Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
Wendell Nichols wrote: > The main problem is the lack (for the moment) of a generally available > 64 bit java plugin for firefox. This has just in the last few weeks > been made available IcedTea has shipped with a 64-bit plugin for a while so... > but because it was unavailable for so long many vendors didn't produce > 64bit native code to go with their applets for linux. ... that's just a lame excuse. Those vendors just don't give a darn about GNU/Linux, it's already a surprise that they bothered providing a 32-bit .so for GNU/Linux. Kevin Kofler -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
Sharpe, Sam J wrote: Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Wed, 2009-03-11 at 22:40 -0600, Frank Cox wrote: > On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 11:45:26 +0800 > Meng Qiu wrote: > >> The "gears" for my GeForce4 MX440 on F10 is about 1700 FPS. >> But the number for my HD1950pro on F11(pre) is never up to 100 FPS! > 7074 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1414.687 FPS > 7103 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.448 FPS > 7102 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.320 FPS > 7112 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1422.319 FPS > > That's on Fedora 10 with an ATI X1550 card and the video driver that's included > with Fedora 10. (Not the proprietary driver.) For comparison: 6799 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1359.743 FPS 6961 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1392.055 FPS 7015 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1402.842 FPS 6660 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1331.944 FPS 7034 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1406.609 FPS 6960 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1391.793 FPS That's on an Intel mobo with a 2GHz Core 2 Duo and 4GB of RAM, using the *onboard* 82Q963/Q965 graphics chip. So either glxgears isn't a very representative benchmark, or installing one of these graphics cards is a waste of time. I'm not sure which. Or it's badly setup, because my low-end NVidia Cards beat that easily. (I have a pair of Quadro NVS 290 PCIe 64MB - admittedly using genuine NVidia drivers) [...@sam ~]$ glxgears 9648 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1929.527 FPS 9566 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1913.107 FPS 9679 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1935.721 FPS 9621 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1924.059 FPS FWIW, I see a definite difference between the card running 2 x 1280x1024 monitors vs. the card running 1920x1200 + 1280x1024 - the latter consistently scores in the 1700-1800s, the former (above) scores in the 1900s. Each card is running NVidia's TwinView, but I don't have Xinerama running to bind the two sets of screens together. (note to others - don't try running Compiz on this setup, it really really can't handle a 5760 x 1200 array of pixels yet) -- Sam In my opinion it has almost nothing to do with performance! The actual differences are just too small to measure without a good ruler. The real issues revolve around what software is available in 64 bit mode and how the lack of 64 bit versions affects you. The main problem is the lack (for the moment) of a generally available 64 bit java plugin for firefox. This has just in the last few weeks been made available but because it was unavailable for so long many vendors didn't produce 64bit native code to go with their applets for linux. Two that seriously affect me are Webex, and Juniper VPN. These things both come with native jni code used by their applets so I have to run 32 fit firefox on my 64 bit laptop. I also have to keep a 32bit jre around for its plugin and manage the link to the dll manually cause all my other java work is with the 64 bit jvm/jre. So its a pita to manage 32bit firefox on a 64bit machine but its necessary. The rest of the 32 bit world runs more or less invisibly on my 64 bit system and I'm quite pleased with how seamless it is. If you compile software which is 32bit, you also have to make sure that you install both 64 and 32 bit versions of all the libraries and development packages. The compiler is pretty good at managing the rest! enjoy... wcn -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: On Wed, 2009-03-11 at 22:40 -0600, Frank Cox wrote: > On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 11:45:26 +0800 > Meng Qiu wrote: > >> The "gears" for my GeForce4 MX440 on F10 is about 1700 FPS. >> But the number for my HD1950pro on F11(pre) is never up to 100 FPS! > 7074 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1414.687 FPS > 7103 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.448 FPS > 7102 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.320 FPS > 7112 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1422.319 FPS > > That's on Fedora 10 with an ATI X1550 card and the video driver that's included > with Fedora 10. (Not the proprietary driver.) For comparison: 6799 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1359.743 FPS 6961 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1392.055 FPS 7015 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1402.842 FPS 6660 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1331.944 FPS 7034 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1406.609 FPS 6960 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1391.793 FPS That's on an Intel mobo with a 2GHz Core 2 Duo and 4GB of RAM, using the *onboard* 82Q963/Q965 graphics chip. So either glxgears isn't a very representative benchmark, or installing one of these graphics cards is a waste of time. I'm not sure which. Or it's badly setup, because my low-end NVidia Cards beat that easily. (I have a pair of Quadro NVS 290 PCIe 64MB - admittedly using genuine NVidia drivers) [...