 jneyam yat tat pravaksyami yaj jnatvamrtam asnute anadi mat-param brahma na sat tan nasad ucyate SYNONYMS jneyam--knowable; yat--that; tat--which; pravaksyami--I shall now explain; yat--which; jnatva--knowing; amrtam--nectar; asnute--taste; anadi--beginningless; ***mat-param--subordinate to Me***; brahma--spirit; na--neither; sat--cause; tat--that; na--nor; asat--effect; ucyate--is called. TRANSLATION I shall now explain the knowable, knowing which you will taste the eternal. This is beginningless, and it is subordinate to Me. It is called Brahman, the spirit, and it lies beyond the cause and effect of this material world. PURPORT Hmmm... the devanaagarii script of that sequence (anaadimatparam) seems to suggest that A.C's reading is actually more unlikely to be correct. IMO, it'd be not necessary to write 'anaadi' and 'mat' together, if 'anaadi matparam' would be what the author had in mind. OTOH 'mat' and 'param' need to be written together (unless one uses 'viraama' instead of a conjunct consonant character, which [viraama] is considered clumsy and indicating of defective skills in writing devanaagarii, ugh!) even if 'anaadimat param' would be the (more?) correct reading... :0
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: FWIW: anaadimatparaM brahma Shankara: *anaadimat* paraM brahma A.C: anaadi *matparaM* brahma IOW, the author of the Giitaa seems to have been a bit, well, mischievous: Shankara's reading is grammatically a bit clumsy(the redundant suffix 'mat'); A.C's reading is otherwise odd, because why would Krishna be such an ego-maniac, that He'd want to emphasize his supremeness, or whatever?! :D From AS-IT-IS: TEXT 13 jneyam yat tat pravaksyami yaj jnatvamrtam asnute anadi mat-param brahma na sat tan nasad ucyate SYNONYMS jneyam--knowable; yat--that; tat--which; pravaksyami--I shall now explain; yat--which; jnatva--knowing; amrtam--nectar; asnute--taste; anadi--beginningless; ***mat-param--subordinate to Me***; brahma--spirit; na--neither; sat--cause; tat--that; na--nor; asat--effect; ucyate--is called. TRANSLATION I shall now explain the knowable, knowing which you will taste the eternal. This is beginningless, and it is subordinate to Me. It is called Brahman, the spirit, and it lies beyond the cause and effect of this material world. PURPORT Hmmm... the devanaagarii script of that sequence (anaadimatparam) seems to suggest that A.C's reading is actually more unlikely to be correct. IMO, it'd be not necessary to write 'anaadi' and 'mat' together, if 'anaadi matparam' would be what the author had in mind. OTOH 'mat' and 'param' need to be written together (unless one uses 'viraama' instead of a conjunct consonant character, which [viraama] is considered clumsy and indicating of defective skills in writing devanaagarii, ugh!) even if 'anaadimat param' would be the (more?) correct reading... :0 Oh shucks! This is such a mess! I forgot that at least in the Finnish edition of AS IT IS the Roman transliteration has 'anaadimat paraM brahma', which is in accord with the reading of Shankara! OTOH, there website has 'anaadi mat-paraM brahma'!
