Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[Raymond Horton]

I have been carefully editing in 2012. As long as I don't click on the
expression tool, it doesn't crash. I just make a list of the expression
work that will need to be done in 2014.

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 25, 2016 5:32 PM, <cr...@parmerlee.com> wrote:

> Agh !!!
>
> Well, I guess I can give up my dream of composing the perfect symphony for
> 273 bagpipes with 15,000 measures, and 250 meter changes.
>
> And I had the first 1500 measures done already.  It was an Ab.
>
> - Original Message ----- Subject: Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5
> speed test, now a request for help
> From: "Raymond Horton" <horton.raym...@gmail.com>
> Date: 7/25/16 5:18 pm
> To: finale@shsu.edu
>
> No, in both 2012 and 2014 the export spun forever. Thanks
>
>  Raymond Horton
>  Composer, Arranger
>  Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
>  Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
>
>
>  On Jul 25, 2016 4:36 PM, <cr...@parmerlee.com> wrote:
>
>  > Raymond,
>  >
>  > Just curious if you were able to do the XML export/import. On really
>  > large scores, the 32,000 Frame ID limit will be a barrier, even if the
> XML
>  > thing can clean it up.
>  > ___
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[Raymond Horton]

Lol!

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[craig]

Agh !!!
 
Well, I guess I can give up my dream of composing the perfect symphony for 273 
bagpipes with 15,000 measures, and 250 meter changes.
 
And I had the first 1500 measures done already.  It was an Ab.
 
- Original Message - Subject: Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed 
test, now a request for help
From: "Raymond Horton" <horton.raym...@gmail.com>
Date: 7/25/16 5:18 pm
To: finale@shsu.edu

No, in both 2012 and 2014 the export spun forever. Thanks
 
 Raymond Horton
 Composer, Arranger
 Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
 Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
 
 
 On Jul 25, 2016 4:36 PM, <cr...@parmerlee.com> wrote:
 
 > Raymond,
 >
 > Just curious if you were able to do the XML export/import. On really
 > large scores, the 32,000 Frame ID limit will be a barrier, even if the XML
 > thing can clean it up.
 > ___
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 > Finale@shsu.edu
 > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
 >
 > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
 > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
 >
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[Raymond Horton]

No, in both 2012 and 2014 the export spun forever. Thanks

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 25, 2016 4:36 PM,  wrote:

> Raymond,
>
> Just curious if you were able to do the XML export/import.  On really
> large scores, the 32,000 Frame ID limit will be a barrier, even if the XML
> thing can clean it up.
> ___
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> Finale@shsu.edu
> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>
> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[craig]

Raymond,
 
Just curious if you were able to do the XML export/import.  On really large 
scores, the 32,000 Frame ID limit will be a barrier, even if the XML thing can 
clean it up.
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[craig]

You would think they might be able to manage to store that frame ID as a 32-bit 
integer, allowing 2 billion frames.
 
- Original Message - Subject: Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed 
test
From: "Robert Patterson" <rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
Date: 7/24/16 9:02 am
To: "finale" <finale@shsu.edu>

I don't think it was b.s. I think changing is quite risky and difficult,
 and Alfred and Hal Leonard never hit the limit with pop chart lead sheets
 so it isn't a priority.
 
 On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 2:43 AM, David H. Bailey <
 dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com> wrote:
 
 > On 7/23/2016 10:50 PM, Robert Patterson wrote:
 > > This is Finale internals now. Sorry to bore you with techy stuff, but
 > > Finale is at heart a piece of software with internals. Despite
 > appearances,
 > > it's not magic.
 > >
 > > Each frame (which is a single layer on a single bar of a single staff)
 > has
 > > an ID. Once the ID is assigned it never changes. So if if you delete one
 > > and add another you'll leave a gap in the numbers. The ID is a 16-bit
 > > value. No one, least of all anyone at MM I would guess, thinks a 16-bit
 > > value makes any sense for a program in 2016. But this is a design
 > decision
 > > that goes all the way back to the 1980s when it did make sense, and it is
 > > really, really hard to change.
 > >
 >
 > Interesting that such a dinosaur of a counting mechanism should still
 > exist -- one of the reasons given for there being no Finale2013 was that
 > they were rewriting the code in order to modernize it. Was that just a
 > bunch of b.s. to mask their superstitious avoidance of the number 13?
 >
 >
 >
 > --
 > David H. Bailey
 > dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com
 > http://www.davidbaileymusicstudio.com
 > ___
 > Finale mailing list
 > Finale@shsu.edu
 > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
 >
 > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
 > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
 >
 ___
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Robert Patterson]

I don't think it was b.s. I think changing is quite risky and difficult,
and Alfred and Hal Leonard never hit the limit with pop chart lead sheets
so it isn't a priority.

