Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Based on the information we have been presented with, this is definitely a software issue (because the two reported systems are nothing like each other). However, the basic start to any troubleshooting is being able to reproduce the issue. And unfortunately, we have not been able to do so here. Nor has N4HY been able to duplicate the issue. Fortunately we have two truly intelligent people that this is happening to, and I suspect that we will find a resolution in time. We have a history of fixing subtle issues like this and the nice part is that the fix will be as easy as downloading another version of the software. Eric Wachsmann FlexRadio Systems > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > radio.biz] On Behalf Of James Courtier-Dutton > Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2006 4:51 AM > To: Jeff Anderson > Cc: Lee A Crocker; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz > Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem? > > Jeff Anderson wrote: > > Hi James, > > > > At this QTH the problem is definitely at the computer output and *not* > at > > the SDR1K itself. > > > > > So, the problem is now narrowed down a bit. > The problem is now computer hardware or software. > So, what spec machine are you using, CPU (hyperthreading, multicore > enabled y/n etc.), MEM, HD, Sound card > Which software, Flex version, OS version, patches installed etc. > > One might be able to narrow down the problem if enough people respond. > As only a few people apparently see the problem, I would suspect the > sound card. > > James > > > ___ > FlexRadio mailing list > FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz > http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz > Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex- > radio.biz/ > FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Let me add to Lee's comments with of my own observations & measurements: >Basically this signal sounds like MCW, like what you >would get if you took your side tone and played it >into your AM transmitter's microphone. You get a >modulated carrier that sounds like WWV without the >tick. [k6jca] Although the envelope appears to be AM modulation, on a spectrum analyzer the carrier is suppressed. Instead, one sees both "sidebands" (CWL *and* CWU) simultaneously. >I did find that the modulation frequency, that is the >pitch of the tone that is transmitted on the carrier >is variable with the sidetone offset. If I set the >sidetone to 400hz I get one modulated tone when I >transmit, if I set it to 1200hz I get a completely >different tone and you can clearly hear the difference >in a external RX. [k6jca] If pitch is set to 400 Hz, the frequency difference between the two tones will be 800 Hz. If pitch is set to 1200 Hz, the frequency difference between the two tones will be 2400 Hz. >This being the case I would look >for some point of cross over that is allowing the >sidetone to mix with the tone that drives the >modulator on CW. [k6jca] Or look for something that causes the I & Q samples to lose their 90 degree phase relationship... -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060525/5187e13e/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
I also have the monitor volume completely turned down, and the monitor off box ticked under the keyer screen It may be what ever sets the transmit freq offset when going between TX and RX is somehow allowing signals from each frequency to be generated and transmitted. In other words there is a CW offset that occurs when in RX to center the passband, that is eliminated when going to transmit, or vice versa, its almost like the transition between these 2 states is not absolutely stable and somehow the sound card is directed to generate both signals, so it dutifully does that. Lee __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
It is not the soundcard. Jeff and I are both using the designated soundcards that every one is using. If it was the sound card it would be a much more frequent occurence. It is unlikely the computer, there are at least 3 known instances of the problem occuring. I have 2 completely independent identical systems each with its own computer, software, soundcard, SDR-1000, cabeling, control circuits (like the X7 connection to an amplifier), linear amplifiers and antennas, all are set up independantly, and it occurs in both systems. I completely re-did one computer with a total plain vanilla setup of windows XP and it occurred. So it is not windows XP. Jeff has his occurence as he described. He uses a desktop P4 windows home, and I use a Laptop P4 and XP pro. It is not the SDR-1000 hardware since that is common to everyone. I have both the built in parallel port and the flex usb parallel adapter and it occurs on both. The system was absolutely stable up to version 1.4.16. It has been unstable with regard to this issue since. My guess is it is some transition point between software and hardware that requires a feedback loop and is updated during transmit peculiar to CW, or something that allows mixing to occur between 2 tones on a random basis. Basically this signal sounds like MCW, like what you would get if you took your side tone and played it into your AM transmitter's microphone. You get a modulated carrier that sounds like WWV without the tick. I did find that the modulation frequency, that is the pitch of the tone that is transmitted on the carrier is variable with the sidetone offset. If I set