Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 12/03/2009 09:51 AM, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 12/03/2009 08:49 AM, Terry Barnaby wrote: The MODE was set up by system-config-network, it is from its list of possible options for Mode and I think was the default. If I run ifup the error you mention is not reported and the interface comes up fine. However, I do get the error: domainname: you must be root to change the domain name Which I assume is due to another F12 bug. Could this cause NM to abort the connection ? I note that domainname is called from /etc/dhcp/dhclient.d/nis.sh. At point of invocation $UID and $EUID are 0 I added a sh into /etc/dhcp/dhclient.d/nis.sh to have a look. Here getuid() and geteuid() return 0. whoami returns root. But when I run domainname kingnet I get the error: domainname: you must be root to change the domain name Also su states su: incorrect password without even prompting for one. What is happening here ? The environment variables are set by dhcp and do not have the usual user environment variables Note that on this system, selinux is disabled. Looking at this I guess the CAP_SYS_ADMIN capability has been lost somewhere. Maybe the dhclient ? This all seems fixed in NetworkManager-0.7.997-1.fc12 Thanks to all who fixed this. Cheers Terry -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On Wed, 2009-12-02 at 16:52 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote: Dan Williams (d...@redhat.com) said: ONBOOT=yes BOOTPROTO=dhcp TYPE=Wireless NM_CONTROLLED=yes USERCTL=yes PEERDNS=yes IPV6INIT=no MODE=Auto This is the problem. Auto is not a valid mode. It's a valid mode according to the iwconfig man page. I have no idea what cards actually support it. Oh, probably none. I'll go fix ifcfg-rh to alias Auto to infrastructure mode. Dan -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On Fri, 2009-12-04 at 10:55 -0800, Dan Williams wrote:
On Wed, 2009-12-02 at 16:52 -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote:
Dan Williams (d...@redhat.com) said:
ONBOOT=yes
BOOTPROTO=dhcp
TYPE=Wireless
NM_CONTROLLED=yes
USERCTL=yes
PEERDNS=yes
IPV6INIT=no
MODE=Auto
This is the problem. Auto is not a valid mode.
It's a valid mode according to the iwconfig man page. I have no idea
what cards actually support it.
Oh, probably none. I'll go fix ifcfg-rh to alias Auto to
infrastructure mode.
96a61a9909c9442aa5f1c14d89dbd3356d4715f1 (master)
090eeaff16c77f4db4454de39d6d4e76d5390443 (0.7.x)
Dan
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Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
The MODE was set up by system-config-network, it is from its list of possible options for Mode and I think was the default. If I run ifup the error you mention is not reported and the interface comes up fine. However, I do get the error: domainname: you must be root to change the domain name Which I assume is due to another F12 bug. Could this cause NM to abort the connection ? I note that domainname is called from /etc/dhcp/dhclient.d/nis.sh. At point of invocation $UID and $EUID are 0 I added a sh into /etc/dhcp/dhclient.d/nis.sh to have a look. Here getuid() and geteuid() return 0. whoami returns root. But when I run domainname kingnet I get the error: domainname: you must be root to change the domain name Also su states su: incorrect password without even prompting for one. What is happening here ? The environment variables are set by dhcp and do not have the usual user environment variables Note that on this system, selinux is disabled. -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 12/03/2009 08:49 AM, Terry Barnaby wrote: The MODE was set up by system-config-network, it is from its list of possible options for Mode and I think was the default. If I run ifup the error you mention is not reported and the interface comes up fine. However, I do get the error: domainname: you must be root to change the domain name Which I assume is due to another F12 bug. Could this cause NM to abort the connection ? I note that domainname is called from /etc/dhcp/dhclient.d/nis.sh. At point of invocation $UID and $EUID are 0 I added a sh into /etc/dhcp/dhclient.d/nis.sh to have a look. Here getuid() and geteuid() return 0. whoami returns root. But when I run domainname kingnet I get the error: domainname: you must be root to change the domain name Also su states su: incorrect password without even prompting for one. What is happening here ? The environment variables are set by dhcp and do not have the usual user environment variables Note that on this system, selinux is disabled. Looking at this I guess the CAP_SYS_ADMIN capability has been lost somewhere. Maybe the dhclient ? -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On Tue, 2009-12-01 at 10:24 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 12/01/2009 07:50 AM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 19:52 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/30/2009 06:12 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 09:55 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems My mistake. I guess it was Rakesh Pandit who was using a CDMA 3G connection. use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? No particular reason, in fact that looks like a bug. NM no longer depends on HAL, but that dependency is still in the initscript, which looks like it pushes NM later than netfs. But in reality, you're looking for a dependency based initsystem which we don't quite yet have. There are already scripts that kick netfs to mount stuff when NM brings the network up (/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/05-netfs), so you get asynchronous bootup *and* your mounts. The rest of the system, if it requires something from the mounted