Re: [Finale] New Finale

[Craig Parmerlee]

It would be great if you could download the free trial and tell us if 
any of those bugs have been fixed.




On 8/17/2016 9:35 PM, Allen Cohen wrote:
>
> I would so much like to be optimistic about the new version--especially that 
> the bugs from 2014 will be fixed! But all of this discussion makes me feel, 
> shall we say, somewhat skeptical...
>
>
> Just for fun, here is a list of bugs I am constantly encountering in 2014.5 
> for Mac (with El Capitan). Please feel free to correct me if I've missed a 
> fix--or double the fun, and add the bugs you've discovered to the list!
>
>
> -Harp parts with glissandi in both hands don't play back correctly in Aria.
> -Harmonics play back correctly in some staves but not in others.
> -Smart Shape metatools can't be changed.
> -Text blocks do not display properly in Page View, except in Column View. (Or 
> sometimes Book View.)
> -Sometimes Page View just refuses to change pages. Only switching to Scroll 
> View gets me to the proper place. This happens (and disappears) unpredictably.
> -Contrary to the User Guide, Command-Home and command-End do not work in Page 
> View.
> -At least when converting older versions to 2014, EPS graphics do not display 
> properly.
> -The Tempo tool no longer allows more than one tempo in a bar! (There are 
> some very kludgy workarounds.)
> -Playback controls do not work well; in particular, you have to hit either 
> Stop or the space bar many times to get playback to stop.
>
>
>
>
> Allen Cohen
> Professor of Music, Fairleigh Dickinson University
>
>
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>
>

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[Finale] New Finale

[Allen Cohen]

I would so much like to be optimistic about the new version--especially that 
the bugs from 2014 will be fixed! But all of this discussion makes me feel, 
shall we say, somewhat skeptical...


Just for fun, here is a list of bugs I am constantly encountering in 2014.5 for 
Mac (with El Capitan). Please feel free to correct me if I've missed a fix--or 
double the fun, and add the bugs you've discovered to the list!


-Harp parts with glissandi in both hands don't play back correctly in Aria.
-Harmonics play back correctly in some staves but not in others.
-Smart Shape metatools can't be changed.
-Text blocks do not display properly in Page View, except in Column View. (Or 
sometimes Book View.)
-Sometimes Page View just refuses to change pages. Only switching to Scroll 
View gets me to the proper place. This happens (and disappears) unpredictably.
-Contrary to the User Guide, Command-Home and command-End do not work in Page 
View.
-At least when converting older versions to 2014, EPS graphics do not display 
properly.
-The Tempo tool no longer allows more than one tempo in a bar! (There are some 
very kludgy workarounds.)
-Playback controls do not work well; in particular, you have to hit either Stop 
or the space bar many times to get playback to stop.




Allen Cohen
Professor of Music, Fairleigh Dickinson University


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[Finale] New Finale plug-ins (Preview)

[Jan Angermüller]

I have updated my homepage with online demos and some detailed 
descriptions of my upcoming Finale plug-ins including an *automated page 
layout plug-in *which will be a huge time saver for many Finale layout 
tasks.


http://elbsound.studio/finale_plugins.php

The website also contains a*comprehensive music related font list with 
more than 850 entries* and a *huge music font comparison* that I created 
with the new Finale House Style Changer plug-in.
It shows four musical examples created with 150 music fonts.
http://elbsound.studio/music_fonts2.php
http://elbsound.studio/music_fonts.php 

I hope this will be a valuable resource for you.

Any comments, suggestions or wishes for more automated tasks in Finale 
are very welcome.

I built the plug-ins with Jari Williamson's great JW Lua plug-in 
development kit. So here again a big thank you to Jari and his fantastic 
contributions to Finale. JW Lua is still in beta and so are the plug-ins 
that rely on it. I expect Q3/Q4 to be the release date. If you want to 
support the projects, you can donate to Jari's work ( 
http://finaletips.nu/index.php/component/phocadownload/category/10-plug-ins-for-mac
 
).

Best,
Jan
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[Finale] new Finale

[Lawrence David Eden]

Although I am still running OS 9.2 on my Mac with Fin 2K3, I have 
been interested in what I am hearing about the latest version of 
Finale.  For a notation program to inadvertently delete your work is 
cruel and unusual.


This is one of the many issues that drove me screaming from 
Nightengale to Finale.  Items that I had carefully entered into the 
score did not extract with the parts.  My Finale teacher who arranged 
for the Air Force Band said that the arrangers that he worked with 
would have thrown Nightengale directly into the trash and gone to an 
alternative program.  Although this sounded a little drastic at the 
time, I find myself wondering why those of you who have been bitten 
by some pretty scary bugs have not simply disposed of this version of 
Finale and gone elsewhere.  MM must be taken to task for selling an 
unstable program.