the sidetone to 400hz I get one modulated tone when I transmit, if I set it to 1200hz I get a completely different tone and you can clearly hear the difference in a external RX. This being the case I would look for some point of cross over that is allowing the sidetone to mix with the tone that drives the modulator on CW. Secondly it overdrives the transmitter to a higher output for example from 100 to 135w. This would indicate it is somehow the mixing is involved after the ALC loop or what ever is done in the software to limit the sound card output (and hence transmitter power) going to the modulator. Thirdly it has variable penetrance which basically means the modulation signal is not constant but has a variable level. The modulation seems to be constant for any given single instance of the phenom, but between phenoms, its strength varies, as if you turned a volume control (like the sidetone level) up and down between occurences. I have heard the situation correct itself on occasion during a transmission. For example if you hit an occurence and let the rig transmit sometimes there will be what sounds like garbage on the signal and then it will be normal. On a couple of occasions I have heard it go the other way. Normal transmit then MCW. This to me indicates it is something that is being updated during the course of transmission AKA a feedback loop. That's what I know at the present time Lee __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Good point, James. Yes, 1.4.4 was tested with the wireless adapter, but it's always worthwhile to retest, so I've just done the following: 1. With the wireless adapater attached and operational, I launched 1.4.4 and tried to create the problem. I cycled through 300 receive-to-transmit transitions, and the problem never occured. 2. Shut down 1.4.4 and launched 1.6.1. The problem occured after the 59th receive-to-transmit transition. 3. Disconnected my wireless adapter and rebooted. Then I launched 1.6.1: The problem occured after the 54th transition. 4. Changed 1.6.1's sampling rate from 96K to 48K (after all, 1.4.4 runs only at 48K). The problem occured after the 5th transition. (Wireless was still disconnected.) My conclusion: 1.4.4 is stable, 1.6.1 is not. - Jeff -Original Message- From: James Courtier-Dutton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2006 3:31 AM To: Jeff Anderson Cc: Lee A Crocker; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem? Jeff Anderson wrote: > Hi James, > > Regarding my hardware: I ordered the computer as well as the radio > simultaneously from Flex (who purhcased the PC from Dell), and I've added no > additional hardware (memory, etc.) to it with the exception of a 2-Wire USB > wireless adapter. From my PC's System Control Panel: > Dell Optiplex 170L > Intel Pentium 4 CPU 3.20 GHz. > 3.19 GHz, 512MB of RAM. > > The soundcard is the Delta 44. > > The computer is used *only* for the SDR1K, it really has had minimial > software added to it. OS is Windows XP Home Edition Version 2002 w/Service > Pack 2. > > I've seen this problem occur with both 1.6.0 and 1.6.1 releases (and of > course, with my own console which is based upon the 1.6.1 code), but not the > 1.4.4 release. > You might think it fairly innocuous, but the 2-Wire USB wireless adapter might be causing all your problems. Did you test the 1.4.4 release with the wireless adapter. To put it in perspective, on a laptop I have, if I use the serial port at 9600 baud, some characters are lost with the wireless enabled. So, if characters are lost on a low speed interface like 9600 baud serial port, I would expect this to have rather bad implications for low latency audio. James ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Jeff Anderson wrote: > Hi James, > > Regarding my hardware: I ordered the computer as well as the radio > simultaneously from Flex (who purhcased the PC from Dell), and I've added no > additional hardware (memory, etc.) to it with the exception of a 2-Wire USB > wireless adapter. From my PC's System Control Panel: > Dell Optiplex 170L > Intel Pentium 4 CPU 3.20 GHz. > 3.19 GHz, 512MB of RAM. > > The soundcard is the Delta 44. > > The computer is used *only* for the SDR1K, it really has had minimial > software added to it. OS is Windows XP Home Edition Version 2002 w/Service > Pack 2. > > I've seen this problem occur with both 1.6.0 and 1.6.1 releases (and of > course, with my own console which is based upon the 1.6.1 code), but not the > 1.4.4 release. > You might think it fairly innocuous, but the 2-Wire USB wireless adapter might be causing all your problems. Did you test the 1.4.4 release with the wireless adapter. To put it in perspective, on a laptop I have, if I use the serial port at 9600 baud, some characters are lost with the wireless enabled. So, if characters are lost on a low speed interface like 9600 baud serial port, I would expect this to have rather bad implications for low latency audio. James ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Hi James, The problem could be the soundcard, and if the problem occured in all modes, then I would certainly suspect it. But because this problem seems to be only in CW mode (and not SSB), I suspect the software. (Also - Lee, who has experienced the same problem, is using a Firebox for his soundcard, and I'm using the Delta 44. Two different cards, but same problem). I wouldn't necessarily give much weight to the fact that only a few people have complained about the problem. Of the entire "set" of users of the SDR1K, I