@sam ~]$ glxgears 9648 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1929.527 FPS 9566 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1913.107 FPS 9679 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1935.721 FPS 9621 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1924.059 FPS FWIW, I see a definite difference between the card running 2 x 1280x1024 monitors vs. the card running 1920x1200 + 1280x1024 - the latter consistently scores in the 1700-1800s, the former (above) scores in the 1900s. Each card is running NVidia's TwinView, but I don't have Xinerama running to bind the two sets of screens together. (note to others - don't try running Compiz on this setup, it really really can't handle a 5760 x 1200 array of pixels yet) -- Sam -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
Frank Cox wrote: > On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 11:45:26 +0800 > Meng Qiu wrote: > >> The "gears" for my GeForce4 MX440 on F10 is about 1700 FPS. >> But the number for my HD1950pro on F11(pre) is never up to 100 FPS! > > 7074 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1414.687 FPS > 7103 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.448 FPS > 7102 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.320 FPS > 7112 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1422.319 FPS > > That's on Fedora 10 with an ATI X1550 card and the video driver that's > included > with Fedora 10. (Not the proprietary driver.) That's because the X1550 is supported by the Free 3D acceleration framework and the HD1950pro isn't. Radeon HD cards are not supported yet. Kevin Kofler -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
Patrick O'Callaghan wrote: > That's on an Intel mobo with a 2GHz Core 2 Duo and 4GB of RAM, using the > *onboard* 82Q963/Q965 graphics chip. So either glxgears isn't a very > representative benchmark, or installing one of these graphics cards is a > waste of time. I'm not sure which. Well, the GM965 isn't that bad, but still glxgears sucks as a benchmark. ;-) Kevin Kofler -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
On Wed, 2009-03-11 at 22:40 -0600, Frank Cox wrote: > On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 11:45:26 +0800 > Meng Qiu wrote: > > > The "gears" for my GeForce4 MX440 on F10 is about 1700 FPS. > > But the number for my HD1950pro on F11(pre) is never up to 100 FPS! > > 7074 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1414.687 FPS > 7103 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.448 FPS > 7102 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.320 FPS > 7112 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1422.319 FPS > > That's on Fedora 10 with an ATI X1550 card and the video driver that's > included > with Fedora 10. (Not the proprietary driver.) For comparison: 6799 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1359.743 FPS 6961 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1392.055 FPS 7015 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1402.842 FPS 6660 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1331.944 FPS 7034 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1406.609 FPS 6960 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1391.793 FPS That's on an Intel mobo with a 2GHz Core 2 Duo and 4GB of RAM, using the *onboard* 82Q963/Q965 graphics chip. So either glxgears isn't a very representative benchmark, or installing one of these graphics cards is a waste of time. I'm not sure which. poc -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 11:45:26 +0800 Meng Qiu wrote: > The "gears" for my GeForce4 MX440 on F10 is about 1700 FPS. > But the number for my HD1950pro on F11(pre) is never up to 100 FPS! 7074 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1414.687 FPS 7103 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.448 FPS 7102 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1420.320 FPS 7112 frames in 5.0 seconds = 1422.319 FPS That's on Fedora 10 with an ATI X1550 card and the video driver that's included with Fedora 10. (Not the proprietary driver.) -- MELVILLE THEATRE ~ Melville Sask ~ http://www.melvilletheatre.com -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 11:29 AM, Craig White wrote: > On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 11:26 +0800, Meng Qiu wrote: > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:56 AM, Petrus de Calguarium > > wrote: > > David Hláčik wrote: > > > Will this sacrifice me ;)? > > > David > > I cannot comment on the suitability of your graphic card or > > your intended > > use of the system, nor do I know exactly how