Re: [Felvtalk] Re anemia and negative IFA (Dave)
What is wrong with the vets? I was not as lucky as David, neither my River :((( Mine was killed by a no-kill animal shelter...Some of you might remember... By the way I sent a complaint letter, called a few of their top supporters, Executive Director called me and I was VERY accurate and not accepting their bs, the director of the faclities stepped down a while ago. I don't know if it is related but I hope the new one is better... I think this starts with vets, they know the facts and they are rushing to kill animals, if they behave that way, what do we expect from the rest of the society...I am open to start a petition etc. whatever comes to your minds. I am new and unfortunately I found this site after the fact, but I will never forget the support I got from all of you, thank you again. Alev From: David Arthurs arthurs.da...@gmail.com To: felvtalk felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2013 11:53 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Re anemia and negative IFA (Dave) Only IFA. I'll ask that she be retested with the Elisa too. Thanks for pointing that out. I thought the IFA was the definitive test but may not be positive right away when acute symptoms present. Also a clarification, my Tux as a kitten story was 5 years ago. She's now an adult. Even back then the vet was ready to destroy her if that snap test came back positive. Of course the current vet wanted to put her down at the first positive snap test with anemia. She may not even be infected with FeLV...but even if she were infected we wouldn't consider that option until her quality of life was so bad to warrant that (and treating her condition to give her a fighting chance at some recovery). Thanks. again. Dave On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 7:01 AM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote: Dave was she just retested on the IFA, or on the Snap test also? A positive Snap with a negative IFA is still a positive cat. If both tests were negative then she is negative. Beth Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! http://www.furkids.org/ From: Dave Arthurs arthurs.da...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Wednesday, February 6, 2013 9:34 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Re anemia and negative IFA (Dave) Update on Tux. Recap: She tested positive for felv on the snap test in December and negative on ifa. She is a felv vaccinated house cat that presented with immune mediated hemolytic anemia. She was treated with prednisolone and doxycycline. She responded well to treatment tho no cause was identified because the vet was convinced she was felv+. This week we retested her. Weight is up 1 lb. and red blood cell count is normal. Negative on ifa. The cause of her anemia is still unknown but the vet has let the felv diagnosis go now. Thank you everyone so much for all the advice. It's heartbreaking to read about the struggles we all go through on this forum for the love of our pets. When we got tux the vet tested her for felv. She said if she was positive that she had to be put down right away. She was very insistent. I knew in my heart that was wrong and wouldn't let her do it. Of course if she were suffering that would be different...but I could never destroy a healthy kitten. I am very happy to see an entire community on this forum that feels as I did (and reinforces what I thought was right at the time). Unfortunately most people will do what the vet says...and that is very sad. Very best wishes to everyone and your furry companions! I will stay subscribed to the forum because you raise a wide array of topics and I may be able to help someone. Thx. Dave On Dec 28, 2012, at 5:50 PM, Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com wrote: Be careful about letting get too much exercise. If she is amemic she is not getting enough oxygen to her cells as it is David Arthurs arthurs.da...@gmail.com wrote: The official diagnosis/condition from the pathologist is immune mediated hemolytic anemia/IMHA. We don't know the cause yet. We're treating for parasites (doxycycline)...and with prednisone to suppress the immune response. We'll repeat the IFA in a month. She is responding very well to treatment...the immune response to her own blood has diminished, gained back 1/4 pound, her CBC increased 50% and her new blood cell count was up 5x. We get another blood test tomorrow. She was still barely below the recommended CBC for transfusion...but is doing well despite everything. She's active though she won't play. There are a couple of times she tried to rough-house with her sister and gave up (it was actually funny to watch...after a few minutes of chase, she gave up and laid on her back...her sister came over and gave her a very gentle little nip on the butt...to which Tux let out a whine of indignation). Our vet admitted some doubt about FeLV but is sticking with it for now. I read online
Re: [Felvtalk] Studies