On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 2:43 AM, David H. Bailey <
dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com> wrote:

> On 7/23/2016 10:50 PM, Robert Patterson wrote:
> > This is Finale internals now. Sorry to bore you with techy stuff, but
> > Finale is at heart a piece of software with internals. Despite
> appearances,
> > it's not magic.
> >
> > Each frame (which is a single layer on a single bar of a single staff)
> has
> > an ID. Once the ID is assigned it never changes. So if if you delete one
> > and add another you'll leave a gap in the numbers. The ID is a 16-bit
> > value. No one, least of all anyone at MM I would guess, thinks a 16-bit
> > value makes any sense for a program in 2016. But this is a design
> decision
> > that goes all the way back to the 1980s when it did make sense, and it is
> > really, really hard to change.
> >
>
> Interesting that such a dinosaur of a counting mechanism should still
> exist -- one of the reasons given for there being no Finale2013 was that
> they were rewriting the code in order to modernize it.  Was that just a
> bunch of b.s. to mask their superstitious avoidance of the number 13?
>
>
>
> --
> David H. Bailey
> dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com
> http://www.davidbaileymusicstudio.com
> ___
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> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>
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> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[Raymond Horton]

Yes, thanks. I got in the habit of running a data check quite regularly.

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 24, 2016 3:35 AM, "David H. Bailey"  wrote:

> On 7/23/2016 6:55 PM, Raymond Horton wrote:
> > Well, exporting back to 2012 has not helped me a bit. Now this file
> crashes
> > everytime I click on anything. I'd appreciate any advice anyone has.
> Thanks
> >
>
>
> Have you done a data check?  That's the only thing I can think of.
>
>
> --
> David H. Bailey
> dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com
> http://www.davidbaileymusicstudio.com
> ___
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[David H. Bailey]

On 7/23/2016 10:50 PM, Robert Patterson wrote:
> This is Finale internals now. Sorry to bore you with techy stuff, but
> Finale is at heart a piece of software with internals. Despite appearances,
> it's not magic.
>
> Each frame (which is a single layer on a single bar of a single staff) has
> an ID. Once the ID is assigned it never changes. So if if you delete one
> and add another you'll leave a gap in the numbers. The ID is a 16-bit
> value. No one, least of all anyone at MM I would guess, thinks a 16-bit
> value makes any sense for a program in 2016. But this is a design decision
> that goes all the way back to the 1980s when it did make sense, and it is
> really, really hard to change.
>

Interesting that such a dinosaur of a counting mechanism should still 
exist -- one of the reasons given for there being no Finale2013 was that 
they were rewriting the code in order to modernize it.  Was that just a 
bunch of b.s. to mask their superstitious avoidance of the number 13?



-- 
David H. Bailey
dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com
http://www.davidbaileymusicstudio.com
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[David H. Bailey]

On 7/23/2016 8:32 PM, Robert Patterson wrote:
> Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If you've
> done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767. Finale
> may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who knows how
> reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience with this
> is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
>
> At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to reset your
> numbers to get rid of gaps.
>

Would running "Data Check" help in that situation?  I'm not sure what 
all that does (Document menu, Data Check, File Maintenance) but unless 
MakeMusic have totally messed it up running it shouldn't make anything 
worse and it might resolve that issue.


-- 
David H. Bailey
dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com
http://www.davidbaileymusicstudio.com
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[David H. Bailey]

On 7/23/2016 6:55 PM, Raymond Horton wrote:
> Well, exporting back to 2012 has not helped me a bit. Now this file crashes
> everytime I click on anything. I'd appreciate any advice anyone has. Thanks
>


Have you done a data check?  That's the only thing I can think of.


-- 
David H. Bailey
dhbai...@davidbaileymusicstudio.com
http://www.davidbaileymusicstudio.com
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

It's worth a try. Thanks

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 24, 2016 2:03 AM, <cr...@parmerlee.com> wrote:

> I presume that if you save as XML and then re-import the XML into a new
> file, that will assign new IDs.  But it may have unacceptable consequences.
>
> - Original Message ----- Subject: Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5
> speed test
> From: "Robert Patterson" <rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
> Date: 7/23/16 10:50 pm
> To: "finale" <finale@shsu.edu>
>
> This is Finale internals now. Sorry to bore you with techy stuff, but
>  Finale is at heart a piece of software with internals. Despite
> appearances,
>  it's not magic.
>
>  Each frame (which is a single layer on a single bar of a single staff) has
>  an ID. Once the ID is assigned it never changes. So if if you delete one
>  and add another you'll leave a gap in the numbers. The ID is a 16-bit
>  value. No one, least of all anyone at MM I would guess, thinks a 16-bit
>  value makes any sense for a program in 2016. But this is a design decision
>  that goes all the way back to the 1980s when it did make sense, and it is
>  really, really hard to change.
>
>
>  On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 9:16 PM, Raymond Horton <horton.raym...@gmail.com
> >
>  wrote:
>
>  > IDs = ?
>  >
>  > Raymond Horton
>  > Composer, Arranger
>  > Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
>  > Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
>  >
>  >
>  > On Jul 23, 2016 9:30 PM, "Robert Patterson" <
> rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
>  > wrote:
>  >
>  > > BTW: in theory, your id's should be able to range as high as 65535,
> but
>  > > once you go past 32767 the likelihood of crash-causing bug goes up. I
> can
>  > > diagnose how high your id's have gone if you want to send me a file
>  > > offline.
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Robert Patterson <
>  > > rob...@robertgpatterson.com> wrote:
>  > >
>  > > > I just ran some tests, and as I feared, if you delete a frame (by
> clear
>  > > > layer or a measure), you don't get that frame number back. So you
> could
>  > > > have exceeded the 32767 id value even though your actual number of
>  > > > assignments is smaller. I don't see an easy way to recover the
> missing
>  > id
>  > > > values either. (File Maintenance doesn't appear to do it.)
>  > > >
>  > > >
>  > > >
>  > > > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:00 PM, Raymond Horton <
>  > > horton.raym...@gmail.com>
>  > > > wrote:
>  > > >
>  > > >> Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604
>  > > >>
>  > > >> Raymond Horton
>  > > >> Composer, Arranger
>  > > >> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
>  > > >> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
>  > > >>
>  > > >>
>  > > >> On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson" <
>  > > rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
>  > > >> wrote:
>  > > >>
>  > > >> > Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is.
> If
>  > > >> you've
>  > > >> > done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded
> 32767.
>  > > >> Finale
>  > > >> > may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who
>  > knows
>  > > >> how
>  > > >> > reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience
>  > with
>  > > >> this
>  > > >> > is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
>  > > >> >
>  > > >> > At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to
>  > reset
>  > > >> your
>  > > >> > numbers to get rid of gaps.
>  > > >> >
>  > > >> >
>  > > >> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas <j...@thomastudios.com
> >
>  > > >> wrote:
>  > > >> >
>  > > >> > > Your message got me thinking Robert. I haven't looked at the
>  > count
>  > > >> is a
>  > > >> > > long time. I did that just now to the largest act and it shows
> I
&g

Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[craig]

I presume that if you save as XML and then re-import the XML into a new file, 
that will assign new IDs.  But it may have unacceptable consequences.
 
- Original Message - Subject: Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed 
test
From: "Robert Patterson" <rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
Date: 7/23/16 10:50 pm
To: "finale" <finale@shsu.edu>

This is Finale internals now. Sorry to bore you with techy stuff, but
 Finale is at heart a piece of software with internals. Despite appearances,
 it's not magic.
 
 Each frame (which is a single layer on a single bar of a single staff) has
 an ID. Once the ID is assigned it never changes. So if if you delete one
 and add another you'll leave a gap in the numbers. The ID is a 16-bit
 value. No one, least of all anyone at MM I would guess, thinks a 16-bit
 value makes any sense for a program in 2016. But this is a design decision
 that goes all the way back to the 1980s when it did make sense, and it is
 really, really hard to change.
 
 
 On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 9:16 PM, Raymond Horton <horton.raym...@gmail.com>
 wrote:
 
 > IDs = ?
 >
 > Raymond Horton
 > Composer, Arranger
 > Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
 > Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
 >
 >
 > On Jul 23, 2016 9:30 PM, "Robert Patterson" <rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
 > wrote:
 >
 > > BTW: in theory, your id's should be able to range as high as 65535, but
 > > once you go past 32767 the likelihood of crash-causing bug goes up. I can
 > > diagnose how high your id's have gone if you want to send me a file
 > > offline.
 > >
 > >
 > >
 > > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Robert Patterson <
 > > rob...@robertgpatterson.com> wrote:
 > >
 > > > I just ran some tests, and as I feared, if you delete a frame (by clear
 > > > layer or a measure), you don't get that frame number back. So you could
 > > > have exceeded the 32767 id value even though your actual number of
 > > > assignments is smaller. I don't see an easy way to recover the missing
 > id
 > > > values either. (File Maintenance doesn't appear to do it.)
 > > >
 > > >
 > > >
 > > > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:00 PM, Raymond Horton <
 > > horton.raym...@gmail.com>
 > > > wrote:
 > > >
 > > >> Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604
 > > >>
 > > >> Raymond Horton
 > > >> Composer, Arranger
 > > >> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
 > > >> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
 > > >>
 > > >>
 > > >> On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson" <
 > > rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
 > > >> wrote:
 > > >>
 > > >> > Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If
 > > >> you've
 > > >> > done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767.
 > > >> Finale
 > > >> > may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who
 > knows
 > > >> how
 > > >> > reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience
 > with
 > > >> this
 > > >> > is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
 > > >> >
 > > >> > At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to
 > reset
 > > >> your
 > > >> > numbers to get rid of gaps.
 > > >> >
 > > >> >
 > > >> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas <j...@thomastudios.com>
 > > >> wrote:
 > > >> >
 > > >> > > Your message got me thinking Robert. I haven't looked at the
 > count
 > > >> is a
 > > >> > > long time. I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I
 > > have
 > > >> > only
 > > >> > > 17471 active frames. So I am well under that stated limit.
 > > >> > >
 > > >> > > And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files. Too
 > much
 > > >> work
 > > >> > > on the back end with parts.
 > > >> > >
 > > >> > > Life goes on
 > > >> > >
 > > >> > >
 > > >> > > ***
 > > >> > > J D Thomas
 > > >> > > ThomaStudios
 > > >> > >
 > > >> > >
 > > >> > > &

Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Robert Patterson]

This is Finale internals now. Sorry to bore you with techy stuff, but
Finale is at heart a piece of software with internals. Despite appearances,
it's not magic.

Each frame (which is a single layer on a single bar of a single staff) has
an ID. Once the ID is assigned it never changes. So if if you delete one
and add another you'll leave a gap in the numbers. The ID is a 16-bit
value. No one, least of all anyone at MM I would guess, thinks a 16-bit
value makes any sense for a program in 2016. But this is a design decision
that goes all the way back to the 1980s when it did make sense, and it is
really, really hard to change.