directories, needs to be smart enough to know that. If you need to, you can set NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network, which causes the NetworkManager initscript to block until a network connection is brought up, or 30 seconds have passed. I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? See the other mail; the problem with a generic isUp() is that it simply says hey, is there a connection? It doesn't provide enough information about the networking state of the system for anything to make an intelligent decision about anything. It's a hey I'm connected to something but there's no information about *what* you're connected to; whether it's a secure home network, whether it's a slow 3G network, whether it's billed by the minute or the hour or unlimited, etc. Dan Hi, Thanks for the info. I would have thought that a generic isUp() is good enough for the likes of Firefox and Pidgen though to decide if to start offline. Being connected to a Network is probably all you need, you may be accessing an Intranet as all my systems Firefox home pages do ... Anyway, following your email (And notes in Bugzilla) I thought I'd try and use NM properly for my config. However I have a problem, which may be a bug. I have turned off the Network services and turned on NetworkManger. I have two main network interfaces eth0 (wired) and eth1 (Wifi), both are set to be managed by NM and to start at boot. I have also added NETWORKWAIT=yes in
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 12/02/2009 09:32 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Tue, 2009-12-01 at 10:24 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 12/01/2009 07:50 AM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 19:52 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/30/2009 06:12 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 09:55 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems My mistake. I guess it was Rakesh Pandit who was using a CDMA 3G connection. use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? No particular reason, in fact that looks like a bug. NM no longer depends on HAL, but that dependency is still in the initscript, which looks like it pushes NM later than netfs. But in reality, you're looking for a dependency based initsystem which we don't quite yet have. There are already scripts that kick netfs to mount stuff when NM brings the network up (/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/05-netfs), so you get asynchronous bootup *and* your mounts. The rest of the system, if it requires something from the mounted directories, needs to be smart enough to know that. If you need to, you can set NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network, which causes the NetworkManager initscript to block until a network connection is brought up, or 30 seconds have passed. I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? See the other mail; the problem with a generic isUp() is that it simply says hey, is there a connection? It doesn't provide enough information about the networking state of the system for anything to make an intelligent decision about anything. It's a hey I'm connected to something but there's no information about *what* you're connected to; whether it's a secure home network, whether it's a slow 3G network, whether it's billed by the minute or the hour or unlimited, etc. Dan Hi, Thanks for the info. I would have thought that a generic isUp() is good enough for the likes of Firefox and Pidgen though to decide if to start offline. Being connected to a Network is probably all you need, you may be accessing an Intranet as all my systems Firefox home pages do ... Anyway, following your email (And notes in Bugzilla) I thought I'd try and use NM properly for my config. However I have a problem, which may be a bug. I have turned off the Network services and turned on NetworkManger. I have two main network interfaces eth0 (wired) and eth1 (Wifi), both are set to be managed by NM and to start at boot. I have also added NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network. When I boot with this the network (eth1 (eth0 is disconnected)) does not come up at boot. There is a message stating a failure on the line where
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
Dan Williams (d...@redhat.com) said: ONBOOT=yes BOOTPROTO=dhcp TYPE=Wireless NM_CONTROLLED=yes USERCTL=yes PEERDNS=yes IPV6INIT=no MODE=Auto This is the problem. Auto is not a valid mode. It's a valid mode according to the iwconfig man page. I have no idea what cards actually support it. Bill -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 12/01/2009 07:50 AM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 19:52 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/30/2009 06:12 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 09:55 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems My mistake. I guess it was Rakesh Pandit who was using a CDMA 3G connection. use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? No particular reason, in fact that looks like a bug. NM no longer depends on HAL, but that dependency is still in the initscript, which looks like it pushes NM later than netfs. But in reality, you're looking for a dependency based initsystem which we don't quite yet have. There are already scripts that kick netfs to mount stuff when NM brings the network up (/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/05-netfs), so you get asynchronous bootup *and* your mounts. The rest of the system, if it requires something from the mounted directories, needs to be smart enough to know that. If you need to, you can set NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network, which causes the NetworkManager initscript to