wonder: how many operate CW regularly, and of those, how many pay close attention to their Transmit RF envelope with an external scope *while* sending? My guess? It's a *very* small number. In other words, others may be experiencing the same problem, but are completely unaware of it. Regarding my hardware: I ordered the computer as well as the radio simultaneously from Flex (who purhcased the PC from Dell), and I've added no additional hardware (memory, etc.) to it with the exception of a 2-Wire USB wireless adapter. From my PC's System Control Panel: Dell Optiplex 170L Intel Pentium 4 CPU 3.20 GHz. 3.19 GHz, 512MB of RAM. The soundcard is the Delta 44. The computer is used *only* for the SDR1K, it really has had minimial software added to it. OS is Windows XP Home Edition Version 2002 w/Service Pack 2. I've seen this problem occur with both 1.6.0 and 1.6.1 releases (and of course, with my own console which is based upon the 1.6.1 code), but not the 1.4.4 release. >From some experiments I made last night, the frequency of occurance of this problem might be related to buffer sizes (Audio and/or DSP) in the SDR1K Setup menu, but I need to do some additional testing before I can be sure of this. Thanks for your suggestions and help. The more people who think about this (or better yet, try to replicate it), the better will be the chances of resolving it. - Jeff, K6JCA -Original Message- From: James Courtier-Dutton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2006 1:51 AM To: Jeff Anderson Cc: Lee A Crocker; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem? Jeff Anderson wrote: > Hi James, > > At this QTH the problem is definitely at the computer output and *not* at > the SDR1K itself. > > So, the problem is now narrowed down a bit. The problem is now computer hardware or software. So, what spec machine are you using, CPU (hyperthreading, multicore enabled y/n etc.), MEM, HD, Sound card Which software, Flex version, OS version, patches installed etc. One might be able to narrow down the problem if enough people respond. As only a few people apparently see the problem, I would suspect the sound card. James ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Jeff Anderson wrote: > Hi James, > > At this QTH the problem is definitely at the computer output and *not* at > the SDR1K itself. > > So, the problem is now narrowed down a bit. The problem is now computer hardware or software. So, what spec machine are you using, CPU (hyperthreading, multicore enabled y/n etc.), MEM, HD, Sound card Which software, Flex version, OS version, patches installed etc. One might be able to narrow down the problem if enough people respond. As only a few people apparently see the problem, I would suspect the sound card. James ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Hi James, At this QTH the problem is definitely at the computer output and *not* at the SDR1K itself. I determined this by monitoring the soundcard's output with two channels of an oscilloscope while observing the RF envelope of my transmitted signal on a third channel. In CW mode, the soundcard's outputs normally have a nice 90 degree phase relationship. However, when I observed the screwy RF envelope, this 90 degree relationship was lost, and the resultant phase relationship between the two signals could be anything. The erroneous phase shift was often much greater (in degrees) than one would expect if the soundcard was one sample out-of-sync on either channel (at 96 ksps such a slip would result in a delay shift of only 10 us - I had my scope set to 2 ms per division, and so such a small delta would have been imperceptible to me). My gut feeling is that it's the software. Otherwise, I would expect to experience the same problem when running sideband. But I ran an experiment yesterday in which, while transmitting LSB, I monitored the USB side of my signal with a seperate receiver, and I never heard a change (nor saw a change on the other receiver's s-meter) in the level or quality of the USB signal. I cycled from receive to transmit at least 100 times, and all appeared fine. - Jeff, K6JCA -Original Message- From: James Courtier-Dutton [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 2:22 AM To: Jeff Anderson Cc: Lee A Crocker; FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem? Has anyone been able to narrow down the problem to the computer soundcard output, or is something going wrong inside the SDR1000 hardware. This problem could be happening in the computer software or the sound card hardware, but identifying which part is wrong would be helpful. There have been cases of some sound card hardware causing the left and right channel to be one sample out of sync. James ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Jeff Anderson wrote: > Hi Lee, > > Very interesting! > > I haven't been checking my power, so I just tried the following experiment: > > 1. Using an Autek WM-1 meter (in Peak Mode), set my SDR1K power to 10 > watts when read on this meter. > > 2. Transmit CW: observe RF envelope on an external oscilloscope and Power > on wattmeter. > > Results: > > Normal Operation: Envelope is clean, and power on wattmeter is 10 watts. > > Screwy Operation: Envelope appears to have modulation (as seen on scope), > and power on wattmeter can be anywhere from, say, 12 to 17 watts (depending > upon the apparent "depth" of the modulation on the signal). (Note: SDR1K > Fwd Power also shows a higher reading (15 watts in lieu of the normal 10 > watts). > > So - I'd say there's