On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 9:16 PM, Raymond Horton 
wrote:

> IDs = ?
>
> Raymond Horton
> Composer, Arranger
> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
>
>
> On Jul 23, 2016 9:30 PM, "Robert Patterson" 
> wrote:
>
> > BTW: in theory, your id's should be able to range as high as 65535, but
> > once you go past 32767 the likelihood of crash-causing bug goes up. I can
> > diagnose how high your id's have gone if you want to send me a file
> > offline.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Robert Patterson <
> > rob...@robertgpatterson.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I just ran some tests, and as I feared, if you delete a frame (by clear
> > > layer or a measure), you don't get that frame number back. So you could
> > > have exceeded the 32767 id value even though your actual number of
> > > assignments is smaller. I don't see an easy way to recover the missing
> id
> > > values either. (File Maintenance doesn't appear to do it.)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:00 PM, Raymond Horton <
> > horton.raym...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604
> > >>
> > >> Raymond Horton
> > >> Composer, Arranger
> > >> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> > >> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson" <
> > rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
> > >> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If
> > >> you've
> > >> > done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767.
> > >> Finale
> > >> > may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who
> knows
> > >> how
> > >> > reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience
> with
> > >> this
> > >> > is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
> > >> >
> > >> > At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to
> reset
> > >> your
> > >> > numbers to get rid of gaps.
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas 
> > >> wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > > Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the
> count
> > >> is a
> > >> > > long time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I
> > have
> > >> > only
> > >> > > 17471 active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too
> much
> > >> work
> > >> > > on the back end with parts.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Life goes on…
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > ***
> > >> > > J D Thomas
> > >> > > ThomaStudios
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > > On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson
> > >> > >  wrote:
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if
> > >> there
> > >> > > > aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For
> any
> > >> work
> > >> > > with
> > >> > > > 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before
> splitting
> > >> > into a
> > >> > > > new file.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > ___
> > >> > > Finale mailing list
> > >> > > Finale@shsu.edu
> > >> > > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> > >> > >
> > >> > > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > >> > > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> > >> > >
> > >> > ___
> > >> > Finale mailing list
> > >> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > >> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> > >> >
> > >> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > >> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> > >> ___
> > >> Finale mailing list
> > >> Finale@shsu.edu
> > >> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> > >>
> > >> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > >> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > ___
> > Finale mailing list
> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >
> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> 

Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

IDs = ?

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 23, 2016 9:30 PM, "Robert Patterson" 
wrote:

> BTW: in theory, your id's should be able to range as high as 65535, but
> once you go past 32767 the likelihood of crash-causing bug goes up. I can
> diagnose how high your id's have gone if you want to send me a file
> offline.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Robert Patterson <
> rob...@robertgpatterson.com> wrote:
>
> > I just ran some tests, and as I feared, if you delete a frame (by clear
> > layer or a measure), you don't get that frame number back. So you could
> > have exceeded the 32767 id value even though your actual number of
> > assignments is smaller. I don't see an easy way to recover the missing id
> > values either. (File Maintenance doesn't appear to do it.)
> >
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:00 PM, Raymond Horton <
> horton.raym...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604
> >>
> >> Raymond Horton
> >> Composer, Arranger
> >> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> >> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
> >>
> >>
> >> On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson" <
> rob...@robertgpatterson.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If
> >> you've
> >> > done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767.
> >> Finale
> >> > may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who knows
> >> how
> >> > reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience with
> >> this
> >> > is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
> >> >
> >> > At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to reset
> >> your
> >> > numbers to get rid of gaps.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas 
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the count
> >> is a
> >> > > long time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I
> have
> >> > only
> >> > > 17471 active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.
> >> > >
> >> > > And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too much
> >> work
> >> > > on the back end with parts.
> >> > >
> >> > > Life goes on…
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > ***
> >> > > J D Thomas
> >> > > ThomaStudios
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > > On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson
> >> > >  wrote:
> >> > > >
> >> > > > You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if
> >> there
> >> > > > aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any
> >> work
> >> > > with
> >> > > > 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting
> >> > into a
> >> > > > new file.
> >> > >
> >> > > ___
> >> > > Finale mailing list
> >> > > Finale@shsu.edu
> >> > > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >> > >
> >> > > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> >> > > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >> > >
> >> > ___
> >> > Finale mailing list
> >> > Finale@shsu.edu
> >> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >> >
> >> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> >> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >> ___
> >> Finale mailing list
> >> Finale@shsu.edu
> >> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >>
> >> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> >> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >>
> >
> >
> ___
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>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

Too bad. Thanks for your help. I actually was able to open the file in 2012
and work for 30 or 40 minutes before it crashed this time. Progress?

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 23, 2016 9:18 PM, "Robert Patterson" 
wrote:

> I just ran some tests, and as I feared, if you delete a frame (by clear
> layer or a measure), you don't get that frame number back. So you could
> have exceeded the 32767 id value even though your actual number of
> assignments is smaller. I don't see an easy way to recover the missing id
> values either. (File Maintenance doesn't appear to do it.)
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:00 PM, Raymond Horton 
> wrote:
>
> > Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604
> >
> > Raymond Horton
> > Composer, Arranger
> > Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> > Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
> >
> >
> > On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson"  >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If
> > you've
> > > done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767.
> > Finale
> > > may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who knows
> how
> > > reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience with
> > this
> > > is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
> > >
> > > At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to reset
> > your
> > > numbers to get rid of gaps.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas 
> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the count
> is
> > a
> > > > long time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I
> have
> > > only
> > > > 17471 active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.
> > > >
> > > > And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too much
> > work
> > > > on the back end with parts.
> > > >
> > > > Life goes on…
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ***
> > > > J D Thomas
> > > > ThomaStudios
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson
> > > >  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if
> there
> > > > > aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any
> > work
> > > > with
> > > > > 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting
> > > into a
> > > > > new file.
> > > >
> > > > ___
> > > > Finale mailing list
> > > > Finale@shsu.edu
> > > > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> > > >
> > > > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > > > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> > > >
> > > ___
> > > Finale mailing list
> > > Finale@shsu.edu
> > > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> > ___
> > Finale mailing list
> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >
> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >
> ___
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>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Robert Patterson]