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Card, Who has time to search out a quote without full attribution - other than you? If you want to quote text then at least give the chapter. Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_re...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister no_reply@ wrote: FWIW: anaadimatparaM brahma Shankara: *anaadimat* paraM brahma A.C: anaadi *matparaM* brahma IOW, the author of the Giitaa seems to have been a bit, well, mischievous: Shankara's reading is grammatically a bit clumsy(the redundant suffix 'mat'); A.C's reading is otherwise odd, because why would Krishna be such an ego-maniac, that He'd want to emphasize his supremeness, or whatever?! :D From AS-IT-IS: TEXT 13 jneyam yat tat pravaksyami yaj jnatvamrtam asnute anadi mat-param brahma na sat tan nasad ucyate SYNONYMS jneyam--knowable; yat--that; tat--which; pravaksyami--I shall now explain; yat--which; jnatva--knowing; amrtam--nectar; asnute--taste; anadi--beginningless; ***mat-param--subordinate to Me***; brahma--spirit; na--neither; sat--cause; tat--that; na--nor; asat--effect; ucyate--is called. TRANSLATION I shall now explain the knowable, knowing which you will taste the eternal. This is beginningless, and it is subordinate to Me. It is called Brahman, the spirit, and it lies beyond the cause and effect of this material world. PURPORT Hmmm... the devanaagarii script of that sequence (anaadimatparam) seems to suggest that A.C's reading is actually more unlikely to be correct. IMO, it'd be not necessary to write 'anaadi' and 'mat' together, if 'anaadi matparam' would be what the author had in mind. OTOH 'mat' and 'param' need to be written together (unless one uses 'viraama' instead of a conjunct consonant character, which [viraama] is considered clumsy and indicating of defective skills in writing devanaagarii, ugh!) even if 'anaadimat param' would be the (more?) correct reading... :0
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
cardemaister: A.C's reading is otherwise odd Swami Bhaktivedanta, a Vedantin, enumerates the five classical states of consciousness which are similar to M's: 1. Wakefulness (jagrat) 2. Dream state (svapna) 3. Deep sleep (sushupti) 4. Superconscious state (turiya) 5. Transcendent state (turiyatita) 'OM Mantra and 7 Levels of Consciousness' by Swami Jnaneshvara Bharati http://www.swamij.com/om.htm#sevenstates
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: Card, Who has time to search out a quote without full attribution - other than you? If you want to quote text then at least give the chapter. Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? XIII 13. I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! Apart from the somewhat and occasionally lopsided translations, it's a supreme source for anybody interested in the original Sanskrit text of the Giitaa!
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
emptybill: Who has time to search out a quote without full attribution - other than you? If you want to quote text then at least give the chapter. You didn't cite any sources for your essay on Yogavasitha. Card already said he was reading from A.C.'s 'Bhagavad Gita As It Is', a copy of which should be be in every informant's personal library.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: June 17, 2004 http://tinyurl.com/26k5vl5 Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga, alt.meditation Date: August 26, 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2dlbyoz
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
So! You even admit you are an informant! My buddy the former narc didn't work in Texas so you couldn't be one of his. Did you find another source for some straight cash on the side? Do you have to wear a cowboy hat to play your part? Left is right and right is wrong. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: emptybill: Who has time to search out a quote without full attribution - other than you? If you want to quote text then at least give the chapter. You didn't cite any sources for your essay on Yogavasitha. Card already said he was reading from A.C.'s 'Bhagavad Gita As It Is', a copy of which should be be in every informant's personal library.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
right, of course. It's true that AC Bhaktivedanta put Krishna first, ahead of the impersonal Absolute. That's why I discard his teachings as being false, along with that other dualist from Barsana Dham. But one can choose to retain a copy of false teachings, since there's plenty of that in the Bible (imo). For the record, I'm a Buddhist foremost; and fully respect - in advance - any questions/criticisms and objections the Skeptics may have regarding any pov whatsoever. For those demanding proof of what's true vs false,; I'll get back to you later on that. My first Buddhist teacher Hsuan Hua probably has never read the Gita. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: June 17, 2004 http://tinyurl.com/26k5vl5 Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga, alt.meditation Date: August 26, 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2dlbyoz