block until a network connection is brought up, or 30 seconds have passed. I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? See the other mail; the problem with a generic isUp() is that it simply says hey, is there a connection? It doesn't provide enough information about the networking state of the system for anything to make an intelligent decision about anything. It's a hey I'm connected to something but there's no information about *what* you're connected to; whether it's a secure home network, whether it's a slow 3G network, whether it's billed by the minute or the hour or unlimited, etc. Dan Hi, Thanks for the info. I would have thought that a generic isUp() is good enough for the likes of Firefox and Pidgen though to decide if to start offline. Being connected to a Network is probably all you need, you may be accessing an Intranet as all my systems Firefox home pages do ... Anyway, following your email (And notes in Bugzilla) I thought I'd try and use NM properly for my config. However I have a problem, which may be a bug. I have turned off the Network services and turned on NetworkManger. I have two main network interfaces eth0 (wired) and eth1 (Wifi), both are set to be managed by NM and to start at boot. I have also added NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network. When I boot with this the network (eth1 (eth0 is disconnected)) does not come up at boot. There is a message stating a failure on the line where it is waiting for the network to come up. When I log in as a local user the network then comes up ...
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
Hi, On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 09:55 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? I think the NetworkManager issue is a confusion between control and monitoring. I've mentioned this before in another context, but there seems to be no reason why these two things should be considered the same. Just because NetworkManager isn't controlling a device doesn't mean that it shouldn't monitor the up/down state of the device and update the applications' idea of the network being up/down accordingly, Steve. -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 30/11/09 09:55, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? Don't know about the reason, but on my work desktop (where we have LDAP auth and NFS home dirs), I can still use NetworkManager in F12: * Make sure your LAN interfaces are marked available to all users in NetworkManager (I think this corresponds to ONBOOT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/ifcfg-eth*) * Add to /etc/sysconfig/network: NETWORKWAIT=true This should bring the network up before netfs. Unfortunately I've had to revert to the old network service because I need bridged networking for my virt guests; there was a plan to support this in NetworkManager in F-12 (http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/NetworkManagerBridging) but nothing seems to have happened with that, though I see there is a similar feature proposed for F-13 (http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/Shared_Network_Interface). Paul. -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 10:05 +, Steven Whitehouse wrote: Hi, On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 09:55 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? I think the NetworkManager issue is a confusion between control and monitoring. I've mentioned this before in another context, but there seems to be no reason why these two things should be considered the same. Just because NetworkManager isn't controlling a device doesn't mean that it shouldn't monitor the up/down state of the device and update the applications' idea of the network being up/down accordingly, NetworkManager provides a consistent API for applications to use to interogate the networking situation of the machine. This includes a consistent configuration mechanism and information about the connections in-use, including a nice human name. It includes a per-connection identifier that applications can (and do!) use to perform specific operations when connection state changes. Part of the problem is that if these aren't provided, you loose quite a lot of functionality and usefulness. You can't match up current network config with specific configuration information stored on-disk because there's nothing keeping track of what's happening on the system. It's a lot harder to, say, have Evolution only check your mail when your VPN is up. There's no tracking of connection dependencies so that if say your mobile broadband device goes down and you've got a VPN up, the VPN stays up and just hangs. Or tie VPN and other connections together so that they come up and go down at the same time. There's no consistent tracking of connection time and data usage which NM will soon be doing. That's just the start. I'd assert that good, useful monitoring *requires* a lot of information that only the controller knows. The problem is that in the old system, there was no controller; ifup/ifdown are basically like terrorist cells upon pain of death have almost no knowledge of anything else on the system. Which is why NM attempts to tie a lot of that together in one central location, including configuration, control, and monitoring. Yes, it's harder for experts to create a world-dominating robot with duct tape and bailing wire because most of the parts are already assembled, but for most people it provides a ready-to-use solution with great integration possibilities into your system