your T5550 > > @1,83Ghz, 4GB > > DDR2 compares to my Core 2 Duo E6320 @1,86Ghz, 4GB DDR2, but I > > switched in the last 2 days and I notice improvements (not > > mind-blowing) in > > general day-to-day use (installing, video conversion, web use, > > etc.). I have > > not had to resort to any heroic measures, not with multimedia, > > nor flash, > > etc. It was all standard fare, same as setting up 32-bit. > > > > I don't think this will "sacrifice you" ;) > > > > > Surely, > > so many applications don't support 64bit Linux platform, especially > > the multimedia apps. > > If you just use it for work, it will work. > > If you hope use it for entertainment, you have a lot of hard work to > > do. > > > > Anyway, it's a chance to learn many things! > > Just DIY!!! > > actually - all of the multimedia apps that I ever use have 64 bit > versions. That hardly seems to be an issue. > > Craig > > -- > fedora-list mailing list > fedora-list@redhat.com > To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list > Guidelines: > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines > Yes, the situation is better now. But I DO think ATI cards' drivers support 3D apps badly. The "gears" for my GeForce4 MX440 on F10 is about 1700 FPS. But the number for my HD1950pro on F11(pre) is never up to 100 FPS! And the newest ATI drivers from ati.amd.com is always hard to install or not work. The driver from yum is no more better than "vesa" version. -- 南无楞严会上佛菩萨！南无楞严会上佛菩萨！南无楞严会上佛菩萨！ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
On Thu, 2009-03-12 at 11:26 +0800, Meng Qiu wrote: > > > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:56 AM, Petrus de Calguarium > wrote: > David Hláčik wrote: > > Will this sacrifice me ;)? > > David > I cannot comment on the suitability of your graphic card or > your intended > use of the system, nor do I know exactly how your T5550 > @1,83Ghz, 4GB > DDR2 compares to my Core 2 Duo E6320 @1,86Ghz, 4GB DDR2, but I > switched in the last 2 days and I notice improvements (not > mind-blowing) in > general day-to-day use (installing, video conversion, web use, > etc.). I have > not had to resort to any heroic measures, not with multimedia, > nor flash, > etc. It was all standard fare, same as setting up 32-bit. > > I don't think this will "sacrifice you" ;) > > Surely, > so many applications don't support 64bit Linux platform, especially > the multimedia apps. > If you just use it for work, it will work. > If you hope use it for entertainment, you have a lot of hard work to > do. > > Anyway, it's a chance to learn many things! > Just DIY!!! actually - all of the multimedia apps that I ever use have 64 bit versions. That hardly seems to be an issue. Craig -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:56 AM, Petrus de Calguarium wrote: > David Hláčik wrote: > > Will this sacrifice me ;)? > > David > I cannot comment on the suitability of your graphic card or your intended > use of the system, nor do I know exactly how your T5550 @1,83Ghz, 4GB > DDR2 compares to my Core 2 Duo E6320 @1,86Ghz, 4GB DDR2, but I > switched in the last 2 days and I notice improvements (not mind-blowing) in > general day-to-day use (installing, video conversion, web use, etc.). I > have > not had to resort to any heroic measures, not with multimedia, nor flash, > etc. It was all standard fare, same as setting up 32-bit. > > I don't think this will "sacrifice you" ;) > > > > -- > fedora-list mailing list > fedora-list@redhat.com > To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list > Guidelines: > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines > Surely, so many applications don't support 64bit Linux platform, especially the multimedia apps. If you just use it for work, it will work. If you hope use it for entertainment, you have a lot of hard work to do. Anyway, it's a chance to learn many things! Just DIY!!! -- 南无楞严会上佛菩萨！南无楞严会上佛菩萨！南无楞严会上佛菩萨！ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
David Hláčik wrote: > Will this sacrifice me ;)? > David I cannot comment on the suitability of your graphic card or your intended use of the system, nor do I know exactly how your T5550 @1,83Ghz, 4GB DDR2 compares to my Core 2 Duo E6320 @1,86Ghz, 4GB DDR2, but I switched in the last 2 days and I notice improvements (not mind-blowing) in general day-to-day use (installing, video conversion, web use, etc.). I have not had to resort to any heroic measures, not with multimedia, nor flash, etc. It was all standard fare, same as setting up 32-bit. I don't think this will "sacrifice you" ;) -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
David Hláčik wrote: > Intel Core Duo T5550 @1,83Ghz The T5550 is actually a Core 2 Duo, not a Core Duo. This is important because only the Core 2 series support x86_64. (So yes, the T5550 supports 64-bit operation and that's what I recommend using.) Kevin Kofler -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