a good chance you and I are experiencing similar > problems. > > Another strange thing that I've noticed is that, when this problem occurs, > there is a slight change in how I perceive the Transmit CW note from my SDR1K > speakers - it almost seems as though the note has shifted position spatially. > > Weird, eh? > > - Jeff, K6JCA > > > Lee A Crocker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I have been fighting this problem for several months. > The problem started after 1.4.16. Prior to this > release the situation was rock solid. I get precisely > what you describe. Also my power output advances > significantly from a nominal 100w to 135w when I get > the modulation. The situation seems to be random and > occurs about 10-20% of the time. It will on occasion > correct itself during a transmission, or it will go > into "modulation mode" during a transmission. Before > it does that I can hear a crackle on the signal. It > sometimes has variable penetrance, meaning instead of > 135W it may only be 110 or 120 and the modulated > portion of the signal is audiably less. > > I use a P4 3.3ghz with a firebox. I have 2 identical > SDR systems including computer and firebox and it > happens on both systems. > > Also I have been told this problem has not occurred at > flex headquarters so I am glad to see it is not > peculiar to my system. > > 73 Lee W9OY > Has anyone been able to narrow down the problem to the computer soundcard output, or is something going wrong inside the SDR1000 hardware. This problem could be happening in the computer software or the sound card hardware, but identifying which part is wrong would be helpful. There have been cases of some sound card hardware causing the left and right channel to be one sample out of sync. James ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
I don't have a scope but I do have another RX and it is clearly discernable on the second RX (aka the transmitted signal). It is also clearly discernable in the monitor when it occurs. Lee __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
The situation is unrelated to RFI. It happens as low as 10W barefoot or at 1500W. It happens on all bands I have antenna for (160 through 20)and it happens on all of my antennas. It happens into a precision dummy load. I have about 20lbs of ferrite hanging off the SDR just to be sure, and I have tried several different cables. This is a software issue. It changed between 1.4.16 and all that followed. My impression is it is somehow related to a feedback loop, carried on the parallel port. I have the flex USB-parallel adapter as well as a hard wired parallel port and the phenom occurs on both types. Lee W9OY __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Eric can't replicate it either, which is what makes this problem particularly frustrating for me. One thing worth mentioning: unless you monitor your Transmit signal with an external oscilloscope, you could experience this problem and not be aware of it. (Although Lee has pointed out that there's a shift in output power when this problem occurs, and I've confirmed his observation here. But unless you're concentrating on the power meter rather than what you're sending, this could be easily missed.) - Jeff, K6JCA [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I have been fighting this problem for several months. I have not seen this problem and (as you well know) I operate CW regularly. However, I also operate (for a variety of reasons, such as feeding my HF amplifier) at lower power levels. Have you tried running with, say, 60 or 80 watts and still see the problem? I'm an ECO level or two behind still. Are you more up to date? Larry WO0Z ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060523/686887c0/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Hi Lee, Very interesting! I haven't been checking my power, so I just tried the following experiment: 1. Using an Autek WM-1 meter (in Peak Mode), set my SDR1K power to 10 watts when read on this meter. 2. Transmit CW: observe RF envelope on an external oscilloscope and Power on wattmeter. Results: Normal Operation: Envelope is clean, and power on wattmeter is 10 watts. Screwy Operation: Envelope appears to have modulation (as seen on scope), and power on wattmeter can be anywhere from, say, 12 to 17 watts (depending upon the apparent "depth" of the modulation on the signal). (Note: SDR1K Fwd Power also shows a higher reading (15 watts in lieu of the normal 10 watts). So - I'd say there's a good chance you and I are experiencing similar problems. Another strange thing that I've noticed is that, when this problem occurs, there is a slight change in how I perceive the Transmit CW note from my SDR1K speakers - it almost seems as though the note has shifted position spatially. Weird, eh? - Jeff, K6JCA Lee A Crocker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I have been fighting this problem for several months. The problem started after 1.4.16. Prior to this release the situation was rock solid. I get precisely what you describe. Also my power output advances significantly from a nominal 100w to 135w when I get the modulation. The situation seems to be random and occurs about 10-20% of the time. It will on occasion correct itself during a transmission, or it will go into "modulation mode" during a transmission. Before it does that I can hear a crackle on the signal. It sometimes has variable penetrance, meaning instead of 135W it may only be 110 or 120 and the modulated portion of the signal is audiably less. I use a P4 3.3ghz with a firebox. I have 2 identical SDR systems including computer and firebox and it happens on both systems. Also I have been told this problem has not occurred at flex headquarters so I am glad to see it is not peculiar to my system. 73 Lee W9OY __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060523/3da4979a/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