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifux...@... wrote: right, of course. It's true that AC Bhaktivedanta put Krishna first, ahead of the impersonal Absolute. That's why I discard his teachings as being false, along with that other dualist from Barsana Dham. But one can choose to retain a copy of false teachings, since there's plenty of that in the Bible (imo). For the record, I'm a Buddhist foremost; and fully respect - in advance - any questions/criticisms and objections the Skeptics may have regarding any pov whatsoever. For those demanding proof of what's true vs false,; I'll get back to you later on that. More interesting would be a proof that all is not one. That's the assumption we groggily start with -- perhaps with little firm basis. My first Buddhist teacher Hsuan Hua probably has never read the Gita. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willytex@ wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. But, A.C.'s edition is one of the few editions of the Bhagavad Gita that give the original Sanskrit, a translation, the word-for-word transliteration AND an erudite purport. In the Vaishnava Vedanta tradition expounded in Vyasa's Bhagavad Gita, Ishvara is equated with the Transcendental Absolute. Beginning on page 9 of his introduction to Bhagavad Gita-As It ia, Swami Bhaktivedanta explains in copious detail how The position of Isvara is that of supreme conciousness. And, on page 10 ...the Paramatman, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is living in everyone's heart as Isvara... Read more: Subject: TM: The Highest First! Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental Date: June 17, 2004 http://tinyurl.com/26k5vl5 Subject: TM in the Hindu Scriptures Author: Willytex Newsgroups: alt.meditation.transcendental, alt.yoga, alt.meditation Date: August 26, 2003 http://tinyurl.com/2dlbyoz
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
emptybill: You even admit you are an informant! It's 'informant' in the sense of those that INFORM, rather than come here to simply pick a cat fight. I hope you're not falling into the latter, because you seem to have something important to share. My buddy the former narc didn't work in Texas so you couldn't be one of his. Did you find another source for some straight cash on the side? Do you have to wear a cowboy hat to play your part? Well, we are hosting the College Football playoffs this year at the Alamo Dome, and a lot of folks around here do wear cowboy hats, since this is Texas. But what does that have to do with M's version of the Seven States? Sounds like to me you're itching for a cat fight. If so, why not post to Judy or Sal and leave the adepts like me and Card alone so we can discuss the mechanics of consciousness? Left is right and right is wrong. Texas is home to one of the largest Tibetan diaspora and there are thousands Hindus that live around here. My place is only about a mile from one of the largest Hindu Temples outside Mother India. 'From Tibet to Texas' http://www.rwilliams.us/archives/tibet.htm Who has time to search out a quote without full attribution - other than you? If you want to quote text then at least give the chapter. You didn't cite any sources for your essay on Yogavasitha. Card already said he was reading from A.C.'s 'Bhagavad Gita As It Is', a copy of which should be be in every informant's personal library.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, WillyTex willy...@... wrote: Who keeps a copy of As-It-Is around except Hari K. or raw beginners who got their copy at the airport in 1976? cardemaister: I think everyone, even down in Texas, should have a copy of it! It would be more likely for someone 'down in Texas' to have a copy, than up in Finland! That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book. Plus which, Sanskrit is the only language capable of fully expressing the subtle meaning contained in Texican pfrases such as y'all, chicken fried, and messcan. Leave the gun. Take the cannolis.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
That's becuase here in Texas we have numerous ISKCON Temples and other Vaishnava seats of learning where people can actually study these ideas and put them into practice, instead of just reading them in a book... azgrey: Plus which, Sanskrit is the only language capable of fully expressing the subtle meaning contained in Texican pfrases such as y'all, chicken fried, and messcan. Don't you just hate those fukin' Latinos! Leave the gun. Take the cannolis. But not all the people that live in Texas are brown-skinned, Sir. But it is a fact that by 2015, over half the population of San Antonio will be Hispanic. You probably wouldn't want to move here, being a really scared white Caucasian, right?
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tartbrain no_re...@... wrote: there was a discussion of Batgap among 3-4 participants who were discussing their sustained experiences of Krishna Consciousness -- beyond BC, I can just see it now. I see your Cosmic Consciousness, and raise you to God Consciousness. Okay, I see your God Consiousness, and I'm going to skip Unity Consciousness and raise you to Krihna Consciousness. As well, I've a side bet of Brahman Consciousness on my left Call!