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 09:55 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems My mistake. I guess it was Rakesh Pandit who was using a CDMA 3G connection. use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? No particular reason, in fact that looks like a bug. NM no longer depends on HAL, but that dependency is still in the initscript, which looks like it pushes NM later than netfs. But in reality, you're looking for a dependency based initsystem which we don't quite yet have. There are already scripts that kick netfs to mount stuff when NM brings the network up (/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/05-netfs), so you get asynchronous bootup *and* your mounts. The rest of the system, if it requires something from the mounted directories, needs to be smart enough to know that. If you need to, you can set NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network, which causes the NetworkManager initscript to block until a network connection is brought up, or 30 seconds have passed. I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? See the other mail; the problem with a generic isUp() is that it simply says hey, is there a connection? It doesn't provide enough information about the networking state of the system for anything to make an intelligent decision about anything. It's a hey I'm connected to something but there's no information about *what* you're connected to; whether it's a secure home network, whether it's a slow 3G network, whether it's billed by the minute or the hour or unlimited, etc. Dan -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 11/30/2009 06:12 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 09:55 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/29/2009 11:30 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Sat, 2009-11-28 at 09:10 +, Terry Barnaby wrote: On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 NetworkManager is intended to control the default internet connection. If NetworkManager cannot control the default internet connection, then you may not want to use NetworkManager. In your case, you're using a mobile broadband device. The real bug here is that for whatever reason, NM/MM aren't connecting your modem, and we should follow up on that bug instead. Dan I am not using a mobile broadband device. The network connection my systems My mistake. I guess it was Rakesh Pandit who was using a CDMA 3G connection. use is not just the Internet it is a local network LAN connection that also serves the internet. Most of my systems use a local network server which provides NIS, /home and /data using NFS and VPN etc. I normally use the service network to bring up wired or wireless networking for this. Fedora, by default, uses NetworkManager to manage all network devices though. I use the service network as, for some reason, the NetworkManager service is started after the netfs and other services are started. Is there a reason for this ?? No particular reason, in fact that looks like a bug. NM no longer depends on HAL, but that dependency is still in the initscript, which looks like it pushes NM later than netfs. But in reality, you're looking for a dependency based initsystem which we don't quite yet have. There are already scripts that kick netfs to mount stuff when NM brings the network up (/etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/05-netfs), so you get asynchronous bootup *and* your mounts. The rest of the system, if it requires something from the mounted directories, needs to be smart enough to know that. If you need to, you can set NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network, which causes the NetworkManager initscript to block until a network connection is brought up, or 30 seconds have passed. I can obviously turn of the NetworkManager service, which I have done on the desktop systems. However, I also have a few Laptops that can roam. In F11 and before I have used the network and NetworkManager services. When the laptop boots away from home, the network service fails and I can then use the NetworkManager service to connect to whatever wireless network or G3 network is available. It does seem sensible to me that the system provides applications with info on if the network is up (not just the Internet). The NetworkManager service seems the place to do this and it looks like the applications are starting to use it for this purpose. So maybe a generic NM isNetworkUp() API call is called for ? See the other mail; the problem with a generic isUp() is that it simply says hey, is there a connection? It doesn't provide enough information about the networking state of the system for anything to make an intelligent decision about anything. It's a hey I'm connected to something but there's no information about *what* you're connected to; whether it's a secure home network, whether it's a slow 3G network, whether it's billed by the minute or the hour or unlimited, etc. Dan Hi, Thanks for the info. I would have thought that a generic isUp() is good enough for the likes of Firefox and Pidgen though to decide if to start offline. Being connected to a Network is probably all you need, you may be accessing an Intranet as all my systems Firefox home pages do ... Anyway, following your email (And notes in Bugzilla) I thought I'd try and use NM properly for my config. However I have a problem, which may be a bug. I have turned off the Network services and turned on NetworkManger. I have two main network interfaces eth0 (wired) and eth1 (Wifi), both are set to be managed by NM and to start at boot. I have also added NETWORKWAIT=yes in /etc/sysconfig/network. When I boot with this the network (eth1 (eth0 is disconnected)) does not come up at boot. There is a message stating a failure on the line where it is waiting for the network to come up. When I log in as a local user the network then comes up ... I also note that, before the user is logged in, I cannot start the network with service network