Hey Lee, Somebody posted on fb that, in a zoo somewhere in Norway- I think- there is a cave and the name plate on it says the most dangerous predator lives here and inside, there are just mirrors... I never liked people who don't like animals but now I detest them-And I found out that not every pet owner really care for animals either...I still have been calling places to find a way to make myself heard about killing animals unneccasserily, they say unless they were not killed by steel pipes, or kicked to death killing them is OK, because it is humane...I see nothing humane in killing helpless animals. And I am not even talking about-yet-the animals grown for us to eat-The good news is, the lady who very casually told me that they put her to sleep stepped down... I am not sure if my complaint was the reason but I am glad. I hope next person is better than her but either way I will not stop badgering people about animal rights. Yes everything we eat, drink have many chemicals, try to avoid as much as you can and eat less, at least you consume less chemicals this way:) I have to go now, I have a job interview tomorrow and I am so nervous. Take care, Alev PS: You are working in an animal shelter right? Am I mistaken? From: Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 3:56 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] Studies I noticed something about humans that is unique to our species. We seem to have an endless ability to purposely misunderstand what is being said or proposed. And we put absolute faith in studies. As the secretary of an animal rights organization, a genuine 501 c-3, I have been asked why I was advocating that animals be given the same benefits as humans and wouldn't that be terribly expensive. Duh? I think these people were mostly worried about their own right to eat cows, chickens, sheep, pigs, turkeys, and other edible beings. But I even hear, on occasion that animal rights advocates want there to be some form of education for animals and that if we have our way, there would eventually be no more animals on Earth because we are against ;breeding dogs and cats, etc.. Really! And when I happened to mention animal welfare, I got the response that there are enough lazy people on welfare, we don't need to put animals on welfare in addition. Welcome to the Twilight Zoned Out. OK. I feel it necessary to clear up all these misconceptions with a name change. From now on I will tell people I am an Animal Advocate. That means that I speak up for animals. Right? Except in UK where it would mean that an animal can hire me as a lawyer. I also seem to have read somewhere that rats, mice, voles, etc. reproduce, much as any other mammal does. A study shows that if the entire New York Sewer system was emptied of rats and mice and a few alligators, if a male and female rat and a male and female mouse were to be placed there on January 1, in just under a year, the entire New York Sewer system would have the same number of rodents as it had before. This study is based on absolutely no verifiable research, and is simply a product of an over-active imagination. As is the study that cats kill BILLIONS of small mammals and birds each year. I need a cup of coffee. Uh, no. Last study I read, coffee was not good for the health. But that was refuted by the former study that it is good for the health and can prevent senility. However, I can't have a sandwich any more because whole wheat or any wheat, oats, bananas, orange juice, and most food is a health hazard, except for animal based food I guess because I haven't seen any studies recently to prove that animal protein is harmful and the myth of clogged arteries from animal fat has been debunked, rebunked and debunked again. I'm down to eating floor dust. Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors too! From: Alev alev_dur...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2013 10:57 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] War on Cats and Others Lee, I couldnt agree more, thank you for this email, I will never stop talking about animal rights to people, take care Sent from my iPhone On Feb 2, 2013, at 5:41 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote: There is so much nonsense, mythology and prejudice going around when it comes to diseases in general, whether cat, dog or human that it's a wonder any of us survive the ignorance rather than the disease. An acquaintance of mine was told by a licensed veterinarian that she needed to have her healthy FIV+ cat euthanized because humans can catch it from cats. Meow? My tenant, when I had a rent house, insisted that FIV was highly contagious but FeLv was NOT. Tail backwards. People to this day refuse to hug a person who is living with HIV
Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
Hello again, I am sorry I was out of reach for a while. I sincerely would like to thank each and every one of you who took time to read my emails, and took time to gave me valuable information. It meant a lot to me. Thank you all, Alev From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2012 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat Yes, per Gavin Nicols' comment on http://www.no-killnews.com/?p=3935 San Antonio is nowhere near No Kill (90%+), even if they considered FIV+/Felv+ cats healthy, which you indicate they don't: ``For 2012 Fiscal Year to Date, the healthy and treatable dogs and cats make up 76% of total intake (in 2011, healthy and treatable was 66% of total intake).'' This is an issue that needs to be discussed in the No Kill community. On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 4:15 PM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote: Beth, How wonderful you are. I had a similar but happier experience. I was known in my city as a rescuer and am on the Board of an animal rights organization. However, I surrendered many cats to the Humane Society, a supposedly no-kill shelter in San Antonio, Tx. Whenever I filled out the surrender form, I always added that the cat must be returned to me for any reason at any time, whether it was FIV or FeLv or some other situation that made the cat unadoptable. I put it all over the form, told the intake people and they agreed. I knew that they killed FIV+ and FeLv+ cats without asking questions. Most people don't realize this or just don't care as long as they can tell themselves that they did their best for the cat. In addition, the HS allows anyone to visit with the cats in visitation rooms, small cubicles with cat toys where the cats can be handled and potential adopters can get to know them. This shelter is better than most because their intake form does have a place to state that the people surrendering the cat can have him/her back in case of something that makes the cat unadoptable. Anyway, one evening the supervising intake person called me. She was near tears. I hadn't surrendered any cats so I wondered what was wrong. She said that they had gotten in two young, gorgeous cats who had tested FIV+ and she was ordered to have them euthanized the next day. She asked me if I would foster, since she knew I did not euthanize FIV+ cats. I had none at the time, but I had about 20 other cats. So I told her that if she took the two cats who were occupying my spare room at that time and who tested negative for everything, were already fixed and had their rabies shots I would take the FIV+ cats. The exchange was made before the shelter opened the next day. This was entirely against the rules but no one complained. I got Sugar Plum Fairy, a lovely blue-eyed white cat who was NOT deaf and Sir Walter, a husky, healthy tabby and white boy. Both were fixed and had their rabies shots. That was about 7 years ago. I named the white one Sugar Plum Fairy and the tabby and white Sir Walter because he looked regal. Sugar Plum Fairy is still with me along with 4 other FIV+ cats who live in separate quarters from my main group. Sir Walter passed a month ago from kidney cancer. Up until a month before he passed, he was a happy, overweight puss with an attitude. Sugar is fine because she has other companions. I also have two FIV+ cats mixed in with my main group because they are lay back non-fighters who get along with everyone. No kill shelters are becoming much more aware that FIV and FeLv do not have to be a death sentence for cats surrendered to them. It's so awful that Alev had such a painful experience. This used to be the norm in this country but things are slowly changing. We always have to speak up for the cats and make sure that we have an understanding when we surrender one to a shelter that they will return the cat if anything is wrong. Get it in writing and call frequently, visit frequently if you can to see how your cat is doing. The two who were exchanged for Sugar and Wally got adopted within two weeks of arriving at the shelter. FIV is not contagious unless the cats get into a major biting and fighting situation. Most FIV+ cats who are neutered do not bite and fight since this is behavior during mating season. However, the five cats I have in my special FIV section exhibited some left over hostility tendencies from their pre-neuter days. That's why they are separate from my main group. The two who are mixed in never exhibited even a hiss at anyone. Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors too! Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal! If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their life. Contact your local pound for
[Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
Dear all, I feel for all of you who lost your cat(s). I have lost one too many and I can't bring myself to think losing another one. I would like to share something with you all and ask your opinions and advice since I am not originally from the US and I don't know how things go over here plus I might not be thinking straight because I am very upset. This happened on Saturday and I have been crying since... I came across to this cat-we named her River-less than 2 weeks ago cross the road from my home in an unused shed. I usually don't look around but for some reason, I looked towards the shed and there she was looking at me...She was not moving a lot, sickly and skinny. I started feeding her, she ate a lot and became more energetic in 2 days. She had started wandering around since she wasn't starving anymore and I became afraid of coyotes killing her or cold weather coming soon. I called the local no-kill shelter to ask what to do. They told me to take pictures and uploaded on their facebook page in order to locate her owners. She definitely had owners once and probably was dumped...She was a very loving sweet cat. I suspected, being a house cat she didn't know what to do to feed herself and that's why she was in that shape. After a while she was so great, even if she was not in the shed, she would come running when I called her. A few days later shelter called and said they had an opening for her. This was a good timing because of freeze warning coming