BTW: in theory, your id's should be able to range as high as 65535, but
once you go past 32767 the likelihood of crash-causing bug goes up. I can
diagnose how high your id's have gone if you want to send me a file offline.



On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Robert Patterson <
rob...@robertgpatterson.com> wrote:

> I just ran some tests, and as I feared, if you delete a frame (by clear
> layer or a measure), you don't get that frame number back. So you could
> have exceeded the 32767 id value even though your actual number of
> assignments is smaller. I don't see an easy way to recover the missing id
> values either. (File Maintenance doesn't appear to do it.)
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:00 PM, Raymond Horton 
> wrote:
>
>> Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604
>>
>> Raymond Horton
>> Composer, Arranger
>> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
>> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
>>
>>
>> On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson" 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If
>> you've
>> > done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767.
>> Finale
>> > may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who knows
>> how
>> > reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience with
>> this
>> > is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
>> >
>> > At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to reset
>> your
>> > numbers to get rid of gaps.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > > Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the count
>> is a
>> > > long time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I have
>> > only
>> > > 17471 active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.
>> > >
>> > > And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too much
>> work
>> > > on the back end with parts.
>> > >
>> > > Life goes on…
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > ***
>> > > J D Thomas
>> > > ThomaStudios
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > > On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson
>> > >  wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if
>> there
>> > > > aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any
>> work
>> > > with
>> > > > 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting
>> > into a
>> > > > new file.
>> > >
>> > > ___
>> > > Finale mailing list
>> > > Finale@shsu.edu
>> > > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>> > >
>> > > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
>> > > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
>> > >
>> > ___
>> > Finale mailing list
>> > Finale@shsu.edu
>> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>> >
>> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
>> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
>> ___
>> Finale mailing list
>> Finale@shsu.edu
>> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>>
>> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
>> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
>>
>
>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Robert Patterson]

I just ran some tests, and as I feared, if you delete a frame (by clear
layer or a measure), you don't get that frame number back. So you could
have exceeded the 32767 id value even though your actual number of
assignments is smaller. I don't see an easy way to recover the missing id
values either. (File Maintenance doesn't appear to do it.)



On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 8:00 PM, Raymond Horton 
wrote:

> Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604
>
> Raymond Horton
> Composer, Arranger
> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
>
>
> On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson" 
> wrote:
>
> > Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If
> you've
> > done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767.
> Finale
> > may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who knows how
> > reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience with
> this
> > is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
> >
> > At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to reset
> your
> > numbers to get rid of gaps.
> >
> >
> > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas  wrote:
> >
> > > Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the count is
> a
> > > long time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I have
> > only
> > > 17471 active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.
> > >
> > > And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too much
> work
> > > on the back end with parts.
> > >
> > > Life goes on…
> > >
> > >
> > > ***
> > > J D Thomas
> > > ThomaStudios
> > >
> > >
> > > > On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson
> > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if there
> > > > aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any
> work
> > > with
> > > > 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting
> > into a
> > > > new file.
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Finale mailing list
> > > Finale@shsu.edu
> > > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> > >
> > ___
> > Finale mailing list
> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >
> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> ___
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>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

Frames 26160 , frame assignments 29604

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 23, 2016 8:32 PM, "Robert Patterson" 
wrote:

> Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If you've
> done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767. Finale
> may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who knows how
> reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience with this
> is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)
>
> At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to reset your
> numbers to get rid of gaps.
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas  wrote:
>
> > Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the count is a
> > long time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I have
> only
> > 17471 active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.
> >
> > And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too much work
> > on the back end with parts.
> >
> > Life goes on…
> >
> >
> > ***
> > J D Thomas
> > ThomaStudios
> >
> >
> > > On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if there
> > > aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any work
> > with
> > > 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting
> into a
> > > new file.
> >
> > ___
> > Finale mailing list
> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >
> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >
> ___
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>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Robert Patterson]

Right, but it doesn't tell you what the largest frame number is. If you've
done a lot of editing your frame numbers could have exceeded 32767. Finale
may have a mechanism for reusing deleted frame numbers, but who knows how
reliable it is? Someone who has a tremendous amount of experience with this
is Jef Chippewa. (Sometimes he monitors this list.)

At any rate, it would be worth finding out if there is a way to reset your
numbers to get rid of gaps.


On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 6:55 PM, J D Thomas  wrote:

> Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the count is a
> long time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I have only
> 17471 active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.
>
> And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too much work
> on the back end with parts.
>
> Life goes on…
>
>
> ***
> J D Thomas
> ThomaStudios
>
>
> > On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson
>  wrote:
> >
> > You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if there
> > aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any work
> with
> > 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting into a
> > new file.
>
> ___
> Finale mailing list
> Finale@shsu.edu
> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>
> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[J D Thomas]

Your message got me thinking Robert.  I haven’t looked at the count is a long 
time.  I did that just now to the largest act and it shows I have only 17471 
active frames.  So I am well under that stated limit.