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 11/30/2009 01:05 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 10:05 +, Steven Whitehouse wrote: configuration, control, and monitoring. Yes, it's harder for experts to create a world-dominating robot with duct tape and bailing wire because most of the parts are already assembled, but for most people it provides a ready-to-use solution with great integration possibilities into your system environment. Then stop shipping the duct tape and bailing wire. If things outside of NM aren't going to work right or are going to break other stuff, get rid of them. The only reason not to is what if NM is broken, which is a moot point since offering a broken interface to use as a backup in case another interface is broken makes no sense. Stick with the one we're interested in supporting and deal with that set of bugs. --CJD Dan -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 02:54:22PM -0500, Casey Dahlin wrote: On 11/30/2009 01:05 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 10:05 +, Steven Whitehouse wrote: configuration, control, and monitoring. Yes, it's harder for experts to create a world-dominating robot with duct tape and bailing wire because most of the parts are already assembled, but for most people it provides a ready-to-use solution with great integration possibilities into your system environment. Then stop shipping the duct tape and bailing wire. If things outside of NM aren't going to work right or are going to break other stuff, get rid of them. The only reason not to is what if NM is broken, which is a moot point since offering a broken interface to use as a backup in case another interface is broken makes no sense. Stick with the one we're interested in supporting and deal with that set of bugs. I will send you a check for $5 if you configure your mailer to do line breaks properly. I am not joking. josh -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 11/30/2009 03:26 PM, Josh Boyer wrote: On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 02:54:22PM -0500, Casey Dahlin wrote: On 11/30/2009 01:05 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 10:05 +, Steven Whitehouse wrote: configuration, control, and monitoring. Yes, it's harder for experts to create a world-dominating robot with duct tape and bailing wire because most of the parts are already assembled, but for most people it provides a ready-to-use solution with great integration possibilities into your system environment. Then stop shipping the duct tape and bailing wire. If things outside of NM aren't going to work right or are going to break other stuff, get rid of them. The only reason not to is what if NM is broken, which is a moot point since offering a broken interface to use as a backup in case another interface is broken makes no sense. Stick with the one we're interested in supporting and deal with that set of bugs. I will send you a check for $5 if you configure your mailer to do line breaks properly. I am not joking. josh *facepalm* T-bird strikes again. Can I claim the money if I just switch mailers, because I'm due. --CJD -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 03:28:55PM -0500, Casey Dahlin wrote: On 11/30/2009 03:26 PM, Josh Boyer wrote: On Mon, Nov 30, 2009 at 02:54:22PM -0500, Casey Dahlin wrote: On 11/30/2009 01:05 PM, Dan Williams wrote: On Mon, 2009-11-30 at 10:05 +, Steven Whitehouse wrote: configuration, control, and monitoring. Yes, it's harder for experts to create a world-dominating robot with duct tape and bailing wire because most of the parts are already assembled, but for most people it provides a ready-to-use solution with great integration possibilities into your system environment. Then stop shipping the duct tape and bailing wire. If things outside of NM aren't going to work right or are going to break other stuff, get rid of them. The only reason not to is what if NM is broken, which is a moot point since offering a broken interface to use as a backup in case another interface is broken makes no sense. Stick with the one we're interested in supporting and deal with that set of bugs. I will send you a check for $5 if you configure your mailer to do line breaks properly. I am not joking. josh *facepalm* T-bird strikes again. Can I claim the money if I just switch mailers, because I'm due. I'd count that. I'll watch for a week and if things seem better I'll send your check after you send me your address :). josh -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. -- Rakesh Pandit https://fedoraproject.org/ freedom, friends, features, first -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
Re: F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
On 11/28/2009 08:35 AM, Rakesh Pandit wrote: 2009/11/28 Terry Barnaby wrote: If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? This is odd behaviour and needs to be fixed. I would suggest open up a bug against firefox. I know one can change toolkit.networkmanager.disable preference, but it is a PITA for our users. One of use cases is: Sometime network manager does not connect me via my CDMA usb modem (in case signal is weak), but wvdial does and once I switch from NM to wvdial, my firefox gets to offline mode, which I don't expect it to as I am connected. Ok, filed as: 542078 -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
F12: NetworkManager-Firefox: Firefox is currently in offline mode and can't browse the Web
If the NetworkManager service is running, but not managing the current network connection, then Firefox starts up in offline mode. Is this a bug in NetworkManager or Firefox ? -- fedora-devel-list mailing list fedora-devel-list@redhat.com https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-devel-list