> I have been fighting this problem for several months. I have not seen this problem and (as you well know) I operate CW regularly. However, I also operate (for a variety of reasons, such as feeding my HF amplifier) at lower power levels. Have you tried running with, say, 60 or 80 watts and still see the problem? I'm an ECO level or two behind still. Are you more up to date? Larry WO0Z ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
I have been fighting this problem for several months. The problem started after 1.4.16. Prior to this release the situation was rock solid. I get precisely what you describe. Also my power output advances significantly from a nominal 100w to 135w when I get the modulation. The situation seems to be random and occurs about 10-20% of the time. It will on occasion correct itself during a transmission, or it will go into "modulation mode" during a transmission. Before it does that I can hear a crackle on the signal. It sometimes has variable penetrance, meaning instead of 135W it may only be 110 or 120 and the modulated portion of the signal is audiably less. I use a P4 3.3ghz with a firebox. I have 2 identical SDR systems including computer and firebox and it happens on both systems. Also I have been told this problem has not occurred at flex headquarters so I am glad to see it is not peculiar to my system. 73 Lee W9OY __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Thanks for the note, Tom. It isn't a problem with the seating of the connector at the SDR1K - when the problem occurts, I can observe that the Line Out I & Q signals lose their 90 degree phase relationship prior to these connectors. 73, - Jeff, K6JCA Tom Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Jeff, Occasionally I have been transmitting SSB but what comes out is DSB. This can be cured by reseating the 3.5 mm connectors on the SDR. This may be causing your intermittent CW problem. Tom W0IVJ -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060523/27c684df/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
A "cleaner, enhancer & preservative for connectors" called DeoxIT will ensure a good connection when using 3.5mm stereo connectors. Radio Shack may still sell it. A vendor was at Dayton again this year for it. This stuff has been used by techs for many years and really does "work". Mel k0pfx - Original Message - From: "Tom Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Jeff Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2006 3:46 PM Subject: Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem? > Jeff, > > Occasionally I have been transmitting SSB but what comes out is DSB. > This can be cured by reseating the 3.5 mm connectors on the SDR. This > may be causing your intermittent CW problem. > > Tom W0IVJ > > > Jeff Anderson wrote: > >>I recently came across a CW Transmit problem while running the official >>Flex 1.6.1 code, and Eric at Flex has tried to replicate it but has not >>had any luck. And I'm wondering if anyone else has seen it, or could keep >>a lookout for it occuring. >> >> The problem is this - sometimes (infrequently) when transmitting CW, the >> Transmit RF envelope will look as though it has AM modulation on it, >> rather than being a nice, clean continuous-wave envelope. >> >> Why is this a problem, you may ask? >> >> What seems to be happening is that, whenever the CW RF waveform appears >> to have modulation on its envelope, what's really occuring is that the >> Line Out Audio I & Q channels from the soundcard to the SDR1K radio no >> longer have a 90 degree relationship. The phase delta is something other >> than 90 degrees (and this new phase value appears to be random). >> >> The result is that I'm not just sending at one frequency, but two! For >> example, if my CW Pitch is set to 600 Hz, I end up transmiting on both >> the intended frequency and one 1200 Hz (i.e. 2 * 600) away. That is, I >> simultaneously transmit on CWL and CWU, rather than on only one or the >> other. >> >> Clearly this is not a good thing to have happen. >> >> When it occurs, this envelope-type effect will continue as long as the >> unit is in Transmit mode (affecting dots and dashes alike), but, if the >> SDR1000 then returns to receive, chances are, when I transmit again, >> it'll be back to normal. >> >> For example, I just ran a test on my radio. From the time I left >> Standby mode, it took me 53 transmit-receive "cycles" (in which a cycle >> consists of going completely back to receive before retransmitting) >> before the problem occured. It then occured again after another 34 >> cycles, and then again after another 83 cycles. >> >> Later it occured twice within 22 cycles, and once after only 5 cycles - >> its occurance seems to be random. >> >> But it does occur, and because of that, it's keeping me off CW. >> >> I've also replicated this problem with the 1.6.0 release, but have not >> seen it with 1.4.4. >> >> I'm running a stock Dell computer that I purchased from Flex along with >> my SDR1K last October. The only other software that's running is my >> wireless network software. And I'm using the Delta 