And, like Raymond, I detest splitting into separate files.  Too much work on 
the back end with parts.

Life goes on…


***
J D Thomas
ThomaStudios


> On Jul 23, 2016, at 4:14 PM, Robert Patterson  
> wrote:
> 
> You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if there
> aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any work with
> 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting into a
> new file.

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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

Very useful information, Robert. Thank you. I am away from home now, but
I'll check that number when I get home tonight.

After working with a musical that I wrote back in 1999 that had different
files for every song, I swore that the next project like this I would keep
in one file no matter what.

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 23, 2016 7:15 PM, "Robert Patterson" 
wrote:

> You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if there
> aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any work with
> 10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting into a
> new file.
>
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 4:47 PM, J D Thomas  wrote:
>
> > Hi Raymond,
> >
> > I have been having very similar issues with a two-act opera I’ve been
> > working on.  Each act is about 1500 measures, full orchestra and up to 18
> > characters in vocal lines with lyrics.  Everything you’re experiencing I
> > have been dealing with for the past several months:
> > saving file takes up to 18-20 seconds.
> > time signature changes takes about 90 seconds.
> > instrument changes take over a minute.
> > JW Navigation plugin refuses to work at all on these files, but it works
> > fine on other files.
> > Lyric editing can be most frustrating.  I have each character with its
> own
> > separate verse for overall organization, and sometimes, when selecting a
> > verse, I get the spinning beachball for over a minute.  But it’s quite
> > random.
> > File size more than doubled when converting from 2012.
> >
> > This is all in Finale Mac 2014.  2014.5 is worse; completely unusable.
> > And, to be honest, things weren’t much better back in 2012.  I abandoned
> > that version since it’s quite buggy under my current OS, Yosemite
> 10.10.5.
> >
> > I have discussed these issues with MM, and they confirm Finale doesn’t
> > like large files!  No shit Sherlock!!
> >
> > I know this doesn’t help your situation, but you’re not alone here.
> >
> > ***
> > J D Thomas
> > ThomaStudios
> >
> >
> > > On Jul 23, 2016, at 2:20 PM, Raymond Horton 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > One more one more thing. Trudging along in 2014 now , I have been
> > reminded
> > > that every time signature change takes a very long time, about a minute
> > or
> > > so. I hope I can move this file back to 2012 before I die of boredom or
> > old
> > > age or both.
> > >
> > > Raymond Horton
> > > Composer, Arranger
> > > Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> > > Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
> > >
> > >
> > > On Jul 23, 2016 3:25 PM, "Raymond Horton" 
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> I promised this several weeks ago but put it off. Unfortunately,
> today I
> > >> was forced to go back and forth between the two versions because my
> file
> > >> kept crashing in 2012.
> > >> (Windows 10 , three year old computer that should be fast enough for
> > most
> > >> apps.)
> > >> The file in question is more than 2,000 measures for orchestra, 5
> voice
> > >> parts, and two pianos. Orchestra is 8 Woodwinds, five brass, timpani,
> > >> percussion, and a xylophone - Glockenspiel staff.
> > >> Saving this file in 2012 takes about 3 seconds, in 2014 22 seconds!
> > >> Exporting the 2014 file to a 2012 file takes about 11 seconds.
> > >> So, I have been working on it in 2012 for the past several months. But
> > the
> > >> good news for 2014 is that the crashing that has been happening, today
> > >> only, every time I edit a certain part of the score happens in 2012
> but
> > not
> > >> 2014. So, despite the time problems, I may need to finish this file in
> > 2014.
> > >>
> > > ___
> > > Finale mailing list
> > > Finale@shsu.edu
> > > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> > >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Finale mailing list
> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >
> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >
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>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Robert Patterson]

You guys may be hitting the frame limit of 32767, especially if there
aren't many rests or if you use a lot of multiple layers. For any work with
10's of staves, I wouldn't take it past 1000 bars before splitting into a
new file.

On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 4:47 PM, J D Thomas  wrote:

> Hi Raymond,
>
> I have been having very similar issues with a two-act opera I’ve been
> working on.  Each act is about 1500 measures, full orchestra and up to 18
> characters in vocal lines with lyrics.  Everything you’re experiencing I
> have been dealing with for the past several months:
> saving file takes up to 18-20 seconds.
> time signature changes takes about 90 seconds.
> instrument changes take over a minute.
> JW Navigation plugin refuses to work at all on these files, but it works
> fine on other files.
> Lyric editing can be most frustrating.  I have each character with its own
> separate verse for overall organization, and sometimes, when selecting a
> verse, I get the spinning beachball for over a minute.  But it’s quite
> random.
> File size more than doubled when converting from 2012.
>
> This is all in Finale Mac 2014.  2014.5 is worse; completely unusable.
> And, to be honest, things weren’t much better back in 2012.  I abandoned
> that version since it’s quite buggy under my current OS, Yosemite 10.10.5.
>
> I have discussed these issues with MM, and they confirm Finale doesn’t
> like large files!  No shit Sherlock!!
>
> I know this doesn’t help your situation, but you’re not alone here.
>
> ***
> J D Thomas
> ThomaStudios
>
>
> > On Jul 23, 2016, at 2:20 PM, Raymond Horton 
> wrote:
> >
> > One more one more thing. Trudging along in 2014 now , I have been
> reminded
> > that every time signature change takes a very long time, about a minute
> or
> > so. I hope I can move this file back to 2012 before I die of boredom or
> old
> > age or both.
> >
> > Raymond Horton
> > Composer, Arranger
> > Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> > Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
> >
> >
> > On Jul 23, 2016 3:25 PM, "Raymond Horton" 
> wrote:
> >
> >> I promised this several weeks ago but put it off. Unfortunately, today I
> >> was forced to go back and forth between the two versions because my file
> >> kept crashing in 2012.
> >> (Windows 10 , three year old computer that should be fast enough for
> most
> >> apps.)
> >> The file in question is more than 2,000 measures for orchestra, 5 voice
> >> parts, and two pianos. Orchestra is 8 Woodwinds, five brass, timpani,
> >> percussion, and a xylophone - Glockenspiel staff.
> >> Saving this file in 2012 takes about 3 seconds, in 2014 22 seconds!
> >> Exporting the 2014 file to a 2012 file takes about 11 seconds.
> >> So, I have been working on it in 2012 for the past several months. But
> the
> >> good news for 2014 is that the crashing that has been happening, today
> >> only, every time I edit a certain part of the score happens in 2012 but
> not
> >> 2014. So, despite the time problems, I may need to finish this file in
> 2014.
> >>
> > ___
> > Finale mailing list
> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >
> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >
>
>
> ___
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> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>
> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
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>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test, now a request for help

[Raymond Horton]

Well, exporting back to 2012 has not helped me a bit. Now this file crashes
everytime I click on anything. I'd appreciate any advice anyone has. Thanks

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 23, 2016 5:48 PM, "J D Thomas"  wrote:

> Hi Raymond,
>
> I have been having very similar issues with a two-act opera I’ve been
> working on.  Each act is about 1500 measures, full orchestra and up to 18
> characters in vocal lines with lyrics.  Everything you’re experiencing I
> have been dealing with for the past several months:
> saving file takes up to 18-20 seconds.
> time signature changes takes about 90 seconds.
> instrument changes take over a minute.
> JW Navigation plugin refuses to work at all on these files, but it works
> fine on other files.
> Lyric editing can be most frustrating.  I have each character with its own
> separate verse for overall organization, and sometimes, when selecting a
> verse, I get the spinning beachball for over a minute.  But it’s quite
> random.
> File size more than doubled when converting from 2012.
>
> This is all in Finale Mac 2014.  2014.5 is worse; completely unusable.
> And, to be honest, things weren’t much better back in 2012.  I abandoned
> that version since it’s quite buggy under my current OS, Yosemite 10.10.5.
>
> I have discussed these issues with MM, and they confirm Finale doesn’t
> like large files!  No shit Sherlock!!
>
> I know this doesn’t help your situation, but you’re not alone here.
>
> ***
> J D Thomas
> ThomaStudios
>
>
> > On Jul 23, 2016, at 2:20 PM, Raymond Horton 
> wrote:
> >
> > One more one more thing. Trudging along in 2014 now , I have been
> reminded
> > that every time signature change takes a very long time, about a minute
> or
> > so. I hope I can move this file back to 2012 before I die of boredom or
> old
> > age or both.
> >
> > Raymond Horton
> > Composer, Arranger
> > Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> > Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
> >
> >
> > On Jul 23, 2016 3:25 PM, "Raymond Horton" 
> wrote:
> >
> >> I promised this several weeks ago but put it off. Unfortunately, today I
> >> was forced to go back and forth between the two versions because my file
> >> kept crashing in 2012.
> >> (Windows 10 , three year old computer that should be fast enough for
> most
> >> apps.)
> >> The file in question is more than 2,000 measures for orchestra, 5 voice
> >> parts, and two pianos. Orchestra is 8 Woodwinds, five brass, timpani,
> >> percussion, and a xylophone - Glockenspiel staff.
> >> Saving this file in 2012 takes about 3 seconds, in 2014 22 seconds!
> >> Exporting the 2014 file to a 2012 file takes about 11 seconds.
> >> So, I have been working on it in 2012 for the past several months. But
> the
> >> good news for 2014 is that the crashing that has been happening, today
> >> only, every time I edit a certain part of the score happens in 2012 but
> not
> >> 2014. So, despite the time problems, I may need to finish this file in
> 2014.
> >>
> > ___
> > Finale mailing list
> > Finale@shsu.edu
> > https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> >
> > To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> > finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> >
>
>
> ___
> Finale mailing list
> Finale@shsu.edu
> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
>
> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[J D Thomas]

Hi Raymond,

I have been having very similar issues with a two-act opera I’ve been working 
on.  Each act is about 1500 measures, full orchestra and up to 18 characters in 
vocal lines with lyrics.  Everything you’re experiencing I have been dealing 
with for the past several months:
saving file takes up to 18-20 seconds.
time signature changes takes about 90 seconds.
instrument changes take over a minute.
JW Navigation plugin refuses to work at all on these files, but it works fine 
on other files.
Lyric editing can be most frustrating.  I have each character with its own 
separate verse for overall organization, and sometimes, when selecting a verse, 
I get the spinning beachball for over a minute.  But it’s quite random.
File size more than doubled when converting from 2012.