The more I read of your problems and frustrations with Finale's 
latest, the better 2K3 looks to me.  I have no problems to report. 
2K3 has been and will continue to be my faithful servant.


Larry Eden
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Re: [Finale] new Finale

[dhbailey]

Lawrence David Eden wrote:

Although I am still running OS 9.2 on my Mac with Fin 2K3, I have been 
interested in what I am hearing about the latest version of Finale.  For 
a notation program to inadvertently delete your work is cruel and unusual.


This is one of the many issues that drove me screaming from Nightengale 
to Finale.  Items that I had carefully entered into the score did not 
extract with the parts.  My Finale teacher who arranged for the Air 
Force Band said that the arrangers that he worked with would have thrown 
Nightengale directly into the trash and gone to an alternative program.  
Although this sounded a little drastic at the time, I find myself 
wondering why those of you who have been bitten by some pretty scary 
bugs have not simply disposed of this version of Finale and gone 
elsewhere.  MM must be taken to task for selling an unstable program.


The more I read of your problems and frustrations with Finale's latest, 
the better 2K3 looks to me.  I have no problems to report. 2K3 has been 
and will continue to be my faithful servant.




Hopefully all of us who have upgraded kept our installations of Fin2005 
and added a second installation for Fin2006, so we can continue to do 
real work in Fin2005 while waiting to see what happens with Fin2006.


I'm on Windows, so the let's trash some data when he's not looking bug 
hassn't bitten me, but even as I installed it I didn't have a great 
feeling of trust (especially when some things which were supposed to 
work in GPO, such as preset ambience settings selection) in it and have 
continued to do any can't have any screwups work in Finale2005.


There isn't anything else to go to -- Sibelius, while not trashing any 
already-entered data, is frustrating for some of us to work with and is 
more limiting in how things are done although it can do almost all that 
Finale can do.


Notion, the new windows version of Nightingale, which was the mac 
version of MusicPrinterPlus, is much more limited in what it can do, and 
seems to be mainly focused on playback rather than on the real needs of 
music engravers.


So we are stuck using the last known-stable version of Finale, and 
hoping against hope that the crippling bug in FinMac2006 can be resolved.


I wonder what would happen if they simply took out all the hooks to GPO 
playback and released a version where playback was like it was in 
Fin2005 but any engraving improvements are left.


Or what if they released a version without the 
manipulate-temp-files-in-memory-rather-than-on-disk supposed improvements.


But as for being able to jump to a different product, there's nothing 
other than Fin2005 that will do for many of us.


--
David H. Bailey
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [Finale] new Finale

[Morris Inouye]

On 11/3/05, dhbailey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hopefully all of us who have upgraded kept our installations of Fin2005and added a second installation for Fin2006, so we can continue to doreal work in Fin2005 while waiting to see what happens with Fin2006.

Like you, I kept my Fin2005 around on Windows. (I tried to get a refund
and return the still shrink-wrapped Fin2006, but they said I had waited
too long and the return period had expired.) I have since installed
Fin2006, but don't dare use it for any real work.
I'm on Windows, so the let's trash some data when he's not looking bug
hassn't bitten me, but even as I installed it I didn't have a greatfeeling of trust (especially when some things which were supposed towork in GPO, such as preset ambience settings selection) in it and have
continued to do any can't have any screwups work in Finale2005.
I am in the process of switching to my iBook G4 that I purchased in
August. Although Tiger is an incredible platform for everything else, I
just don't have the courage to install software that will delete entire
folders and trash data when I'm not looking.
I wonder what would happen if they simply took out all the hooks to GPOplayback and released a version where playback was like it was in
Fin2005 but any engraving improvements are left.
Finale has become severely bloated. One of the challenges of bloatware
development is keeping it from collapsing under its own weight. (I
know--I've worked on such projects [sigh]). I hope MakeMusic rethinks
its current strategy, or they will lose lots of customers. (Speaking
for myself, I won't buy any more updates until they address their
stability problems.)
Or what if they released a version without themanipulate-temp-files-in-memory-rather-than-on-disk supposed improvements.
But as for being able to jump to a different product, there's nothingother than Fin2005 that will do for many of us.
I am (still) seriously considering upgrading my Sibelius 2
(Windows) to version 4 (Mac). For the present, though, I'll stick with
FinWin2005, and use my Mac for
everything-else-but-desktop-music-publishing.-- Morris Inouye [EMAIL PROTECTED]Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity. --Hanlon's Razor
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Re: [Finale] new Finale

[A-NO-NE Music]

Lawrence David Eden / 2005/11/03 / 06:24 AM wrote:

I find myself wondering why those of you who have been bitten 
by some pretty scary bugs have not simply disposed of this version of 
Finale and gone elsewhere.