44 card. So there's >> nothing about my system which would appear to me to be out of the >> ordinary. >> >> The radio itself is setup as follows: >> >> Audio: >>Buffer: 2048 >>SoundCard: Delta 44 >>Sample Ratte: 96 Ksps. >> >> DSP: >>Buffer Size: 2048 (but this doesn't seem to matter). >> >> Keyer: >>Primary: SDR >>Secondary: None >> >>Semi-Breakin: Enabled >>Weight: 50 >>Ramp: 5 ms. >> >> My paddles are plugged into the back of the SDR1K, and I've unchecked >> "Iambic" so that I can use them as a handkey. >> >> The only reliable way to observe if the problem is occuring is to >> monitor your RF with an oscilloscope (although you may also be able to >> see the problem if you have a good spectrum analyzer (or a second >> SDR1K)). >> >> If you don't observe your RF waveform, you may never know if this >> problem is occuring ! >> >> If you can monitor your transmit waveform, if/when this problem occurs >> you'll see what looks like AM modulation on the CW envelope. (The >> "depth" of this modulation varies with the "incorrectness" of the phase >> delta between the I & Q signals.) >>
Re: [Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
Jeff, Occasionally I have been transmitting SSB but what comes out is DSB. This can be cured by reseating the 3.5 mm connectors on the SDR. This may be causing your intermittent CW problem. Tom W0IVJ Jeff Anderson wrote: >I recently came across a CW Transmit problem while running the official Flex >1.6.1 code, and Eric at Flex has tried to replicate it but has not had any >luck. And I'm wondering if anyone else has seen it, or could keep a lookout >for it occuring. > > The problem is this - sometimes (infrequently) when transmitting CW, the > Transmit RF envelope will look as though it has AM modulation on it, rather > than being a nice, clean continuous-wave envelope. > > Why is this a problem, you may ask? > > What seems to be happening is that, whenever the CW RF waveform appears to > have modulation on its envelope, what's really occuring is that the Line Out > Audio I & Q channels from the soundcard to the SDR1K radio no longer have a > 90 degree relationship. The phase delta is something other than 90 degrees > (and this new phase value appears to be random). > > The result is that I'm not just sending at one frequency, but two! For > example, if my CW Pitch is set to 600 Hz, I end up transmiting on both the > intended frequency and one 1200 Hz (i.e. 2 * 600) away. That is, I > simultaneously transmit on CWL and CWU, rather than on only one or the other. > > > Clearly this is not a good thing to have happen. > > When it occurs, this envelope-type effect will continue as long as the unit > is in Transmit mode (affecting dots and dashes alike), but, if the SDR1000 > then returns to receive, chances are, when I transmit again, it'll be back to > normal. > > For example, I just ran a test on my radio. From the time I left Standby > mode, it took me 53 transmit-receive "cycles" (in which a cycle consists of > going completely back to receive before retransmitting) before the problem > occured. It then occured again after another 34 cycles, and then again after > another 83 cycles. > > Later it occured twice within 22 cycles, and once after only 5 cycles - its > occurance seems to be random. > > But it does occur, and because of that, it's keeping me off CW. > > I've also replicated this problem with the 1.6.0 release, but have not seen > it with 1.4.4. > > I'm running a stock Dell computer that I purchased from Flex along with my > SDR1K last October. The only other software that's running is my wireless > network software. And I'm using the Delta 44 card. So there's nothing about > my system which would appear to me to be out of the ordinary. > > The radio itself is setup as follows: > > Audio: >Buffer: 2048 >SoundCard: Delta 44 >Sample Ratte: 96 Ksps. > > DSP: >Buffer Size: 2048 (but this doesn't seem to matter). > > Keyer: >Primary: SDR >Secondary: None > >Semi-Breakin: Enabled >Weight: 50 >Ramp: 5 ms. > > My paddles are plugged into the back of the SDR1K, and I've unchecked > "Iambic" so that I can use them as a handkey. > > The only reliable way to observe if the problem is occuring is to monitor > your RF with an oscilloscope (although you may also be able to see the > problem if you have a good spectrum analyzer (or a second SDR1K)). > > If you don't observe your RF waveform, you may never know if this problem is > occuring ! > > If you can monitor your transmit waveform, if/when this problem occurs > you'll see what looks like AM modulation on the CW envelope. (The "depth" of > this modulation varies with the "incorrectness" of the phase delta between > the I & Q signals.) > > I'm stumped as to what could be the cause of this problem. I find it hard > to imagine that it's something specific to my system, given that the system > is "stock", but then again, who knows! > > Any comments or suggestions would be welcome. > > Thanks, and 73, > > - Jeff, K6JCA > > > > > > >-- next part -- >An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >URL: >http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060523/558654c2/attachment.html >___ >FlexRadio mailing list >FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz >http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz >Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ >FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com > > > > ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
[Flexradio] Has anyone seen this CW Transmit problem?