to our way. I already have another cat and I didn't want to bring her home without knowing that she is healthy...We-me and the kids-were so happy to bring her to safety. They asked me to sign a form saying that I gave all her rights to the shelter. I was puzzled but knowing that it was a no-kill shelter I was not that concerned. I put a note saying that I was not the owner and she probably had an owner...I asked a lot of questions, when would we know about her health, how can we adopt her, can I visit her etc.? I told them we were planning to adopt her but my husband needed to be convinced...They told me the vet would be coming on Thursday and the blood test would be back and she would be in pet finder after a while. They said no to visitation and no to adopting her right from the shelter...I said what if someone adopts her before we see the ad, please call me etc...And then we left. I didn't know that I brought her to her death by my hands thinking I was doing the right thing... I called them Saturday and they informed me that they put her to sleep on Friday because she had FeLV+...I said why didn't you call? no answer...Between killing an animal and making a phone call they picked killing her. After I read online that there are many false positive on this test ( I don;t think anyone bothered to do the second test) and even if she was positive she could be living a long life in a one-cat household...I can't believe any animal lover would be that quick to kill one without exploring other options or calling someone-me- who showed extreme interest on saving this cat...Please anyone let me know if this is what they do in the shelters? Is there anything we can do to change their policy? She even gave me a line of oh, you did such a good job taking care of her, she would have died if not for you No one ever mentioned me killing the cat-never...If they did I wouldn't leave River there. Please drop me a few lines, I am still crying and I think I owe this to River to at least question their actions...I can't even look over the shed which is cross the road from my home-impossible to avoid and couldn't even tell the kids what happened... Thank you for all your help, Alev From: ter...@tazzys.org ter...@tazzys.org To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:22 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv BTW...would like to add this nasty tumor grew so fast within one month before Taz passed. So we were pressed for time and had to do whatever it would take. TAZZY'S ANIMAL TRANSPORTS/SIAMESE COLLIE RESCUE Sultan, WA. 98294 Terrie Mohr-Forker http://tazzys.org/ Non-Profit national rescue Dedicated to the welfare of animals. Copyright © 1999-2012 tazzys.org. All rights reserved. Original Message Subject: [Felvtalk] Nitnoy and felv From: dlg...@windstream.net Date: Mon, October 15, 2012 3:07 pm To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org My Nitnoy crossed over today at 12:45. She had been with me since 2008, survived a raccoon biting of her tail and being FELV +. There was nothing to idicate whaat was going on. During the holidays, she was not doing well so took her to ER. They did x-rays and complete bloodwork. I had told them she was FELV+ but they did not seem upset that she was just 1 point low on red and white cells. After the holiday, I took her to my vet as she was not improving, had not passed urine or stool. First thing he
Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
They may call themselves a shelter but killing the animals dragged them down to a level of a pound I would call them a death camp if you ask me... This shelter/pound I brought River is a charity organization I believe and works with donations. Alev From: Beth create_me_...@yahoo.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:26 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat According to her email it wasn't a pound, it was a so-called no-kill shelter. Pounds are usually owned by the local municipality. Don't Litter, Fix Your Critter! www.Furkids.org From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Cc: Alev Durmus alev_dur...@yahoo.com Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:19 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat What pound was this? That's one of the only good things about the pounds around here is that they don't test for FIV/Felv, so then they don't kill for it. Of course, I think they should test, and still not kill for it. These are the open-admission No Kill (saving 90%+) shelters in the U.S.: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ Since they made you wait for an opening, they are not open-admission by that list compiler's standards. There are many so-called no-kill (note the lowercase letters) ``shelters'' that are not open-admission, and many say they are no-kill even if they do kill, presumably to get donations. The only way you can absolutely tell if a pound is a No Kill shelter is to somehow get their intake/transfer/kill stats---sometimes via FOIA (Freedom of Information Act). If you're lucky, they post them on their website. Most pounds in this country are just killing machines, unfortunately. See the bottom of my messages for how to change this. Fortunately, now that people know it can be done, they are demanding their pounds become No Kill shelters. All it will take is time. Hopefully, in my lifetime. ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