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, seventhray1 steve.sun...@... wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tartbrain no_reply@ wrote: there was a discussion of Batgap among 3-4 participants who were discussing their sustained experiences of Krishna Consciousness -- beyond BC, I can just see it now. I see your Cosmic Consciousness, and raise you to God Consciousness. Okay, I see your God Consiousness, and I'm going to skip Unity Consciousness and raise you to Krihna Consciousness. As well, I've a side bet of Brahman Consciousness on my left Call! Excellent. I browsed BATGAP the other day, glanced at the discussion in which people were rating their experiences in terms of Stages, thought to myself, Ego Poker, and bailed. :-)
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Bhaktivedanta's contentions were standard Gaudiya ideological propaganda. These Gauda descriptions of Brahma-Jyotih are really just like descriptions of insentient pradhaana, only not independent like in Sankhya but totally dependent. This is why they must ascribe insentience to Brahman itself, since they contend that Brahman is nothing but Krishna jyotih, his tanu-bhaa (external splendor). Like most monotheisms, they need to assert ontological primacy to their chosen Godhead, Shri Krishna. Thus they assert three grades of reality. The lowest is Brahman, mere jyotih. Higher is Paramatman, the supreme self present in the heart of all creatures. Highest is Bhaagavan, Krishna himself. Their problem is that none of these contentions are confirmed in their source scripture, Shrimad Bhagavata Purana. There the supreme Deity is MahaVishnu and Krishna is his avatara. Maybe they were influenced into this kind of theology by their aping their Muslim overlords. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifux...@... wrote: Right...precisely what the Hare Krishna Guru proclaimed. If you look at his works, his translated Skt into English uses words such as Effulgence: (i.e. the impersonal Absolute is an Effulgence or Light of Krishna.). But imo - that doesn't make sense. Then in countless verses of the BG and Srimad Bhagavatam, Prabhupada uses the phrase Supreme Personality of the Godhead for Krishna, stating outright that the impersonal aspect of Brahman is subordinate to the Personality of Krishna. imo - such bizarre distortions of the truth!; but since he's Skt scholar, it's virtually impossible to propose a counterargument on that basis. Likewise - with that other Krishna Guru with the Ashram in Austin (Barsana Dham) His foremost San Diego disciple was a good friend of mine (former TM teacher Richard Dahout). But then in the 80's he got sucked into the Krishna dualism, suddenly having a quick dualistic answer for the false teachings of MMY at his fingertips - should anybody like myself dare to mention any Advaita Vedanta. ... But then, the Krishna dualists (of course) proclaim that Krishna is the supreme Advaita Vedanta. I've given up even attempting to argue with such people. ... I suppose that everything ultimately boils down to preferances; and then the intellectual rationalizations follow down the road. Naturally, I'm probably in that category too. -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptybill@ wrote: Tart! I forgot to add: Just to confuse even more, Madhusuudhana's version of stages asserts that Bhagavan-Chaitanya is beyond Brahma-Chaitanya (i.e. Unity). Heh, Heh.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: Bhaktivedanta's contentions were standard Gaudiya ideological propaganda. These Gauda descriptions of Brahma-Jyotih are really just like descriptions of insentient pradhaana, only not independent like in Sankhya but totally dependent. This is why they must ascribe insentience to Brahman itself, since they contend that Brahman is nothing but Krishna jyotih, his tanu-bhaa (external splendor). Like most monotheisms, they need to assert ontological primacy to their chosen Godhead, Shri Krishna. Thus they assert three grades of reality. The lowest is Brahman, mere jyotih. Higher is Paramatman, the supreme self present in the heart of all creatures. Highest is Bhaagavan, Krishna himself. Their problem is that none of these contentions are confirmed in their source scripture, Shrimad Bhagavata Purana. There the supreme Deity is MahaVishnu and Krishna is his avatara. FWIW: anaadimatparaM brahma Shankara: *anaadimat* paraM brahma A.C: anaadi *matparaM* brahma
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
thats in line with what Maharishi said, but he used the words Krishna Consciousness. (just to confu --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: Tart! I forgot to add: Just to confuse even more, Madhusuudhana's version of stages asserts that Bhagavan-Chaitanya is beyond Brahma-Chaitanya (i.e. Unity). Heh, Heh.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: Tart! I forgot to add: Just to confuse even more, Madhusuudhana's version of stages asserts that Bhagavan-Chaitanya is beyond Brahma-Chaitanya (i.e. Unity). Heh, Heh. That kind of fits -- the Totality of Bhagavan -- Lila within and including Brahman. Related -- and to a point Judy made about M's system with GC -- that its not God's perception -- there was a discussion of Batgap among 3-4 participants who were discussing their sustained experiences of Krishna Consciousness -- beyond BC, and the experience being debated was, as some reported (their interpretation of course -- and I am just reporting their words, without commentary) in KC one perceives -- to the full extent --everything as Krishna does, or as some claimed, they actually were Krishna (apologies if I misremember or miscast their views.)