On Wed, 11 Mar 2009 21:08:33 +0800 萌邱 wrote: > Just ONLY for your ATI card, the 32bit version is better. > The driver for ATI, especially for Linux 64bit, is very poor! I have an ATI card in my main desktop computer (this one) and F10 is the first Fedora version that I have been able to use my widescreen monitor with the open source ATI driver that comes with the operating system. It works great for me with F10/x86_64. Prior to that, it still worked well but I had to use the proprietary ATI driver to get the proper resolution out of it. -- MELVILLE THEATRE ~ Melville Sask ~ http://www.melvilletheatre.com -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: [SPAM]Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
萌邱 wrote: > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 8:56 PM, David Hláčik wrote: > >> Hi guys, >> >> sorry for opening this neverending story again. >> >> I am about to reinstall Fedora 10 on my laptop. >> >> Asus F3Sr, ATI, 230GB disk 5400rpm, Intel Core Duo T5550 @1,83Ghz, 4GB DDR2 >> Ram >> >> I was using all the time only 32bit version here all the time (with >> kernel-pae). >> My question is , should I go with 64bit? Will this sacrifice me ;)? >> >> What I am using NB for? >> >> Pyton, PHP, XML , XHTML development in Netbeans. I am using apache, for >> that. >> Virtualization with VMware Workstation (For Windows XP). >> >> Thanks, and best regards, >> >> David >> -- >> fedora-list mailing list >> fedora-list@redhat.com >> To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list >> Guidelines: >> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines >> > > Poor you, poor me(I had the same trouble, for my crossfire), and poor us. > > Just ONLY for your ATI card, the 32bit version is better. > The driver for ATI, especially for Linux 64bit, is very poor! > > I will not buy a NB with ATI card in the next few years. > > > I disagree completely. The Open Source radeon driver is awesome for 64-bit. It works great is rock solid and I don't have any trouble with it at all. In fact, the latest ATI (Proprietary) drivers are not that bad either, but since I don't need 3D for anything on this system I haven't setup that driver. For the record, I've had nothing but crap experiences with NVidia's cards in linux (and windows) and will not buy another NVidia card. So it's all a matter of personal preference. -- Frustra laborant quotquot se calculationibus fatigant pro inventione quadraturae circuli Mark Haney Sr. Systems Administrator ERC Broadband (828) 350-2415 Call (866) ERC-7110 for after hours support -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
David Hláčik wrote: > Hi guys, > > sorry for opening this neverending story again. > > I am about to reinstall Fedora 10 on my laptop. > > Asus F3Sr, ATI, 230GB disk 5400rpm, Intel Core Duo T5550 @1,83Ghz, 4GB > DDR2 Ram > > I was using all the time only 32bit version here all the time (with > kernel-pae). > My question is , should I go with 64bit? Will this sacrifice me ;)? > > What I am using NB for? > > Pyton, PHP, XML , XHTML development in Netbeans. I am using apache, for > that. > Virtualization with VMware Workstation (For Windows XP). > > Thanks, and best regards, > > David I think the 64-bit will be fine. I run it on my Athlon 64 with 4GB RAM and I don't have trouble with it. I find the performance compiling is better, since I do a lot of that. -- Frustra laborant quotquot se calculationibus fatigant pro inventione quadraturae circuli Mark Haney Sr. Systems Administrator ERC Broadband (828) 350-2415 Call (866) ERC-7110 for after hours support -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
Re: 64bit or 32bit for my laptop
On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 8:56 PM, David Hláčik wrote: > Hi guys, > > sorry for opening this neverending story again. > > I am about to reinstall Fedora 10 on my laptop. > > Asus F3Sr, ATI, 230GB disk 5400rpm, Intel Core Duo T5550 @1,83Ghz, 4GB DDR2 > Ram > > I was using all the time only 32bit version here all the time (with > kernel-pae). > My question is , should I go with 64bit? Will this sacrifice me ;)? > > What I am using NB for? > > Pyton, PHP, XML , XHTML development in Netbeans. I am using apache, for > that. > Virtualization with VMware Workstation (For Windows XP). > > Thanks, and best regards, > > David > -- > fedora-list mailing list > fedora-list@redhat.com > To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list > Guidelines: > http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines > Poor you, poor me(I had the same trouble, for my crossfire), and poor us. Just ONLY for your ATI card, the 32bit version is better. The driver for ATI, especially for Linux 64bit, is very poor! I will not buy a NB with ATI card in the next few years. -- 南无楞严会上佛菩萨！南无楞严会上佛菩萨！南无楞严会上佛菩萨！ -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
64bit or 32bit for my laptop
Hi guys, sorry for opening this neverending story again. I am about to reinstall Fedora 10 on my laptop. Asus F3Sr, ATI, 230GB disk 5400rpm, Intel Core Duo T5550 @1,83Ghz, 4GB DDR2 Ram I was using all the time only 32bit version here all the time (with kernel-pae). My question is , should I go with 64bit? Will this sacrifice me ;)? What I am using NB for? Pyton, PHP, XML , XHTML development in Netbeans. I am using apache, for that. Virtualization with VMware Workstation (For Windows XP). Thanks, and best regards, David -- fedora-list mailing list fedora-list@redhat.com To unsubscribe: https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-list Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Communicate/MailingListGuidelines