This is all in Finale Mac 2014.  2014.5 is worse; completely unusable.
And, to be honest, things weren’t much better back in 2012.  I abandoned that 
version since it’s quite buggy under my current OS, Yosemite 10.10.5.

I have discussed these issues with MM, and they confirm Finale doesn’t like 
large files!  No shit Sherlock!!

I know this doesn’t help your situation, but you’re not alone here.

***
J D Thomas
ThomaStudios


> On Jul 23, 2016, at 2:20 PM, Raymond Horton  wrote:
> 
> One more one more thing. Trudging along in 2014 now , I have been reminded
> that every time signature change takes a very long time, about a minute or
> so. I hope I can move this file back to 2012 before I die of boredom or old
> age or both.
> 
> Raymond Horton
> Composer, Arranger
> Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
> Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016
> 
> 
> On Jul 23, 2016 3:25 PM, "Raymond Horton"  wrote:
> 
>> I promised this several weeks ago but put it off. Unfortunately, today I
>> was forced to go back and forth between the two versions because my file
>> kept crashing in 2012.
>> (Windows 10 , three year old computer that should be fast enough for most
>> apps.)
>> The file in question is more than 2,000 measures for orchestra, 5 voice
>> parts, and two pianos. Orchestra is 8 Woodwinds, five brass, timpani,
>> percussion, and a xylophone - Glockenspiel staff.
>> Saving this file in 2012 takes about 3 seconds, in 2014 22 seconds!
>> Exporting the 2014 file to a 2012 file takes about 11 seconds.
>> So, I have been working on it in 2012 for the past several months. But the
>> good news for 2014 is that the crashing that has been happening, today
>> only, every time I edit a certain part of the score happens in 2012 but not
>> 2014. So, despite the time problems, I may need to finish this file in 2014.
>> 
> ___
> Finale mailing list
> Finale@shsu.edu
> https://lists.shsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/finale
> 
> To unsubscribe from finale send a message to:
> finale-unsubscr...@shsu.edu
> 


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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

One more one more thing. Trudging along in 2014 now , I have been reminded
that every time signature change takes a very long time, about a minute or
so. I hope I can move this file back to 2012 before I die of boredom or old
age or both.

Raymond Horton
Composer, Arranger
Minister of Music, Edwardsville (IN) United Methodist Church
Retired Bass Trombonist, Louisville Orchestra, 1971-2016


On Jul 23, 2016 3:25 PM, "Raymond Horton"  wrote:

> I promised this several weeks ago but put it off. Unfortunately, today I
> was forced to go back and forth between the two versions because my file
> kept crashing in 2012.
> (Windows 10 , three year old computer that should be fast enough for most
> apps.)
> The file in question is more than 2,000 measures for orchestra, 5 voice
> parts, and two pianos. Orchestra is 8 Woodwinds, five brass, timpani,
> percussion, and a xylophone - Glockenspiel staff.
> Saving this file in 2012 takes about 3 seconds, in 2014 22 seconds!
> Exporting the 2014 file to a 2012 file takes about 11 seconds.
> So, I have been working on it in 2012 for the past several months. But the
> good news for 2014 is that the crashing that has been happening, today
> only, every time I edit a certain part of the score happens in 2012 but not
> 2014. So, despite the time problems, I may need to finish this file in 2014.
>
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Re: [Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

One more thing. The file size is about twice as big and 2014.5. 3515 KB in
2012, 6560 KB in 2014.

Raymond Horton


On Jul 23, 2016 3:25 PM, "Raymond Horton"  wrote:

> I promised this several weeks ago but put it off. Unfortunately, today I
> was forced to go back and forth between the two versions because my file
> kept crashing in 2012.
> (Windows 10 , three year old computer that should be fast enough for most
> apps.)
> The file in question is more than 2,000 measures for orchestra, 5 voice
> parts, and two pianos. Orchestra is 8 Woodwinds, five brass, timpani,
> percussion, and a xylophone - Glockenspiel staff.
> Saving this file in 2012 takes about 3 seconds, in 2014 22 seconds!
> Exporting the 2014 file to a 2012 file takes about 11 seconds.
> So, I have been working on it in 2012 for the past several months. But the
> good news for 2014 is that the crashing that has been happening, today
> only, every time I edit a certain part of the score happens in 2012 but not
> 2014. So, despite the time problems, I may need to finish this file in 2014.
>
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[Finale] 2012 vs 2014.5 speed test

[Raymond Horton]

I promised this several weeks ago but put it off. Unfortunately, today I
was forced to go back and forth between the two versions because my file
kept crashing in 2012.
(Windows 10 , three year old computer that should be fast enough for most
apps.)
The file in question is more than 2,000 measures for orchestra, 5 voice
parts, and two pianos. Orchestra is 8 Woodwinds, five brass, timpani,
percussion, and a xylophone - Glockenspiel staff.
Saving this file in 2012 takes about 3 seconds, in 2014 22 seconds!
Exporting the 2014 file to a 2012 file takes about 11 seconds.
So, I have been working on it in 2012 for the past several months. But the
good news for 2014 is that the crashing that has been happening, today
only, every time I edit a certain part of the score happens in 2012 but not
2014. So, despite the time problems, I may need to finish this file in 2014.
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