Hi Christiane, Thank you so much...I am so sorry to find out about all these a little too late...Yes, they show kittens, young cats, but very few seniors on their website for adoption...They are a kill shelter and people do not know this. People are happily donating money thinking they are helping the animals, but they are helping them to be killed too. What can I do to change this? I want to send them an email, what should I say? I want to say the right things and not sound like a crazy woman... Thank you so much for your kind words, maybe River will be the reason that this shelter does something about their policy. You (and the animals in that area) are very lucky. Take care, Alev From: Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 12:49 PM Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it means is they will not kill adoptable animals. Unfortunately, its up to the individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”. All too often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a healthy easily adoptable animals. These kinds of facilities never ever publish their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they will kill. True no kills (as we think it means as defined by Nathan Winograd) are tough to find. I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans (ARNO) the handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain. They never put down for fiv or felv! The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter why they wouldn’t have alerted you to the cat’s test results given you some time demonstrates an attitude that is unfortunately all too common. I’m so sorry this happened to you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t had in a very long time. From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev Durmus Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat
Thank you Kathryn, I signed the Houston petition already...I hope you guys get enough people on time. I checked the list, it was not in it before. I will check the new one too. I am thinking to send them an email about what I think of them and send a FB messages to people around town to warn that this shelter is not no-kill I don't know what else I can do? Thank you so much to you all for all you support and info, really, sharing this with you made me cry more but better than holding in... Alev From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 1:07 PM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat Yes, and some have even gone so far as to define ``adoptable'' as those for which they have cages! Outta space, outta luck. As Christine probably knows, there are over 200 cities/towns that are now No Kill. As for No Kill places being hard to find, at least someone is looking for them. In fact, I just realized that my link to the No Kill communities list is outdated and should be replaced with this, which is the above someone's blog: Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ (see the right sidebar) On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 8:49 AM, Christiane Biagi ti...@mindspring.com wrote: The caveat to the “no kill” (as defined in the Asilomar Accords) is that all it means is they will not kill adoptable animals. Unfortunately, its up to the individual shelter/rescue to define what they consider “adoptable”. All too often, facilities that advertise themselves as “no kill” really mean that they will kill all ill, senior, problem behavior, etc. animals but never kill a healthy easily adoptable animals. These kinds of facilities never ever publish their euthanasia matrix” which is where they define their policy on who they will kill. True no kills (as we think it means as defined by Nathan Winograd) are tough to find. I volunteer for one such shelter in New Orleans (ARNO) the handful of animals they’ve put down have been terminally ill animals who were either comatose or in intractable pain. They never put down for fiv or felv! The shelter you cited clearly is a kill shelter why they wouldn’t have alerted you to the cat’s test results given you some time demonstrates an attitude that is unfortunately all too common. I’m so sorry this happened to you but please know that River had love from you—something she likely hadn’t had in a very long time. From:Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Alev Durmus Sent: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 11:15 AM To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Subject: [Felvtalk] No-kill animal shelter killing FeLV+ cat ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org -- Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal! If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their life. Contact your local pound for information. If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to free up cage space. Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/ Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/ Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/ More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902 Local feral cat crisis? See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537 ___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___ Felvtalk mailing list Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