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
Right...precisely what the Hare Krishna Guru proclaimed. If you look at his works, his translated Skt into English uses words such as Effulgence: (i.e. the impersonal Absolute is an Effulgence or Light of Krishna.). But imo - that doesn't make sense. Then in countless verses of the BG and Srimad Bhagavatam, Prabhupada uses the phrase Supreme Personality of the Godhead for Krishna, stating outright that the impersonal aspect of Brahman is subordinate to the Personality of Krishna. imo - such bizarre distortions of the truth!; but since he's Skt scholar, it's virtually impossible to propose a counterargument on that basis. Likewise - with that other Krishna Guru with the Ashram in Austin (Barsana Dham) His foremost San Diego disciple was a good friend of mine (former TM teacher Richard Dahout). But then in the 80's he got sucked into the Krishna dualism, suddenly having a quick dualistic answer for the false teachings of MMY at his fingertips - should anybody like myself dare to mention any Advaita Vedanta. ... But then, the Krishna dualists (of course) proclaim that Krishna is the supreme Advaita Vedanta. I've given up even attempting to argue with such people. ... I suppose that everything ultimately boils down to preferances; and then the intellectual rationalizations follow down the road. Naturally, I'm probably in that category too. -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill emptyb...@... wrote: Tart! I forgot to add: Just to confuse even more, Madhusuudhana's version of stages asserts that Bhagavan-Chaitanya is beyond Brahma-Chaitanya (i.e. Unity). Heh, Heh.
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
yifuxero: But then, the Krishna dualists (of course) proclaim that Krishna is the supreme Advaita Vedanta... The Gaudiya Vaishnava sect is monotheistic, and transcendental, based on the Vedanta. You are incorrect about them being 'dualists'. They do not proclaim the Advaita but follow the 'Achintya Bheda Abheda' of Madhvacharya. These Vaishnavas are basing their philosophy on the Vedanta - Krishna is the 'Transcendental Person', but they are not dualists. Chitta or chaitanya in Sanskrit means consciousness. Swami Bhaktivedanta Saraswati enumerates the five classical states of consciousness: 1. Wakefulness (jagrat) 2. Dream state (svapna) 3. Deep sleep (sushupti) 4. Superconscious state (turiya) 5. Transcendental state (turiyatita)
[FairfieldLife] Re: M version and others
emptybill: emptybill@ Bhagavan-Chaitanya is beyond Brahma-Chaitanya (i.e. Unity). tartbrain: ...there was a discussion of Batgap among 3-4 participants who were discussing their sustained experiences of Krishna Consciousness... The Gaudiya Vaishnavas believe that consciousness is not a product of matter. This is based on the Vedanta - all the Upanishad thinkers were transcendentalists. I spent one year at their headquarters in 1970 and once walked on the beach with the Swami Bhaktivedanta Saraswati. According to the Swami, all the souls are captivated by the illusory nature of the world which is Maya. People, because of their karma, are repeatedly reborn in samsara. By practicing Yoga, individuals can realize the Transcendental state of consciousness. According to the Gaudiya Vaishnavas, there are five states of consciousness, the fifth being the Transcendental state. This is entirely consistent with the concepts found in the Upanishads and throughout Hindu philosophy.