I recently came across a CW Transmit problem while running the official Flex 1.6.1 code, and Eric at Flex has tried to replicate it but has not had any luck. And I'm wondering if anyone else has seen it, or could keep a lookout for it occuring. The problem is this - sometimes (infrequently) when transmitting CW, the Transmit RF envelope will look as though it has AM modulation on it, rather than being a nice, clean continuous-wave envelope. Why is this a problem, you may ask? What seems to be happening is that, whenever the CW RF waveform appears to have modulation on its envelope, what's really occuring is that the Line Out Audio I & Q channels from the soundcard to the SDR1K radio no longer have a 90 degree relationship. The phase delta is something other than 90 degrees (and this new phase value appears to be random). The result is that I'm not just sending at one frequency, but two! For example, if my CW Pitch is set to 600 Hz, I end up transmiting on both the intended frequency and one 1200 Hz (i.e. 2 * 600) away. That is, I simultaneously transmit on CWL and CWU, rather than on only one or the other. Clearly this is not a good thing to have happen. When it occurs, this envelope-type effect will continue as long as the unit is in Transmit mode (affecting dots and dashes alike), but, if the SDR1000 then returns to receive, chances are, when I transmit again, it'll be back to normal. For example, I just ran a test on my radio. From the time I left Standby mode, it took me 53 transmit-receive "cycles" (in which a cycle consists of going completely back to receive before retransmitting) before the problem occured. It then occured again after another 34 cycles, and then again after another 83 cycles. Later it occured twice within 22 cycles, and once after only 5 cycles - its occurance seems to be random. But it does occur, and because of that, it's keeping me off CW. I've also replicated this problem with the 1.6.0 release, but have not seen it with 1.4.4. I'm running a stock Dell computer that I purchased from Flex along with my SDR1K last October. The only other software that's running is my wireless network software. And I'm using the Delta 44 card. So there's nothing about my system which would appear to me to be out of the ordinary. The radio itself is setup as follows: Audio: Buffer: 2048 SoundCard: Delta 44 Sample Ratte: 96 Ksps. DSP: Buffer Size: 2048 (but this doesn't seem to matter). Keyer: Primary: SDR Secondary: None Semi-Breakin: Enabled Weight: 50 Ramp: 5 ms. My paddles are plugged into the back of the SDR1K, and I've unchecked "Iambic" so that I can use them as a handkey. The only reliable way to observe if the problem is occuring is to monitor your RF with an oscilloscope (although you may also be able to see the problem if you have a good spectrum analyzer (or a second SDR1K)). If you don't observe your RF waveform, you may never know if this problem is occuring ! If you can monitor your transmit waveform, if/when this problem occurs you'll see what looks like AM modulation on the CW envelope. (The "depth" of this modulation varies with the "incorrectness" of the phase delta between the I & Q signals.) I'm stumped as to what could be the cause of this problem. I find it hard to imagine that it's something specific to my system, given that the system is "stock", but then again, who knows! Any comments or suggestions would be welcome. Thanks, and 73, - Jeff, K6JCA -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/attachments/20060523/558654c2/attachment.html ___ FlexRadio mailing list FlexRadio@flex-radio.biz http://mail.flex-radio.biz/mailman/listinfo/flexradio_flex-radio.biz Archive Link: http://mail.flex-radio.biz/pipermail/flexradio_flex-radio.biz/ FlexRadio Homepage: http://www.flex-radio.com