'Coz 2006 still is more productive for me, and remember I got bitten 3
times already :-)

The biggest improvement that makes me not to go back to previous version
is the Copy Item dialog by Opt+Shift+Click.  This alone made my workflow
much, much faster.  I can't think of working without it, period.

The so called nasty bug is not like you loose file by crash, like we
used to have from v1.0 up to v2.6 (ack!).  Wait.  I even remember one
file which was $$ job got totally corrupted with v3.2, and only to
realize backup also didn't open(!).  That was fatal.

When data disappears, unlike someone reported, the disappearing data is
always around the measure(s) I made action to so I notice the problem
right away.  I close the file without saving it.  No big deal.  I
haven't lost much work by the bug.  I certainly don't mind living with
it at this moment.  I am serious!

-- 

- Hiro

Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA
http://a-no-ne.com http://anonemusic.com



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Re: [Finale] new Finale

[David W. Fenton]

On 3 Nov 2005 at 7:07, dhbailey wrote:

 Or what if they released a version without the 
 manipulate-temp-files-in-memory-rather-than-on-disk supposed
 improvements.

Bugs don't work that way.

First off, there's nothing fundamentally unreliable about in-memory 
temp data. Indeed, that's really the norm (though very often in 
combination with on-disk temp files, either as scratch files or to 
allow backup recovery).

The problem is that MakeMusic made some major mistake(s) in 
implementing their changes to temp file handling. The implementation 
mistake(s) are the problem, not the feature being implemented.

Secondly, you can't just back out a change like this and replace it 
with the old way of doing things, because that process is likely to 
introduce *more* bugs than it will fix.

Third, the speed of autosave (and manual saves) is probably due to 
this new approach to temp files, so you'd be losing something truly 
useful at the same time that you're getting rid of the horrid bug.

This kind of thing is probably very difficult to diagnose and fix. 
That's why it got through the beta process without being found, 
because it's a tough one to begin with.

For perspective, let me describe the worst bug that Microsoft Access 
ever had. In an Access form, there's a method for navigating between 
records that uses what are called bookmarks, which are pointers to 
cursor locations in a recordset. Forms have two sets of bookmarks, 
one in the recordset loaded in the form, and one in an exact 
duplicate of that recordset, called the RecordsetClone. The 
RecordsetClone allows you to find out things about the real recordset 
without having an effect on the real recordset.

The method for navigation via recordset is that you do a FindFirst in 
the recordsetclone. If there's a match, it sets the bookmark to the 
new record position. Since the form's real recordset is identical, 
you can set it equal to the RecordsetClone's bookmark, which then 
moves the form's cursor location to the same place as it was in the 
RecordsetClone.

So far so good. This feature had been implemented sometime around 
Access version 1.x and 2.0, if I'm remembering correctly (i.e., in 
1993 or so), and had been relied on by all Access programmers (as 
well as by some of the wizards built into Access that write code for 
you to accomplish tasks, like finding a record).

But in August of 1998, it was announced that a bug had been found 
with bookmark navigation that could cause data to be written to the 
wrong record. The bug manifested itself in these circumstances:

1. in a form having a recordset with more than 262 records

2. that has had a record deleted from it

3. that then has an edit to a record that is after record 262 and 
after the deleted record

And the result was that changes to any of the remaining undeleted 
records *after* the deleted record got written to the record *after* 
what the form displayed.

The problem was that the recordsetclone and the form's actual 
recordset were out of synch with each other because of the deleted 
record.

The workaround was actually very simple -- after deleting a record, 
requery the form (if you don't requery you keep the same number of 
records with the deleted record display #deleted in all fields).

But the problem existed back to all versions of Access since 1993. 
For more than five years people had been using the product and nobody 
had identified this extremely serious bug.

By the time I heard about it, it had already been diagnosed and the 
workaround discovered. Microsoft issued a service release about a 
month later that fixed the problem permanently.

As it turns out, one of my applications probably was bitten by this 
bug in early 1998 (users reported remembering entering data into 
particular records, then coming back to the same record and not 
seeing it there; we never could identify the cause, though it may 
have been the bookmark bug; reports of the bookmark bug also caused 
me to discover that bookmark navigation had problems when activated 
on unsaved records because under some circumstances the data would 
*not* be saved and no error would be raised). But because the 
symptoms were so incredibly hard to diagnose (who is going to 
recognize that the data in a record actually belongs to a different 
record?), and because the scenario required for it to happen was so 
specific (though not at all uncommon).

Microsoft is a much, much larger company than MakeMusic, and Access 
has orders of magnitude more users than Finale, but it took FIVE 
YEARS for the bug to actually be discovered, even though it had the 
potential to badly corrupt the data of any application that was 
exposed to the bug (i.e., using bookmark navigation and allowing 
deletes without requery in a form with more than 262 records).

It may take MakeMusic quite a while to fix this bug. I'm not at all 
surprised that a fix did not make it into release 2006a, since that 
was surely already gold by the time